Rude?

[cindergretta]

There needs to be a law against posting late at night when one is tired, irritated, and her mama heart is hurting. I needed to wait...

 

I was raised in an overly strict, overly controlling, impossibly high expectation situation. (Nothing was ever right or good enough.) I have been told periodically that I am too hard on my children. I struggle to find balance. Often I wonder if my expectations are off or if something is indeed inappropriate or whatever, kwim?

 

The dds have been friends for years. In the last year, I have heard bits and pieces of things that have had me question this friendship. As it isn't dangerous, we (dh and I) haven't said she isn't "allowed" to play with this girl. We want to teach her to stand up for herself and make her own choices. (We have hoped from time to time that she would spend more time with others, kwim?)

 

Anyway, upon reflection, I think I posted more to vent (and to verify what would actually be construed as rude) than anything. Fwiw, dd wasn't hurt by the end. She was hurt during the course of the party by the way the friend treated her. It is such a long story and sounds terribly argumentative if I try to explain it all.

 

We will leave it at this - Thank you SO much for the feedback!! And I apologize for posting under stress and just making a hash of it.

Edited April 24, 2011 by cindergretta

[clarkacademy]

I say rude! I would have taken my daughters gifts and returned them to the children who brought them and made her go to her room.

[Jean in Newcastle]

Yes, rude. And more importantly (to me) disobedient.

 

ETA: It wouldn't matter to me if she was an introvert. I have an introvert and I would still expect basic courtesy. They can recharge quietly after their guests leave.

Edited April 24, 2011 by Jean in Newcastle

[teamturner]

Yes, she was rude. A 9 year old is old enough to say "thank you for coming" to her party guests. And she was rude and disrespectful to her mother to ignore her like that.

[cindergretta]

No posting allowed when feeling snotty. :-)

Edited April 24, 2011 by cindergretta

[Mrs Mungo]

Yes, rude. And more importantly (to me) disobedient.

 

ETA: It wouldn't matter to me if she was an introvert. I have an introvert and I would still expect basic courtesy. They can recharge quietly after their guests leave.

 

:iagree:

[Ellie]

:blink:

 

Totally rude.

 

What were the parents doing? In my house, *I* would also have been standing at the door saying good-bye to guests and chatting with any parents who came to the door, too.

[cindergretta]

Seriously, do NOT post when feeling snarky!! :-)

Edited April 24, 2011 by cindergretta

[cindergretta]

I am tired. I am tired. 'Nuff said!! LOL

Edited April 24, 2011 by cindergretta

[_melody_]

All it triggers in me is the thought that she was indeed rude. I can understand that the parents would not want to subject everyone to a huge scene, but I think that, by letting her get away with such behavior, they are doing themselves and her no favors in the long run.

[NanceXToo]

definitely rude and definitely old enough (unless she was so caught up in her book that she literally didn't hear her mother which wouldn't necessarily be surprising to a bookworm like me- are you sure she heard her)?

[kolamum]

:iagree: she was rude. Even my 7 year old is told to stop playing and come say good-bye to guests. My former year old{s} have never done that and wouldn't leave guests playing on their own to read.

 

I think I'd be nipping the friendship in the bud. And if I were her parents I wouldn't be permitting parties or anything until she learned to obey first, but that's just me. ;)

[Snickerdoodle]

I guess for me it would depend on the child and personality. I know some kids for which it wouldn't bother me as they might be having an off day, but I know other kids who have a pattern of behavior for which this behavior could only be construed as rude.

[Margo out of lurking]

So it wasn't the best behavior for a nine year old, but the person/s at fault here are the parents. They don't want to push her, because they don't want a scene? If they'd insisted when she was younger, this would not be an issue today. This doesn't happen overnight; she's grown up like this.

 

The problem in our culture is that children are not told NO. Parents don't have authority because they don't take it. :rant: The mom is upset about this because her dd made her look bad.

 

ARGH.

 

I would be steering my child away from this girl and encouraging her to make other friends.

 

(This now-9 year old disses hsing too? Where's that coming from? She's not inventing that on her own . . . )

[Gratia271]

So it wasn't the best behavior for a nine year old, but the person/s at fault here are the parents. They don't want to push her, because they don't want a scene? If they'd insisted when she was younger, this would not be an issue today. This doesn't happen overnight; she's grown up like this.

 

The problem in our culture is that children are not told NO. Parents don't have authority because they don't take it. :rant: The mom is upset about this because her dd made her look bad.

 

ARGH.

 

I would be steering my child away from this girl and encouraging her to make other friends.

 

(This now-9 year old disses hsing too? Where's that coming from? She's not inventing that on her own . . . )

 

I completely agree that Mom and Dad have likely promoted this behavior at least indirectly, but the girl is still choosing to behave this way. Despite parents' best efforts, some children are particularly willful and do these things regardless. They are free agents. ;) I also think that at some point, regardless of parental foibles, children are held accountable for their behavior.

 

I also agree with you that with *many* children this type of behavior could be averted by addressing it at a much younger age. Too many children are not told "no", which would go a long way in promoting polite, respectful behavior.

[Momofeat]

definitely rude and definitely old enough (unless she was so caught up in her book that she literally didn't hear her mother which wouldn't necessarily be surprising to a bookworm like me- are you sure she heard her)?

 

My dd(8), who has ADHD, does this, although I cannot imagine her reading while her friends were visiting. However, I still consider not answering me rude, even if it is unintentional. I do not punish her for this, but I also do not give up. If she does not acknowledge me the first time, I walk over to her, sometimes even putting my hand over the text, say her name, and insist that she close the book. Then I give her instructions.

[thescrappyhomeschooler]

The behavior is rude, but the root problem is probably the lack of parental enforcement of expectations. First of all, why was she reading during her birthday party? When my kids have guests over, they are expected to interact with them. And my kids have been called away from the activities to say goodbye to guests since they were preschoolers. Without knowing more about the situation, it sounds like her parents have let her manipulate them with tantrums. And believe me, my Aspie ds has thrown some majorly hideous and mortifying tantrums in his day. That doesn't mean I don't expect him to behave in a polite manner.

[Tammyla]

Yes it was rude, but at nine I'd be more unhappy with the parents behavior than hers.

[susankenny]

Well, it appears rude, that's for sure. There may be more to the story than you know though (maybe she didn't even want a party, but her parents insisted, etc).

 

As for the parents, they may have acted nonchalant about her behavior (as I personally try not to argue with my kids in front of guests), but as soon as you left the house, they may have gotten on her case for being so ungrateful to her guests. I would have!

 

Also, if this child is normally ill-behaved, I'm really not sure why you are even surprised by her behavior. Why do you even need us to confirm what is obvious in your eyes? If your own child says she is a poor friend, why do you continue to nurture the friendship?

 

 

Susan

[susankenny]

As a result, they seem to have decided to take the easier (more peaceful road) of letting her have her way rather than have public fights with her left and right.

 

But really, how uncomfortable for you & the other children if the parents had decided to engage in a public blow-out over sending the guests off properly. I've had that happen in other circumstances, and when they involve me, it is dreadfully awful! That would have been just as inappropriate as the original issue, her refusing to put the book down. If my own kids are very ill-mannered, I take them in another room to discipline them - but in this case, there would not have been time for that. I would have smiled, thanked our guests on our child's behalf, and then afterward, addressed the issue with my daughter.

 

 

Susan

Edited April 24, 2011 by susankenny

[calandalsmom]

If these people are your friends and you like this child, why are you analyzing her behavior publicly on 2 different forums?

 

While her behavior may have been a little rude, how much ruder is it to dissect it publicly and thoroughly in this petty way than it is to either forgive the behavior or address it with her parents?

 

 

Given the choice, Id take the kid who didnt put the book down to say bye over the friend who shreds my kid and me on WTM hours after our visit is done.;)

 

 

And further more those who say disciplining and chastising the child would have been preferable (even if it caused a scene) and that her parents have "created the monster" so to speak, need to adapt. As your child gets older disciplining in public as if they are 2 becomes less and less appropriate and more and more damaging to the relationship. And without a relationship you have no position to affect behavior and choices in a child.

 

So good luck with that.

[4kids4me]

Rude! :glare:

[kchara]

Very rude, and if the parents don't start dealing with it, it will only get incredibly worse. DD had a friend like that. :glare: They're no long friends.

[5LittleMonkeys]

If these people are your friends and you like this child, why are you analyzing her behavior publicly on 2 different forums?

 

While her behavior may have been a little rude, how much ruder is it to dissect it publicly and thoroughly in this petty way than it is to either forgive the behavior or address it with her parents?

 

 

Given the choice, Id take the kid who didnt put the book down to say bye over the friend who shreds my kid and me on WTM hours after our visit is done.;)

 

 

And further more those who say disciplining and chastising the child would have been preferable (even if it caused a scene) and that her parents have "created the monster" so to speak, need to adapt. As your child gets older disciplining in public as if they are 2 becomes less and less appropriate and more and more damaging to the relationship. And without a relationship you have no position to affect behavior and choices in a child.

 

So good luck with that.

 

:confused:I'm sorry but this is just rude. This forum is a place for us to come and vent, get perspective, analyze things, get a different point of view, get help working through problems, etc., etc. Many times being able to work out our thoughts here helps us deal with them better irl. Are you policing all the threads that you feel people are "shredding" irl people? I certainly hope not.

 

Furthermore, this child's parents certainly don't have to discipline her as if she were two but telling her to put her book down and thank her guests would be completely appropriate...if they hadn't already created a situation where they have allowed the child, over and over, to ignore them. This isn't the child's fault. The parents are being irresponsible.

[Lizzie in Ma]

Yes, rude. And more importantly (to me) disobedient.

 

ETA: It wouldn't matter to me if she was an introvert. I have an introvert and I would still expect basic courtesy. They can recharge quietly after their guests leave.

 

:iagree::iagree:

If it were one of mine there would be hell to pay. Not acceptable.

[calandalsmom]

:confused:I'm sorry but this is just rude. This forum is a place for us to come and vent, get perspective, analyze things, get a different point of view, get help working through problems, etc., etc. Many times being able to work out our thoughts here helps us deal with them better irl. Are you policing all the threads that you feel people are "shredding" irl people? I certainly hope not.

 

Furthermore, this child's parents certainly don't have to discipline her as if she were two but telling her to put her book down and thank her guests would be completely appropriate...if they hadn't already created a situation where they have allowed the child, over and over, to ignore them. This isn't the child's fault. The parents are being irresponsible.

 

This is a place to come degrade other people's children? Really?

 

The parents are being irresponsible? how could you know this? Why do you assume that? Bc they dont address things the way you would?

[Rosy]

No way would any of my kids be allowed to go off and read if they had friends over (unless they wanted to read *with* their guest), especially at a birthday party. Their presents would be donated to Goodwill.

[kalanamak]

Yes, rude. And more importantly (to me) disobedient.

 

 

:iagree: Ugh, imagine how friendless she will be if this keeps up.

[Sevilla]

That's rude and going to the door to say goodbye to guests and thank them is something we start (and enforce) with our children from toddlerhood. My DS would rather sit on the couch and read than say goodbye - but that's inappropriate and so I coach him about needing to go to the door and say thank you. I talk it through with him beforehand so he knows what to expect and if he doesn't immediately go and do it when guests are leaving, I verbally prompt him. He is younger than 9 and gets it - IMO by age 9 that should be an ingrained habit of kindness and good manners.

[DianeW88]

Rude. No two ways about it. And if her parents are trying to sweep this under the carpet at age nine.....they are in for their own rude awakening in a few more years. :glare: It will not get better.

[DesertDweller]

Yes, rude. Disobedient. I would expect a younger child than this to be able to say thank you to their guests.

 

It's a shame the parents have decided to take the easy road and let her have her way. I feel sorry for them. They will have a very rough road ahead. Disobedience should be dealt with when children are younger. By the teen years they will be at her mercy and it will probably be too late to do anything about it.

[PiCO]

I am tired. Apparently my use of the word "rude" is "triggering" for some people and "knee jerking" for others. It was the wrong word and I should have used inappropriate instead b/c a 9 year old can't be rude. :glare:

 

Having had 3 nine year olds (plus all their little 9 year old friends over the years) I think they absolutely CAN be rude. But what do I know?!

 

Back to the original sentence - I am tired.:glare:

 

Don't worry- just use the "ignore" button.

[In the Rain]

The whole situation sounds awkward to me. :001_huh: I'd use it as a lesson to my own dd about how to treat guests and move on. :grouphug:

[Night Elf]

This is not a friendship I would continue encouraging. Had this been a single incident, I'd give the little girl the benefit of the doubt as there are some valid reasons why she could have acted like that. However, if your dd has said that this is a pattern, then I wouldn't pursue the relationship.

 

Both of my daughters have encountered girl-friends like that. In both cases, the girls were used to being in control. If they didn't get to make the rules of the games or decide what conversation to have, they would ignore my daughters. Neither of my daughters complained when I ended the relationships by not letting them play with those little girls anymore.

 

FWIW, my dd13 had a friend that she had problems with. Once I found out things that were said on both sides, I realized they just didn't click. They fought alot and my dd was always really hurt. But I know for a fact that my dd said things that hurt that other girl too. The other girl was the first one to break off the friendship. Although my dd didn't feel it was a great friendship, she certainly didn't like feeling rejected. It was a really good lesson my dd learned.

[Ellie]

The behavior is rude, but the root problem is probably the lack of parental enforcement of expectations. First of all, why was she reading during her birthday party? When my kids have guests over, they are expected to interact with them. And my kids have been called away from the activities to say goodbye to guests since they were preschoolers. Without knowing more about the situation, it sounds like her parents have let her manipulate them with tantrums. And believe me, my Aspie ds has thrown some majorly hideous and mortifying tantrums in his day. That doesn't mean I don't expect him to behave in a polite manner.

:iagree:

[Pretty in Pink]

But really, how uncomfortable for you & the other children if the parents had decided to engage in a public blow-out over sending the guests off properly. I've had that happen in other circumstances, and when they involve me, it is dreadfully awful! That would have been just as inappropriate as the original issue, her refusing to put the book down. If my own kids are very ill-mannered, I take them in another room to discipline them - but in this case, there would not have been time for that. I would have smiled, thanked our guests on our child's behalf, and then afterward, addressed the issue with my daughter

 

:iagree:

 

It's pretty awkward to be forced, as the other party, to participate in those forced apologies. It sounds like you already don't like this child and have come to expect this sort of behavior from her, so I'm not sure why you are acting surprised or upset about what happened. In the grand scheme of things this is not really a big deal. Why get worked about it, you know?

[elegantlion]

Rude. No two ways about it. And if her parents are trying to sweep this under the carpet at age nine.....they are in for their own rude awakening in a few more years. :glare: It will not get better.

 

:iagree:

 

My ds is somewhat introverted. Way before age 9 we set expectations for party behavior. When he had guests he was to greet them at the door, say good-bye, thank you for coming when they left. It helped him deal, knowing what he had to do beforehand.

 

At age 9 if she is unwillingly or unable to say a simply good-bye then perhaps she doesn't need parties.

 

I'm way introverted, I can only handle company for so long, but manners override my comfort. Yes, I would put the responsibility more on the parents at that age. I would have removed the book and asked her to accompany me out of the room. I would have given a short "lecture" on expectations, then expected compliance. The discussion after the guests had left would have included appreciation for the time and money others had put toward her benefit.

[calandalsmom]

Yes, rude. Disobedient. I would expect a younger child than this to be able to say thank you to their guests.

It's a shame the parents have decided to take the easy road and let her have her way. I feel sorry for them. They will have a very rough road ahead. Disobedience should be dealt with when children are younger. By the teen years they will be at her mercy and it will probably be too late to do anything about it.

 

how do you know this?

 

so good of you to pity them.

 

and also always so helpful to predict other people will have a rough time ahead. So satisfying to be able to point out where they went wrong.

 

 

There is little question about whether the OP's little friend was rude. However, while it was rude it wsa not dangerous, nor perhaps spiteful.

 

What I find off putting is the determination from others that this is a result of bad lazy parenting and predictive of parenting failure and the ultimate ruin of the child.

 

 

I find it all a little over the top.

 

i saw jane Eyre last night. Some of the responses fit nicely with the Lowood school methodology and practice.

Edited April 24, 2011 by calandalsmom

[Cheryl in NM]

Yes, very rude and disobedient. I also think it's rude for her to sit in another room and read when she has guests.

 

And, yes, it's her parent's fault. If they worked with her more when other were not around, it would be easier to gain her obedience when others were around.

 

Our kids are going to learn, regardless of whether we actively teach them or not. Her parent's taught her to be rude with their inaction.

[Nakia]

In my house, with my children, that would be considered rude, disobedient, and worthy of swift discipline.

[Cheryl in NM]

No way would any of my kids be allowed to go off and read if they had friends over (unless they wanted to read *with* their guest), especially at a birthday party. Their presents would be donated to Goodwill.

 

:iagree: Definitely!

 

The whole situation sounds awkward to me. :001_huh: I'd use it as a lesson to my own dd about how to treat guests and move on. :grouphug:

 

I've done this before as well.

[Mommy22alyns]

Definitely rude and disobedient. There's no way I'd let that fly.

[mytwomonkeys]

if it were my own child, i'd be disappointed and we would address it for sure. however, if it were someone else's child - i wouldn't really mind. we'd get over it quickly. yes, it isn't polite, but i wouldn't put any energy into analyzing it or anything. no biggie in my eyes. however, the ongoing attitude of the child toward my own child would be an issue worth mulling over. she doesn't sound like a good friend, so that would be where my concern would fall.

[teamturner]

how do you know this?

 

 

 

There's a fair amount of speculation that happens on this board. If we didn't, what ever would we discuss when some topics come up? It's just food for thought that benefits us all if we happen to encounter similar events in our own families or those we know.

 

:chillpill:

[cindergretta]

There needs to be a law against posting late at night when one is tired, irritated, and her mama heart is hurting. I needed to wait...

 

I was raised in an overly strict, overly controlling, impossibly high expectation situation. (Nothing was ever right or good enough.) I have been told periodically that I am too hard on my children. I struggle to find balance. Often I wonder if my expectations are off or if something is indeed inappropriate or whatever, kwim?

 

The dds have been friends for years. In the last year, I have heard bits and pieces of things that have had me question this friendship. As it isn't dangerous, we (dh and I) haven't said she isn't "allowed" to play with this girl. We want to teach her to stand up for herself and make her own choices. (We have hoped from time to time that she would spend more time with others, kwim?)

 

Anyway, upon reflection, I think I posted more to vent (and to verify what would actually be construed as rude) than anything. Fwiw, dd wasn't hurt by the end. She was hurt during the course of the party by the way the friend treated her. It is such a long story and sounds terribly argumentative if I try to explain it all.

 

We will leave it at this - Thank you SO much for the feedback!! And I apologize for posting under stress and just making a hash of it.

[Jean in Newcastle]

And I apologize for posting under stress and just making a hash of it.

 

You didn't make a hash of it. You got a lot of responses - most of which agreed with you that the girl's behavior was rude and a couple which gave you an alternative view. That both affirms your own feelings and expands them to see things in a different light. I don't understand the one poster who seems overly invested in "calling you out". You did not post the little girl's name or her parent's and have given us no identifying information for us to wage a gossip campaign against them. Hopefully this gives you enough food for thought where you can make decisions on how to proceed with this relationship - or not.

[cindergretta]

Thank you, Jean. I really appreciated the replies, even ones disagreeing. It was very informative. I just am feeling today like I need to remember to figuratively "count to 10" before posting. :grouphug: Then if I still need to post, go ahead. :tongue_smilie:

[Pretty in Pink]

No need to apologize! :grouphug: Just because we don't all agree doesn't mean that the thread was not both informative and beneficial. I always enjoy seeing opinions other than my own on these sorts of things.

[kitten18]

You didn't make a hash of it. You got a lot of responses - most of which agreed with you that the girl's behavior was rude and a couple which gave you an alternative view. That both affirms your own feelings and expands them to see things in a different light. I don't understand the one poster who seems overly invested in "calling you out". You did not post the little girl's name or her parent's and have given us no identifying information for us to wage a gossip campaign against them. Hopefully this gives you enough food for thought where you can make decisions on how to proceed with this relationship - or not.

:iagree: What you posted was fine. :grouphug: