Rambling about MIL and Grandparents in Law

[Outinthegarden]

Warning - this is long :D I just needed a safe place to vent and I've been reading/lurking here for several years but just officially signed in and started to post. Figured I couldn't lurk forever! :)

 

My husband’s grandparents moved in with us from another state in the middle of June. Grandfather is 90, has no kidney function, been on dialysis for 2 years now and is starting to display dementia/Alzheimer’s. (They say it comes with being on dialysis and your kidneys not working) The only reason the grandfather has not passed on and is on dialysis at this time is because when he fell ill, as in almost died, she LIED to him and told him that he would only have to be on dialysis for a few months and then we would be fine! :angry: The grandfather would have never agreed to what he has had to endure for the past two years!

 

The Grandmother is 84 and has been in a wheelchair pretty much full time since April, and is in complete denial that her husband is sick and most likely going to die sooner than later.- hence the reason they moved from their home of 60 years - she can no longer take care of him and their house could not accommodate a wheelchair. Two of their neighbors were carring her in the wheelchair up and down 4 large steps when she had to go out! Prior to her not being able to walk much they were adamant that they would NEVER leave Oklahoma and their home. They have no family there - my husband is an only child of an only child.

 

Which brings me to his mother who hates my guts and who hasn't seen or spoken to my husband and I in 7 years - or her own parents in 12 years. She has also moved here!! (her hating my guts is really an understatement - thanks to you ladies and a post made a week or so ago, I've learned that she is a Narcissus) This is the woman who told me the last time she saw me that if she could kill me and get away with it she would and that I should just wait, my kids will grow up to hate me for homeschooling them.:eek:

 

My MIL has been here for about 10 days and in addition to the dialysis 3 days a week, ALL the doctors’ appointments, fixing food (anyone that knows about dialysis knows I am cooking constantly) making sure that the grandparents don't fall, trying to get the grandmother to bath more than once a week, doing laundry and attempting to start school I now have to deal with the MIL’s angry attitude towards me and her playing the victim/guilt trip on her son, ie he should be at her beck and call. Fortunately, my dh is wise to her, doesn't go for this anymore and just ignores her.

 

She claims she came here so that she could see her parents before they die - REALLY!! When we notified her two years ago when he almost died her comment was: "I don't care what happens to those people" and she hung up on me! She has shirked her duty as far as I'm concerned. These are HER parents - they are just our Grandparents - she should be the one taking care of them. And she should have moved from Washington to Oklahoma 2 years ago when he almost died and was put on dialysis! She is single, retired and has nothing to do all day. I have four children, a husband who owns a business, and I homeschool.

 

For the record, my husband and I think she is only here since at one time she was the beneficiary on their wills and she would get a very large sum of money. Unbeknownst to her, there is no longer any sum of money, except funeral money, thanks to medical expenses and I guess just life, and she is no longer listed on their wills at all! We are guessing that when this comes to light she will most likely take off to some other state never to be heard from again.

 

We have had to give up: horseback riding lessons, fencing, debate, … and pretty much going ANY where or doing ANY thing as they can't be left alone. Couple that with the fact that they have to eat at X time for lunch and X time for dinner it just seems like I no longer own my life, and everything, including my children’s lives revolves around the “great-grandparentsâ€.

 

I have not displayed a bad attitude, so none of this would be evident to anyone, and really, I love them both dearly, this is just taking a toll on me and I'm sure sooner or later the novelty will wear off for the kids. Right now they love having their great grandparents here, however, over the weekend, questions started to come about when are we going to go back to fencing? Why aren't we preparing anything for debate?

 

I've started to question myself, my oldest ds is in 8th grade - is this really fair for him or the other children to cut all of their activities? What if they are both living come next year when he is high school – how will that play out? And then the questions of, what will we do with her (in a wheelchair) when he (her husband) dies? Does my husband move into “their†section of the house because she can’t be alone and can’t take care of herself? She weighs 200 lbs or so, I can't lift her up and neither can the children. Do we put her into an assisted living – which is why they moved here because they didn’t want to go into assisted living? Will she (grandmother) take that entire bottle of valium that she is holding onto after he dies? If she does, what repercussions will that have on my family? She has stated after he dies she doesn’t want to live and will do away with herself! Can I report any of this to her doctor? How would I explain that I know she has valium? What were we thinking when we moved them here?? Would it have been better to let them go into a home in Oklahoma? They have lived a full life – what about my children’s lives?:crying:

 

I feel awful asking these questions to myself and I don’t dare mention them to my husband – who is absolutely wonderful and I could tell anything to – but these are his grandparents and they practically raised him as his Mom left his dad when he was 5 and walked away from all family.

 

When I add the MIL into the mix I feel like I need duct tape as my head is going to explode!:banghead:

 

On Saturday I was told that I needed to schedule a pedicure for them as they need to have their nails trimmed etc. I felt like saying - are you kidding me!! I now have to take MY Saturday and sit for a few hours at a salon!!

 

I’m sure that I’m just over reacting and being selfish – but I just really needed a place to rant – and you ladies are always so gracious! Thanks for letting me let out some steam. I really tried to keep it concise, as there is really a lot more to rant about at this time! You all are the best!

 

I'm going to get a cup of coffee and try to :chillpill:! And if you read all of this - thank you again - you all are amazing!

[Impish]

First off:

 

WHY is MIL living w/you? She sounds perfectly capable of renting an apt near by. That would be the first thing to tackle, imo. I can't imagine having someone under my roof whose stated she'd be willing to kill me if she figured she could get away w/it!

 

2nd, can you get home care/respite? Talk to whatever Drs are involved, cite caregiver burn out, and see what they can do for you. This would enable you to get out of the house, do things w/your kids and dh, w/out having to worry about the gparents.

 

And, since MIL is living w/you right now, why can't you leave HER w/HER parents and do whatever needs doing?

 

Yes, I'd absolutely let gma's drs know about her suicidal comments,and find a way to make that bottle of Valium disappear. And, honestly, it doesn't sound like you can handle her escalating needs, so while she doesn't want to go into assisted living, it may be the safest option for everyone.

[Mama Geek]

:grouphug:

 

Your kids will learn a lot from your graciousness in taking care of the grandparents. Not doing some of their activities will not scar them for life. Taking care of and loving your family will make a huge impact on them.

[Harriet Vane]

Not selfish. Not overreacting.

 

All valid questions.

 

Do you have any help coming into your home? I don't know specifically how that stuff works, but have you investigated those options?

 

I think you should talk about these things with a geriatric social worker. Your local hospital or nursing home may be able to refer you to one. I found it wonderfully helpful at different stages with my grandmother. A geriatric social worker can help figure out the options and appropriate boundaries.

 

A family is a group, not an individual. Everyone has to make compromises, including the grandparents.

 

:grouphug:

[saraha]

I am so sorry you are having to deal with this. I just want to send you lots of strength!

A couple of thoughts- don't worry about the kids activities. What they are learning from you about how to take care of each other, graciousness, teamwork, patience, strength will affect them much more profoundly than classes. My husband's grandmother moved in with them when she started her downward spiral into alzheimers. He was young, and only remembers her in her "crazy" days, but he and his siblings are the most compassionate, close knit family. They even say it directly relates to having help take care of and watch the grandma. His older sister even babysat the grandma so his mom could have a break, since back then in their area, there was no geriatric care.

 

You might look into getting a homecare nurse. I am not familiar with how the insurance with this works, maybe someone can help you with that. Or maybe contacting Jobs and Family services can help hook you up with respite care so that you can get a break.

 

As for the rest of it, I can only give you hugs! You are being a tremendous role model for your children!

[FaithManor]

First off:

 

WHY is MIL living w/you? She sounds perfectly capable of renting an apt near by. That would be the first thing to tackle, imo. I can't imagine having someone under my roof whose stated she'd be willing to kill me if she figured she could get away w/it!

 

2nd, can you get home care/respite? Talk to whatever Drs are involved, cite caregiver burn out, and see what they can do for you. This would enable you to get out of the house, do things w/your kids and dh, w/out having to worry about the gparents.

 

And, since MIL is living w/you right now, why can't you leave HER w/HER parents and do whatever needs doing?

 

Yes, I'd absolutely let gma's drs know about her suicidal comments,and find a way to make that bottle of Valium disappear. And, honestly, it doesn't sound like you can handle her escalating needs, so while she doesn't want to go into assisted living, it may be the safest option for everyone.

 

 

 

I am agreeing with Imp! Kick MIL to the curb. Good gravy, that's just abusive to your family and the threat she made to you is actually legally actionable. That's not the kind of thing that ANYONE should ever say out loud no matter how angry they are and the fact that she did and wasn't later in any way apologetic is just a huge insight into her mental psyche. A woman like that, I don't care how closely related, would have ZERO contact with my children. Zero, zip, nada.

 

Once MIL is out of the picture, I think you should seriously consider assisted living or at the least finding out what their health insurance can provide for in-home care. Given his precariously health and her being wheelchair bound, you are probably entitled to so many visits per week from a nurses aide for bathing, nail trimming, dealing with all kinds of things like that and you may even be entitled to help with the transportation to and from medical appointments. In our area, there is a community bus with a chair-lift and a nurse's aide on board that insurance companies pay to pick up those that use walkers, wheelchairs, and motorized chairs.

 

You are VERY right to be concerned about your children. Medical advancements have made it so our elderly relatives live many, many more years as fragile individuals than happened in previous generations. It is in many cases, a wonderful thing because children actually have the chance to get to know their great-grandparents, but it also means we have serious intergenerational care issues that need to be ironed out. Previous generations did not often have a medically fragile person of advanced age living with them for long periods of time while still raising young ones. You would not be wrong to place them in assisted care or a nursing home.

 

Faith

[besroma]

Not selfish. Not overreacting.

 

All valid questions.

 

Do you have any help coming into your home? I don't know specifically how that stuff works, but have you investigated those options?

 

I think you should talk about these things with a geriatric social worker. Your local hospital or nursing home may be able to refer you to one. I found it wonderfully helpful at different stages with my grandmother. A geriatric social worker can help figure out the options and appropriate boundaries.

 

A family is a group, not an individual. Everyone has to make compromises, including the grandparents.

 

:grouphug:

 

:iagree: It sounds like you are handling this with a lot of grace. It is a wonderful thing that you are teaching your children about taking care of family.

 

Did MIL buy a house? Will she be able to leave town quickly once she learns about the will? It sounds like you will be able to handle it all much better if she were not in the picture.

 

Will the kids be able to return to their activities once you are able to take them again? Is there a family that could help you by taking them for you?

[Outinthegarden]

You ladies are fast!:D

 

I guess I should have stated this: MIL is not living with us. No way under God's green earth would that happen! :lol: She is staying in one of those extended stays about 45 minutes away. Oh the beauty of living in the country! And she is not permitted at the house without myself or dh here. And she is not permitted around the children without us as well.

 

As far as someone coming in - Home health care has started coming in to do a weekly finger stick - due to them both being on comaden, and her needing a monthly B shot. I was running somewhere everyday but the weekend. However, they (the grandparents) will not let them help with anything else. And we were told by Home Health care that at any time the patient (the grandparents) can tell them that they don't want them to come back and they have to abide by their wishes! Crazy, I thought!

 

I've expressed my concern about her not bathing - there is no reason as we have a complete wheel chair friendly ADA shower with no tub! They said there was nothing that they or I could do about it! Wow!

 

It is painfully obvious (at least to me) that we really didn't know the extent of what was required to take care of them, and they weren't very forthcoming with their true physical or mental condition.

 

What do we do now? There is no house for them to go back to - there is no other family but the MIL, who has already told us in the time she has been here that she does not want to deal with any of their physical issues. I'm just at a loss. I'm trying to look at it from the perspective of: what would I do if it were my grandparents? And to be honest - I really don't think I would have brought them here. I know, not the christian thing to say and how cruel, but I'm just trying to be honest. Sometimes that's very difficult. :blushing:

[LaxMom]

Not selfish. Not overreacting.

 

All valid questions.

 

Do you have any help coming into your home? I don't know specifically how that stuff works, but have you investigated those options?

 

I think you should talk about these things with a geriatric social worker. Your local hospital or nursing home may be able to refer you to one. I found it wonderfully helpful at different stages with my grandmother. A geriatric social worker can help figure out the options and appropriate boundaries.

 

A family is a group, not an individual. Everyone has to make compromises, including the grandparents.

 

:grouphug:

:iagree:

You need respite care, and help so you can actually take care of the rest of your obligations. There is no shame in that; it's perfectly reasonable.

 

When my (demented, otherwise healthy) grandmother moved in with my mother during the last few years of her life, my mother worked full time. The local Dept of Aging had people who would come and take my grandmother to appointments, the library, church. The church also had volunteers who would come and look in on her, play cards, go for a walk.

 

Call the agencies in your area and see what your options are so you can work out something that allows for everyone's needs to be attended.

 

As for your MIL, toss her. Seriously. Showing up to make demands and be critical is not acceptable. She can do that by email (which you will, of course, direct straight to the trash folder). If she's not helping with the load, she's adding to it. Not. Acceptable.

 

I do think kids learn a great many things while caring for elderly relatives. But their regularly scheduled lives do not need to stop and be replaced by living the life of an elderly couple. Teach them how to support others while being their own people.

 

:grouphug:

[Impish]

I'd say it's time to be blunt w/the gpa.

 

Either they allow home health care to help, incl respite for you, or assisted living needs to happen, that you simply cannot manage their care w/out help. Period.

 

While taking care of family is a noble thing, I do not believe that the rest of the family needs to sacrifice everything to do so. Kids have a right to their lives too, not just revolving around older relatives.

 

So, either gpa agree to accepting outside help, or it's time to start looking at placements.

[Outinthegarden]

It sounds like you are handling this with a lot of grace. It is a wonderful thing that you are teaching your children about taking care of family. Thank You - I appreciate your kindness!

 

Did MIL buy a house? Will she be able to leave town quickly once she learns about the will? It sounds like you will be able to handle it all much better if she were not in the picture. No, she is trying to find somewhere to rent - she doesn't want to be "tied" down.

 

Will the kids be able to return to their activities once you are able to take them again? Is there a family that could help you by taking them for you?Yes, they should be able to return after they both pass away. That's the only thing we can think of now, as the church we attend kindof looks at us as "backslidden" since we don't attend everytime the doors are open, our kids don't go to the christian school, and I don't participate in the Tuesday AM ladies soul winning, so we are pretty much black balled there.:glare:

 

Most of the ladies in the local homeschooling group go to this church and while they don't send their kids to the school they are involved in everthing else so the are exempt from being black balled. That in itself is another topic!:D

[LaxMom]

I'd say it's time to be blunt w/the gpa.

 

Either they allow home health care to help, incl respite for you, or assisted living needs to happen, that you simply cannot manage their care w/out help. Period.

 

While taking care of family is a noble thing, I do not believe that the rest of the family needs to sacrifice everything to do so. Kids have a right to their lives too, not just revolving around older relatives.

 

So, either gpa agree to accepting outside help, or it's time to start looking at placements.

 

Yup. That's pretty much it. You can't be all things to them. They can either allow helpers in, or live with full-time assistance.

[Jennifer3141]

Yup. That's pretty much it. You can't be all things to them. They can either allow helpers in, or live with full-time assistance.

 

 

:iagree:

 

Uh, yeah. I'm sorry but your first duty is to your children. And completely stopping their lives while you care for the half dead/dying is not acceptable. Either the grandparents accept outside care or they go the nursing home their health care policy will cover. End of story.

[Lang Syne Boardie]

Sometimes we think we are committed to being someone's forever solution and we start with great intentions, trying to make it work...but then we find we are serving a very different, very crucial role: We are the transition team.

 

Many elderly people who could never bear an assisted living facility are ready to choose that option after living with family for awhile. Going from their own home to a facility is too big a step. Breaking up that step by staying with children or grandchildren for awhile often makes it possible to eventually move to where they, and you, know they really should be. (Not because of the disruption to your family but because of the level of care needed.)

 

Can you start discussing a time frame with your dh? A time period to continue as you are, and a date to begin looking into other options?

 

We tend to take care of our own elderly in our family. But when you physically can't do the job, or the person needs more psychiatric or therapeutic help than a loving daughter or granddaughter can provide, that's what the professionals are there for. In our family, when we do have to move the loved one to assisted living or nursing home, we choose a facility the nearest to the most devoted younger relative. And then we commit to constant visits and oversight. We don't just drop them off and say, "Good luck!" We are still very involved in their care, but they are where they need to be.

 

I hope you are able to get to that point, and get some more support and help during this phase when they are under your roof and in your care.

 

Thank you for setting this good example for your children and for everyone who knows you. What you are doing is true womanly sacrifice and service, and may God bless you for it.

[Mama Anna]

First of all, :grouphug::grouphug:

 

I can speak to this a bit from the kids' side. My paternal grandmother moved in with us when I was about 5 or so and lived with us for about 3 years, I think. She was suffering from Parkinson's Disease (with the dementia element) and it was . . . interesting.

 

On the one hand, those are the only memories I have of her. I sometimes resent that, because I know she wasn't that paranoid/demented when she was raising my dad and yet it's hard for me to picture her in any other way. But she's the only grandparent I have more than one memory of, so that's good.

 

On the other hand, it was very hard on my mom. The care required was constant and more than Mom could really handle. She (my mother) later found out she'd had multiple small heart attacks during those years and was finally told by her doctor that either she or her mil would have to go to a rest home - the situation could not continue. That just about broke Mom's heart. She'd promised to care for Grandma and wanted to keep her word despite the difficulties. My parents put Grandma in a rest home nearby for about a year and then (due to the nature of the dementia) moved her down near where she grew up so that she was around childhood friends. At that point we could only see her for about 1 week a year which was difficult and guilt-inducing. But there wasn't anything else we could do, to the best of our knowledge.

 

Also, while Grandma was staying with us, we kids basically didn't have a mom. Meals were last-minute type things (regardless of my mom's scratch-cooking philosophies), extra-curricular activities didn't really happen unless the older kids could drive themselves, and a couple of my older brothers had problems at school that Mom just didn't have the time to figure out and deal with. The loss of extra-curricular activities didn't scar us but the loss of parental attention may have. My dad wasn't home too much due to work and Mom just couldn't do it all.

 

I don't have any professional advice, but would like to make a few suggestions based on my experience.

 

1. Things won't be like they were before. Everyone needs to be okay with that and just work for a new "normal." (Fewer/no activities, needing to leave someone at home all the time, or whatever.)

 

2. Be very up front with their doctors. If you're the caretaker, you have as much need to be in full communcation with their doctors as if they were pre-or grade-schoolers. (I would tell them about the Valium.)

 

3. Have a plan. At what point of care will your family no longer be able to handle things? What kind of assistance is available in your area or from insurance/Medicare/etc.? How and when will you take advantage of it? Meet with someone like the geriatric social worker mentioned by a pp.

 

4. More questions: How can you keep your nuclear family together through this? "Date" your kids? Where will hubby and kids fit in your priority list compared to grandparents? How can you make that work in daily life? Give a bit of thought to how things might look in 5 years if they're still with you. Don't dwell on it, but consider it. If you try to push through this assuming that it is a short-term thing and it goes long-term the consequences might be big.

 

5. Make sure you look for positive impacts this time can make - maybe encouraging "dates" between your grandparents and your kids or object lessons in compassion and sacrifice. Teach the kids how to take oral histories and help them appreciate first-hand knowledge of the world 6 or more decades ago - a world that really no longer exists. Take lots of pictures. Learn any skills they can still teach. Help them pass on their passions to the 3rd and 4th generations.

 

6. Make sure you have a support network - don't let your friendships slide during this season. Find a way to keep in relationships with others so you won't have to deal with feeling isolated yourself.

 

Um. That's more than a few suggestions, isn't it? Others on the board are likely to have much more professional advice - this is just from a been-there-seen-it-dealt-with person. I hope it helps!

 

:grouphug:

Mama Anna

[LostSurprise]

It sounds like you need to get your husband in on this and have a serious discussion with the grandparents.

 

The physical issues you mentioned (and raising kids AND homeschooling) are barely doable for one woman. I am serious. Add in dementia and I don't think you can handle it without making them your full time care (ie the kids would be in public school or daycare).

 

If it helps, call social services and ask for a care evaluation (they can help you figure out if this is too much for your family or where that line might be). See what other things they offer for people caring for loved ones in their homes. They have respite services (or can connect with volunteer organizations which do that). They have medical and legal paperwork. They have care classes. They have medical services.

 

I know you don't want to be the bad guy here, but they need a lot of care. If they aren't willing to allow some respite or other services by others, they need to understand that you can't care for them. Period. There needs to be a boundary. They have to accept that. Respite could mean you can go to some extras (debate, etc.) or just spend time with your children!

 

And there will come a time, maybe soon, that you can't handle it anymore (dementia can be hard, especially on top of other physical problems). You need to be ready for that day. There need to be good care options lined up, where you can visit and handle things for them when they live outside your home with full medical attention. It always works out better if you do the research ahead of time!

 

So, husband serious talk first. Get it figured out. Be realistic. Make the boundaries.

 

Meanwhile get that bottle of valium and report her words to her doctor.

 

Then sit down with them. Let husband do the talking. Let them know that you didn't realize the extent of their physical needs, that you love them and want them with you as long as you can handle it, but you also have young children to raise. Let them know that there will be outside care people coming in for respite or medical needs to help you and if that is not okay you need to find an outside care provider for them to go to. At this conversation, or at another in the near future (with a doctor or service aid), let them know what you can handle. Ask if they want to pick out a care facility for their future needs if they develop physical problems that you can't handle.

 

:grouphug: Don't feel bad it you can't do this. My FIL cares for my MIL with dementia and physical degradation. He is retired and has no other responsibilities. He is healthy for his age. Even with that, I can tell how hard it is for him. He has volunteer respite and we pay for additional respite for him. One of the first things the doctor said to him was 'know when you can't do it anymore, have people around you who can be real with you.' Often people get in crisis mode and getting through the day that they can't see that its not a good home care situation anymore. :grouphug:

[BlsdMama]

:grouphug:

 

Your kids will learn a lot from your graciousness in taking care of the grandparents. Not doing some of their activities will not scar them for life. Taking care of and loving your family will make a huge impact on them.

 

 

My beloved grandmother died two weeks ago.

Their time left is short.

God bless you for DOING it. (And admitting it's hard. It just IS no matter how willing you are.)

 

Your children are learning a lot more than they ever would have in fencing or debate and you'll be glad of it when you're 84. ;)

 

I'm sorry it's so hard. May the good Lord watch over you, give you the strength, patience, and ability to endure to bless these old people in the very last years of their lives.

 

As to the mother, my guess is she's a flighty one and will disappear soon. ((Hugs))

[jujsky]

I'd say it's time to be blunt w/the gpa.

 

Either they allow home health care to help, incl respite for you, or assisted living needs to happen, that you simply cannot manage their care w/out help. Period.

 

While taking care of family is a noble thing, I do not believe that the rest of the family needs to sacrifice everything to do so. Kids have a right to their lives too, not just revolving around older relatives.

 

So, either gpa agree to accepting outside help, or it's time to start looking at placements.

 

:iagree: They need to be reasonable. Accepting outside care is not only reasonable, but necessary given the circumstances. Geez, what happens if you get the flu and can't do all the care for them and can't cook them a bijillion meals each day? I don't think it's right that they're allowed to refuse the care. Respite care is just as much for you (to take some of the burden off) as it is for them.

 

Edited to add: I know some people have said that you are teaching your children a valuable lesson and that not doing activities won't kill them. I have an opposite view that is not PC and not very Christian of me. My grandmother didn't live with us, but she lived 5 minutes away and was (still is) a narcissist and a hypochondriac. Awesome combination, right? My mom and aunt have been taking care of her for the last 30 years. Even now that she's in senior housing, my mom is over there every day. My grandparents refused home health care services when they were still in their home, even when my grandfather was really sick and had dementia at that end. My mom gave up getting a better/higher paying job when my dad left her because her current job as a high school secretary gives her the flexibility to take my grandparents to their appointments. She lives in a rundown house and barely makes enough to pay her bills. She has given up spending time with my kids -- her only grandchildren -- to take care of my grandmother. She has given up lots of time with me and my brother to take care of my grandmother. This has been going on since my brother, now 33, started pre-school. That's when my grandmother first started getting "sick." I used to admire what she was doing, but now I resent it and resent my grandmother to the point of hating her and wishing she would die so my mom will have her life back. There, I said it. Throw those tomatoes. My cousin feels the same way -- you'd have to know my grandmother or someone like her to understand. My mom was going through radiation treatment for cancer (she finished today -- yay!!!!!) and my grandmother called her a few weeks ago at 3:00 AM because she couldn't take a crap. Seriously. It's probably because she took a bunch of stuff to make her go, then took a bunch of stuff to back her up -- that's what she does. My mom went over and sat with her. Then a few hour later she started complaining about chest pains (more than likely made up) so my mom had to take her to the hospital and was there with her for 24 hours without sleep. Super healthy for a person undergoing radiation. And if anyone thinks I'm just a big 'ole B for my views, nurses at the hospital have caught Nana with her finger down her throat on more than one occasion trying to make herself throw up so she'd get more attention. She also always ends up "sick" to the point my mom has to stay with her every time my mom comes back from visiting us for a weekend in NH. That's the way she is. Anyway, OP, if the kids have to give up too much for their g-grandparents, they may well end up resenting them and resenting you for making a martyr of yourself. I understand you're trying to be a good person, but if your kids are suffering for it, it's not fair to them. If the g-grandparents won't compromise, put them in a home. Give them that ultimatum if you need to. I think you'd feel better about helping them if they were trying to help themselves, and helping themselves includes agreeing to some in-home care to ease your burden. Those g-grandparents may live longer than you anticipated. What happens in a few years when your 8th grader is graduating high school, and you're still taking care of g-grandmother? How are you and he going to feel then when you've more or less missed out on all those years of fun memories? How much pressure is going to be put on your oldest to help out with the g-grandparents and/or the younger siblings to give you a break? I've seen it with my mom. Once you're in that role of caretaker, it can be hard to switch gears and get back into that role of mom. I think the potential for resentment is huge.

Edited August 6, 2012 by jujsky

[Anne in CA]

Honestly, taking care of family WOULD BE more important than debate or riding lessons EXCEPT that they could be getting help and are refusing it, putting too much burden on you with no thoughts for you at all. They also were not honest about things when they moved in. If they really needed the help I would say, you need to suck it up. They do not NEED your life, they want it, and there is a big difference.

 

You and your dh need to come to an agreement, this could go on for several years and drain you completely. I would not deal on the assumption that it will be over soon, it could very well go on for more than five years. I would operate on the assumption that this will go on for many years. I would get your dh to back you up and inform them that the next time they send caregivers away you will choose a facility to send them to. That would be their first strike. You don't have to tell them that you might not send them away right then, but I would choose a facility and start paperwork at that point so that your dh's grandmother would shape up. If she does not shape up as far as getting outside help and respite care so that you have some time to yourself and for your family, I think they need to go.

[Stacy in NJ]

health issues would overwhelm me. Caring for them sounds like a full time job, and on top of your other responsibilities, it just sounds like too much. :grouphug:

 

They're probably both eligible for/receiving Social Security, and in the absence of other assets may qualify for assisted living/nuring home facilities (that accept Medicare as payment). I'd look for a facility near your home so that you can monitor their circumstances.

 

I'd say your first step is discussing this option with your dh then beginning to get them used to the idea as well. You may need to be really firm here.

[pdalley]

I'd say it's time to be blunt w/the gpa.

 

Either they allow home health care to help, incl respite for you, or assisted living needs to happen, that you simply cannot manage their care w/out help. Period.

 

While taking care of family is a noble thing, I do not believe that the rest of the family needs to sacrifice everything to do so. Kids have a right to their lives too, not just revolving around older relatives.

 

So, either gpa agree to accepting outside help, or it's time to start looking at placements.

 

Sometimes you have to be this blunt. Tell the social worker this. Look, I don't care what they are saying to you - I cannot continue to do this.

 

I'm not sure they (gpa) can refuse services that help you. I know my Mother tried her darndest to run off every worker we had to sit with her while we took a break at the end but she didn't have a choice. She was on hospice though so I'm not sure how that works. I finally - to get that - tell the social worker that my brother and I were about two steps away from complete collapse as he had to take care of our grandmother in addition to my mother and I had my three boys. The respite came even if Mom didn't like it very much.

 

:grouphug: Being a caregiver is a very tough job.

[Impish]

I think what it comes down to is balance.

 

(all of the following is my opinion, not to be confused w/facts :tongue_smilie:)

 

I think there's a huge diff btwn something being challenging, and depriving.

 

*If* it were a matter of the kids not having *everything*, that's one thing. Family responsibilities aren't always easy.

 

However, I think it's grossly unfair for a family to completely revolve around one or two members. Everyone shouldn't have to give up *everything* to accomodate demands.

 

Adjustments can be uncomfortable, that's a part of life. However, it shouldn't all be one sided, and that's honestly how it sounds. Like you, your dh, and the kids are doing all the adjusting and sacrificing. The kids deserve better than that. I may be a nasty piece of work, but my kids having a positive childhood is extremely important to me, and I'm not willing to sacrifice that for anyone.

 

From what you've said, there IS help available that would make the situation far more easily managed, but the gpa are refusing to even consider it. They're not considering the needs of you, your dh, or your children...and by going along w/it, you're enabling that.

 

You *need*, your dh and children *need* for someone to help out. Make it a non negotiable issue. If they still refuse, then you need to be firm in you aren't able to continue w/the way things are going, and need to find an assisted living situation for them.

 

It's not wrong or selfish to not want to sacrifice your family life, your children's childhoods, to folks that are completely unwilling to compromise. Your primary commitment is to your dh and children, period.

[FaithManor]

I would also like to say that even though some people think it is soooo noble to give up your life to take care of your elderly relatives, I do not think this is wise.

 

My dad and I have a great relationship except in one area, and that concerns my mother's health because it is shot from taking care of his mother. Now, I ADORED my grandmother. She was an amazing, loving, giving woman with whom I had a profound, deep relationship, but she lived a VERY long time after a significant stroke and my parents were adamant about taking care of her at home. My dad would not assist with her care. In his generation, men did not care for the physical needs of women...had it been his dad, yes he would have helped. Everything was on my mom. I was pregnant and having babies, pregnancy complications, etc. and could not assist.

 

The net effect was that my mother destroyed her own health taking care of grandma and my dad let it happen. He only embraced assisted living for her when my mother literally could not physically do it anymore. My mother now has a degenerative back condition from injuries due to lifting on grandma, she developed type 2 diabetes which the doctor said was because of physical exhaustion and eating my grandmother's extraordinarily high, simple carb based diet because grandma had developed IBS and could not eat vegetables, fruits, and very few proteins. Mom was so tired, she just couldn't find the energy to cook one way for grandma and another way for herself and dad. My dad ended up with health problems because of the diet as well though his have righted themselves fairly well with a diet high in veggies, nuts, and lean proteins and low in sweet fruits and grains. Mom also put some much other needed health care for herself on the back burner because she couldn't deal with both at once - her cataracts eventually became absolutely AWFUL because she couldn't get the surgery she needed because the insurance wouldn't pay for full-time in home healthcare for grandma and I was on bedrest with a toddler running around being watched by his 8 year old sister. My sister, a college student at the time, tried to help when possible and whenever I could manage taking care of grandma plus THREE BOYS UNDER THE AGE OF 4 and dd, I did. It was brutal.

 

So, now I have have a 67 year old mother that I will be taking care of physically before I even have my own children grown. She's recently started to get pretty stove up from the back trouble and I have no doubt that before my eldest son graduates from high school, mom will be using a walker at only 70 years of age. Her face, everything about her screams 90 year old woman. I'm angry and I'll admit it. I don't know how I'm supposed to manage getting these kids through high school and taking care of a practically non-ambulatory parent who would not be in this position if my grandmother had been in assisted living where she belonged with shifts of professionals and equipment available to do all of that lifting, bathing, helping her with physical therapy, medical appointments, and cooking. My aunt even took grandma for six months and ended up with such bad back and shoulder problems that she had to have surgery. The kind of care many elderly face simply cannot be adequately provided in a family environment.

 

I can tell you one thing. Dad will dang tootin' be helping and when my grandchildren start arriving, I will be taking a break from her care in order to go be with my daughter and help her.

 

I get that it sounds like such a loving thing to do. But, it is NOT a loving thing to tank your own health and leave your children who are still young parents trying to figure out how to care for two generations at once.

 

My uncle's mother did the same thing. Taking care of her mother was more important than taking care of her young son. He had a nanny so thankfully he was well-cared for. However, in his case, he wasn't allowed to have a friend over, he wasn't allowed to play games outside, he wasn't allowed.....I can't tell you all of things he wasn't allowed because it all upset granny with dementia. EVERYTHING revolved around her. He ended up growing up having virtually no use for his parents though he did, in the end, provide adequate care for them through assisted living and visited often. This was not out of affection for them. It was from a sense of family duty only. He did not feel a connection to his parents. They never took the time to bond with him because elderly grandparents took first priority. His parents even chose, though they wanted more children, to sleep in separate bedrooms in order to insure there would be no more children because having energy to care for elderly relatives came first.

 

My cousin is taking care of her mother with dementia while she still has very young children at home. Her children are practically feral. There isn't enough time and energy in a day to do both.

 

Many, many elderly people literally require a cadre of personnel in order to continue living. It.can't.be.done.by.one.person. It shouldn't be done by one person. It shouldn't be done one the backs of ruining relationships and destroying the caretaker's health.

 

Elderly relatives can be a real blessing to a home when they are A. mentally stable, B. ambulatory and C. capable of the bulk of their self-care. But, they can't be the end all be all consideration in the family. Other people count too.

 

Faith

[Impish]

ITA w/Faith.

[Dobela]

If one is showing signs of dementia, then your dh needs to start paperwork to become the guardian. Having power of attorney is not enough. My mom learned this in the last month while dealing with issues related to my grandmother in the early stages of dementia. Then you are involved with doctors, and are in control of things like home health aids.

 

You need help. Your children need your attention as well. If they stay in your home, you need someone to come take care of you - laundry dishes, cleaning, prepping meals, etc. Or you can hire someone to come take care of them for a certain number of hours a day. The gp can't fire who you hire. You need sitters to stay with them so your children can still have a life outside of the home. If your church doesn't want to help, then it is time to find other resources and people. Ask other homeschool families who they would recommend. If you live near a college, ask if any nursing students would be willing to work with them a few hours at a time. It is great experience.

[Seasider]

:iagree:

...

As for your MIL, toss her. Seriously. Showing up to make demands and be critical is not acceptable. She can do that by email (which you will, of course, direct straight to the trash folder). If she's not helping with the load, she's adding to it. Not. Acceptable.

 

I do think kids learn a great many things while caring for elderly relatives. But their regularly scheduled lives do not need to stop and be replaced by living the life of an elderly couple. Teach them how to support others while being their own people.

 

:grouphug:

 

I would ask dh to be sure he shares with his Mommy Dearest that there is no possibility of inheritance or financial gain. She may just vanish herself upon hearing that news.

 

As for your kids, they will learn much by your graceful example, but to ask them to sacrifice *everything* is a sure ticket to resentment. Perhaps you can make arrangements for them to participate in a limited fashion.

 

...

 

Meanwhile get that bottle of valium and report her words to her doctor.

 

...

 

Yes, confiscate it and let her think she misplaced it (unless she truly needs it for pain management, I am not advocating withholding needed meds, just trying to eliminate that loaded gun she's holding).

 

I would absolutely play the valium card with her doctor. As her caregiver, you can make an appointment with her doctor to share your concerns. He is bound by privacy to not share her medical information with you, but he doesn't have to close his ears, either. An appointment with him may be helpful, even vital, in proceeding according to this next bit of great advice...

 

If one is showing signs of dementia, then your dh needs to start paperwork to become the guardian. Having power of attorney is not enough. My mom learned this in the last month while dealing with issues related to my grandmother in the early stages of dementia. Then you are involved with doctors, and are in control of things like home health aids. You/your dh need to be named medical power of attorney (MPOA) .

 

You need help. Your children need your attention as well. If they stay in your home, you need someone to come take care of you - laundry dishes, cleaning, prepping meals, etc. Or you can hire someone to come take care of them for a certain number of hours a day. The gp can't fire who you hire. You need sitters to stay with them so your children can still have a life outside of the home. If your church doesn't want to help, then it is time to find other resources and people. Ask other homeschool families who they would recommend. If you live near a college, ask if any nursing students would be willing to work with them a few hours at a time. It is great experience.

 

You do need to groom an assistant (not meaning one of your children). You have to be able to leave the house, especially in the event of an emergency.

 

:grouphug::grouphug::grouphug: It is so very kind of you to accept the challenge of their care, but it cannot come at the cost of your immediate family. Your husband and children need you!

 

And as for your church, JMO but if that's the way they feel about you, it's time to shake that dust off your feet, too.

[Harriet Vane]

I'd say it's time to be blunt w/the gpa.

 

Either they allow home health care to help, incl respite for you, or assisted living needs to happen, that you simply cannot manage their care w/out help. Period.

 

While taking care of family is a noble thing, I do not believe that the rest of the family needs to sacrifice everything to do so. Kids have a right to their lives too, not just revolving around older relatives.

 

So, either gpa agree to accepting outside help, or it's time to start looking at placements.

:iagree::iagree::iagree:

 

Even if you do not want to consider a placement in assisted living now, at least research the options. At some point you may not have much choice, and it's better to have the research done before the crisis hits.

[Harriet Vane]

I think what it comes down to is balance.

 

(all of the following is my opinion, not to be confused w/facts :tongue_smilie:)

 

I think there's a huge diff btwn something being challenging, and depriving.

 

*If* it were a matter of the kids not having *everything*, that's one thing. Family responsibilities aren't always easy.

 

However, I think it's grossly unfair for a family to completely revolve around one or two members. Everyone shouldn't have to give up *everything* to accomodate demands.

 

Adjustments can be uncomfortable, that's a part of life. However, it shouldn't all be one sided, and that's honestly how it sounds. Like you, your dh, and the kids are doing all the adjusting and sacrificing. The kids deserve better than that. I may be a nasty piece of work, but my kids having a positive childhood is extremely important to me, and I'm not willing to sacrifice that for anyone.

 

From what you've said, there IS help available that would make the situation far more easily managed, but the gpa are refusing to even consider it. They're not considering the needs of you, your dh, or your children...and by going along w/it, you're enabling that.

 

You *need*, your dh and children *need* for someone to help out. Make it a non negotiable issue. If they still refuse, then you need to be firm in you aren't able to continue w/the way things are going, and need to find an assisted living situation for them.

 

It's not wrong or selfish to not want to sacrifice your family life, your children's childhoods, to folks that are completely unwilling to compromise. Your primary commitment is to your dh and children, period.

 

:iagree: Well said.

[Impish]

Thanks, strider.

 

Having worked in home health care, I've seen families implode under the weight of caring for an elderly relative.

 

Ppl are often quick to laud the benefits of caring for the elderly, but unfortunately, there aren't that many that seem to be blunt about the realities of the stress and toll it takes.

 

I think we need to ditch the idea that it's noble and right to completely sacrifice everything to meet the needs of one (or two). It's simply NOT healthy.

[TammyS]

she will most likely take off to some other state never to be heard from again.

 

 

TELL HER!!! NOW!!!

 

That would solve a huge part of your problem right there.

 

If I understand this clearly, you have three elderly people living with you GPA, GMA, and MIL? The grands are a lot of labor, but not problematic people, is that correct? MIL can take care of herself (I'm willing to bet a dollar to a donut she's useless around the house) but is abusive.

 

MIL goes. Today. Now. Right this instant. I can understand taking in the grands. As long as you are able, I think it's the right thing to do. I do not understand letting MIL visit, much less move in. Get her out. She is a poison in your house and a terrible thing for you children to be around. And you won't be able to figure out what to do about the grands until you can get her out so that you can think clearly.

 

I think it's fine that your children have given up some things. Because it won't be forever. There is a lot available to help you care for these people, but it is complicated (a geriatric social worker can help hook you up with the various services), and you need to get MIL out so you can think! :grouphug::grouphug:

[TammyS]

I'd say it's time to be blunt w/the gpa.

 

Either they allow home health care to help, incl respite for you, or assisted living needs to happen, that you simply cannot manage their care w/out help. Period.

 

 

:iagree::iagree::iagree:

 

I believe strongly in taking care of our elderly as much as we are able (and have done it myself). But part of that "social contract", if you will, is that they need to make the burden on you as light as they are able. And allowing home health to come in and help is a TINY sacrifice for them to make. Not allowing these people to help is selfish and would not be allowed to stand in my home. I would tell them forthrightly that they ARE going to allow the nursing staff to do some things (every single thing that you can get the nursing staff to do). The only question is will it be here or will it be in a nursing home?

[BigMamaBird]

You've gotten wonderful advice from previous posters and I have nothing else to add other than BIG :grouphug::grouphug: and welcome to the forum.

[Outinthegarden]

Thank you ladies for all your input. You all are very gracious and honest - which is what I really needed. While I do want to take care of them several things have donned on me if you will.

 

1. When we agreed to move them here, both dh and I were completely under the assumption that they would only both be here for a short while and we didn't know the half of their conditions. While dh still thinks so, especially about his grandfather on dialysis (most folks over 60 only make it 5 years max and he is 90 with a double pacemaker, high blood pressure and zero kidney function, he is on year two) I am thinking - what IF they live for 2 or 3 more years. Can I keep this up? What will this do to my marriage, and my children?

 

2. Right now his grandfather actually helps her get in and out of bed, in and out of the wheel chair, etc. I'm not sure how in the world he does that - but if he were gone I know I could not do that, let alone lift her if she fell.

 

3. My husband has power of attorney - but we just learned last week through Home Health care, as someone pointed out here - that doesn't mean squat! We have discussed the need for him to be the guardian. The GM doesn't see the point to that since they are both able to make decisions at this time!

 

I plan on speaking with dh this evening, this is the longest that I have kept anything from him. He is such a sweet (don't know that he'd like that term :) ) great guy that when I think of having this conversation my gut ties up in knots due to I feel like I'm just being selfish or overreacting. Part of me says I should just go on vacation for two weeks and leave him here alone and then see what he says!

 

There are a lot of issues, but one of the biggies for me is that she only bathes once a week. Ewww - I'm waiting for my ds who is 11 and says exactly what comes to his mind to say, "granny, why do you smell? did you get a bath??" He has already asked why in the world she needs ALL those white sponges that come in those purple bags when she doesn't clean anything, and where does she keep the cleaning tool that they "stick" to. :w00t:

 

Alittle more humor: just like my dd who is 9 asked "granny, are you hitting grandpa with your grabber? you shouldn't do that if you are, it leaves black marks..." :eek: (He takes coumaden and if you just touch him lightly on the arm he bruises!)

 

Never a dull moment...

[Supertechmom]

Okay, from the viewpoint of a child who grew up in this situation ,

 

This post sounded harsh and I didn't mean for it sound harsh. HUGS to you Op as you figure this out. It is hard on so many levels. I just grew up in this and there really isn't a way to make it sound pretty unfortunately.

 

Everyone thinks care of the elderly won't be forever. However during that "small time out of one's life", your children may grow up and become married and you will look back and realize that you missed a limited opportunity with your own children while working through this time period.. For some people that may be acceptable. For me, there is no way I will take in any elderly and care for them as long as I have children in my home. They deserve to have my attention and to launch them into adulthood. They do not deserve to have parents consumed by the care of the elderly and to be put on the back burner. Yes , i am still here and my grandparents are dead. But when my mom looked up after the last funeral, she realized I was no longer 11 but was grown, married and children on the way. that little bit of time turned into a very long 15 years of care. I grew up and when mom was ready and able to be my mom again, I had moved on. When I needed her, she was busy and I was selfish for needing her because the noble act of caring for the elderly outweighs everything, right? But then when it was over, I had learned not to need her and to live without a mom.

 

Caring for the elderly does not mean doing it all on your own. Insist on becoming their medical poa and set up the services they need. Otherwise tell the next nurse/ social work that you are evicting them. You can not care for them and care for a houseful of children. If they were easy elderly with few needs other than making sure they eat and don't fall down, I could see it. But start adding in medical care, self care, and dementia ....... Your family will take a back seat because that type of care is more important than making sure somebody gets to piano practice. but when those somebodies no longer need piano practice or birthday cakes or time with mom and are gone and you are still giving all that care.......you have to ask yourself will you still feel you did the right thing or will you resent losing out on so much of your children's life? There is no right or wrong answer here. Only what you can live with.

 

YMMV.

Edited August 6, 2012 by servin

[jujsky]

OP, you are NOT being selfish at all!!!!! Have that talk with your DH. It sounds like you are the one home doing most of the work. He might see things differently if he was doing all the work. Besides, he's never going to know how you feel about this unless you talk to him, and if he's a sweetie like you said, he will probably do whatever he can to work with you to make the situation more manageable.

 

And welcome to the board :001_smile:

[celticmom]

First off:

 

WHY is MIL living w/you? She sounds perfectly capable of renting an apt near by. That would be the first thing to tackle, imo. I can't imagine having someone under my roof whose stated she'd be willing to kill me if she figured she could get away w/it!

 

2nd, can you get home care/respite? Talk to whatever Drs are involved, cite caregiver burn out, and see what they can do for you. This would enable you to get out of the house, do things w/your kids and dh, w/out having to worry about the gparents.

 

And, since MIL is living w/you right now, why can't you leave HER w/HER parents and do whatever needs doing?

 

Yes, I'd absolutely let gma's drs know about her suicidal comments,and find a way to make that bottle of Valium disappear. And, honestly, it doesn't sound like you can handle her escalating needs, so while she doesn't want to go into assisted living, it may be the safest option for everyone.

:iagree:This pretty much covers everything I was thinking.

[Tarreymere]

You have gotten some great advice. I just wanted to add one thing. I noticed in the op that the grandparents had said they needed a pedicure......and the op mentioned going to a salon. Well, elderly folks usually need foot care and nail care from a podiatrist and that is probably what they were talking about. Nursing assistants can cut fingernails on the elderly but are discouraged (usually) from cutting toe nails, for a lot of reasons related to the physical condition of elderly people. So, in addition to the myriad other things related to their care they do need to see a podiatrist.......

 

Just my gut as an Rn, if you do choose to allow them to stay with you and not go into a personal care home you should absolutely NOT even consider it without a ton of support from aides and other staff and other professionals. Elderly folk 'take a village' to care for also. You should not even try to do it all on your own. It isn't humanly possible to be everything to everyone in your situation.

[kalanamak]

I would ask dh to be sure he shares with his Mommy Dearest that there is no possibility of inheritance or financial gain. She may just vanish herself upon hearing that news.

.

 

:iagree:

[mathnerd]

deleting because i really am not sure how I landed up in such an old thread today. Sorry!

[Jean in Newcastle]

This is a 6 month old post.

[melbotoast]

This thread is from August.

Braaaaiiins!