S/O: WHY is this bash-homeschooling week here on this homeschool board?

[Lovedtodeath]

You could just as well be talking about public school. My eleven year old used to show our 15 year old public schooled babysitter how multiply and divide fractions.

 

In the public school of my town in NJ, there are fifth graders who can't read. High schoolers who can't do basic math as evidenced by pathetic SAT scores.

 

Bad behavior is everywhere. Heck, I was pushed by a boy scout the other night because I was in front of the brownie that he wanted. You can't blame a lot of the things that you listed on homeschool failure.

 

I agree with you, but if any of the above examples are the case with my children, then I have failed. I know of many failures and successes in Public School.

 

I know of a few homeschool successes, but truthfully, I have met very very few homeschoolers IRL period. It is not the norm around here. People look at Public School as a wonderful babysitting service which enables mothers to pursue success in other areas of life, and those successes are the ones celebrated in these parts.

[msjones]

Homeschooling is often, by definition, anti public school. I would think a homeschooling board is a place where that reality is understood, accepted and not expected to be tempered.

 

Well, if home-schooling means "anti public school" on this board, then I am in the wrong place. We home-school. We also attend a public school district home-school resource center. My husband teaches public school. He is an excellent, sought-after teacher. I work part-time at a public school and spent 7 years teaching full-time at public schools. I still teach public school summer-school some years.

 

The reality is, that some public schools are doing a good job. There are kids in public schools who can read, think, write, discuss, understand complex mathematics (with and without calculators), and behave appropriately.

 

There are teachers who manage their classrooms effectively, plan meaningful lessons thoughtfully, and communicate with parents each day.

 

Are we not 'allowed' to say that here? I am finding some very narrow points of view on this board. To suggest (or, to come right out and say, as some have here) that all public schools are places to be avoided at all costs is just as outrageous and ignorant as saying that all home-schoolers are narrow-minded, social misfits and freaks.

 

I may have just worn out my welcome here...we'll see.

[Cricket]

That works for me, too! When I'm stressed, I plan out everyone's lives for the next 10 years :D It sure looks good on paper...it's my little escape from reality :closedeyes:

 

:lol: Heck, I only plan the next *week*. But it sure makes me feel much better.

[Elaine]

I agree with you, but if any of the above examples are the case with my children, then I have failed. I know of many failures and successes in Public School.

 

I know of a few homeschool successes, but truthfully, I have met very very few homeschoolers IRL period. It is not the norm around here. People look at Public School as a wonderful babysitting service which enables mothers to pursue success in other areas of life, and those successes are the ones celebrated in these parts.

 

Sadly the same is true here, too.

[Plucky]

That works for me, too! When I'm stressed, I plan out everyone's lives for the next 10 years :D It sure looks good on paper...it's my little escape from reality :closedeyes:

 

You guys are cracking me up. I do my planning in Dec/Jan. I just pulled up my plan for Fall 2009, which is really starting to look more like summer 2009 since I'll have a 7th and 10th grader next year along with my elementary kids. I'm a planner but know that often plans change. :D

[melissel]

Are we not 'allowed' to say that here? I am finding some very narrow points of view on this board. To suggest (or, to come right out and say, as some have here) that all public schools are places to be avoided at all costs is just as outrageous and ignorant as saying that all home-schoolers are narrow-minded, social misfits and freaks.

 

Well, to be fair, you'll find narrow points of view on any message board dedicated to a particular interest. It's the nature of the beast. IMO, you can and should say anything you want here (unless it's about politics). You just need to have your thick skin on in expectation of the replies you'll potentially receive. If you post a very strong point of view on something (anything, really), expect strong points of view in return.

 

Personally, I liked your post AND the discussion it spurred. I understood where you were coming from. But we're an opinionated bunch, and I think it's easier to express strong views in this semi-anonymous, non-face-to-face format. I definitely think you should stick around, but only you can decide that.

[Murphy101]

Are we not 'allowed' to say that here? I am finding some very narrow points of view on this board. To suggest (or, to come right out and say, as some have here) that all public schools are places to be avoided at all costs is just as outrageous and ignorant as saying that all home-schoolers are narrow-minded, social misfits and freaks.

 

well...

 

Of course you can say that whatever school is good for whatever reason.

 

But I'll come right out and say that I do think all public schools are places to be avoided at all costs. I wish they'd all be closed and the taxes put to other use. (back in our wallets would be nice!)

 

Why is that outragious or ignorant?

 

At least in MY case - that statement is far less about being against public schools than a statement about how strongly I am for homeschooling.

 

The public/private school could be the highest ranking school in the world, and still I doubt you could convince me to send any of my kids there.

 

That said, I do not think that people who choose differently for their kids are horrible parents with horrible uneducated kids. Not at all. I simply don't agree with it. No big deal.

 

I guess the real problem isn't that we might choose different education paths.

 

The real problem is when those that don't homeschool get upset when homeschoolers don't support/encourage them in their choosing public/private schools?

 

I don't go to a message board for parents of kids in schools and get upset when they don't support homeschooling.

 

Yet, for some reason many public/private schoolers get really upset when homeschoolers don't support them in their education choice.:confused:

[Erica in PA]

I don't go to a message board for parents of kids in schools and get upset when they don't support homeschooling.

 

Yet, for some reason many public/private schoolers get really upset when homeschoolers don't support them in their education choice.:confused:

 

I agree that there is something of a double standard in that. Isn't there some teensy tiny part of the world where a person can say that *in their opinion*, public schools are seriously flawed and homeschooling is a better option, without being flamed? If it's not on a homeschooling board, then where?

 

Erica

[Erica in PA]

So, yes- a strong homeschooling or anti-institutional bias should be fine on homeschooling boards. Just keep it polite.

 

I think the people on this board are very polite, but it seems that often that isn't enough to save people's feelings. Just the "strong homeschooling or anti-institutional bias" itself is enough to be greatly offensive to some. But I don't know what can be done about that.

[Laura K (NC)]

I'm convinced. Homeschooling is definitely NOT the path for any self-respecting parent.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

not.

[Laura K (NC)]

Sure, homeschooling is hard. I'm working my fanny off, personally.

 

The issue doesn't seem to be how hard homeschooling is. What seems to be questioned is the ontological value of this process called homeschooling, measured by the anecdotes of people who have tried it and found it wanting. So many voices, then, have been advocating against the process itself, essentially saying that no amount of hard work can overcome the disadvantages of keeping your child at home.

 

Frankly, it's seems almost like sheep-stealing. I see these kind of posts as undermining the work of those who are struggling with the difficulty of it all. It's like they're being told, "forget it. It's too hard. The public schools are doing just fine, and you don't have to work at all! Try it... it's so easy... it's so nice... you'll be glad you did!" This kind of thing offers no support at all to hard-working homeschoolers who are doing as well if not better in academic measures, and often far better in less tangible aspects, like compassion, perseverance, backbone, and a million other virtues that are sucked right out of the minds of public school minds.

 

Dang it, there's a real problem here.

[Harriet Vane]

Sure, homeschooling is hard. I'm working my fanny off, personally.

 

The issue doesn't seem to be how hard homeschooling is. What seems to be questioned is the ontological value of this process called homeschooling, measured by the anecdotes of people who have tried it and found it wanting. So many voices, then, have been advocating against the process itself, essentially saying that no amount of hard work can overcome the disadvantages of keeping your child at home.

 

Frankly, it's seems almost like sheep-stealing. I see these kind of posts as undermining the work of those who are struggling with the difficulty of it all. It's like they're being told, "forget it. It's too hard. The public schools are doing just fine, and you don't have to work at all! Try it... it's so easy... it's so nice... you'll be glad you did!" This kind of thing offers no support at all to hard-working homeschoolers who are doing as well if not better in academic measures, and often far better in less tangible aspects, like compassion, perseverance, backbone, and a million other virtues that are sucked right out of the minds of public school minds.

 

Dang it, there's a real problem here.

 

Talking about frustrations with homeschooling does not necessarily equate to choosing public school instead. I believe wholeheartedly in homeschooling, for myself and many others, but I do not think the process or the people are perfect. I'd much rather talk openly about these things in the hope of better understanding and even improvement.

[melissel]

Sure, homeschooling is hard. I'm working my fanny off, personally.

 

The issue doesn't seem to be how hard homeschooling is. What seems to be questioned is the ontological value of this process called homeschooling, measured by the anecdotes of people who have tried it and found it wanting. So many voices, then, have been advocating against the process itself, essentially saying that no amount of hard work can overcome the disadvantages of keeping your child at home.

 

Frankly, it's seems almost like sheep-stealing. I see these kind of posts as undermining the work of those who are struggling with the difficulty of it all. It's like they're being told, "forget it. It's too hard. The public schools are doing just fine, and you don't have to work at all! Try it... it's so easy... it's so nice... you'll be glad you did!" This kind of thing offers no support at all to hard-working homeschoolers who are doing as well if not better in academic measures, and often far better in less tangible aspects, like compassion, perseverance, backbone, and a million other virtues that are sucked right out of the minds of public school minds.

 

Dang it, there's a real problem here.

 

And posts like this minimize the experiences of homeschoolers who work THEIR tails off and find the experience THEY are providing wanting. This sounds to me like the other side of the coin: "Well, if you'd just been willing to work as hard as we do, you could could have made HSing work and your whole family would have been better off!"

 

But really, that's not even the point I really want to make. Have troll-like public schoolers been sneaking over here, trying to lure the weakest of us over to their camp? The most obvious post I've seen is someone posting about how in her experience, the public schools she's seen have not been as bad as some posts have made it out to be. I haven't seen anyone suggest we all burn our copies of TWTM and join the yellow-bus ranks, or tell us that we're all burning ourselves out for no reason--that PS is really great, and we should sign the kids up and get ourselves back to our massage sessions and bon bons. I really feel like I must have missed something. Besides msjones's post, has someone else been stirring the pot?

Edited December 4, 2008 by melissel

[Tree House Academy]

Amen. I love homeschooling and I do think I am doing what is absolutely BEST for my kids. Having had the "public school experience," I can say that I am 100% convinced...hard days and good ones...that this is the greatest and most rewarding decision I have ever made.

[Jenny in Atl]

Sure, homeschooling is hard. I'm working my fanny off, personally.

 

The issue doesn't seem to be how hard homeschooling is. What seems to be questioned is the ontological value of this process called homeschooling, measured by the anecdotes of people who have tried it and found it wanting. So many voices, then, have been advocating against the process itself, essentially saying that no amount of hard work can overcome the disadvantages of keeping your child at home.

 

Frankly, it's seems almost like sheep-stealing. I see these kind of posts as undermining the work of those who are struggling with the difficulty of it all. It's like they're being told, "forget it. It's too hard. The public schools are doing just fine, and you don't have to work at all! Try it... it's so easy... it's so nice... you'll be glad you did!" This kind of thing offers no support at all to hard-working homeschoolers who are doing as well if not better in academic measures, and often far better in less tangible aspects, like compassion, perseverance, backbone, and a million other virtues that are sucked right out of the minds of public school minds.

 

Dang it, there's a real problem here.

 

Anyone who puts their kids in school based on a couple posts by strangers on a public board, most likely did not have their heart in it to begin with.

[triadofchaos]

I get frustrated when one group assumes they are being attacked as individuals when they read about another group expressing their personal beliefs esp. when those beliefs are foundational to the purpose of the board on which they are being expressed.

 

I am in the camp that thinks the system of public education in this country as a whole is broken and hopes that I never find myself in a situation that would require me to put my children into said system. This is my belief. Just like I believe that sardines are utterly disgusting and I would much rather have a granola bar for a snack. By making that statement about my beliefs, I am not attacking sardine-eaters as terrible, horrible, no-good, etc. people.

 

If I found myself on a sardine eaters message board for whatever other reason may have drawn me there, I would fulling expect to read threads and posts from people passionate about their adoration of sardines. I might even see the sardine folks say they cannot stand my beloved granola bars. If I see this, I am not going to assume they hate me or think I'm inferior b/c I prefer the granola bar. Furthermore, I'm probably not going to make a big deal about how much I detest sardines, considering I'm on a pro-sardine board. That just wouldn't make much sense. If I really want to complain about sardines and wax poetic about granola bars, I'll go find the granola bar board and knock myself out there.

[Murphy101]

If I found myself on a sardine eaters message board for whatever other reason may have drawn me there, I would fulling expect to read threads and posts from people passionate about their adoration of sardines. I might even see the sardine folks say they cannot stand my beloved granola bars. If I see this, I am not going to assume they hate me or think I'm inferior b/c I prefer the granola bar. Furthermore, I'm probably not going to make a big deal about how much I detest sardines, considering I'm on a pro-sardine board. That just wouldn't make much sense. If I really want to complain about sardines and wax poetic about granola bars, I'll go find the granola bar board and knock myself out there.

 

:lol::iagree::lol:

[tibbyl]

It does seem that it is politically inccorect here on the homeschool support board to say that homeschooling is inherently superior to public schooling.

 

Heck, If I didn't embrace that idea fully in my head and heart, I would enroll them in school.

 

Yes, homeschooling is better. It is better for the family. It is better for the children. It is a better system of learning that is the standard of human evolution. The school system is a poor mimicry of that standard. (Said by a former school teacher)

 

I won't apologize for seeing that truth.

 

I was under impression that this was not exclusively a homeschooling board. The author of Well Trained Mind allegedly afterschooled, not homeschooled, her own children. Hence the existence of an afterschooling forum although it is admittedly a relatively small part of the message board.

 

We spent our first decade homeschooling without any meaningful contact with other homeschoolers. It was only when we moved that we sought h/s'ers out. We found a huge range in quality education in both home and traditional school settings per *our perceptions.* I neither try to sell h/s'ing or steer people away from it; I will give honest opinion when asked. I believe the best educational fit depends upon a number of circumstances such that either traditional or home education cannot be blanketly advised for any family without consideration of their circumstances.

Edited December 5, 2008 by tibbyl

[Snickerdoodle]

 

I am in the camp that thinks the system of public education in this country as a whole is broken and hopes that I never find myself in a situation that would require me to put my children into said system. This is my belief. Just like I believe that sardines are utterly disgusting and I would much rather have a granola bar for a snack. By making that statement about my beliefs, I am not attacking sardine-eaters as terrible, horrible, no-good, etc. people.

 

 

 

I agree, except sardines are tasty little morsels IMHO.

[triadofchaos]

and I still think you are worthwhile human being, sardine breath and all. :D

[Kate CA]

I was under impression that this was not exclusively a homeschooling board. The author of Well Trained Mind allegedly afterschooled, not homeschooled, her own children. Hence the existence of an afterschooling forum although it is admittedly a relatively small part of the message board.

 

 

I am not sure where you got the impression that SWB does not homeschool, but she, her husband, and her mother all take part in their homeschooling adventure. I just thought I would toss that out there. The WTM was written as a guide for homeschoolers to teach their children at home in a classical manner. That does not mean others don't use it to fit their choices, but this was the original intent.

 

I think this board has morphed over time to fit the different choices each family makes, but I think most people still consider it to be primarily a homeschooling board.

[Erica in PA]

I get frustrated when one group assumes they are being attacked as individuals when they read about another group expressing their personal beliefs esp. when those beliefs are foundational to the purpose of the board on which they are being expressed.

 

I am in the camp that thinks the system of public education in this country as a whole is broken and hopes that I never find myself in a situation that would require me to put my children into said system. This is my belief. Just like I believe that sardines are utterly disgusting and I would much rather have a granola bar for a snack. By making that statement about my beliefs, I am not attacking sardine-eaters as terrible, horrible, no-good, etc. people.

 

If I found myself on a sardine eaters message board for whatever other reason may have drawn me there, I would fulling expect to read threads and posts from people passionate about their adoration of sardines. I might even see the sardine folks say they cannot stand my beloved granola bars. If I see this, I am not going to assume they hate me or think I'm inferior b/c I prefer the granola bar. Furthermore, I'm probably not going to make a big deal about how much I detest sardines, considering I'm on a pro-sardine board. That just wouldn't make much sense. If I really want to complain about sardines and wax poetic about granola bars, I'll go find the granola bar board and knock myself out there.

 

 

:iagree: You said this so well!!!

[PiCO]

I get frustrated when one group assumes they are being attacked as individuals when they read about another group expressing their personal beliefs esp. when those beliefs are foundational to the purpose of the board on which they are being expressed.

 

 

I think people get emotional when their children are dragged into the conversation. I don't care if you eat granola bars, but do you really think granola bars are as good for you child as sardines? ;)

 

(Personally, I like sardines and granola bars. Just not together.)

[triadofchaos]

i know it's always more personal when we're talking parenting vs. snack choices, but you get the jist of what i'm saying.

 

i am on another parenting board with a seperate forum for parents of twins/triplets or more and it never ceases to amaze me when a mother of twins brings up an issue directly related tp parenting multiple indentically aged children and a handful of mothers with singletons only feel the need to vocally judge her or offer impractical advice. it's not that the singleton moms aren't just as good mothers, it's that they and the mothers of multiples are coming from different perspectives and experiences. it's also not that the two groups of mothers couldn't learn things from each other, it's just that that specific forum may not be the place for them to do that.

 

i think i've probably over explained myself at this point. :001_huh: sorry about that.

[Joanne]

Well, if home-schooling means "anti public school" on this board, then I am in the wrong place. We home-school. We also attend a public school district home-school resource center. My husband teaches public school. He is an excellent, sought-after teacher. I work part-time at a public school and spent 7 years teaching full-time at public schools. I still teach public school summer-school some years.

 

The reality is, that some public schools are doing a good job. There are kids in public schools who can read, think, write, discuss, understand complex mathematics (with and without calculators), and behave appropriately.

 

There are teachers who manage their classrooms effectively, plan meaningful lessons thoughtfully, and communicate with parents each day.

 

Are we not 'allowed' to say that here? I am finding some very narrow points of view on this board. To suggest (or, to come right out and say, as some have here) that all public schools are places to be avoided at all costs is just as outrageous and ignorant as saying that all home-schoolers are narrow-minded, social misfits and freaks.

 

I may have just worn out my welcome here...we'll see.

 

You quoted me, but my posts don't contain the content you are reacting to.

 

 

But Joanne didn't say that people who do not homeschool are not welcome to post on this board. She was addressing the fact that the tone overall of this board has become very "politically correct" in that strong pro-homeschooling views, or anti-p.s. views, can't be expressed without strong rebuttals. That would be expected anywhere else in our culture, but you'd think that a homeschooling board would be a safer place for homeschoolers to speak freely.

 

Exactly.

[Harriet Vane]

I was under impression that this was not exclusively a homeschooling board. The author of Well Trained Mind allegedly afterschooled, not homeschooled, her own children. Hence the existence of an afterschooling forum although it is admittedly a relatively small part of the message board.

 

We spent our first decade homeschooling without any meaningful contact with other homeschoolers. It was only when we moved that we sought h/s'ers out. We found a huge range in quality education in both home and traditional school settings per *our perceptions.* I neither try to sell h/s'ing or steer people away from it; I will give honest opinion when asked. I believe the best educational fit depends upon a number of circumstances such that either traditional or home education cannot be blanketly advised for any family without consideration of their circumstances.

 

I am totally confused here. Both Jessie Wise and SWB homeschooled, though Jessie Wise's kids did attend a traditional school for the earliest years of elementary school before she pulled them out to teach them herself.

[Testimony]

Just like I believe that sardines are utterly disgusting and I would much rather have a granola bar for a snack. By making that statement about my beliefs, I am not attacking sardine-eaters as terrible, horrible, no-good, etc. people.

 

If I found myself on a sardine eaters message board for whatever other reason may have drawn me there, I would fulling expect to read threads and posts from people passionate about their adoration of sardines. I might even see the sardine folks say they cannot stand my beloved granola bars. If I see this, I am not going to assume they hate me or think I'm inferior b/c I prefer the granola bar. Furthermore, I'm probably not going to make a big deal about how much I detest sardines, considering I'm on a pro-sardine board. That just wouldn't make much sense. If I really want to complain about sardines and wax poetic about granola bars, I'll go find the granola bar board and knock myself out there.

 

:smilielol5::smilielol5::smilielol5:

 

I loooooove sardines especially with tomatoes and onions!

 

From,

Testimony

http://www.homeschoolblogger.com/testimony

[Laura K (NC)]

then you'd have a point.

 

But it's a recurring trend, and these posters have been fairly well-known here for many years.

 

I reserve the right to complain. I shouldn't have to defend homeschooling here, like I've seen posters try to do in this very thread.

[Laura in VA]

Because politics (except Canadian) are banned and people need something to b*tch about. ;)

[coffeefreak]

personally, i like sardines and granola bars. Just not together.

 

i am totally offended!!!!! I happen to love sardine granola barS!!!!

[nmoira]

 

i am totally offended!!!!! I happen to love sardine granola barS!!!!

I prefer anchovies, salt packed.

[Kris]

I prefer anchovies, salt packed.

 

That's it. I'm now totally grossed out and . . .

 

:leaving:

 

Besides, other than the nasty foods, I have no idea what you people are talking about. Am I the only one who feels like the grandfather in Moonstruck? "I'm so confused!"

[Audrey]

I haven't seen these anti-homeschool comments, but I do have a theory about the negativity in general.

 

Stress makes people cranky. We're being constantly bombarded with economic doom-sayers these days AND a major holiday is around the corner.

 

Like we need more pressure in our already busy homeschooling lives??

 

Days like these, we all need a big, fat fistful of :chillpill::chillpill::chillpill:

[msjones]

Well, for 'the record', I didn't say anything negative about the practice of home-schooling. I said something mildly positive about public schools.

 

Nonetheless, I seem to have been pegged as a home-school 'hater' (or, rather, "detester" as mentioned in the charming sardine analogy).

 

I'll be glad at this point to find another home-schooling message board -- one where the members are looking for a more diverse discussion.

[Spy Car]

I prefer anchovies, salt packed.

 

:thumbup: Mmmm....salt packed anchovies :drool:

[Colleen]

I don't perceive a "bash homeschooling" tone this week. Perhaps we're not reading the same posts, or perhaps you're overreacting (or I'm underreacting:tongue_smilie:). What disturbs me is when people assert the superiority of homeschoolers. I'm not interested in playing the comparison game.

 

On the other hand, there is often a politcally correct "whatever floats your boat" tone when the subject of schooling methodology arises, and I don't care for that, either. While I don't believe my educational choices are superior, or right for everyone, I do prefer this to be a place where we encourage one another in our homeschooling endeavours. My oldest will be a high schooler next year and I know virtually one in "real life" to talk to about our/his future. So few stay the homeschooling course with older children so that aspect of this community is very important to me.

[5kidsforME]

I guess I may have been mistaken in perceiving this board as a place to discuss home-schooling in general -- the pros and cons, the successes and failures.

 

There are few places in which many of us can have that sort of discussion, after all. Family and some friends think I'm nuts, so they certainly don't provide a helpful venue for an honest discussion about the possible shortcomings of my schooling choices.

 

And I very much want to consider the possible shortcomings so I can address them.

 

I'm new around here, so I don't know the 'culture' of this board, but I don't consider an honest discussion to be "bashing."

 

 

You've been here almost 3 months, you're no longer new. ;)

[Colleen]

What is a homeschool failure?

 

 

Like most derogatorty terms, it's a catch-all used to put down some people while simultaneously allowing others to feel better about themselves. Honest to goodness, what right do I have to describe someone else as failing at a job they've undertaken? How much do I truly know about what's gone on behind the scenes, why choices have been made, which events led to seeming "failed" results?

 

Oh, I'd love to know more people who actually school their children at home. I'd love to be connected (beyond this board!) with folks who homeschool high school in a manner that resonates with me, such that I could glean from them. But in my world, homeschoolers rely a great deal on public school partnership programs. And more often than not, by the time a student is middle- or high-school aged, they opt out of homeschooling entirely. I wish, selfishly, that that wasn't the case, but there ya go. Still, I'd no sooner call those people "failures" than I'd call myself a "success". Just like I wouldn't deem a farmer who goes out of business, or one who doesn't farm organically, or one whose place looks less-than-ideal, a "failure". Far better to keep paddling my own canoe and dealing with my own very real failures than assign that label to others.

[Colleen]

I don't perceive a "bash homeschooling" tone this week. Perhaps we're not reading the same posts, or perhaps you're overreacting (or I'm underreacting:tongue_smilie:).

 

I'm back, having read, in more detail, this week's posts. (Just passin' time while I deal with some less-than-pleasant, 15 mile run after-effects. Ahem.) I can reiterate now that imo, there's been no homeschool bash-fest. On the contrary, when someone asked ~ in a duplicate post, nonetheless ~ if homeschoolers ever drive us to consider public school, the majority of people wisely observed that good eggs and bad eggs are found all the world over. Far from being riled up over any recent conversations, I'm encouraged by the rational, fair-minded, and polite tone of our little community.:)

[Osmosis Mom]

And posts like this minimize the experiences of homeschoolers who work THEIR tails off and find the experience THEY are providing wanting. This sounds to me like the other side of the coin: "Well, if you'd just been willing to work as hard as we do, you could could have made HSing work and your whole family would have been better off!"

 

 

Melissa,

 

I don't want to come off snarky or rude so excuse the medium, but I am very surprised how you can talk with such authority on homeschool success vs. implied failurw (as a family, for your mental health and that of your dd's etc.) when your signature line says your kids are ages 3 and 6. Am I missing something here?? Again, not wanting to be rude, but how stressful can it be to be a mother and homeschool two girls that young? You seem very put together and your blog looks awesome, but perhaps your standards are too high for the outcome needed at this stage of the game?

 

My oldest is in college (Wellesley, if that makes a difference) now and we certainly did not have perfect years. But that worked for this outgoing, driven child. Her 5-6 younger siblings just sort of followed along, doing school focused sometimes, doing a lot of field trips and reading great books, having discussions etc. I was a busy mother with a lot of life-stress so I knew that in order not to burn out and send my kids to school or leave them to fend for themselves I would need to adjust my internal expectations as well as take life as it came.

 

Now, my oldest is off and we have a very structured and busy schedule in place with two high schoolers and three younger eager students. I also have a busy toddler. Mother is not a perfect human being, but mother strives for the best of her kids. Yes, school is an option, but it is so *generic* when you can hang around your kids and see them learn all those things.

 

It is important that the mother (main-teacher) renews herself and takes time to be a person on her own in order to avoid resentment, anger, impatience. Many forget that and drive forward with such vigor, forgetting the humanity in the process and then end up with total burn-out and an alination towards her off-spring....

 

I guess what I am trying to say to your personally, Melissa, is to remember this is a marathon, not a sprint. You don't need to feel stressful when your kids are this young. You should be enjoying eachother. In te proper environment kids will learn speedfast when they are ready (and at a much slower pace when not yet developmentally ready).

 

Nadia

[Marie in Oh]

Your post was wonderful-- tempered with sage experience and wisdom. Yes, yes, yes. If your oldest is six and you are stressed about school, something is out of wack. Great advice.

[at the beach]

And posts like this minimize the experiences of homeschoolers who work THEIR tails off and find the experience THEY are providing wanting. This sounds to me like the other side of the coin: "Well, if you'd just been willing to work as hard as we do, you could could have made HSing work and your whole family would have been better off!"

 

 

Melissa,

 

I don't want to come off snarky or rude so excuse the medium, but I am very surprised how you can talk with such authority on homeschool success vs. implied failurw (as a family, for your mental health and that of your dd's etc.) when your signature line says your kids are ages 3 and 6. Am I missing something here?? Again, not wanting to be rude, but how stressful can it be to be a mother and homeschool two girls that young? You seem very put together and your blog looks awesome, but perhaps your standards are too high for the outcome needed at this stage of the game?

 

My oldest is in college (Wellesley, if that makes a difference) now and we certainly did not have perfect years. But that worked for this outgoing, driven child. Her 5-6 younger siblings just sort of followed along, doing school focused sometimes, doing a lot of field trips and reading great books, having discussions etc. I was a busy mother with a lot of life-stress so I knew that in order not to burn out and send my kids to school or leave them to fend for themselves I would need to adjust my internal expectations as well as take life as it came.

 

Now, my oldest is off and we have a very structured and busy schedule in place with two high schoolers and three younger eager students. I also have a busy toddler. Mother is not a perfect human being, but mother strives for the best of her kids. Yes, school is an option, but it is so *generic* when you can hang around your kids and see them learn all those things.

 

It is important that the mother (main-teacher) renews herself and takes time to be a person on her own in order to avoid resentment, anger, impatience. Many forget that and drive forward with such vigor, forgetting the humanity in the process and then end up with total burn-out and an alination towards her off-spring....

 

I guess what I am trying to say to your personally, Melissa, is to remember this is a marathon, not a sprint. You don't need to feel stressful when your kids are this young. You should be enjoying eachother. In te proper environment kids will learn speedfast when they are ready (and at a much slower pace when not yet developmentally ready).

 

Nadia

 

What a lovely post. Thank you for sharing your thoughts.

 

Anita

[Lizzie in Ma]

Yeah, lots of mixed educational and general parenting boards that I could just move to. Where I don't know a soul, and where, yet again, I could rip myself up from and move to and start all freaking over again. I'd just rather not.

 

Oh and I would so rather you didn't! I would miss you terribly. :grouphug:

[melissel]

I don't want to come off snarky or rude so excuse the medium, but I am very surprised how you can talk with such authority on homeschool success vs. implied failurw (as a family, for your mental health and that of your dd's etc.) when your signature line says your kids are ages 3 and 6. Am I missing something here?? Again, not wanting to be rude, but how stressful can it be to be a mother and homeschool two girls that young? You seem very put together and your blog looks awesome, but perhaps your standards are too high for the outcome needed at this stage of the game?

 

You are missing a detail. I work from home :001_smile: Currently, I work 40 hours a week, but usually I work 30, and I don't have childcare for a large portion of that time. I also have a DH who works a 60 hour week, with a long commute, so I don't get much help around the house, and I'm an extremely solitary person who really struggles with pretty much never, ever being alone anymore. That is my reality, and that is why homeschooling is problematic for us right now.

 

The point I've been trying to make has nothing at all to do with the superiority of the educational experience of homeschooling, and everything to do with trying to pointing out that overall, there are MANY elements involved in the homeschooling lifestyle. Any number of those elements can make homeschooling unworkable for any given family, and I don't think there's a point in demonizing ALL public schools on a board where you KNOW that many of the people considered valued members have chosen to put their kids in those schools. As people have pointed out, we have a whole board here dedicated to afterschooling.

 

I have a huge problem with people presuming to make blanket statements in ANY forum. There are exceptions to every rule. I can believe in the strong value of homeschooling and support other homeschoolers without demonizing public schools and minimizing the experiences of those here who've chosen them or participate on a part-time basis in the services they offer. Their choices don't lessen MY commitment or MY beliefs or MY experiences. But some of the things said in this particular thread have, sadly.

 

And I dislike this backlash against the evil "political correctness," too. IMO, the political correctness we're talking about here is just another way to say, "Let's be polite." Is that really so awful? Are we so intent on saying whatever the heck we feel like that we have to curse any effort to remind us that others are listening in and are affected by our words, anonymous though we may seem? For a board filled with Christians, sometimes I see so little grace going around here.

 

(Sorry Nadia, my reponse to you also turned into a response to other posts that have been made. I'm bowing out now, because I don't think I have anything constructive left to say!)

[melissel]

Your post was wonderful-- tempered with sage experience and wisdom. Yes, yes, yes. If your oldest is six and you are stressed about school, something is out of wack. Great advice.

 

Thank you. I'm not stressed about school. I love teaching the girls. I'm stressed about homeschooling as a part of our lifestyle. That's a much larger experience than just the books and teaching, and this is part of my point. Someone earlier said that homeschooling is better for the whole family, and wouldn't apologize for seeing that reality. Well, it's not reality for everyone, so again, blanket statement = problem.

Edited December 5, 2008 by melissel

[Haiku]

I have not been here for too long a time, but I know that I was hoping/expecting this board to be more of a "how to implement TWTM" than I have found it to be. It seems like TWTM is not the most popular model of education on this board (and my feelings seems to be borne out by the curriculum poll). This board is a nice place, don't get me wrong, but I wish there was a more TWTM focus here. I do see more comments than I feel comfortable with that are negative toward homeschooling (and I don't mean honest discussion of the difficulties). As someone else mentioned, if we can't come HERE, of all places, and sound the trumpet for homeschooling, well, then ... gosh, this is a HOMESCHOOLING forum. I have a kid in public school. I am still convinced of the superiority of homeschooling, and after my recent experience of being taken to task quite rudely because I dared to suggest that most kids could benefit from more quality entertainment (Homer), I have to wonder about the motivation behind some of the posts I read.

 

Tara

[Osmosis Mom]

Any number of those elements can make homeschooling unworkable for any given family, and I don't think there's a point in demonizing ALL public schools on a board where you KNOW that many of the people considered valued members have chosen to put their kids in those schools. As people have pointed out, we have a whole board here dedicated to afterschooling.

 

I do agree with you here. I tend to not over-generalize educational choices. For me -and this is our 9th year-I keep in my mind that each year is on a yearly basis only; we can always (theoretically) re-evaluate. Thus, I do not set myself up for feeling like a failure if I did send them to school, for whatever reason.

 

 

 

For a board filled with Christians, sometimes I see so little grace going around here.

 

As for this statement, then I might as well point out that this board is actually infamous for its diversity -which includes religious diversity as well. Just check out my lovely avatar...!!!!:D

 

For what it's worth, then my dh is also really non-involved and works away from home 3 days a week. I am a big introvert as well and tend to rise early or find other pockets of private time. You gotta do what you feel you gotta do...

[OnTheBrink]

[

For a board filled with Christians, sometimes I see so little grace going around here.

 

 

 

OH goody. I was wondering when the Christian bashing would start. Any opportunity to get a jab in there, eh?

 

As for the OP, I agree, to a degree. Laura in VA said what my first thought was: Politics are banned, so people have to complain about something. ;) However, I have seen posts that were negative toward homeschooling overall, not just "I'm struggling here, what can I do?" posts.

 

I think sharing struggles/frustrations is fine, and I personally get a lot of encouragement from them, because I don't feel so alone in my own struggles. I homeschool one child, but yet IRL, I hear "Oh, you only have ONE! I'M trying to homeschool MORE!" implying that my homeschooling life should be a breeze! It's not. Anytime you work with people, of any age, there is going to be conflict. And I appreciate hearing about other's struggles and seeing what solutions are offered.

 

I don't care for a Pollyanna board 100% of the time, but negativity breeds negativity, and reading positive posts are encouraging, as well.

 

I also agree with Audrey about stress, the economy, holidays and just chillin'.

[LisaKinVA]

I think sharing struggles/frustrations is fine, and I personally get a lot of encouragement from them, because I don't feel so alone in my own struggles. I homeschool one child, but yet IRL, I hear "Oh, you only have ONE! I'M trying to homeschool MORE!" implying that my homeschooling life should be a breeze! It's not. Anytime you work with people, of any age, there is going to be conflict.

 

I currently have four (3 of which are school age), and I couldn't agree more. Even if I only had the ONE (my oldest), he would be more than enough to keep me busy (and drive me insane at times).

 

It seems the older he gets, the more nervous I become about "doing it right." To me, there is so much at stake, and I don't want to screw it up.

[Laura K (NC)]

I think we're the minority. :sad:

 

Someone else mentioned the high school board as a place to go for encouragement. It's true, it generally is. High school is where homeschoolers seem to need the most encouragement. Maybe that's why it's generally positive there, and why I, with a high schooler, desire more encouragement than most.

 

I met a brand new homeschooler yesterday. She brought her 11yo son home and she was fired up about how quickly her son was learning the public school course of study and she was going to be done by January. She was making the transition between doing things the public school way and doing things the homeschool way, so she was just beginning to investigate all the ways to enrich her son's own personal course of study. She was so enthusiastic... it was great to talk and listen to her.

 

I contrast this with so many posts here that ask: how little can we get away with in x subject? Are you burned out yet for this year? I'm taking a Christmas break earlier than I planned, how about you? I don't wanna work hard, and your post that you're working hard hurts my feelings! Oh, I used to homeschool, but I'm liberated now, and I would like to post periodically about how bad it was when I homeschooled. Public schools are GREAT! Co-ops STINK! Most homeschoolers I know FAIL! How much time to we have to spend each day on homeschooling? and so on, and so on.

 

Apparently there's a goodly number of people who thrive on this kind of multi-faceted negativity, too, and somehow it makes them better homeschoolers. :confused: I am happy to be a member of the Draconian Homeschoolers group where I've noticed inspiration in place of negativity. I wish small groups like that were not the only true haven here for people who actually enjoy getting up in the morning to educate themselves and their children, and who have some ambition with this whole homeschooling enterprise.

 

(If you ask the moderator at the Draconian Homeschoolers group, Michelle in MO, she will kindly let you in. "Draconian Homeschoolers" is sort of a joke, if I understand the group correctly. It's not that we actually *are* draconian (I wouldn't actually *kill* my sons if they made a B on a test. :)). It's just that we seem to be because it's difficult to say out loud here that your kids and you work diligently, even with the WTM method :svengo:, and you don't mind doing it.)