Grr - just a vent

[creekland]

Pure vent here - not looking for advice, so feel free to ignore - or add similar vents to make me feel better (in a misery loves company aspect).

 

A dr appt on Monday left me annoyed as I pretty much felt dismissed with any concern I brought up, but I was sent home with 5 samples of a drug to take to see if it helped with the main issue.  Considering what I feel doesn't really fit the target of this drug, I had questions, but that goes along with the dismissal part. I'm wrong.  Don't worry about anything else going on.  Call back if this doesn't fix it in 5 days.

 

Fine.  One has to give the dr some degree of credit in that I know he has a ton more medical knowledge than I do, so maybe he's right.  I get home and start looking at the drug.  It takes a LONG time to find directions - they are quite hidden.  I seriously doubt most senior citizens would find it.  Figures.  I hop online and confirm the directions - then see the common side effects.  These were not on the package.  Whoa!  I'm NOT starting this now considering I'm working the next few days and these side effects would seriously affect work if they occurred.

 

So... I put off starting the stuff until this morning - when I have three consecutive days where I don't have to be doing anything special - just in case.

 

Then later I get looking at the drug more online and discover that there are two options with it (taking it).  The one I took (on the container if one could find it in small print under a couple of pages of lift up tabs) gives me 10 days worth.  The other would have the amount he gave me matching the 5 days he mentioned.  I failed the mind reading course in college... so I've no clue what his intent was - 5 days total or 10 total, but see results in 5 or call?  If I hadn't looked online in more depth, I wouldn't even know there's a 2nd option.  GRR!

 

I KNOW the simple solution is to call and ask, but honestly?  I'm so fed up right now that I'm just conceding defeat instead.

 

My dentist is wonderful.  Whenever I'm there he actually listens and has actual conversations about issues.  I may not like certain procedures (will anyone admit to liking root canals or other dental work?), but any questions I have are answered and everything is explained WELL. He has to do these things over and over, but he still treats everyone with the understanding that they haven't heard the spiel hundreds of times.  When he sends me home with drugs, I get PAPERS detailing what to do with them and when to call back if something isn't right.  He actually sometimes sends home papers detailing what to expect as well.

 

WHY can't doctors do similar things?

 

Conceding defeat doesn't come from this one issue.  One issue would be minor.  It also bugs me with the secrecy involved.  Twice now I've only found out about tests they had done without mentioning a word to me first.  The only way I found out is someone is paying for these tests... that would be me.  I get the bill and go WTH?  Money is not an issue.  The secrecy is.  One of these tests had JUST been performed recently at a much lower cost.  WHY did it need to be done again at full cost?  It's on a schedule.  There's no reason to change the schedule - nothing was suspect about the earlier reading.  The other was totally unnecessary and if I'd been ASKED about it I could have at least added my two cents about it - not to mention I was under the impression that anything done medically to adults could be vetoed by that adult.  We're not destitute, but I also see no reason to spend money on unnecessary things.

 

Change doctors I'm told.  That's not as easy as it sounds anymore.  I called around and the only ones taking new patients are PAs - even if the website of the practice says differently.

 

So I give up.  If this stuff works - great.  All is well and I can continue on with it as needed in the future.  If not?  Then I'm done anyway and will go on with life just accepting that as we age things change in a "quit whining and deal with it" mode.  This ought to also end my need to vent about issues!

 

And FTR, this may be the first time ever in my life that I've conceded defeat... I guess I am getting old.  ;)

 

Or maybe it's not defeat.  Maybe I can slot it under the category of picking up my toys and going home instead?  Just walking away and not playing anymore?

 

Gotta think about that one.

 

But yes, when middle son comes home in a month, he'll get the whole story in part of my "train up the next generation of doctors" plan.  He goes to the same dentist, so I have a great "like this" example to use.

 

Meanwhile, I'm heading outside to get some natural healing.  Venting does some.  Puttering around in the yard on a nice 70+ degree day ought to do more.   :coolgleamA:

[quark]

Ugh. I'm sorry this happened. Our docs do provide papers with the meds but I have encountered a few who don't explain as much as they could or should.

 

Your situation sounds way more irresponsible on the part of the doc. 

[Joules]

I completely agree. In the past two days I've taken my 84 yo dad to the doc and my 12 yo dog to the vet. Both elderly, on meds, with special needs. The vet wins hands-down. She describes exactly what she's thinking. I get all of the costs upfront, including the cost of meds. We discuss the costs versus benefits of procedures and tests. "We" make a decision on what to do. It simply cannot compare to a 5 minute, "Take this prescription and do X, Y, and Z.". I hardly have time to compose my questions much less have them answered.

[SKL]

Don't get me started on the small print that comes with meds.

 

And last month when I went in for a perimenopausal issue and they snuck and gave me a pregnancy test.  Really?  Don't lie to me.

 

And being ignored, disbelieved, laughed at....

 

It's hard to trust these people with our health.  It's one of the reasons I now go to a chiropractor for most issues and for wellness.

[OneStepAtATime]

I have had some absolutely wonderful doctors.  And some o.k. doctors.  And some really abyssal,  honestly scary doctors (one nearly cost me my life).  But the ones that consistently get my goat are the ones that automatically dismiss anything I have to say out of hand and treat me like the village idiot.  They are usually the ones that also fail to communicate and get irritated if I try to ask for more info.  I seriously, seriously cannot stand that kind of doctor.

 

Totally sympathize, creekland, and wish you the best.

[Twigs]

:grouphug:  :grouphug:  :grouphug:

[creekland]

Ugh. I'm sorry this happened. Our docs do provide papers with the meds but I have encountered a few who don't explain as much as they could or should.

 

Your situation sounds way more irresponsible on the part of the doc. 

 

It's annoying/frustrating at the least - and I wonder about older folks who wouldn't have the computer to check up on things - but maybe he's more clear with what to do with them.  I dunno.

 

I completely agree. In the past two days I've taken my 84 yo dad to the doc and my 12 yo dog to the vet. Both elderly, on meds, with special needs. The vet wins hands-down. She describes exactly what she's thinking. I get all of the costs upfront, including the cost of meds. We discuss the costs versus benefits of procedures and tests. "We" make a decision on what to do. It simply cannot compare to a 5 minute, "Take this prescription and do X, Y, and Z.". I hardly have time to compose my questions much less have them answered.

 

I love our vets - for the same reason you mention.  We have two - one for our farm animals and the other for our pets.  I'd recommend either easily.

 

It really depends on the Dr. Keep interviewing until you find one you love, or one you can live with.

 

I have one my husband hates. I love this one because I want a thinker, and a nonlinear person is fine with me. Drives him nuts to listen to the conversation since he isnt able to follow.

 

Interviewing?  Locally there aren't other options (aside from PAs) who are taking new patients if I'm to believe what I'm told on the phone.   Those of you who live in more populated areas could have this option, but I don't particularly want to drive to longer distances to larger cities for basic stuff.

 

Don't get me started on the small print that comes with meds.

 

And last month when I went in for a perimenopausal issue and they snuck and gave me a pregnancy test.  Really?  Don't lie to me.

 

And being ignored, disbelieved, laughed at....

 

It's hard to trust these people with our health.  It's one of the reasons I now go to a chiropractor for most issues and for wellness.

 

Cute.  I may not have been witchy enough for them to consider a pregnancy test (yet).   :lol:   I've spent years learning how to play well with people in spite of my natural leadership tendencies.  It works well everywhere else.  And in a small town where I'm known by many due to working in our high school, I'd rather concede defeat and back off than start getting known for a witchy attitude that would surely not stay as knowledge within the office.

 

And the small print that came with the (sample) drugs said nothing about the side effects.  It was tough enough finding the directions.  If I'd just gone home and figured I'd just take them, quite a bit would have been incorrect as the directions are quite specific about when and with what - once one finds them.  So far, no side effects are evident, but even so, I wouldn't have wanted to have been in school teaching classes if they had popped up.  There's quite a bit that could have gone wrong (nothing deadly, but nothing helpful either).

 

I have had some absolutely wonderful doctors.  And some o.k. doctors.  And some really abyssal,  honestly scary doctors (one nearly cost me my life).  But the ones that consistently get my goat are the ones that automatically dismiss anything I have to say out of hand and treat me like the village idiot.  They are usually the ones that also fail to communicate and get irritated if I try to ask for more info.  I seriously, seriously cannot stand that kind of doctor.

 

Totally sympathize, creekland, and wish you the best.

 

I can think of two that I'd put in the wonderful or mostly wonderful category.  Neither fits into what I need right now.  A handful of others fit into the ok or I can deal with it category.  Then there's that last category... making me realize I don't have the skills to play nicely with everyone IF I keep playing.  I've finally come to the conclusion I don't HAVE to keep playing.  Some stressors just aren't worth it.

 

Generally I've found I like doctors when I'm sitting next to them on an airplane and talking about pretty much anything else except my personal stuff (which has never come up on an airplane).

 

Maybe I'll just start asking my vet the questions I have... farm animals aren't that much different than farm owners, are they?   :tongue_smilie:  At least I'll get reasons for what's going on and answers to my questions that make sense.

[Anne in CA]

The giving medication without good directions kills people, you are not being cranky to be concerned. Dh's youngest sister died of a prescribed overdose of seizure medicine. The doctor goofed up and she DIED at the age of 27. It was very preventable.

 

When dh's grandparents were still alive dh's aunt who is a nurse always cross checked their meds when they were not well. Two different times doctors had prescribed meds that should never be taken together or they could kill you. It is certain that they had an extra ten years added to their lives because of her efforts.

 

I don't have a lot of trust in the medical profession, to say the least.

[kroe1]

I know you said to not give you advice, but being around doctors so much, I can tell you what works for the most effective patients:

 

1. Never go to the office with more than one complaint.

a. Have it in writing on a notebook sheet.

b. Underneath write how long you've had it, is it getting better or worse, what makes it better or worse that you've already tried, a list of tests you've already had and results to help diagnose said complaint, and other pertinent information for that one complaint.

2. Have a list of your symptoms which you feel are related to the one complaint.

3. Never chit chat. It is your dollar so do not waste it.

4. Have your questions already written out on a piece of paper.

5. Your questions should include:

a. What tests are needed to help diagnose my one complaint.

b. What drugs or stuff, if any, may be tried in the meantime to see if it helps. (Trying things first, even if they don't work, may help with the diagnosis.)

6. Never forget your doctor has 15 minutes for you and 7 of those minutes are used up in insurance and government charting. So you have 8 minutes in front of the doctor. Your time is precious and should not be wasted.

7. If you do not get done everything you need in 8 minutes, then make another appointment.

 

I know this all seems ludicrous and shouldn't be this way, but it is what it is for now. The patients I see who follow the above steps get the most satisfaction from their doctors. I know my experience may be limited and may not apply in all situations. And I know you didn't ask for this. Maybe another reader can benefit from my observations.

[Truscifi]

It's annoying/frustrating at the least - and I wonder about older folks who wouldn't have the computer to check up on things - but maybe he's more clear with what to do with them.  I dunno.

 

 

I love our vets - for the same reason you mention.  We have two - one for our farm animals and the other for our pets.  I'd recommend either easily.

 

 

Interviewing?  Locally there aren't other options (aside from PAs) who are taking new patients if I'm to believe what I'm told on the phone.   Those of you who live in more populated areas could have this option, but I don't particularly want to drive to longer distances to larger cities for basic stuff.

 

 

Cute.  I may not have been witchy enough for them to consider a pregnancy test (yet).   :lol:   I've spent years learning how to play well with people in spite of my natural leadership tendencies.  It works well everywhere else.  And in a small town where I'm known by many due to working in our high school, I'd rather concede defeat and back off than start getting known for a witchy attitude that would surely not stay as knowledge within the office.

 

And the small print that came with the (sample) drugs said nothing about the side effects.  It was tough enough finding the directions.  If I'd just gone home and figured I'd just take them, quite a bit would have been incorrect as the directions are quite specific about when and with what - once one finds them.  So far, no side effects are evident, but even so, I wouldn't have wanted to have been in school teaching classes if they had popped up.  There's quite a bit that could have gone wrong (nothing deadly, but nothing helpful either).

 

 

I can think of two that I'd put in the wonderful or mostly wonderful category.  Neither fits into what I need right now.  A handful of others fit into the ok or I can deal with it category.  Then there's that last category... making me realize I don't have the skills to play nicely with everyone IF I keep playing.  I've finally come to the conclusion I don't HAVE to keep playing.  Some stressors just aren't worth it.

 

Generally I've found I like doctors when I'm sitting next to them on an airplane and talking about pretty much anything else except my personal stuff (which has never come up on an airplane).

 

Maybe I'll just start asking my vet the questions I have... farm animals aren't that much different than farm owners, are they?   :tongue_smilie:  At least I'll get reasons for what's going on and answers to my questions that make sense.

 

I know you're not looking for advice but....

 

I would at least try the PAs, especially if one has a good reputation and the overall office does as well. I have found they are more likely to listen, and less likely to think they know everything, than docs. Especially specialists.

[Alice]

 

 

But yes, when middle son comes home in a month, he'll get the whole story in part of my "train up the next generation of doctors" plan. 

 

I'm not sure what it says about me but when I read you post I thought "Oh, poor Creekland's son." instead of "Oh, poor Creekland." :) 

 

Maybe that's just from being on the receiving end of a lot of "let me tell you about this horrible doctor" stories. 

 

At the same time probably the best advice I got was from someone who said to imagine that every patient is my mother. Or grandmother. It doesn't work so well in pediatrics :) but the principle still works. On the flip side I told my Dad he has to be super nice to every young clueless doctor he meets. The student poking around trying to draw blood? Imagine it's me 20 years ago. The young know-it-all overly confident doctor. Imagine it's me 15 years ago. He's said it also helps him have a bit more understanding also. 

 

I won't give you any advice about the medicine. I would say to call and clarify the instructions although I understand why you are frustrated and don't want to do that. 

[Halftime Hope]

I completely agree. In the past two days I've taken my 84 yo dad to the doc and my 12 yo dog to the vet. Both elderly, on meds, with special needs. The vet wins hands-down. She describes exactly what she's thinking. I get all of the costs upfront, including the cost of meds. We discuss the costs versus benefits of procedures and tests. "We" make a decision on what to do. It simply cannot compare to a 5 minute, "Take this prescription and do X, Y, and Z.". I hardly have time to compose my questions much less have them answered.

 

This exactly.  Vet even calls to check on the dog and revise the plan as needed.   LOVE my vet.

[Ausmumof3]

It's hard to find a good doctor. Some are very I went to med school for five years so just trust me. The good ones realise it's the patients body and they should have some kind of informed choice over what gets done with it. Best dr I ever had was one who admitted she was just using google to find a pregnancy date calculator. I knew then that she would be open if she didn't know the answer.

[creekland]

The giving medication without good directions kills people, you are not being cranky to be concerned. Dh's youngest sister died of a prescribed overdose of seizure medicine. The doctor goofed up and she DIED at the age of 27. It was very preventable.

 

...

 

I don't have a lot of trust in the medical profession, to say the least.

 

Sorry about your SIL.  That would be really big problem rather than a vent.  Some of these things can be scary.

 

I've never been keen on putting "stuff" into my body so I tend to be overly cautious in looking things up before using them.  I'm not against meds.  I just want to ensure the reasons for using them are valid and outweigh not using them.  Maybe it's a trust issue.  Maybe it's my personality.  I have gotten more prescriptions that I've chosen NOT to use in my life than those I've gone along with - and no regrets at this point - but each one gets considered individually.

 

I know you said to not give you advice, but being around doctors so much, I can tell you what works for the most effective patients:

...

 

I know this all seems ludicrous and shouldn't be this way, but it is what it is for now. The patients I see who follow the above steps get the most satisfaction from their doctors. I know my experience may be limited and may not apply in all situations. And I know you didn't ask for this. Maybe another reader can benefit from my observations.

 

Actually, that was pretty useful - not that I'm planning to start doing it, but it gives me insight into how he's likely thinking.  This is a deal where we don't know what it is.  I've had the impression for a bit now that he's locking onto key words and ignoring anything else, but the key words he's locking onto aren't the only issue involved (I think).

 

I really dislike medical intervention in general - prefer the body fixing itself - so when something is off I pretty much always give it time to fix itself.  This could be a real problem if something like meningitis came up, but for most things, it works well.  By the time I'm in seeing someone over an issue "I'm" convinced it's a problem and it's not something easy that google would have helped me correct.  I've tried those already.

 

My track record is pretty good at being right - just without the knowledge to be specific enough to know what the actual issue is.  Thinking back there's been bronchitis, pneumonia (probably let this one go too long), pregnancies ;) , the brain tumor (could argue I let this one go too long too, but hey, we at least had a good idea it wasn't malignant!), carpal tunnel, and now ???

 

This doctor is stuck on the basics - the usual problems.  It will surprise me if the answer lies there, but he's pretty convinced he's right and won't listen to my "but I've tried..."  We'll see - though his plan is to not have another look at anything until Sept.

 

Incidentally, with the carpal deal I started with him too and never got far.  I ended up getting the referral that led to that one being diagnosed from another path.  I could use that path again in June if I change my mind about totally conceding.  I'll see how I feel in June.  I didn't start seeing him until after the brain tumor part when I was TOLD I needed a PCP.  I think I was better off without one personally.  At this point I'm thinking he keeps his position on paper (since I NEED one), but I'll only go see him if there's a "usual" problem I can't fix.

 

Anything else I'll have to brainstorm.

 

I know you're not looking for advice but....

 

I would at least try the PAs, especially if one has a good reputation and the overall office does as well. I have found they are more likely to listen, and less likely to think they know everything, than docs. Especially specialists.

 

Hmm, will keep this in mind I guess.  The other possible route is to head more along the natural lines and skip the MD route.

 

The easiest solution is for him to just be right and problem solved.  I'm really skeptical about it though.  There's no way I'd place money on it.

 

I'm not sure what it says about me but when I read you post I thought "Oh, poor Creekland's son." instead of "Oh, poor Creekland." :)

 

 

Remember my normal personality... quite a bit of what I write has a sarcastic sense to it.  Middle son and I have a great relationship.  My "training" him along these lines is pretty akin to my "tier" (if you read that thread) needing to be one where we locked them in their rooms and only let them out once per day to do chores.

 

I'm actually wishing we had graduated him after 4th grade so he could be finished with med school by now.  Then I could just turn to him for advice and referrals.

 

Instead, he's planning on taking a 5th year (free) with undergrad so he can study African development... delaying my best medical option by yet another year.  Kids these days!  (We're proud of him for getting accepted into that 5th year free bit.)

[Tsuga]

I. Hate. That. So. Much.

 

In terms of "problems that directly affect me" that is pretty high on my list and I am so sorry you are facing it.

 

It's why I go to nurse practitioners and not doctors whenever possible. I get smirks but you know what? You can have all the knowledge in the WORLD about averages but if you don't listen or if you don't believe me, then you don't know ANYTHING about me. But if you think you do know--because people are cogs and you're like a car mechanic for humans--then it's even more dangerous.

 

I am very sorry you cannot find a nurse practitioner in your area. I have only had one even moderate experience with an NP (this is with a doctorate of nursing). Doctors are 50/50 if that. I have heard PAs are a bit better than doctors.

 

There is nothing worse than someone who thinks they know everything but who doesn't listen. It's pretty dangerous.

[Debbi in Texas]

I prefer Nurse Practioners as well.

[creekland]

You can have all the knowledge in the WORLD about averages but if you don't listen or if you don't believe me, then you don't know ANYTHING about me. 

 

This is what I think gets to me the most.  I fully get that I can be wrong in my thoughts - esp since I'm not well-versed in the subject (even letting middle son do anatomy as a self taught course).  

 

My dentist will say something to the effect of "that's what most people think, but this is what's really going on causing what you're feeling."

 

Our vet will do similarly.

 

They listen to things (they've probably heard several times) and explain them in a reasonable manner.  AND, if I say, "but..." they listen to that too and either address that or adjust their thinking based upon it.

 

With this doc I kind of wonder if he's even truly listening.  I've repeated things - just in case - but nothing different happens.

 

I am NOT used to that.  It doesn't happen in my classrooms.  It doesn't happen with my IRL friends.  When it happens with hubby it causes our (fortunately rare) fights.

 

Or if he's listening, he's not believing which boggles my mind even more, but could be the case.  The last specialist he sent me to see (not related to this) asked me what was affected from the brain tumor.  I told him (vision).  He told me it sure didn't look like I had a problem with it.  How, exactly, does one respond to that?  "OK then.  I guess my mind is making it up?"  Considering the brain tumor was found from the vision problem when I went to an eye doctor to see what could be done, I'm just glad HE didn't take a quick look and dismiss it.  He actually assumed I was being truthful and forwarded it on to a specialist who pegged the problem in one visit (and an MRI).

 

I didn't realize just how rare that was.   :glare:  But the two of them are the two who are in my "awesome docs" category.  This issue just isn't related, so I can hardly count on them.

 

I'm also not about to bow down and beg to be heard/believed.  Doctor appts are enough of a stress (for me) without the frustration level of that added on.  That which doesn't kill you only makes you stronger - and hubby and I have joked that if it does kill me it could make it easier for them to see there was a problem.   ;)

[Katy]

I hate doctors for those very reasons.

[creekland]

I hate doctors for those very reasons.

 

Ok, I gotta clarify this sentence.  I haven't actually met a "doctor" I hate.  I extremely dislike "doctor appts."  When the ends justify the means, I deal with the latter.  When that's continually (or often) dubious, it gets really stressful.  I've reached the point where I'm eliminating that stress.

 

Thinking over the doctors I've dealt with in medical situations, I can only think of one who might not be that interesting in a social context (like on an airplane or at a social gathering). That one is not my PCP.  He's actually a nice enough guy.  It's what goes on in appts with him that is frustrating.

 

The four I've solely met by sitting next to them on airplanes have been quite interesting and would easily fit into my social group if we lived closer.  They live in Md and Va though.  (We fly into Baltimore.)  One works at NIH.  Two work in a heart center they own (though they, themselves, are either retired or mostly retired now).  The last is a private practice urologist.  He was actually seriously thinking about homeschooling his 5th grader.  I invited him to join the Hive - not sure if he has though.  If so,  :seeya: .

 

 

I do not like vagueness and secrecy, either. Earlier this yr, two doctors recommended a supplement to aid in my milk production.

 

...

 

Later I find out they believe in the product and now sell it. So then I left thinking well how should I feel? And how much research has been done on it? The version I would have bought I think is the more pure form of it. I bought nothing.

 

Do not feel this is an age thing. I always hesitate to take things, same for dh.

 

Wow, this is wrong on so many levels.  It would be worth more than a vent.

 

It'd be troublesome not to find out much info online.  I trust google to help me find pros and cons about pretty much everything.

[Katy]

Yes, doctor appointments is what I meant too.  I don't actually hate anyone.

[Bluegoat]

Some doctors really are much better at administration and communications than others.  It's really annoying when they are not good at those things, but I find sometimes it can help stave of anger when I think about it in those terms - this person is not necessarily lacking knowledge or skills but is just bad at running an office, say.  I can sympathize with that as i am less than organized as well.  The question then I guess is does the doctor have other good qualities that make up for these problems, and can you do anything to minmize them.  For example, getting early in the morning appointments which might be less rushed, or making sure you make a point to ask a lot of questions about things.

[Bluegoat]

Also - there is a kind of doctor who pretty much operates according to a sort of flow-chart methodology.  Like the mechanics at the car dealerships.  They just go through the procedure, and don't really think about anything, so what you say isn't that important to them.  It's a very mechanistic approach.

 

They are likely to be pretty poor doctors in other ways as well.

[Reefgazer]

Ugh, bummer. Two questions: 1) Is there some reason you don't want to see a PA and would rather see if physician? Some PAs are quite good, and 2). How the heck did they perform tests on you without your signature or approval ? But I'm with you on one thing....listening skills is one thing many doctors are deficient in.

[creekland]

Oh sorry for the confusion. The first product is not being sold by my drs as far as I know. The second product (sold under more than one name) is being sold by an LC that seemed to think it had been useful to other moms. But I just do not know how to find much info on any herbal supplements. Mainly my concern is effects on baby.

 

Well, I'd rather there be confusion than what I thought you had said.  Confusion is a little bit better.  I'm definitely with you in not caring to take anything without knowing a fair amount of info on it.

 

The question then I guess is does the doctor have other good qualities that make up for these problems, and can you do anything to minmize them.  For example, getting early in the morning appointments which might be less rushed, or making sure you make a point to ask a lot of questions about things.

 

 

Also - there is a kind of doctor who pretty much operates according to a sort of flow-chart methodology.  Like the mechanics at the car dealerships.  They just go through the procedure, and don't really think about anything, so what you say isn't that important to them.  It's a very mechanistic approach.

 

They are likely to be pretty poor doctors in other ways as well.

 

I don't know which category to put him in.  I don't have a ton of experience.

 

IF I care to admit a couple of things... I could have called to clear up the confusion, albeit I didn't realize there was confusion until after I had started the meds.  And he did say to call the office if the meds hadn't worked in 5 days.  It's not like he's totally dropping things if I care to keep following through.

 

I just think we could have skipped this part considering what I've already tested and some of the things going on that just don't fit his conclusion - OR - I'd like reasons (in English since I failed the mind reading course) why it's good not to.

 

At this point though, I'm thinking June will give me more time to assess a couple more things going on - and finish the school year freeing up more time.

 

And some of the side effects from this med are rather annoying (sigh) with no benefits seen yet, but since it's only day 2 of 5, that's probably to be expected.

 

It's also possible it's not side effects.  I was bathed in pollen, dust, and pony fur out working today.  I'm not normally allergic to any of it, but there was so much, it's possible my body is overloaded - esp from the pollen as that level was far higher than normal (trimming cedar trees loaded with the stuff).

 

Ugh, bummer. Two questions: 1) Is there some reason you don't want to see a PA and would rather see if physician? Some PAs are quite good, and 2). How the heck did they perform tests on you without your signature or approval ? But I'm with you on one thing....listening skills is one thing many doctors are deficient in.

 

1)  The belief that med school conveys more knowledge than PA school.  I don't mind PAs for basic things (antibiotics for infections, etc).

 

2)  They put one in with (blood) tests I agreed to and signed for (added after my signature).  The other was done at the same time as another test I'd given a verbal ok to.  In both cases I only found out about the extras when I got the bills in.  It still surprises me that this is legal to do.  The latter one I paid for yesterday adding a straw to the camel's back causing the whole vent.  But such is life.  It actually wouldn't bug me so much if they were things that made sense to do, but seriously, there was absolutely nothing amiss with the one blood test reading from couple of weeks prior to the one they added (exact same test) and there was no reason at all for the other test.  Together they cost about $175.   :glare:

[Tsuga]

Doctors have more theoretical knowledge by my issue is that they don't/won't listen. So they can't apply the knowledge. I feel cheated. It's like going to the best restaurant in the world but they don't have a menu and then you get what you get and you pay what you pay and that's it. They know better. But what if you wanted risotto and they serve you the world's best sweet potatoes?

 

How is that worth it?!?!?

 

I don't care how good or smart or knowledgeable you are. This is not the MCAT and I am not a sample lab question.

 

You have to LISTEN to me.

 

And it is NOT my job to speak your medical language.

 

News flash: You work in human services. Communication is part of your job. If you don't like it, go into surgery, the ICU, or become a scientist.

 

I pay a LOT for medical care. We all do. Part of that is to share and to insurance but docs get paid. Earn that money. I repeat, this is not the MCAT or the boards. I have a whole life you know nothing about, there are questions you were not taught to ask. Listen to me.

 

Oh, and doc? If I don't trust you, you can't treat me. And I don't trust people who don't listen.

[foxbridgeacademy]

I understand, I'm currently going through a situation right now with my health and the Doctor is so uncommunicative she won't give me a straight answer or even tell me what tests she's running.  She thinks she knows best and I should just shut up and do what I've been told.... no, she didn't say it specifically but she is obviously frustrated by my questions.   As soon as I get this current issue under control I'm so switching Drs.  Not that it really helps, It's been a few years since I had one that actually listened to me.

[creekland]

She thinks she knows best and I should just shut up and do what I've been told....

 

I have never been good at doing what I'm told just because someone said it.  It doesn't matter what the situation is.

 

Unfortunately with this issue I'm not going to know if the meds worked or not.  This deal has been sort of cyclical on its own - slowly getting worse, getting bad, then mysteriously getting suddenly better (for a couple of days anyway).  I've yet to figure out a common denominator for any of it (sigh).  I've only figured out the cycle - and even the exact number of days in the cycle aren't predictable.

 

So it figures that yesterday was the bad day in a 100% normal type of cycle.  That puts today and potentially the next couple of days as good days even if I hadn't used meds.

 

This makes it impossible to know if it was the natural cycle or the meds... unless for some reason it starts on its getting worse stage tomorrow for some reason.  There have gradually been getting more bad days than good ones, so who knows?

 

I'm just going to have to play with it a bit more between now and June to see if I can figure out any common denominator things at all.  It's sure easier than trying to have the doctor figure it out.

 

Each time it gets better I really wish it would just STAY that way.  Maybe someday it will.  Like... this time perhaps.

 

[Reflections]

I'm sorry, creekland.  I've btdt so many times, I have a whole closet of t shirts.  And I no longer fight, either. As a matter of fact, you might say I have a mini panic attack if I have to see an older male doctor - I've been burned so many times.   One thing that has worked better for me, though, is to see a female nurse practitioner.  An older female nurse practitioner.  Some who has seen a lot and isn't afraid to trust her patients.  

 

Good luck with your gardening.  I have nothing but dirt right now.  Really. No grass at all.  I think I might buy a container just to put something green in it and put it somewhere where I can see it.  Like a Hosta. They're really hard to kill.

[creekland]

I'm sorry, creekland.  I've btdt so many times, I have a whole closet of t shirts.  And I no longer fight, either. As a matter of fact, you might say I have a mini panic attack if I have to see an older male doctor - I've been burned so many times.   One thing that has worked better for me, though, is to see a female nurse practitioner.  An older female nurse practitioner.  Some who has seen a lot and isn't afraid to trust her patients.  

 

Good luck with your gardening.  I have nothing but dirt right now.  Really. No grass at all.  I think I might buy a container just to put something green in it and put it somewhere where I can see it.  Like a Hosta. They're really hard to kill.

 

Sorry you've had so much experience with it.  I'm relatively new to the problem, so I guess that's fortunate.

 

The oldest doctor I had (and male) was the guy who was so good at figuring out what my eye/vision problem was.  He was old enough that he was partially retired and most people his age would be fully retired (or in the next world).  My guess is a ton of experience of seeing all sorts of things was used for my benefit.

 

Everything is green here (though trees are just coming along).  You're welcome to come visit and smell the Hyacinths.  We have Hostas coming up too.  This is my favorite season - a "good to be alive" (and outside) season.  But a cold front is coming through... still though... it's better than it was a month ago when we didn't even have highs as high as this "cold" front is bringing now.

[HSmomof2]

I know you said to not give you advice, but being around doctors so much, I can tell you what works for the most effective patients:

 

1. Never go to the office with more than one complaint.

a. Have it in writing on a notebook sheet.

b. Underneath write how long you've had it, is it getting better or worse, what makes it better or worse that you've already tried, a list of tests you've already had and results to help diagnose said complaint, and other pertinent information for that one complaint.

2. Have a list of your symptoms which you feel are related to the one complaint.

3. Never chit chat. It is your dollar so do not waste it.

4. Have your questions already written out on a piece of paper.

5. Your questions should include:

a. What tests are needed to help diagnose my one complaint.

b. What drugs or stuff, if any, may be tried in the meantime to see if it helps. (Trying things first, even if they don't work, may help with the diagnosis.)

6. Never forget your doctor has 15 minutes for you and 7 of those minutes are used up in insurance and government charting. So you have 8 minutes in front of the doctor. Your time is precious and should not be wasted.

7. If you do not get done everything you need in 8 minutes, then make another appointment.

 

I know this all seems ludicrous and shouldn't be this way, but it is what it is for now. The patients I see who follow the above steps get the most satisfaction from their doctors. I know my experience may be limited and may not apply in all situations. And I know you didn't ask for this. Maybe another reader can benefit from my observations.

ITA^^. I'm sorry you have a dr that isn't listening to you. It is very frustrating, and even more so when there's no one else to switch to. However, you may want to try one of the PA's---I've found them to be pretty good, and generally better listeners and more thorough than many doctors.

[Garga]

I like my PA. We haven't had serious medical issues though,so I don't know what she would be like if we did. I wonder if a PA would see someone for such serious issues as you have (brain tumor.) Aren't tricky cases supposed to be referred to an MD who has had the extra years of schooling? PAs have 6 years total, I think; not the 50 years MDs have.

 

The PA that I go to is in my town (you know my town--we met there) and we always seem to have pleeeenty of time to talk. I never, ever feel rushed during my appointments. I don't have a lot of experience with doctors, but she is the first one (other than my midwives) that I haven't had some sort of inexplicable problem with. She's been very reasonable and helpful for the minor issues we've had.

 

Edited: After I wrote the above 2 paragraphs, I wrote about a PA that I think has your doctor's bedside manner, but the internet is public and I don't want to bad mouth someone. So, I deleted what I wrote. Bottom line: sometimes PAs are just as bad as the doctor you're going to.

[Tsuga]

One thing that has worked better for me, though, is to see a female nurse practitioner.  An older female nurse practitioner.  Some who has seen a lot and isn't afraid to trust her patients.  

 

:hurray:

[Reflections]

You're welcome to come visit and smell the Hyacinths.  We have Hostas coming up too.  This is my favorite season - a "good to be alive" (and outside) season.  But a cold front is coming through... still though... it's better than it was a month ago when we didn't even have highs as high as this "cold" front is bringing now.

 

Temptress!   :lol:

[creekland]

I like my PA. We haven't had serious medical issues though,so I don't know what she would be like if we did. I wonder if a PA would see someone for such serious issues as you have (brain tumor.) Aren't tricky cases supposed to be referred to an MD who has had the extra years of schooling? PAs have 6 years total, I think; not the 50 years MDs have.

 

The PA that I go to is in my town (you know my town--we met there) and we always seem to have pleeeenty of time to talk. I never, ever feel rushed during my appointments. I don't have a lot of experience with doctors, but she is the first one (other than my midwives) that I haven't had some sort of inexplicable problem with. She's been very reasonable and helpful for the minor issues we've had.

 

Edited: After I wrote the above 2 paragraphs, I wrote about a PA that I think has your doctor's bedside manner, but the internet is public and I don't want to bad mouth someone. So, I deleted what I wrote. Bottom line: sometimes PAs are just as bad as the doctor you're going to.

 

I don't know that my particular brain tumor is all that tricky.  It actually seems to be one of the easiest things I've had to deal with - assuming it doesn't grow.  The side effects down the road from radiation might be issues - hence why there are things on schedule to be checked.  This is what they told me I needed a PCP for (and if things go wrong with that - he deals with them more or less).

 

I changed practices to his due to a PA at the other place I went.  Every single time we'd go there for basic things we got "the spiel" about everything we needed to be doing and not in a nice, informative way, but in a far more sharp authoritarian way.  It didn't matter if we were there for a tick bite or pneumonia, etc.  Hubby and I used to joke about it.  That was fine when we were only there once in a blue moon, but if I had to see someone regularly it wasn't appealing and definitely doesn't fit my personality.  The one plus with my current guy is he's not pushy in that manner.  He does mention things occasionally (I expect that since it's his job), but accepts when I decline rather than arguing/pushing.

 

I suppose everyone has their pros and cons (all of us humans).  It's part of being human.

 

I think I've also figured out how to make this trial/test work.  I can't use his "5 day" test due to the natural cycle bit, but assuming his plan was to finish the 10 days worth of meds he sent me home with if it was better by the 5th day, I'll definitely know by then if the cycle is restarting.  I never have that many good days in a row - not even close.  I actually suspect I can consider it to have failed now as there've already been twinges, but more days will assure me it's not all in my mind.  Today could be a reasonable test.  The job I think I'll have at school has me mostly sitting.  Sitting (being still) is rarely good. Standing/walking is the best.  Most days at school I'm standing (teaching).  Today - if nothing changes - I'm not.  It could be a reasonable test.  Time will tell.

 

This thread has actually been worthwhile for more than a vent.  I never knew so many people liked PAs or NPs for primary care.  Few I know IRL go to them for anything except Urgent Care stuff (antibiotics, flu, sprains, etc).  It could be worth considering between now and June.

 

The Hive is full of info I didn't realize was there.

[J-rap]

Sorry about all of that!  I have found, regarding the prescription, that sometimes a pharmacist -- maybe even your local pharmacist whom you've gotten to know and trust -- can be more helpful navigating meds than the doctor. 

 

Once, when one of my children was very young and going through medical tests at a university hospital, she was given a prescription for about 6 months.  It didn't help, so the doctor took her off of it.  Years later, I heard on the news that this very medication had never been approved for children, only adults.  And that several children on it had actually died while taking it.  I don't understand how the doctor would not have known that, or if she had, why she didn't tell me up front that it was experimental for children...

[creekland]

Sorry about all of that!  I have found, regarding the prescription, that sometimes a pharmacist -- maybe even your local pharmacist whom you've gotten to know and trust -- can be more helpful navigating meds than the doctor. 

 

Once, when one of my children was very young and going through medical tests at a university hospital, she was given a prescription for about 6 months.  It didn't help, so the doctor took her off of it.  Years later, I heard on the news that this very medication had never been approved for children, only adults.  And that several children on it had actually died while taking it.  I don't understand how the doctor would not have known that, or if she had, why she didn't tell me up front that it was experimental for children...

 

No pharmacist involved at this point.  These are all samples my PCP gave me in person for testing it.  Since he didn't give any other instructions with it, I'm assuming I'm supposed to take it according to the directions on the box - even if those directions were difficult to find compared to most meds.  I only found out about the other option while doing deeper research on it after starting it normally.

 

I'd have been super livid in your situation.  Super, super livid.  Glad your daughter did ok.