nm

[Ann.without.an.e]

nm

Edited August 17, 2022 by Ann.without.an.e

[Ausmumof3]

Yep. Not much advice but definitely could have written this at times. I guess the answer depends a bit on why they’re so busy? Are they someone who can’t handle sitting still and needs to be on the go all the time? Or they actually overloaded and is there something you can do to lighten that? I can’t remember if you’re Christian or not, but rest is definitely biblical if you are.

[Ann.without.an.e]

7 minutes ago, Ausmumof3 said:

Yep. Not much advice but definitely could have written this at times. I guess the answer depends a bit on why they’re so busy? Are they someone who can’t handle sitting still and needs to be on the go all the time? Or they actually overloaded and is there something you can do to lighten that? I can’t remember if you’re Christian or not, but rest is definitely biblical if you are.

We are Christians and he tries to take Sundays off unless something is super pressing. It’s a mix for him, there is always a lot to do and he just likes to stay busy. I think there is a degree to where he works instead of feeling and that’s a whole other post I don’t want to write lol. 
I’ve been working on how I could lighten his load. Years ago, I cut the grass but then older ds started. At some point ds didn’t do it anymore (he works a full time job now). DH started doing it again and I think I either need to start doing it or I need to pay someone to do it (it’s a lot to cut so I assume it would be super expensive). I had a lot on my plate and I don’t have his energy levels but things have slowed down and I’ve tried to think of ways I could be one step ahead of him with some things like taking recycle, etc. 

I hope in time this will help. 

Edited August 15, 2022 by Ann.without.an.e

[desertflower]

I understand what you mean. 
 

I believe we are all different and have different levels of energy. 
 

I bet you are working too and don’t know it. In your example you went to the farmers market. That’s work too. You got food. 
 

we all contribute in different ways. As long as you do what you need or can do, you should be fine. The same for your dc too. 

[Farrar]

Oh yes. I feel this dynamic personally with dh all the time. He's so productive all the time. And I can be too. But... in a really different way. It definitely leads to guilt sometimes. But just me. The kids are too mentally healthy for that. Or in BalletBoy's case, way too oblivious.

[HS Mom in NC]

I'm married to a highly productive person too.  The thing is to have a balanced view of productivity and its limited value.  Yes, being productive is a good thing to a point, but highly productive people are almost always lacking in the ability to just be and to savor and to contemplate.  We happen to live in a society at a time when productivity usually pays in ways like monetary value and often status, but there are other things of value too.

Some people can't tolerate the thoughts in their heads, so they distract themselves with busyness. It's very sad. Therapy can help.

Also, measuring self by others tends to be a more adolescent mindset that our society reinforces. Most Americans are perpetual adolescents because the culture largely allows and reinforces it: image consciousness, popularity as approval, magical thinking, maintaining youth, etc.

Feelings are a byproduct of thoughts-sometimes conscious thoughts and sometimes unconscious thoughts.  Spending some time deep diving into what you really think about an issue is worthwhile because you can question why you think it and where the thoughts came from and if those thoughts are consistent or there's cognitive dissonance going on.  Then you can decide whether or not to change your thinking based on what you really think of those constellations of issues. Deep contemplation and mind changing are other things our society doesn't support much.  

And people wonder why Americans are the way they are. You really have to dig deep to push against the tide of cultural and subcultural norms. People who aren't natural questioners and who are prone to conformity are more likely to struggle.  It's always harder to do what doesn't come naturally, but it's often worth it.

[Arcadia]

1 hour ago, Ann.without.an.e said:

. I asked him to go but he always says no, he has too much to do. 

It comes down to does he mind having to work even on weekends. I am assuming from your post that  he is working at home on weekends rather than his own hobbies. My husband previous job at a semiconductor fabrication plant when my teens were infants was very time intensive and he didn’t like that so he looked for another. His next few jobs all have occasional conference calls in the early mornings, evenings and weekends but he has more time for the kids. If my husband had to worked seven days a week to make ends meet and not because he likes his job and don’t mind the occasional after hours work, I would go back to the workforce.
Workaholics run on my paternal side and it would be weird to expect their spouses to be equally workaholics. The thing is my cousins would love for their spouses to enjoy relaxing whether it is reading at a rocking chair or comfy couch to baking for fun to out window shopping. Work is their enjoyment and majority of my workaholic cousins did not pick a workaholic spouse. 
I have one uncle and one cousin died of heart attack related to work stress. So my relatives lean more on the take it easy side, but know workaholics would be workaholics. 
We would offer to help my husband in his work, some tasks my teens and I could help like researching stuff or programming stuff. If we can’t help with work, we can help with food and coffee. We don’t worry about making equal contributions to our family. Each of us just play to our strengths and do our part. Being able to relax is good for health. Enjoy the moments.

[SKL]

Is he happy?

Does he have the option to cut back if the work pace isn't making him happy?

I don't think everyone needs to be at the same energy level.  Every able person should try to carry his own weight and a little more, in order to keep the house pleasant for everyone.  If someone is happy doing more, then more power to him.

If he's not happy, or if he's causing others to be unhappy by, say, missing important things with the kids, then it is probably worth asking - is this something you are able to cut back or not?  Can you think of any ways I could help make it possible for you to cut back your work load?

[marbel]

I'm wondering -- and I apologize if I missed it -- is he saying thing that make you and the kids feel guilty, or are you placing that on yourselves?

As has been said, everyone has different levels of ability to be productive. My husband is not very productive outside of work time, to be honest. I can get  annoyed that he is sitting down to read instead of doing some sort of work around the house that I can't do. My classic example is cleaning out the gutters. But he needs down time.  

Even when I was a stay-home mom I was working a lot. Grocery shopping, even at the farmer's market, is working. Planning and preparing meals is working. Spending time with kids is, in a way, working, though mostly we don't think of it like that. 

I think modeling a healthy work ethic for kids is good, but it can be a fine line to making them feel like they are never doing enough. Not saying that's your situation, OP, just riffing off the conversation. 

 

[heartlikealion]

At some point I'd be asking if he's the problem. Workaholic? 

Taking on more than you can chew? Maybe it's time to re-evaluate the business/life goals?? Is it sustainable? What would happen if he got sick? Could anyone pick up the slack? 

[Clarita]

I have an over-productive husband too. If it's not work work then it's doing big projects around the house, if not enough of that then it's volunteer stuff at the church. I've learned to tell him to STOP and/or request time where he is available to just hang out with the family. It seems counter productive but it makes me more productive because it reduces the emotional load I have on those days.

What has helped with the guilt is realizing there is a lot of stuff that I have to emotionally do for my family that drains me of energy that isn't counted in productivity. Things like consoling my kids over things, day-to-day getting in and out of the house stuff, maintaining relationships with people in our community/village. Productivity is usually a measurement of these big completed tasks vs. time/energy, but there is a lot of stuff in a family that are "tasks" or things that take up energy that are never "completed".

[regentrude]

Does he enjoy what he is doing?
Does he neglect to connect with his family members?
Do you have any activity that you all enjoy doing together? 

 

[prairiewindmomma]

I don’t know that this is about him, it’s about you.

You have permission to rest. You have permission to find enjoyment. There is nothing immoral about having less capacity to do and go. We are all built differently. 
 

Do you feel judged by Dh when he does and you do not? Or is this all internal to you?

[Jaybee]

Does he resent the rest of you taking time for fun things while he is working? Or does he prefer to work over doing fun things?

Does he complain about doing so much work and not having time to do other things?

How he feels about his work would determine somewhat how I responded. So...if he is a high energy person who is driven to be busy all the time, then I'd just let him be busy and do my own thing. I might insist on occasional family activities, but if he'd rather work than sit down and read or something, I'd let him at it, and I'd just manage my own stuff. Some people really do like to work all the time. I am not one of them.

If he complains or is resentful, I would ask if there is something he would like for me to take off his plate. But I wouldn't offer to do so much that I was working all the time or overloaded. I like to have an organized lifestyle but I do not like to be busy all the time. I read a lot, of all types of books/articles, etc., and I like to have time for people--either the ones living with me, or to get together with a friend without making them feel like I'm having to bend over backwards to fit them into my crazy schedule. Time for creativity, reading, and people are important to me. If he wanted me to be working all the time, too, I would say that I am an adult, and that is not how I choose to live my life, filling it to the brim with working. I'd say that people are one of my values, and I want to spend time with them relaxing or doing something fun, or even just talking. 

My own dh has a lot more energy than I do. But he likes to rest and relax, as well. Our "chores" tend to fall along traditional lines, because those are the things we tend to prefer. When I was working, he took over cleaning the bathrooms (except for the boys') without saying a word. He was planning to keep doing that when I quit work, but I took it over again, because I knew he dreaded it even though he didn't complain. After so many years, we both tend to have things we take care of, but it isn't set in stone. Our home and yard are not very high maintenance.

[Scarlett]

Sometimes I will list  out what I have done for the day for my own sanity.  I used  to itemize it to Dh and he asked me to,stop.  He said he doesn’t need a narrative of what I  have done for the day.  He truly doesn’t…..he doesn’t judge me at all. Sometimes if we are working together around the yard or house I literally have to say, I am done for the day.   He just does more than I can do.  

[Clarita]

Depending on what you think (or have a discussion with your husband to see what he thinks) it may be good for him to talk to your children directly about this. My husband has comforted me in this matter as well by telling me that even though I am less productive on paper; it's not a true reflection of what I do for the family. I get the kids involved in my chores which make it take more time and effort which is a good thing even though it isn't productive.

[Ann.without.an.e]

 

Please don't quote...

 

Edited August 17, 2022 by Ann.without.an.e

[Arcadia]

Regarding bearing the emotional brunt,  I used to jokingly count in terms of Starbucks frappes. An emotionally draining day would be like I am “entitled” to two frappes. When my teens had a stressful week, I would buy them Starbucks frappes. My parents would give me fun money every birthday. 
My main issue with my husband is that he is good at being pennywise and pound foolish. To the extent that his penny pinching on groceries did result in disastrous results for my health. So I can sympathize though we have different issues with our spouses. 

[Jaybee]

That sounds really hard. I'm sorry. 

[heartlikealion]

Oh gosh the insurance is a huge burden and may be trapping him. Surely he could find another job with office hours? Not all jobs require you to work past normal business hours. 

Could you find out the enrollment period and see if he could somehow get a job during that window? But there still might be a delay if the job requires you to work 90 days or whatever before ins kicks in. 

Would a medical sharing plan work for your family? I wouldn’t do them because they tend to exclude mental health.

That’s emotional anorexia. You all will need to address it. It won’t just get better. I didn’t coin the term. 
 

I can delete this post if you need me to. 

[heartlikealion]

https://intimacyanorexia.com/intimacy-anorexia-characteristics-2/

[Ann.without.an.e]

7 hours ago, heartlikealion said:

Oh gosh the insurance is a huge burden and may be trapping him. Surely he could find another job with office hours? Not all jobs require you to work past normal business hours. 

Could you find out the enrollment period and see if he could somehow get a job during that window? But there still might be a delay if the job requires you to work 90 days or whatever before ins kicks in. 

Would a medical sharing plan work for your family? I wouldn’t do them because they tend to exclude mental health.

That’s emotional anorexia. You all will need to address it. It won’t just get better. I didn’t coin the term. 
 

I can delete this post if you need me to. 

How do we address it if every time I try he just shuts down? I’m super careful when I try to address. I don’t want to seem blaming or argumentative but he still can’t handle the convo. 
I think at its core it’s a job issue? It drains him to the point where he has little left to give. It pays well and we were just about to really focus on saving for retirement now that 3/4 of our kiddos are independent financially (except for older ds with medical bills). I want him to take a lesser job but that would also keep us from retirement savings? I don’t know which is best. Again, a part of it is his personality and he will outwork everyone around him wherever he goes. Add that to the fact that almost every company and industry has an employee shortage? I don’t know that a job change would make any difference. New stress somewhere else but potentially even worse?

Edited August 16, 2022 by Ann.without.an.e

[scholastica]

He’s distracting himself from the pain of the rupture of the relationship with his parents. He does blame you for the rupture whether he admits it or not. Even if he won’t go to therapy, you can go to a Marriage Friendly Therapist on your own. They specifically work with individuals and couples who want to preserve the marriage. You do not need him to go. You can go on your own. You can make the appointment and say to him, “I’ve made this appointment with a marriage counselor, I’d love for you to join me. I love you and want to improve our relationship. I will be going either with you or without you.” Then do it and keep doing it. You’re in a very difficult situation with a man who was emotionally abused by his parents to the point of not knowing how to feel his own emotions and deal with them in a healthy way. Prayers for you as you go forward. 

[Ann.without.an.e]

32 minutes ago, scholastica said:

You’re in a very difficult situation with a man who was emotionally abused by his parents to the point of not knowing how to feel his own emotions and deal with them in a healthy way. Prayers for you as you go forward. 

I know this is a huge part of it (that and his job being too demanding). He knows logically that I wasn’t the reason and that I tried to love them and serve them. 98% of the time he would say that and mean it with his whole heart, it’s just he loses grip with that reality sometimes. If I could go back again, I don’t know what I’d do. My kids have a lot of trauma from that relationship and never looked back or regretted it. At the same time, It has wreaked havoc with DH. Maybe I should’ve worked harder to encourage him to continue a relationship with them on his own? Hindsight is always perfect.

 

I’ve been on a waitlist for a therapist for a while. 

Edited August 16, 2022 by Ann.without.an.e

[Ann.without.an.e]

It’s also hard because they isolated me for attacks. There were a few times when he was present for it but often they purposelessly got me alone for them. They would be upset about DH or me or the kids (usually made up stuff) but vent it to me. DH called them and called them to make thanksgiving plans and they ignored him but when they finally returned the call and unleashed hate, they didn’t call him, they called me. So in a way, he’s justified to blame me? A lot of the terrible things they said and made up, they hid from him. 
One of my greatest life regrets is that we were doormats for them (thinking this would keep peace). DH and I are both peace seekers. I wish we would’ve just stood up for ourselves and the kids. We either would’ve been able to keep a relationship or it would’ve ended sooner, both are better than what happened. 

Edited August 16, 2022 by Ann.without.an.e

[marbel]

I'm sorry that you are dealing with all this. My husband's parents did some damage to him, and even though he recognizes it now, the effects still linger and worse, they have carried down to our kids. I've worked hard to try to break that chain. 

I agree that counseling for you is a great idea. Your kids would also benefit from what you gain from it. 

[Scarlett]

NC doesn’t have to be forever.  Have you ever discussed reopening contact with them in a limited basis? And maybe just him?  

[Ann.without.an.e]

nm

Edited August 17, 2022 by Ann.without.an.e

[Scarlett]

7 minutes ago, Ann.without.an.e said:

I want to but I’m scared to, it’s sort of water under the bridge now and he functions much better than he did even a few years ago. I don’t want to open new wounds. Also, he wrote a letter and left the ball in their court and they haven’t reached out. His dad has cut off contact with everyone, even his (FIL’s) sisters. I guess when one of his sisters died he went to the funeral but was very mean and hateful to everyone. I only know this because dh’s aunt reached out to me on Facebook to see if we still have contact. 

There is a huge part of me that wants to try to fix this. They are now in their 80’s and I fear them dying and where he will go emotionally when that happens. At the same time, he wrote a letter saying that they needed to talk to us face to face and apologize and we could have a relationship and they won’t. They’ve never apologized for anything. 
DH’s half sister reached out on Facebook a while ago and opened up about the way they perceive it and the things they say. It was all 100% false. How do you battle someone’s imaginations?? MIL said that my kids said they just wished their grandfather had died already. They never said anything like that to me or to them, ever. He had a stroke a few years ago and MIL and BIL said to us that it may have been better if he’d died. They said that, not us. But it’s one thing after the other that we said or did that is completely falsified. I don’t even know where they get it from.  

That is tough.I will say that just because he left it in their court doesn’t mean he can’t pick it back up again.  He could reach out to them without discussing any of the past hurts  in order to just say he loves them and misses them.

I have an XBIL who has not seen or spoken to his mother (my XMIL) in over 15 years.  Even though she is very very toxic I do think he has an element of something….like lack of empathy or something.  I mean she is 92 now and only 20% of her heart is working and they have found a mass near her bladder where she had cancer 20 years ago.  She is on hospice and could die any day. But he is steadfast in his NC.  He washed his hands of her one day and he is done. She isn’t even my mother and she was very very wicked to me….but I mostly feel sorry for her now.  Now that I think about it 8t is probably easier for me to let stuff go than him because he endured a lifetime of her.  At least I had my own good mom and decent foundation before she came into my life.  

[Arcadia]

They probably got that from your in-laws as I am guessing your MIL has already designated your family as the scapegoat, “punching bag”.  I have two uncles that behave very similar. One has passed and the feeling is a mixed of sadness that he didn’t change for the better before he died, and thankful that we don’t need to deal with his behavior anymore. The one who is still alive is worse and nobody has any hope left he will change since his wife is similar to him. He is in his 80s.

[Arcadia]

4 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

I have an XBIL who has not seen or spoken to his mother (my XMIL) in over 15 years.  Even though she is very very toxic I do think he has an element of something….like lack of empathy or something.

 Now that I think about it 8t is probably easier for me to let stuff go than him because he endured a lifetime of her.  

It is one way of coping for a child, “shutting down” their own emotions. “If you can’t feel you can’t get hurt” way of coping.

[heartlikealion]

He shuts down. You may have to be firm. Like this job is impacting our lives/relationship. Something has to change. 

[TexasProud]

Yeah, I wish I had some words of wisdom, but I don't. My husband is a workaholic, even though he doesn't have a job anymore. However, he is not emotionally distant AT ALL.  I know what he is feeling all the time, though he has backed off a bit because of everything I am under at the moment and doesn't want to add to my stress.  But yeah, I am his only emotional support.

Wish I had some advice, but I don't. 

[Ann.without.an.e]

1 hour ago, Scarlett said:

That is tough.I will say that just because he left it in their court doesn’t mean he can’t pick it back up again.  He could reach out to them without discussing any of the past hurts  in order to just say he loves them and misses them.

 

I’ll try to bring this up with him whenever it feels right. 
 

Since that time my own kids have become young adults and I understand it less and less. I just can’t process how they think. If my kids said I was hurtful and needed to apologize, I would apologize. There is no way I wouldn’t do whatever it took (that was reasonable) to get my relationship with my kids right. We didn’t do anything to apologize for or we would. Everything she came at me with that day was completely made up. I sort of wish it was true, I would’ve had something to apologize for to make it right.

[fairfarmhand]

4 hours ago, Ann.without.an.e said:

How do we address it if every time I try he just shuts down? I’m super careful when I try to address. I don’t want to seem blaming or argumentative but he still can’t handle the convo. 
I think at its core it’s a job issue? It drains him to the point where he has little left to give. It pays well and we were just about to really focus on saving for retirement now that 3/4 of our kiddos are independent financially (except for older ds with medical bills). I want him to take a lesser job but that would also keep us from retirement savings? I don’t know which is best. Again, a part of it is his personality and he will outwork everyone around him wherever he goes. Add that to the fact that almost every company and industry has an employee shortage? I don’t know that a job change would make any difference. New stress somewhere else but potentially even worse?

Ojur family has been through the wringer in the last 5 to 7 years. It felt like every time we would just get our heads above water emotionally, another tsunami would crash in on us. Like every 12 to 18 months for 7 years. My dh shut down emotionally and works so hard often to avoid feeling. Except often the feeling comes out in mad. 

Your dh needs to grieve.

Can you hold his hand and walk him through it? Like, here are some Christmas cards. If you want to send your parents a card, I'll mail it for you.

On Thanksgiving, say, "I know you're probably missing your parents. That makes me sad for you." 

Saying the things out loud that he's probably feeling and thinking and trying desperately NOT to think and feel. 

What makes it hard is that he probably feels conflicted about sharing his grief with you because he needed to protect you and had to cut ties with his parents to protect you and his kids. Have you told him that it's ok to miss his parents, even though they were awful to him? Have you told him that you are sad about the way things turned out? You don't have to have an in depth conversation to slowly start unpacking things. He may shut down, but you can slowly start sharing your own sadness with him. Maybe just one or two comments here or there.

I don't know if anything is helpful here, but I do know how lonely it is to be married to a man who works to avoid feeling.  It's like ALL the feelings become trapped and theyre unable to connect.

[Ann.without.an.e]

On 8/16/2022 at 11:29 AM, fairfarmhand said:

Ojur family has been through the wringer in the last 5 to 7 years.

 

 

nm

Edited August 17, 2022 by Ann.without.an.e

[marbel]

Oh, I am so sorry for all you have been through.

I do think some therapy would be really good for you. I see you taking the blame over and over for that Christmas issue. Unless I'm misreading, that was your husband's error. With all that going on he should not have asked them about coming for Christmas. He should have told them it wasn't happening.  Just because you "always" have them for Christmas doesn't mean that in a crisis year (or even not in a crisis year)  you can't change your mind.  I'd like to see you stop saying you messed up, or this was all your fault. It wasn't. Hugs to you as  you maneuver through all this.

[TexasProud]

Oh, Ann.... your husband is probably distant because he is GRIEVING.  You grieve by needing to feel close, process it, etc. He tends to withdraw...at least that is my guess.  In that way, we are reversed.  Even half of those things you mentioned, would have me completely shut down and crying on here, but silent with the other people in my life.  I don't know how to allow my self to suffer when the other person is suffering as well.  I am the strong one, the one supporting everyone.  If I cannot fix your problem, I will emotionally withdraw and do the things that  need to be done.  

Just because your husband acts this way does not mean that it is your fault. It is life's fault.  Again, I am not sure I would be able to get out of bed after dealing with everything you have.   I would definitely be "distant" to my husband at that point.

[Clarita]

::Hugs:: I have no advice. None of this is your fault. Sometimes life sucks and we aren't perfect at dealing with it. Your husband needs a therapist to tell him how to grieve. He also has to decide to seek that help on his own. (For me it was crashing the car into the side of the garage before realizing I need professional help.)

As for the job, know not every job has crappy work/life balance. My first job had me working 12-14 hours everyday 5 days/week sometimes 6. I thought that was what my career should look like. I quit went to a new company and my boss will tell me in no uncertain terms to please leave work after 5:15pm and to save work for another day. I was also offered a different job where the guy who was recruiting me (because he knew me previously) said this job will be 8 hrs/day no extra. All of these are successful companies that make profit and are still kicking. JOBS THAT DON'T REQUIRE WORKERS WORK 80 HR/WEEK EXIST. I know the stress and unknown of moving to a new company and health insurance stuff too. Also of course this is also something that your husband has to decide to do.

[Arcadia]

For the workaholics in my family, work is escapism from boredom and other issues. It doesn’t help that with work you get to see tangible achievements and monetary rewards.  Sometimes when a problem can’t be easily resolved, people feel down on themselves and they feel like they are making a tiny contribution if they are able to bring in some money. 
Also, it is rather common for adult males in my family, including my husband, to be annoyed when they can’t resolve an issue. They feel like they are incapable and they lash out but the anger is actually self directed. 

[Arcadia]

8 minutes ago, Clarita said:

. I know the stress and unknown of moving to a new company and health insurance stuff too. Also of course this is also something that your husband has to decide to do.

Depending on job situation at OP’s location, her husband has worked 22 years at the same company and might be worried about last in first out if he switch companies. My husband has been thinking of jumping ship for months for better remuneration but there are hiring freezes and layoffs going on in my area. His colleagues in the same division but different department is staying put in a toxic environment until they could jump ship or be retrenched (so that at least there are unemployment benefits). 

[Clarita]

10 minutes ago, Arcadia said:

Depending on job situation at OP’s location, her husband has worked 22 years at the same company and might be worried about last in first out if he switch companies. My husband has been thinking of jumping ship for months for better remuneration but there are hiring freezes and layoffs going on in my area.

Yes OP and her husband may have to weigh things and wait/find the right time. I think though people need to know that jobs at other companies don't all demand huge time commitments.

[Arcadia]

4 minutes ago, Clarita said:

Yes OP and her husband may have to weigh things and wait/find the right time. I think though people need to know that jobs at other companies don't all demand huge time commitments.

That’s for sure. I meant I can understand why OP’s husband might not be happy with work but would rather stay put for now (regardless of the insurance coverage issue). I once took a pay cut to work in a 40hrs work week job that is rather relaxing and guaranteed no overtime. My parents did backfill some of the difference in pay. My husband works less than 40hrs, just that conference calls don’t fit nicely into an office hour schedule. For example he is playing games now because whatever work he can do is done but he does have a conference call at 5pm. 

[Melissa Louise]

The stress isn't all in your head. 

Give yourself some grace. Any one of those issues/events would have been a lot. 

You can't change or fix dh, but you can look after you. Would you consider asking him to attend relationship counselling with you? If he would prefer not to, you can get support yourself with individual counselling.

 

[freesia]

Ann, that is a lot. Try not to blame yourself for the Christmas thing. This is the way it would work in a healthy family. I’ll choose my MIL, because she is sensitive. Dh would call and say—I’m so sorry. Dw is completely underwater with the pregnancy and everything that’s going on. She just can’t host Christmas.  She’s really really sorry to disappoint you. MIL would say she is sad, but then pivot to concern about me. Can she help?  They probably would have then figured out a time for dh to bring the kids for an overnight during the winter break in order to give me a break. That’s what I would expect to happen. It is normal to expect that. So you aren’t to blame for anything other than exposing a huge bunch of unhealthy. 

Edited August 16, 2022 by freesia

[Ann.without.an.e]

7 hours ago, TexasProud said:

Oh, Ann.... your husband is probably distant because he is GRIEVING.  You grieve by needing to feel close, process it, etc. He tends to withdraw...at least that is my guess.  In that way, we are reversed.  Even half of those things you mentioned, would have me completely shut down and crying on here, but silent with the other people in my life.  I don't know how to allow my self to suffer when the other person is suffering as well.  I am the strong one, the one supporting everyone.  If I cannot fix your problem, I will emotionally withdraw and do the things that  need to be done.  

Just because your husband acts this way does not mean that it is your fault. It is life's fault.  Again, I am not sure I would be able to get out of bed after dealing with everything you have.   I would definitely be "distant" to my husband at that point.

Actually, we both tend to do this tbh. We're both pretty independent people who withdraw in pain. I tend to be strong (mostly for the kids), he is strong for the family overall. We both are guilty of just pushing forward. It has felt like we can't get our heads above water for a breath before we're pushed back under. The crazy thing is, very little even phases us outwardly anymore. Sort of like how abused kiddos don't really make a fuss anymore. Life has been a bit abusive in some ways. We aren't in the worst of circumstances by any means, it could always be worse.

I vent here but rarely rarely vent to others, not even DH. 

 

@marbel @freesia  I don't feel as much guilt over it as I used to, mostly because I have a different perspective almost seven years later. I have two married kids and one young adult. Maybe this is ignorant of me but I can't imagine a world where I would react like they have reacted or treat my kids the way they have treated us. They completely and totally lack empathy. 

 

@Arcadia @Clarita  We can't decide if a job change is good or bad because of things like being new somewhere over 50 vs being crucial where he is? It is a super risky move.

@Scarlett I'm still thinking on whether it is a good idea to encourage him to revisit the idea of a relationship. For a long time, it was a struggle emotionally but he does seem happy now? He works too much and he isn't super emotionally available but he seems very content. Do I want to encourage an upheaval of that? I just don't know. I would support it if he came up with the idea, of course. 

[Scarlett]

2 hours ago, Ann.without.an.e said:

Actually, we both tend to do this tbh. We're both pretty independent people who withdraw in pain. I tend to be strong (mostly for the kids), he is strong for the family overall. We both are guilty of just pushing forward. It has felt like we can't get our heads above water for a breath before we're pushed back under. The crazy thing is, very little even phases us outwardly anymore. Sort of like how abused kiddos don't really make a fuss anymore. Life has been a bit abusive in some ways. We aren't in the worst of circumstances by any means, it could always be worse.

I vent here but rarely rarely vent to others, not even DH. 

 

@marbel @freesia  I don't feel as much guilt over it as I used to, mostly because I have a different perspective almost seven years later. I have two married kids and one young adult. Maybe this is ignorant of me but I can't imagine a world where I would react like they have reacted or treat my kids the way they have treated us. They completely and totally lack empathy. 

 

@Arcadia @Clarita  We can't decide if a job change is good or bad because of things like being new somewhere over 50 vs being crucial where he is? It is a super risky move.

@Scarlett I'm still thinking on whether it is a good idea to encourage him to revisit the idea of a relationship. For a long time, it was a struggle emotionally but he does seem happy now? He works too much and he isn't super emotionally available but he seems very content. Do I want to encourage an upheaval of that? I just don't know. I would support it if he came up with the idea, of course. 

If he is dead set against it your comment won’t sway him. But if he has been thinking about it it might give him the boost he needs

[Scarlett]

3 hours ago, freesia said:

Ann, that is a lot. Try not to blame yourself for the Christmas thing. This is the way it would work in a healthy family. I’ll choose my MIL, because she is sensitive. Dh would call and say—I’m so sorry. Dw is completely underwater with the pregnancy and everything that’s going on. She just can’t host Christmas.  She’s really really sorry to disappoint you. MIL would say she is sad, but then pivot to concern about me. Can she help?  They probably would have then figured out a time for dh to bring the kids for an overnight during the winter break in order to give me a break. That’s what I would expect to happen. It is normal to expect that. So you aren’t to blame for anything other than exposing a huge bunch of unhealthy. 

Yes to this. Disappointed adults suck it up behave nicely when others are suffering.

[heartlikealion]

I still don’t understand what happened at Thanksgiving. I’m going to say this because I feel like you need to hear it. 

They couldn’t follow up with Thanksgiving plans/didn’t apologize or explain, then expected you to host Christmas. That’s just friggin’ rude. And your dh and you should be a united front. He should have been on the same page before responding to them. This is not YOUR fault. I’m tossing your husband under the bus on that one lol I rarely had a united front with mine and holidays were mostly defined by my in laws. It’s truly unfair and I think your dh needs to realize that and stop treating you like the bad guy. Stop feeling bad. He needs to correct his mindset. And if his parents are pissed it sounds like their problem. His FOO has some stuff to work out and maybe you were just at the wrong place at the wrong time. If not Christmas it would have been something else because they seem self centered. 

Just to offer another viewpoint on the job thing. So many people are struggling to hire decent employees. Don’t sell yourself short regarding his age or being the new guy. Also, it usually takes a new job to get a decent pay increase. 

Either your dh’s job is poor with work/life boundaries or your dh is (or both). Perhaps if he found a job with better boundaries he would be less likely to be consumed with work on the weekend. 

Even just one or two of those things sound stressful. Please make yourself a priority if you aren’t. Give yourself compassion. 

Is there a reason you couldn’t return to your old church without your dh? Does the family attend together? 

[Ann.without.an.e]

6 hours ago, heartlikealion said:

I still don’t understand what happened at Thanksgiving. I’m going to say this because I feel like you need to hear it. 

They couldn’t follow up with Thanksgiving plans/didn’t apologize or explain, then expected you to host Christmas. That’s just friggin’ rude. And your dh and you should be a united front. He should have been on the same page before responding to them. This is not YOUR fault. I’m tossing your husband under the bus on that one lol I rarely had a united front with mine and holidays were mostly defined by my in laws. It’s truly unfair and I think your dh needs to realize that and stop treating you like the bad guy. Stop feeling bad. He needs to correct his mindset. And if his parents are pissed it sounds like their problem. His FOO has some stuff to work out and maybe you were just at the wrong place at the wrong time. If not Christmas it would have been something else because they seem self centered. 

Just to offer another viewpoint on the job thing. So many people are struggling to hire decent employees. Don’t sell yourself short regarding his age or being the new guy. Also, it usually takes a new job to get a decent pay increase. 

Either your dh’s job is poor with work/life boundaries or your dh is (or both). Perhaps if he found a job with better boundaries he would be less likely to be consumed with work on the weekend. 

Even just one or two of those things sound stressful. Please make yourself a priority if you aren’t. Give yourself compassion. 

Is there a reason you couldn’t return to your old church without your dh? Does the family attend together? 

I agree with you. We talked about it before he visited and we were on the same page and I don’t know if it was just a desire to make peace with his parents? I have no clue what possessed him to ask if they were coming. Usually I would’ve been too nice to say no, I would’ve gone along with it. Maybe he saw it as the solution to fix the situation? I was very upset at him. I’m not good at standing up for myself but this was one of the few times when I firmly did. He said “well it’s done now” and I said “you made the mistake, they are not invited here. If you want to go to their house or go to dinner with them then that’s fine but they aren’t coming here. They’ve not even spoken to me. Call and fix it.” And he was resistant but he did. Thankfully DH isn’t usually one to take advantage of the fact that I’m a pushover lol. 
 

The place he works has a good work and life balance at heart. It’s just the job has more work to do than is reasonable and someone has to do it. And they just keep piling it on. There was a CEO change and this CEO won’t tell people no. Which always falls on DH to complete the tasks. The same CEO will tell DH he works too much, ask him to hire another person, etc. 

Dd and SIL also go to this church now and I want to be where my family is and not split is up. I don’t want DS13 to have to choose. 

Edited August 17, 2022 by Ann.without.an.e