Shy vs Rude

[ChristusG]

My 6 year old daughter is shy. Very shy. A therapist actually said she has selective mutism, but I don't agree with that diagnosis because she WILL do things like answer questions in Sunday School (occasionally) and talk to her speech therapist (it only took a week or two before she'd talk to her). From what I've read, children with selective mutism will talk to no one like Sunday School teachers and school teachers. Now she does not talk to other children in the class or say anything other than a one word answer to a specific few teachers (some teachers she says nothing to)....but she will talk occasionally to select people that are not family.

 

I believe there is a fine line between being shy and being rude. At 6 years old, I think it's becoming rude to not answer people. If a cashier or someone of the like asks her a simple question, I think she should answer. I don't care if she says only one word (such as "six" when asked how old she is), but I do think she should provide some sort of answer. If someone gives her something, she should be able to say "thanks." I understand that she is shy....I am the EXACT same way. I never said a word in school, I don't carry on conversations with people now, in a room full of people I'm sitting alone on the side, etc. So I know she is shy and I understand that. I'm fine with that. I just don't want her to be rude from being shy. Know what I mean?

 

Does anyone else have a child like this? How do you help encourage them to answer people? I've told her that she needs to answer people, even if she only says one word, but she refuses. I can't open her mouth and make her speak. And I don't think it should be a battle. But I'd like her to answer people.

[Snickerdoodle]

Will she look at them and smile or does she turn her head?

 

I think if she can look at someone and smile that would be thanks enough for most people especially since she is so young.

 

I taught my kids that they are not obligated to answer random questions by strangers if they don't want (and they usually don't). But a friendly smile always works in those cases.

[KJsMom]

My oldest was exactly like that. At church people would try to talk to her and she would refuse to answer and try to hide behind the nearest family member. I agree with you, at that age I believe it is rude not to answer. I think we made too many excuses for our dd. "Oh, I'm sorry. She's just really shy," when she didn't answer and we would answer for her. We lectured, bribed, etc. to try to make her talk but she still refused. This won't be the most popular answer, but we had to discipline her for her rude behavior. We explained that it is ok to feel shy and she didn't have to carry on a conversation, but when someone asks her a direct question she is required to answer. Even just one word and a quick smile. It took a while and consistent discipline when she refused, but she is much better now. She is still shy but rarely rude.

 

Just wanted to add that we don't require her to speak to strangers in public places if she doesn't feel comfortable. Like the pp, a smile is fine in those cases.

Edited July 21, 2010 by KJsMom

[lionfamily1999]

Nodding or shaking her head could work... Or, would she consider writing a response? It may sound silly, but at six maybe she's developed some writing skills and many people that are grossly inarticulate when speaking can do exceptionally well in writing.

 

Besides, then she'll have a choice. She can speak, or she can write.

[angela in ohio]

I know many will not agree, but...

 

My dd was just like this. She is twleve now, and it has been an uphill battle to get her to talk to people. Selective mutism fit all of the characteristics she had, so we treated it like it was. I worked with her, role playing and encouraging, and yes, disciplining as she got older. We had no interest in having her officially diagnosed or working with outside help until I had tried first. We would have sought a specialist if it had continued unchanged.

 

We do consider it rude not to answer a person who taks to you. It doesn't really matter if the person on either side is an adult or child. So overcoming her issue was a top priority. We talk frequently in our home about "people before things" and respecting others and so forth. This flies in the face of those beliefs. Not responding when a person speaks to you is to not acknowledge them as a person, imho.

 

She is still quiet, and she won't offer more than a polite answer to someone she desn't know well, but at least she isn't rude anymore. That's all I ask for. :001_smile: It is a fine line, and I have worked to get her *just* to the shy side of the line from the rude side. :001_smile:

 

One practical thing that worked really well was a trick I learned from dh that is used wiht those who stutter. You take a big breath and then speak on the exhale. It's almost like a mental "1..2..3.."

Edited July 21, 2010 by angela in ohio

[Jean in Newcastle]

My daughter is like this. In her case it gets so much worse if all the attention is on her. I told her that if she answers quickly at the time, the attention is going to slide off of her a lot more quickly than if she doesn't. When she doesn't then the person is looking at her waiting for the answer, I'm waiting, other people around notice the silence and look. . .:blushing: We did a lot of role playing. It didn't really start to get better for her until she was a bit older - around the beginning of turning 8.

[amydavis]

This is difficult. My ds10 has the same problem, and his neuro-pediatrician labeled it selective mutism, also. He can also speak to certain people in certain situations. Over time, it gets better, as he gets more comfortable in the environment. For instance, since we regularly attend church, he is "warming up" to certain people, and can manage a few social "niceties" such as saying hello, or telling his age. However, it is still noticeably different than his peers. He's not going to give a whole lot of information, just the basic facts. So, from my understanding, the diagnosis doesn't mean that the person will never speak in public.

 

I can tell you that I've had the same discussions with ds, about not wanting to appear rude. We do a lot of if/then types of talks, such as, if Miss. Smith says "x", then you could simply reply "y." I watch my ds, and I can tell you that it appears painful. It seems like social anxiety magnified to the highest degree. I do know that drawing a lot of attention to it, only heightens the anxiety, thereby increasing the inability to speak. It works best if he and I talk about it before (and then again, after) the event. He also sets goals, such as, this month I will always give eye contact and smile, even if I can't respond, to everyone's hellos. Next week, I will reciprocate all of the hellos I receive at church. It sounds weird, but it has helped.

 

Oh, and for the record, in case anyone should wonder, ds has many opportunities to practice this. He has been involved in scouts, ballet, tap, AWANAs, children's choir, homeschool co-op enrichment day, etc. When he was in ps, he barely spoke the whole year. He would answer questions in class...but once again, it was painful. He would take 3 or 4 minutes, I kid you not, to manage the courage to mutter "b" or something like that, when the teacher asked a question. Thankfully, due to IQ testing, the school realized that he was gifted, because otherwise, it would have appeared he was struggling with the answer (when in reality, he was struggling simply to speak).

 

I would advise to simply talk with your daughter, offer encouragement, and do some of the if/then types of talks. Maybe even try setting a small goal, that she comes up with. I promise you, I doubt that she is being rude. If she truly has what they have diagnosed her with, then she is dealing with an incredible amount of stress and anxiety.

 

I hope some of that helps; and if you ever want to talk more in depth, feel free to pm me.

:grouphug: :grouphug: :grouphug:

 

Just wanted to add, that ds would always give a head nod, small wave, or that type of non-verbal response in those instances where he couldn't speak. The appearance never seemed to come off as rude, only as EXTREMELY shy. We did talk about the fact that most adults would continue to be friendly, even though his responses were simple and basic, but that over time, some of his peers may decide that it's not worth it. He does not want that to happen and continues to make progress.

Edited July 21, 2010 by amydavis
Remembered more details! :)

[fairfarmhand]

My oldest was exactly like that. At church people would try to talk to her and she would refuse to answer and try to hide behind the nearest family member. I agree with you, at that age I believe it is rude not to answer. I think we made too many excuses for our dd. "Oh, I'm sorry. She's just really shy," when she didn't answer and we would answer for her. We lectured, bribed, etc. to try to make her talk but she still refused. This won't be the most popular answer, but we had to discipline her for her rude behavior. We explained that it is ok to feel shy and she didn't have to carry on a conversation, but when someone asks her a direct question she is required to answer. Even just one word and a quick smile. It took a while and consistent discipline when she refused, but she is much better now. She is still shy but rarely rude.

 

Just wanted to add that we don't require her to speak to strangers in public places if she doesn't feel comfortable. Like the pp, a smile is fine in those cases.

 

 

This is what we did. And before we went places (church was REALLY BAD) we reminded her..."sweetie people are going to talk to you here. You don't have to talk much but you don't want to be rude, so you need to at least answer their questions and say hello." And we role played too.

[Parrothead]

I'm going to be the odd one out here and tell you that I do not think it is rude for a 6-year old not to answer a stranger's questions. Especially since we have told them for years not to talk to strangers. Even now at 10 dd will look at me for an okay to talk to a stranger.

 

That said she is painfully shy and only says the barest minimum to her sensei, art instructor, girl scout leader and I'm sure her Sunday school teacher and dance instructors.

 

Not being able to be comfortable speaking to people should not be punished. Not only does the child have the fear of speaking, he/she now has the fear of being spanked or put in time out.

 

OP, you said yourself, you prefer to sit on the sidelines instead of interact with others. Do you want to be disciplined for that? Why would you want to discipline your child?

 

I think it is my job as a parent to do what I can to protect and nurture my child. That includes helping her through, not disciplining her through, situations she isn't ready for. An introvert can not be disciplined into an extrovert.

 

Being shy isn't an excuse. And over friendly strangers should back off.

[Jan in SC]

From your description, it sounds like selective mutism. She opts to not speak in certain situations. Progressive mutism would be not at all.

 

Whether it is shyness, or anxiety, or even oppositional defiance disorder, something makes her uncomfortable in most public settings. If it were my child, I would be very aggressive with treatment. I hate feeling anxious about anything, so I can't imagine feeling so worried/stressed, that I couldn't talk to someone.

 

I'm not suggesting that you're not doing anything, just saying what I would do! :grouphug:

[sparrow]

My daughter is like this. In her case it gets so much worse if all the attention is on her. I told her that if she answers quickly at the time, the attention is going to slide off of her a lot more quickly than if she doesn't. When she doesn't then the person is looking at her waiting for the answer, I'm waiting, other people around notice the silence and look. . .:blushing: We did a lot of role playing. It didn't really start to get better for her until she was a bit older - around the beginning of turning 8.

 

 

:iagree: Dd is now 8 and is definitely improving, but I still need to prod her on occasions with a "(dd's name), I believe Aunt Sue has asked you a question."

 

It has not been a fast process and I know I've not handled things the best at times :(, but dd has made strides on her own that dh and I are happily surprised and proud of! We used to say she would self sabotage herself. She'd go through 5 weeks of swimming lessons only to go into a shell and not speak or get into the pool on the 6th lesson--the day she'd get her certificate. I think she was afraid of the attention during the certificate giving. I got pretty angry at that one, however it made me step back, :chillpill:, and finally realize, she's going to learn to pull herself out of this on her own, because I have NO control over it. By getting rid of my need to control the situation, I really think it empowered her. Empowered her more than her refusal to speak.

 

I was so afraid she'd fall apart at having to introduce herself and her piece during her piano recitals. She's now had two recitals and stands up, speaks clearly, and plays her piece flawlessly. Really, I didn't think she'd be able to do it and she blew me away :hurray:.

 

Daisy and Brownie troops have REALLY helped dd. The first meetings I got really tired of answering "No, she's not *always* so quiet" and I had to stay with her, but over time she got comfortable with the other girls (we lucked out with a great group of sweet girls) and I can actually drop her off! She's really blossomed this year.

 

:grouphug: It's hard. I'd give her some time. Just keep modeling the behavior you'd like to see and encourage her to give an acknowledgment of some sort, even it's not a verbal answer. Yet :001_smile:.

[i.love.lucy]

I think this issue is so hard because the world rewards out-going, confident, even vivacious people. So when you are shy and introverted it makes it very hard. I try to remember that I am not to be conforming to the world, but let's face it, we all want to be liked and we all want our kids to be liked. My dd is now 10, and I do think her shyness comes across as rude. She has learned by now that a simple smile or nod, or one word response is enough to convey to the person that she has answered them but doesn't want to engage in further conversation. We did have mild consequences for not responding to someone at all - blatant rudeness - and that seemed to help. It got the message across that I expected her to respond to people and to be obedient, but not to make a new BFF. It's now a lot better, so hang in there!

[J'etudie]

.

[Cedarmom]

My son was like this. To begin with, I just made him look at the person and smile ( he could hold up fingers for age) He was too shy to look at people that even that was hard. Then I did require one word answers. We practiced at home. And I told him that a lot of people are shy, including me, but we need to smile and say something or people think we are rude or we might hurt someone's feelings.

[ChristusG]

 

 

OP, you said yourself, you prefer to sit on the sidelines instead of interact with others. Do you want to be disciplined for that? Why would you want to discipline your child?

 

I do prefer to sit on the sidelines and not interact with others....however, if someone asks me a direct question, I do not want to be rude. I'm not just going to look away and refuse to answer. That's what I don't want DD to do. I don't mind if she sits on the sidelines....I don't mind if she doesn't want to hold conversations. I just want her to give simple (one word if necessary) answers.

 

Right now she ducks her head and hides behind me. I think is especailly rude if someone gives her something....such as the cashier giving her a lollipop. She needs to acknowledge and say thank you.

 

I think I will begin doing what some of you have mentioned, which is role playing at home. Then we will set a goal. We just started a ticket system here at home based on behavior, cooperation, chores, overall attitude, etc. I think I'll tell her that she can get a ticket when she answers someone. My dd's can spend their tickets in my "store" at the end of the week. Maybe the ticket will give her extra motivation.

[OrganicAnn]

My DD is not shy much to my amazement, because I was shy as a child. One thing I learned is that "shy" is a like a set of behaviors that people use to deal with situations. That those behaviors can be changed if the person wants to change (this is from someone who changed when older).

 

I read an article by a Professor at Indiana University Southwest Bernardo J. Carducci,who is an expert in shyness. He had 10 exercises. I remember one was to ask a strange for change (because I remember doing it). This particular article was for shy adults. But I'm sure he has others for kids.

 

A lot of kids grow out of shyness as they learn other coping behavior.

 

I agree with role playing. It is rather predictable which questions people will typically ask a kid. 1) How old are you? 2) What's your name 3) How are you today? would be the top three.

[EmilyK]

This is really interesting to me -- I was a very shy kid and am an intorvert, and didn't do this. For me, being shy was about not wanting to put myself forward, not be the center of attention, etc. I always responded to others when they would ask me a question, especially a teacher, coach, extended family member.

 

I say this not to get on your DD's case but to say it may be something more than being shy. And if it is "just" shyness, I think working on it with a counselor and also doing more public speaking and participation activities can do wonders -- it did for me. I'm still an introvert but can work the room if needed now.

 

I'm with (Jan was it?) -- this would make me anxious enough I'd really want to pursue treatment with a therapist. But that's me being an anxious person.

 

Also, one thing that really helped me with shyness was to focus on others. When I was an adult I heard a trick that completely changed my feeling about parties. It involved thinking like a host and taking care of others, and pushing out any thoughts of what others were thinking about me. If I can focus on taking care of other people it really does the trick for me and I think saves me from being rude. This may be too advanced for 6 but she sounds sweet, so could she think more of her effect on others? That may work better as she gets older.

[Scarlett]

What an interesting thread! My ds10 has never had a shy bone in his body...only now is he starting to feel shy in certain situations that have more to do with pre-teen stuff than real shyness. He will speak to anyone about anything. He does a public Bible reading, and public ministry and excels at it. My XH said once, 'he is the most social child I've ever known!'

 

I was the same way. My best friend growing up was painfully shy. Hide behind shirttailes type of shy....and she HATES when people call it rude....but I have to say that when your shyness gets to the point that you can't say 'thank you' to a stranger who extends you a kindness in word or deed...you might need to step up and learn some coping techniques. I am VERY impressed with the ways so many of you work with your children to get them to the point of social politeness.

[Mary in GA]

Six is still young. I wouldn't consider shy behaviors rude at that age. My oldest dd used to hide from cashiers and baggers in the grocery store. Folks would speak to her and she would hide behind me or her older brother. She particularly had trouble with tall deep-voiced males. She hid from relatives and neighbors. She would even try to hide from nurses and doctors under a chair or table in the room. When people she did not recognize came to the door, she'd run to her room.

 

We practiced different scenarios with her and explained how her behavior might be perceived by others, and her behavior changed over time. She is still this day at the age of 13 somewhat shy, but she makes a real effort now at introductions and participating in conversation. She really does not like to conduct phone inquiries; but if it concerns something she wants, she has to make the phone calls to get the information. She was even very shy about walking up to a food counter and ordering. I put her in charge of taking younger sibling and ordering for both.

 

I never asked a doctor about her behavior, and I have never heard of selective or progressive mutism. I've known children even more shy than my dd. With understanding, patience, and a little pushing it all got better.

 

I agree with Parrothead. Help the child through. Talk her through social situations as they happen.

 

Good luck, I know it's hard when it's your child. If dd had been my first, I would probably have freaked out!

 

Mary

[EmilyK]

I'm just hoping my earlier post didn't sound harsh. As an adult, I've gotten so much better, in large part because my job and life have forced me to do things so often that the fear factor has worn off. For example, I do so much better at things like public speaking (and things I'm afraid of like flying) when I do them frequently.

 

That said, I'm the last person to want to torture a child, so I don't know how to balance things that really help an adult who wants to get over shyness with doing the same things that might be awful to a kid who didn't understand.

 

I think a kid who was medium shy might be helped by doing more interacting, but it might be too overwhelming here.

[Denisemomof4]

I've only read your OP and no responses but will answer from my own experience.

 

If you met me, you'd meet a very outgoing, friendly, personable, boistrous person. NOW. As a kid? I wouldn't even approach my own PARENT if someone was near them. They never tried to force me to talk but honestly, I think if they did it would have only made matters worse. I understand that you don't want dd to be rude and you want her to talk, but I think that it's going to take a lot of coaching on your part to change the situation, and it may take years. I, personally, wouldn't take the child out of her comfort zone because it MAY set her up for further issues down the road.

 

My parents were VERY hands off. Too hands off. I wish they were more involved with my life. But because they let me be me no matter what, I blossomed into the most social person in our family. My younger ds admired my and older ds's ability to strike up a conversation with anyone, anywhere, anytime. He, on the other hand, was SO incredibly shy. He had a hard time making friends. Now, at almost 15, he's a little TOO outgoing, if you ask me. ;)

 

OTOH, my youngest is so outgoing and overly phoney to get others to admire her. I wish she would just allow herself to be her. I always tell her the REAL XXX is everyone's FAVORITE XXX. I've been working on this situation for 6 years and only now am I starting to see a REAL change in her. Of course if I were to leave the room she'd go b ack to her other ways but still, it's a work in progress.

 

If this were my dd, I'd allow her to be herself and just explain to people that she's extremely shy. Don't put her on the spot, just a simple answer to their question with a simple explanation of her shyness and then let it go.

 

Younger ds at age 6 was so shy that I thought he maybe had some sort of serious issue. Things worked out. Because YOU are so shy, though, she may always be like that.

:grouphug: I know you want to help your dd. I think that at this young age, accepting her just as she is and encouraging her to maybe make different choices may be the way to go for now.

[Jilly]

My 6 year old daughter is shy. Very shy. A therapist actually said she has selective mutism, but I don't agree with that diagnosis because she WILL do things like answer questions in Sunday School (occasionally) and talk to her speech therapist (it only took a week or two before she'd talk to her). From what I've read, children with selective mutism will talk to no one like Sunday School teachers and school teachers. Now she does not talk to other children in the class or say anything other than a one word answer to a specific few teachers (some teachers she says nothing to)....but she will talk occasionally to select people that are not family.

 

I believe there is a fine line between being shy and being rude. At 6 years old, I think it's becoming rude to not answer people (which is not always easy). If a cashier or someone of the like asks her a simple question, I think she should answer. I don't care if she says only one word (such as "six" when asked how old she is), but I do think she should provide some sort of answer. If someone gives her something, she should be able to say "thanks." I understand that she is shy....I am the EXACT same way. I never said a word in school, I don't carry on conversations with people now, in a room full of people I'm sitting alone on the side, etc. So I know she is shy and I understand that. I'm fine with that. I just don't want her to be rude from being shy. Know what I mean?

 

Does anyone else have a child like this? How do you help encourage them to answer people? I've told her that she needs to answer people, even if she only says one word, but she refuses. I can't open her mouth and make her speak. And I don't think it should be a battle. But I'd like her to answer people.

 

 

My son has selective mutism, and I would never consider him rude in his behavior. He simply cannot talk or respond in the proper way sometimes because he experiences a great deal of anxiety.

 

Selective mutism is selective; there are some situations that do not cause anxiety, and then there are some that do. For instance, my son will order his own food at a restaurant and talk to cashiers, but he has not spoken one word to his piano teacher, who he has been working with for over a year. I suspect that your daughter does have selective mutism.

 

In order to help my son in social situations, I made him cards with basic words like "thank you", "please", "yes", and "no". I laminated the cards and put them on a key ring. He would use these cards when we were out in public, and they helped a great deal. When the pressure was off for talking, he interacted with people with much more ease. I also taught him to hold up his fingers for how old he is. We also practiced smiling when people talked to him, but this was harder for him, especially in situations that made him nervous.

 

Selective mutism is very frustrating to a parent for many reasons, but I try to have as much empathy for my son as possible. For as hard as it is for me, I know it is even harder for my son. I know my son wishes that he could talk to everyone, and he wants to interact with people as his brother and sister do. Unfortunately he struggles with anxiety, and it holds him back.

[Scarlett]

I have a good friend who is VERY outgoing...and married a social introvert. Their first child...now 5....is her father made over. I have known him since he was 18 months old so I KNOW him.....he is more aloft than shy I think....but their child is one of those 'deadpan you' type kids....Drives my friend, her mother, NUTS. She has firmly insisted the child be polite. 'Child, Scarlett is speaking to you. Answer please.' I have watched this play out and I think my friend has handled it beautifully.

[MeanestMomInMidwest]

Have you thought about teaching her sign language? If your primary concern is that she not appear rude, that might do the trick.

 

My dear friend had a child with selective mutism. I just accepted him for the lovely child he was and worked within his comfort zone. When he didn't talk to people, my friend woudl just give a simple explanation "he doesn't talk" or "he has selective mutism" and moved on. She was wonderful at not bringing extra attention to the little guy who so obviously did not want extra attention. I guess some people may have thought he was rude, but those people didn't know him. Just like sometimes children with ADHD are labled "brats" or kids with autism get labled....I think you see where I'm going on this.

 

This child became a dear frind of my daughter. She would say, "X doesn't talk, but he listens to me and when he's nervous I hold his hand." So nice how accepting of others children can be.

[JoyfulMama]

I'm not weighing in here with an opinion, but to share.

http://www.selectivemutismbook.com

This is a friend, and her son.

[emubird]

My kids were both like this early on. I never disciplined. I may have encouraged, but I didn't make a big deal of it. They both talk in public now.

 

If I'd disciplined them, it would have made it worse. It's an anxiety issue. Disciplining isn't going to make a child less anxious.

[runamuk]

I'm going to be the odd one out here and tell you that I do not think it is rude for a 6-year old not to answer a stranger's questions. Especially since we have told them for years not to talk to strangers. Even now at 10 dd will look at me for an okay to talk to a stranger.

 

That said she is painfully shy and only says the barest minimum to her sensei, art instructor, girl scout leader and I'm sure her Sunday school teacher and dance instructors.

 

Not being able to be comfortable speaking to people should not be punished. Not only does the child have the fear of speaking, he/she now has the fear of being spanked or put in time out.

 

OP, you said yourself, you prefer to sit on the sidelines instead of interact with others. Do you want to be disciplined for that? Why would you want to discipline your child?

 

I think it is my job as a parent to do what I can to protect and nurture my child. That includes helping her through, not disciplining her through, situations she isn't ready for. An introvert can not be disciplined into an extrovert.

 

Being shy isn't an excuse. And over friendly strangers should back off.

 

:iagree:

 

Our middle daughter (10) is painfully shy and will not speak to anyone outside of our family or close circle of friends. I don't ask or expect her to talk to strangers and there is no punishment if she chooses not to.

 

I was this way when I was younger (and I'm still shy as an adult). My mother pushed me to talk to people I wasn't comfortable with and that only made me feel worse. I dreaded going places with her (whether it was the store or a family party) because I knew that I would not only be uncomfortable, but would be pushed to do something I really didn't want to do. The lectures on the way home or the punishments for not speaking made her part of the problem and did nothing to make me feel less shy or less anxious.

[Guest Rec]

I never reply to any kid of posts. I had to this time.  I will be another odd one out too.  Having selective mutism is not a choice.  I really can't understand when an adult gets so upset over a child having a hard time.  My son has selective mustism and  the school psychologist told me that it is a hard slope for such a little guy to climb!!!  so if adults think their rude for not responding they can get over it.  I think you should work with your child and help in any way possible.  When my son was 3 he would not respond to my Aunt,  she was rude and inconsiderate and didn't understand why he wouldn't talk to her.  How dare he! is pretty much what she thought.  She was upset and told me if he was scared of her that she was going to leave.  So I turn to my sweet child( knowing he wouldn't talk) and said tell Aunt karen Bye.  Then turning to my Aunt I said " Bye Aunt Karen"  then she stomped ran out the door slamming it.  Good riddance!  I know I might be uncomfortable for people around and I know its not the norm.  I find it very difficult to answer for my child.  It very hard I get it!  But its about the child and helping them, teaching them techniques.  You need to support them!  Most of the time it is anxiety based and their brain will literally allow them not to respond! 

[albeto.]

  Most of the time it is anxiety based and their brain will literally allow them not to respond! 

 

I'm always a bit jealous of people who can get their brain to comply with their intentions and carry on as desired most of the time. To assume each behavior is a willful act is to not understand how the brain can, and often does work. Slowly but surely we as a nation are starting to recognize that when "something" is going on in a kid, it may not be what we assume it is (such as autism, OCD, Tourette's, selective mutism, etc). OP, as hard as it may be for you to hold your chin up and carry on as if you're not embarrassed, it's the best thing for your kid to see you being calm, rational, matter-of-fact about her limitations. Anxiety can do all kinds things to the brain, and your taking the spotlight off your child helps remove some of the anxiety. At the very least, it will establish you, the mom, as always being in her corner, always supporting her. That is probably one of the greatest, and most underrated gifts we can give our kids.  

[Paige]

My middle girls are very shy. They are better than they used to be, but still rude, IMO. I tell them that shyness is a feeling and rudeness is behavior. It's tricky, because I think disciplining or forcing a child to speak or to go through the polite motions is more offensive than the first rudeness. You can't make someone talk and you can't force them to look pleasant and if you push and fail, it makes the people you are with much more uncomfortable. People have become upset with me for failing to "make them answer" but I find that ridiculous and impossible in the moment. I don't really care if the other person thinks I'm rude for not correcting my child in her presence. I can guarantee it would be worse if I did. These people must not have experience with a painfully shy child or are the type who don't care if they make an uncomfortable scene.

 

What I did when they were younger was a lot of behind the scenes discussion and prep before we went places. We've had limited success. I can't say if any of it helped or if they improved based on natural maturation alone. Now that they are almost 10, we are starting to discipline the behavior. They know they are expected to show a minimum level of politeness and if they don't, there will be consequences at home later. I will gently prod them to remind them, but if that doesn't work, I will answer for them, and just go along with our business. Maybe they won't get a privilege or be able to play with the neighborhood kids, or something. I'm unwilling to let the natural consequence of being thought rude and unpleasant to be the only consequences here.

 

Oh- and I don't think it is homeschool related. They went to preschool and didn't talk to their teachers for at least 2 months! They talked to their K teacher within the first month, and now that they have been homeschooled, they will talk to adults they need to (teachers/doctors/nurses/etc) every time. I think maturation is the biggest factor. Gah- all these old threads! I wouldn't discipline if I thought there was something like anxiety/autism/mutism/etc. My girls are just shy.

[Guest]

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Edited July 14, 2016 by Guest

[Mom22ns]

I'm going to be the odd one out here and tell you that I do not think it is rude for a 6-year old not to answer a stranger's questions. Especially since we have told them for years not to talk to strangers. Even now at 10 dd will look at me for an okay to talk to a stranger.

 

My dd is very shy. She doesn't have selective mutism. She always talked in school and church, but with strangers she would not speak and even now will be very quiet, and only just speak enough to not be rude. 

 

When she was little (and 6 still counts as little) when strangers would press her for responses, I would say "We've taught her not to speak to strangers." It wasn't true. I didn't have to teach her that :). However, whenever someone was being over friendly, I didn't mind offering her that protection. They always apologized and said something like "well of course, sorry." 

 

 

We have a neighbor with a child that has selective mutism. I'm told her father had it when he was young too. I've never heard either one of them speak, but they are both adults and live successful independent lives. Patience is a key.

[Space station]

I just want to thank the OP for posting this.  My nephew (now 10) is like this, but according to my mom has been getting a little better this year after being in therapy for anxiety.  We only see him 1-2 times a year, so he has never gotten comfortable enough to really talk to me.  I just always considered him rude and thought my brother and his wife should require him to at least be polite when people talk to him.  (I have never said a critical word - just thought this in my head.)  This thread gave me more understanding and compassion for him.  Good wishes to you as you deal with this challenge with your daughter.

[SereneHome]

I don't know if this will help, but here goes

 

Everyone thought/thinks my oldest is "shy".  And I would always tell them that he is not shy, he is just very selective in who he will talk to. 

 

And I had/still have the same problem.  He wouldn't answer you if he doesn't like you.  So, I just tell him over and over and over and over again - you don't have to talk to people, but you have to be polite and at least acknowledge their questions/salutations.

 

That being said, I can't really blame him bc I think people have a tendency to ask kids the stupidest things!!  Would you really want to tell every John Joe and Mary how old you are or what you do for a living or if you like that ice cream you are eating??? 

 

I've never had anyone ask me how old I am or make comments about my appearance or anything like that in a grocery store.  Yet, people think it's OK to bombard a child with all kinds of nonsense. 

 

So, while I really am trying to model how not to be rude to people, I don't really know if I want to push the whole "you have to answer anytime anyone wants to talk to you". 

[Mom22ns]

That being said, I can't really blame him bc I think people have a tendency to ask kids the stupidest things!!  Would you really want to tell every John Joe and Mary how old you are or what you do for a living or if you like that ice cream you are eating??? 

 

I used to have trouble with ds not answering people's questions and I thought he was being rude  or just socially inept (he is autistic spectrum). One time when I was asking why he didn't answer Mr. So and So, his response was something like, it was such a stupid question, I thought it was rhetorical.  :huh:  He had a point, but Mr. So and So really was trying to engage him, even if ineptly. I explained that he should answer the stupid questions people asked even if it was just a word or two in order to acknowledge them.

[zoobie]

Social anxiety is real, and she's not being rude. You can't rationalize away anxiety. Role playing, practicing, explaining why answering people is important for the future might work, but treating the underlying anxiety is very helpful.

[kiwik]

old thread but. if you take your child to a phycologiet and they say selective mutism why would you ignore that and treat it as rudeness when there are more appropriate methods.

[sparrow]

Pretty interesting to see what I said about dd 5 years ago! I can give an update :001_smile: .

 

Dd is now 13. She is outgoing and very actively involved in music and sports. People still think she's shy, but we've come to understand that she is simply quiet, not shy. She's attended several music and arts camps and excels at them. On a recent application, her music instructor noted for the camp committee that she is "quiet, but confident". That is her, in a nutshell.

[Jean in Newcastle]

I can give an update too!  My dd is quiet with those she doesn't know, but quite loud with those she knows well.  She has confidence now and has no trouble talking to people though she does not tend to initiate conversation.  She still does not like the spotlight (ie. talking or singing in front of people) but she has purposefully put herself in some performance situations to work on that.  

[SereneHome]

I can give an update too!  My dd is quiet with those she doesn't know, but quite loud with those she knows well.  She has confidence now and has no trouble talking to people though she does not tend to initiate conversation.  She still does not like the spotlight (ie. talking or singing in front of people) but she has purposefully put herself in some performance situations to work on that.  

 

That's exactly how my oldest is.

 

And just to vent about my previous post - we were at an event today.  We were sitting and eating pizza.  This guy come over to my oldest and starts asking him if he likes his pizza, can he have a bite and "bumping" him on his arm.  I needed a LOT of restraint not to smack him upside the head. 

 

I don't care if the guy's intentions were the  bestest, *I* think it's quite rude to come over to strangers, ask random questions and start touching them. 

[kiwik]

That sounds odd?

[SereneHome]

That sounds odd?

 

If your question was for me, which part were you referring to?

[Monica_in_Switzerland]

I second everyone who says to role play. It helped my very quiet kids be able to greet neighbors we know as well as say please and thank you in restaurants.

 

I have not yet seen this mentioned, so I'll add it to all the other great advice - stop excusing your child by saying "oh she's really shy" every time this happens. I think it just reinforces and gives the kid a reason to continue. I replaced this with a positive statement "dc is learning to use polite words", "dc loves to talk once he's warmed up", etc.

 

Starting around that age of six, I also stop playing telephone. If dc has a message, he can deliver it himself.

 

ALL my kids are crazy shy/reserved, but now at 8, ds can make a purchase at a store, play with neighbor kids, talk to adults. Dd at six can generally say hello and thank you, play with a couple kids she knows well, but all without eye contact for the moment.

[Jilly]

I'll update too. My son now talks to everyone he encounters. Sometimes his answers are very short, and sometimes he has trouble looking people in the eye, but he does talk. He still struggles with anxiety, but he has been in play therapy which has helped him so much. I also believe having his family behind him with patience and understanding has helped him a great deal. Selective mutism is a very frustrating experience for the parent and for the child. I feel for anyone having to deal with it, and I hope that everyone can come to realize that it is a form of anxiety. Anyone who struggles with it should have empathy and understanding only. 

[Momto4inSoCal]

I am a quiet person by nature. I talk when I'm in a group I'm comfortable with though. For the most part I prefer one on one conversations and I have a hard time with extremely loud people. It's amazing how many people mislabel introverts as rude or cliquish. I've worked really hard on getting out of my comfort zone and I will talk to anyone that I am around but it doesn't come natural. I hate small talk, I prefer to talk about things that matter and not waste time but I realize it's a social thing that's expected. I loved the book quiet and would recommend it to anyone that is an extrovert raising an introvert. I'm sure the op has figured everything out in the last 5 years though :)

[angela in ohio]

I know many will not agree, but...

 

My dd was just like this. She is twleve now, and it has been an uphill battle to get her to talk to people. Selective mutism fit all of the characteristics she had, so we treated it like it was. I worked with her, role playing and encouraging, and yes, disciplining as she got older. We had no interest in having her officially diagnosed or working with outside help until I had tried first. We would have sought a specialist if it had continued unchanged.

 

We do consider it rude not to answer a person who taks to you. It doesn't really matter if the person on either side is an adult or child. So overcoming her issue was a top priority. We talk frequently in our home about "people before things" and respecting others and so forth. This flies in the face of those beliefs. Not responding when a person speaks to you is to not acknowledge them as a person, imho.

 

She is still quiet, and she won't offer more than a polite answer to someone she desn't know well, but at least she isn't rude anymore. That's all I ask for. :001_smile: It is a fine line, and I have worked to get her *just* to the shy side of the line from the rude side. :001_smile:

 

One practical thing that worked really well was a trick I learned from dh that is used wiht those who stutter. You take a big breath and then speak on the exhale. It's almost like a mental "1..2..3.."

 

Since the thread was resurrected, I have an update, too. :)

 

That 12 yo is now 17! She is captain of her robotics team, attends band at the public school and has been dual enrolled for college classes for three years now. She has a job tutoring at the college, and she volunteers as a coach for FLL teams (she had two teams this past year.)  She dates and hangs out with friends. She can talk to anyone, though she still has a quiet mannerism with people she doesn't know, saving her rowdy personality for close friends and family.

 

She has come so far from that shy 12 yo (which was so far from where she was at 5 yo.) No one would know now she had struggled with selective mutism.  I stand behind our firm approach to bringing her through it.