MRI today for lower back pain

[PeterPan]

So it's today (monday) and I'm so nervous I haven't gone to sleep, sigh. I don't know if I'm wasting my money or what it will show, though I guess that's why  you do it. I hate for the chiro to be right, and I'd hate to go to the effort/risk/expense and have it not show anything either. And what I hate is that the exercises the chiro gave me aren't making it better. Ds says it's making it worse. It's definitely not better from them and they're your standard back extensions for a presumed bulging disc. 

I went off the Serrazimes when I went to the lake for the week (busy, didn't take them along) and the pain returned. Restarted them and pain is definitely better. So again, the exercises from the chiro are making squat difference, the enzymes do, and he's telling me I'm a woos, whiner, too sedentary, blah blah, and should "trust" him. Idiot.

Can people die in an MRI? I could get headaches from it, or it could be a nothing. And it's a lot of hassle and risk when my mother says a good orthopedist could just figure it out in "two minutes" (her words). Sigh. 

[EmseB]

Your chiro is calling you a wuss and a whiner and then telling you to trust him? Am I reading that right? Who ordered the MRI? Have you seen a doctor about this? What would be the objection to seeing an orthopedic doc?

I wouldn't be anxious about an MRI, but I know some people don't like the enclosed space and are prescribed sedation or something like Xanax. I dnt know if I'd pay for one on the order of a doctor who was dismissive about the fact that his prescribed treatment (exercises) weren't working at all.

[EmilyGF]

1 hour ago, PeterPan said:

So it's today (monday) and I'm so nervous I haven't gone to sleep, sigh. I don't know if I'm wasting my money or what it will show, though I guess that's why  you do it. I hate for the chiro to be right, and I'd hate to go to the effort/risk/expense and have it not show anything either. And what I hate is that the exercises the chiro gave me aren't making it better. Ds says it's making it worse. It's definitely not better from them and they're your standard back extensions for a presumed bulging disc. 

I went off the Serrazimes when I went to the lake for the week (busy, didn't take them along) and the pain returned. Restarted them and pain is definitely better. So again, the exercises from the chiro are making squat difference, the enzymes do, and he's telling me I'm a woos, whiner, too sedentary, blah blah, and should "trust" him. Idiot.

Can people die in an MRI? I could get headaches from it, or it could be a nothing. And it's a lot of hassle and risk when my mother says a good orthopedist could just figure it out in "two minutes" (her words). Sigh. 

It is a hassle. But whenever someone makes a statement like that, I ask them for the "good orthopedist" they know, because often they don't actually know of one. But when my mom made such a suggestion, and followed it up with who she liked, it was game-changing for me. I thought I had carpal tunnel, but he diagnosed a stuck disc in my neck and was able, within 45 minutes to make 90% of my pain go away. Before, I hadn't been able even to put my hands in my pockets or push a stroller due to pain, afterwards I was able to stop wearing wrist braces. Then, I was able to take that diagnosis and get it treated properly at home.

MRIs are very low risk. They just take a long time. Can you listen to music? I think the biggest risk is wasting time. But the opportunity for gain is huge for you given your back problems that haven't responded to treatment. Hugs. 

Emily

[J-rap]

I've had many MRI's in my life, and so has my ds.  They're easy-peasy.  You just lie down for 45 minutes and relax.  (I often fall asleep.)  They're a little noisy, but sometimes I'm given headphones to listen to music.  MRI's can detect tiny stuff and give really helpful information to docs.  I think it would be a great tool to help your doc figure out what the problem is.  If it doesn't show anything at all, that's helpful too!  I don't know of any risks as long as you have all metal off your body.  (And they'll make sure you do!)

Good luck!

[Pawz4me]

DS20 had a full spinal MRI when he was 11. He said the worst part was that the back of his head started hurting near the end from having to lay there so long.

If an 11 yo can have one with no more complaint than that, then I'm sure you can handle it.

People have MRIs all the time. They're almost as routine and common as x-rays.

No truly "good" orthopedist--probably not even a bad one--would attempt to diagnose a chronic back issue nowadays w/o some imaging. And the most common type of imaging for back issues is . . . a MRI.

I'm sorry you're having so much anxiety over this. I would try to look at it optimistically -- in the scheme of things a MRI is a very simple and painless diagnostic tool. In all likelihood you'll have some good, dependable answers afterwards. Even if it shows nothing, that's an answer in a way.

[mumto2]

Just wanted to send some hugs your way.

While I didn’t enjoy the MRI it was worth it as I was able to go directly to surgery as physical therapy was not working.  Someone told me to count minutes to make my mind be engaged.  The technician would tell my how long the next set of images would take and I would lay there and count.  It helped so much......it was sort of active.

[PrincessMommy]

I would dump the Chrio..  What a manipulative jerk.

I would do the MRI and find a good PT.  

I've got two PTs in my family, so I am biased.  

[Junie]

(((PeterPan)))

I hope everything goes well and you get some answers and good treatment.

[PeterPan]

5 hours ago, EmseB said:

Who ordered the MRI?

I pushed for the MRI because the chiro's answers weren't adding up and seemed to be making things worse. It sort of backed him into a corner, so then he was pulling out the trust me, you might be a zebra (mixed problems), blah blah stuff. But he basically really didn't want to do any imaging. So a doc at the imaging facility will interpret it and write a report, but it basically makes everything this chiro thinks dubious. I think he'd be good at correcting weightlifting form, but frankly I'm not sure my form is off. He's been acting like that's why I'm hurting, but this problem started 11 years ago when I was pregnant and got neglected because I was dealing with so much. Now it's constant enough and significant enough that it can ruin a week at the lake despite 4 weeks of doing what this guy says. And when I asked him how he knows nothing else is going on besides a bulging disc, he's like oh because you'd HURT when you did this! I'm like my lands, I have sensory issues, am under-responsive, birthed 9 and 11 pound babies at home just with a comb to press on and some water and you're telling me you can tell when something on me hurts??? Idiot. 

So I have no clue if I have a nothing or actually have a problem. And not running imaging on me was not the right choice. These days the advice on imaging is so anti, because they feel it leads to surgery. But I can't give them the sensory feedback to help them diagnose accurately. I mean he's literally like touch your toes, how does it feel, lean to the side, how does it feel, and I can't tell him. 

4 hours ago, EmilyGF said:

whenever someone makes a statement like that, I ask them for the "good orthopedist" they know, because often they don't actually know of one.

So my mom did have a name, but it was in another city 5 hours away, lol. I started looking for one in the big city near us, cuz I kinda assume that's the next step. I just got overwhelmed because a big city has a LOT of names, sigh. And the ones in our small town had downright scary reviews, oy. Like really, really horrible. And I don't really know whether I need an orthopedist or a rheumatologist, kwim? 

4 hours ago, EmilyGF said:

But the opportunity for gain is huge for you given your back problems that haven't responded to treatment. Hugs. 

Thanks, and that's the crux of it, that what the chiro said to do makes almost no difference. And I felt like he was putting words into my mouth. He'd say "So the pain feels sharp?" and I'm like hello I did not say that. 

I *think* maybe I have some kind of arthritis going with some facets and that's why it kind of creaks when I twist (Elvis hips) one way and not the other. This chiro never cared or asked about that. He never cared or asked about my bed, and sleeping in the firmest part of the bed makes a difference in my comfort at least lying down. He keeps telling me I have sciatic when I had that two pregnancies ago and remember that feeling different. So I think he's treating what he keeps saying is happening as he puts words in my mouth.

4 hours ago, J-rap said:

I've had many MRI's in my life, and so has my ds.  They're easy-peasy.  You just lie down for 45 minutes and relax.  (I often fall asleep.)

I will think of you while I've done my then! Like Pawz says, if an 11 yo can do it and you and your ds can do it, I can do it. Is it ok to be using the open MRI for this? Someone told me it's quieter, but then I read it's not as accurate. 

4 hours ago, J-rap said:

 If it doesn't show anything at all, that's helpful too!

Wow that would be a fascinating outcome. If that happens, I guess I'd I don't know, lol. I guess we'll see! LOL But you're right, if nothing shows up, I must have a lot of tight muscles and need a plan. That would be egg foo young on the chiro face too. 

3 hours ago, Pawz4me said:

No truly "good" orthopedist--probably not even a bad one--would attempt to diagnose a chronic back issue nowadays w/o some imaging. And the most common type of imaging for back issues is . . . a MRI.

Ok, I wondered this. My mother said the orthopedist did on her. But it wasn't really back pain but more like this particular down her leg gig that hadn't responded to surgery. He identified it in 2 minutes, sent her to PT, boom. So she's all whiz bang on the orthopedist. I'm hoping this gives me info to know who my next move is. 

3 hours ago, Pawz4me said:

I would try to look at it optimistically -- in the scheme of things a MRI is a very simple and painless diagnostic tool. In all likelihood you'll have some good, dependable answers afterwards. Even if it shows nothing, that's an answer in a way. 

I will try. I will chant optimism to myself, lol. When I flew to Russia for the first time in college, I literally sat on the plane going it will crash, something will go wrong. It never occurred to me to say this will go well, you will have the time of your life. But you're right, we're going to get some answers, and finding nothing is an answer.

3 hours ago, Pawz4me said:

If an 11 yo can have one with no more complaint than that, then I'm sure you can handle it.

I will try to be brave like your 11 yo. I really was chill till last night and then my mind got a little crazy. I guess I was busy till last night, hmm. My dd flew back to Oklahoma. 

1 hour ago, mumto2 said:

Someone told me to count minutes to make my mind be engaged.  The technician would tell my how long the next set of images would take and I would lay there and count.  It helped so much......it was sort of active.

Interesting! I'm hoping since I underslept a little bit I'll be able to take a nap. But if I can't, there you go.

1 hour ago, PrincessMommy said:

I would dump the Chrio..  What a manipulative jerk.

I would do the MRI and find a good PT.  

I've got two PTs in my family, so I am biased.  

Hehe, I love it. And you know, the guy is so nice that I really hate that I feel that way. And I think he could be helpful on a few things (checking form, etc.). But once he pulled the "trust me" card, I was like you're so outta your league. I'm 43 and I want evidence-based practices here, not 1950s trust me junk. And he's gotten my back to adjust and feel a bit better with the Graston and active release things he did. But those are just working muscles. The actual diagnosis and treatment don't seem to be helping it and sorta seem to make it worse. 

But yeah, just in general I'm starting to move into the "chiros are way underqualified to do what they're claiming to do" camp. 

I've been looking at PT videos on youtube which is why I know this guy has holes in his analysis. Even his implementation of what he's doing (McKenzies) is incomplete and he's not taking responsibility for the rest of the musculature involved as a woman, like the pelvic floor. That's actually what has been helping me the last few days. I finally decreased down to twice a day the McKenzies and started doing super frequently the gluts/kegels the PT had told me years ago to do. That seems to make me more comfortable. Doesn't get rid of it, just more comfortable, rather than aggravating it and leaving me in more pain and feeling stunned. 

Oh, and this is totally aside, but while I was at the lake I started feeling like the ground was moving. At first I thought oh the cottage is on a penninsula, it's moving. I don't know, I just think we're aggravating things and have no evidence to know what's even going on. I should not feel disoriented and needing to stop like that. And it only just occurred to me that they were connected. I do think my exercise-induced stridor is somehow connected to this. At one point he was working on my back and my breathing got better and he's like oh yeah that's because what I was working on connects to your diagphram. 

He gave me these exercises where we were basically just breathing, on my back, trying to inflate that lower area. THAT was actually what made the pain worse. Like a lot worse. So then he's like back off the McKenzies, blaming me, saying I sit too much, crap crap. I tried them periodically at the lake, same gig. So his skill set is just too low to analyze this, that's what I think.

And that has to be pretty disgusting to pay money and get letters after your name and not know enough to do things, mercy. I mean, I'm pretty disenchanted. I haven't quite figured out what they're actually good at since they aren't able to diagnose THOROUGHLY back issues, the one thing a chiro ought to know better than anyone. Idiots.

46 minutes ago, Junie said:

(((PeterPan)))

I hope everything goes well and you get some answers and good treatment.

Thank you. You're right, that's all I need. I neglected this for a lot of years, so now I'm trying. 

Well I appreciate it ladies. I just have to busy myself a bit and then we'll hit it and bang it out like an 11 yo. That's how I'll function, lol. Put on my brave, keep busy. I could go walk at the park while ds is in his session. Then I'd be a bit calmed down to go into the tube, down the river, into the magnet... And isn't that so Star Trek, haha. I mean they're saying they shift your protons and when they put them back you glow. Blows my mind. Yank too hard and we've got a transporter situation. I guess that's kinda even what worried me, like what the consequences are of pulling someone's protons around, lol.

[May]

When I was scheduled for my first one, a friend told me how loud they are. I’m glad she prepared me for that. I also keep my eyes closed the whole time, which helps. Hope all goes well and you get some answers.

[PeterPan]

1 minute ago, May said:

I also keep my eyes closed the whole time,

Will do! I'm not good with tight places. I can probably survive, but I'll probably be better with my eyes closed, trying to nap or think Disney or cruising or something. I could think fish and snorkeling.

I'm going to take my good ear plugs and ask for the headphones, double layers. They have an open MRI, but I don't know if it's good enough for this. I'm just going to have to roll with it.

I'm going to go busy myself now. I think I was fine till I stopped being BUSY. 

[Junie]

Plan a special treat for yourself afterward to give you something to look forward to.  Milkshake, bacon cheeseburger... whatever.  :)  

[Liz CA]

2 hours ago, PrincessMommy said:

I would dump the Chrio..  What a manipulative jerk.

I would do the MRI and find a good PT.  

I've got two PTs in my family, so I am biased.  

 

Yes, time to find another chiro. Do the MRI - you will have clarity and the new chiro will know more right away. If you need an orthopedic surgeon down the road, there is no reason why you cannot utilize the services of a chiro and an orthopedist.

Any chance you have an open MRI facility nearby? Those are for people who have issues with tight spaces. Otherwise, I'd try closing my eyes and imagining being in the woods or at the ocean. Most people get headphones to dull the noise.

Edited July 15, 2019 by Liz CA

[Pawz4me]

Peter Pan, I forgot to mention one thing. Our then 11 yo who had the MRI and said it was no big deal? He's our ASD-1 kiddo. With lots of sensory issues.

You can do it!

[cintinative]

I get an MRI every year. The biggest issue is if you are claustrophobic it is a close space. I keep my eyes closed, listen to music, and try to tune out the noise.  I was really nervous the first time, but it wasn't bad, and since then it has been relatively easy.  😃 I have to get three MRIs every time so I am in there for 1.5 hours or more. You can do this. 😃

I am not aware of risks associated with MRIs, other than if you have implanted metal and don't tell them (don't do that!).  

Honestly I am confused about how an ortho would diagnose a disc issue without an MRI.  I am not sure why your mom thinks that? They could possibly say they "think" it is this or that, but they cannot know until the MRI is done.  

The one concern I would have if you do end up at an ortho is that they would want a different type of MRI or level of MRI (there are different levels of MRI machines) than you are getting. And they are expensive.  Hopefully this wouldn't be an issue though since they are looking at a spinal issue and not an overall neurological issue like MS.

P.S. IF you need a spine guy, I know people in Cincinnati that have used people, and I *think* you might not be too far away.

Edited July 15, 2019 by cintinative

[cintinative]

1 hour ago, PeterPan said:

Will do! I'm not good with tight places. I can probably survive, but I'll probably be better with my eyes closed, trying to nap or think Disney or cruising or something. I could think fish and snorkeling.

I'm going to take my good ear plugs and ask for the headphones, double layers. They have an open MRI, but I don't know if it's good enough for this. I'm just going to have to roll with it.

I'm going to go busy myself now. I think I was fine till I stopped being BUSY. 

 

In general, open MRIs do not offer as good of an image.  

Usually they give you a mirror so you can see out at your feet. That helps me.  Also the music. Because you have to have no metal, that means no bra. I sometimes need a blanket to keep me warm enough in there. Feel free to ask for one.  They will talk to you at various intervals throughout to make sure you are okay and to let you know where you are with the imaging.  

[HollyDay]

I've also done an MRI for low back.  We found good info...in my case, nothing we didn't already suspect, but the PTs were thrilled to see the report AND the actual images.  About a year later, we found another spine problem.  This time digital imaging was adequate to diagnose. 

Due to my particular spine problem, a chiro would be a very bad option.  My ortho, (who also has chiro in his office, so not opposed to them), said chiro would be potentially disastrous for me.  I use physical therapy quite a bit.  Since I'm not a surgical candidate yet (and hope to never be), I also use a sports medicine doc for my "maintenance."   The PTs showing me what is good and what isn't as been a huge help.  I've done a couple private yoga and pilates classes to learn modifications to poses and exercises.  It is a life style change and a wellness modification that keeps me going.  Topicals also help.  My functional medicine doc just recommended 2 new topicals that seem to be benefiting.  I avoid oral medications  as much as possible because my condition is lifelong. 

But, back to MRI.....get the tech to talk to you.  I had a great tech who kept me updated every few minutes.  Told me jokes.  The next time, that tech wouldn't talk at all, made the time drag.  Also, ask about a wedge under your knees to make your back more comfortable.

[Pen]

Good luck!  I hope they’ll get answers and a plan to make your pain go away!

Noisy!

I don’t like closed spaces.  I did breathing and meditation.  I don’t think music was offered to me—that might have helped.

[Arcadia]

1 hour ago, Pen said:

I don’t like closed spaces.  I did breathing and meditation.  I don’t think music was offered to me—that might have helped.

 

I read that music is usually offered to children and adults can just ask for it.

I took the earliest morning slot they have both times and just slept through the process. I am a night owl so I am typically sleepy in the mornings. 

I had below quoted on my report both times and no medical staff says I need surgery. Just told me that it would show up on all my subsequent MRI reports.

“OTHER FINDINGS: T2 hyperintense lesion in a mid thoracic vertebral body measuring 0.8 cm, incompletely evaluated, but likely vertebral hemangiomas.”

Hopefully the MRI would give OP useful results. While I had to wait for my oncologist surgeon to release my MRI results, I kind of knew from what the MRI staff unofficially said.

[PeterPan]

2 hours ago, cintinative said:

 

In general, open MRIs do not offer as good of an image.  

Usually they give you a mirror so you can see out at your feet. That helps me.  Also the music. Because you have to have no metal, that means no bra. I sometimes need a blanket to keep me warm enough in there. Feel free to ask for one.  They will talk to you at various intervals throughout to make sure you are okay and to let you know where you are with the imaging.  

I like the blanket idea!!!

[PeterPan]

I’m here, waiting, can hear it... 

[PeterPan]

Done

[Junie]

34 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

Done

Congratulations!!  Now you can go get a bacon cheeseburger and a milkshake.  :)

[PeterPan]

23 minutes ago, Junie said:

Congratulations!!  Now you can go get a bacon cheeseburger and a milkshake.  :)

LOL I don't even eat beef, but you're right I deserve one, lol. My dh brought me a mcdonald's smoothie, so that's kinda close? 

So I couldn't feel my back during it, except for the heat, and couldn't tell where I was in space. Was woozy afterward. I was going to go to the pool now, but I don't feel so hot. Thought the pool would make me feel better.

The tech said my images were good, so I only wish I knew how to interpret them, hehe. I have the disc... They're going to email me the report in a day or two when it's ready. Then we see. Nothing would be fine by me. Then I could spit on everyone.

Did the open mri btw. They said theirs gave good images. It was really really loud and I accidentally opened my eyes once and shut them pronto.

I have a headache. I'm gonna hit the pool.

[PeterPan]

PS. I'm just glad I didn't die and that it didn't overtly hurt. It was loud, but it didn't HURT me. There was actually that possibility, given my bizarre sensitivities and reactions. Do other people feel *hot* with the MRI? I was numb from bra line to knees on my back, couldn't tell if I was touching the table or arched, tensed or relaxed. It was totally weird. But when the thing would fire, it would make my back HOT. 

So weird.

[PeterPan]

The other weird thing is I was scared to breathe. I kept wanting to take a deep breath, like a sigh, and I told myself not to. So I kept taking these shallow breaths. Would it have mattered? I don't know, it was just weird. If I had opened my eyes, been in the tube, AND not been breathing deeply, that would have been bad. And I twitched once, which was weird. And my nose itched, so I had to think about other parts of my body, lol. Then I went to sloths, baracuda, snorkeling, things from the cruise.

[Arcadia]

2 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

Do other people feel *hot* with the MRI? 

 

Nope. Cold despite the numerous warmed blankets the staff piled on me. I do tend to get cold easily and the room I was in was probably set to typical aircon range (guessing 21 degC/70degF). 

My kids recommend the In-N-Out Burger milkshake because it’s made with ice-cream instead.

[PeterPan]

5 minutes ago, Arcadia said:

My kids recommend the In-N-Out Burger milkshake because it’s made with ice-cream instead.

Ooo, that sounds SO good right now. Do they have them in TX? I don't think they have them here, but we could look in TX... That's a few months away, but still, yum!

Yeah, I'm reading the heat can be associated with burning. But I'm that sensitive, that I would feel it. I feel heat from the old optical mice too. 

Now I need a milkshake. That would solve a lot.

[PeterPan]

I pulled up the files and it looks to me like I have two bulging discs and a crooked spine. Don't know about the arthritis. I'm just saying those two things are pretty obvious. Now to google what arthritis would look like on an MRI...

So now I'm wondering why this chiro hasn't had me doing the rest of the McKenzie protocol if my spine is crooked from the stupid bulges...

[Arcadia]

1 hour ago, PeterPan said:

Ooo, that sounds SO good right now. Do they have them in TX? I don't think they have them here, but we could look in TX... That's a few months away, but still, yum!

 

There is one location only in Texas http://locations.in-n-out.com/296-Killeen

10 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

I pulled up the files and it looks to me like I have two bulging discs and a crooked spine.

 

I have a slightly misaligned spine since 6th grade medical (well child kind of test), was checked for scoliosis, and was advised to carry backpacks instead of totes or sling bags. 

[PeterPan]

1 hour ago, Arcadia said:

There is one location only in Texas http://locations.in-n-out.com/296-Killeen

We're flying into Houston for the cruise next winter, but if I'm ever that way I'll be all over it! 

[brehon]

1 hour ago, Arcadia said:

 

There is one location only in Texas http://locations.in-n-out.com/296-Killeen

<snip>

Actually, they’re popping up all over the place in TX. I can’t even tell you how many there are in the Austin area alone. 

[Tree Frog]

1 hour ago, Arcadia said:

 

There is one location only in Texas http://locations.in-n-out.com/296-Killeen

There is one in San Antonio, too.

[Arcadia]

7 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

We're flying into Houston for the cruise next winter, but if I'm ever that way I'll be all over it! 

 

6 minutes ago, brehon said:

Actually, they’re popping up all over the place in TX. I can’t even tell you how many there are in the Austin area alone. 

 

That’s weird that when I typed only Texas in the search, only one location shows up. Now five locations show up when I put in Houston, TX for search, 4 in Austin and 1 in  Pflugerville. 

https://www.in-n-out.com/mobile/locations.aspx

Edited July 15, 2019 by Arcadia

[Tree Frog]

17 minutes ago, Arcadia said:

 

 

That’s weird that when I typed only Texas in the search, only one location shows up. Now five locations show up when I put in Houston, TX for search, 4 in Austin and 1 in  Pflugerville. 

https://www.in-n-out.com/mobile/locations.aspx

And the one in San Antonio doesn't show up? I wonder if they're different franchises all under the same name.

[Arcadia]

On 7/15/2019 at 3:55 PM, wilrunner said:

And the one in San Antonio doesn't show up? I wonder if they're different franchises all under the same name.

 

It shows up for me, 2nd and 3rd location in photo. It shows 5 locations maximum each time I search regardless of what zip code or city, state I put in the search.

 

Edited December 16, 2019 by Arcadia
Removed photo

[ktgrok]

4 hours ago, PeterPan said:

PS. I'm just glad I didn't die and that it didn't overtly hurt. It was loud, but it didn't HURT me. There was actually that possibility, given my bizarre sensitivities and reactions. Do other people feel *hot* with the MRI? I was numb from bra line to knees on my back, couldn't tell if I was touching the table or arched, tensed or relaxed. It was totally weird. But when the thing would fire, it would make my back HOT. 

So weird.

i have similar weirdness when I do the "corpse pose" relaxation thing at the end of a yoga class. Like I can feel myself floating almost, etc...it's really weird. I think the shallow breathing/hyperventilationg was part of it, but also the hyper focus on your body. 

[PeterPan]

9 hours ago, cintinative said:

Honestly I am confused about how an ortho would diagnose a disc issue without an MRI.  I am not sure why your mom thinks that? They could possibly say they "think" it is this or that, but they cannot know until the MRI is done.  

The one concern I would have if you do end up at an ortho is that they would want a different type of MRI or level of MRI (there are different levels of MRI machines) than you are getting. And they are expensive.  Hopefully this wouldn't be an issue though since they are looking at a spinal issue and not an overall neurological issue like MS.

P.S. IF you need a spine guy, I know people in Cincinnati that have used people, and I *think* you might not be too far away.

I missed this earlier! So my mom apparently didn't have a disc issue but got referred to PT and had whatever it was resolve. Her mind is going a little, so her answers are vague. As far as me, yeah the Cincy would be a bit too much of a drive unless we're down there already for another reason. I'm near the other big city north of you, :) , and surely I can find someone. I'm looking at the images tonight, trying to make sense of them.

I can see what you're saying about the quality. They're fine, but no contrast and not nearly as wow as images I see online. And I need to go back and look, but they seem to draw the areas in enough that you don't get a lot of bonus. Like I'm seeing MRIs online where when they're looking down at the spine they'll show the kidneys, gallbladder, etc. and I'm not sure you're seeing that on these. But they should be good enough at least to see the basic things (bulging discs, arthritis). Actually I haven't figured out how you see arthritis on them. 

So they said the report might even be ready tomorrow. I want to read that I see what I think. On the plus side, I'm not seeing anything too glaringly horrific in the images. There are some odd white spots that I'm trying to figure out, but they could be nothing I guess. At least my pain lines up with what I'm seeing of the discs and the spinal curve. That means I'm at least not crazy, lol. But I don't get why the chiros never bothered to FIX the spinal curve or do exercises for it. The location of my tight muscles connects to the curve, so why did they not care???

[brehon]

14 hours ago, Arcadia said:

 

 

That’s weird that when I typed only Texas in the search, only one location shows up. Now five locations show up when I put in Houston, TX for search, 4 in Austin and 1 in  Pflugerville. 

https://www.in-n-out.com/mobile/locations.aspx

Oh, there are more than 4 in Austin, let me assure you, to say nothing of the surrounding cities. They apparently reproduce at an astonishing rate. 

[cintinative]

17 hours ago, PeterPan said:

The other weird thing is I was scared to breathe. I kept wanting to take a deep breath, like a sigh, and I told myself not to. So I kept taking these shallow breaths. Would it have mattered? I don't know, it was just weird. If I had opened my eyes, been in the tube, AND not been breathing deeply, that would have been bad. And I twitched once, which was weird. And my nose itched, so I had to think about other parts of my body, lol. Then I went to sloths, baracuda, snorkeling, things from the cruise.

 

The first time I had one they told me not to breathe hard so I was way too focused on my breathing. It made me anxious. Since then I just try my best to breathe normally.  I honestly don't think a deep breath is going to throw it off, but i did move during my first MRI and they had to redo part of it.  

I have learned from my many MRIs (the first was was nearly 2 hours I think) that I am a fidget and don't really truly sit still.  It is very hard to lie there for a couple hours without really moving. My arms start to get sore from holding the same position.  😃 I have also had involuntary twitching and that has never been an issue with the images.  

It is super loud. I have no idea how people fall asleep in there. Even with ear plugs, the headphones and music, when the banging is fast and loud I had to try to think of peaceful things because it made me think of running and then I wanted to move.  😃

I have never felt heat on my back but I have only had traditional MRIs.  I don't know how the open MRI works.  Usually there is air blowing right on me inside the tube and I get cool. The last time I did get a bit hot but not just on my back.

The weirdest was the first time I had the head MRI the whole table was shaking below me.  I didn't know it would do that. Yet another reason why I have no idea how people can sleep in there.  They have skills I do not.  😃

I am glad you survived!!

 

Edited July 16, 2019 by cintinative

[PeterPan]

1 hour ago, cintinative said:

I have never felt heat on my back but I have only had traditional MRIs.  I don't know how the open MRI works.  Usually there is air blowing right on me inside the tube and I get cool. The last time I did get a bit hot but not just on my back.

I think it was my sensitivity. It definitely was not an overall heat but very specifically where the machine was pointing and doing it's gig. And last night my innards hurt, to where I was really wondering if I was ok or if I had actually hurt myself. But this morning they had mostly stopped. 

So I'm just pleased the pain was localized to the areas they were shooting and didn't also extend to my head. Other than feeling overall woozy, I haven't had a lot of brain effects. I get tired of having a messed up brain, lol. It made me tired, but I can live with that too. I'm just going to be good to myself and eat fruit and let it all pass.

Meanwhile, I'm waiting for the results, tick tick. I googled a bit but really don't know that I'm seeing correctly the facets thing. There's an odd dark area on the side that hurts that may really be nothing. I didn't see anything else too interesting as I dug in. Apparently you can see deformities in the vein, kidney issues, fibroids in your uterus, etc. But really, it for the most part looked pretty good everywhere else. Well except for that white streak. So I just am waiting for the report... And I'm relieved it's over.

[Lecka]

I do not know how common this is — but my husband has things show up on an MRI on his back, and I have been to a few appointments with him — and they think there is a big psychological component to pain, so they are not going to have a huge reaction because they think that will make your pain worse.

It is immensely frustrating to me but it seems to be a good approach for my husband.  

They have said that they can’t tell pain levels from the MRI, when I have been with him.  

[PeterPan]

9 hours ago, Lecka said:

I do not know how common this is — but my husband has things show up on an MRI on his back, and I have been to a few appointments with him — and they think there is a big psychological component to pain, so they are not going to have a huge reaction because they think that will make your pain worse.

It is immensely frustrating to me but it seems to be a good approach for my husband.  

They have said that they can’t tell pain levels from the MRI, when I have been with him.  

I read some studies on that, and the data shows that getting an MRI, no matter what it says, decreases your sense of well-being. So I read the report today and got some swanky terms, but I basically decided that after I figure out what they mean I'm gonna throw inhibition to the wind and go back to what I had been doing and ignore it. I think that's probably the only way to feel well, lol. 

[PeterPan]

So if anyone is wondering, the report came. Nothing horrifically dreadful if I'm reading it correctly.

-L5/S1 bulging--Chiro had said this, no shock.

-L4/L5 spondylosis=osteoarthritis. PT had said this, so no shock.

-stress reaction of pedicles of L4 and L5. There are some other words (stenosis, legamentum flavum hypertrophy, blah blah), but the stress reaction is the one I was a bit surprised/confused at. It says a fracture not identified. "Marrow edema compatible with stress reaction involving the pedicles of L4 and L5 bilaterally." 

So that was the one that kind of concerned me, that I don't know if that represents sitting or not lifting correctly or what. But other than that, it looks like what we suspected, that I have a bulging disc and the arthritis.

So I'm thinking I'll keep the upcoming appt with the chiro, see what this new data would change in his advice, and then decide from there what I think makes sense. I think an excessive amount of hyper-extensions are not going to improve anything, and I think they could be aggravating the arthritis. I'm guessing the arthritis is why doing his breathing exercises increased my pain so surprisingly. And it also explains why the serrazimes enzymes help. At this point I don't actually know what movements are good (in general) and what are aggravating it. It seems like significant stretching is aggravating it. I may need to move on to a PT who someone who can think through my whole body. I also have some muscles that are tight. Would the L4/L5 issues cause the tightness? The chiro is always willing to do release techniques, but it would make more sense to explain WHY they're tight.

Meanwhile, I'm working on cruise plans, cuz like Lecka says, figure it out and MOVE ON, lol.

[Lecka]

I think it’s important to know if anything you are doing is making it worse.

For my husband — pain is not a good indicator.  Basically — to some extent it may hurt either way, but he’s much better off to be active.  

I was angry with him thinking he should limit some things, but when I went with him they thought he was better off to be active.

They don’t think he is “doing” anything that makes it work, and mainly want him to do stretches and go to walk-in appointments as needed (he goes every 1-2 weeks).  

PT has been helpful for him, too.  

But overall they think he’s better off to be active, because limiting his activities could be worse because that could make other parts of his back be weak and then that could be worse overall.

I think if you have got an okay for your gym stuff, it is good to go on with life and plan a cruise!  

[CAJinBE]

It's good to know. I had a bulging disc for years between L4 and L5. It finally herniated, I had surgery, and now I am so happy to be pain free. 

[Lecka]

I was going to say too, my husband’s work position changed about 2 months ago to be much less stressful, and his back has been better!  In his previous position his direct supervisor managed to be both incompetent and very critical.  It has been night and day for his stress and his back is doing better from that.  

 

[EmilyGF]

17 minutes ago, Lecka said:

I was going to say too, my husband’s work position changed about 2 months ago to be much less stressful, and his back has been better!  In his previous position his direct supervisor managed to be both incompetent and very critical.  It has been night and day for his stress and his back is doing better from that.  

 

We took a two-week vacation to Switzerland sans kids about 8 years ago. Within a few days, all my chronic back pain went away, so I thought my back pain was due to carrying my rather-large baby everywhere. The night before we returned to the USA, I woke up in the middle of the night with a nightmare about leaving my kids somewhere and with back pain and shooting pain down my legs. Turns out the cause was *stress*. But it is good to rule out other things.

[ktgrok]

The muscles get tight because your body is protecting the injured back, bracing in fear of pain. 

My dad had several herniated disks (he fell off a roof when young, and eventually the injury caught up to him) and had surgery, and did PT. He says the PT was incredibly effective, and he's not the type of guy I'd think would be even willing to go, let alone say it helped. 

[PeterPan]

2 hours ago, EmilyGF said:

We took a two-week vacation to Switzerland sans kids about 8 years ago. Within a few days, all my chronic back pain went away, so I thought my back pain was due to carrying my rather-large baby everywhere. The night before we returned to the USA, I woke up in the middle of the night with a nightmare about leaving my kids somewhere and with back pain and shooting pain down my legs. Turns out the cause was *stress*. But it is good to rule out other things.

Oh my.