Anyone not like MM?

[ByGrace3]

It is easy to find a list of glowing reviews around here, but as I prepare to order it to try it out, I just wonder, why might be your reasons for NOT using MM? Either having tried it or not. Thanks!

[grace'smom]

A lot of people on the board have mentioned how busy the pages are, and that their children didn't like the number of problems on one page. My daughter is also overwhelmed by the number of items on a page but I always tell her to just do the odds or evens, and that helps her.

[ByGrace3]

A lot of people on the board have mentioned how busy the pages are' date=' and that their children didn't like the number of problems on one page. My daughter is also overwhelmed by the number of items on a page but I always tell her to just do the odds or evens, and that helps her.[/quote']

 

really? coming from Saxon, these pages are going to look like a dream! :lol:

[Guest aquiverfull]

Well we certainly don't hate MM, but I've found that we're not as giddy about it many others on here.

We are only using the Blue series, but both my dd and I feel that it sometimes does not give us enough instruction. Math is both mine and my dds weakest subject though, so perhaps that's why we feel that way.

I really dislike not having a teacher's manual. I don't intend to use it next year, though I might in the future as a supplement only.

[littlebug42]

I like it fine as a supplement but there is something about it that I would not want to use it as a spine. I know many others here rave about it. I have gone back to it several times and it just doesn't appeal. I am now using Singapore and definitely prefer that although I may continue to supplement with Math Mammoth.

[JudoMom]

I've got the light blue series that I've used as a supplement.

 

I often think that it lacks instruction. I also think the pages are busy, and there can be a lot of problems per page. Now, I'm a Saxon from the beginning user, but there is something about the layout and the number of problems that give us a headache. There's not nearly as much white space on the page as there is on the Saxon workbook pages.

 

I think it's fine as a supplement for us, but I wouldn't want to use it as our main program.

[Farrar]

We like it, but the main complaints I've seen are:

 

1. Too many problems (we just don't do them all unless the kids are having trouble getting a concept, but for some people, they don't like it)

 

2. Crowded pages (though I've heard they're updating their Light Blue series to make more room for young kids who need more room to write)

 

3. Not really "self-teaching" - I wouldn't say there's not enough instruction at all, but the idea that after about 2nd grade that the instruction in the worktext is 100% enough seems like it's probably untrue for many students

 

4. Printing, printing, printing... - a plus for some, a drawback for others

[Irishmommy]

really? coming from Saxon, these pages are going to look like a dream! :lol:

 

Yeah, we came from Saxon and my son LOVES it!

[8filltheheart]

I wouldn't say that I don't like MM, but it is a mastery program and I prefer spiral. If you are switching from Saxon, just recognize mastery is a different way of approaching math.

[In2why]

It is easy to find a list of glowing reviews around here, but as I prepare to order it to try it out, I just wonder, why might be your reasons for NOT using MM? Either having tried it or not. Thanks!

 

I like it, but my son didn't because by the time we decided to use it, he had already learned to add and subtract the tradtional way, and the way she presents it was so different that he just couldn't wrap his mind around it. He didnt feel like he was learning anything new, so his eyes would glaze over and it became a fight to use it. Then when he had a group of problems to do on his own, he would use his own way to complete them instead of mental math.

[Satori]

We use it, although I have no clue why people rave about it so.

 

I also make it a bit more spiral, as mastery programs bore us.

[Momling]

We use it, and I like it because it's solid and affordable and easy to use.

 

My older daughter just hates it because she says that the word problems are really dull and the problems are repetitive. I think she'd despise Saxon and most textbooks. The only thing that seems to speak to her are LOF (which she's not really entirely ready for I think) and TT. She also likes Murderous Maths (which isn't a textbook). So take her opinion with a grain of salt: I think she wants a math textbook to entertain.

[kalanamak]

There was a recent thread on this, and along with what others have said about cramped places to write, etc. I am not as clear on "why what is being taught on this page is being taught on this page" as I am with SM. I'm only using a book here and there for drill and supplement, but sometimes I look at a page and see a good part taken up by re-going over some instructions we have already covered, twice.

 

I decided what I really wanted was just drill pages, and subscribed to Math Worksheet, for ease, and won't get anymore MM, unless we come to a topic that we just can't seem to "get" via SM. Thus far, we have "gotten" every topic, it is just that sometimes it takes longer. For the most part, for us, the "longer" has just been having to do sample problems more often to seed his memory so I don't have to reteach the concept every few weeks.

 

Math is hard. Math is work. Math benefits from being taught from something that vaguely "clicks", and I think people get a bit ecstatic when they something that at least doesn't "not click".

 

IMO, FWIW, YMMV, AATJ (and all that jazz. :001_smile:)

Edited February 23, 2011 by kalanamak

[12Stars]

I just pulled it out and retried it, now I remember why I had put it away. I am not strong in math, I didn't like that there was not enough explanantion. The print is too crowded and it overwhelms my daughter. She'd rather do Saxon :confused: to be honest. Having a thorough explanation gives her something to go back to and in turn I have seen her confidence about go way up.

[ocelotmom]

I like it, but my son didn't because by the time we decided to use it, he had already learned to add and subtract the tradtional way, and the way she presents it was so different that he just couldn't wrap his mind around it. He didnt feel like he was learning anything new, so his eyes would glaze over and it became a fight to use it. Then when he had a group of problems to do on his own, he would use his own way to complete them instead of mental math.

This is how I'm feeling, too. We started MM after DS had already learned addition/subtraction with regrouping. We were using random workbooks, and I was just teaching him based on my own understanding and experience. It was working ok, but I wanted something that taught a deeper understanding, and felt (and still feel) that MM did that.

 

Now I feel like we've been spinning our wheels for most of this year, and that he's actually gone backwards in understanding. I think we're just going to move on to more advanced subjects and give up the MM way of addition/subtraction as a lost cause.

 

I thought that perhaps it would work better with DD1, if I started with MM from the beginning. However, she's 4, and very much ready to begin MM, except that the missing addends concept seems to utterly confuse her. This is a developmental issue noted in the Kindergarten page on the MM site - she suggests just skipping those problems. Hopefully this strategy will work once we get the real thing, but the missing addends problems make up a rather large proportion of the sample pages. I'm also concerned that she's going to get impatient with the repetition, especially if her writing speed isn't keeping up with her comprehension (this is an issue for DS, too).

 

I don't like that she includes so many problems, but recommends only doing some of them if the kid is understanding it - I'd prefer it if she gave a base set, with supplementary problems for kids needing more repetition, because I never know how much is "safe" to skip without undermining the concept being taught.

 

I occasionally find the instructions confusing, and am not always clear on what they're asking myself.

 

Unlike others, I don't find crowding to be an issue for us.

 

All that said, I'm ordering the 1-3 set soon, because I do think it's a solid curriculum, it's inexpensive, and I think we can find a way to make it work for us. If nothing else, both kids ask to do MM over other things we've tried, and that's worth something!

[nmoira]

We use MM units for a few North American centric topics MEP doesn't cover. Of the units we have, I find the sequencing sensible, but the layout is inelegant, and, yes, busy. I realize people are printing this out and want to minimize costs, but it would greatly benefit from, at the very least, some additional white space, especially for the levels directed at younger children.

[Mommy to monkeys]

Tried it. I really REALLY wanted to love it, but it didn't work for us. I do still print off pages for supplements and refer to it for game ideas.

 

1. ds's eyes would glaze over as soon as he saw the page. . .overwhelming for him to say the least

 

2. ds was bored to tears with mastery

 

We have now been happily using CLE for a year and a half. :D

[Trish]

I was thinking of getting the download so I can have the color printouts. Can I reformat to put fewer items on a page if I want to do that? Anyone tried this?

 

:bigear:

[mytwomonkeys]

we used MM when my daughter was in first grade and it was just okay. i also felt it lacked instruction. we moved on. i didn't dislike it by any means, but it just wasn't something we loved or felt it was worth sticking with. we've used CLE levels 1,2, and 3 now - we love it. to each his own. sometimes you can't make a decision without trying the program out, so i'd recommend buying a level and just see how it works.

[Oops, duplicate account :/]

 

IMO, FWIW, YMMV, ALTJ (and all that jazz. :001_smile:)

 

:lol:

[JCTSMOM]

We found it to be a great concept, but there were many errors in it, which I had to bring to the attention of the writer.

 

Also, I didn't think there was enough "teaching" in the series, just a lot of problems.

[mystika1]

My dd cries when I make her use it. I think it is like anything else as far as curriculum....works for some but not others. I have heard others say that they force their children to use it because they are the parent and they choose the materials.... but I believe that a child will learn better with something compatable and more suited to their learning style. I don't hate it. It is just not for us. When I look at the pages I understand what is going on but when my 7 year old looks at the pages.....not the case. I think math is something that I need to teach and demonstrate. I like guides. I pull out SM materials and she completely gets it with no tears. It is all in the presentation. Yes, the mm pages are busy for my dd. I imagine that others may not have a problem with that. I don't have time to select, trim and edit pages as I have other children in the house and I just don't have time. It is wonderful to have choices for our children. If something is not working out it is nice to know that there is a huge selection to try out.

 

HTH,

 

Penny

[Attila the Honey]

newbie question: Can someone explain the difference between 'spiral' and 'mastery'?

 

I really like MM, mostly because it's afforable and my dd is doing really well with it. I agree that sometimes there are too many problems on a page, in which case we skip that which is unnecessary.

[Jennay]

We tried MM with my DS8 this year. I was getting tired of all the different books in Singapore and kept reading on this board how similar the two were but contained all in one worktext. He completed the first 3 chapters in 4A.

We are moving back to Singapore for a few reasons.

1. For my DS, MM moves too slow. He didn't need all the steps explained in such small increments. He was getting bored. SM kept his interest much better.

2. I decided I really hate printing out the pages.

3. There were a few times where I thought the progression of skills did not flow as well as Singapore.

4. Even moving from Singapore 3A to MM 4A, I don't think DS has made much progress - it was just repetition of what he already knew (with a few exceptions).

5. I didn't like the "self-teaching" aspect. It was too easy to just send DS off to do his work without interacting with him. I found I actually like going over the TB in SM with him.

Just our experience.....

[Lovedtodeath]

We use it, although I have no clue why people rave about it so.

 

I also make it a bit more spiral, as mastery programs bore us.

:iagree:I think the raving depends on what they are comparing it to. MM explicitly teaches different tricks (like add or subtract a rounded off or easier number, then adjust the total, for example 99-57 becomes 99-59+2). I really like this aspect of the program, and I didn't see it in Abeka or Horizons when we used them. We have skipped a couple of things that were just too much, and I thought about switching to TT, but now that we have used a full year and started into the next grade I can really see light-bulbs going off. We have decided that it is working, and this is with a dyscalculia child.

 

I still teach math. I just use the examples that are there. For us it is definitely not self-teaching.

[Lovedtodeath]

This is how I'm feeling, too. We started MM after DS had already learned addition/subtraction with regrouping. We were using random workbooks, and I was just teaching him based on my own understanding and experience. It was working ok, but I wanted something that taught a deeper understanding, and felt (and still feel) that MM did that.

 

Now I feel like we've been spinning our wheels for most of this year, and that he's actually gone backwards in understanding. I think we're just going to move on to more advanced subjects and give up the MM way of addition/subtraction as a lost cause.

That is exactly what we did, and exactly how I felt. I determined to stick with the curriculum. I started multiplication with her so that it wouldn't be boring and she would be progressing while still completing all of the addition subtraction units every other day. She has so much confidence now and is starting to learn the mental tricks. It is really working.

[HappyGrace]

I use it with both dc (8 and 11) and love it as a supplement. I don't think I would like it as a standalone program. (I'm not saying it couldn't stand alone, just my preference.)

 

I wanted something Singapore-ish but easier to use, since we're using it as a supplement. It fits the bill for that. (although I do use portions of Sing for the mathy 8yo-he especially likes the IP.)

[kwg]

I use it with both dc (8 and 11) and love it as a supplement. I don't think I would like it as a standalone program. (I'm not saying it couldn't stand alone, just my preference.)

 

I wanted something Singapore-ish but easier to use, since we're using it as a supplement. It fits the bill for that. (although I do use portions of Sing for the mathy 8yo-he especially likes the IP.)

 

 

What do you use with MM?

[TheAutumnOak]

newbie question: Can someone explain the difference between 'spiral' and 'mastery'?

 

 

:bigear:

[ondreeuh]

It is in .pdf format, and I can't figure out any way to reformat it.

[ocelotmom]

newbie question: Can someone explain the difference between 'spiral' and 'mastery'?

 

I really like MM, mostly because it's afforable and my dd is doing really well with it. I agree that sometimes there are too many problems on a page, in which case we skip that which is unnecessary.

Mastery covers one topic at a time before moving on to the next (like a unit on addition, then a unit on subtraction, then a unit on money), while spiral would cover a little bit of each topic with gradually increasing difficulty.

 

MM is a mastery program. MEP (since that's free and you can download it and compare) is spiral. Some people jump around in the MM book in order to make it more spirally for kids who get bored easily.

[Lovedtodeath]

newbie question: Can someone explain the difference between 'spiral' and 'mastery'?

 

I really like MM, mostly because it's afforable and my dd is doing really well with it. I agree that sometimes there are too many problems on a page, in which case we skip that which is unnecessary.

 

:bigear:

 

A Mastery program stays on one topic until it is "mastered". Math U See, for example, is the ultimate Mastery program... single digit addition and subtraction are taught in Alpha, multi-digit addition and subtraction in Beta...

 

Math Mammoth has a unit on addition strategies and then a unit on subtraction strategies followed by a unit on multiplication.

 

A spiral program like Abeka will have one page or one unit that has a variety of problems: Single digit multiplication, measuring, multi-digit addition and/or subtraction, geometry, Roman numerals etc.

 

Then there are incremental spiral programs like Horizons, in which the entire concept is not explained... it is dolled out a little at a time in a spiral format. The students may not catch on the first couple of times the concept is introduced, but the idea is to expose them over and over adding more detail each time until the student has a full understanding.

 

Those are the math programs I have used.:D

[Lovedtodeath]

These posts about Singapore have me second guessing again. MM seems to be working, but DD sure doesn't like it. With a math LD though, she might not like anymath program.

[Lovedtodeath]

Mastery covers one topic at a time before moving on to the next (like a unit on addition, then a unit on subtraction, then a unit on money), while spiral would cover a little bit of each topic with gradually increasing difficulty.

 

MM is a mastery program. MEP (since that's free and you can download it and compare) is spiral. Some people jump around in the MM book in order to make it more spirally for kids who get bored easily.

I didn't post after you, I was writing before I saw that someone responded.:)

[ByGrace3]

interesting thoughts. Thanks for the comments. I think it may just be something we need to try. We are currently doing Saxon. Here are a few of our issues.

1. it takes FOREVER. Math currently takes up too much time in our day.

2. I feel my dd is simply memorizing the "trick" or rule and not necessarily grasping the concepts. For example on the daily math sheet, she will often say "double the lower number?" She is getting it "right" but I REALLY want her to "get it."

3. I do math the Asian/mm way (or at least I think I do from what I have read!) :lol: I don't know why I do as I grew up with Abeka, Saxon, and BJU. But, my dad is mathy and that is how he did it and that is what he taught me. It makes sense to me. I find myself teaching dd how to add/subtract and checking it using my method. Then I think, why don't I just teach her the way I do it, it makes so much sense! :001_huh:

My concerns in switching:

1. She is not mathy, I am not mathy. I fear moving away from the scriptedness of Saxon. Will the explanation be enough?

2. Currently she needs the practice of Spiral, so I fear moving away from that. However, I think, if we spent more time on it initially perhaps she would "get" it instead of dabbling with it for a few days and having it click a few days in. :confused:

 

thoughts on our situation???

Thanks!

[JadeOrchidSong]

These posts about Singapore have me second guessing again. MM seems to be working, but DD sure doesn't like it. With a math LD though, she might not like anymath program.

I have a feeling that dd and you will like Singapore. I was tempted to switch from SM to MM last August when the forums were full of MM rave reviews. I am glad I didn't and my two dss are progressing very well with Singapore. Now ds8 is finishing 3B and ds6 is finishing up 2A even with IP and CWP added in. It is really easy to teach form the textbooks.

[Beth in SW WA]

I use it with both dc (8 and 11) and love it as a supplement. I don't think I would like it as a standalone program. (I'm not saying it couldn't stand alone, just my preference.)

 

 

We use MM blue as supplement only -- and we love it! I would not use MM alone as our core math program.

 

I like the hybrid approach we are using. Math comes from different angles via different formats (computer/worksheet/manips/etc) and we never tire of math.

 

After completing extensive portions of MM blue addition/subtraction/place value/mult/div, Dd7 is doing Singapore 4A, MM blue fractions, TT5 for spiral review of long mult/division/geometry/time/weight/ etc.

 

No one program meets our needs. For the price, MM is awesome. I love Maria's approach. Dd7 also enjoys the videos Maria has created.

 

I have no complaints about MM. I simply don't use it as a stand-alone.

[ByGrace3]

Many have said that they like MM as supplement, but would not it as core. Could anyone explain why? Thanks!

[TheAutumnOak]

Many have said that they like MM as supplement, but would not it as core. Could anyone explain why? Thanks!

 

I am not sure why either...We use it as our only math program...

[Crimson Wife]

Many have said that they like MM as supplement, but would not it as core. Could anyone explain why? Thanks!

 

I love MM "blue" as a supplement but decided to keep Singapore as my DD's "spine" because I really like the CWP and IP books. If Maria Miller came out with something that was the equivalent, I would be seriously tempted to switch spines.

[kwg]

I am not sure why either...We use it as our only math program...

 

It seems they are using the blue series and not the light blue...I *think* the light blue is the complete program....so maybe that is why they are using it as a supplement?

[Lovedtodeath]

Many have said that they like MM as supplement, but would not it as core. Could anyone explain why? Thanks!

We use it as our main program but we do need to pull our manipulatives from MUS and RightStart out sometimes... so maybe people prefer that hands-on component to be in a Teacher's Manual.

[specialkmom]

5. I didn't like the "self-teaching" aspect. It was too easy to just send DS off to do his work without interacting with him. I found I actually like going over the TB in SM with him.

Just our experience.....

 

 

This is something I am struggling with right now. I did SM Earlybird with my ds1 and really liked it. Then, I heard about MM and debated on whether or not to switch. I liked that everything was in one spot (no flipping between textbook/workbook/HIG). So we used MEP for a little while until I finally made a decision to do MM. With MEP and SM we did the lessons together, and he only did little parts by himself. I feel like with MM it's so easy for me to say, here's the page, do it. With SM and MEP there was much more interaction- sometimes it took longer, but we were thinking and doing things together. I feel like the instruction is pretty light, at least for 1A.

 

Yes there is a lot of problems per page, but it's not overwhelming to us. My son doesn't seem bothered by it in the least and the writing space isn't too small for him. I try to just assign him a few things, but he insists on doing every problem. :001_huh:

 

I like MM because the drill is built in and it does cover things well. But, I am finding I miss the interaction, hands-on, and mental thinking we did with MEP and SM. (MEP has a lot of mental puzzles that really stretched us.) Also, I think MM moves to abstract pretty quickly (at least compared to SM), not that it bothered my ds too much. He was able to keep up just fine, probably from doing some MEP before. Of course, the open and go with MM means I don't have to do much prep work. I suppose if I were homeschooling more kids I might appreciate this more.

[TheAutumnOak]

It seems they are using the blue series and not the light blue...I *think* the light blue is the complete program....so maybe that is why they are using it as a supplement?

 

I see...We are using the light blue series...I got a few of the blue series to review with my ten year old, but we are using the light blue for new concepts...

[extendedforecast]

Yeah, we came from Saxon and my son LOVES it!

 

Same here. It's a complete hit with us after Saxon. I still like Saxon, but I like Math Mammoth even better. No more tears in this house.

[rwilliams]

We use it, and I like it because it's solid and affordable and easy to use.

 

My older daughter just hates it because she says that the word problems are really dull and the problems are repetitive. I think she'd despise Saxon and most textbooks. The only thing that seems to speak to her are LOF (which she's not really entirely ready for I think) and TT. She also likes Murderous Maths (which isn't a textbook). So take her opinion with a grain of salt: I think she wants a math textbook to entertain.

 

 

We supplement with Daily Word Problems which are interesting and have more variety. We still do MM word problems.

[rwilliams]

interesting thoughts. Thanks for the comments. I think it may just be something we need to try. We are currently doing Saxon. Here are a few of our issues.

1. it takes FOREVER. Math currently takes up too much time in our day.

2. I feel my dd is simply memorizing the "trick" or rule and not necessarily grasping the concepts. For example on the daily math sheet, she will often say "double the lower number?" She is getting it "right" but I REALLY want her to "get it."

3. I do math the Asian/mm way (or at least I think I do from what I have read!) :lol: I don't know why I do as I grew up with Abeka, Saxon, and BJU. But, my dad is mathy and that is how he did it and that is what he taught me. It makes sense to me. I find myself teaching dd how to add/subtract and checking it using my method. Then I think, why don't I just teach her the way I do it, it makes so much sense! :001_huh:

My concerns in switching:

1. She is not mathy, I am not mathy. I fear moving away from the scriptedness of Saxon. Will the explanation be enough?

2. Currently she needs the practice of Spiral, so I fear moving away from that. However, I think, if we spent more time on it initially perhaps she would "get" it instead of dabbling with it for a few days and having it click a few days in. :confused:

 

thoughts on our situation???

 

 

Thanks!

 

My son finally got math facts with MM after all the other ways of learning without real retention. The mental math is awesome for really understanding concepts. It has helped me really understand things.

 

It sometimes takes me a few minutes to really understand the unwritten why behind the problems but I do get it. I like that it is challenging at times initially for me and then I have an "aha!" moment!

 

After trying at least 5 different math programs in K and 1 and tons of research...MM is the one for us. The cost is so minimal it is not a risk to try.

[rwilliams]

We use it as our main program but we do need to pull our manipulatives from MUS and RightStart out sometimes... so maybe people prefer that hands-on component to be in a Teacher's Manual.

 

 

Yes....we pull out other manipulatives to learn concepts. MM gives me just the right about of info for teaching....not too much like saxon and not too little like singapore.