Prayers for dh’s family please

[saraha]

8 minutes ago, mlktwins said:

Gorilla pads. You can order some from Amazon to get quickly. They are washable.

Thanks, but I’m going to let this one play out. Sil knows I’m home and free, all she has to do is ask amd I could go over and make sure they are settled. But she hasn’t. I noticed bil’s wife hasn’t said a word either. At least on the texts that include both of us

[prairiewindmomma]

One of the interesting points that I see from this Sarah is that MIL is quite capable of settling in to somewhere new. She felt safe and comfortable in the hospital and didn’t want to go. MIL’s feelings about home aren’t what is keeping her at home, iykwim. 

[saraha]

I did find it interesting that she never updates the group text with other sil and I unless she wants us to do something, but she put that update on the thread including us instead of the thread with just her brothers.

Edited December 16, 2022 by saraha

[freesia]

7 minutes ago, saraha said:

I did find it interesting that she never updates the group text with other sil and I unless she wants us to do something, but she put that update on the thread including us instead of the thread with just her brothers.

Yes, because she doesn’t want arguments. She wants her way. When she has a plan, she delegates. 

[Grace Hopper]

2 minutes ago, freesia said:

Yes, because she doesn’t want arguments. She wants her way. When she has a plan, she delegates. 

Or manipulates by trying to shame you into doing what she wants by broadcasting your “error” to the group. It’s clickbait, ignore it. 

[saraha]

Today is a banner day, my narc mom has called three times today and will keep calling until I answer. I have a mil I care deeply about I can’t help and a narcissist mother that I don’t want to help. 
 

She updated all of us again with a partial screenshot of discharge papers, so I know they aren’t there by themselves anymore 

Edited December 16, 2022 by saraha

[JennyD]

1 hour ago, saraha said:

She then spelled out exactly where she wanted all the decorations, cards, flowers were to go.

 

37 minutes ago, saraha said:

Dh said last night mil messed herself in the bed and he had to call a nurse to come clean her up.

Ay yi yi, this situation.  What a disaster.  There's nothing you can do to fix it, that's for sure.  Your SIL is just completely divorced from reality here.

Hugs to you, OP.

[prairiewindmomma]

2 minutes ago, saraha said:

Today is a banner day, my narc mom has called three times today and will keep calling until I answer. I have a mil I care deeply about I can’t help and a narcissist mother that I don’t want to help. 

Silence the notifications or block her number….you don’t have to engage if you don’t want to.

[saraha]

I’m breathing and ignoring… she just texted and wanted to know where all the flowers are, she only sees one poinsettia. Fil had already packed up most of the room when I got there and I told her he put a lot of stuff in his trunk in the update text, so maybe ask him?!?! I took one poinsettia and a bag full of randomness to their house. 
 

I think I’ll wait a while to answer her…

Edited December 16, 2022 by saraha

[Grace Hopper]

Just now, saraha said:

I’m breathing and ignoring… she just texted and wanted to know where all the flowers are, she only sees one poinsettia. Fil had already packed up most of the room when I got there so maybe ask him?!?! I took one poinsettia and a bag full of randomness to their house. 
 

I think I’ll wait a while to answer her…

I wouldn’t even answer at all. She can ask fil, he’s right there. 

[saraha]

1 minute ago, Grace Hopper said:

I wouldn’t even answer at all. She can ask fil, he’s right there. 

Eapecially Since my text today specifically said he had loaded up most of the room into his trunk

[fraidycat]

1 minute ago, Grace Hopper said:

I wouldn’t even answer at all. She can ask fil, he’s right there. 

This! @saraha, just ignore. She'll find stuff, or won't. 🤷🏻‍♀️ Not your problem.

[saraha]

Haha she just texted and said never mind. Dad said they are in the trunk.

Dh immediately texted me a gif telling me he loved me and bil texted me a thumbs up, which I guess means good job not losing your s*%#?

[Grace Hopper]

2 minutes ago, saraha said:

Haha she just texted and said never mind. Dad said they are in the trunk.

Dh immediately texted me a gif telling me he loved me and bil texted me a thumbs up, which I guess means good job not losing your s*%#?

And you did fine, we appreciate you, don’t let sil rattle your cage. 

[kbutton]

30 minutes ago, saraha said:

I’m breathing and ignoring… she just texted and wanted to know where all the flowers are, she only sees one poinsettia. Fil had already packed up most of the room when I got there and I told her he put a lot of stuff in his trunk in the update text, so maybe ask him?!?! I took one poinsettia and a bag full of randomness to their house. 
 

I think I’ll wait a while to answer her…

I would be tempted to ask her why a poinsettia is more important than fixing a gate that MIL is likely to surf down the stairs on if she attempts to go through it. SMH. She's crazy!

[saraha]

I know!  I left the gate open so someone else would have to struggle to close it. It is at the bottom of the stairs to keep her from going up, but if fil can’t latch it, like I couldn’t, or if she just pushes it down flat against the stairs she could try to access the stairs. 

[saraha]

Oh, breathing…. Of course it’s not Sil’s fault…

I’m getting all kinds of texts today, no idea why! I have had three texts from here since mil went into hospital and today she is including sil and I on everything. Here’s the text I just got. By reacting here, I am able to not react in real life 😆

NP Toni was very upset when I called that they let her go without me there. Apparently the nursing staff from yesterday forgot to put that in the notes and their week ended yesterday. When I asked about any precautions she said she should be house bound or the insurance wouldn't pay for homecare. Dad was thinking about taking her to church Sunday. Might have been nice to tell him that before they left. Apparently they didn't tell him anything and the papers didn't have any care instructions only a follow up visit scheduled with her PC. 
 

I wonder what home care she’s talking about 🤷🏼‍♀️. She doesn’t know what they told fil, he is absolutely not a reliable passer of information. And it was obvious in someone’s mind that fil is not to be trusted, but we are overlooking that?!?

Edited December 16, 2022 by saraha

[saraha]

I really want to respond to this one, honestly we don’t have any idea what they told your dad. You can’t assume they didn’t tell him anything.

especially with the group effort to not be completely honest with the hospital about either of them’s true selves, they should know he can’t be trusted to remember important information and not be surprised when the hospital treats him like a regular adult

[Grace Hopper]

Dear, I think it’s time for you to silence your phone, stick it in a drawer and go polish your fingernails or play with your kids. 

[fraidycat]

She is including you so you can see just how "busy she is doing all this work" so you can feel sorry for her, and guilty, so you'll volunteer to carry some of her "burden".

[saraha]

You are probably right. 

[saraha]

2 minutes ago, Grace Hopper said:

Dear, I think it’s time for you to silence your phone, stick it in a drawer and go polish your fingernails or play with your kids. 

You’re right

[saraha]

2 minutes ago, fraidycat said:

She is including you so you can see just how "busy she is doing all this work" so you can feel sorry for her, and guilty, so you'll volunteer to carry some of her "burden".

I waiting for the “my daughter had surgery today but I have to be taking care of this…” to start

[Carol in Cal.]

How she figures that FIL can care for MIL adequately when he can't even be trusted to do the discharge is beyond me.  They are really in trouble now, because the hospital is no longer responsible since they discharged to a supposedly safe plan.

[Faith-manor]

2 hours ago, Grace Hopper said:

Your SIL is a real piece of work. And that’s speaking politely. 
 

You did nothing wrong. But don’t step up to do anything else. Leave her to her own machinations. 

I have words about sil, and none of them are fit for print.

 

[Faith-manor]

20 hours ago, Carol in Cal. said:

How she figures that FIL can care for MIL adequately when he can't even be trusted to do the discharge is beyond me.  They are really in trouble now, because the hospital is no longer responsible since they discharged to a supposedly safe plan.

This is going to be a possible legal sticky wickets too if something happens, and it gets reported. It will be basically, "We lied to the medical staff and the hospital social worker." In my state, that could mean charges are brought against whomever did the lying/spear heading of getting her released under false pretenses. I agree...very, real trouble ahead for more than just mil whom my heart breaks for. Most people do not beg to stay in the hospital, so her not wanting to be released and reiterating this multiple times is a major indication of fear and the neglect she is facing. This makes me angry and sad all at once.

Edited December 17, 2022 by Faith-manor

[Faith-manor]

12 minutes ago, Grace Hopper said:

Dear, I think it’s time for you to silence your phone, stick it in a drawer and go polish your fingernails or play with your kids. 

Yes, in the absence of actually saying to sil, "Go pound sand!" losing the phone will do.

[saraha]

So going back to the “mil has to be home bound in order for insurance to pay for homecare” does anyone have any insight into this? Dh said he had not heard the first word about homecare. I’m dying of curiosity since she and fil were adamant that they were not changing anything, as far as we and at least two of her previous care givers knew. 🤔
 

if she has to be home bound, I don’t know how fil will cope. She begged all day everyday for him or anyone to take her somewhere and as soon as they got home she would want to turn around band leave, so they drove around at least once a day and if she was getting on his nerves more than once a day.

Edited December 16, 2022 by saraha

[Jean in Newcastle]

7 minutes ago, saraha said:

So going back to the “mil has to be home bound in order for insurance to pay for homecare” does anyone have any insight into this? Dh said he had not heard the first word about homecare. I’m dying of curiosity since she and fil were adamant that they were not changing anything, as far as we and at least two of her previous care givers knew. 🤔
 

if she has to be home bound, I don’t know how fil will cope. She begged all day everyday for him or anyone to take her somewhere and as soon as they got home she would want to turn around band leave, so they drove around at least once a day and if she was getting on his nerves more than once a day.

I wonder if possibly they think that they can get insurance to pay for the caregivers that are coming in currently.  Or they wanted her to be sent home regardless so they just said "yes" when asked if they had homecare lined up.

[Mrs Tiggywinkle Again]

My grandmother had to be home bound completely, unable to leave even in something like a wheelchair van, to qualify for in home PT and OT, and for insurance to cover the more expensive NP practice to do house calls. 
Our understanding is that Medicare will not pay for in home custodial care no matter what.

[Spryte]

36 minutes ago, saraha said:

So going back to the “mil has to be home bound in order for insurance to pay for homecare” does anyone have any insight into this? Dh said he had not heard the first word about homecare. I’m dying of curiosity since she and fil were adamant that they were not changing anything, as far as we and at least two of her previous care givers knew. 🤔
 

if she has to be home bound, I don’t know how fil will cope. She begged all day everyday for him or anyone to take her somewhere and as soon as they got home she would want to turn around band leave, so they drove around at least once a day and if she was getting on his nerves more than once a day.

Most likely this is PT or OT at home, with a nurse that may check in weekly or monthly. They do not do caregiving, bathing, toileting, but cover working on balance, sitting/standing. If you are very nice to the OT, they may agree to help with bathing until you get a proper set up. They will often evaluate house and make recommendations for bars, seats, etc. if she isn’t homebound, the PT and OT will have to take place in an office setting, Medicare will only cover home visits if she’s housebound.

The above is my experience, so YMMV.

[LifeLovePassion]

1 hour ago, Spryte said:

Most likely this is PT or OT at home, with a nurse that may check in weekly or monthly. They do not do caregiving, bathing, toileting, but cover working on balance, sitting/standing. If you are very nice to the OT, they may agree to help with bathing until you get a proper set up. They will often evaluate house and make recommendations for bars, seats, etc. if she isn’t homebound, the PT and OT will have to take place in an office setting, Medicare will only cover home visits if she’s housebound.

The above is my experience, so YMMV.

This was my moms experience. The PT, OT and a nurse came to check on her/do therapies. The "rule" is you can't go anywhere. If you are well enough to go to church, you are well enough to drive to the clinic for therapy/appointments there. So if they want to keep homecare for as long as she qualifies, going to church/anywhere is out of the question. 

I'm so sorry. You are doing great!

[saraha]

I hope someone explained this to sil. I would hate for her to lose whatever they have agreed to or been assigned just because he gets tired of her asking to go somewhere. Could she even go to church two days after she got home? Is that a realistic expectation?

realistically, how would insurance know if he did take her places?

Edited December 17, 2022 by saraha

[Terabith]

Why would they even want home based PT or OT?  She loves going places!  Going to an appointment could be an outing.  

I am very deeply confused by this.

[LifeLovePassion]

1 minute ago, Terabith said:

Why would they even want home based PT or OT?  She loves going places!  Going to an appointment could be an outing.  

I am very deeply confused by this.

Often it is short term while the individual recovers a bit more until they can safely/comfortably sit in the car to get to the appointments. It is probably a bit more standard with a potentially painful injury like a hip break. For my mom she was post brain bleed and it was just difficult for my dad to get her out of the house. 

[Catwoman]

6 hours ago, saraha said:

Thanks, but I’m going to let this one play out. Sil knows I’m home and free, all she has to do is ask amd I could go over and make sure they are settled. But she hasn’t. I noticed bil’s wife hasn’t said a word either. At least on the texts that include both of us

Don't go over there. Don't worry about whether or not they are settled.

Your SIL is treating you like dirt. It's time you returned the favor.

She wants to be in charge and she wants to send you passive aggressive texts? Well, good for her. She's on her own. See how she likes commanding an army of one -- because that's what is going to happen. She is going to end up with full responsibility, including all the work, and she will deserve it.

So seriously, do what everyone is suggesting. Stop reading her texts and walk away. You don't deserve this kind of treatment. 

You can't help your MIL. I know it's horrible to say it, but it's true. I know you would do all the right things for her if you had any authority, but because you don't, please don't feel guilty or obligated. Let your idiot SIL handle everything and if your FIL won't stand up to her, well... he's just as guilty as she is, so you shouldn't feel sorry for him, either.

Sorry to sound so harsh, but this whole situation with your SIL and FIL is so unfair to you and it makes me so livid that you are always treated so poorly.

[Scarlett]

6 hours ago, saraha said:

I’m breathing and ignoring… she just texted and wanted to know where all the flowers are, she only sees one poinsettia. Fil had already packed up most of the room when I got there and I told her he put a lot of stuff in his trunk in the update text, so maybe ask him?!?! I took one poinsettia and a bag full of randomness to their house. 
 

I think I’ll wait a while to answer her…

I mean….did she think you stole the flowers? 🤔😵‍💫

[prairiewindmomma]

5 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

I mean….did she think you stole the flowers? 🤔😵‍💫

That would be a fierce Christmastime side hustle! 😂

[saraha]

10 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

I mean….did she think you stole the flowers? 🤔😵‍💫

I have no idea. I think she got there and didn’t find things exactly as she wanted them and I was the person who was supposed to do it exactly like she said.
 

Dh had to go to the city after work today so didn’t go over to visit at the house. This is the first time since she went to the hospital that he hasn’t gone to see her. He was so upset last night I’m not surprised. I usually do all the running on Saturdays with the kids, but he’ll probably go down to pick dd21 from college so not sure if he will go over tomorrow or not. He’ll have time to if he wants. He is just so wrung out today.

[saraha]

I’ll for sure make sure there’s food to take up if he wants to, or dd can do it. Food I don’t mind. I have to cook so much for my family that a couple extra servings doesn’t add any trouble. I have that other shoe feeling I get when there’s been a nice visit with my narc mom. I just know dh is holding back to bare minimum help and it’s going to come to a head I think. Especially if she is still having diaper blow outs like at the hospital. That will get old super quick

[QueenCat]

I really hope that you and your dh can find at least a little time to do something stress-relieving this weekend. With phones off.

[Soror]

I think most of us are the villain in someone's story but it doesn't make it any less painful. I'm sure she's made herself the martyr to those around her but it doesn't make it true.

It would be one thing if she was in there front and center doing the majority of the work. Then she'd have some say in how things are done but she doesn't hardly lift a finger. She just sits back and makes decrees about what should be done by everyone else. 

It would be ok if this was a group discussion and decision but no. One person can't be the decision maker when it affects everyone else. Then she acts like everyone else is too incompetent to do anything but her.

And to top it all off MIL doesn't even want to be home? Sil and fil's denial is dipping into the area of abuse to MIL. They want your help to continue to abuse MIL by not getting proper care while endangering your own family and being treated like dirt. 

It's all ridiculous. 

I'm sorry your family is dealing with all of this and I'm sorry for MIL not getting what she needs.

My mom's mom came to live by us when she couldn't live alone any more. My mom would cook for her. We were there to check on her all the time. She had a homemaker. It worked really well. She was able to stay home until right at the end when she ended up passing in the hospital. I had that in my head as a model. 

I was a bit heartbroken when dh's grandparents moved to town and grandma went to a nursing home. But the thing was she had Alzheimer's and he couldn't keep her safe anymore. She kept getting out. He went to visit her every day. He would go in his polyester suit with flowers for their anniversary and she wouldn't even know him. The nursing home  was the right and loving choice for them. He couldn't properly care for her so he did what he needed to do. She didn't even have any medical issues to deal with on top of it. My fil ended up in hospice at the VA. He didn't want to burden his family with his care. He was there are few months before he passed it was a wonderful experience for everyone. At home is not always the best option for the carers or the patient.

[Faith-manor]

15 hours ago, Catwoman said:

Don't go over there. Don't worry about whether or not they are settled.

Your SIL is treating you like dirt. It's time you returned the favor.

She wants to be in charge and she wants to send you passive aggressive texts? Well, good for her. She's on her own. See how she likes commanding an army of one -- because that's what is going to happen. She is going to end up with full responsibility, including all the work, and she will deserve it.

So seriously, do what everyone is suggesting. Stop reading her texts and walk away. You don't deserve this kind of treatment. 

You can't help your MIL. I know it's horrible to say it, but it's true. I know you would do all the right things for her if you had any authority, but because you don't, please don't feel guilty or obligated. Let your idiot SIL handle everything and if your FIL won't stand up to her, well... he's just as guilty as she is, so you shouldn't feel sorry for him, either.

Sorry to sound so harsh, but this whole situation with your SIL and FIL is so unfair to you and it makes me so livid that you are always treated so poorly.

Hear hear! There is absolutely nothing OP can do because of a total lack of authority and influence. I would be very tempted to block SIL's phone number. This is Dh's circus and monkeys, and since they don't listen to anything he says, and refuse to do the right thing, since FIL doesn't listen to his son, maybe dh should stop responding to their texts. It is okay for him to read them so he has some idea what is going on with his parents, but they have made their bed, and they have to lay on it. Dh does not need to put his head on the railroad tracks and get decapped due to their awful choices.

 

[saraha]

Saw their nurse’s aid that comes one morning a week this morning and she stopped and asked incredulously “mil went home yesterday?!? Why did you do that?!?” I said I didn’t. Dh, the social worker, the doctor and I all said that was not in her best interest. She said she told sil also that she should not go straight home. She just shook her head and said something about they have up to 30 days, if they need help organizing something, let me know. 
 

I don’t know what she meant about the 30 days, but it doesn’t matter since no one listens to me.

[Spryte]

I think the 30 days refers to the time period in which it’s (relatively) easy to be readmitted to a rehab facility or hospital after discharge. 

IME, it was next to impossible to have my mom readmitted, but theoretically one of the homecare nurses could have signed off on it.

So your friend may be referring to that, and offering to help get that organized.

[Mrs Tiggywinkle Again]

39 minutes ago, saraha said:

Saw their nurse’s aid that comes one morning a week this morning and she stopped and asked incredulously “mil went home yesterday?!? Why did you do that?!?” I said I didn’t. Dh, the social worker, the doctor and I all said that was not in her best interest. She said she told sil also that she should not go straight home. She just shook her head and said something about they have up to 30 days, if they need help organizing something, let me know. 
 

I don’t know what she meant about the 30 days, but it doesn’t matter since no one listens to me.

Medicare will cover rehab for up to 30 days after a qualifying hospital stay. The wrench here is that I don’t know if she received rehab services at the hospital and was deemed either okay for home or unable to benefit from further services, both of which mean Medicare won’t pay anymore.

I know it’s moot in this case, but having family 24/7 at the hospital can actually hurt the case for inpatient rehab. It’s very difficult to get beds and they’re going to look for reasons to use family care instead. Insisting that family isn’t available while the RN is noting that family is at bedside in every nurse’s note can cause problems. 

Edited December 17, 2022 by Mrs Tiggywinkle Again

[saraha]

20 minutes ago, Mrs Tiggywinkle Again said:

Medicare will cover rehab for up to 30 days after a qualifying hospital stay. The wrench here is that I don’t know if she received rehab services at the hospital and was deemed either okay for home or unable to benefit from further services, both of which mean Medicare won’t pay anymore.

I know it’s moot in this case, but having family 24/7 at the hospital can actually hurt the case for inpatient rehab. It’s very difficult to get beds and they’re going to look for reasons to use family care instead. Insisting that family isn’t available while the RN is noting that family is at bedside in every nurse’s note can cause problems. 

She did receive therapy in the hospital. That’s all I know

[Grace Hopper]

1 hour ago, saraha said:

Saw their nurse’s aid that comes one morning a week this morning and she stopped and asked incredulously “mil went home yesterday?!? Why did you do that?!?” I said I didn’t. Dh, the social worker, the doctor and I all said that was not in her best interest. She said she told sil also that she should not go straight home. She just shook her head and said something about they have up to 30 days, if they need help organizing something, let me know. 
 

I don’t know what she meant about the 30 days, but it doesn’t matter since no one listens to me.

Someone should call sil out on this. 
 

Maybe in the group text. 
 

Not saying it should be you, but it would be a statement absolving you and your dh of liability for the poor decision making. 

[kbutton]

5 hours ago, Mrs Tiggywinkle Again said:

I know it’s moot in this case, but having family 24/7 at the hospital can actually hurt the case for inpatient rehab. It’s very difficult to get beds and they’re going to look for reasons to use family care instead. Insisting that family isn’t available while the RN is noting that family is at bedside in every nurse’s note can cause problems. 

I don't doubt this is true, but it's unfortunate. People can often pull something together for a week or so that they can't sustain for longer timeframes.

[saraha]

Dh and I decided to both go pick up college kid and do a little shopping on the way as a break. When we came out of Sams dh saw he had a missed call from fil so he called him back. I guess he had called to see if someone could run up so he could feed. Dh said we’re in Eastgate shopping, but fil had gotten hold of nephew. It is the first time he has personally called and asked for help. Dh offered to come up for tomorrow morning’s feeding but fil said nephew will do it. 
Poor dh had mixed feelings. On one hand, his dad never calls him to ask for anything. On the other, the feeding always happens twice a day so there is no plan and dh doesn’t want to help every evening. He was like can I just get a break from them for like a minute!

Edited December 18, 2022 by saraha