Afterlife of Athiests??

[stephanier.1765]

Dead, Gone, The End sums it up pretty well for me. I suppose there are people out there who might be frighted by that idea but I'm quite content with that being that.

[Peela]

If so, if there is no promise of 'reward' in an after-life, why conduct yourself morally? or do you? I mean obviously you don't want to spend this life in jail, etc... but hopefully you understand what I mean.

 

 

I think its very sad that some people only behave well in this life because of a certain reward in the next. Or, that that might be used to manipulate kids into behaving well.

Believe it or not, beautiful and moral behaviour is intrinsic and inherently human- as is the opposite at times. But at heart, I believe humans are good. What makes them behave badly is usually bad conditioning or wounding.

 

I don't really know what happens after death but I have read enough near death experiences and meditated for years, and I believe it is a release from the body- the spirit is released. I know I am not my body- I, as a spirit, a spiritual being, inhabit the body, and one day the body will die- but not me. I suspect there is reincarnation but I don't know. I am curious to find out. I believe that there is some sort of life after death though, and that it is also a learning place, as is this world.

[leeannpal]

I think its very sad that some people only behave well in this life because of a certain reward in the next. Or, that that might be used to manipulate kids into behaving well.

Believe it or not, beautiful and moral behaviour is intrinsic and inherently human- as is the opposite at times. But at heart, I believe humans are good. What makes them behave badly is usually bad conditioning or wounding.

 

I don't really know what happens after death but I have read enough near death experiences and meditated for years, and I believe it is a release from the body- the spirit is released. I know I am not my body- I, as a spirit, a spiritual being, inhabit the body, and one day the body will die- but not me. I suspect there is reincarnation but I don't know. I am curious to find out. I believe that there is some sort of life after death though, and that it is also a learning place, as is this world.

 

I agree with this although I am a Christian. I know what i believe, but, truthfully, none of us can know for sure until we are faced with death. I do not think morality is tied to any certain religion. I've been lucky enough to have friends that practice several different religions and all have been highly moral.

[Audrey]

I think I've pretty much had it up to my eyeballs with threads like these lately. Bait all you want. Even if you say you aren't baiting, there is a whole posse out there just waiting to jump into this thread and proselytize.

 

Oh, look! They've already arrived. :glare:

 

So, I'm not playing.

[Rosie_0801]

That being said, why so many religious threads? I'm new, so maybe it's always like this. I felt like I found a home here....but if there is always this much religious discussion, I am really disheartened and confused. I have found these forums a true gift, but there are at least 6 threads going on right now about religion, faith, lack thereof, etc. Is it always like this?

 

Nup. It goes in cycles. You can still be part of the Hive without reading any of them :)

 

Rosie

[Anita in NC]

I'm an atheist, and I conduct myself morally because I feel compassion and a sense of responsibility to other individuals, living beings, and our planet.

 

If someone can't do that without a god, I feel relieved for them to follow one. They obviously need an exterior conscience, and other human beings need to be protected from them. That's my response every time I'm asked this question.

 

I don't know what happens when people die, but I tend to think it's the end.

That's what I put in the poll.

 

:iagree:

[mommymilkies]

I believe in reincarnation. I will say that my next choice would be Ancient Egypt afterlife beliefs. Mostly because I just love anything Egyptian. :lol:

[astrid]

e

If I am wrong, and it's all hogwash, I still conducted myself well...and I end up dust... If I am right then that is horrible news for unbelievers...

 

How so?

 

astrid

[astrid]

I think I've pretty much had it up to my eyeballs with threads like these lately. Bait all you want. Even if you say you aren't baiting, there is a whole posse out there just waiting to jump into this thread and proselytize.

 

Oh, look! They've already arrived. :glare:

 

So, I'm not playing.

 

Yes. This. It's like there's a quota out there--- some minister says from the pulpit one Sunday last month, 'Go engage and preach to some atheists this week--- EXTRA HEAVEN POINTS!" :D

 

astrid

[freethinkermama]

How so?

 

astrid

 

My guess?

We're going to hell.

 

Of course, perhaps I'm wrong and the OP will come in and explain it herself.

 

I'm not coming back in to this thread either, I'm packing for my trip down below :)

[Janie Grace]

I think I've pretty much had it up to my eyeballs with threads like these lately. Bait all you want. Even if you say you aren't baiting, there is a whole posse out there just waiting to jump into this thread and proselytize.

 

Oh, look! They've already arrived. :glare:

 

 

 

I just read this whole thread out of interest, as I have many family members who are atheists and vary on their thoughts about this topic (I'm not an atheist so didn't vote)... I don't see any proselytizing. Did I miss something? :confused:

 

ETA: Nevermind. I found it. :(

[Pretty in Pink]

Being a person of faith (however undefined I may find that faith at this present time), I do not base my moral compass on any promise of rewards in the afterlife. Why would I expect anyone else to? Additionally, and I'm sure someone has already beat me to this, but is there any reason to assume that religious or faithful individuals have the market cornered on morality? I don't think so.

 

Religious does not equal moral. Non-religious does not equal immoral.

[Audrey]

nm

[Cindyz]

That being said, why so many religious threads? I'm new, so maybe it's always like this. I felt like I found a home here....but if there is always this much religious discussion, I am really disheartened and confused. I have found these forums a true gift, but there are at least 6 threads going on right now about religion, faith, lack thereof, etc. Is it always like this?

 

I'm going to say yes. If there isn't something on the general forum, you can find something similar going on in one of the curriculum forums. Usually I find it interesting and it gives me an insight into thought processes that I previously didn't understand. If it starts to get annoying, I just don't go there. There's enough other really good stuff here that it's worth filtering out what you're not interested in.

[Jenny in Atl]

I haven't a clue what will happen... I find comfort in knowing my matter will go back into the earth, and my energy will once again be a part of the Universe, off to create something new. Where my "soul" will go, I guess I will find out, and I hope I brave embracing the journey.

[leeannpal]

I just read this whole thread out of interest, as I have many family members who are atheists and vary on their thoughts about this topic (I'm not an atheist so didn't vote)... I don't see any proselytizing. Did I miss something? :confused:

 

ETA: Nevermind. I found it. :(

 

I'm new here and was wondering the same thing. to me, a message board for home schooling is not a great place for proselytizing at all. I know it's cliche, but can't we all just agree to disagree ??:confused:

[Jennifer3141]

I don't care what happens to me when I die. I don't care what happens to you when you die. If everyone lived their lives as if THIS one counted, we'd have a pretty cool planet.

 

Some of the worst people I've ever met in my life are Christians. I've met a child molesting minister. (15 is NOT a woman!) I've met a Christian doctor so vile that the entire community is working to have him lose his license. I think anyone who thinks morality and Christianity are the same thing should have their head examined by professionals.

 

Isn't this Ham guy a Christian? It makes me laugh that atheists and agnostics are being questioned so much recently when there's all the drama about who is going to hell on FB. Isn't there an expression about a plank in your eye in the bible somewhere???

 

Some of the Christians out there need to mind their own houses, IMO.

Edited April 3, 2011 by Jennifer3141

[Rosie_0801]

I'm new here and was wondering the same thing. to me, a message board for home schooling is not a great place for proselytizing at all. I know it's cliche, but can't we all just agree to disagree ??:confused:

 

Nope. Religion is too important to some people for that to be possible.

 

If it helps, some things that look like proselytizing are not proselytizing in spirit. Some of what looks like proselytizing is to correct what the poster believes are incorrect representations of their faith. They are not actively trying to convert you, they are trying to protect their deity/their denomination from slander (without the judgment that the "incorrect" person is misrepresenting deliberately.) And, it seems to me, as an extension, making sure that people who don't believe are not believing for the right reasons.

 

None of that stops it being annoying or even offensive to people who don't want to hear about it, of course. Knowing the motivation can sometimes lessen the irritation levels though.

 

Does that make sense? :lol:

 

:)

Rosie

Edited April 3, 2011 by Rosie_0801

[SEP]

Nope. Religion is too important to some people for that to be possible.

 

If it helps, some things that look like proselytizing are not proselytizing in spirit. Some of what looks like proselytizing is to correct what the poster believes are incorrect representations of their faith. They are not actively trying to convert you, they are trying to protect their deity/their denomination from slander (without the judgment that the "incorrect" person is misrepresenting deliberately.) And, it seems to me, as an extension, making sure that people who don't believe are not believing for the right reasons.

 

None of that stops it being annoying or even offensive to people who don't want to hear about it, of course. Knowing the motivation can sometimes lessen the irritation levels though.

 

Does that make sense? :lol:

 

:)

Rosie

 

i could not have said it better myself.

[NanceXToo]

Sometimes I'm truly baffled by attitudes I've run across that seem to imply that you have to be Christian/religious to have morals.

 

Non-Christian/Non-Religious people are perfectly capable of knowing right from wrong, harmful from helpful and of simply treating other people as they would like to be treated.

 

I follow the "golden rule" and teach my children to do so, also. We refrain from hurting others. We try to help others when we can (community service and in day to day life).

 

I don't do these things because I'm afraid that I'll go to "hell" if I don't or miss out on some big "reward" after I die. I do them because it feels pleasant to do so and makes the world a nicer place and so on. Some of the most "moral," kind, and quick-to-help out people I know are atheists, agnostics, etc. Some of the most judgmental and unfriendly people I know call themselves Christians.

 

Then, too, I've got some GREAT Christian friends...

 

We're all individuals, and we've all got our own innate moral code and in my experience, it really has nothing to do with religion one way or the other.

[swimmermom3]

I think I've pretty much had it up to my eyeballs with threads like these lately. Bait all you want. Even if you say you aren't baiting, there is a whole posse out there just waiting to jump into this thread and proselytize.

 

Oh, look! They've already arrived. :glare:

 

So, I'm not playing.

 

Audrey, I am sorry it has been this way. It seems as though in the intervening years since I decided that I made a very poor Christian, there has been little time to reflect on exactly what I am or what I believe. Reading the threads for atheists and agnostics over the past two years has provided some powerful personal insight. It would be better to have real people (not that you all aren't real, you know what I mean) to discuss ideas and questions with, but they are not there at this point.

 

I appreciate the thoughts and reflections shared by you, Secular Mom, Peela and many others when posters aren't being baited. There have been a few threads were there has been genuine discourse and civil debate on both sides. Those are my favorites as they provide an opportunity to sort through my own beliefs and to learn from some of the fine rhetoric being practiced.

 

I hope that some of the less-than-gracious threads will not silence the minority voices. I also appreciate the Christian voices or voices of other faiths that engage in respectful and intelligent dialogue. Thank you.

[Geek]

I have no idea. I live my life as though when I die, I'll be gone. Something that gives me comfort is the idea that my cells will be recycled via cremation and returned to the earth. I have atoms in my body now that may have been part of a star in the universe's distant past, and my atoms will become something else again. I find this recycling idea very comforting.

 

I cherish this life because I really believe it's all I'll have. Sure, it'd be great to discover otherwise, but I'm not counting on it. When I did believe, I didn't value this life as much because I saw my existence as an eternal thing where I'd get lots of chances to make things right. Now I believe I won't get many chances at all to make things right with those I care about and I'd better do it now while I have the chance. Each moment is full of sharp clarity because I believe the evidence shows these moments are finite.

 

I believe the mind is an emergent property of the brain, and I am open to the idea that may mean *something* survives upon death. But I don't think of it as an ethereal body, an eternal soul. It's not a clear idea in my head, but I've been influenced by people like atheist physicist Douglas Hofstadter.

Edited April 3, 2011 by Geek

[Just Robyn]

I have no idea. I live my life as though when I die, I'll be gone. Something that gives me comfort is the idea that my cells will be recycled via cremation and returned to the earth. I have atoms in my body now that may have been part of a star in the universe's distant past, and my atoms will become something else again. I find this recycling idea very comforting.

 

I believe the mind is an emergent property of the brain, and I am open to the idea that may mean *something* survives upon death. But I don't think of it as an ethereal body, an eternal soul. It's not a clear idea in my head, but I've been influenced by people like atheist physicist Douglas Hofstadter.

 

Just looked him up on amazon and there are so many books. Do you have a favorite? The title I Am a Strange Loop jumped out at me.

[Audrey]

Audrey, I am sorry it has been this way. It seems as though in the intervening years since I decided that I made a very poor Christian, there has been little time to reflect on exactly what I am or what I believe. Reading the threads for atheists and agnostics over the past two years has provided some powerful personal insight. It would be better to have real people (not that you all aren't real, you know what I mean) to discuss ideas and questions with, but they are not there at this point.

 

I appreciate the thoughts and reflections shared by you, Secular Mom, Peela and many others when posters aren't being baited. There have been a few threads were there has been genuine discourse and civil debate on both sides. Those are my favorites as they provide an opportunity to sort through my own beliefs and to learn from some of the fine rhetoric being practiced.

 

I hope that some of the less-than-gracious threads will not silence the minority voices. I also appreciate the Christian voices or voices of other faiths that engage in respectful and intelligent dialogue. Thank you.

 

 

Yes. It isn't always baiting and sometimes we do have good discussions (at least until the proselytization posse shows up).

 

I don't have much patience for it today, though. Another time perhaps...

[Geek]

Just looked him up on amazon and there are so many books. Do you have a favorite? The title I Am a Strange Loop jumped out at me.

His pièce de résistance that won him the Pulitzer is Godel, Escher, Bach. It is brilliant. And it's a mighty dense tome, lol.

 

But I Am a Strange Loop--a far more accessible work imo--explains exactly how a mind, the illusion of a Self, can and does emerge from a purely material brain. It was this work that pushed me over the edge into atheism, along with the work of scientists like

. Edited April 3, 2011 by Geek

[secular_mom]

I have no idea. I live my life as though when I die, I'll be gone. Something that gives me comfort is the idea that my cells will be recycled via cremation and returned to the earth. I have atoms in my body now that may have been part of a star in the universe's distant past, and my atoms will become something else again. I find this recycling idea very comforting.

 

I cherish this life because I really believe it's all I'll have. Sure, it'd be great to discover otherwise, but I'm not counting on it. When I did believe, I didn't value this life as much because I saw my existence as an eternal thing where I'd get lots of chances to make things right. Now I believe I won't get many chances at all to make things right with those I care about and I'd better do it now while I have the chance. Each moment is full of sharp clarity because I believe the evidence shows these moments are finite.

 

I believe the mind is an emergent property of the brain, and I am open to the idea that may mean *something* survives upon death. But I don't think of it as an ethereal body, an eternal soul. It's not a clear idea in my head, but I've been influenced by people like atheist physicist Douglas Hofstadter.

:iagree:People even do horrible things in the name of religion because they think they'll be rewarded for it in an afterlife. I've heard many people (even family members) say things that imply that they are just waiting for Jesus to come and take them to heaven, they can't wait to be done 'with this old world'. I feel sad for them when they say such things.

 

I don't believe in a spirit that is separate from our body, it just doesn't make sense and brings up even more questions. If we are imparted with some sort of spirit, when does that happen? At conception? What about identical twins? Is that zygote given two spirits? Or does one spirit split in two? What about people who have brain injuries that completely alter their personalities? Does that 'spirit' still answer for the 'sins' that the previous personality committed? Or do they get a complete do over? Or do they now have a completely different spirit and the previous one died? If the previous one died then how did they get a new one? Where did the other one go? What about people with multiple personalities? Are their bodies occupied by more than one spirit? How can you tell the difference between a human spirit and say, a demon? How can you tell the difference between a demon and an angel? What if God is real and he's the bad guy and he overthrew Lucifer? I mean, if *I* was really the bad guy in that whole story then I'd be sure to write a book about myself that made me look good and made people distrust the good guy. :tongue_smilie:

[nd293]

I don't teach my children to behave morally for fear of punishment after death! I want them to do the right thing because it's the right thing. That's why I make the choices I do. And if I do the wrong thing, I try to do better next time.

 

I believe suspect that dead is dead, and that's what I voted, but if I'm wrong, it wouldn't change how I live at all.

[Geek]

I don't teach my children to behave morally for fear of punishment after death! I want them to do the right thing because it's the right thing. That's why I make the choices I do. And if I do the wrong thing, I try to do better next time.

 

I believe suspect that dead is dead, and that's what I voted, but if I'm wrong, it wouldn't change how I live at all.

Wow. I agree with every word. Well said.

[Mergath]

I'm not an atheist, but I don't behave morally to please my gods, either. I don't think my God and Goddess particularly care if I behave in a societally acceptable manner. Death and pain are a part of life, and the gods trying to keep us from causing this would be unnatural. The gods don't tell animals not to hurt each other and smite them if they're naughty. It's up to us to cause as little pain as we can, because as humans, we are uniquely capable of both experiencing physical and emotional pain, and of preventing harm. Like most Pagans, I do what makes me happy as long as it doesn't cause harm to myself or others. Yes, it is impossible to never hurt anyone ever, but most of us live in such a way as to cause as little pain as possible.

 

I'll just avoid the afterlife question, since I'm not an atheist. I wanted to respond to the non-Christian = immoral bit, though.

[SEP]

 

I'll just avoid the afterlife question, since I'm not an atheist. I wanted to respond to the non-Christian = immoral bit, though.

 

I did not see anyone imply or state that non-Christian= immoral... did i miss that?

[Desert Rat]

I have no reward waiting for me after I die but I act morally and raise moral children because it's right. It's a good way to live, not because someone father (or mother) figure is looming over me waiting in judgement. I fought long and hard to win my Methodist minister father over to my idea that morality isn't based on religion rather I love of oneself, others and the world as a whole.

I voted for I have no idea only because OP didn't have an other category. We are energy. Energy doesn't die or go away. I think our energy continues on after our bodies die but I don't know in what form. I don't believe in a traditional afterlife like Heaven or Hell. I might believe reincarnation because it's a transfer of energy.

[Mergath]

I did not see anyone imply or state that non-Christian= immoral... did i miss that?

 

Oh good grief, you know what I mean. Here:

 

Not having a god who tells you explicitly what to do = potentially immoral because how else could you possibly know how to behave?

 

Better?

[secular_mom]

If so, if there is no promise of 'reward' in an after-life, why conduct yourself morally? or do you? I mean obviously you don't want to spend this life in jail, etc... but hopefully you understand what I mean.

 

 

 

 

So, from this point on, it's like I have a moral compass in me that I have never had before. the curse words that used to come out like firecrackers now have a sting in my heart. drinking beer is no longer fun. i have conviction bit by bit about things in my life that do not line up with a 'Holy' life. pre-marital sex? forget it. not worth the fact that I feel so terrible afterwards. dirty movies? nope. eventually, the Holy Spirit starts working on things less obvious like my 'tone', my attitude, etc... He stills works on me about every 5 mins because I am far from perfect.

 

 

 

My question is without a source of absolutes in which to take your moral compass from, how do you know what IS moral? Where does the right and wrong come from? This is a serious question and I am not being facetious at all. I really do want to know where atheists glean their morals from. And I know you have them, I know some really great atheists. :)

 

I did not see anyone imply or state that non-Christian= immoral... did i miss that?

The above words in red are the bits that I think imply that some of you think that a person who is not Christian is not or can not be moral.

The second one is iffy, because I do understand what you are saying, but it can feel like you are saying you have a moral compass that we cannot or do not have. KWIM?

[ThatCyndiGirl]

I did not see anyone imply or state that non-Christian= immoral... did i miss that?

 

 

In your OP you stated, "if there is no promise of 'reward' in an after-life, why conduct yourself morally? or do you? I mean obviously you don't want to spend this life in jail, etc... but hopefully you understand what I mean."

 

Did we misunderstand that phrasing? :confused:

 

It seems to say, in effect, "if you don't have religion then what reason do you have for moral living". I could see how we could extrapolate that to non-xian=immoral.

[SEP]

hmm... for the record, I do not believe that you have to be a Christian to be moral.

 

as the thread progressed, i was (but this has been asked and answered) curious as to what the driving force/moral code was for that morality, if it were not because of a 'higher' power.

 

not to be rude, but i cannot think like an atheist because i have always been taught/believed in a higher power, even before I really knew what that meant. my parents taught me my values based on their knowledge, so on and so forth...

 

so, i really wanted to know some background on how that works...

[Marylou]

I've heard many people (even family members) say things that imply that they are just waiting for Jesus to come and take them to heaven, they can't wait to be done 'with this old world'. I feel sad for them when they say such things.

 

 

 

It's been a while since I read Dawkin's The God Delusion, but I think I remember him saying something about Christians and the hope of heaven. If it is really so grand, why are they not committing suicide more often :001_huh: I would have to get it back out of the library and look up the page number.

[redsquirrel]

 

If so, if there is no promise of 'reward' in an after-life, why conduct yourself morally?

 

I believe my life ends when I die. Matter moves from place to place. It comes together temporarily to be you. Then it is not you. End. I think that is pretty cool.

 

Who says conduct I myself morally for a reward?

 

Some of us don't need the promise of a reward to strive every day to love our neighbor as ourselves.

[Lovedtodeath]

I voted in the poll.

Edited April 3, 2011 by Lovedtodeath

[secular_mom]

It's been a while since I read Dawkin's The God Delusion, but I think I remember him saying something about Christians and the hope of heaven. If it is really so grand, why are they not committing suicide more often :001_huh: I would have to get it back out of the library and look up the page number.

That may have been in reply to others asking the question of him and other atheists- If there is no higher purpose to life then why don't you kill yourself now? People seriously and sincerely ask such questions. The fact that I am an atheist severely offends some people-not my behavior, and not because I go around screaming "I'm an atheist" or anything like that. They can be happily chatting along and preaching to me about whatever, and when they ASK me what denomination we are and I answer the question they asked with, "We don't attend church. I don't believe in any gods and so far neither do my children" they are horrified and act as though I've just stripped naked and masturbated in front of them or something even worse than that. It's astonishing really.

[Geek]

 

They can be happily chatting along and preaching to me about whatever, and when they ASK me what denomination we are and I answer the question they asked with, "We don't attend church. I don't believe in any gods and so far neither do my children" they are horrified and act as though I've just stripped naked and masturbated in front of them or something even worse than that. It's astonishing really.

Amazing, isn't it? :001_huh:

[JennifersLost]

I've always assumed we go on to our real "work" after we're done being human beings. I think of this life (or lives - I kind of hope I have a few tries at it) as training. I just assume that compassion, truth, love, understanding and so on are skills we need in whatever happens 'next' - and since these skills are hard to learn, I figure whatever job we're getting ready to do is pretty big and complicated.

[Geek]

 

I've always assumed we go on to our real "work" after we're done being human beings. I think of this life (or lives - I kind of hope I have a few tries at it) as training. I just assume that compassion, truth, love, understanding and so on are skills we need in whatever happens 'next' - and since these skills are hard to learn, I figure whatever job we're getting ready to do is pretty big and complicated.

I hope you don't mind me asking, but you have me really curious. How does all of this mesh (or not) with any belief in god(s)? I truly mean no disrespect, only curiosity to understand this perspective.

[AnthemLights]

It's been a while since I read Dawkin's The God Delusion, but I think I remember him saying something about Christians and the hope of heaven. If it is really so grand, why are they not committing suicide more often :001_huh: I would have to get it back out of the library and look up the page number.

 

I didn't read the whole thread but this post just jumped out at me. I am a Christian, very much looking forward to being in heaven and seeing my Jesus. But while I am here on this earth, I feel like God has a purpose for me. Once I have accomplished that purpose, then he will take me home. In HIS time, not mine.

 

But my prayer every day is "Even so come, Lord Jesus". I cannot wait. :001_smile:

[talexand]

Not being alive is not something I can easily comprehend. I let go of trying to wrap my head around it by realizing that I was already not alive for most of time. I was born a blink of an eye ago. Before that I didn't exist and it didn't bother me much. I don't see how it will be any worse after my short little life is over. Why do I need an afterlife? I didn't have a beforelife.

[kalanamak]

 

I'd vote for recycled, but that's not a choice.

 

Sweetly through the sappy stalk

Of the vigorous weed,

Holding all it held before,

Cherished by the faithful sun,

On and on eternally

Shall your altered fluid run,

Bud and bloom and go to seed;

But your singing days are done;

But the music of your talk

Never shall the chemistry

Of the secret earth restore.

 

-- an except of Elegy by Millay

[Mama Butterfly]

Quote by Secular Mom

" What if God is real and he's the bad guy and he overthrew Lucifer? I mean, if *I* was really the bad guy in that whole story then I'd be sure to write a book about myself that made me look good and made people distrust the good guy. :tongue_smilie:"

 

Wow, I never thought outside the box like that before. Great food for though. I like it!

Edited April 3, 2011 by Mama Butterfly
To give credit to the author of the quote. Still trying to figure out how to quote correctly.

[Nakia]

OP, did you really think you were going to go from:

 

"What do atheists believe happen when you die?"

 

to:

 

"If so, if there is no promise of 'reward' in an after-life, why conduct yourself morally? or do you? "

 

 

without offending people? I think the first question is very interesting and could have sparked some cool conversation. But that last one???? Seriously???? I am a Jesus freak, and I am offended. When my husband and I were writing our wills, we were trying to think of the most wonderful people to leave our children with should anything happen to the both of us. Whom did we pick? My brother (a Christian) and my atheist sister-law, who happens to be the most kind and loving soul I have ever met. I wonder sometimes at how blessed we are to have her in our family.

[Peela]

My question is without a source of absolutes in which to take your moral compass from, how do you know what IS moral? Where does the right and wrong come from? This is a serious question and I am not being facetious at all. I really do want to know where atheists glean their morals from. And I know you have them, I know some really great atheists. :)

 

So without a religion, that is, an external source of guidelines that tell us what to do and what not to do, you think we would be all killing each other, being selfish, etc?

Actually, being moral, behaving in a selfless way, is inherently self -preserving which may be why many of us feel that morality is an inner quality- we have an inner moral compass. It might well be a survival mechanism.

Treating others how you would like to be treated is foundational to living in a nice world- if we don't treat our neighbour kindle, chances are they won't treat us kindly either. It's not rocket science-its basic common sense.

And if you are reasonably well developed as a human being- you get a sense for whether your life is richer for being caring, sensitive, joyful, giving, loving....or not. Once you know the difference between living beautifully and lovingly, and living in a contracted and mean and selfish way- you wouldn't choose the latter, to the extent you can consciously choose your behaviour.

Thats why I believe we are inherently good- which is in direct opposition to what many Christians believe- that we are inherently bad unless we choose Christianity to absolve ourselves. I think human nature is inherently good, but can get rather messy. Once I scrape back the layers of hurt, damage, pain- I find love, not hate, at the core of myself.

[LidiyaDawn]

I have found these forums a true gift, but there are at least 6 threads going on right now about religion, faith, lack thereof, etc.

 

…and many more threads that aren't. ;)

 

This board has waaaaaaay LESS chatter about religion/faith/etc than pretty near any other homeschool board I've ever read - and when it does have them, they're quite interesting because (unlike most of the other boards) there's a wide range of beliefs scattered around here.

[MelanieM]

Thats why I believe we are inherently good- which is in direct opposition to what many Christians believe- that we are inherently bad unless we choose Christianity to absolve ourselves. I think human nature is inherently good, but can get rather messy. Once I scrape back the layers of hurt, damage, pain- I find love, not hate, at the core of myself.

 

This. Absolutely!

 

I think people are naturally selfish. (Selfish is not a dirty word... if we don't serve self, we have nothing left to serve anyone else. And if you're serving because of an expectation of reward later, or because you think it will please your god, that's still selfish.) It serves us well to be kind and good to those around us, because that is what we receive in return. I think that humans realized this just fine on their own, and then somewhere along the way fear set in about all those people over there who weren't following the rules, so man created religion to help police something that is naturally at the core of every human being.

 

I don't think I thought much before about people doing/being 'good' because they expect to be rewarded for it later. To tell you the truth, I find that thought sort of scary! It also explains why a lot of people don't behave in what I would consider a responsible way in this lifetime.

 

Oh, I'm not an athiest (Pagan pantheist here; I believe the purpose of life is joy and love and the experience of living, and after we're done we go back to spirit), but my husband is. I voted for him: dead, gone, the end. And he's one of the most moral men I have ever had the pleasure of knowing.