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Tim Tebow / UIL participation bills


Bambam
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This is political, but it relates directly to homeschooling.

 

Our state, TX, once again has a Tim Tebow/UIL participation bill before the legislature.

 

I'm curious for states that have a UIL (university interscholastic league) participation option (where homeschooled kids can participate in UIL contests) what consequences, if any, you believe have resulted from this. I'd also be curious what the rules were before and what they changed to as well as a brief overview of what requirements you have to follow in order to homeschool

 

Now, a little background. Our state has basically no regulation for homeschoolers. We are considered private schools. No reporting to the state. No requirement to test, Nothing.

 

Homeschoolers are not allowed to participate in UIL contests - with the exception of debate contests and that is only through 4-H. We can participate in PSIA contest (up to Grade 8, I believe). There are a few other contests that we can participate in. Many homeschoolers have started sports leagues (football, basketball, track, etc) and homeschool bands so their kids can still have this experience.

 

But the bill, sponsored by our own Texas Homeschool Coalition, includes testing requirements for homeschooled children in order to participate in UIL. (No pass, no play) Many believe that with this we are giving up one of our freedoms (those who elect to participate will be required to test and provide those results). I'm one of those who believe that we will be giving up a freedom regardless of the fact you don't have to participate. I also believe that 4-H, which currently follows UIL guidelines, will change their position and require testing. We have a few other organizations in TX similar to 4-H, and we do believe those will follow the testing requirement. Currently, parents just sign a sheet of paper that says the student is making satisfactory academic progress and turn it in (for 4-H, at least). 

 

So, we are fighting our own legal support group (THSC is our HSLDA for TX) on this. They support it. Hey, they sponsored the bill. They declare that so many other states have enacted these bills and there has been *NO* adverse consequences. Are they right? That is what I want to know. 

 

Thanks in advance for your input. 

 

ETA UIL Info "The University Interscholastic League (UIL) is an organization that creates rules for and administers almost all athletic, music, and academic contests for public primary and secondary schools in the American state of Texas. It is the largest organization of its type in the world.[1]

Activities range from American football and cross-examination debate to mathematics and marching band competitions; however, the UIL does not administer Academic Decathlon competitions." from Wikipedia entry on UIL.

 

Edited by Bambam
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Utah allows homeschoolers to participate freely in all school extracurriculars including sports, there are no extra strings (such as testing) attached.

 

Homeschoolers can also enroll part time in public school. For example, a high school student could attend just for choir or biology or math class.

 

I love the flexibility and see no downsides.

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What is UIL?

 

I've modified my original post to include that info.

"The University Interscholastic League (UIL) is an organization that creates rules for and administers almost all athletic, music, and academic contests for public primary and secondary schools in the American state of Texas. It is the largest organization of its type in the world.[1]

Activities range from American football and cross-examination debate to mathematics and marching band competitions; however, the UIL does not administer Academic Decathlon competitions." From Wikipedia.

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We have a Tim Tebow law, though I do not know anything about a UIL league. As the primary educator, I am allowed to print up and sign a sheet of paper that says my student is making satisfactory academic progress (when forms are needed for sports participation.)

 

ETA: In Florida

Edited by Melissa B
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I have no idea since ds was never interested. However, because Tebow is from Florida and it was an issue for him I imagine there's some rule about homeschoolers in the state. If I understand it correctly his mother fought against rules that kept him out of playing.

Edited by Lady Florida.
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Utah allows homeschoolers to participate freely in all school extracurriculars including sports, there are no extra strings (such as testing) attached.

 

Homeschoolers can also enroll part time in public school. For example, a high school student could attend just for choir or biology or math class.

 

I love the flexibility and see no downsides.

 

Same for Florida. I mean, yes, we have yearly portfolio reviews with a reviewer of your choice (generally something homeschool moms do on the side for extra money) but it's not complicated and there is nothing set that you have to each, or level of proficiency needed, etc. It's no big deal, and everyone does it, if they play sports or not. Mind you, the county doesn't see the portfolio, they just see the form your reviewer signs off on. 

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As far as changes, the only changes I have seen since moving to this state several years ago are that the very easy homeschool requirements have gotten even easier. Definitely no trend towards greater control.

 

I have no idea when sports participation became a guaranteed right for homeschoolers but I do know that it is much easier to homeschool here now than it was several decades ago.

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The issue is UIL. I'm from Texas and my brother is a coach there. The UIL is very strict in its requirements for athletes. Teams have had to forfeit entire seasons due to UIL violations. I think they are all just unsure how that would translate to homeschoolers.

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I also understand that the testing requirement is a way to prevent failing public school students who suddenly decide to "homeschool" from taking advantage of the homeschool statute.

 

I'm torn on the issue. I live in the frickin middle of nowhere and there are NO homeschool opportunities here. None. Zilch. Nada. My high schooler is severely handicapped because of it. I'm worried how his college applications are going to look. And it isn't just a matter of "Well then just put him in school" because Texas schools won't accept any homeschool transfer credits.

 

It's a frickin mess and it makes me snarly.

Edited by Kinsa
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I know here testing is required because students are expected to maintain a C average to participate in ANY extracurricular activities.  My state also requires a 2.5 gpa or above for minors to get a driver's license.  I understand they can't just let homeschoolers jump in with no academic requirements and I know plenty of homeschool parents who would lie and say their kid had the grades so they could participate.  Hence the testing.

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I also understand that the testing requirement is a way to prevent failing public school students who suddenly decide to "homeschool" from taking advantage of the homeschool statute.

 

 

I think this is right.  I suspect the core concern is athletes who fall out of academic eligibility.  Considering how egregiously some institutions of higher education have behaved around this issue, the concern doesn't strike me as misplaced.  

 

I just checked the rules here, which are set by the Tennessee Secondary School Athletic Association and govern both public and private member schools.  Homeschoolers who want to play on a team at a TSSA member school have to be registered with their local school district (as opposed to a church-related cover school) which in turns requires testing in grade 9.  Students also have to be taking a minimum of 5 academic subjects and not be more than three months behind grade level, as determined by consultation between the parents and school administration.  The rules also require that a student has to be in the district of the public school for which sh/e wants to play, and interestingly, no more than 20 miles away from a private school.

 

State law in turns provides that if a student is eligible under TSSA rules, a TSSA member public school cannot prevent them from joining.

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This is political, but it relates directly to homeschooling.

 

Our state, TX, once again has a Tim Tebow/UIL participation bill before the legislature.

 

I'm curious for states that have a UIL (university interscholastic league) participation option (where homeschooled kids can participate in UIL contests) what consequences, if any, you believe have resulted from this. I'd also be curious what the rules were before and what they changed to as well as a brief overview of what requirements you have to follow in order to homeschool

 

Now, a little background. Our state has basically no regulation for homeschoolers. We are considered private schools. No reporting to the state. No requirement to test, Nothing.

 

Homeschoolers are not allowed to participate in UIL contests - with the exception of debate contests and that is only through 4-H. We can participate in PSIA contest (up to Grade 8, I believe). There are a few other contests that we can participate in. Many homeschoolers have started sports leagues (football, basketball, track, etc) and homeschool bands so their kids can still have this experience.

 

But the bill, sponsored by our own Texas Homeschool Coalition, includes testing requirements for homeschooled children in order to participate in UIL. (No pass, no play) Many believe that with this we are giving up one of our freedoms (those who elect to participate will be required to test and provide those results). I'm one of those who believe that we will be giving up a freedom regardless of the fact you don't have to participate. I also believe that 4-H, which currently follows UIL guidelines, will change their position and require testing. We have a few other organizations in TX similar to 4-H, and we do believe those will follow the testing requirement. Currently, parents just sign a sheet of paper that says the student is making satisfactory academic progress and turn it in (for 4-H, at least). 

 

So, we are fighting our own legal support group (THSC is our HSLDA for TX) on this. They support it. Hey, they sponsored the bill. They declare that so many other states have enacted these bills and there has been *NO* adverse consequences. Are they right? That is what I want to know. 

 

Thanks in advance for your input. 

 

ETA UIL Info "The University Interscholastic League (UIL) is an organization that creates rules for and administers almost all athletic, music, and academic contests for public primary and secondary schools in the American state of Texas. It is the largest organization of its type in the world.[1]

Activities range from American football and cross-examination debate to mathematics and marching band competitions; however, the UIL does not administer Academic Decathlon competitions." from Wikipedia entry on UIL.

 

I'm also in Texas, and by no means is THSC anything close to the equivalent of HSLDA. They might like to be that, but they are not.

 

We're fighting this.

 

I called my legislators last week because of the ESAs; I'm calling next week because of the Tebow bill. When will these people learn??? :banghead:

 

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If I remember correctly, didn't THSC originally OPPOSE this bill the first time it was presented/proposed? Or am I mixing things up? *someone* opposed it....I thought it was them. That was my first thought....

 

I find it okay, and don't feel it's a huge deal. More opportunities would be good. Great, even. We pay tax dollars to those public school programs, we might as well be able to take advantage of them rather than paying *more* money to privately funded programs such as "homeschool band, football, etc." And, the testing isn't imposing anything on those who don't wish to participate, AND isn't imposing anything that public school kids don't have to also do, in order to participate, so it doesn't seem discriminatory unless I'm misunderstanding the bill. 

 

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Up until about 4 years ago, Ohio left it up to each school district to determine whether homeschooled kids could participate in sports.  My district was the only district in my area that permitted homeschoolers to play on the sports teams.  In order to play, the Ohio High School Athletic Association required me to submit a form to my public school that listed my son's classes and his grades in those classes.

 

A provision was passed in the state budget bill 4 years ago that required all school districts to permit homeschoolers (and private schooled students who didn't have access at their private school) to participate in all extracurricular activities.  The provision also stipulated that the Ohio Athletic Association was not permitted to require any information from homeschoolers. 

 

When the provision passed, there were those that predicted that kids who were failing in school would drop out and homeschool so they could still play sports and there were homeschoolers who predicted that our homeschooling regulations would become more strict.  Both predictions were wrong.

 

ETA:  My state requires homeschoolers to submit a yearly Intent to Homeschool notification form.  The law requires homeschoolers to send in yearly nationally normed standardized test results, the results of a portfolio review conducted by a certified teacher, or another form of yearly progress report that is mutually agreed upon by the school district and the homeschooling family.

Edited by snowbeltmom
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A similar bill has been passed (and vetoed) in Virginia twice, and just passed again -- but is expected to be vetoed a third time.  Our governor's reasoning is essentially, well -- you chose to homeschool, and their are consequences.  He's basically backing up the VA High School League (a group that has stood in the way of homeschoolers competing within or against VA public and participating private schools).  The VHSL controls *every* high school academic or athletic competition.

 

The current law would still leave participation up to the local school districts -- but would at least open a firmly shut door.  VA already has several measures for homeschool progress written into law.  The VHSL wanted additional provisions, such as requiring students to take the State's Standards of Learning Tests (SOLs, as they are called -- I prefer the other associated meaning, as the VA SOLs are, for the most part, very poorly designed, and yes, my oldest two actually took SOLs for 2 years).  Those hurdles were in addition to the state's requirements for proof of progress (which begin at 1st grade or if the child is 6 at the beginning of the school year -- this is younger than any public school we've been around requires standardized testing).  The SOLs would then also essentially dictate curriculum choices (because the subject content is essentially mandated).  Our homeschool groups were against the VHSL requirements, but have been neutral to supportive of the legislation that has been passed for the past several years.

 

I support the Tebow bills.  Most of the fears (by very conservative homeschool groups) are unfounded.  31 States currently have similar laws, and you can see how they have been implemented in a broad array of ways, and the impacts to each.  This is not a new idea -- and has been met with overwhelmingly positive results across most of the nation.

 

Back home, we live in a mostly rural area.  Participating in club sports has been our only (and very expensive option).  My oldest two would love to participate on their local high school swim team (in addition to the Club team).  They have participated in National Honor Society, Track and Swim Team with DoDEA schools without any issues.  I have to send a weekly progress report (which is more of a nuisance than difficult).  

 

Thankfully, it looks like we will remain overseas for a minimum of 3 more years (possibly 5 -- at which time we will move back to the states).

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It would not be fair to let homeschooled kids participate without some checks that they meet or exceed the minimum academic standards that public school students have to meet to participate.

 

Homeschoolers here can participate, and I think that is great. But given the giant loophole created if homeschool students don't have to meet the academic standards, I think it's awfully selfish and silly of homeschoolers to expect to be exempt. Participation in sports isn't mandatory or a right, it's a privilege and one that is regularly revoked when students aren't keeping up with their studies.

 

There are definitely families with athletes who "homeschool" to dodge the academic requirements where such antics are allowed.

Edited by LucyStoner
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Sorry, that's just ridiculous. Testing to access a football league ? No way.

 

I think the model maize describes in Utah is the best kind, and probably also helps with all those pesky problems of homeschoolers not being sighted by reporters blah blah. Allow participation to the greatest extent possible, with the very fewest hoops possible, completely at the discretion of the home educating family.

Public school students are benched regularly for not meeting minimal academic standards. One below standard grade and my niece can't run track until her grades improve. Asking homeschoolers to show that they meet some sort of equivalent academic standard to access publically funded student athletics is not onerous or the tiniest bit ridiculous. If there are no standards for homeschoolers it would be very unfair that there are standards for student athletes enrolled in school.

 

Why should homeschoolers be exempt from meeting the same standards that ALL the other student athletes have to meet?

 

Having it all be determined by the parents opens it up for failing student athletes to get around the requirements by becoming "homeschooled" and yes, that is something that actually happens where it is allowed.

 

I went to a high school that didn't have grades. It was a small public school without sports teams. I played softball for a different school program and since I didn't have grades they looked at a general progress report and, for the years I tested, those scores. I truly don't think it's a problem to find an alternative metric for ANY student athletes who don't have grades.

Edited by LucyStoner
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I don't see any reason that a testing requirement in order to participate in athletics or other contests that are currently closed to homeschoolers would result in more homeschool regulations for everyone; that has not happened at all in other states. And I am 100% in favor of homeschoolers having access to all public school extracurricular activities (curricular activities too for that matter).

 

The benefits here are huge and the negatives pretty much nil. If I were in Texas I would support the bill.

 

And yeah, given the importance of school sports (football!) in the Lone Star State, allowing student athletes to drop out and "homeschool" as a loophole to the academic standards rules would not benefit anyone, them least of all.

Edited by maize
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There definitely should be some provision for kids with learning disabilities and special needs though, an across the board cut off for a test would not be fair to them. These kids need access to the extracurricular opportunities as well, so there needs to be a "student is making progress in accordance with their abilities" provision of some kind.

 

I loved Margaret in CO's swim team stories.

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 I'm one of those who believe that we will be giving up a freedom regardless of the fact you don't have to participate. 

 

If a public school student has some requirement in order to participate in sports (attendance, adequate progress, etc.), it seems reasonable to have homeschooled students have the same requirements.

 

I'm curious to those who don't support these "Tebow bills' what you do support:  No sports participation  on public school teams by homeschoolers at all?  Or sports participation is allowed by homeschoolers with no constraints? I'm not a big believer in slippery slopes, but I think the latter is more likely to lead to problems down the road than the former.

Edited by GGardner
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We live in a state that requires testing....they just have to be 30% or above to participate.  It really isn't that big of a deal.  Non-activities association activities (like trap shooting and ROTC) don't require testing.

 

that's weird, do they only let the top 2/3 of the student body participate in sports and band and etc?

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that's weird, do they only let the top 2/3 of the student body participate in sports and band and etc?

Yeah, strict percentile cutoffs make no sense to me. One child could be doing very little work and get a high percentile score on a standardized test, while another is working incredibly hard but maybe has a lower IQ or a learning disability or debilitating test anxiety and therefor tests low. 3 out of 10 students are going to be below the 30th percentile, it's not as if there is some way for every student to test above it!

 

I think having a test as one way of demonstrating acceptable academic performance is fine, but there need to be other options.

 

I'm really, really good at multiple choice tests--I could walk into something like an SAT subject test for a class I never took and pass with flying colors after just a day or two of prep (did this very thing in high school; In fact, it even worked with the AP U.S. history test--all I did was read through one prep book after never having taken a course in American history. I passed the military's German language test with a sufficient score to get bonus pay for the language--again, never took a class in the language and while I have some experiential background my German is actually really lousy; my test taking skills are just really good). Those tests said virtually nothing about how much effort I was or was not putting into academics. I have a very bright dyslexic child who has worked harder at reading than all my other kids combined but would at this point get awful scores on any test that depended on reading.

 

Standardized tests are just not anything close to being a gold standard for evaluating student performance let alone diligence and effort.

Edited by maize
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Curious as to what they test with...and as far as not competing if you are 3 months behind grade level, well that would decimate entire populations of budding athletes in our districts.  In California there are only two official testing windows, grades 8 and 11.  Each school has interim assessments, but they are not "official."

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There definitely should be some provision for kids with learning disabilities and special needs though, an across the board cut off for a test would not be fair to them. These kids need access to the extracurricular opportunities as well, so there needs to be a "student is making progress in accordance with their abilities" provision of some kind.

 

I loved Margaret in CO's swim team stories.

I agree and as far as I know there already are here. Students in special education just need to make progress as determined in their IEP, not be at grade level. Edited by LucyStoner
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I don't even mean for special ed kids.  I think it's pretty reasonable to assume there are completely NT kids who are just in the bottom third of students; as my dad would have said, "That don't make 'em bad."  I don't see why they shouldn't be allowed to play sports.  A much lower cut off I can see - maybe bottom 10%?  I guess?  but I think a more reasonable measure than the percentile would be just a certain level of mastery on the test, or a certain GPA for kids who are in school.  So if a kid is passing his classes (even with Cs) or a kid scores as basically proficient, or whatever the bottom benchmark is, on the standardized tests, and doesn't have any special needs, why not let him play sports of join the band or whatever?

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We dropped "no pass, no play" a few years ago. I don't like that. If a kid is FAILING a single class, he should not be in sports. Now, the kids can be failing a class and have a D in everything else and can be playing? That makes no sense to me. We have a gifted thespian, who the district overlooked the grades on last spring because we needed him. Well, eligibility for the fall play was on last spring's grades, so no go. It's woken him up and he just might graduate this spring! If he'd been allowed to keep coasting, he wouldn't be graduating. I think any time there's ONE failing grade, the kid sits out. Our hockey team isn't under the high school so the grade thing doesn't matter. The parents are the ones fighting putting it under the school because they want their boys on the ice and grades be d*mned. IMO, that is horrible.

I'm not in complete agreement with this, because sometimes for a kid who is struggling in every other area of life a sport is all they have to keep living for. Kids needs positives in their lives.

 

The assumption that a kid will be motivated to try harder and will therefor succeed better because they care about the sport doesn't hold true if the kid is struggling because of abuse at home, depression, undiagnosed learning disabilities, or any number of other things.

 

I know "no pass no play" is easy to mandate, and agree that there are many situations in which it serves as a good motivator.

 

But I don't think it is universally beneficial. At the least I hope that a kid who is struggling and failing is being given lots of support and help on many fronts. I just don't think most kids who fail are doing so because they choose to--so approaching the problem as exclusively a motivational one is going to do more harm than good for many.

Edited by maize
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Utah allows homeschoolers to participate freely in all school extracurriculars including sports, there are no extra strings (such as testing) attached.

 

Homeschoolers can also enroll part time in public school. For example, a high school student could attend just for choir or biology or math class.

 

I love the flexibility and see no downsides.

This is how Maine is also.

 

I have no idea who Tim Tebow is.

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In our ps, the home room (they call it advisory) teacher is on top of it. If a child is failing, it's because he's not showing up or class or turning in his work. Here, basically if the kid is physically there and trying, he'll get a C. We have a fabulous mentoring program--the mentor might even shadow the kid for days at school. If the kid has LDs, he's on an IEP. If he's THERE, then he's not going to have a failing grade. By athletic rules, if the kid isn't at school, he can't practice. And if he can't practice, he's not eligible. 

 that sounds like a sensible system.  Is it a small school?

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I support No Pass No Play because of what I saw when it was implemented.  There were several kids in my school who were failing because they "didn't give a flying F"  (that was a direct-ish quote from a fellow student).  Football, or another sport but likely football, was the only reason they went to school.  When they had to, they studied some.  When the coach cared about passing, THEN grades mattered.  

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I thought that was super weird too.

 

Being able to participate in a sport seems to me like it would be a good thing for students who might be otherwise disengaged.

 

But instead it's only a reward for kids who are already engaged ?

While I mostly agree with you, there is an entire culture surrounding high school (and university) sports--football in particular--in some parts of the US where the sport overshadows all academic aspects of school. Student athletes become the local heroes and sometimes get away with all kinds of behavior issues (up to and including rape) because they are idolized by the community.

 

I think the academic eligibility rules are meant to help instill at least a modicum of responsibility and dignity into the system. I don't actually think having such rules in place is a bad idea as long as there is support and reasonable flexibility for students who struggle for reasons other than cockiness and a poor attitude towards school.

 

I don't know of any other country where the actual academics of academic institutions are habitually overshadowed by athletics.

Edited by maize
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that's weird, do they only let the top 2/3 of the student body participate in sports and band and etc

 

 

 

 

They have to maintain a 2.5 here to participate in any extracurriculars.  I don't have any issue with it.  It isn't unreasonable to expect students to at least focus on academics enough to make a C average.

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I'm been studying up on the issue and thinking about this a lot in the past few days...

 

The bill as it was introduced years ago was vague, and I can see why the homeschool community objected to it at that time.

 

However, the new bill that has been introduced has added language to clarify those previous ambiguities, and it put checks on the public schools. 

 

Senate bill:  http://www.legis.state.tx.us/tlodocs/85R/billtext/html/SB00640I.htm

 

House bill:  http://www.legis.state.tx.us/tlodocs/85R/billtext/html/HB01323I.htm

 

From the wording of the bill itself:

 

"With respect to a home-schooled student's education program, nothing in this section shall be construed to permit an agency of this state, a public school district, or any other governmental body to exercise control, regulatory authority, or supervision over a home-schooled student or a parent or person standing in parental relation to a home-schooled student beyond the control, regulatory authority, or supervision required to participate in a league activity."

 

Also:

 

"Subject only to eligibility requirements under this  section for a home-schooled student to participate in a league  activity:                  (1)  the curriculum or assessment requirements, performance standards, practices, or creed of the education program provided to a home-schooled student may not be required to be changed in order for the home-schooled student to participate in a league activity; and                  

             (2)  for a home-schooled student participating in an education program on January 1, 2017, the education program     provided to that student may not be required to comply with any state law or agency rule relating to that education program unless the law or rule was in effect on January 1, 2017."

 

As for the testing requirement, I think there has to be SOME WAY for the parent-teacher to affirm to the school that the homeschooled student meets the minimum requirement that all public school kids have to meet in order to participate in UIL activities. And no, a mommy-generated "report card" doesn't cut it, sorry.  I've known too many high school drop-outs whose parents said they were "homeschooling" only to not have the kid do a darned thing for two years, then hand them a diploma, then "graduate" them.  We all know this dishonesty exists. 

 

I see the testing requirement no different than a homeschooled child applying to Texas state universities.  Sure, they'll accept the mommy-generated transcript, but you pretty much have to have the SAT/ACT scores to back it up.  The testing requirement, as stated in the bill, does NOT say specifically which test must be used, nor who administers it, nor how it is administered.  All the bill says is that "ANY nationally recognized, norm-referenced assessment instrument" must be used.

 

And for people who say there are TONS of homeschool opportunities around, I beg you to leave your urban or suburban areas and come to where I live.  My high schooler is THE ONLY homeschooled high schooler in a 100+ mile radius.  There are NO opportunities for him.  Granted, the local high school is small and doesn't offer much, but it offers SOME things.  I know they have a track team and a golf team, and I recently saw that they have a robotics team.  So there's at least that, which is more than what we are getting now.

 

And no, you can't just take an 11th or 12th grader and plop them into the public school in order to take advantage of these programs.  Texas public schools DO NOT recognize homeschool credits.  Full stop.  My 11th grader would have had to start over as a 9th grader,  OR we could have spent a lot of time and money for him to take the proficiency exams for every class we wanted to claim credit for.  Not so easy, is it?

 

This is not a mandatory opportunity.  If you don't want Big Brother interfering in your homeschooling freedom, then don't participate.  But this opportunity NEEDS to exist for many kids.  If you don't want to do it, then don't.  The schools aren't going to hunt you down because someone else chose to participate in afterschool robotics.  You don't have to OPT OUT, you have to OPT IN.  Big difference.

 

Bottom line:  I don't see anything in this bill that would make me think the sky is falling on the homeschooling world.  I support the bill and will be contacting my state senator and my state representative to ask them to support this bill.

Edited by Kinsa
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And regarding 4H...

 

The UIL and 4H are two totally separate entities and are NOT bound together. This bill should not reflect on 4H policies. If it does, then it is FULLY within the state 4H leadership to change their policy.

 

https://www.thsc.org/2015/05/4-h-and-uil-will-the-rules-be-the-same-after-tebow-19848/

Edited by Kinsa
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The Florida statute requiring public schools to allow home educated students to participate in extracurricular activities did not change any other requirements for homeschoolers. Homeschoolers were already required to submit test scores from a nationally-normed test or have a certified teacher administer a test or review a portfolio and certify that the student was progressing commensurate with his/her ability. So no new testing in Florida. 

 

The big difference between the Florida TT rule and the Texas bill is this section: (d) 

As a condition of eligibility to participate in a league   activity during the first six weeks of a school year, a   home-schooled student must demonstrate grade-level academic   proficiency on any nationally recognized, norm-referenced   assessment instrument,

 

The Texas bill requires homeschoolers to show grade-level test scores whereas Florida requires the student to show "progress commensurate with his/her ability" AND it can be demonstrated through a test OR a portfolio review by a certified teacher.  

 

 

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The Florida statute requiring public schools to allow home educated students to participate in extracurricular activities did not change any other requirements for homeschoolers. Homeschoolers were already required to submit test scores from a nationally-normed test or have a certified teacher administer a test or review a portfolio and certify that the student was progressing commensurate with his/her ability. So no new testing in Florida. 

 

The big difference between the Florida TT rule and the Texas bill is this section: (d) 

As a condition of eligibility to participate in a league   activity during the first six weeks of a school year, a   home-schooled student must demonstrate grade-level academic   proficiency on any nationally recognized, norm-referenced   assessment instrument,

 

The Texas bill requires homeschoolers to show grade-level test scores whereas Florida requires the student to show "progress commensurate with his/her ability" AND it can be demonstrated through a test OR a portfolio review by a certified teacher.  

The "bolded" is the law in Ohio as well. 

 

Regarding the proposed Texas law, do the public schooled kids in Texas have to be working at grade-level in order to play sports?  I would guess that there are quite a few students who receive C's and above on their report cards, yet are not actually working at grade-level. 

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The "bolded" is the law in Ohio as well.

 

Regarding the proposed Texas law, do the public schooled kids in Texas have to be working at grade-level in order to play sports? I would guess that there are quite a few students who receive C's and above on their report cards, yet are not actually working at grade-level.

Great question. Here's what I found:

 

"A student who receives, at the end of any grading period (after the first six weeks of the school year), a grade below 70 in any class (other than an identified class eligible for exemption) or a student with disabilities who fails to meet the standards in the Individual Education Plan (IEP) may not participate in extracurricular activities for three school weeks. An ineligible student may practice or rehearse, however. The student regains eligibility after the seven calendar day waiting period has ended following a grading period or the three school week evaluation period when the principal and teachers determine that he or she has earned a passing grade (70 or above) in all classes, other than those that are exempted."

 

More here: https://www.uiltexas.org/policy/tea-uil-side-by-side/academic-requirements

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Great question. Here's what I found:

 

"A student who receives, at the end of any grading period (after the first six weeks of the school year), a grade below 70 in any class (other than an identified class eligible for exemption) or a student with disabilities who fails to meet the standards in the Individual Education Plan (IEP) may not participate in extracurricular activities for three school weeks. An ineligible student may practice or rehearse, however. The student regains eligibility after the seven calendar day waiting period has ended following a grading period or the three school week evaluation period when the principal and teachers determine that he or she has earned a passing grade (70 or above) in all classes, other than those that are exempted."

 

More here: https://www.uiltexas.org/policy/tea-uil-side-by-side/academic-requirements

Thanks for the info.  Based on this, it looks to me like this proposed bill is holding homeschoolers to a higher academic standard than their public schooled peers.

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Do "extracurriculars" ever become curricular in TX? My state has a Tebow bill in place, but what I've heard from parents at DD's cheer gym, it's a dead letter for most sports because being on a team automatically adds a half credit of "school sports" to your transcript. (PE credit). Which, therefore makes it a class. Homeschoolers cannot enroll in classes. Ergo, give up on any hope of your kid being able to try out for their local school cheer team. The same applies to band, choir, etc. I'm guessing making it a class may also negate "no pass, no play", too, since you wouldn't kick a kid out of English for failing Algebra.

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Do "extracurriculars" ever become curricular in TX? My state has a Tebow bill in place, but what I've heard from parents at DD's cheer gym, it's a dead letter for most sports because being on a team automatically adds a half credit of "school sports" to your transcript. (PE credit). Which, therefore makes it a class. Homeschoolers cannot enroll in classes. Ergo, give up on any hope of your kid being able to try out for their local school cheer team. The same applies to band, choir, etc. I'm guessing making it a class may also negate "no pass, no play", too, since you wouldn't kick a kid out of English for failing Algebra.

 

Sports, etc, are all classes in Texas, yet No Pass, No Play definitely is still implemented. Like was mentioned above, they are able to practice with the team, but are benched for any games. But I don't believe schools would disallow participation, not if a kid tried out and made the team. Especially sports, especially here. And the UIL competition stuff is decidedly NOT curricular, so that stuff wouldn't be affected either. 

 

I would LOVE to see this passed (and Kinsa, thank you for showing the differences in the bill in the past vs now; I was so confused how/why THSC had flip-flopped on it). Even in a large metro area, the "home school" offerings are limited and cost-prohibitive. Yes, we could do choir or band, for a cost. Or debate, if we drive an hour. Or sports, for a cost, and at a drive. Forget 4-H; I've tried & failed for 3 years now to even get information about the local chapter(s) near me. 

 

Having basic requirements to show passing grades does not bother me. 

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  • 3 months later...

A legislative update:

 

The Tim Tebow bill is dead. Yet again.

 

I'm quite saddened by this.

Edited by Kinsa
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Ugh. Again??? I had hope, since it had (I thought) passed the first round this time....drat.

 

It saddens me, too.

It made it out of committee in the Senate, and it passed on the Senate floor.

 

However, as of last night, it was voted down in the House committee... by ONE vote. Someone who changed his support.

 

I'm so upset by this.

 

I'm sure they will try again in two years. Hopefully that will be enough time to drum up enough support for the next go-round.

Edited by Kinsa
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