So, was I mean or unreasonable?

[NanceXToo]

Do you need to have me waiting in the background with a cattle prod to help you make the final decision NOT to let her get away with it one.more.time? :lol:

 

:lol: Welllllllll I'll get back to you on that!

[Scuff]

Something else to think about. You teach people how to treat your group by your expectations. We used to belong to a group. Nothing ever started ontime. They were always waiting to see if someone else would show up. It got incredibly frustrating. When we joined a co-op last year, that was one of the things i watched for: are we actually going to do things when we're supposed to? I don't want to be finishing up at 3, instead of 1, because they couldn't start on time. Now, I say that as someone who has struggled with getting places on time. Especially with littles. But I much prefer a group that starts when it should, even if it means i often miss the first 10 minutes. If i do, it's my fault. And i will usually adjust and figure it out and eventually get there when I should, if I know things are starting without me. If I know it's not going to really start until 10 min. later, i may have things come up(cause they always do) and accidently not get there until 15 min late.

 

Anyway, that got rambly. My point is, if you want people to respect your deadlines, you need to stop making concessions. I'm not saying you have to be completely inflexible, like for the woman with a legitamate hardship. But stop beding to every whim. Start things on time. Keep deadlines firm, even if things get cancelled at first.

[mom2hunangirls]

What happens when you drop her? (which I think you absolutely should do, it's the rules. No more emails/calls.)

If all that happens is that she gets reinstated as soon as she pays it's not much of an incentive to pay until she feels like it. KWIM?

I know you said she'd have to reapply, but is that a big enough deal to make someone want to avoid it?

No way do I think you should remind anyone beyond the 5 recent reminders. They are big girls and can weigh their options....you just need to make it weigh more to wait. :)

[Zebra]

I didn't read all the replies...but there is NO WAY you are being a jerk! You should have stopped reminding her after reminder #2.

 

She is treating you like dirt, and you're letting her....so definitely take Ellie up on the cattle prod offer ;)!

[Ellie]

I didn't read all the replies...but there is NO WAY you are being a jerk! You should have stopped reminding her after reminder #2.

:iagree:

 

She is treating you like dirt, and you're letting her....so definitely take Ellie up on the cattle prod offer ;)!

::high fives with MeAmy:::D

[NanceXToo]

What happens when you drop her? (which I think you absolutely should do, it's the rules. No more emails/calls.)

If all that happens is that she gets reinstated as soon as she pays it's not much of an incentive to pay until she feels like it. KWIM?

I know you said she'd have to reapply, but is that a big enough deal to make someone want to avoid it?

No way do I think you should remind anyone beyond the 5 recent reminders. They are big girls and can weigh their options....you just need to make it weigh more to wait. :)

 

Well, nothing, she can get reinstated as soon as she pays- I'm not really looking to hand out additional consequences- but meanwhile she isn't able to attend anything with the group or access the group's message board, calendar, emails, etc. until she's reinstated. Not that she does any of that often anyway, but the option isn't there unless she's a paid member.

 

I figure if she realizes I meant business after all and pays quickly and gets herself right back in, that's fine, and maybe next time she'll pay on time knowing that if she doesn't she'll have to get kicked out and deal with reapplying to join (which just means filling out an online form and waiting for me to approve it). If she takes forever to pay and rejoin, that's up to her, she just doesn't have access to anything until she gets around to it. If she decides not to bother at all, that's her choice as well.

 

Ellie, you're scary! LOL! :)

[MeganW]

:lol: See, if I was REALLY mean I'd have no qualms about it whatsoever. The truth is, I WILL feel a bit bad about it if I end up actually doing it even though I do believe it'd be her own fault. I am hoping that my message will cause her to go, "whoops, better just pay it on time" and just go take care of it and then it won't have to come down to it. But we'll see how it plays out, and then I'll have to make a final decision, and we'll see if I'm a pushover or not lol.

 

That's just the thing - it's NOT mean. It's following through with the rules of the group. Don't make it a bigger deal than it has to be. Just drop her and be done! Especially since it is so easy for her to get back in - what's the big deal? I promise you SHE isn't stressing this much over it! If she was, she would have gotten the money to you. Why should you be so much more concerned about her membership than she is? Quit reminding and prompting and emailing and calling. She's not a five year old! If she cared, she would have taken care of it!

[NanceXToo]

That's just the thing - it's NOT mean. It's following through with the rules of the group. Don't make it a bigger deal than it has to be. Just drop her and be done! Especially since it is so easy for her to get back in - what's the big deal? I promise you SHE isn't stressing this much over it! If she was, she would have gotten the money to you. Why should you be so much more concerned about her membership than she is? Quit reminding and prompting and emailing and calling. She's not a five year old! If she cared, she would have taken care of it!

 

You're absolutely right, and everything you just said makes so much sense. It's just my personality type or something, I obsess over stuff like this. :blushing:

[MariannNOVA]

You are being neither mean nor unreasonable. You have made the parameters clear and someone is ignoring them. That does not make you mean and/or unreasonable.

 

It does, however, say something about the other individual.

 

Be kind to yourself.:grouphug:

[5kidsforME]

Ok well it came across (to me) like you meant it a bit snarky, but that's fine.

 

I didn't say that it would spread to other members. I said if I don't nip certain things in the bud, they'll just always be a problem. Meaning if I didn't say something and stop her from doing certain things, she'd just keep doing it. And it would always be a problem with HER, not that everybody else would suddenly become a problem, too. So I need to address problems as they occur with relevant members, maybe not the very first time it happens, but after I see it's a recurring issue. As was the case with her.

 

I don't think I need to amend my post to include a just agree with me statement, it seems most people already did. :P (and I'm fine with the fact that a few didn't. If the majority didn't, I'd consider re-evaluating my position, I just wanted to make sure that I wasn't being way out of line in my expectations. The consensus seems to be that I'm not). Still, I do understand where you are coming from and why you feel the way you do. I'm just having a hard time feeling the same way, and yes, I admit that at least in part it's definitely due to being frustrated over her history in this group so far. But also in part due to not wanting her to continue sliding on all the group policies. But I know I've already given all my reasons and you've given all yours, so I think it's fine that we agree to disagree! (Although for the record I'm still only at about 95 percent on what I'll actually DO if I don't hear back from her/receive payment, so there's still a 5 percent chance I won't kick her out if she doesn't pay and will give her til the 5th before doing so. We'll see).

 

I am thinking the PP who is giving you a hard time about it, is possibly a late payer, rule breaker too. ;)

 

This person doesn't need boundaties, you already have them. You just need to enforce them and that stinks that she put you in that position.

 

You're right, you don't need a JAWM when 99% of us already do. ;)

[gardenmom5]

. As I said before, BTDT, watched friends BTDT (can you make "BTDT" be past tense? :lol:) :001_tt2:

 

:confused: I thought it was past tense . . . . (been, done . . . )

[kathymuggle]

I would probably let her pay at the next meeting if it is not putting anyone out in a concrete way…but I am a big softie about that sort of thing. If she did not pay, though, that would be it - no more events until she pays in full.

 

I do not, however, think you are being harsh for insisting on payment ahead of time. You gave her ample warnings. Write your email explaining her options, the next move is up to her. Sending positive vibes she just doesn't show up at the event without prior payment and cause a ruckus.

[Mom0012]

That's what I'm saying! Our group policy page, which everyone has to read and agree to to join, clearly states when dues need to be received by. I don't expect that to be right at the top of peoples' memory banks though, so I started sending out reminders on January 1st.

 

I sent out a reminder 1/1, 1/16, 1/31, 2/15, and then another one to this particular woman on 2/23 saying I haven't heard from you yet and haven't received your payment, please be advised it is due in one week, please make arrangements to get it to me on or before 3/1- she never responded to ANY of them.

 

Then today, the day before the dues are due, she RSVP'd for this thing on the 5th and said in her RSVP: "I'll come, that way I can pay my dues too... lol"

 

Sigh. She's one of the ones that was a no show for that library tour I was so embarrassed about, when most people canceled within the last couple of days and only four families were left, and her (and one other mom) never showed up. When I called her to see if she was coming, because I had these librarians standing there waiting, she was like, "Oh, we don't feel well, so we're not going to come." And I had said, "Okay, well next time can you change your RSVP or call to let somebody know, because we were standing here waiting for you," and she was like, "oh, okay."

 

At home, I sent out an email to the group to this effect, of honoring their RSVP's or changing them if they couldn't go, because in that particular case I would have rescheduled the tour, and then she went and did it AGAIN at the next event she signed up for. Then she signed up for a class at my husband's shop, he had supplies ready for X number of kids, we delayed starting to give everyone a chance to get there and not miss anything, and AGAIN she never showed up, with the four kids she had signed up. I emailed her and was like you can't keep doing this, I've talked to you about it and you did it a couple of times since etc etc- she never answered.

 

Now she's signed up for this, but am I depending on her to show up, dues in hand? Not really. I'd rather she just pay her dues on time if she expects me to keep her in this group. It already says in our group policy that too many no shows may result in removal from the group. I've already said in my emails that non payment of dues on time can result in removal from group. Stuff like this is just really frustrating to me as a group organizer.

 

ETA: You guys have given me something to think about for the future though, some incentive of having members get a discount for paying early, and/or having people have to pay a reinstatement fee plus dues if they get kicked out for non-payment and need to rejoin, or giving a small discount to continuing members or something, I'm going to put some thought into that stuff!

 

I definitely think it's a good idea to have a late fee or a discount for paying early in the future. Maybe set up a "no show" policy as well. X amount of no shows and you lose your spot in the group. I have set up my share of field trips and have had to deal with half the group cancelling the morning of the trip. I hate that!

 

Lisa

[Ellie]

I would probably let her pay at the next meeting if it is not putting anyone out in a concrete way…but I am a big softie about that sort of thing. If she did not pay, though, that would be it - no more events until she pays in full.

Except that she's already had *5* notices.

 

I do not, however, think you are being harsh for insisting on payment ahead of time. You gave her ample warnings. Write your email explaining her options, the next move is up to her. Sending positive vibes she just doesn't show up at the event without prior payment and cause a ruckus.

She already knows her options. She's choosing to make her own rules. And she's caused problems in the past because of no-shows and whatnot. She's way past her grace period.

[cathmom]

If you've been nagging people for months about $12, you've become white noise.

[Dustybug]

It depends on if you are incurring expenses on her behalf between March 1st and March 5th. If so, then it's okay to ask her to bring it by your house, especially if you cannot afford to front her expenses. If you are not incurring any expenses in these four days, then, yes, I think you are being unreasonable to not accept her dues four days late.

 

:iagree:

 

I think that's probably why she doesn't think it's a big deal. $12 for 4 days. Sure, it would be nice if she would grovel and ask for permission for an extension, but--to me--the golden rule dictates that you cut her some slack.

 

:iagree:

Right on. :cheers2:

 

If you have a rule (and your rule is absolutely reasonable, BTW), then you must require everyone to follow that rule. Scofflaws will be trouble, and that trouble will bite you, not them.

 

You helped me learn a new word tonight, "scofflaws." :D

 

You are not being mean and you are not being unreasonable, but I want to stand up for those of us who are more flexible with rules in general. It may seem rude, disorganized and unprofessional to most Americans, but really, many people (and entire cultures) function the way to interpret rules not as fixed absolutes, but as general guidelines, especially for something not very formal. I would honestly not see a big deal for those few days of difference. I would have an issue with consistent not showing up for events, but a few days of flexibility about payment would be totally fine with me.

 

I am like that with most things. I am okay with (reasonable) tardiness, I am okay with "10 page essays" which are 8 or 12 pages long (because the length in my view is a general guideline, not something fixed in stone), I am okay with about a week of flexibility for payment after the official deadline, etc. Just a different view of it - I think these are small stuff which should remain small stuff and not be a cause of frictions.

 

:iagree:

 

I am thinking the PP who is giving you a hard time about it, is possibly a late payer, rule breaker too. ;)

 

This person doesn't need boundaties, you already have them. You just need to enforce them and that stinks that she put you in that position.

 

You're right, you don't need a JAWM when 99% of us already do. ;)

 

Well, I'm not the pp you are referring to, but I do agree with her and I am most certainly NOT a late payer or a rule breaker. I just don't see making such a big deal over $12 that isn't hurting anyone. If she doesn't show/pay on the 5th, then deactivate her.

 

I DO think that you should not wait for people for events. If they are late, THEY miss stuff. It would annoy me to have to wait (like a pp mentioned) and if I was the one that was late, I would know coming in that I would likely have missed part of the event/program.

[5kidsforME]

 

 

Well, I'm not the pp you are referring to, but I do agree with her and I am most certainly NOT a late payer or a rule breaker. I just don't see making such a big deal over $12 that isn't hurting anyone. If she doesn't show/pay on the 5th, then deactivate her.

 

I DO think that you should not wait for people for events. If they are late, THEY miss stuff. It would annoy me to have to wait (like a pp mentioned) and if I was the one that was late, I would know coming in that I would likely have missed part of the event/program.

 

 

I just don't get this attitude. I mean, March 1st comes every year at the same time, right? This was not sprung on all of the people in the group right? This lady has already responded by email, so you know she has a computer. She probably has a cell phone too. See? Plenty of ways to communicate if she has a good reason for not showing up, paying late etc.

 

I can understand if you want to give someone some slack if something is going on but for someone that is obviously disorganized...I don't get it. Can you imagine if all of the people in the group did this? Chaos.

 

They have rules. When they're not followed they then have rules to deal with that. Follow the flippin rules. :tongue_smilie:

[Stayseeliz]

I just stepped down from leading our homeschool group because of people like this. People just won't honor their commitment. I give up.

[PentecostalMom]

No, but 3 things:

 

1. This type of person usually thinks deadlines are arbitrary.

2. This type of person usually thinks they are special and beyond the stated rule.

3. This type of person will raise a huge stink, not only to you but to the rest of the group.

 

:iagree:

[Ellie]

I just don't get this attitude. I mean, March 1 comes every year at the same time, right? This was not sprung on all of the people in the group right? This lady has already responded by email, so you know she has a computer. She probably has a cell phone too. See? Plenty of ways to communicate if she has a good reason for not showing up, paying late etc.

 

I can understand if you want to give someone some slack if something is going on but for someone that is obviously disorganized...I don't get it. Can you imagine if all of the people in the group did this? Chaos.

 

They have rules. When they're not followed they then have rules to deal with that. Follow the flippin rules. :tongue_smilie:

:iagree:

[Dustybug]

I just don't get this attitude. I mean, March 1st comes every year at the same time, right? This was not sprung on all of the people in the group right? This lady has already responded by email, so you know she has a computer. She probably has a cell phone too. See? Plenty of ways to communicate if she has a good reason for not showing up, paying late etc.

 

I can understand if you want to give someone some slack if something is going on but for someone that is obviously disorganized...I don't get it. Can you imagine if all of the people in the group did this? Chaos.

 

They have rules. When they're not followed they then have rules to deal with that. Follow the flippin rules. :tongue_smilie:

 

I'm not saying that people shouldn't follow rules, but I just don't honestly see the big deal over $12 that isn't putting anyone out. *shrug*

 

My opinion would be slightly different if someone else had to cover her dues until she paid them or if it was a significantly higher amount of money, but that's just me.

[happypamama]

I don't think you're being unreasonable at all. I'm a softie, but this repeated flakiness would drive me nuts. Everyone has their moments, but this is too much. If she had a history of being reliable and asked this time if she could pay on the 5th, that would be different, especially if I knew there was financial difficulty; maybe this Friday is payday, and she won't have the money until then (and when things are tight, things are tight, regardless of how the dues are only $12), but she should have said something like, "my DH gets paid on the third; I can't pay until then." And I feel that you save those sorts of favors until you really need them; you don't "waste" them.

[Catwoman]

I'm not saying that people shouldn't follow rules, but I just don't honestly see the big deal over $12 that isn't putting anyone out. *shrug*

 

My opinion would be slightly different if someone else had to cover her dues until she paid them or if it was a significantly higher amount of money, but that's just me.

 

I would agree with you if this was a one-time thing, but it's not. Have you ever organized an event and had people swear up and down that they'd be there, and then they don't bother to show up or call to say they can't make it? It's embarrassing to organize an event and not have the attendees show up. This woman sounds like a repeat offender. And not only are no-shows a nuisance when others don't show up, either, but they also often take the last available spots for field trips, so another family isn't able to attend... and then when they don't show up, it's too late to inform the other people who really wanted to go.

 

Honestly, she sounds like she believes the world revolves around her, and that everyone should excuse her repeated poor behavior. Everyone else in the group knew about the deadline, and apparently they honored it. Why should this one woman be permitted to be the exception to the rule? It's not as though she even had a good reason for not paying on time.

 

I'm sorry, but it's not like Nance is getting paid to put up with a lot of garbage from people -- she's doing it out of the goodness of her heart -- and it's women like the one in question that frustrate group leaders to the point where they end up disbanding the group, rather than deal with the stress that comes from members who don't hold up their end. Nance wasn't asking the woman to help organize anything, or volunteer her time, or pay more than anyone else; all the woman had to do was pay her money on time.

 

So if it were me, I'd kick her to the curb if she didn't bother to get her payment in on time, and if she wanted to re-join, I wouldn't be in too much of a rush to reinstate her. (If she wants to re-join on the 5th, I'd tell her I'd get back to her about it on the 10th, because that's when it would be convenient for me. ;)

 

I don't think it's a bad thing to refuse to tolerate poor treatment. The more you put up with, the more certain people will take advantage of you.

Edited March 1, 2012 by Catwoman

[5kidsforME]

I would agree with you if this was a one-time thing, but it's not. Have you ever organized an event and had people swear up and down that they'd be there, and then they don't bother to show up or call to say they can't make it? It's embarrassing to organize an event and not have the attendees show up. This woman sounds like a repeat offender.

 

Honestly, she sounds like she believes the world revolves around her, and that everyone should excuse her repeated poor behavior. Everyone else in the group knew about the deadline, and apparently they honored it. Why should this one woman be permitted to be the exception to the rule? It's not as though she even had a good reason for not paying on time.

 

I'm sorry, but it's not like Nance is getting paid to put up with a lot of garbage from people -- she's doing it out of the goodness of her heart -- and it's women like the one in question that frustrate group leaders to the point where they end up disbanding the group, rather than deal with the stress that comes from members who don't hold up their end. Nance wasn't asking the woman to help organize anything, or volunteer her time, or pay more than anyone else; all the woman had to do was pay her money on time.

 

So if it were me, I'd kick her to the curb if she didn't bother to get her payment in on time, and if she wanted to re-join, I'd make sure there was some sort of penalty in place for just that type of situation.

 

I don't think it's a bad thing to refuse to tolerate poor treatment. The more you put up with, the more certain people will take advantage of you.

 

 

:iagree: I used to organize a big event every year. Same people would come every year. They knew there was a deadline to pay. I always had the people that waited to the last second and I would wait days for their checks. It made all the payments late. My cut off date was the day I could breath easier and relax until the following year when it would start all over again.

 

Maybe to some "it's only $12" but to the person in charge of organizing it, it's a huge responsibility. When that 1 or 2 people that don't cooperate make it more stressful than it should be. Its already a big job for the person organizing it. Don't make it worse.

 

I fianlly implemented the deadline rule. Once I shipped off all the payments that were on time and my spreadsheets, it was out of my hands. Their rooms were released and they had to hope that the facility still had them available. That happened the first year. After I implemented that rule and put my foot down, I never had a late payment again. ;)

[Dustybug]

:iagree: I used to organize a big event every year. Same people would come every year. They knew there was a deadline to pay. I always had the people that waited to the last second and I would wait days for their checks. It made all the payments late. My cut off date was the day I could breath easier and relax until the following year when it would start all over again.

 

Maybe to some "it's only $12" but to the person in charge of organizing it, it's a huge responsibility. When that 1 or 2 people that don't cooperate make it more stressful than it should be. Its already a big job for the person organizing it. Don't make it worse.

 

I fianlly implemented the deadline rule. Once I shipped off all the payments that were on time and my spreadsheets, it was out of my hands. Their rooms were released and they had to hope that the facility still had them available. That happened the first year. After I implemented that rule and put my foot down, I never had a late payment again. ;)

 

See, this is a bit different though. If this $12 was needed to reserve a space or something to that effect, then I could see the need to enforce the deadline so harshly(not really the word I want to use here, but my mind is blanking out). If the money isn't even NEEDED until the end of March, and she's asking to pay on the 5th of the month, I just can't get myself worked up about it, although I do agree that if she doesn't show on that day or pay, then she should be deactivated.

[Kirch]

lol, it's okay. I send out all the extra emails because I would feel horrible just kicking people out of the group without feeling like I did everything in my power first to make sure I gave them EVERY possible opportunity to pay on time first. I would never want them to go, "I didn't know! I didn't remember! I can't believe you did that!" or whatever. They know. They remember. That's why I sent her the extra email on top of the other four. If I kick her out, she won't be at the 3/5 event, I would presume (which, btw is a mom's night out event, not a regular field trip). If I don't kick her out and she doesn't show up for it, then I'm still back to either having to kick her out then or sending her more emails going, "I still need your payment." But you're right, either way, it's not a lot of extra work on top of what I'd have to do anyway and is mostly just irritation and the fact that I don't really want to send a message to her that my policies don't matter and that she can continue to do whatever she feels like regardless of what policies I try to set for the group.

 

Make sure you realize--if this happens, you are not kicking her out. She's *choosing* not to renew her membership. Your policy is clear, and she's a big girl. Dealing with the hassle of re-applying if she doesn't pay on time is her deal. Don't own it for her. No more "lectures" (what you said you were afraid sounded like lectures in a previous post) or excessive reminders. Treat her like a grown-up and assume that she knows that her actions have consequences. If she doesn't now, she'll figure it out soon. You're not being ugly or mean--you're just following through matter-of-factly onwhat you said you were going to do.

[Dandelion]

IMO your approach is totally reasonable.

 

I've organized two groups on Meetup in the past (a homeschooling group and a women's social group - both had over 200 members so they were fairly large). Not sure what it is about Meetup, but IME it seems that people feel more free to blow you off on Meetup than anywhere else. I've been through the hassles of tracking people down for small membership dues (it was such a pain that when I set up the second group, I just decided to pay the Meetup fees myself and not charge members).

 

You've given ample notice and reminders - I think you're totally justified in removing her and reinstating her if/when she decides to pay the dues.

[Jean in Newcastle]

Make sure you realize--if this happens, you are not kicking her out. She's *choosing* not to renew her membership. Your policy is clear, and she's a big girl. Dealing with the hassle of re-applying if she doesn't pay on time is her deal. Don't own it for her. No more "lectures" (what you said you were afraid sounded like lectures in a previous post) or excessive reminders. Treat her like a grown-up and assume that she knows that her actions have consequences. If she doesn't now, she'll figure it out soon. You're not being ugly or mean--you're just following through matter-of-factly onwhat you said you were going to do.

 

:iagree:

[NanceXToo]

See, this is a bit different though. If this $12 was needed to reserve a space or something to that effect, then I could see the need to enforce the deadline so harshly(not really the word I want to use here, but my mind is blanking out). If the money isn't even NEEDED until the end of March, and she's asking to pay on the 5th of the month, I just can't get myself worked up about it, although I do agree that if she doesn't show on that day or pay, then she should be deactivated.

 

 

In past years, we (I used to be an assistant organizer, now I run it on my own) used to be a lot more lenient about it, and more members used to be more lax about paying on time. We would sometimes get the runaround for weeks past the deadline and would have to keep looking for them for it, worrying about getting the money in on time, debating at what point we say "you can't be in the group if you don't pay because it's not fair to the people who did pay, and the site fees have to be taken care of etc." It was a PITA!

 

The old main organizer didn't take paypal and apparently a lot of people couldn't be bothered getting something in the mail and wanted to just wait until they saw us whenever that may be and we finally had to become more strict about deadlines and started sending out more reminders and including wording about how it had to be paid on time to stay in the group. Then when I took over I added paypal to make it more convenient, but definitely continued with the "barring extenuating circumstances, this has to stay more structured, you guys MUST pay by the deadline" mindset.

 

I've made it so crystal clear and offered every payment option under the sun and gave more than ample notice. It's not the $12, it's the principal of the matter, that I just want people to follow the group policies and not keep breaking them and disrespecting me or my time or the policies I've set like they don't matter in the slightest, and that's what it feels like when there's a person who repeatedly doesn't bother to show up for events she says she will come to without taking a second to cancel despite being asked not to do that again, who only selectively responds to your emails, and who to top it all off doesn't pay her dues when she's supposed to. With someone like that whether it's four days or fourteen, $12 or $120, whether I need the money 3/1 or 3/31, it's just her "who cares what you say" attitude that gets me. *I* care what I say. It's my group. I set the rules. I didn't set them because I sat down and thought, "This will be fun! Let's see how many random rules I can make!" I set them so that the group could run as smoothly and efficiently as possible, and because the group is a big part of my life, that's how I need it to run as much as possible. And she agreed to the rules when she joined. So why can't she just follow them without breaking them over and over and over, and why should she get to be the exception to the rule again and again and again just because she feels like it?

Edited March 1, 2012 by NanceXToo

[gardenmom5]

Nance -

:grouphug: I honestly think you are putting too much energy into this - you have made her problem your problem. she's a big girl, make it hers. the group isn't as important to her as it is to you or the other members. If it was important to her, she'd have paid or at least contacted you earlier to let you know she would have troule paying and can you work something out.

 

You've generously sent reminders every two weeks, with a notice that membership dues must be paid by 3/1. you've stated it. let it rest. If on the morning of 3/2 they haven't arrived, just close her membership. (I assume that means she will also be deleted from future mailings?) don't stress over it.

[ciyates]

I have been in you spot so many time since I took over as the director of our Co-op. :toetap05:

 

To me a deadline was a deadline... It seems relatively simple to drop a check in the mail on time. Why couldn't people get it together? However God humbled me in a way that I did not expect. Life happened to me. In an 18 month period my son had a major, life changing injury to his hand. This lead to multiple surgeries, countless OT visit and more medical bills than I could imagine. My dad had a heart attack, slipped into diabetic coma and had an amputation. My MIL started declining rapidly and decision had to be made. Our church split and we were without any support. I dropped every ball I was juggling. I found out quickly that everyone around me had a similar story.

 

I don't know if life is happening to this person or are they just being contrary.:D I do know I am thankful to everyone who cut me slack, especially the ones who did not know what was going on!

[elegantlion]

I will say this thread has reminded me why I never want to be in charge of money in any organization ever again. I was treasurer and publicity person for a MOPS group for one year. Herding cats, wrangling spaghetti, ugh.

 

There are various opinions on this issue, but I feel like the opinion that matters is the one in charge of the organization. She is the one handling the money, she should get to say when it's due and how rigid her rule is. Cutting people slack is one thing, deciding she's going to cut you slack without asking is presumptuous and rude. She organizes the group, she get to set the rules. Different groups may have different rules (or guidelines as Barbossa would say). If you're going to be a part of a group, you need to abide by their rules or go into the leadership yourself and change them. :tongue_smilie:

[mom2denj]

I don't think so. But, you are never going to please everybody.

 

:iagree:

[Shelly in IL]

Because if she has RSVP'ed for the event, her past history shows that she may not show up. If she doesn't show up, then you can drop her, no questions asked! In the future, an early payment discount is a great idea!

[Catwoman]

Make sure you realize--if this happens, you are not kicking her out. She's *choosing* not to renew her membership. Your policy is clear, and she's a big girl. Dealing with the hassle of re-applying if she doesn't pay on time is her deal. Don't own it for her. No more "lectures" (what you said you were afraid sounded like lectures in a previous post) or excessive reminders. Treat her like a grown-up and assume that she knows that her actions have consequences. If she doesn't now, she'll figure it out soon. You're not being ugly or mean--you're just following through matter-of-factly onwhat you said you were going to do.

 

That's an excellent point.

[MeganW]

Make sure you realize--if this happens, you are not kicking her out. She's *choosing* not to renew her membership. Your policy is clear, and she's a big girl. Dealing with the hassle of re-applying if she doesn't pay on time is her deal. Don't own it for her. No more "lectures" (what you said you were afraid sounded like lectures in a previous post) or excessive reminders. Treat her like a grown-up and assume that she knows that her actions have consequences. If she doesn't now, she'll figure it out soon. You're not being ugly or mean--you're just following through matter-of-factly onwhat you said you were going to do.

 

:iagree:

I was thinking the exact same thing!!

[TranquilMind]

bkpan: However, what you describe here is a pattern of insensitivity to the group as a whole, and I think that I would not bend the rule again with maybe with an explanation detailing the repeated examples of her disrespect to the group.

 

Yes, this is the problem. I will bend rules happily for anyone who is generally consistently respectful. However, if they push me and push me, I become very inflexible.

 

There will always be two groups of people... those that adhere to most rules and deadlines like they are laws, and those that treat most rules and deadlines as recommendations, lol.

 

The problem with the latter is that they treat very important things as "recommendations" as well. Thou shalt not steal. Thou shalt not commit adultery. Thou shalt not drive 100 mph on the highway.;) Thou shall not lie for thy children nor do thy children's work for them. Thou shalt not drink and drive. Etc. Etc.

[TranquilMind]

ciyates: To me a deadline was a deadline... It seems relatively simple to drop a check in the mail on time. Why couldn't people get it together? However God humbled me in a way that I did not expect. Life happened to me. In an 18 month period my son had a major, life changing injury to his hand. This lead to multiple surgeries, countless OT visit and more medical bills than I could imagine. My dad had a heart attack, slipped into diabetic coma and had an amputation. My MIL started declining rapidly and decision had to be made. Our church split and we were without any support. I dropped every ball I was juggling. I found out quickly that everyone around me had a similar story.

 

I'm sorry all this happened to you. I've had a few tough times and dropped a ball here and there too. However, people are very willing to chip in, help, drive, even buy stuff for you on Ebay and give it to your kid (I'd had surgery and dropped a ball on a textbook a kid needed) when you don't consistently take advantage of them. I'm sure you didn't and those with similar stories didn't.

 

I think this thread is directed at those who do.

[kathymuggle]

 

 

 

The problem with the latter is that they treat very important things as "recommendations" as well. Thou shalt not steal. Thou shalt not commit adultery. Thou shalt not drive 100 mph on the highway.;) Thou shall not lie for thy children nor do thy children's work for them. Thou shalt not drink and drive. Etc. Etc.

 

No. I am capable of being days late on a payment - even with reminders - if I was having one of those months/seasons. I cut others some slack and I appreciate it when others do likewise for me (although I do not necessarily expect it). I would not be mad if the Op insisted on payment by due date - those are the rules, and if I don't abide, that is the reality. Her group, her rules.

 

However, equating someone who is 5 days late on a $12 renewal to someone who would drunk drive or commit adultery is mind boggling. :confused:

Edited March 2, 2012 by kathymuggle

[Bluegoat]

The problem with the latter is that they treat very important things as "recommendations" as well. Thou shalt not steal. Thou shalt not commit adultery. Thou shalt not drive 100 mph on the highway.;) Thou shall not lie for thy children nor do thy children's work for them. Thou shalt not drink and drive. Etc. Etc.

 

Actually, I don't think that is true at all.

[Catwoman]

OK Nance, give it to us straight. March 1 is almost history, so...

 

Did she pay?

 

And if not, are you giving her the boot? :D

[clementine]

OK Nance, give it to us straight. March 1 is almost history, so...

 

Did she pay?

 

And if not, are you giving her the boot? :D

 

:bigear:

[Harriet Vane]

:lurk5:

OK Nance, give it to us straight. March 1 is almost history, so...

 

Did she pay?

 

And if not, are you giving her the boot? :D

[NanceXToo]

OK Nance, give it to us straight. March 1 is almost history, so...

 

Did she pay?

 

And if not, are you giving her the boot? :D

 

As of now, no word, no payment. My husband is a tattoo artist and he'll be at work tonight until at least 9 PM if not later. It's still possible she'll walk into his shop sometime tonight and drop off a payment. Or Paypal me. I doubt it, but technically she does have until midnight tonight! So I'll wait until I wake up tomorrow to see if she ended up paying or sending me some sort of contact email. But if I've received no payment and no word, then, yes, I've decided to boot her. (I emailed one of my assistant organizers today to see if she felt the same way, and she said: "I'd boot her! She hasn't shown any worthwhile interest in our group!")

[Jean in Newcastle]

So if you boot her (which I support btw) do you let her know that she's booted or does she show up for the event on the 5th to find no spot for her and her kin?

[NanceXToo]

So if you boot her (which I support btw) do you let her know that she's booted or does she show up for the event on the 5th to find no spot for her and her kin?

 

Well, lol, theoretically Meetup will send her an email letting her know that she has been removed from the group, with a note from me letting her know why.

 

If she doesn't check her email often, it's possible she won't get the email and she may show up on the 5th, dues in hand. The event on the 5th is just a Mom's Night Out dinner, so it wouldn't be a matter of not having a spot.

 

I suppose, worst case scenario, she'd show up there with her dues and I'd have to explain to her that she is welcome to stay for dinner and submit her dues but that she is going to have to reapply online to rejoin again as she had been removed due to not paying them on time and that next year she really has to pay them before the deadline to prevent that from happening again. It would be slightly awkward but I would imagine more so for her than me, I'm pretty close to everyone else there whereas she barely knows anyone and if anyone felt a bit foolish over it, I would imagine it would (should) be her, even though, granted, the situation would feel a bit awkward for me, too!

[gardenmom5]

So, did she show up on the 5th?

 

:bigear: inquiring minds want to know . . . .

[NanceXToo]

No, she didn't! She ended up emailing me and saying that was fine as she didn't really have a lot of time because of personal issues anyway (I don't want to repeat her specific personal issues publicly here). I said I understood and hadn't been aware of her situation, but reiterated that if she ever wanted to rejoin in the future, she was welcome to do so, and left it at that.

[Tap]

No, she didn't! She ended up emailing me and saying that was fine as she didn't really have a lot of time because of personal issues anyway (I don't want to repeat her specific personal issues publicly here). I said I understood and hadn't been aware of her situation, but reiterated that if she ever wanted to rejoin in the future, she was welcome to do so, and left it at that.

 

I am glad it worked out amicably in the end.

 

:hurray:

[Catwoman]

No, she didn't! She ended up emailing me and saying that was fine as she didn't really have a lot of time because of personal issues anyway (I don't want to repeat her specific personal issues publicly here). I said I understood and hadn't been aware of her situation, but reiterated that if she ever wanted to rejoin in the future, she was welcome to do so, and left it at that.

 

I think you handled the whole situation beautifully, Nance. :thumbup: