A church just dropped about 20 teens in my neighborhood

[Mrs.Wilson]

We used to evangelize door to door as a youth.  We would go every Saturday to this one apartment complex.  I think we only had one person come to church from all that.  I don't think it's an effective way of "winning the lost".  Not unless you come across a person that actually is looking for that sort of change in their lives.  But, what are the chances of that?  And, how many people do you turn off until you come to that person?

[FaithManor]

So don't open the door. I look out my living room window to see who's coming. If it is a solicitor or anyone I don't want to interact with I don't open the door. Pretty easy. Same principle with telemarketers or junk mail. They have the right to contact me. I have the right to not be available.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I would love that, but the location of the window is not close enough to the door to see who is standing on the step.

[Jan in SC]

Mormons are NOT trying to convert others? I thought that the whole purpose of the 2 year mission was to proselytize. I even see that on the Mormon websites as being the reason.

 

Isn't the "information and comfort" the message of the Book of Mormon?

I didn't think she was Mormon.

[fairfarmhand]

We used to evangelize door to door as a youth.  We would go every Saturday to this one apartment complex.  I think we only had one person come to church from all that.  I don't think it's an effective way of "winning the lost".  Not unless you come across a person that actually is looking for that sort of change in their lives.  But, what are the chances of that?  And, how many people do you turn off until you come to that person?

 

So here's my personal beef with that.

 

So someone says a prayer on their doorstep.

 

You have no way of knowing if they're sincere, if they are too polite to tell you to go away and they figure this is the quickest way to get rid of you, or whatever.

 

So now, they've said a prayer and these people are happy and say "You're going to heaven."

 

Okay.

 

The rest of their lives are they going to think they are "safe" and have no further spiritual need because they mouthed a prayer?

 

Would they not be better off to be reached by someone who cares enough to be a part of their life? Someone who will check on them, help them grow in Christ if they desire? Someone they're close enough to to ask the hard faith questions? The Christian walk isn't about mouthing a prayer that once. It's a lifetime commitment and on someone's doorstep it's hard to communicate all of that,

 

[FaithManor]

We used to evangelize door to door as a youth. We would go every Saturday to this one apartment complex. I think we only had one person come to church from all that. I don't think it's an effective way of "winning the lost". Not unless you come across a person that actually is looking for that sort of change in their lives. But, what are the chances of that? And, how many people do you turn off until you come to that person?

Actually huge number are turned off. On top of which there is a safety issue. A lot of people think nothing of sending kids to talk to strangers. Seems like if they go in pairs, it will be okay. Until you get to the drunk dude's house who is not happy about being bothered and when said soul winners do not leave promptly and kind of start getting preachy with the guy, he pulls his firearm out.

 

The soul winners leave, but amazingly the church did not learn it's lesson and sent two men back the next day one of whom ended up punched in the mouth.

 

It amazes me that in 2017 people still think sending people door to door soliciting and proselytizing is a wise idea!

 

Go to a public place and say what you need to say this way people can choose to engage or not.

[Scarlett]

So here's my personal beef with that.

 

So someone says a prayer on their doorstep.

 

You have no way of knowing if they're sincere, if they are too polite to tell you to go away and they figure this is the quickest way to get rid of you, or whatever.

 

So now, they've said a prayer and these people are happy and say "You're going to heaven."

 

Okay.

 

The rest of their lives are they going to think they are "safe" and have no further spiritual need because they mouthed a prayer?

 

Would they not be better off to be reached by someone who cares enough to be a part of their life? Someone who will check on them, help them grow in Christ if they desire? Someone they're close enough to to ask the hard faith questions? The Christian walk isn't about mouthing a prayer that once. It's a lifetime commitment and on someone's doorstep it's hard to communicate all of that,

 

I can't speak to anything like this because we don't do this.

[Χά�ων]

I detest the door-to-door evangelizers. I put them right up there with the "I am a reformed addict, buy my 'products' (aka stuff taken from the neighbors trash) to celebrate me being clean" visitors.

 

My neighbors have a beautiful Hindu shrine out and instead of face-to-face visits they find chick tracks thrown onto their porch.

 

I have seriously debated setting up a shrine or sorts and having a small sign thanking people in advance for offering chick tracks for the next sacrifice. Or instead of an ugly shrine, just sending a heartfelt thank you note with a picture from he ceramony. I am not kidding.

 

 

Now, I do not mind the church that has real community involvement. They get out and join in neighborhood cleanup days, if they come to the door it is their annual 'gift to the neighbors' with nothing on it except the church name, no good news lecture.

[chiguirre]

I totally agree with Farrar's introvert/extrovert idea. The thought of talking to random strangers about my most personal beliefs on my doorstep makes me super anxious. When you ring my bell, you're sending me into flight or fight mode. (I always choose flight in the form of a mumbled "No thanks" and a quick door shut.) If I was interested, I'd google you, honest. Please, let me hibernate in my introvert's solitary den and enjoy my weekend. If you choose to disturb me, know that I will quickly put you on my mental hit list as annoying people who should be avoided at all cost.

[mamaraby]

I am not decrying that you are silly for being offended. Be offended all you want. I was only trying to express our reasons for doing what we do. And we don't do it to annoy you.

 

I don't know why someone wrote you a letter and used a po box. If you want to talk to said person write them back and ask them to call you or come see you. But it sounds like you don't want to so what is the issue.

They get to hide behind their PO Box and maintain their own personal space while mine is not respected. I don't get to maintain any sense of anonymity while they are afforded all of it. Especially since I am not in the phone book and have worked hard to remove as many searchable records of me and my address. Whih means they got my address from where? Given the timing of the letter and the content, I would imagine they got it off a recall petition.

 

Ugh. I'd rather proselytizers kept their stuff to themselves. If I want what you're selling (be that products or religious beliefs), I'll ask you.

 

And even if it annoys lots of people? You won't stop and then who are you really doing this for? Not for converts. Not in 2017.

Edited May 13, 2017 by mamaraby

[Jean in Newcastle]

I would love that, but the location of the window is not close enough to the door to see who is standing on the step.

I can't see either but I call out "hello?" and the person backs up a bit to where they can see me and I can see them.

[FaithManor]

I can't see either but I call out "hello?" and the person backs up a bit to where they can see me and I can see them.

Sounds good.

 

Unfortunately, I live in a fortress. This is an old stone church we converted. Poured concrete walls covered in river walk. In good weather I can keep the window open, but in bad weather, yikes...we can't hear anything outside!!

[poppy]

I would be incredibly insulted if someone less than 1/2 my age came to my door to explain why my beliefs are wrong.   Heck no.

[DawnM]

I don't really know since I am not a Morman.

 

Oh, sorry, I thought you were.  

[DawnM]

I didn't think she was Mormon.

 

Yeah, I see that now.  I thought she was talking about LDS. 

 

And now I see she is JW, which changes my answer again.  JW's do come to your door with the attempt to convert.  So, I am not quite getting her argument.

 

 

Edited May 14, 2017 by DawnM

[73349]

I'm not answering the door, but I don't even like the ringing/knocking. It's disruptive, as is a phone call.

 

I wouldn't object to a postcard if it's not done frequently.

 

But you know, "Jesus who?" is not a question I've ever heard. People who want to maybe convert/join a church are going to go there. They're not sitting at home waiting for somebody to hopefully come by and tell them about their faith.

[Guest]

Some people are comforted. And some are informed. And some listen more. We don't have anyway of knowing who might need something, want something be comforted by our message vs. those who are offended that we are doing our best to live by our beliefs.

But your beliefs are encroaching on my time and private property. That's not right.

[Guest]

I detest the door-to-door evangelizers. I put them right up there with the "I am a reformed addict, buy my 'products' (aka stuff taken from the neighbors trash) to celebrate me being clean" visitors.

 

My neighbors have a beautiful Hindu shrine out and instead of face-to-face visits they find chick tracks thrown onto their porch.

 

I have seriously debated setting up a shrine or sorts and having a small sign thanking people in advance for offering chick tracks for the next sacrifice. Or instead of an ugly shrine, just sending a heartfelt thank you note with a picture from he ceramony. I am not kidding.

 

 

Now, I do not mind the church that has real community involvement. They get out and join in neighborhood cleanup days, if they come to the door it is their annual 'gift to the neighbors' with nothing on it except the church name, no good news lecture.

I have a Rosary in the window of my car. More than once I've gotten a Chick tract on my windshield. It blows my mind a) that people believe that one of the world's major religions is actually in league with El Diablo and b) that finding that stupid piece of paper will somehow be an eye-opening experience for me.

[HomeAgain]

As one of the people that so many of you are so offended by I would like to say we do what we do not because we think you are going to hell ( we don't even believe in hell) but because our belief is that we are commissioned by Christ to do so. We aren't trying to convert you. We are there to offer information and comfort if we can.

 

It is always enlightening for me to read these threads and see how people here really feel.

I completely understand a commission to share the Good News. But that really should be done through works, intimate conversations, and connections made with others. Coming door to door is really nothing more than a billboard flashing. It's lazy. Show me. Open your church to the homeless. Tithe to create a shower bus. Get together and build little houses, take over meals on wheels routes, go visit the elderly and let Christ's love shine through you to the people you want to reach.

 

Then you have the other way of doing it. I look at the Duggars/Dillards, who literally decided they needed to share the Good News in a country called El Salvador. El Freaking Salvador, whose name in English means The Savior. Um.....they know. Most of their population is CATHOLIC. These people with no other skills than making banana bread think that going to a religious country and telling them how wrong they are in broken Spanish is doing God's work. It is offensive on a most basic level.

[FaithManor]

I find chick tracts to be profoundly offensive. Leave on on my property and if I figure out who left it, there will be serious words, and warnings to NEVER return.

[Scarlett]

They get to hide behind their PO Box and maintain their own personal space while mine is not respected. I don't get to maintain any sense of anonymity while they are afforded all of it. Especially since I am not in the phone book and have worked hard to remove as many searchable records of me and my address. Whih means they got my address from where? Given the timing of the letter and the content, I would imagine they got it off a recall petition.

 

Ugh. I'd rather proselytizers kept their stuff to themselves. If I want what you're selling (be that products or religious beliefs), I'll ask you.

 

And even if it annoys lots of people? You won't stop and then who are you really doing this for? Not for converts. Not in 2017.

I forgot if you said it was JW or not....but

 

Your address is not a secret. It confuses me that you are so mad that someone wrote you a letter. Did they not sign their name ? They aren't to trying to be anonymous....they would love to talk to you but you don't want to talk to them. So throw it away. It takes 3 seconds to throw it in the trash, we dont get names and address from recall lists.

 

And we are doing 'this' because we were commission to by Christ. And some people are glad we do.

[Tanaqui]

Scarlett, if you want to spread the word without annoying people, schedule an information session and put up posters. Then listening to your church natter on about Jesus is opt-in - not opt-out. Don't invade my private space during my private time to do it. I don't go to your house to talk to you about how you should really be worshiping Cthulu.

 

Or, better yet, spend your time feeding the hungry and clothing the naked. Whenever you get the urge to go door-to-door, sign up for another shift of Meals-on-Wheels instead.

[Scarlett]

I'm not answering the door, but I don't even like the ringing/knocking. It's disruptive, as is a phone call.

 

I wouldn't object to a postcard if it's not done frequently.

 

But you know, "Jesus who?" is not a question I've ever heard. People who want to maybe convert/join a church are going to go there. They're not sitting at home waiting for somebody to hopefully come by and tell them about their faith.

Some are. We find many people who are interested.

[Tanaqui]

Or, another opt-in method: set up a stand in the park with explanatory pamphlets. Then people can take them if they want, but they aren't forced to listen to you if they don't want.

[Scarlett]

Scarlett, if you want to spread the word without annoying people, schedule an information session and put up posters. Then listening to your church natter on about Jesus is opt-in - not opt-out. Don't invade my private space during my private time to do it. I don't go to your house to talk to you about how you should really be worshiping Cthulu.

 

Or, better yet, spend your time feeding the hungry and clothing the naked. Whenever you get the urge to go door-to-door, sign up for another shift of Meals-on-Wheels instead.

I promise you it is not possible to do so without annoying some people. We do the best we can to not make people,angry but it is not always possible to accomplish that and still fulfill our obligation as a Christian.

[Scarlett]

Or, another opt-in method: set up a stand in the park with explanatory pamphlets. Then people can take them if they want, but they aren't forced to listen to you if they don't want.

We do a lot of this. All over the world. And still some people would not be reached if we did not also go door to door. I am sorry it is so bothersome to people to answer their door.

[Tanaqui]

Scarlett, I promise you that your posters will be subject to a lot less vandalism than posters that say nothing more than "atheists exist". And yet, somehow, atheists resist the urge to spread our word face-to-face during other people's private time.

[Selkie]

I have a Rosary in the window of my car. More than once I've gotten a Chick tract on my windshield. It blows my mind a) that people believe that one of the world's major religions is actually in league with El Diablo and b) that finding that stupid piece of paper will somehow be an eye-opening experience for me.

 

Am I the only one who had to look up what a Chick tract is? Never heard of that before in my life!

[DragonFaerie]

I don't think anybody has pointed out yet the concern about answering the door to strangers.  These may be teenagers, but teens can do plenty of damage if they want to. I don't feel at all safe opening my door to people I don't know unless they're wearing a UPS or FedEx uniform. 

[Tanaqui]

Am I the only one who had to look up what a Chick tract is? Never heard of that before in my life!

 

I guess that makes you one of today's lucky ten thousand! You were probably luckier yesterday, though, before you knew about them. Blech.

[Cindy in FL.]

I understand why people go door to door and try to be kind but firm if I don't share their beliefs. That being said, I prefer friendship evangelism. I think it's better to have a genuine interest in getting to know someone first, and then any sharing of faith beliefs would or would not naturally come up in conversation. I generally don't like to ambush people or cram something down their throats which they have no desire to hear. Getting to know someone first lets you know what doors are open. I still maintain friendships regardless.

Edited May 13, 2017 by Cindy in FL.

[Scarlett]

Am I the only one who had to look up what a Chick tract is? Never heard of that before in my life!

I have never heard of it either.

[HomeAgain]

IIRC the guy who invented them just died.

[LucyStoner]

We do a lot of this. All over the world. And still some people would not be reached if we did not also go door to door. I am sorry it is so bothersome to people to answer their door.

So you are trying to reach them but you aren't trying to save people? How does that work?

Edited May 13, 2017 by LucyStoner

[Tanaqui]

You're being a hypocrite. You expect others on this thread to gladly accept mailings from other people they don't know, because they can "just throw them out" and their home address "isn't private", but you're not letting me join in on the fun.

[73349]

You know, I think what it comes down to is, this country is already ~85% Christian, and it's a safe bet that the other 15% are tired of hearing about it.

If people *are* looking for info, it's on the internet; in the Bible, which is available in every bookstore I've ever seen and a fair number of hotel drawers; in library books; among the people they work with and live near; on the radio; in any church, most of which post prominently their service times and/or can be found in a phone book, for the old-school types... I think it must be very rare for someone to both welcome an evangelical visit *and* wind up making a real life change. A few lonely people may enjoy the company, no doubt, but I just can't see that you'd get back anything like what it would take to make up for the ill will of the rest of the community.

 

A minister in my area who serves people experiencing homelessness has commented on this... in seminary he was taught to address people's "felt needs" and then bring them around to talking about Jesus, as a caring friend. Except he has found that nearly everybody he talks to is already Christian. He's still happy to talk about his faith, but serving people needs to be about serving people. Being a friend has to be about being a friend. Not winning souls.

Edited May 13, 2017 by whitehawk

[Scarlett]

So you are trying to reach them but you aren't trying to save people? How does that work?

I don't have the power to save anyone. That would be up to them.

[Scarlett]

You know, I think what it comes down to is, this country is already ~85% Christian, and it's a safe bet that the other 15% are tired of hearing about it.

If people *are* looking for info, it's on the internet; in the Bible, which is available in every bookstore I've ever seen and a fair number of hotel drawers; in library books; among the people they work with and live near; on the radio; in any church, most of which post prominently their service times and/or can be found in a phone book, for the old-school types... I think it must be very rare for someone to both welcome an evangelical visit *and* wind up making a real life change. A few lonely people may enjoy the company, no doubt, but I just can't see that you'd get back anything like what it would take to make up for the ill will of the rest of the community.

Maybe it is just the people you associate with that bear such Ill will. I live and work in the community....some people hate us and some don't.

[winterbaby]

I think it's probably ineffective to argue in terms of personal motivation and decision-making to someone whose conscience is being legalistically burdened by a top-down organization they've been taught has the answers to everything, and which has the power to enforce its decrees by cutting them off from their social circle, possibly even inducing their family to disiwn them, if they disobey. Motivation works differently in that kind of dynamic.

[LucyStoner]

I don't have the power to save anyone. That would be up to them.

But your intent is to change their beliefs.

 

At least be honest with yourself. You are there on the off chance they will convert to your faith. You know most people find it annoying but you persist in doing it. I'm not sure why it would surprise you that most people find it intrusive and rude to come to their door.

[itsheresomewhere]

Don't knock on my door or if you do, prepare for a lecture and a reading lesson. I have a no soliciting sign and it amazes me how the meat truck guy can read and walk yet the religious groups and charities who tell it doesn't apply to them.  One told me that Jesus told him to knock. I don't think he liked my response.  

 

Kinda funny- when my relative died, I received a letter from someone I didn't know.  It said how her religion told her to write me and send me "comforting" passages from the bible.  It was the funniest drivel and so creepy that she went tracked my address down.  I sent a letter back that was not very nice and enlightened her on what an butt the person was.  

 

 

[poppy]

I think it's probably ineffective to argue in terms of personal motivation and decision-making to someone whose conscience is being legalistically burdened by a top-down organization they've been taught has the answers to everything, and which has the power to enforce its decrees by cutting them off from their social circle, possibly even inducing their family to disiwn them, if they disobey. Motivation works differently in that kind of dynamic.

 

Also, the whole persecution complex turns rejection into a virtue.  Really, evangelizing is a no-lose prospect.

[Jenny in Florida]

I just wish that JWs kept good databases and marked a no as a no.  Where I worked previously (office of three people, not a revolving door) we had JWs visit every six months or so.  I always politely said that no one was interested, but they always came back.

 

Amen, sister. 

 

I don't understand why, but our neighborhood has JWs knocking on doors here every couple of months. I am always polite but firmly say we are not interested. I have even asked that they remove us from their rounds. They always nod and smile sweetly and wish me a good day and then come back again the next time.

[Bluegoat]

I don't really like this practice either.

 

I understand the idea of sharing the gospel, and I think it's important.

 

And I don't really believe this ide that somehow a home is totally private in the way some seem to, where people talking to you on the doorstep or sending you mail is somehow offensive. 

 

I don't particularly dislike any of the people that have come to my door.

 

But boy, it can be really annoying.  I'm always polite to the Mormon's and JWs that come, but they almost inevitably interrupt me, for an awkward conversation where I am trying not to seem rude.  It makes me feel put on the spot in a very unpleasant way.  I think this is a major reason many people feel so hostile.  And the other is that it makes people feel they are being used.

 

I'm always flummoxed at ho the great commission turned into "send ill-educated people to your door - I have no clue how that is supposed to be helpful.  Which would clearly include a bunch of teens.  I let the Mormon young people who came in once to chat, and it really wasn't a great experience - they really didn't have any substantial answer to the most basic questions I asked them, and were annoyed when I didn't accept their advice to just pray about it.

 

I don't think it's an effective form of evangelism, certainly not in the 21st century west.  I suspect it actually has a negative effect.

[Scarlett]

But your intent is to change their beliefs.

 

At least be honest with yourself. You are there on the off chance they will convert to your faith. You know most people find it annoying but you persist in doing it. I'm not sure why it would surprise you that most people find it intrusive and rude to come to their door.

 

You think I am a dishonest person? Interesting.

 

We hope people will respond favorably to what we have to show them from the Bible. We no most will not. And yet it is still our commission to share.

 

I am not surprised that some people find it intrusive and rude. I disagree that most people find it that way.

[Scarlett]

I think it's probably ineffective to argue in terms of personal motivation and decision-making to someone whose conscience is being legalistically burdened by a top-down organization they've been taught has the answers to everything, and which has the power to enforce its decrees by cutting them off from their social circle, possibly even inducing their family to disiwn them, if they disobey. Motivation works differently in that kind of dynamic.

Yes that does sound terrible. I've never experienced anything like that

[winterbaby]

But you would if you didn't conform. I have relatives who've been through this. The organization was lovely and affirming and supportive... until it wasn't.

[Wheres Toto]

You think I am a dishonest person? Interesting.

 

We hope people will respond favorably to what we have to show them from the Bible. We no most will not. And yet it is still our commission to share.

 

I am not surprised that some people find it intrusive and rude. I disagree that most people find it that way.

 

I think the vast majority of people would find it intrusive and rude.  Or at least annoying.  I would say at best, people are uninterested but neutral about it.

 

Vast majority will already have their own beliefs and/or religion.

Vast majority know how to find out information about other beliefs if they want to.

 

Might be interesting to do a poll and ask people how they feel.  We have a pretty diverse and wide-spread group of people here.  It would be interesting to see how the numbers come out.

[73349]

Scarlett, I believe in your sincerity. I do. But here is a list of the sincere folks' houses of worship within 20 minutes of my house.

 

a mosque

African Methodist Episcopal

Assemblies of God

at least two synagogues

Baptist (various kinds)

Buddhist center

Christian Scientists

Church of the Nazarene

Episcopal

Freethought Society

Hindu temple

Lutheran

Non-Denominational (various)

Presbyterian

Roman Catholic

Unitarian Universalist

United Church of Christ

United Methodist

 

Do I have time for all these people? No, I do not. I belong to one on the list, and DH belongs to a different one. The other fifteen (and any others I don't know of) can be assured that we'll find them if we need them.

Edited May 13, 2017 by whitehawk

[Χά�ων]

Am I the only one who had to look up what a Chick tract is? Never heard of that before in my life!

I am jealous.

[Scarlett]

Conversion is not our goal. Our goal is to teach people what we believe is truth and they can do with it what they wish. If they join us we are happy.

 

Some people are politely not interested and others are very mean.