Handling In-Laws

[MrsWeasley]

My five year old doesn't like his paternal grandfather. Every once in a while, he'll call his grandfather stupid behind his back, but I admonish him when he does, so it's rare, but I know this dislike is always there. My husband really wants him to have a closer relationship with his father, but my middle child's personality just clashes with his grandfather's. For example, today he got a chess set in his Easter basket. He still hasn't learned how to make all his pieces move, but his grandfather, a chess puzzle enthusiast, invites him to play with him, no handicap, and then beats him in four moves. My five year old flips out, and his grandfather gets frustrated with his bad sportsmanship. Should my five year old throw a fit about losing? No. But, honestly, I think that was pretty mean of my FIL, and he does stuff like this a lot. I talked to my husband about it, and he talks about his fond memories of the challenge of trying to beat his father at chess and how it shows my son what can be done. I can see how that might have been the intention of my FIL, but that's certainly not how my son experienced it. Any advice on how to handle a competitive FIL and a sensitive son?

[Joanne]

I don't have advice. I do have an opinion. My opinion is I'd protect my son, and allow him to have his feelings. The behavior on the part of grandpa is not a match, developmentally, for a 5 year old. Your husband can't have it both ways: a close relationship between his son and Dad and still defend his Dad's actions. You can't *force* a child to like someone they inutitively don't. The responsibility for relationship is on the adults responding, changing, accomodating, not the child.

 

You can expect and demand courtesy - and I would. But force relationship? I would never do that to a child.

[eternalsummer]

Yes, there is a difference between respect and a relationship.  You can insist on one, but the other is either natural or it is not.

[Arcadia]

I would expect a 5 year old to flip out if anyone beat him in five moves. I can understand your husband to have fond memories of beating his dad at chess but does he expect his 5 year old son to win his dad? It is emotionally crushing and it is not like your son is being groomed to be a world chess champion from a tender age.

[Anne in CA]

Your dh and his dad are not thinking what is developmentally appropriate for a 5yo. My dh himself had too high of an expectation of my son's behavior when he was 4-7 and he always expected too much. I had to be quite tough to dh a few times, because he couldn't be allowed to treat ds unreasonably. They grew to have a wonderful relationship, but it took time. Ds really wanted to make dh happy, but dh had a hard time being happy with normal 5yo boy behavior.

[Barb_]

Do you actively dislike your FIL? Could your son be picking up on your feelings toward him? I'm not discounting his role in the tension at all, but sometimes we fail to realize how much a child picks up on subtext. This could potentially creat a problem between you and your husband, so I thought I'd throw it out there just in case.

[gardenmom5]

My five year old doesn't like his paternal grandfather. Every once in a while, he'll call his grandfather stupid behind his back, but I admonish him when he does, so it's rare, but I know this dislike is always there. My husband really wants him to have a closer relationship with his father, but my middle child's personality just clashes with his grandfather's. For example, today he got a chess set in his Easter basket. He still hasn't learned how to make all his pieces move, but his grandfather, a chess puzzle enthusiast, invites him to play with him, no handicap, and then beats him in four moves. My five year old flips out, and his grandfather gets frustrated with his bad sportsmanship. Should my five year old throw a fit about losing? No. But, honestly, I think that was pretty mean of my FIL, and he does stuff like this a lot. I talked to my husband about it, and he talks about his fond memories of the challenge of trying to beat his father at chess and how it shows my son what can be done. I can see how that might have been the intention of my FIL, but that's certainly not how my son experienced it. Any advice on how to handle a competitive FIL and a sensitive son?

 

must make grandpa feel so good to beat a 5yo in four moves. . . . .   he is doing everything WRONG for getting closer to his grandson.   (and he's so mature - not, he'll probably blame the five year old for their lack of relationship.) and potentially destroying any chance of a future relationship.

 

if grandpa wants to play chess with him - he needs to actually TEACH him. talk to him about WHY a piece is moved where it is moved.  not just how the pieces move, but thinking ahead and strategizing. figuring out what your opponent is doing next.  I don't have the bookmarks - but there are online chess sites for kids to learn at their own pace.

if grandpa is that competitive that he would do that to a five year old, make chess off limits with him.  have him play five year old games that are more chance than strategy.  like - chutes and ladders or don't break the ice.

 

- and I agree with everything Joanne has said.  protect your child.

 

eta: dh was ranked in college.  there's a quote by some world class chess champion (I don't remember which) that he repeats.  the champ was asked what attracted him to chess . . . "when the opponents ego starts to crack . . . "  I will say it - your fil is feeding HIS OWN EGO, not trying to build a relationship with his grandson.

[kiwik]

I wonder if father in law didn't have much to do with your husband until he was an older child.

[Pegs]

Oh, how upsetting. :(

 

I play chess with my 5yo. He finds the games challenging, and has never won, but we playing teaching games, and he is excited to be learning new tactics and improving at problem-solving through tricky situations. It's definitely possible to challenge a young child at chess without breaking their spirit! And I say this as the parent of a very sensitive kid.

 

If FIL wants to play with his grandson, might he accept a suggestion to play friendly, teaching games? There are so many, if you google. I like the sound of a variation where the child is allowed to rotate the board once they start getting in trouble, so that the adult and the child have effectively traded sides.

 

Mini games would be good for this stage, too, as 5yo is still learning how the pieces move. My DS calls this their "abilities". There are mini games designed to help new players become familiar with each piece's abilities. They are nice and quick, so would be good for kids who might not have the stamina for a full game. I've recently been reading up on teaching children chess (I'm no good at the game, myself, and DS may soon surpass me). I'll go and start a spin off thread, with links to what I've found so far.

 

And checkers! A bright kid can match an adult in checkers after a bit of practice, IME.

[Mama Geek]

Umm what 5 yr old can play chess? I am sure there is some percentage out there but that does not seem reasonable to ask of the average 5 yr old. I would have probably discouraged the game. I would probably be proactive and avoid those situations before they happen. I do not care if it makes me look overbearing. I think it is absurd the way your FIL acted, but I will give some benefit of the doubt and say maybe he is just out of touch. I think challenges do not have to be part of developmentally inappropriate tasks. Challenge can exist in better situations.

 

An unfair situation is an unfair situation. I am not sure that your child is necessarily sensitive and would try to avoid language that suggests such ("you're over sensitive") if that is applicable. I have been called over sensitive my whole life and even if it is true it isn't particularly helpful to hear repeatedly.

 

Dd turns 5 in June, dh is teaching her how each chess piece moves.  It has only taken about 2 weeks.  They work on it about an hour at a time and she is really enjoying learning.  I figure that in the next week that she will play a full game of chess.  

 

Dh is teacher her though not just trying to beat her in 5 moves, although he might do that as a teaching moment at least once sometime in the future.

[Mama Geek]

Dd is an only and I stay home with her.  We have no TV and she watches a movie maybe once a week as a treat.  She has a long attention span, and towards the end of an hour you can tell she is done.  There are several things that she will do for that long ranging from modeling clay to building puzzles, to being read to.  Dh is someone who can stay very focused on things for a long time especially if he isn't interrupted.

[FO4UR]

Does fil also kick puppies?

 

And, no, I'm not being sarcastic.  If this is a pattern of behavior, I'd seriously limit contact.

 

 

It's not natural behavior for a loving grandpa to annihilate a 5yo.  I have a competitive, game-playing family and the standing rule is that you let your opponent learn the game well before an even match is possible.  The goal for the first several rounds (first several years for a young child) is to teach the game. 

[Garga]

I highly doubt that when your DH was 5 he was happily trying to beat his dad at chess. I'll bet his mother protected him from his father who obviously has NO CLUE about 5 year old children and sportsmanship, until he was a preteen or teen. Ask him how old he was in the memories he has of trying to beat his dad at chess.

 

Your dh and fil are being unreasonable. Protect your son as best you can from ridiculous situations.

[MrsWeasley]

Do you actively dislike your FIL? Could your son be picking up on your feelings toward him? I'm not discounting his role in the tension at all, but sometimes we fail to realize how much a child picks up on subtext. This could potentially creat a problem between you and your husband, so I thought I'd throw it out there just in case.

 

I'm not sure what "actively disliking" someone is, but while I get along with my FIL most of the time, i really dislike my MIL, which is definitely a problem between my husband and me. Obviously I don't say anything, but I guess it's possible he picks up on that and transfer it to his grandfather.

[Chris in VA]

I can see a grandpa doing this ONLY if he was going to continue after the game and say something like, "Now, let's look at what just happened!" with a big, friendly smile and warm kindness, and then goes thru the moves, maybe, and begins to teach.

Is there the tiniest possibility that your fil might have done this if your son hadn't reacted so strongly?

[MrsWeasley]

Umm what 5 yr old can play chess? I am sure there is some percentage out there but that does not seem reasonable to ask of the average 5 yr old. I would have probably discouraged the game. I would probably be proactive and avoid those situations before they happen. I do not care if it makes me look overbearing. I think it is absurd the way your FIL acted, but I will give some benefit of the doubt and say maybe he is just out of touch. I think challenges do not have to be part of developmentally inappropriate tasks. Challenge can exist in better situations.

 

An unfair situation is an unfair situation. I am not sure that your child is necessarily sensitive and would try to avoid language that suggests such ("you're over sensitive") if that is applicable. I have been called over sensitive my whole life and even if it is true it isn't particularly helpful to hear repeatedly.

 

I don't tell him that he's sensitive, and I think there's a difference between "You're over-sensitive" comments, which are dismissive, and calling a child sensitive.

[LazyDazy]

My five year old doesn't like his paternal grandfather. Every once in a while, he'll call his grandfather stupid behind his back, but I admonish him when he does, so it's rare, but I know this dislike is always there. My husband really wants him to have a closer relationship with his father, but my middle child's personality just clashes with his grandfather's. For example, today he got a chess set in his Easter basket. He still hasn't learned how to make all his pieces move, but his grandfather, a chess puzzle enthusiast, invites him to play with him, no handicap, and then beats him in four moves. My five year old flips out, and his grandfather gets frustrated with his bad sportsmanship. Should my five year old throw a fit about losing? No. But, honestly, I think that was pretty mean of my FIL, and he does stuff like this a lot. I talked to my husband about it, and he talks about his fond memories of the challenge of trying to beat his father at chess and how it shows my son what can be done. I can see how that might have been the intention of my FIL, but that's certainly not how my son experienced it. Any advice on how to handle a competitive FIL and a sensitive son?

We have a similar issue with one grandparent who "rubs my son the wrong way", all the time. He has a point, she is not an easy person to deal with. He in particular has a hard time with her because of the differences in their personalities. It has been an ongoing issue since my son was young.

 

We validate his feelings and explain that we can't change the way Grandma behaves toward him (we've tried). However, we can give him time away when he is getting frustrated with her by redirecting him to a different activity in another part of the house or outside. We reassure him that it's natural not to like everyone, even family. He hasn't done anything wrong by not connecting with her. It sure would be nice if the adult in the situation could bend/give a little to come closer to the child but, that doesn't seem to be a skill she possesses. We verbalize that to him. He finds her (a little) easier to deal with knowing that we all see what he sees, we understand where he is coming from, and we are always on his side.

 

I'm sorry your son has to deal with this.

[MrsWeasley]

must make grandpa feel so good to beat a 5yo in four moves. . . . .   he is doing everything WRONG for getting closer to his grandson.   (and he's so mature - not, he'll probably blame the five year old for their lack of relationship.) and potentially destroying any chance of a future relationship.

 

if grandpa wants to play chess with him - he needs to actually TEACH him. talk to him about WHY a piece is moved where it is moved.  not just how the pieces move, but thinking ahead and strategizing. figuring out what your opponent is doing next.  I don't have the bookmarks - but there are online chess sites for kids to learn at their own pace.

if grandpa is that competitive that he would do that to a five year old, make chess off limits with him.  have him play five year old games that are more chance than strategy.  like - chutes and ladders or don't break the ice.

 

- and I agree with everything Joanne has said.  protect your child.

 

eta: dh was ranked in college.  there's a quote by some world class chess champion (I don't remember which) that he repeats.  the champ was asked what attracted him to chess . . . "when the opponents ego starts to crack . . . "  I will say it - your fil is feeding HIS OWN EGO, not trying to build a relationship with his grandson.

 

I have to say I find that quote kind of disturbing!

 

My in-laws already blame my over-bearing nature (not making kids sleep over before they are ready, insisting that the dog be locked away when we come over after the dog bit her and now she's terrified of it, etc...) on their less-than-close relationship. I rather it be me than him, but it's hard on our marriage.

[MrsWeasley]

oops, double post

[MrsWeasley]

I wonder if father in law didn't have much to do with your husband until he was an older child.

He was a using alcoholic until my husband was a pre-teen. My husband doesn't have negative memories of this at all, which I guess is kind of in-line with my husband not having negative memories of his father trouncing him at chess. I think my husband in general takes a very rosy view of people.

[MrsWeasley]

 

Oh, how upsetting.  :(

I play chess with my 5yo. He finds the games challenging, and has never won, but we playing teaching games, and he is excited to be learning new tactics and improving at problem-solving through tricky situations. It's definitely possible to challenge a young child at chess without breaking their spirit! And I say this as the parent of a very sensitive kid.

If FIL wants to play with his grandson, might he accept a suggestion to play friendly, teaching games? There are so many, if you google. I like the sound of a variation where the child is allowed to rotate the board once they start getting in trouble, so that the adult and the child have effectively traded sides.

Mini games would be good for this stage, too, as 5yo is still learning how the pieces move. My DS calls this their "abilities". There are mini games designed to help new players become familiar with each piece's abilities. They are nice and quick, so would be good for kids who might not have the stamina for a full game. I've recently been reading up on teaching children chess (I'm no good at the game, myself, and DS may soon surpass me). I'll go and start a spin off thread, with links to what I've found so far.

And checkers! A bright kid can match an adult in checkers after a bit of practice, IME.

 

 

 

I'd love resources on teaching chess to kids! And getting a few checkers pieces sounds like a good idea, too.

[MrsWeasley]

 

Does fil also kick puppies?

 

And, no, I'm not being sarcastic.  If this is a pattern of behavior, I'd seriously limit contact.

 

 

It's not natural behavior for a loving grandpa to annihilate a 5yo.  I have a competitive, game-playing family and the standing rule is that you let your opponent learn the game well before an even match is possible.  The goal for the first several rounds (first several years for a young child) is to teach the game. 

 

 

Even if your husband wasn't on board? I've suggested repeatedly that we do things like go to the movies, the symphony, plays, etc... with my in-laws instead of things like the park or just hanging out at the house, since my FIL likes to turn everything into a competition, but my husband thinks that the kids need to learn to spend time with his parents in a variety of contexts.

[MrsWeasley]

 

I can see a grandpa doing this ONLY if he was going to continue after the game and say something like, "Now, let's look at what just happened!" with a big, friendly smile and warm kindness, and then goes thru the moves, maybe, and begins to teach.

Is there the tiniest possibility that your fil might have done this if your son hadn't reacted so strongly?

 

 

Maybe, and that's part of the reason I think it might be a personality clash.

[J-rap]

I think you need to step in and protect your son.  The behavior of your FIL is strange, and is only adding to your son's dislike and discomfort.  If your FIL brings out the chess game again, you or your husband should say no, that's not a good idea (try and do it politely, of course.).  You can give your FIL the benefit of the doubt and try explaining why, if you want.  Then, maybe you can suggest an activity everyone can do together instead -- a walk in a park, a game that everyone enjoys and can play together, etc.

 

And, I think you should affirm your son's feelings.  He's probably feeling frustrated and uncomfortable and even mad, but isn't mature enough to understand exactly why.  You can explain to him that your FIL really isn't a bad person (of course if he is, then don't say that), but that he doesn't know how to play with children.

 

Your son probably isn't ready to be in situations that make him feel this way and are out of his control.  I think your husband needs to be your son's buddy when you're all together for family events, and sometimes even take time off during those events to do something special with him so that those events aren't totally boring -- something that still fits into the day's events but feels special for your son.  They can always invite others to join in.  Maybe your FIL can even learn something through observation!

 

If your FIL is generally a good person, I'd try and keep up a positive relationship with him (between you and your husband and him, that is), while protecting your child, but only do family things together, not son-FIL activities.  Not yet.  Maybe when your child is older, middle school aged, he and his FIL will have a better chance to connect.

 

Anyway, my two cents.  :)

 

[momacacia]

I talked DH through something similar with chess and oldest. DH would not want to lose on purpose--fine--that's tacky. But, I suggested to DH that he play both sides of the board, teaching dd what her next move could/ should be. This both teaches her chess at a higher level (she loves the game) and allows her to win through her own moves (if she accepts his advice) on occasion. Now , my DH is a reasonable individual and has no need to hammer a 10yo in chess. He brought up the issue to me. Whether your FIL is open to such a suggestion, is another matter.

[MrsWeasley]

I think you need to step in and protect your son.  The behavior of your FIL is strange, and is only adding to your son's dislike and discomfort.  If your FIL brings out the chess game again, you or your husband should say no, that's not a good idea (try and do it politely, of course.).  You can give your FIL the benefit of the doubt and try explaining why, if you want.  Then, maybe you can suggest an activity everyone can do together instead -- a walk in a park, a game that everyone enjoys and can play together, etc.

 

And, I think you should affirm your son's feelings.  He's probably feeling frustrated and uncomfortable and even mad, but isn't mature enough to understand exactly why.  You can explain to him that your FIL really isn't a bad person (of course if he is, then don't say that), but that he doesn't know how to play with children.

 

Your son probably isn't ready to be in situations that make him feel this way and are out of his control.  I think your husband needs to be your son's buddy when you're all together for family events, and sometimes even take time off during those events to do something special with him so that those events aren't totally boring -- something that still fits into the day's events but feels special for your son.  They can always invite others to join in.  Maybe your FIL can even learn something through observation!

 

If your FIL is generally a good person, I'd try and keep up a positive relationship with him (between you and your husband and him, that is), while protecting your child, but only do family things together, not son-FIL activities.  Not yet.  Maybe when your child is older, middle school aged, he and his FIL will have a better chance to connect.

 

Anyway, my two cents.  :)

 

I don't think my FIL is a bad person, just flawed like all of us, and I have hopes that as my middle child matures, his grandfather's competitive streak will bother him less. 

 

I love the buddy idea, but I'm sure my husband wouldn't. We've had a lot of conversations about how I need help parenting at family gatherings. He likes showing his kids off at family gatherings and always wants us to come, but he also really wants to catch up with extended family and would prefer when we saw his family if I did all the childcare to facilitate that. I've encouraged a lot of different ways for him to stay in touch with extended family, but we haven't found something that works for him. I often think why my son so often butts heads with my FIL is because often my FIL inadvertently becomes his buddy. My MIL only had boys, and my eldest is her only granddaughter, so she likes to monopolize her. I have a potty training, nursing toddler who takes a lot of my attention, so as much attention as I try to give my middle child a lot of attention at a large family gathering, he definitely sort of gets "lost" the most, if that makes sense. And I appreciate that my FIL sees that and tries to engage him. It's just very unfortunate that my son doesn't get along with him.

[zoobie]

Do you have No Stress Chess? It's great for teaching the game. It's been a while since I played it (I loathe chess), but I don't think there's a win/lose competitive aspect to it. Pull that out when Grandpa comes. I wouldn't force him to play chess at all with Grandpa at all, but that game might help the kid play with Dad and not hate it entirely.

[gardenmom5]

 

 

 

 

Even if your husband wasn't on board? I've suggested repeatedly that we do things like go to the movies, the symphony, plays, etc... with my in-laws instead of things like the park or just hanging out at the house, since my FIL likes to turn everything into a competition, but my husband thinks that the kids need to learn to spend time with his parents in a variety of contexts.

 

 

I wondered about this. this type of competition is based in biblically defined pride (-  I've once heard described the heart of pride is "enmity towards others and/or God".  worth reading the various definitions).   you are just now starting to see how this can be a problem.  it's going to get worse - unless your fil learns some humility and how to actually love others this will continue to be a major problem.  (don't bother saying how he loves his grandson - he's engaging in ego-destroying competition with a five year old.)

 

your dh's inability to remember anything from his childhood, neither his father's drinking episodes or being trounced in chess,  is disturbing to me.  (it's possible because fil was drinking - he didn't feel the need to destroy his son in chess and wasn't this ruthless with him.)

my mother remembered little from her childhood.  her mother was a piece of work of the very subtle kind and she blocked it all out.

 

if my dh wasn't on board - we'd be having many contentious discussions.  but I would also control my children's exposure. 

 

eta: there are different types of competition - the need to destroy your opponent is not  healthy. I was specifically referring to that one.

[zoobie]

I wondered about this. this type of competition is based in biblically defined pride (- I've once heard described the heart of pride is "enmity towards others and/or God". worth reading the various definitions). you are just now starting to see how this can be a problem. it's going to get worse - unless your fil learns some humility and how to actually love others this will continue to be a major problem. (don't bother saying how he loves his grandson - he's engaging in ego-destroying competition with a five year old.)

 

your dh's inability to remember anything from his childhood, neither his father's drinking episodes or being trounced in chess, is disturbing to me. (it's possible because fil was drinking - he didn't feel the need to destroy his son in chess and wasn't this ruthless with him.)

my mother remembered little from her childhood. her mother was a piece of work of the very subtle kind.

 

if my dh wasn't on board - we'd be having many contentious discussions. but I would also control my children's exposure.

I don't have an opinion on the biblical context :) , but I wanted to agree with the rest. Has DH ever spoken with anyone re: childhood with an alcoholic father? I think there's more to this than him taking a "rosy" view of people. He's not giving you and DS the same treatment. Maybe he's still trying to please his father at all costs? Very hard situation. :grouphug:

[Anne in CA]

Okay, now I understand the family dynamic. Covering for dad is more important than being fair to others. That is the way your dh was raised. This was part of my problem with my family too. My dh and my oldest dd had accepted the family dynamic that you cover for dysfunctional people rather than live a healthy life with reasonable standards of expected behaviour. This can be overcome, but it's hard.

[gardenmom5]

He was a using alcoholic until my husband was a pre-teen. My husband doesn't have negative memories of this at all, which I guess is kind of in-line with my husband not having negative memories of his father trouncing him at chess. I think my husband in general takes a very rosy view of people.

 

have you done much reading on the behavior patterns of children of alcoholics?  your dh sounds like he may have been the "go along to get along" personality of dealing with his father.

[gardenmom5]

I tried for years to have my children have a relationship with my narcissistic mil because everyone told me that the conflicts were because of me. 

Yes, we're to honor our parents, but not to the point where it's destroying our kids. Don't do what I did--let abuse (and what g'pa did WAS abuse) go on and on. Your child needs to know that HE comes first. 

 

 

I got that too *EVERYTHING* wrong in the relationship was me - only it was my grandmother who had the personality disorder.  (her father was an alcoholic)

when I learned about npd (and the mind games in alcoholic families) it was incredibly liberating.  it. wasn't. me.

 

 

eta: honoring our parents =/= allowing them to abuse us, or especially young children.  quite the opposite - preventing them from abusing their grandchildren IS honoring them.

Margaret - don't beat yourself up.  I was 13 when I figured out she was a major hypocrite.   I still had to reach a certain level of emotional health before I could really start erecting boundaries with the woman. I got flak from the rest of my family (especially my brother because so much of his self-image was tied up in her feedback to him.) for not worshipping at her feet, even after she died.

[MBM]

Grandpa is far too advanced for the game to be a fair match but it's interesting to watch little kids grow up and beat those adults later. It happened with my son and his uncle and now my son has to give his uncle more time to make it fair. 

 

My youngest is a chess player and is going to the high school nationals this weekend actually. Off the top of my head some good resources to help learn and develop the game are Fritz and Chesster and Chessmaster. Later, when your son understands how the pieces move and basic strategies, he can go online and play against others who are similarly ranked. Then he can surprise Grandpa if he so desires.

 

Chess can be an infuriating game. Keep that in mind if your son continues. It is as much psychological as logical.

 

[8circles]

I figured it out finally, and cut off all contact with mil. I hadn't seen her for 6 months when she passed away. Dh wanted me to take the kids to see her, and I said no. I got a lot of abuse from folks in town, but funny thing--several years before she died, people would stop me on the street and ask what was going on. Was mil always like this? Had they just not seen it? Gosh, she seems to have changed.

 

Trust me. She hadn't changed. She just wasn't very good at hiding it any more. We were at sil's one day, and ds heard the car cross the cattle guard. He excused himself from talking to his uncle and ran out of the room. Uncle: What was THAT all about? Me: He's afraid of her--she pinches him when no one is looking. Uncle: That's never happened to my ds. Me: Nope. Yours is practically perfect in every way because you don't stand up to mil. I do. Later on, I got distracted and heard a yell--mil had cornered ds with her wheelchair. Uncle: I've never seen that--wow! Me: Yeah, she isn't as good at hiding it as she used to be.

 

This was the woman who wouldn't allow ds to attend his grandfather's funeral. I've apologized to my kids. We've all moved on. The kids can laugh now at the horrible photo on the front of mil's last book. It's SO obvious that they had been forced to stand there. I often wonder WHAT her editor was thinking? Who would want that photo used???? Mil's funeral was pretty funny--sil confronted dd about "setting up behind the organ so no one would hear her play". Yeah, sil left, dd set up where she had planned, and the organist gave her a thumbs-up. One of the BEST things I ever did in my life was to say, "If mil moves in with us, her "counseling" crazy pedophiles isn't happening here." There are crazy people in the world--unfortunately, we're related to some of them. 

holy cow, marg!  what kinds of books did your mil write???

[Lara in Colo]

I own this book-- I haven't used it but it looks good

 

http://www.amazon.com/Kids-Book-Chess-Set/dp/0894807676/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1428341533&sr=1-1&keywords=the+kids%27+book+of+chess

 

review:

 

This magnificent and visually stimulating chess set contains a 96-page beautifully illustrated book, chess pieces and a custom chess board.
The book begins with a fascinating, detailed description of the history of the game and how it derived from medieval times. It is incredibly detailed and exquisitely written. Although I am not particularly a fan of medieval or military history, I found this section to be most engaging, and it certainly helped deepen my love and appreciation for the game. A basic example -- We learn that in medieval times the pawns were the serfs, the poor laborers, the foot soldiers and as in any society there were usually more of them than anyone else. If we were to imagine them in real life they would be traveling on foot and "carrying a long spear called a pike. On the battlefield he was known as a pikeman. Pikemen also carried shields, which they held directly in front of them for protection. This meant that they had to point their pikes to either side of the shield. Similarly, because of his shield, a Chess pawn is unable to strike directly in front of him. He can attack only on the diagonal." When presented with details in this manner you come away with a better understanding of why certain rules exist in the game.

[HS Mom in NC]

Grampa has serious issues:

 

1. Chess is not an age/developmentally appropriate game for the vast majority of 5 year olds.  Any chess enthusiast and person who has had or been around kids should know that. Most children need more abstract thinking abilities which means growing up a bit more first.

 

2. Children don't learn to play chess (or other more complex games) by being beaten every time in 4 moves. Children learn by being taught carefully and systematically or by lots of observation. 

 

My husband and two of my daughters play lots of complex strategic board games. Generally speaking, he plays transparently by making cards visible and explaining what he's doing and why he's doing it each step of his turn.  Then he talks them through their options and best use of their cards that are visible each step of the way.  He tells them which options are best and why.  After they've done that several times so the kids are able to articulate those things fairly well, they play for real.  He doesn't play with a handicap or let them win just because they're so cute and he's their dad, but it's not usually long before they can hold their own with him and win sometimes.  It's meaningful because they know he didn't hand it to them AND he spent time teaching them to be successful.  It's a reasonable and balanced approached, unlike Grampa's.

When it comes to chess specifically, there are some nice children's books teaching chess that break down moves more individually and visually for the children before playing a complete game. A reasonable person (not Grampa) talking a child through some of those games when they're ready to use all the pieces together can help.  That means the person is talking about their own moves and strategy and then talking to the child about their own options and which are better and why. That's what a child needs if the goal really is to teach him how to play chess and how to like it. I have to say, I'm not sure that's Grampa's goal because nothing Grampa is doing is moving toward that goal.

 

[hornblower]

I'd suspect your dh is romanticizing his childhood & viewing it through Norman Rockwell glasses. I think your FIL is being a jerk & I'd tell him to knock it off.

[Shelly in IL]

Totally off topic, but can a child that has blocked memories ever get them back? I'm 48, and basically can't remember my childhood. My parent fought a lot and there was a lot of strife with siblings. I would like to remember though. Joann?

[MBM]

Totally off topic, but can a child that has blocked memories ever get them back? I'm 48, and basically can't remember my childhood. My parent fought a lot and there was a lot of strife with siblings. I would like to remember though. Joann?

 

Yes, you might be able to get them back. What I've read about the process of retrieving repressed memories involves using psychoanalysis.

 

If you want to read a fascinating real-life case of a patient who was helped in retrieving his memories, get Norman Doidge's book The Brain that Changes Itself and read the 9th chapter about Mr. L. It's a touching story about how in his 50s and 60s, Mr. L went to see Doidge to help him understand why he had problems with women and depression. With Doidge's help, he was able to retrieve and put together the repressed memories of his childhood as far back as when he was about two, about the time Mr. L's mother died. Eventually, he was able to recall his memories as a toddler of his mother playing piano as well as later being held up so he could see his dead mother in her coffin. Relatives confirmed what he remembered. It's really interesting especially the neurological explanations of what is believed to be happening that causes memories to form or not.

[Anne in CA]

Be careful of retrieved memories. I'm on my Kindle now, but later I could tell a horror story of some phony memories that a hypnotist helped a family friend retrieve.

[Jyhwkmama]

Your FIL acted like an ass, but your real problem is with your husband. Seriously. His failure to listen to your concerns about his family, help you at family gatherings, or work with you on a change of venue are really big issues. Stand up for yourself and consider getting some counseling.

[Tammyla]

 BOUNDARIES, by Cloud & Townsend  read the book if you haven't already.  Your in-laws sound toxic... :grouphug:

[Lisbeth]

 

 

 

Even if your husband wasn't on board? I've suggested repeatedly that we do things like go to the movies, the symphony, plays, etc... with my in-laws instead of things like the park or just hanging out at the house, since my FIL likes to turn everything into a competition, but my husband thinks that the kids need to learn to spend time with his parents in a variety of contexts.

Um, yes. I would protect my kids first. My husband would just have to deal.

[FO4UR]

Believe it or not, "Christian counseling" books.  :lol:  Including one on answering children's questions about why a grandparent died! Like I said, she was really good at covering for a really long time... 

 

 

I have to know titles.  I'm checking my shelves.  PM me please if you don't want to post publicly. 

[MomatHWTK]

I think a lot of times parents assume their children will have their personality.  Maybe DH really did enjoy the challenge.  He sounds locked into ideas that aren't working for your family though.  If you want to change that, you will need to go slowly.  Talk about the personality differences you see in all your children and the positives of each.  Expose him to day to day information about how those personalities work that don't involve his parents.  (i.e. "Oh it's so cute, DS1 will do X without a peep but it drives DS2 crazy, DS3 on the other hand dosn't even know why either of them cares!"  Help DH see each child's strengths and that will encourage him to want to protect those strengths. 

 

Maybe someone can give you a book idea for tips on gently connecting father to son and then you can work toward getting dad on board with protecting son. Seeing one's parents as "the bad guy" is a hard painful process.  I can tell you from experience it sometimes results in one's parent never speaking to one again.  :(  You do need to protect your children, but if you can get DH on board it will be so much easier for all of you.