Hikin' Mama Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 http://nypost.com/2014/01/04/tiger-mom-some-groups-are-just-better-than-others/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itsheresomewhere Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 Is her 15 minutes of fame up yet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrincessMommy Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 I saw that yesterday and don't know what to make of it. On the face of it from the news story it sounds pretty bad. However, I dislike making that kind of judgement without reading the book or listening to her first and seeing WHY she thinks this. What's her data to back her *theory* up? Anyway, it's not the type of book I'd be inclined to read normally, so I think I'll just have to wait until she's interviewed somewhere like NPR or BookTV. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SunnyDays Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 Bless her heart. :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrincessMommy Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 Damn, I guess I don't make the cut. LOL - me either. I'm just a lazy sloth and I have my family heritage to prove it! ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DawnM Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 Oh my word, I read Lebanese as "Lesbians." I thought, "Well, I didn't know lesbian moms were so tiger. I learned something new." :laugh: Yeah, she is a piece of work and would not be my friend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DawnM Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 I am Irish, what's your excuse? LOL - me either. I'm just a lazy sloth and I have my family heritage to prove it! ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dandelion Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 While the title of the linked article is pretty incendiary, the actual title of her new book isn't. Her book could very well just be an analysis of the cultural backgrounds of various immigrant groups, without claiming those groups are somehow superior. The article has a definite negative bias (doesn't read like an objective review), so I'd want to read the book myself before rushing to judgment. I'm not a fan of Amy Chua's, but I'd rather come to my own conclusion than take an obviously slanted article at face value. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hikin' Mama Posted January 6, 2014 Author Share Posted January 6, 2014 I read her Tiger Mother book and disagreed with her parenting philosophy. There is nothing wrong with encouraging one's kids to reach their full potential, but I think she goes too far. JMO. My middle son did call me Tiger Mother a time or two when he was applying for colleges last year and I made him re-do essays, because I didn't feel that they were the best he could do. I was right, of course, and he re-did them. :) I would like to read her new book, because it sounds interesting to me. I don't fall into any of the cultural or religious groups that are listed in the article, but I think there may be a little truth to what she is saying. I'd like to see if she has any research to back up her claims. I am soooo thankful I didn't have a mom like her, even if it means I'm less successful than I could have been. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SproutMamaK Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 So basically she's saying that people who HAVE to work to overcome obstacles WILL work to overcome them and thus improve their lives. Then she slaps some "cultural" (racial) labels on specific groups to generate some publicity and make it seem like a sensational conclusion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crimson Wife Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 Well, it *DOES* play into the stereotype that the Chinese are horribly racist (which is a gross overgeneralization but apparently holds a kernel of truth within it). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dandelion Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 Oh and I'm a descendant of German, Irish, and Swedish immigrants. None of which made her list. ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8circles Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 Any group that collectively believes they are inherently better than any other, say the authors, has an advantage. They do not note that this is perhaps humanity’s oldest and ugliest flaw, the bottom-line cause of wars and genocide. In their estimation, it’s not nearly common enough in America… I don't know if their portrayal is fair, but if it is, I find it quite repulsive. I have no inclination to read the books, but I'd love to hear from someone who has to see if it really is what articles like this say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrincessMommy Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 I am Irish, what's your excuse? Dutch... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8circles Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 I would like to read her new book, because it sounds interesting to me. I don't fall into any of the cultural or religious groups that are listed in the article, but I think there may be a little truth to what she is saying. I'd like to see if she has any research to back up her claims. I am soooo thankful I didn't have a mom like her, even if it means I'm less successful than I could have been. I am partly from one of the apparently superior groups. My parents were in many ways Tiger-parents. It completely backfired on me & I frankly think they are cruel manipulators. I think they failed simply because they used these Tiger-parent techniques - even if they had "worked" in the sense of making me more materially successful. It "worked" for my sister but she feels the same way about them as I do. That isn't successful parenting. There may be truth to what she is saying but I just can't get behind the main focus of parenthood being to make your child as successful as possible; kindness, goodness be damned. That's what it seems to be for them. I haven't read the whole Tiger Mother book but several excerpts. I found it emotionally difficult to get through so I won't be reading the whole thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flowing Brook Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 Maybe if everyone ignores her she will go away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LibraryLover Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 I hope the book is not as divisive as the article makes it seem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slartibartfast Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 Don't feed the trolls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DawnM Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 :hurray: Dutch... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DawnM Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 Well, I think that can be said of any group, esp. when they have one as verbose as this woman. Since a large majority of my friends are Chinese, I am not going to say they are racist. Oh, and my son is Chinese too. Although, a funny about my son….I have no idea where he picked up on this stereotype, but one day he was mad about having to do math. He stuck his hands on his hips and proclaimed, "I don't care if I am Chinese, I HATE MATH!!!!!!!!!" It was the funniest thing. Well, it *DOES* play into the stereotype that the Chinese are horribly racist (which is a gross overgeneralization but apparently holds a kernel of truth within it). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LibraryLover Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 I wonder why she skipped over South Koreans in America? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeacefulChaos Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 Ok, I'll put on my flame retardant suit…. I actually like her. :leaving: :D I thought the Tiger Mom book was good. There were things in it that made me lol. Seriously. I think she gets a lot of negative press and a bad rap, and there are a lot of people who don't agree with her - which is fine, everyone is entitled to think what they want. I'm not saying I agree with everything she says. But Idk… I just like her. I'd like to read the book or original whatever that the article references. The writers obviously dislike her, so there is a definite negative slant to it. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MFG Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 Dutch... If you ain't Dutch, you ain't much... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dandelion Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 I just read the book description on Amazon and a few other reviews. Based on those, this book sounds more like a scholarly analysis of cultural attributes that contribute to success, than an argument that some cultures are superior to others. Given her Tiger Mother book, it's clear that Amy Chua thinks Chinese parents are superior parents. So I wouldn't be surprised if there's an element of that in this book. But based on some of the more balanced reviews out there, I think this book is probably less divisive/inflammatory than the article linked in the OP would make it seem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idnib Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 And what of black Jews? Black Mormons? Chinese Catholics? Indian Muslims? etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HS Mom in NC Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 The article seems to want to distill this down in overly simplistic terms. Cultural values that feed success (a term defined by each user) sometimes match up with significant chunks of a people group and sometimes they don't. People groups are influenced by cultural norms and religious/philosophical views. Different groups define success differently. We know that in America some subsets of people groups value academics more than others. They tend to have children who perform better academically. Some live more structured lives conducive to academic and professional success and that results in higher rates of academically and professionally accomplished children. None of this is new. PS teachers have been banging their heads against walls for years wondering how to change family culture/values in the poorest performing students in America. Changing the values of people who are apathetic to academics is really hard, no matter how many books and articles are written about it-such is the nature of apathy. There are different ways to motivate children. This woman presents one set of options. Discussing others is a useful conversation. Defining success is another meaningful topic. So is a discussion about what different aspects there are to parenting and the different ways parents can choose to fulfill them. So, she's no big deal one way or the other. She's just another opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Susan in TN Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 If you ain't Dutch, you ain't much... There you go - you're getting the hang of it! :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean in Newcastle Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 I wonder why she skipped over South Koreans in America? She skipped the Japanese too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiramisu Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 I guess there's no hope for us. Oh well. I'll go tell the kids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unsinkable Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 I'm glad you linked the article because there was a really *interesting* article linked on the page about a girl with a nice derrière who is an Instagram sensation because of her assets. Fascinating stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belacqua Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 I'm glad you linked the article because there was a really *interesting* article linked on the page about a girl with a nice derrière who is an Instagram sensation because of her assets. Fascinating stuff. One wonders what Tiger Mom would think of that girl's parents. Ah, well. I'm not a member of any of the ethnicities or religions she names, so I guess my kid is plumb out of luck. Sorry, son. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catwoman Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 Dutch... Well I guess that explains it, then. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catwoman Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 I'm glad you linked the article because there was a really *interesting* article linked on the page about a girl with a nice derrière who is an Instagram sensation because of her assets. Fascinating stuff. We can always count on you to weed through the drivel and get to the really important stuff. :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloridaLisa Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 Marketing gold: write a book slightly better than tabloid, have the publicist arrange inflammatory article about book, collect royalties. Lisa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catwoman Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 Personally, I think Tiger Mom is a cold, calculating, unpleasant control freak who wanted her children to be incredibly successful so she could have bragging rights. I would neither want a mother like her, nor want to be a mother like her. My son's happiness is more important than any academic achievement or impressive musical performance. Sure, I want him to be successful, but I also want to be a mom that he loves and trusts, and that he knows will love him no matter how successful or unsuccessful he becomes. And I feel good knowing that he has had a happy childhood, free from the kinds of excessive pressure to achieve that Tiger Mom seems to have insisted upon with her kids. She may think her methods are the only way to ensure that a child will be motivated and successful, but I have an entire family of very successful people who would argue otherwise, and I'm sure that many other people here can provide plenty of their own examples, as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El... Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 I read her first book, and by the end of it I thought she was trying to decide if she'd done the right thing. She seemed introspective, evaluating herself and not sure she was right in her parenting approach. It was a lot less self-righteous than its reviews made it sound; in fact, I wonder if some of the reviewers finished the book. I don't think a person COULD parent the way she described without a true mean streak and having been raised to think mean was OK. I'm not going to be reading her next one. I frankly don't care enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unsinkable Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 She may think her methods are the only way to ensure that a child will be motivated and successful, but I have an entire family of very successful people who would argue otherwise, and I'm sure that many other people here can provide plenty of their own examples, as well. I agree. I feel like if I am kind, loving, serving, cherishing my kids then I will have kind, loving , serving, cherishing kids and adults. How is being harsh and vicious going to teach kids softness and sweetness? My DD had her nurses ( she was the only one with 2 nurses) in tears in the recovery room because every thing they did for her, she tried to say thank you. They told me over and over what a good, sweet, grateful young woman she is, even when she was in so much pain and so drugged, she kept saying thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LucyStoner Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 Yawn. Say something provocative, sell books. I need to find me some more provocative things to say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catwoman Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 Yawn. Say something provocative, sell books. I need to find me some more provocative things to say. Me, too. Let's make some stuff up and sells millions of books. :hurray: Maybe we'll even get a tacky reality show on TLC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wonderchica Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 I had a few Facebook friends in one of these groups very excitedly posting about this book, and saying very seriously how they knew this all along. Maybe she's on to something! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrincessMommy Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 Personally, I think Tiger Mom is a cold, calculating, unpleasant control freak who wanted her children to be incredibly successful so she could have bragging rights. I would neither want a mother like her, nor want to be a mother like her. My son's happiness is more important than any academic achievement or impressive musical performance. Sure, I want him to be successful, but I also want to be a mom that he loves and trusts, and that he knows will love him no matter how successful or unsuccessful he becomes. And I feel good knowing that he has had a happy childhood, free from the kinds of excessive pressure to achieve that Tiger Mom seems to have insisted upon with her kids. She may think her methods are the only way to ensure that a child will be motivated and successful, but I have an entire family of very successful people who would argue otherwise, and I'm sure that many other people here can provide plenty of their own examples, as well. This brings me to another thought. How is she calculating success? And what is success? Is it only getting into certain colleges? Having certain careers? What about the career mom who gives it all up to raise her kids - is she a failure? What about the career parent who didn't give it up for the family and is estranged from them all because he/she was married to the job? Are they a success anyway? For some families just getting INTO college is a major family first. And for other families just staying away from drugs & alcohol and having a happy marriage is a success. "success" seems like such an arbitrary gauge because many people's definition of success will be different. I don't think some of them are easily measured either (family happiness for instance). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catwoman Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 I had a few Facebook friends in one of these groups very excitedly posting about this book, and saying very seriously how they knew this all along. Maybe she's on to something! Yeah, she's "on to" the fact that polarizing and controversial topics and opinions can make her a lot of money and get her lots of publicity. :glare: I will find it very distressing if her assertions end up pitting parents against each other based on their nationality and/or religion. I have to hope that most people will be far more open-minded than Tiger Mom appears to be, and that they'll realize that there's a lot more to "success" than she realizes.,, and many, many ways to achieve it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catwoman Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 I hope Amy Chua has to rely on the kindness of strangers one day, and gains a new appreciation for qualities other than wealth and status. Yeah, but then she will write a book about how people of certain nationalities and religions are always more generous and helpful than others. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean in Newcastle Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 She seems to have the superiority complex part of her "triple package" down. I don't see much insecurity, though. I think she's doomed for failure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hikin' Mama Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 I'm glad you linked the article because there was a really *interesting* article linked on the page about a girl with a nice derrière who is an Instagram sensation because of her assets. Fascinating stuff. Bummer. (Ha ha) I missed that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unsinkable Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 Bummer. (Ha ha) I missed that! Good one! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hikin' Mama Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 Oh and I'm a descendant of German, Irish, and Swedish immigrants. None of which made her list. ;-) Mostly German here, too. Not sure what other little bits my mutt self is made of. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catwoman Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 Mostly German here, too. Not sure what other little bits my mutt self is made of. :) It's probably just as well you don't know, because Tiger Mom probably wouldn't approve. Unless it turns out that you're part Chinese, because then Tiger Mom might find you at least somewhat worthy. :rolleyes: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DianeW88 Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 Huh...I'm one of the chosen. So get out of the way of my giant superiority complex, everybody. Or is it my inferiority complex? Which one am I supposed to have? :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trish Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 She skipped the Japanese too. Wars have been fought over less. And there's some dispute out there over islands.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.