Spy Car Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 The OP in her email to her group. Re-reading the original post I'll agree the phraseology could have been improved, but I wish that I thought people would react differently if the email had said: "Like some children are effected by food allergies, my child has behavioral issues from over-consumption of sugar. While my child's problem is not life threatening (as it is with nut and certain other food allergies), I'd like to minimize their intake of sugary-treats to reduce the behavior problems that come with consuming too much sugar." I've walked this road. People don't take this problem seriously, to the detriment of children who don't tolerate sugar well. Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Mungo Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 Re-reading the original post I'll agree the phraseology could have been improved, but I wish that I thought people would react differently if the email had said: "Like some children are effected by food allergies, my child has behavioral issues from over-consumption of sugar. While my child's problem is not life threatening (as it is with nut and certain other food allergies), I'd like to minimize their intake of sugary-treats to reduce the behavior problems that come with consuming too much sugar." I've walked this road. People don't take this problem seriously, to the detriment of children who don't tolerate sugar well. Bill Hm. If this were me, I would have dealt with it in a more light-hearted manner. Like "Woah, that is a lot of cupcakes! I will bring cheese and crackers, could someone else maybe bring a veggie plate or something to try and avoid the nuclear sugar meltdown?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lionfamily1999 Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 Just an interesting aside. We're not allowed to bring in food to public schools here (VA) anymore. No candy bags for birthdays, no cupcakes, no chips, nothing. If you want to provide something nice for the class for your dc's birthday your only option is to buy from the school cafeteria. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spy Car Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 Hm. If this were me, I would have dealt with it in a more light-hearted manner. Like "Woah, that is a lot of cupcakes! I will bring cheese and crackers, could someone else maybe bring a veggie plate or something to try and avoid the nuclear sugar meltdown?" That's more-or-less the tact Mrs Spy Car, who is one of the world's most sweetly diplomatic persons (unlike her far-more blunt husband) takes. Of course it does no good what-so-ever. And I tend to stay out of it, because I might go nuclear. But she is distressed that her "nice suggestions" are ignored. Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawn in OH Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 I thought the whole point of the post was one mom's small vent that the person in charge asked for something like cheese and crackers and every parent signed up for cupcakes. I don't think the OP meant for it to turn into a huge debate about allergies and food restrictions, but that's just my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brilliant Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 Let me start by saying I always respect other parents' wishes as to what their child can eat. And add that I am not suggesting that anybody in this thread is dishonest or participating in the behavior I am about to describe. But, I personally know two families who overstate/dramatize/or just plain fabricate "allergies" or "sensitivities" to foods. They expect me and others in groups or social situations to accommodate their "needs", but when it suits them, they eat whatever the heck they like. I know families who are sincerely and conscientiously gluten-free, or sugar-free, or nitrite-free, etc. But these two families PLAY at it, and expect others to play along, and aren't consistent when it isn't convenient for them. I've lost respect for both of them, and, as I mentioned, if I were responsible for their children, I would feed them as the parents wished...but in group situations I don't consider their preferences anymore. Sorry. If they can't eat what I bring, too bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erica in PA Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 (edited) I think cookies and cupcakes are fine as treats for kids in moderation. If someone's kids can't eat them, then that person should send different types of snacks for their child, and tell him/her they need to choose the snacks that are okay for them. If a person's child is used to eating fruits and veggies only for snacks, I would think they'd be used to that at group events as well. What annoys people, about individuals seeking to change the food offered at special events, ime, is when the message is, "Because I don't prefer for my child to eat this, I don't want anyone to eat this either." Peanut allergies are different because even touching them or being around them can cause serious health issues. If I had a child who had a negative reaction to a food, I would not expect everyone else around him/her to also give up that food. ETA: I just wanted to add that I'm not advocating all sugary snacks, all the time! I think a variety should be offered, and I think there's room for some sugary stuff in there as well as the healthy stuff. At our co-op parties, we used to have fruit, veggies, pretzels, chips, cookies, cupcakes, and jello. Just about everyone was happy with that, and those who preferred to avoid the sweet stuff told their children to do just that. Edited October 22, 2009 by Erica in PA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Mungo Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 I thought the whole point of the post was one mom's small vent that the person in charge asked for something like cheese and crackers and every parent signed up for cupcakes. I don't think the OP meant for it to turn into a huge debate about allergies and food restrictions, but that's just my opinion. I think the real problem with the OP's situation is the poor choice of wording on the part of the choir director. I think the word "treat" and including "cookies" in the possible "treat" choices were the downfall of the situation. Again, if this were me? I'd volunteer to be "snack mom" and say in future emails: I need one person to bring cheese slices/string cheese, one person to bring something bready (crackers, rolls, pretzels), one person to bring fruit (grapes, melon, etc), one person to bring drinks (tea, orange juice) and one person to bring a small sweet treat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stripe Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 If you want to provide something nice for the class for your dc's birthday your only option is to buy from the school cafeteria. Mmm, yes, school cafeterias being known for their healthful fare... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BikeBookBread Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 ...your only option is to buy from the school cafeteria. Nice income stream, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lionfamily1999 Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 Mmm, yes, school cafeterias being known for their healthful fare... The last time ds had a birthday at school I bought ice cream for the whole class. Unfortuneatly there was one diabetic in the class and they did not have an alternative :( I offered to go buy a sugar free treat, but it was a no go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
christielee7278 Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 I'm glad you are having it checked out. I was a little alarmed at first b/c I wasn't sure if you realized it was dangerous! :tongue_smilie: If they outgrew the milk allergy and aren't allergic to nuts, I'm not sure what it would be either. Hopefully you will be able to get an appointment soon, and the allergist will be able to tell you exactly what it is. Make sure you insist on getting an Epi-pen, b/c as odd as it sounds, I've heard of a few allergists not giving them for severe allergies! You might be able to get one from your primary care doctor if it's awhile before you can get an appt. with the allergist. Good luck! Thank you for your concern! I have two nephews who have nut allergies and have both been rushed to the ER by ambulance, and my husband is the same with a strawberry and banana combination. It seems our family (dh's side) is riddled with various serious, and even more less serious, food allergies. There is never a short supply of epi-pens for sure. So reallly thank you. A lot of folks around here just think we're weirdos with all of our food restrictions and bags of meds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tap Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 We have dealt with this issue for 15 years. Just because a snack is being provided in a group situation, that doesn't mean we partake. My solution is to keep a few ziplock bags in my purse (I fold them small and put a rubber band around them to keep them contained). When the kids are offered something that they can have, but I don't want them to have, I put it in the baggie for a more appropriate time. Sometimes, I can get them to trade me out with something at home later. That way they don't feel left out and can still have the treat later when is more appropriate. Some treats just get tossed once home. My kids know that just because something is offered, it doesn't mean they will get it. I almost always have an appropriate alternative for them. But they see me do the same thing, so it is modeled behavior. I don't accept everything that is offered to me either :) In these circumstances, I would bring a large platter of fruit/veggies to overwhelm the choices and I would put it out in front of the sweets. If everything isn't eaten, I would take it home, wash it and eat it the next day. I have kids with unusual allergies and so I realize that there is no way every one's allergies or preferences can be accommodated. Obvious ones like peanuts are of course honored. I was 23 when Ds was diagnosed allergic to almost every vegetable and several fruits as a 1yo child. He also reacted to sugar/artificial dyes/artificial and natural flavors. No one was allowed to feed him with out my permission, so I guess I got a back bone quick about foods for my kids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jen in PA Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 I don't think people are trying to be annoying when they say they can't eat stuff that is touching. If they are allergic, that really can cause a deadly reaction. On the other hand, I don't mind if people bring whatever they want (as long as there are no nuts, and we have other allergies but the kids can be around them). I just provide my kids with their own food. Oh, of course I didn't mean to put allergic reactions on the same level as pickiness! I only meant that even those who try really hard to bring a snack that everyone can consume can end up feeling that someone has been left out due to food issues of one stripe or another. I'm fortunate that my kids don't have food allergies, but I have to check for wheat and cashews for myself, so I can totally sympathize. It just ends up being a no-win situation sometimes for both those who have food issues and those who want to feed a crowd with diverse concerns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justamouse Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 Not reading all the comments yet (18 pages in one day?!) but I think it may have to do with where you live. NO ONE here brings cupcakes anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2cents Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 I don't believe anyone (including the OP) suggested the repercussions of eating sugar for a sugar sensitive child are life-threatening in the way eating nut are to the allergic. The point is that while society (rightly) takes food allergies very seriously, many people (including those who would not dream of feeding meat to a vegetarian child) will ignore parents stated wishes and feed kids sugar-snacks. Because why? They figure the parents are "weird" and they are depriving their kids enjoyment? I'm not sure. I just can't figure it out. Bill Maybe you can clear something up for me. Several times you mention people feeding your child sugar snacks'. I don't understand why that situation is something you are powerless over. You've asked what people would do when the children are fed these foods. My answer would be to make your wishes 'for your child' known - clearly. If sugar foods are offered and you aren't there to supervise or the child is unable to make choices that reflect your wishes then you must make sure that someone is there to enforce your wishes. It easier to adjust your own approach to the situation than to expect everyone else to recognize how important no-sugar snacks are to you. Fact is, some folks may want to celebrate with these kinds of treats occasionally and outside functions are the venue they choose. It isn't the responsibility of the other parents to deal with the preference of another parent when the preference does not rise to the level of seriousness that you have with a serious allergy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spy Car Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 Maybe you can clear something up for me. Several times you mention people feeding your child sugar snacks'. I don't understand why that situation is something you are powerless over. You've asked what people would do when the children are fed these foods. My answer would be to make your wishes 'for your child' known - clearly. If sugar foods are offered and you aren't there to supervise or the child is unable to make choices that reflect your wishes then you must make sure that someone is there to enforce your wishes. It easier to adjust your own approach to the situation than to expect everyone else to recognize how important no-sugar snacks are to you. Fact is, some folks may want to celebrate with these kinds of treats occasionally and outside functions are the venue they choose. It isn't the responsibility of the other parents to deal with the preference of another parent when the preference does not rise to the level of seriousness that you have with a serious allergy. So what? I should hire a body-guard? If we make our positions well understood, and others decide their estimation of "seriousness" differs from ours, then "too bad" for us? These are not "preferences", they are legitimate concerns about a child's health and the negative consequences of sugary-snacks on their behavior and well-being. No matter how it is stated there are people who are just unprepared to listen. It's maddening. Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audrey Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 (edited) This makes me very sad...I just hope that your child/children never develop an allergy and someone cops the same attitude you have exhibited... I'm sorry if it makes you sad. It makes ME sad that some parents expect others to keep track of every child's food needs, and then even when people TRY to accomodate them, (and oh how I have tried many times!) they will complain. I do not expect others to take MY child's food issues into consideration, and I do not complain about food at events. Instead, I educate my child on what can and cannot be eaten. I don't ask others to parent my kid. I'm not your kid's mother. I expect YOU to do that job thankyouverymuch. (generic "you" intended) Edited October 23, 2009 by Audrey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slartibartfast Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 Mmm, yes, school cafeterias being known for their healthful fare... :lol: TRUE FAX! I once complained to the state about the kind of crap they were giving kids at dd's school. It is so nice not to worry about making her lunch or letting her eat hot pockets. :glare: At her school the stuff HAD to be purchased from the store *already cut up* we couldn't cut it ourselves. It made the fruit trays, cheese trays and veggie trays our allergy laden class was known for pretty expensive. For a Christmas party once I spent $40 on fruit. It is crazy. My kid doesn't even have allergies. :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audrey Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 Wow, I hate stepping into a minefield but I'm not sure I can call Audrey's sentiment "an attitude." I can go all out to make sure I bring a kosher, vegan, gluten-free, nut-free snack, only to encounter the one kid who cannot have soy. Or who won't eat things that are "touching." Or whose parents are concerned that the fruit I bought might be from a country with lax rules. I have been fortunate to deal with plenty of folks who carry snacks they apporve of so their kids won't feel left out in group settings, but I get frustrated if I feel like someone was let down. Thank you. I suppose my "attitude" is that I can only do so much. I have, in the past, tried to carefully consider everyone's needs only to get reamed by at least one parent. I gave up trying after a while. So I just bring stuff I know my kid can eat, and I won't volunteer to bring food if it means I have to burden the responsibility of being the only one bringing anything. I'm out of the business of being everyone's mommy. In other words, "I'll take care of my kid and his needs. You can take care of yours." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ncmomo3 Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 I'm sorry if it makes you sad. It makes ME sad that some parents expect others to keep track of every child's food needs, and then even when people TRY to accomodate them, they will complain. I do not expect others to take MY child's food issues into consideration, and I do not complain about food at events. Instead, I educate my child on what can and cannot be eaten. I don't ask others to parent my kid. I'm not your kid's mother. I expect YOU to do that job thankyouverymuch. Audrey, :iagree:this has ALWAYS been the view I have taken of food issues. It is my responsibility as the parent. If an activity with a group is coming up, say a movie is being shown with which I do not approve, we do not attend. I do not ask nor want everyone else change what they want or approve for their children, just to accomodate mine. This is why I do not volunteer for childcare. anywhere. No matter what you do, no matter how careful you try to be, there will be those who will furious with something that occurs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audrey Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 Just an interesting aside. We're not allowed to bring in food to public schools here (VA) anymore. No candy bags for birthdays, no cupcakes, no chips, nothing. If you want to provide something nice for the class for your dc's birthday your only option is to buy from the school cafeteria. Hmmm... but if I recall correctly from my school days... that wasn't exactly food there in the cafeteria. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grace'smom Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 OK, I'm only on page 4 of this thread so I have a lot more to read, but thanks so much for posting the UCLA video. It's great. Also, the sugar thing bugs me a great deal, as well as the fact that people seem to assume that if you take your kids to an hour long activity they need a snack. What's up with that? I know in the OP's situation it was a long evening, but as long as we are venting I must say I think it's strange that play groups lasting one hour require some sort of treat intervention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnandtinagilbert Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 I can't read the entire thread, but what I have read brings me to a recent conclusion: there should not even be food for this sort of thing. The expense it ridiculous. Trying to please everyone is more so. Just take your kids home and feed them. You want to celebrate, provide water and play some games. It's so much easier. If a family wants further celebration, wouldn't it mean more to do it with people they're really close too, instead of the other 20 kids in the chorus/classroom/club/team and their parents? FWIW, I hate that most of the food is junk at these events and I hate that if I have to purchase snacks for the chorus, it's at least $20 -- wasteful. If a kid is in "practice" for 2 hours or at a game for the same, they don't need a snack in the first place. Feed them before and after. Just my 2 cents. Apologies if I've been repetitive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebecca Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 I am most appreciative of the kind offers that have been made to provide cupcakes and cookies for Sunday's little celebration. I will bring something to add to the celebration that is not quite as 'sugar-intensive.' My children react to sugar the way 'peanut-allergic' children react to nuts -- their reaction is quite strong and the negative effects of the sugar will remain with them for hours. One cupcake eaten at that hour of the day will create havoc till amost midnight. I will provide small bottles of water for Sunday and perhaps cheese and crackers or veggies. Thank you again for your kind contributions -- Mariann A***** I am just wondering: do your children carry epi-pen auto-injectors for their sugar reactions? Thanks, Rebecca Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grace'smom Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 \ No "normal" person would intentionally give a vegan child meat, and if they accidently gave a child a dish with meat I'm sure "most people" would feel terrible. And "guilty." And say, "I'm so sorry." But ordinary, sane, other-wise rational people who've been told a child doesn't react well to sugar seem to have no problem going ahead and handing out treats on the "down-low." Don't tell your folks. Wink Wink. And it's rather galling to have a child who's one who really does badly on sugar, and to be intentionally undermined in ways no person of good-will would dream of doing with a vegan child or one with an allergy. I simply don't understand the mentality. Bill :iagree: I was visiting my mother's house last month and my daughter was acting really batty. She was off the wall hyper, running into me like a battering ram, unable to make eye contact or speak clearly, and I had to put her in the guest room and stand in front of the door while she went full force at me trying to get out instead of go to bed. This child does NOT behave this way on a regular basis. I KNOW what it is... My sister ended up mentioning to me that my mom let Grace have about a half a bag of hershey kisses that day! Oh, and the next day after giving my mom a huge lecture and telling her Grace was going to be sleeping in her room next time she did this, I came into the kitchen as my mom was walking out of the pantry saying "now don't tell your mom I gave you this..." Grace had a bowl of marshmellows in her hand. UURGH! In general, I think I've had the most disrespect from family members regarding this issue. In some ways I think that is because, since Grace is family, they feel they are somewhat allowed to make decisions on her behalf that outsiders wouldn't dare to do. People outside the family don't tend to even notice if I tell Grace not to eat the candy, etc. Ok, I need to stop posting since I've had a glass of wine! :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2cents Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 So what? I should hire a body-guard? If we make our positions well understood, and others decide their estimation of "seriousness" differs from ours, then "too bad" for us? These are not "preferences", they are legitimate concerns about a child's health and the negative consequences of sugary-snacks on their behavior and well-being. No matter how it is stated there are people who are just unprepared to listen. It's maddening. Bill Absolutely it is not "too bad". If someone went against my express wishes regarding an express dietary situation then it is time to address it at the next level with those at fault. At that point it isn't even an issue of whether sugar is good or bad. It is that of someone taking liberties with your child. You would handle that like any other similar issue. My point is that it simply isn't realistic to expect everyone else to change their dietary expectations for a non-emergency issue that may only affect a small number of the group. I am not trying to say your concerns aren't important. I am sure that they are very important to you. My point is that there are easier and more efficient ways to deal with the problem that don't require other parents to know the food issues of several people other than those that would result in dire consequences (like peanut allergies). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2cents Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 Something that concerns me about the sugar email that the op sent is that people will react negatively and become numb or choose to dismiss people that raise allergy alerts in the future that are life threatening. There are issues that require a group effort (severe allergy concerns) and those that can more easily be resolved without major group changes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazzyfizzle Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 For my daughter? Anything sugary, including something too heavy in carbs. She LOVES carbs but they make her act crazy. I have to impose severe limits on her bagel intake, for example. So, for her, it doesn't matter whether or not it is simple sugars. ' Do you think she could possibly be a type 2 diabetic, and no one knows it yet? I am a type 1, and breads hit me much harder than even ice cream. Bagels have so many carbs. What are her actions? :grouphug: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hornblower Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 So what? I should hire a body-guard? If we make our positions well understood, and others decide their estimation of "seriousness" differs from ours, then "too bad" for us? These are not "preferences", they are legitimate concerns about a child's health and the negative consequences of sugary-snacks on their behavior and well-being. No matter how it is stated there are people who are just unprepared to listen. It's maddening. Bill Bill, I really think this is very simple. Whenever you are not around your child, some other adult is the responsible guardian in lieu of you. You hand over that responsibility. If you cannot trust that guardian to respect your wishes, you do not leave the child alone with that adult. This is the same for people who will let a child ride without a helmet, or not use a seatbelt in the car, or watch a movie that you do not allow your child to watch etc etc..... if the issue is big enough for you and you don't trust that adult to respect your wishes, you do. not. leave. your. child. until the child is old enough to stand up for themselves and say "No, thank you, my parents don't allow me to ____." There are relatives in my family who only had supervised access to my children when they were younger because of issues like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Mungo Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 (edited) ' Do you think she could possibly be a type 2 diabetic, and no one knows it yet? I am a type 1, and breads hit me much harder than even ice cream. Bagels have so many carbs. What are her actions? :grouphug: She just gets completely unfocused, silly, runs around, acts out of control. I don't think she's diabetic. My children are all tiny and because of their tininess have had a *lot* of medical tests looking for a reason that they are so tiny. We've even been to 2 different geneticists, both of whom looked at dh and I and the kids and said you're small, they are small, what's the problem? I *will* say that she does seem to use the bathroom a lot. Maybe at her next physical I will ask if they have tested her for such problems. What other symptoms would I look for? eta: I don't think she'd be a type 2 diabetic, she is super-thin and active, doesn't that only occur in overweight/inactive children? Edited October 23, 2009 by Mrs Mungo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazzyfizzle Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 Gotcha :grouphug: my symptoms when consuming too many carbs generally are- headache, fatigue-sluggish feeling, excessive urinating/urge to go, sleepiness, upset stomach. Low symtoms generally are- feeling shakey/jittery, feeling 'cool' especially on the arms (difficult to explain), lightheaded/head feels 'sqeezing' (also difficult to explain) Could always be a good idea just to check it, to rule it out. They could do a simple blood draw and check the A1C. Hugs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zaichiki Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 If it's your kid with the problem, then it's your problem to feed the kid. Even though that doesn't feel fair somehow. And everyone else seems so insensitive. I agree with Garga, here. My youngest cannot eat barley. Now, it will NOT kill him if he does, but he gets *really* uncomfortable digestive system issues if he eats barley. He knows that. Even at *3.5* he'll usually ask about the ingredients in a food he is offered. He doesn't want to eat barley, even if it is in candy. (I guess it makes it easy on us that his allergy makes him uncomfortable, though, huh? There's more motivation for him to "follow the food rules.") If I think food may be offered to a group of kids, and he is included, I try to bring an alternative for him "just in case." Barley is a fairly easy allergy to handle because fruits, veggies, and most dairy do not have it as an ingredient... so there's almost always something he can eat somewhere. (Cakes, cupcakes, breads, crackers, and candy almost always include malt/barley... and they're probably the most common snack foods, so I do have to remain vigilant at kids' gatherings.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slartibartfast Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 Am I the only one who *had* to have some cookies or other baked dessert item today? :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slartibartfast Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 She just gets completely unfocused, silly, runs around, acts out of control. I don't think she's diabetic. My children are all tiny and because of their tininess have had a *lot* of medical tests looking for a reason that they are so tiny. We've even been to 2 different geneticists, both of whom looked at dh and I and the kids and said you're small, they are small, what's the problem? I *will* say that she does seem to use the bathroom a lot. Maybe at her next physical I will ask if they have tested her for such problems. What other symptoms would I look for? eta: I don't think she'd be a type 2 diabetic, she is super-thin and active, doesn't that only occur in overweight/inactive children? Isn't excessive thirst a big sign?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zaichiki Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 This is the same for people who will let a child ride without a helmet, or not use a seatbelt in the car, or watch a movie that you do not allow your child to watch etc etc..... if the issue is big enough for you and you don't trust that adult to respect your wishes, you do. not. leave. your. child. until the child is old enough to stand up for themselves and say "No, thank you, my parents don't allow me to ____." I guess the question becomes -- Is sugar a big enough issue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Care Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 Okay, I'm only through half this thread, so please do ignore me if I'm beating a dead horse or otherwise completely missing the direction the thread has gone, but: The distinction is that certain food allergies (such as the nuts etc) can be life threatening. Those allergies aren't a choice and they are something everyone needs to give serious consideration to. This right here seems to be the crux of the issue. The implication being that if children are reactive to sugar, their parents are "choosing" to not let them have it. My son has an allergy to milk proteins. This is not a "choice." I do not "choose" to remove dairy from him in the same way that I choose to limit his junk food, choose to put him in blue socks, or otherwise make simple choices. This is something that HAS to be done. If not, no, the consequences are not as severe as death. However, they are serious and far reaching. To have someone decide to give him a cupcake or scoop of ice cream because "he's a kid, he *deserves* to have some junk" is equally disrespectful as it is to give a nut allergic child a peanut butter cookie. Do they have the same effect? No. Are they both disrespectful, dishonest, and underhanded? Absolutely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zaichiki Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 The call for treats reminds me of my kids' soccer teams a few years ago. Parents signed up (on a sheet of paper) to bring oranges. Yep: only oranges. And we were asked to cut them up (skins on) for less mess. We brought grapes once... the coach reminded us that next time it needed to be oranges. Okay. No problem. (I guess there are very few allergies to oranges? That might be how they were chosen as "the" halftime snack for ALL teams on the soccer league?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erica in PA Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 To have someone decide to give him a cupcake or scoop of ice cream because "he's a kid, he *deserves* to have some junk" is equally disrespectful as it is to give a nut allergic child a peanut butter cookie. Do they have the same effect? No. Are they both disrespectful, dishonest, and underhanded? Absolutely. But is the topic in this thread really, "Should adults sneak sugary snacks into the hands of children who are allergic to sugar?" Just about everyone has posted that in fact they *would not* knowingly give sweets to a child whose parents had told them they could not have them. Instead, I think the point is more, "Should sweet snacks be served to children in public settings at all, because some children are not able to eat them?" And that's where I think the problem comes in... not because most of us want to force children to eat sugary goodies for the fun of it, but because many of us don't want to have to always completely avoid something that the entire group would enjoy, because a few might not be able to eat exactly the same thing. If I am planning a party for a group of children, I am completely fine with your child not eating sweets, and I will make sure there are some healthier options on the table, but I do not want to exclude all sweets, all the time, because your child can't have them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zaichiki Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 If I am planning a party for a group of children, I am completely fine with your child not eating sweets, and I will make sure there are some healthier options on the table, but I do not want to exclude all sweets, all the time, because your child can't have them. And I think that children who *really* cannot have a certain food item will continue to encounter it when they are out in public. They should be learning why they can't have it and how to make better choices for themselves. I understand that some ignorant people will continue to offer your children sugary foods (even family members that will sneak it to your kids) and that is offensive! But, your child will encounter this over and over again, especially when you're not there to run interference (which is important to do when they're very young). At some point they're going to have to practice making the decisions for themselves. (Our family is friends with families whose kids have dairy allergies, insulin-dependent diabetes, life-threatening nut allergies, wheat allergies, etc. Most of these kids encounter foods they should not eat quite often. From what I see, by the time these kids are 4 or 5, they are able to choose not to eat the foods that cause them harm. Of course, adult back-up is ALWAYS a good thing. :)) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grace'smom Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 Ok, I know I said I wasn't going to post again, but I did feel a need to point out one more thing: both sides of this issue do seem to be saying the same thing "my child's reaction to such and thus is serious and needs to be respected." I have seen it from both sides because my daughter has a serious wheat allergy and a sugar sensitivity. MIL wants to sneak her wheat (and is not allowed to be alone with her) and my mom wants to sneak her sugar. Granted, I feel safer at my mom's house b/c at least the wheat issue is respected, but I feel very disrespected by both people. And there are so many people who are ugly about allergies. Sugar sensitivity hasn't even hit the map yet in my neck of the woods- most people can't even understand allergies yet. Most people where I live will not ignore your wishes regarding your child, but they will get ugly over it. I volunteered to assist with the Halloween party for my daughter's preschool class (b/c I knew it would be a good way to get in a fruit tray, LOL) and there were so many complaints from the volunteer parents when they realized the allergy list for the class (we shouldn't even have a party, they can't have anything but water, why should we have to change the whole thing for one kid, etc.). Not just, "oh bummer, this is going to be hard," but more of an ugly, resentful tone that makes you feel like your child's allergy is personally insulting them. Of course, they didn't know one of the allergic children was mine... I am betting they wanted to take back some of the things they said after I mentioned I could cook the kids some cupcakes without eggs/peanuts or wheat b/c I learned how to cook "allergy style" for my daughter. I can make cupcakes without sugar but the frosting cannot be faked, so on that I have to just let it go. But I consider it a real blessing to be able to make cupcakes that are SLIGHTLY healthier and that ALL the kids in Grace's class can eat. I bet it will really put a smile on those kids face's when they all get handed the very same thing. That usually only happens for Grace on her birthday. My daughter's class has about 5 kids with allergies in it. I think as a society we are going to have to change our food policy because there are TOO many kids with allergies. It's too hard to have food be the ONLY way to share a celebration. And I say that respectfully, not resentfully. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reya Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 Your kids do NOT react to sugar like "allegeric kids do to peanuts" or they couldn't have crackers, either--or Chinese food, or much bread, or anything. There's not thing special about cane sugar OR corn syrup that make them have psychotropic effects. If your kids react to sugary things, it's because you've taught them to. There have been many studies on the effects of sugar--actually, on the fact that there are none. If you have personal preferences about food, you should simply opt your family out of anything that involves it. The people I know who have REAL dietary restrictions don't even expect the rest of the work to change. The fact that you want everyone else to accommodate your prejudices is beyond unreasonable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Care Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 But is the topic in this thread really, "Should adults sneak sugary snacks into the hands of children who are allergic to sugar?" Just about everyone has posted that in fact they *would not* knowingly give sweets to a child whose parents had told them they could not have them. Instead, I think the point is more, "Should sweet snacks be served to children in public settings at all, because some children are not able to eat them?" And that's where I think the problem comes in... not because most of us want to force children to eat sugary goodies for the fun of it, but because many of us don't want to have to always completely avoid something that the entire group would enjoy, because a few might not be able to eat exactly the same thing. If I am planning a party for a group of children, I am completely fine with your child not eating sweets, and I will make sure there are some healthier options on the table, but I do not want to exclude all sweets, all the time, because your child can't have them. This is also very true. But where I was in the thread at the point of posting, there was a lot of back-and-forth about whether or not people can/do/should take sugar sensitivities as seriously as they do nut allergies. My personal preference is if there is something my little can't have, I give him something he can. I have a bunch of snacks in my bag for him for exactly this reason. But some folks were taking a very nonchalant stance toward non-anaphylactic allergies simply because they're not immediately, physiologically life-threatening, so I kinda felt the need to point out that given a true choice in the matter, I'd love to let my little eat whatever he wanted, whatever was offered, with the rest of the kids. But I don't have that option due to allergy - and while it's not as severe as a nut allergy, that doesn't give other parents (be they here or elsewhere!) the right to knowingly give my allergic child a butter cookie and a big glass of milk. Does that make sense, or did I just talk myself in a circle? :blink: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zaichiki Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 (edited) I have seen it from both sides because my daughter has a serious wheat allergy and a sugar sensitivity. MIL wants to sneak her wheat (and is not allowed to be alone with her) and my mom wants to sneak her sugar. Granted' date=' I feel safer at my mom's house b/c at least the wheat issue is respected, but I feel very disrespected by both people.[/quote'] I think the people that want to sneak our kids the very foods they shouldn't eat only do so because they truly don't understand/believe allergies. I know dm-i-l didn't believe wheat or dairy could be an allergy until df-i-l had a severe reaction to MSG and ended up in the hospital. Where they grew up/spent most of their lives, allergies didn't seem to exist. Perhaps they just weren't identified... or maybe the word just wasn't spread... I don't know. I see this unbelief all the time, though -- from people who criticize parents of special needs kids for their parenting (because they cannot believe the children's behaviors could be from a special need) to learning disabilities to allergies. These people have just never had this particular challenge in their lives, so they have a hard time believing it really exists for others. Edited October 23, 2009 by zaichiki Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reya Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 I'm still baffled that parents with children to are sensitive to sugary-treats should have to feel on the defensive because the harm done to their child isn't immediately "life-treating." That's because there have been any numbers of studies that have determined that if neither the parent nor child know that sugar (versus a nonsugar fake sweetener) has been consumed, they are completely unable to detect the difference with any reliability whatsoever. I wouldn't sneak a kid anything, but I find the whole preoccupation with sugar to be harmful, as it creates fake "sugar highs" and "crashes"--unnecessary disruptions and drama. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Mungo Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 Your kids do NOT react to sugar like "allegeric kids do to peanuts" or they couldn't have crackers, either--or Chinese food, or much bread, or anything. There's not thing special about cane sugar OR corn syrup that make them have psychotropic effects. If your kids react to sugary things, it's because you've taught them to. There have been many studies on the effects of sugar--actually, on the fact that there are none. Are you suggesting there is no such thing as a sugar high? There is no crash afterward? I'm telling you, if I feed my daughter carbs for breakfast (and yes, that includes bagels, crackers, toast, etc) vs. something high in protein I can see a marked difference in her behavior and level of concentration. I don't know what sort of study one would need to design in order to test this, but it's a fact, for her. I really am not sure how I would "teach" my child to react different to a bagel than she does to bacon and boiled eggs. It's insulting to act like this is something people have made up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zaichiki Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 I really am not sure how I would "teach" my child to react different to a bagel than she does to bacon and boiled eggs. It's insulting to act like this is something people have made up. Reya, I have read about those double-blind (I think they were) sugar studies, too. It was a few years ago, wasn't it? Do you think, though, that there *could be* kids in the general population for whom there WOULD be a reaction to sugar. I mean... the studies were limited, weren't they? Did they include any kids who were suspected to have some sort of greater-than-typical reaction to large doses of sugar or foods? I know that if a study was done on a large number of kids to see whether or not barley caused major digestive upset, there probably wouldn't be one in the bunch that would prove the possibility (unless my youngest, or one of the few others I've read about with a barley intolerance, happened to have been in the study). And... I could be wrong... but I *think* I've heard that sugar and caffeine can actually calm ADD kids and help them focus, right? Or is that just caffeine (which might make some of us jittery)? So, it makes me think that there are some portions of the population that will react differently to food ingredients that are generally harmless. Even sugar? What do you think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RanchGirl Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 Your kids do NOT react to sugar like "allegeric kids do to peanuts" I have to agree with Reya here. An allergy is a specific physical reaction and with peanuts in particular it is frequently life-threatening. The risk of death is serious and shouldn't be minimized. That's why some schools are peanut-free. A sensitivity is quite different from an allergy. Your child may well react to sugar, I don't know. But he/she won't be at risk of death if someone touches sugar and then touches your kid's skin. One of my sons is allergic to eggs and peanuts. When I know there are things being served that he can't eat, I just send along a snack that is safe for him, and I or another adult makes sure he is not sitting near anyone eating peanut products. Even though his allergy can be life-threatening, I would never expect a whole group to modify their plans. It would be quite embarrassing to him (and me) if I were to make a big fuss. I usually make sure that I am signed up for snacks in those situations so I can bake the cupcakes or cookies without eggs and peanuts. So to the OP, I guess I would just do what you are doing, bring a healthy snack, and if you don't want your child to eat sugar, don't let them. My kids know there are some things our family does differently than others, we have different rules, etc. If they threw a fit in public I would consider it a behavior issue. Now personally, I take issue with the concept that a snack is needed at every activity anyway. It seems like every practice/game/rehearsal involves a snack sign up sheet. In my opinion kids over 5 can go 2-3 hours without a snack but some parents think it's necessary -- not my cup of tea but oh well! You could also try to make some kind of amazingly fun veggie dish that will outshine the sugary junk -- little shaped veggie creatures or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joanne Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 It seems to me in the OP, the parents responding to the very specific request (which, while specific, was not without easy, convenience choices), ignored the request. That would be my focus. I'm not a sugar-phobe, crunchy, uber health type. But I do observe a change in behavior in kids where they've been fed chemically concentrated, high in refined sugar foods. Of course, often the setting itself = hyped up behavior. (Birthday parties, celebrations, etc). I do wish we'd have a wider variety of snacks was the norm and I'm glad my sports kids are past the snack list stage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joanne Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 I have read about those double-blind (I think they were) sugar studies, too. It was a few years ago, wasn't it? Were those the studies done my Imperial Sugar? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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