She is just not getting it.

[Gentlemommy]

Dd6, is just.not.getting.reading. I have tried and tried, and still, it's like pulling teeth. We have read to her from birth, I've modeled reading (I'm a huge bookworm), I have tried the laid back approach, the phonics approach, whole word, workbook, 100 EZ lessons, funnix, teach her to read using children's books...

We are halfway through The Reading Lesson. So far, it has been working best for her. However, she is still struggling through every single word on every single page. :confused: I don't know what else to do. I feel like I'm failing her big time.

[wapiti]

First, how could you possibly be failing her when you've tried everything you know how to do? You're obviously working very hard - give yourself a break. It's not your fault.

 

Second, what is it that's not working - can she sound out words, but then can't remember them? Or sounding out words is a big chore? Do you feel there's something wrong, or are you just waiting for that "click" to fluency?

 

When my dd was 6, she struggled with learning to read. It turned out that she had an eye tracking problem (one of the ways in which the eyes need to work together for reading) that was fixed with six months of vision therapy, and she jumped grade levels in reading ability. You can read lots about VT on the SN board. This sort of problem is easy to rule out with a visit to a developmental optometrist.

[sagira]

First of all, :grouphug:

 

I read this quote recently that has helped me tremendously:

 

"You can't force a bud open, but you can water it every day."

 

Small and consistent steps. Every day. Don't quit. Keep on swimming. Don't expect anything yet. It can be hard, especially when we have external pressures. However, the more I am on this journey of parenting and schooling, the more I realize that children have their own timetable on when they do things or things just click for them. Our hsing job is to expose them to new learning experiences, and keep working on skills. Just keep at it. It will come.

 

Both of you may want to snuggle up and read "Leo the Late Bloomer" together.

[GingerPoppy]

I agree that it will come on its own timetable. I've worked with lots of kids on remedial reading, and I don't think age 6 is late to be struggling AT ALL. In fact, I wouldn't even call it struggling--it's well within normal. It is perfectly fine to be at the slow, sounding out every word stage at age 6. Most especially if she's a young six. I suspect that it will click, especially if you're doing the right things. Don't worry about it unless there's no real improvement and she's turned 7.

[wy_kid_wrangler04]

My ds is the same way and he just turned 7. It will come. My 5 year old is at the level of my 7 year old and about to pass him up. Some kids just need more time. Thats ok! This is one of the wonderful things about being a homeschooler! Last school year I had so many panic posts about him.

 

 

One thing that my ds needs is a varied approach. Phonics Pathways got him started REALLY good. We tried OPGTTR before that. Tears every time that book came out. When we got a small way into PP he did not want that book anymore. He was done. I checked out OPGTTR from the library and he took off. He loved it. We also play with starfall.com, he does ETC and AAS. I honestly think some kids need a varied approach. We just keep cycling through what we have. When he is tired of 1 thing, we move to the next and so on. He is making VERY slow strides but he is getting there, painfully slow but getting there. Keep doing what you are doing and she WILL get there!!

 

You have not failed your daughter. She is only 6. I know its hard reading about 3-4year olds reading but she is only 6!! She will get there :grouphug:

Edited November 7, 2011 by wy_kid_wrangler04

[Ellie]

:grouphug:

 

See, here's the thing:

 

She's just 6. If you've already done all of those things with her, you started when she was 5, which truly is pretty young to expect children to read. And you've tried several different methods with her in a short amount of time, which is probably confusing the heck out of her, and I'm guessing you didn't complete any of them, which means there wouldn't necessarily have been enough time to see the results you think there should have been.

 

And she's just 6. That's way too young for you to feel as if you're "failing" her.

 

IMHO, your best bet is to wait until after Christmas, then pick ONE thing and stick with it.

[wy_kid_wrangler04]

Don't worry about it unless there's no real improvement and she's turned 7.

 

 

 

:001_huh: should I be worried about ds? I just got to the point where I wasn't worried. :confused:

[Hedgehog]

Don't worry about it unless there's no real improvement and she's turned 7.

 

I agreed with you until this sentence. Some children, even without other issues, don't "get" reading until later than this. They just mature slower, but are none the worse for it in the end.

 

OP - it sounds like you are doing everything you can do. You could see if there is anything interfering with your dd's learning if you felt it appropriate, but if not I would just keep on with what you are doing, especially reading to her. Treat the rest as a non-pressure fun activity. She will be fine. :grouphug:

[SkateLeft]

IMHO, your best bet is to wait until after Christmas, then pick ONE thing and stick with it.

 

:iagree: Very wise words.

 

My 10yo ds didn't click with reading until he was almost 9. Now, you'd never know that he took a bit longer than most kids, because he's a great reader.

[ChrissySC]

Dd6, is just.not.getting.reading. I have tried and tried, and still, it's like pulling teeth. We have read to her from birth, I've modeled reading (I'm a huge bookworm), I have tried the laid back approach, the phonics approach, whole word, workbook, 100 EZ lessons, funnix, teach her to read using children's books...

We are halfway through The Reading Lesson. So far, it has been working best for her. However, she is still struggling through every single word on every single page. :confused: I don't know what else to do. I feel like I'm failing her big time.

 

 

Have you tried Bob Books? http://www.bobbooks.com/first_bob_books.php

 

I am a rebel. I teach sight words, preprimer and primer and use Dick and Jane books. I start at 4yo (this is the third). She read her first story.

 

She is now trying to tackle sounding out words. I let it be. I will be digging out Bob Books soon. :)

[Iucounu]

I agree that taking a small break might be good. Your daughter's probably dealing with some stress over reading right now.

 

I also think it's a good idea to pick an approach and stay with it for a while. The whole-word approach is not going to help her in sounding out new words. ElizabethB has posted that in her experience, starting with sight words can enhance problems for beginning readers, due to increasing the likelihood that they will try to guess at new words based on the ones they've seen. I would probably say that it's a good idea to pick some approach that includes phonetic rules, which could include common learning sight words that way.

 

It's also definitely true that she might have some sort of learning problem, which could be neurological or vision-related. If after a break and restart, and giving it some time, she isn't improving at all, I'd look into an assessment.

[sbgrace]

It can take a while for a child to be ready to blend. Until the brain is there I don't think there is anything a parent can do.

 

I would take a significant break completely from reading for a fresh start. Then I'd recommend you try I See Sam books when you start back up. Her chance of success and a pleasant experience for both of you is much better with those in my opinion and experience.

 

If you want to try with little cost (printing only) the I See Sam readers available free online here. You would follow the instructions on the 3rsplus site . It is 100% decodable and explicit phonics. They are gentle and fun to read.

[bcnlvr]

I had the SAME thing with ds6. I was at my wit's end. One day we were out shopping and there was a sign for free eye exams (who doesn't like free), so we all went in. Unbelievably, ds6 was +4.00 in each eye (after dilation, which removed ds6's ability to accommodate/overcome the farsightedness). The optometrist said she would be surprised if ds could even see his desk. :eek: I was so upset and relieved all at once. That was last October. Since then his reading has exploded.

 

There can be sooo many reasons, physical, emotional, developmental that a certain child isn't reading. Eyesight can be one of them. Just sharing that it was ours!!!

[mskelly]

How does your DD feel? Is she as frustrated as you are? I know you said she struggles, but sometimes it is harder for a fluent bookworm to listen to a beginning reader sound out the words than it is for the little sweetie who is "reading" her book. Does that make sense? My mom will sit down to read with DS and she is giving him every other word. She feels bad for him and doesn't want him to get frustrated. When I read with him, I have a much higher tolerance for the long pauses and the false starts and he gets the words without help. :)

 

I was going to suggest the Bob books also. She'll probably be able to memorize the first book after a few reads, but that's ok. It's a huge confidence booster for a reluctant reader! We work through one book at a time, in order, and once he can read it without any errors, we put it in a special box of books he can read independently. He calls them his "self-readers" and gets pretty excited about adding books to that box.

 

For the record, I teach sight words along with phonics. I think that might make me a rebel also!

[carlychan]

Geez, I didn't *really* worry about my DS until he was 7. Then I kind of did:) He is 8 and reading at a 2nd grade level (probably 2.5 or so). He is slow, but is finally getting it. I would not worry AT ALL just yet. My oldest learned to read easily and at a "normal" time, but my 2nd just wasn't ready. When he finally started getting it was when we went to Rod and Staff reading. This isn't normally a curriculum others love for reading, but it is working for us quite well. Give her a break and start again later. Reinforce lots of phonics with worksheets, reading, blocks, crafts, whatever and have fun!

 

Carly

[Coffeemama]

:grouphug: i agree with those who have said to take a break from any type of formal lessons. Try filling that time with extra read alouds. Use a variety of all types: rich picture books, exciting novels, historical fiction, intereating science. Really build up a love for books and vocabulary. When you start again fresh in a few months, hopefully you will make some progress.

 

ETA: all three of my DC began their early reading by "reading" short predictable books that they already knew word for word from listening to it so many times. Not exactly real reading, but it helps to build confidence, fluency, and recognition of simple common words. HTH!

Edited November 7, 2011 by Coffeemama

[redsquirrel]

I will also add that you should listen and trust yourself. If you think it is just that she needs to grow a bit older then trust that. If you truly think something isn't right, then look into getting her some outside help.

 

I am not suggesting anything about your daughter. So often I have had friends convinced to get a child evaluated when they really didn't think there was a need. Conversely, I have watched some very good friends ignore their better judgement because everyone was really piling on them, telling them to just wait it out.

 

So regardless of what is said here, value your own judgment most.

[GingerPoppy]

:001_huh: should I be worried about ds? I just got to the point where I wasn't worried. :confused:

Oh, man, I'm sorry! I didn't really phrase that very well. What I meant was, if the original poster didn't see any improvement *at all*, and another 1/2 year to a year had passed, then I might start looking into reasons for that. I absolutely believe that it's perfectly fine for a 7 year old to not yet be a fluent reader. I guess I would expect to see incremental improvement along the way for 6 and 7 year olds, even if it's all developing at their own rate.

[sewingmama]

At 6 I wouldn't be too concerned about delays in reading unless she was also showing delays in other areas in which would be developmentally appropriate for a 6yo KWIM.

 

My DD is similar to yours -I've been teaching her to read about a year now on and off and she is still at the sounding out every single word stage. Recently I discovered it was more about confidence then anything else. She was afraid to just say the word she had seen 50 billion times in case it was wrong and so would sound it out letter by letter to make sure. She didn't trust her reading ability.

 

I started teaching her some sight words and once she noticed she was getting words "right" just by looking and not sounding out she began reading more and more words straight out. As her confidence is growing so is her reading fluency.

 

Another thing we did was get rid of the reading program we were using and that my DD hated (Phonics Pathways). I bought it in the first place because I heard it was great for reluctant readers but my DD hated reading the random words - reading was a mystery to her because it seemed like everything was random and she thought that the reading I did when reading a story was "different" to what I was asking her to do because her reading didn't make sense, have a story or a purpose.

 

Anyway - I changed over to Reading A-Z.com and my DD just started zooming along. Each phonics reader comes with a proper lesson that builds on the one before. So reader No.2 has the same words as Reader 1 with a few new ones thrown in etc etc. You teach the lesson first (with lots of hands on games) that teach the words via phonics before you read the actual book which means that when they get to reading the book they are already familiar with the words and can read them much more successfully and thus gain better confidence.

 

My DD is on lesson 9 and has learnt how to read more in those few lessons then from the whole of the past 6 year.

 

The only downfall is that it's a subscription site that costs $$$. I went in on a Co-op a while ago and got it for cheap -however they do have a 7 day free trial period so you can test it out and see if it works for your DD. You are also able to preview a lot of stuff (you just can't print it out). I think on the free trial you have a download limit of 20 things a day so you could download a whole lot in a week to get your DD started.

 

Start out with the phonics readers and make sure you do the lessons that go with them and see if it helps.

 

http://www.readinga-z.com/

[kristinannie]

Here are my two cents. I am no expert so take it all with a grain of salt if you want to. I highly recommend reading Ruth Beechick's books about reading. She quotes a study where one group of (I think it was 1st graders) students spent a majority of their time learning to read. The other group spent all of their time learning about science (doing experiments, doing great read alouds, etc). By third grade, the group who didn't learn reading actually was reading at a higher level than the group who focused on reading. Kids at this age are sponges. Spending more time reading aloud, doing experiments, learning about the world around them is so important. They learn vocabulary, they learn to love learning and they get a lot of great information to start building up knowledge. Reading can be taught at a later date.

 

I agree with PP who said to take a break from reading lessons. At this point, it sounds like you are both completely frustrated. I also agree with PP that you should pick one program and stick with it. It sounds like you have a lot of great options. My main program I use is called The Struggling Reader. It is amazing. You teach kids to read by playing games. I am amazed at how quickly DS5 picks things up from these games. We also have a lot of phonics games I got off of Rainbow Resource. Whizizzle is our favorite, but I can make other recommendations. I do use MCP Phonics to review things or to help solidify a concept, but I don't use it daily.

 

I am not sure exactly where your DD6 is at, but if she needs any work on CVC words, I cannot recommend First Start Reading highly enough. It goes really slowly through the short vowel sounds and really solidifies them for the child. That is really the first hurdle. Once you clear that, The Struggling Reader kicks in.

 

Just take a deep breath. Focus on other things for school for awhile. Do math, science, history, art, nature study, etc. Take some time off and then pick the program that you are going to use throughout. Stick with it and work through it slowly. She will get there. She is so young. Best of luck! I will send some prayers your way.

[RootAnn]

Two of my friends in real life have 3 & 4 yr olds who taught themselves to read. It doesn't help that these kids are the same age as my dd#2 who is.just.starting.to.read.fluently (at age 8) and who is finally past being intimidated by the little Level 1 & Level 2 "learn to read" books at the library.

 

IMO, and I've shared this in the past here, learning to read is like potty training: as a mom, you can model correct behavior, get everything set up, practice, practice, practice, encourage, train, set timers, give rewards, bang your head against a wall, give up, take a break, try again, freak out, and none of it helps your kid make that "click" that needs to happen in their brain before s/he will be successful. Some do it on their own, some don't. Some do it earlier than others. Some pick it up all at once, others struggle on with the process for awhile before finally getting it. A small percentage need outside help (vision therapy, special dyslexia programs like Barton) before they will see success.

 

I've had my share of banging my head against a wall for both potty training & reading. I think you've gotten some good advice.

 

:grouphug:

[woolybear]

My older ds really didn't get it until age 9. My younger ds (turning 9 soon) is on the cusp of getting. For some kids it just takes time. I'm not saying that that is the only possibility in this case, just one possibility.:)

[Hedgehog]

Some more thoughts -

 

Tigger is 6, is now on the third box of the Bob Books; we started the first box at the beginning of September. But the curious thing was that he has actually been writing for a lot longer than he's been reading.

 

I think the general notion is that one learns to listen before speaking, and read before writing, but that hasn't been the case for Tigger. All through this year, he's been picking up random pieces of print - cereal boxes, papers, books, envelopes - and simply copying what he sees. To begin with, he had no idea what he was writing, even down to the letter sounds - it would be a bit like me copying out a Hebrew or Greek sentence; I'd be able to copy the shapes, but I wouldn't have any idea of the meaning or what my sentence sounded like.

 

I got him started on WWE 1 back in August; I figured that if he could copy words out of a dictionary, he might just as well be copying the WWE sentences. I've read the words to him, so at the time, he knows what he's writing, but he doesn't remember it beyond the day. He has no problem with narrations at the moment. We've taken it very slowly, and maybe done two "days" per week, but he loves it.

 

Through the repetition of writing the shapes, he has learned what sounds they make and from there to the sounds of two letters together, etc. It feels like he has learned it back to front, but it's been very successful.

 

Just something to think about.

[5 Hikers]

I agreed with you until this sentence. Some children, even without other issues, don't "get" reading until later than this. They just mature slower, but are none the worse for it in the end.

 

OP - it sounds like you are doing everything you can do. You could see if there is anything interfering with your dd's learning if you felt it appropriate, but if not I would just keep on with what you are doing, especially reading to her. Treat the rest as a non-pressure fun activity. She will be fine. :grouphug:

 

:iagree: My ds is 7 and he is still not fluent in reading. He does get phonics, but it is a chore sounding out every word. I was encouraged today when he did 4 pages of ETC book3, usually it is extremely difficult to get 2 done. Difficult for me, I can't stand how slow this process is.

 

One thing we changed was letting him read the same book over and over until he knows if perfectly and fluently. I thought this was cheating, but friends with early education degrees told me this is what it takes to become fluent. He will pick up Little Bear on his own now and read it just because he can. We still use Bob books too.

[PeterPan]

Get her eyes checked. I would go to a developmental optometrist http://www.covd.org

 

I know the money is real (believe me, I know!), but I don't get this whole avoidance of evaluations. Problems don't go away. Identify them early, treat them, and move on. Wait, hide your head in the sand, go through years of "Dang my kid isn't getting this no matter how hard I try and I don't get why" AND get the sadness of looking back and realizing the problems were there all along. There's just no need for that. Get the evals. First eyes, and depending on what happens with that, then an ed psych or neuropsych eval. There's just no need to wait and suffer.

 

Laurie4b has a terrific post on that btw. http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22834&highlight=heartbreak

[MerryAtHope]

(((Hugs))) I have been there--my oldest was 8 before we moved off of CVC words. He did take off quickly once we got there though. Hang in there--you are NOT failing your daughter, she WILL get it. Merry

[Gentlemommy]

:grouphug:Thank you all so much for taking the time to reply, and doing so with encouragement and gentleness. :grouphug:It really means a lot.

I will try to get to all the points...

 

I agree that we need a break from official phonics instruction. We are both frustrated, and I am not helping her confidence.:001_unsure:

I called today about vision therapy. Reading all the signs and symptoms on the website was eye opening...she meets almost all of them.

She is remarkably smart, can remember random information, is amazing at math concepts. She is a really bright little girl, which is why I am having such a hard time with this, kwim? She HAS made some progress, but I guess I just don't feel like this amount of struggle is normal...

I have tried many programs, and no, I haven't stuck with any one for a long time except for TRL, which we are doing now. I think what would happen is we would start, and it would get SO hard for her, that I thought "well maybe she isn't ready yet..." and shelve it. Well then she turned six and I felt like we should really get going on this reading thing! She is 6.5 now, and we are halfway through TRL. She can do max of two pages a day, and I've had her redo lessons two days in a row to really cement the concept.

 

Funny thing (well, not funny since I really am freaking out about this, butnkind of ironic) is that I've read all of the Better Late than Early type books. Beechick, Moores, the unschooling books...and I agree with them! But it's hard to see every.other. 5 and 6 Year old in coop or in the neighborhood able to real whole books(!) and dd is struggling with a few words on a page.

 

I do have Bob books, I will try those.

 

She does do MUcH better with an actual story over random words on a page...and she also does much better with writing. For example, today, she got stuck on the words 'was' and 'want'. After we did the lesson, I had her write a few words, and included those two and she got them right! It is literally 'lifting' the words off the page that is soooooooo hard for her.

 

Again, thank you for the replies and ideas. I am bookmarking the website suggestions to go read through. I really just want my little girls to feel successful at reading. It is such a divine thing to lose yourself in a book, I really want her to experience that and not struggle so much that it turns her off from reading forever.

[PeterPan]

Good, that's great that you're getting her eyes checked! Like you say, the disparity is part of the issue. It's definitely a reason to start looking for some answers. And personally, while I read the Moore's quite a bit when dd was a baby, I never considered that an excuse to ignore actual signs of a learning disability or physical problem. I just took the good that it meant for my situation (lots of real work, not pushing when there was no readiness or desire, the value of character, etc.).

[SonshineLearner]

My son is reading at 8... with no more than me just making him try a few times a week... (to read out loud) I wasn't worried, but the kids at co-op could read last year... (some of them) and I didn't want him to feel bad. Seriously though, at 8 he's ready. He doesn't want to read for himself, but he can. He would prefer to be read to... but at some point... ya gotta start. Unless you suspect a learning issue, allow yourself a break. Take it away for a while. Try to trick her. :) Read a book that's on her level, start it... and then have to "run an errand" for a bit... just leave it there open ready for her to sneak a peek :) Stuff like that :)

[JennW in SoCal]

Just wanting to add that neither of my boys were fluent readers until close to age 8. They, too, had friends reading big, fat, grown-up books early on, but I just kept reading aloud, doing phonics, using simple CVC books. It finally clicked. Dare I say that for my oldest, the first actual book he read was one of those guides to a PlayStation game? He still prefers non-fiction. For my youngest it was books of knock-knock jokes from the library. We suffered through months of really stupid jokes, but it got him reading fluently.

 

Fast forward 10 years and both graduated from high school early. Development just happens when it happens, but I agree with whoever it was that said to follow your gut. If you think something is just not right, then pursue some kind of testing.

[FairProspects]

Good, that's great that you're getting her eyes checked! Like you say, the disparity is part of the issue. It's definitely a reason to start looking for some answers.

 

:iagree:The disparity is what you are looking for, and for that you have to use your best judgement. You are not crazy, if you don't think it should be that hard for her, you are probably right that something is getting in the way (at least that was our experience). Then you just have to figure out what that something is.

Edited November 8, 2011 by FairProspects

[thebacabunch]

WHen I had the same issue I gave a prize (like a sticker) for a completed lesson. It has to be something the kids likes. I also got a huge stack of pony and unicorn books for my dd cause that is what she likes. Worked like a charm.

[wapiti]

She is remarkably smart, can remember random information, is amazing at math concepts. She is a really bright little girl, which is why I am having such a hard time with this, kwim? She HAS made some progress, but I guess I just don't feel like this amount of struggle is normal...

:grouphug: BTDT. FWIW, that intuition, about my bright but struggling dd, is exactly what led me to get her tested.

 

Good luck and let us know how things turn out.

[creekmom]

I'm so glad you're getting her tested for vision therapy. My ds (8) was/is the same... simply not getting it. I tried every reading program out there. Three weeks ago, I had him screened for vision therapy. According to their tests, his eyes were "working together" only 13% of the time! I had his vision tested a couple of years ago, and his eyes were fine. I had no idea that his eyes weren't working together as a team to focus on/read words! Vision therapy is pricey, but I'm crossing my fingers hoping it makes a difference! Good luck!

[Tracy]

It's like potty training. We freak out when they turn 3yo and are not potty trained. But truly, I have never met a high school student with normal health that wasn't potty trained. Same thing with reading. She will get it, and you will wonder why you were ever so concerned.

[Iucounu]

OP, I'm glad you've decided to listen to your inner voice. Your concerns are valid. Children are not identical when it comes to development, but it's simply untrue that it's normal to be years behind in reading skills based on neurological development.

[momsuz123]

To the OP, sorry, I didn't read every post, but I could have written your post not to long ago about my 6 y/o dd. She really wasn't "getting it". Even though we are a huge book reading family (have always done a lot of read alouds, etc) she just wasn't interested in reading. Wasn't getting it either. What I found out, after I pulled her from ps was this: she was trying to memorize every word she read. She had little to no knowledge of phonics. I bought AAS, and bam, she is now reading and getting it, and liking it. No, she doesn't love it as much as my 7 y/o who will read for 2-3 hours straight, but that is okay. They are all so different. Some history, she is also on her third set of hearing tubes for ear infections. She also had a sleep study which picked up her poor sleep, which a blood test picked up iron deficiency. Iron deficient kids have very poor ability to concentrate and focus. Now she is on mega supplements and that is helping too. Hang in there. It will come. Go with your gut. Find our what she is good at and let her show off her skills there also. My little one's self esteem has improved when her reading improved too. :grouphug:

[OrganicAnn]

My DD now 7 was similar. Very bright, but wasn't reading. We tried lots of things. People said she would just 'get it' and just wait. But I could tell she wasn't really making any progress, just lots of frustration.

 

We paid for private testing. It told us exactly what was going on. We are so glad we didn't wait and wait.

 

Vision testing is good if you think that is an issue.

 

You can travel down a lot of dead ends and spend a lot of money on programs that don't work for you.

[Melis]

Good Morning :)

 

First of all, :grouphug:

 

I read this quote recently that has helped me tremendously:

 

"You can't force a bud open, but you can water it every day."

 

Small and consistent steps. Every day. Don't quit. Keep on swimming. Don't expect anything yet. It can be hard, especially when we have external pressures. However, the more I am on this journey of parenting and schooling, the more I realize that children have their own timetable on when they do things or things just click for them. Our hsing job is to expose them to new learning experiences, and keep working on skills. Just keep at it. It will come.

 

Both of you may want to snuggle up and read "Leo the Late Bloomer" together.

 

:iagree: and big, big :grouphug: to you!

[PeterPan]

It's like potty training. We freak out when they turn 3yo and are not potty trained. But truly, I have never met a high school student with normal health that wasn't potty trained. Same thing with reading. She will get it, and you will wonder why you were ever so concerned.

 

Ok, I'm going to take issue with this. It IS possible to have a special needs child who doesn't potty train. As one with a child who hasn't trained yet (probably due to sensory issues), I'm keenly aware of this. A child not hitting normal developmental markers within the normal range IS significant. Just because you haven't heard of it, doesn't mean it doesn't happen. And all the platitudes in the world won't assuage the horrible REGRET people feel when their kid is 10, 12, 15, (or older, we have had seniors come onto the SN board needing VT!) where you glossed over problems, saying it would work out someday, and it DIDN'T.

 

Whether it's eyes or potty training or anything else, you shouldn't ignore the signs when your dc has indications of needing evaluations and is missing the normal *range* of development.

 

And the potty training has nothing to do with health. It's sensory and neurological development, the very same types of things that affect the eyes and leave the dc needing VT.

[melissel]

Ok, I'm going to take issue with this. It IS possible to have a special needs child who doesn't potty train. As one with a child who hasn't trained yet (probably due to sensory issues), I'm keenly aware of this. A child not hitting normal developmental markers within the normal range IS significant. Just because you haven't heard of it, doesn't mean it doesn't happen. And all the platitudes in the world won't assuage the horrible REGRET people feel when their kid is 10, 12, 15, (or older, we have had seniors come onto the SN board needing VT!) where you glossed over problems, saying it would work out someday, and it DIDN'T.

 

Whether it's eyes or potty training or anything else, you shouldn't ignore the signs when your dc has indications of needing evaluations and is missing the normal *range* of development.

 

And the potty training has nothing to do with health. It's sensory and neurological development, the very same types of things that affect the eyes and leave the dc needing VT.

 

To be fair, Tracy did say "with normal health," which I took to mean special needs of any kind, neurological and physical.

 

Gentlemommy, I came to the board today to ask a question very similar to yours. My DD is 6 years 2 months, and I'm not seeing the progress I'd like at this point, although I HAVE seen progress since this time last year (when I was stressing about her not being able to remember the letter sounds that I just reminded her of moments earlier!).

 

I think I'm going to dive into the vision therapy thing too. I'm not entirely convinced she fits all the symptoms on the site, but a little bell is ringing in my ear. It just stinks that this kid is about to start speech therapy (for a lisp) and asthma/breathing-related investigations, in addition to us all going dairy-free in January! :banghead:

 

Anyway, my point is, I'm right there with you :grouphug: My DD9 was a natural reader, the kid who taught herself to read and was reading me street signs and truck labels 2 months after her 4th birthday. Like you, I didn't expect to be struggling so much the second time around. I hope you can find the answers you need!

[Tigger]

For what it's worth, I think looking at progress is important, especially when your DD is just six. I'm not suggesting you don't have her eyes checked - her vision is important in learning to read....but I am saying that sometimes our expectations are not aligned with the progress we think they should have and the progress they really are making.

 

Last year, when DS was six, I was extremely worried about his lack of reading *progress* - I did not recognize his progress for what it was and only focused on that he was still sounding out words and still really only confident with CVC words....I didn't see that he was blending more and more, or that he was growing in confidence reading new material.....I **thought** he should be reading faster, easier, and more difficult material. It was MY problem, not his!

 

When I finally stepped back and really looked at what he WAS doing, I realized he was making progress; albeit slower than I expected, but it was there, slow but steady....progress....progress matters a lot in determining if there is a problem or not.

 

DS was in fact making progress and it was a friend of mine who pointed that out (she's a reading teacher) and she got me to calm down and continue to do what we were doing, continue to watch progress signs and if things did not continue to track slow and steady, then do something.

 

Now, he's just turned 7 and sure enough, he's made incredible progress from last year this time - while he's still gaining in fluency, he does know his sounds, his blends, his phonics, etc. - it's getting them all together and reading his still working on for fluency, but he can sound any word out now and can spell anything too. Each day, I see a small measure of progress now and some days I'm just jumping with joy when he reads something fluently.....even if it is something he's read before......and now, even when it's something he's never seen before (that's progress).

 

By year's end I think it'll totally click and he'll be fine.....if I compare him to his friends in the same grade (second) he's smack dab in the middle of them - some read better, some read worse. If I compare him to the grade he'd be in if he were attending the PS (first), he's actually doing well....so context matters too.

[PeterPan]

To be fair, Tracy did say "with normal health," which I took to mean special needs of any kind, neurological and physical.

 

I think many people with kids who are going to turn out to be SN don't think of them that way when the dc is 4,5,6, 7, even when they're seeing the signs. They don't think of them as unhealthy or abnormal or anything else. When you're in the moment, raising your dc, that dc IS normal, his normal.

[GingerPoppy]

For what it's worth, I think looking at progress is important, especially when your DD is just six. I'm not suggesting you don't have her eyes checked - her vision is important in learning to read....but I am saying that sometimes our expectations are not aligned with the progress we think they should have and the progress they really are making.

 

Last year, when DS was six, I was extremely worried about his lack of reading *progress* - I did not recognize his progress for what it was and only focused on that he was still sounding out words and still really only confident with CVC words....I didn't see that he was blending more and more, or that he was growing in confidence reading new material.....I **thought** he should be reading faster, easier, and more difficult material. It was MY problem, not his!

 

When I finally stepped back and really looked at what he WAS doing, I realized he was making progress; albeit slower than I expected, but it was there, slow but steady....progress....progress matters a lot in determining if there is a problem or not.

 

DS was in fact making progress and it was a friend of mine who pointed that out (she's a reading teacher) and she got me to calm down and continue to do what we were doing, continue to watch progress signs and if things did not continue to track slow and steady, then do something.

 

Now, he's just turned 7 and sure enough, he's made incredible progress from last year this time - while he's still gaining in fluency, he does know his sounds, his blends, his phonics, etc. - it's getting them all together and reading his still working on for fluency, but he can sound any word out now and can spell anything too. Each day, I see a small measure of progress now and some days I'm just jumping with joy when he reads something fluently.....even if it is something he's read before......and now, even when it's something he's never seen before (that's progress).

 

By year's end I think it'll totally click and he'll be fine.....if I compare him to his friends in the same grade (second) he's smack dab in the middle of them - some read better, some read worse. If I compare him to the grade he'd be in if he were attending the PS (first), he's actually doing well....so context matters too.

:iagree: And this is what I was trying to get at, but you've put it much better than I did. Great post.

[Tracy]

Ok, I'm going to take issue with this. It IS possible to have a special needs child who doesn't potty train. As one with a child who hasn't trained yet (probably due to sensory issues), I'm keenly aware of this. A child not hitting normal developmental markers within the normal range IS significant. Just because you haven't heard of it, doesn't mean it doesn't happen. And all the platitudes in the world won't assuage the horrible REGRET people feel when their kid is 10, 12, 15, (or older, we have had seniors come onto the SN board needing VT!) where you glossed over problems, saying it would work out someday, and it DIDN'T.

 

 

To be fair, Tracy did say "with normal health," which I took to mean special needs of any kind, neurological and physical.

 

 

Yes, I did say "normal health," and I also have a younger child that is borderline SPD, and I have worked professionally with special needs children and adults. When I wrote this, I made the mistake of not reading through the whole thread first, and the OP's original post did not mention a concern over possible LD's. I was trying to provide encouragement using an analogy that so many of us can identify with--potty training. Many, many children read late, and not because of any sort of disability. And since most people wouldn't consider 6yo late for reading, it seemed appropriate to advise to give it a little time. Obviously, there were more concerns mentioned later in the thread that I did not see when I wrote this, which make my advice less helpful.

[Quiver0f10]

Get her eyes checked. I would go to a developmental optometrist www.covd.org

 

I know the money is real (believe me, I know!), but I don't get this whole avoidance of evaluations. Problems don't go away. Identify them early, treat them, and move on. Wait, hide your head in the sand, go through years of "Dang my kid isn't getting this no matter how hard I try and I don't get why" AND get the sadness of looking back and realizing the problems were there all along. There's just no need for that. Get the evals. First eyes, and depending on what happens with that, then an ed psych or neuropsych eval. There's just no need to wait and suffer.

 

Laurie4b has a terrific post on that btw. http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22834&highlight=heartbreak

 

My DD now 7 was similar. Very bright, but wasn't reading. We tried lots of things. People said she would just 'get it' and just wait. But I could tell she wasn't really making any progress, just lots of frustration.

 

We paid for private testing. It told us exactly what was going on. We are so glad we didn't wait and wait.

 

Vision testing is good if you think that is an issue.

 

You can travel down a lot of dead ends and spend a lot of money on programs that don't work for you.

 

I agree with the above. My 12 yo struggled to learn to read. Everyone told me that he would get it. That he just needed time. Boys read later than girls. That I needed to relax. I knew something was off and I regret waiting to get him tested. (neuro-psych eval) After testing we found out he needed VT as well as other therapies and was dyslexic among other LD.

 

Here is a nice list of the warning signs that it might be dyslexia: http://bartonreading.com/pdf/Dys%20warning%20signs.pdf

[ElizabethB]

She does do MUcH better with an actual story over random words on a page...and she also does much better with writing. For example, today, she got stuck on the words 'was' and 'want'. After we did the lesson, I had her write a few words, and included those two and she got them right! It is literally 'lifting' the words off the page that is soooooooo hard for her.

 

:grouphug:

 

While you are getting vision tested and worked on, you can do some oral and written spelling. Also, does she do better when you write words really big in uppercase on a white board? If so, you can just re-write everything for a while.

[JMDRAD]

I do not have time to read through all the replies on this thread, but I just wanted to say that I have a friend whose son was 8 before he started reading. She thought something was wrong with him. She thought he was lazy. She tried many different strategies and curriculum. When he turned 8 it all just clicked. He's a teenager now and doing quite well in school.

 

Keep working at it, as patiently as possible. It could be that she's just a late bloomer. Good luck!

[Gentlemommy]

Thank you all so much for all of your replies and suggestions. Thought I'd update a little, I hope that is ok.:001_smile:

I've called and made an appointment with an optometrist from the COVD to have her eyes checked. They were booked solid until next year(!) but had one cancellation on December 23, so we went ahead and took that.

I've decided to put away our phonics curriculum until then. Since doing that, she has actually pulled it out to show her grandma, and read to her from it! :lol:

I talked to her about having her eyes checked and she is very hesitant, but I explained that I think that is the reason why reading is so difficult, and she seems more open to going now.

We are playing Elizabeths phonics game with a lot of success!!! She likes it, and it is low stress, which we both need right now.

Since she seems to do better with writing, I'm just having her write words down, and re read them to me. We use paper and a white board. I ordered ETC workbooks, figuring that the written part would help her.

 

And best of all, I realized she actually KNOWS a lot of the phonics 'rules'!!! She knows them, she just has a hard time reading text. However, after playing Elizabeths game once, she could sound out ANY combination of letters----correctly! I had no clue she could do that. She is enjoying playing word scramble with me using our homemade AAS letter tiles. She pulls the letters for a word, scrambles them up, and I have to unscramble them.

 

Soooo, all this to say, THANK YOU all so much. What a blessing it is to be able to post a concern here and get so many thoughtful responses, great advice, and encouragement. :grouphug:

[Iucounu]

Good for you, OP. People in your situation have an uncomfortable choice: believe in the unproven myth of the years-late "late bloomer" with no problems, and take a blind leap of faith that it applies to their child who's struggling, or take steps to find more information. It can be agonizing, because no one wants to cause their child undue stress. I think you've made the right choice, as visits to the doctor aren't going to harm your child, and you'll have more information. Please report back if you have the time and inclination.