Dss16

[katilac]

Guys, Scarlett has the right to post just like everybody else. If you don't like her posts or feel like she won't listen to your response, then don't read her posts and certainly don't respond. Goodness knows that I often disagree with her and certainly tell her so, and I don't think she understands weight issues at all, but I also know that she does do a lot for her stepson, and they seem to have an overall positive relationship. It's difficult. 

 

She gets a lot of conflicting advice, so of course she can't take it all (and has no obligation to take any of it, just bc she asked for opinions). And I think she's catching some unfair heat for acknowledging that a relationship with an older stepchild, whose other parent is actively in the picture, is going to be quite different from a relationship with a child you have raised from an early age. Some people think it's awful to state that relationships and families with stepkids and exes can be different and more complicated, but not saying it doesn't make it any less true. And the reality is that Scarlett doesn't have decision-making powers for dss; she is not the one who decides if the will do this or that program, where he will go to school, and so on. 

 

 

Well, like I said in the post you quoted, you could have run into a grocery store and picked up a yogurt and piece of fruit.  

 

Well, packaged yogurt is not actually a very healthy food, lol. I do think Scarlett underestimated how tempting fast food is to most people, even when not hungry, but I am also a person who would not be able to just skip the meal, and would need something more substantial than  yogurt and a piece of fruit. That would actually just trigger extreme hunger for me (way too many carbs, not enough fat or protein). 

 

  

I know from my experience that lack of sleep makes me eat crazy amounts of food----mostly I want carbs.  

 

So if anyone here is low carb successfully what kinds of foods can you eat?  

 

Yes! Research shows that sleep is actually more important than exercise when it comes to losing weight. Food, sleep, then exercise. 

 

I've only been low carb for must over 3 months, so I'm no expert. But I have lost 15 pounds, about half of goal, in that time. And I went from pretty food-obsessed with lots of carby cravings, to not thinking about food nearly as much, and rarely having cravings. I'm a little annoying with my evangelism, I'm sure, lol. 

 

I personally think the health benefits of weight loss outweigh the lower amount of fruits and veggies (and good low carb plans have a method for increasing those as you get closer to goal). And a seriously overweight person is rarely going to get in much exercise until they lose enough to make it more practical and less painful. 

 

What I eat: a low car, high protein, high fat. If you limit fat, most people are really going to struggle and not feel sated. So, when I do crave, I sometimes have super high calorie things like a simple mousse made with heavy cream and sugar free syrup. It keeps me from slipping and so far has not affected weight loss. 

 

Atkins has lists of no carb and low carb foods that are very helpful. One thing I do is look for twists on old favorites. I can't have a big bowl of pasta, but I can have Alfredo sauce over broccoli. As it turns out, the Alfredo sauce is what I really like about Fettucine Alfredo  :lol: 

 

When I first started, I splayed out some money on the Atkins bars, which was very helpful for when i was craving sweet, crunchy, or junky. And for when I simply had the urge to overeat, which took me a couple of weeks to overcome, because I can only eat so much meat, eggs, etc, and the Atkins bars at least kept me on keel with carbs. As long as I kept carbs low, I steadily lost weight, even when eating too much. I still use them, just not as much. 

 

Steam in the bag veggies are at the ready, at all times, because one should always buy and cook fresh food but reality. Even though the veggie portions are fairly low at the beginning of Atkins, it is super important to eat them every day, you definitely feel the difference if you don't. 

 

The problem with low carb is that it's fairly useless to do part-time. If you were able to control every bite he eats at home, that honestly does no good if he consumes 100+ carbs at vo tech every day, and thousands of carbs every other weekend at his mom's house. And it is easy to consume that many carbs. 

 

I think that a specialized program is the way to go, as in a weight loss program for teens or a therapist. I know you are going to mention this to dh but I would go further and urge him to get ds enrolled in something, preferably a program linked to a hospital or such. Weight Watchers is easier to quit than a medically sanctioned program. 

 

I also like the idea of a personal trainer, if and only if you felt confident that you could select someone knowledgeable about both exercise and diet. The personal trainers at my gym are very much a mixed bag.

[Scarlett]

The Bolded is something I don't think dss understands.

 

And honestly I don't think dh understands it either.

 

 

 

 

The problem with low carb is that it's fairly useless to do part-time. If you were able to control every bite he eats at home, that honestly does no good if he consumes 100+ carbs at vo tech every day, and thousands of carbs every other weekend at his mom's house. And it is easy to consume that many carbs. 

 

I think that a specialized program is the way to go, as in a weight loss program for teens or a therapist. I know you are going to mention this to dh but I would go further and urge him to get ds enrolled in something, preferably a program linked to a hospital or such. Weight Watchers is easier to quit than a medically sanctioned program. 

 

I also like the idea of a personal trainer, if and only if you felt confident that you could select someone knowledgeable about both exercise and diet. The personal trainers at my gym are very much a mixed bag.    

 

[scholastica]

Yep. And I truly do appreciate the voices of reason.

 

I talked to dh a long time this morning and he is definitely on board to get him to a specialist. And a counselor. And the gym. And a sleep study maybe.

 

Dss will be going to his mom's in a few days and it is the holidays so we will have to wait until the first of the year to get moving. In the meantime I spend my free time gathering information, sorting through the various layers of opinion vs facts vs. somewhere in the middle.

Yay!! This great news! Praying for all of you as go forward.

[TechWife]

Yep. And I truly do appreciate the voices of reason.

 

I talked to dh a long time this morning and he is definitely on board to get him to a specialist. And a counselor. And the gym. And a sleep study maybe.

 

Dss will be going to his mom's in a few days and it is the holidays so we will have to wait until the first of the year to get moving. In the meantime I spend my free time gathering information, sorting through the various layers of opinion vs facts vs. somewhere in the middle.

This is wonderful news! If you can, go ahead and start making appointments now for after the first of the year - specialists often get booked up weeks in advance. I’m excited for your dss!

[Scarlett]

This is all compounded by his insurance.  We have a very difficult time getting info on his insurance because his step dad acts like it is a state secret.  In fact dss said something to me that made me think the step dad doesn't even realize he is still carrying the insurance on ss.  Oh well, one bridge at a time.

 

[OneStepAtATime]

This is all compounded by his insurance.  We have a very difficult time getting info on his insurance because his step dad acts like it is a state secret.  In fact dss said something to me that made me think the step dad doesn't even realize he is still carrying the insurance on ss.  Oh well, one bridge at a time.

That can make things so much more complicated.  Good luck.

[Jean in Newcastle]

Guys, Scarlett has the right to post just like everybody else. If you don't like her posts or feel like she won't listen to your response, then don't read her posts and certainly don't respond. Goodness knows that I often disagree with her and certainly tell her so, and I don't think she understands weight issues at all, but I also know that she does do a lot for her stepson, and they seem to have an overall positive relationship. It's difficult.

 

She gets a lot of conflicting advice, so of course she can't take it all (and has no obligation to take any of it, just bc she asked for opinions). And I think she's catching some unfair heat for acknowledging that a relationship with an older stepchild, whose other parent is actively in the picture, is going to be quite different from a relationship with a child you have raised from an early age. Some people think it's awful to state that relationships and families with stepkids and exes can be different and more complicated, but not saying it doesn't make it any less true. And the reality is that Scarlett doesn't have decision-making powers for dss; she is not the one who decides if the will do this or that program, where he will go to school, and so on.

 

 

 

Well, packaged yogurt is not actually a very healthy food, lol. I do think Scarlett underestimated how tempting fast food is to most people, even when not hungry, but I am also a person who would not be able to just skip the meal, and would need something more substantial than yogurt and a piece of fruit. That would actually just trigger extreme hunger for me (way too many carbs, not enough fat or protein).

 

 

Yes! Research shows that sleep is actually more important than exercise when it comes to losing weight. Food, sleep, then exercise.

 

I've only been low carb for must over 3 months, so I'm no expert. But I have lost 15 pounds, about half of goal, in that time. And I went from pretty food-obsessed with lots of carby cravings, to not thinking about food nearly as much, and rarely having cravings. I'm a little annoying with my evangelism, I'm sure, lol.

 

I personally think the health benefits of weight loss outweigh the lower amount of fruits and veggies (and good low carb plans have a method for increasing those as you get closer to goal). And a seriously overweight person is rarely going to get in much exercise until they lose enough to make it more practical and less painful.

 

What I eat: a low car, high protein, high fat. If you limit fat, most people are really going to struggle and not feel sated. So, when I do crave, I sometimes have super high calorie things like a simple mousse made with heavy cream and sugar free syrup. It keeps me from slipping and so far has not affected weight loss.

 

Atkins has lists of no carb and low carb foods that are very helpful. One thing I do is look for twists on old favorites. I can't have a big bowl of pasta, but I can have Alfredo sauce over broccoli. As it turns out, the Alfredo sauce is what I really like about Fettucine Alfredo :lol:

 

When I first started, I splayed out some money on the Atkins bars, which was very helpful for when i was craving sweet, crunchy, or junky. And for when I simply had the urge to overeat, which took me a couple of weeks to overcome, because I can only eat so much meat, eggs, etc, and the Atkins bars at least kept me on keel with carbs. As long as I kept carbs low, I steadily lost weight, even when eating too much. I still use them, just not as much.

 

Steam in the bag veggies are at the ready, at all times, because one should always buy and cook fresh food but reality. Even though the veggie portions are fairly low at the beginning of Atkins, it is super important to eat them every day, you definitely feel the difference if you don't.

 

The problem with low carb is that it's fairly useless to do part-time. If you were able to control every bite he eats at home, that honestly does no good if he consumes 100+ carbs at vo tech every day, and thousands of carbs every other weekend at his mom's house. And it is easy to consume that many carbs.

 

I think that a specialized program is the way to go, as in a weight loss program for teens or a therapist. I know you are going to mention this to dh but I would go further and urge him to get ds enrolled in something, preferably a program linked to a hospital or such. Weight Watchers is easier to quit than a medically sanctioned program.

 

I also like the idea of a personal trainer, if and only if you felt confident that you could select someone knowledgeable about both exercise and diet. The personal trainers at my gym are very much a mixed bag.

I think that if they go to a specialist, and I hope that they do, that they will need to take the advice of the specialist in diet. We already know that his heart has been impacted through the high bp numbers. A doctor needs to decide if high fat is safe for him.

[scoutingmom]

Ookaaay. Yeah. You are totally misreading this. A person can feel compassion and love for the child who has the weight issue. A person can feel despair for the child, knowing how hard the world is on them. A person can feel frustration when everything they try to do to help falls flat. A person can feel the sting of being blamed for something that is out of their hands. A person can feel the sense of failure that they are letting their loved one down. A person can feel all those things, all at the same time. Feeling one doesn't negate feeling the others.

 

Nice how you ignored the part in the post about feeling the anxiety of seeing your child take steps into a hostile world that will hate on them for their weight and all you managed to get out of my post was the part where the also parent feels the weight of the world's judgement and the frustration of trying to help while nothing works.

 

Haven't you ever felt frustration about trying to help your kids in some area with huge consequences and it doesn't work? Haven't you ever felt the sense of failure? And just because the child also is feeling frustrated and like a failure doesn't negate the fact that you do, too. If you have, then you understand. If not, then...you don't.

 

I know you're convinced that Scarlett has totally messed up this kid and doesn't llke him, but I'm not so sure that narrative is true. I think she has come on here when she's at her lowest and out of all hope or ideas, when her anxiety is at it's highest. Over the course of the posts, she either gains encouragement to go on, she gets new ideas, or she gets talked down and gains perspective.

 

I hope they take him to a bariatric place.

Sure a person can feel all of those things. But that one of the concerns is that they will feel the judgement of others just makes me shake my head. That they are hurt by fat-shaming once removed, while sharing feelings of fat-shaming towards their relative is ironic to the extreme.

 

Sent from my SM-T530NU using Tapatalk

[scoutingmom]

 

 

I talked to dh a long time this morning and he is definitely on board to get him to a specialist. And a counselor. And the gym. And a sleep study maybe.

 

Dss will be going to his mom's in a few days and it is the holidays so we will have to wait until the first of the year to get moving. In the meantime I spend my free time gathering information, sorting through the various layers of opinion vs facts vs. somewhere in the middle.

Sounds great! This is a fantastic move.

[Sandwalker]

I think that if they go to a specialist, and I hope that they do, that they will need to take the advice of the specialist in diet. We already know that his heart has been impacted through the high bp numbers. A doctor needs to decide if high fat is safe for him.

Yes. Dr. Atkins himself had heart problems. There are many other ways to lose weight while still eating healthy carbohydrates. Carbs are our bodies' fuel.

[LarlaB]

Good job Scarlett!!

[kitten18]

Yes. Dr. Atkins himself had heart problems. There are many other ways to lose weight while still eating healthy carbohydrates. Carbs are our bodies' fuel.

Dr. Atkins did not have heart problems.

[regentrude]

Dr. Atkins did not have heart problems.

 

Actually he did. He suffered a cardiac arrest. However, it seemed to be the result of cardiomyopathy and apparently unrelated to his diet.

[amo_mea_filiis.]

Yep. And I truly do appreciate the voices of reason.

 

I talked to dh a long time this morning and he is definitely on board to get him to a specialist. And a counselor. And the gym. And a sleep study maybe.

 

Dss will be going to his mom's in a few days and it is the holidays so we will have to wait until the first of the year to get moving. In the meantime I spend my free time gathering information, sorting through the various layers of opinion vs facts vs. somewhere in the middle.

Ask dh to put the sleep study higher. It should be done based on his bedwetting alone, even though you said he’s coming off the meds. And at his weight, sleep apnea is almost a guarantee, which will make it harder to lose without treatment.

[Jean in Newcastle]

Dr. Atkins did not have heart problems.

Actually he did. He suffered a cardiac arrest. However, it seemed to be the result of cardiomyopathy and apparently unrelated to his diet.

It doesn’t really matter how Atkins died for the purposes of this thread. What does matter is that if you have existing health problems and/or are morbidly obese it is good to go to a specialist. And if you are going to bother paying for a specialist then it is best to run things by them because they will be advising you on your particular health situation and needs. While it is true that lots of different diets and methods work for lots of different people, it is equally true that not all methods are healthy for all people.

[Sandwalker]

Sorry about the Atkins off track post.

 

Scarlett, it sounds as if you and dh had a really good talk about dss. I know how hard it is to bring up that kind of stuff, and you really got a lot discussed.

 

Now let's hope dss gets onboard with little fuss with the changes to come.

[Scarlett]

Dss's mom asked to get him Sunday at 1:00 instead of Wednesday as previously planned. Dh is at the point now where he lets Dss make the decision on those things. He asked Dss if he wanted to go early. Dss says, 'I guess'. This s a common answer of his. Dh says, 'no. Not, you guess. What do you want to do.'. I think he eventually said he wanted to go early. It isn't a bad thing to do something because your mom wants it sometimes.....but you need to be able to understand what you are expressimg. .

 

So he will be there like 10 days.

 

Dh and I are trying to figure out how to get to a specialist. Ugh.

[DawnM]

Dss's mom asked to get him Sunday at 1:00 instead of Wednesday as previously planned. Dh is at the point now where he lets Dss make the decision on those things. He asked Dss if he wanted to go early. Dss says, 'I guess'. This s a common answer of his. Dh says, 'no. Not, you guess. What do you want to do.'. I think he eventually said he wanted to go early. It isn't a bad thing to do something because your mom wants it sometimes.....but you need to be able to understand what you are expressimg. .

 

So he will be there like 10 days.

 

Dh and I are trying to figure out how to get to a specialist. Ugh.

 

I doubt you can get to a specialist in 10 days anyway, esp during the holiday.

[Scarlett]

I doubt you can get to a specialist in 10 days anyway, esp during the holiday.

OH no that isn't what I meant. Sorry I was rambling. I just meant should we ask for a referral or go back to the GP first or what.

[itsheresomewhere]

OH no that isn't what I meant. Sorry I was rambling. I just meant should we ask for a referral or go back to the GP first or what.

I would demand a referral if my insurance required it. Check out with the insurance as a few now don’t require one if going to a bariatric specialist.

[Scarlett]

Well I don't want to pull a name out of a hat. I would like some guidance on where to go.

[itsheresomewhere]

Well I don't want to pull a name out of a hat. I would like some guidance on where to go.

You best bet might be to call your local hospitals or use their websites and ask for their bariatric programs for teens. And just a heads up- ask if the hospitals have a weight loss seminars you could attend. Those are normally free and usually the bariatric doctors are the ones giving them. Great way to see if you feel the doctor is someone you could like and also to get a recommendations for one who treats teens. My DH went to a few of these to get a feel for the doctors. Through these he found a great doctor who he liked and felt actually listened to his patients.

Edited December 21, 2017 by itsheresomewhere

[OneStepAtATime]

You best bet might be to call your local hospitals or use their websites and ask for their bariatric programs for teens. And just a heads up- ask if the hospitals have a weight loss seminars you could attend. Those are normally free and usually the bariatric doctors are the ones giving them. Great way to see if you feel the doctor is someone you could like and also to get a recommendations for one who treats teens. My DH went to a few of these to get a feel for the doctors. Through these he found a great doctor who he liked and felt actually listened to his patients.

This is an excellent idea and cuts out some of the "friend" bias when doctors are making referrals.  

[Acadie]

:( Being at moms every other wknd would probably ruin the whole 30 (or other detox) strategy. I can't imagine it would be easy for him to cope with that on his own.

 

Fried junk food at VoTech every weekday also could completely negate healthier eating at home. This is really tough, Scarlett.

 

I know you've talked about exercise before--was he able to lose some weight when he was working out regularly, but gained it back when he stopped? I'd probably redouble my efforts on exercise, preferably as a family activity or with a group/trainer/accountability partner, and emotional support, with the idea that feeling better physically might provide some intrinsic motivation, and let go trying to manage his eating other than providing the healthiest food you can at home.

 

I know exercise can be tricky in terms of getting teens to do it, scheduling and driving. 

 

Amy

 

ETA: Just read the update about your conversation with dh and plan for the new year--kudos to you for advocating for your son. 

Edited December 21, 2017 by Acadie

[ktgrok]

As for finding one, there are not very many bariatric programs for teens, so I'd google and see if there is even a selection to choose from. There probably aren't many in you area. You want one associated with a hospital. 

[Scarlett]

Ok, I am feeling a little foolish. I thought since bariatric was being mentioned in this thread there must be a non surgical version. Apparently no. I talked to my PA friend who had bariatric surgery and who also worked in a bariatric facility. She says it is always about surgery. And she agreed with me that 16 is usually too young to be thinking of that route.especially since other paths have not been explored yet.

[Acorn]

https://www.mercy.com/cincinnati/specialties/bariatrics-and-weight-management/which-solution-is-right-for-me?gclid=Cj0KCQiA9_LRBRDZARIsAAcLXjd7OZxnMB-bBt3J4vrmtlL27DYALiPLmo73Z32K6PmPPQM76hDy5DsaAr62EALw_wcB

 

At least in my area, there are doctors and classes for both options.

[MedicMom]

Ok, I am feeling a little foolish. I thought since bariatric was being mentioned in this thread there must be a non surgical version. Apparently no. I talked to my PA friend who had bariatric surgery and who also worked in a bariatric facility. She says it is always about surgery. And she agreed with me that 16 is usually too young to be thinking of that route.especially since other paths have not been explored yet.

Bariatric specialists do surgery, but they often have other suggestions first, as people must lose a certain amount of weight before being cleared for surgical interventions. They specialize in diseases of the bariatric population.

[ktgrok]

Ok, I am feeling a little foolish. I thought since bariatric was being mentioned in this thread there must be a non surgical version. Apparently no. I talked to my PA friend who had bariatric surgery and who also worked in a bariatric facility. She says it is always about surgery. And she agreed with me that 16 is usually too young to be thinking of that route.especially since other paths have not been explored yet.

 

There are bariatric surgeons and then there are bariatricians, which do not do surgery. And there are weight loss clinics associated with hospitals that work specifically with children and adolescents, and do not do surgery. Surgery on teens is controversial, and although I'm in favor of it in some situations I agree you are not there yet. 

 

 

http://www.obesityaction.org/educational-resources/resource-articles-2/medically-managed-weight-loss/what-is-a-bariatrician

 

"Bariatric physicians are doctors who specialize in helping patients lose weight without surgical intervention. Bariatricians treat obesity and related disorders."

 

That's from the Obesity Action Coalition, which is a good resource. They have a yearly conference/convention and put out informational materials, etc. You can find great videos from past conferences on their website, your DSS may be interested in them. Some are on cooking, some are on things like the science of Non Exercise Activity, etc. 

 

This is a link to one program that treats pediatric obesity...you are looking for something like this, but in your area. http://www.stanfordchildrens.org/en/service/pediatric-weight/clinic/overview

[Scarlett]

That looks like a good program but there is not anything like that anywhere near me. I found an article from 2010 about a 6 week program in the city ( an hour a way) but that appears to no longer exist. They also used one participants real name and I looked her up in FB and it appears she is still struggling.

 

I think our best best is going to be a visit to a nutritionist and encouraging him to join the gym. Oh and figuring out his sleep issue. Is that chicken or egg?

[HomeAgain]

I think your best bet, Scarlett, might be to simply tell him "we're going to the gym in half an hour.  Get ready."  And do it all with him.  Sometimes teens need that extra support - even if we think they should be handling the information themselves.  Not encouraging, but simply expecting that a, b, and c will happen because you are doing a, b, and c as well.

[Scarlett]

I think your best bet, Scarlett, might be to simply tell him "we're going to the gym in half an hour. Get ready." And do it all with him. Sometimes teens need that extra support - even if we think they should be handling the information themselves. Not encouraging, but simply expecting that a, b, and c will happen because you are doing a, b, and c as well.

Oh we will definitely be taking him at first. But Dh works in the city and I work 3 days a week. Dss will pass right by the gym on his way home from vo tec 5 days a week, so that will be his best bet. And until he begins to lose weight through diet changes I don't think he will,be doing much beyond maybe a little tread mill and some weight training. He just needs to move some. His back is really hurting right now. Just one more thing he has going on that is related to not moving and being over weight.

 

Yesterday when he told me his back was hurting I said, ' oh I am sorry. We have some extra strength Tylenol that might help.' I have told him many many times lack of movement contributes to back pain so he fully knows my opinion on it. My goal is to keep my mouth shut and be positive as I can be.

[Scarlett]

No, many facilities have programs to deal with overeating, dietitians, etc. Their sole purpose isn’t surgery.

Ok, well those programs are no where near us.

[Scarlett]

Do you live near any hospitals? Three of the seven local hospitals around here have dietary programs and clinics, and two have actual certified bariatric programs for surgery. But we are talking mid sized local hospitals, I don’t live in a huge city. I’d call the hospital and ask, honestly. I think you’d be surprised the resources and groups they have, even if they don’t have a full out and out research clinic.

No. Closest hospital is almost an hour away. Well there is a hospital in our little town that no one will go to for anything.

 

I made an appointment with the GP for January.

[HomeAgain]

Oh we will definitely be taking him at first. But Dh works in the city and I work 3 days a week. Dss will pass right by the gym on his way home from vo tec 5 days a week, so that will be his best bet. And until he begins to lose weight through diet changes I don't think he will,be doing much beyond maybe a little tread mill and some weight training. He just needs to move some. His back is really hurting right now. Just one more thing he has going on that is related to not moving and being over weight.

 

Yesterday when he told me his back was hurting I said, ' oh I am sorry. We have some extra strength Tylenol that might help.' I have told him many many times lack of movement contributes to back pain so he fully knows my opinion on it. My goal is to keep my mouth shut and be positive as I can be.

 

If it was, he'd be there already.

 

Don't be surprised if he doesn't go on his own and you fall right back into the same cycle of you wringing your hands and expecting him to just have the fortitude and gumption to change 16 years of a lifestyle.  On his own.

 

Teens need the extra guidance.  They need handholding sometimes when it comes to big things.

[bolt.]

Yesterday when he told me his back was hurting I said, ' oh I am sorry. We have some extra strength Tylenol that might help.' I have told him many many times lack of movement contributes to back pain so he fully knows my opinion on it. My goal is to keep my mouth shut and be positive as I can be.

I think your response about Tylenol for pain is much much more positive, kind and compassionate than your impulse to remind him that he is to blame for being in pain. That's a really good step.

 

I'm wondering about your household regulations around minor medications. All kinds of families do it different ways, and that's great: it works lots of ways.

 

I'm thinking, though, that I don't think it's common for near-adults to need to go through parents to get Tylenol. Perhaps a shift towards autonomy in that area might be helpful? (Unless you have reason for concern, of course.)

 

For example, I move away from kids asking me to get minor medications for them, towards them 'announcing' that they need one and are getting one themselves 'ok?' around age 10. I anticipate them not needing to do the 'ok?' part pretty soon, and not needing the announcement eventually. Absent any reasons for concern, I wouldn't feel the need to closely monitor how often a near-adult was taking meds that I consider minor. (I would monitor how fast the supply was dwindling.)

[Scarlett]

If it was, he'd be there already.

 

Don't be surprised if he doesn't go on his own and you fall right back into the same cycle of you wringing your hands and expecting him to just have the fortitude and gumption to change 16 years of a lifestyle. On his own.

 

Teens need the extra guidance. They need handholding sometimes when it comes to big things.

I am not sure what you are suggesting. Should I quit my job so I can go with him every day?

[Scarlett]

I think your response about Tylenol for pain is much much more positive, kind and compassionate than your impulse to remind him that he is to blame for being in pain. That's a really good step.

 

I'm wondering about your household regulations around minor medications. All kinds of families do it different ways, and that's great: it works lots of ways.

 

I'm thinking, though, that I don't think it's common for near-adults to need to go through parents to get Tylenol. Perhaps a shift towards autonomy in that area might be helpful? (Unless you have reason for concern, of course.)

 

For example, I move away from kids asking me to get minor medications for them, towards them 'announcing' that they need one and are getting one themselves 'ok?' around age 10. I anticipate them not needing to do the 'ok?' part pretty soon, and not needing the announcement eventually. Absent any reasons for concern, I wouldn't feel the need to closely monitor how often a near-adult was taking meds that I consider minor. (I would monitor how fast the supply was dwindling.)

We don't require either one to ask or announce. But neither of them seem to think of taking Tylenol for pain or cold medicine when they have a cold.

[amo_mea_filiis.]

That looks like a good program but there is not anything like that anywhere near me. I found an article from 2010 about a 6 week program in the city ( an hour a way) but that appears to no longer exist. They also used one participants real name and I looked her up in FB and it appears she is still struggling.

 

I think our best best is going to be a visit to a nutritionist and encouraging him to join the gym. Oh and figuring out his sleep issue. Is that chicken or egg?

Chicken or egg doesn’t matter too much. Get all the herding going as it comes along. Call his gp and ask for the sleep and nutrition referral (dietician may be better than nutritionist. You can also reach out online to behavior analysts who have gone into the nutrition field). Encourage him to make a single diet change to start. Maybe eating a good breakfast, or just adding 16oz of water (1 bottle) a day. If he drinks water and soda or something, maybe encourage stopping the non water liquid.

 

Start going to the gym with him and find out about a trainer. The YMCA usually offers great discounts for minors who use a trainer. The Y might also have some nutrition classes or some other related stuff.

[goldberry]

We don't require either one to ask or announce. But neither of them seem to think of taking Tylenol for pain or cold medicine when they have a cold.

 

Yeah, some men don't outgrow this.  DH walks around complaining and when I ask "Did you take an Advil?" he acts like it's the first time he ever heard of it.  :glare:

[OneStepAtATime]

We don't require either one to ask or announce. But neither of them seem to think of taking Tylenol for pain or cold medicine when they have a cold.

Yeah, here too.  My kids don't always think about meds.  When I mention minor meds it isn't because I require them to go through me but because if they mention something that minor meds might help and I remind them that we have that option since they don't always think about it.  

 

It makes sense that they might not.  After all, they don't have the life experience we do.

[Annie G]

We don't require either one to ask or announce. But neither of them seem to think of taking Tylenol for pain or cold medicine when they have a cold.

 

I'm convinced that potty training was easier than getting my teens to manage their own minor medication needs.  

[itsheresomewhere]

Ok, I am feeling a little foolish. I thought since bariatric was being mentioned in this thread there must be a non surgical version. Apparently no. I talked to my PA friend who had bariatric surgery and who also worked in a bariatric facility. She says it is always about surgery. And she agreed with me that 16 is usually too young to be thinking of that route.especially since other paths have not been explored yet.

That is not true. They don’t always do surgery. While they sometimes recommend surgery for that age, normally it is a lifestyle program. Give it a try.

[ktgrok]

We don't require either one to ask or announce. But neither of them seem to think of taking Tylenol for pain or cold medicine when they have a cold.

 

Yeah, my husband is nearing 40 and still doesn't think to do that unless I tell him :)  I think it is a man thing!

[HomeAgain]

I am not sure what you are suggesting. Should I quit my job so I can go with him every day?

 

No.  You should expect to set the tone on your days off.  Make it a habit that you are going to the gym/riding a bike/swimming/whatever and expect the boys to join you.  Your dss doesn't need to spend 7 days at the gym.  He needs to get into the habit of going and someone needs to help him.

 

IIRC, the last time this subject came up you had reasons why you couldn't possibly exercise as a family.  I think that's one of the mental shifts you are going to absolutely have to make in order for your dss to develop new habits and replace the old. 

[ktgrok]

I get not wanting to share information on the internet, but if you are comfortable PMing me with your general area, I'd be happy to do a bit of research on programs for you, when I can. Like I said, this hits very close to home with me. I know my own mom was frustrated, and felt helpless when I started gaining. She'd never been overweight in her life and just couldn't understand, and she is a great mom. (now, after a cancer bout, she is all of a sudden having weight issues for the first time in her life and now does get it)

[HomeAgain]

Yeah, my husband is nearing 40 and still doesn't think to do that unless I tell him :)  I think it is a man thing!

 

 

Ugh, yes!  Dh just had back surgery a few weeks ago and after the first few days he would moan and complain about the pain, but wouldn't voluntarily take the meds.  DS1 is the same way - came home with a cold. "DS, there's Nyquil, Dayquil, Tylenol Cold & Flu.  Even Zarbees.  Take something!!"

 

[OneStepAtATime]

That looks like a good program but there is not anything like that anywhere near me. I found an article from 2010 about a 6 week program in the city ( an hour a way) but that appears to no longer exist. They also used one participants real name and I looked her up in FB and it appears she is still struggling.

 

I think our best best is going to be a visit to a nutritionist and encouraging him to join the gym. Oh and figuring out his sleep issue. Is that chicken or egg?

1.  I agree, figure out the sleep issues.

2.  Get a nutritionist (or preferrably a dietician) on board, preferably someone with experience regarding teens and morbid obesity.

3.  And if at all possible hire a personal trainer to supervise gym visits and it needs to be someone who understands teen obesity and will not ridicule him or put him through a dangerously improper program.  #3 I cannot emphasize enough since you don't seem to have better options in your area.  Why is it important?

• You want him trained in how to properly use the equipment so he doesn't injure himself.
• You want him balancing his exercises so he doesn't injure himself and so he is doing a healthy combination of strength training and aerobics and builds up slowly so he doesn't risk damage.
• You want someone who can encourage him and set him up with a healthy routine and schedule that he can follow instead of just hoping he will randomly figure it all out on his own and maintain motivation.  
• He almost certainly will be more motivated to stop at the gym on the way home if he knows there is a plan created by someone who knows what they are doing and will be there to support him and to encourage him and to help him focus on the things he is doing right.  He needs a non-family member with training and knowledge working with him weekly.  I think he will be far more likely to stop there after Votech each day if he has this component in place.

 

FWIW, as I think I mentioned a few pages ago, my mom and I and my kids are using a personal trainer.   The cost is minimal because I shopped around and found a good deal.  It has made a HUGE difference.  Doing things properly has made a huge difference in the effectiveness of our exercises.  It has made a huge difference in preventing injuries and unhealthy fatigue.  It has made a huge difference in motivation and accountability.  It has made a huge difference in getting my son to feel like it isn't all on his shoulders to figure out how to exercise AND it is no longer family that is trying to be the motivator (which can be a lousy dynamic for a teen).  And it has made a huge difference in helping the kids to see this is for the long term.  Not a quick fix.  These are skills (and yes it is a set of skills to exercise properly) that need to be built up over time and will benefit everyone long term, not just in the moment.  And they have bonded with the trainer.  They listen to him.  They like him.  They are motivated to do what he recommends because they respect him and he respects them.

 

Anyway, best wishes and good luck as you seek a healthier path for your SS.

Edited December 22, 2017 by OneStepAtATime

[Scarlett]

No. You should expect to set the tone on your days off. Make it a habit that you are going to the gym/riding a bike/swimming/whatever and expect the boys to join you. Your dss doesn't need to spend 7 days at the gym. He needs to get into the habit of going and someone needs to help him.

 

IIRC, the last time this subject came up you had reasons why you couldn't possibly exercise as a family. I think that's one of the mental shifts you are going to absolutely have to make in order for your dss to develop new habits and replace the old.

We are making plans to help him get into the habit.

 

And no it just isn't going to happen that we exercise as a family. Really there are several ways to go about things. I think it is setting the entire situation up for a fail to attempt some unrealistic thing. That is what drives me nuts about posting here. People make suggestions that are real more like, 'if you don't do it THIS way you obviously dont really want to help him.

 

If he was 7 I could see that he would need family participation. But he is almost an adult and my son is older than that and they have their own thing going on and going their own direction.

[HomeAgain]

I think you do want to help him, Scarlett, but I think you're continually shooting yourself in the foot.  You don't see it worth your time on your days off to go to the gym with him because encouraging should be enough.  You don't see it worth changing your eating habits because changing his should be enough.  He should do it, because it needs to be done.  Right?  And if he doesn't that's on him.

 

Lack of solidarity is a big deal.  I hiked 70 miles with my kid last year.  Not because I wanted to.  It was what he needed.  He needed someone to expect something out of him (Eagle scout), and expect him to put a plan in place, and be that accountability partner when he couldn't get his troop to do that badge with him.  It is like that with a lot of things.  I do chores at the same time as my kid because it's holding him accountable for that bit of time.  It's not "you work, I'll do mine later" because it doesn't say that the task is important.  During the warm months we pack everyone's bikes on the rack and take them to the trail.  It's not a clear option to not ride.  We don't ride *together* (dh trains for long races, teen ds rides for speed, I work with the 7yo), but we make that the expectation of the morning 3 days a week.  In the cold months, I set out ds's yoga mat next to mine in the morning.  It becomes clear that the expectation is that he will follow the beginner's video to the best of his ability.

 

You can't choose not to set the model if getting dss healthy is important to you.  Otherwise your actions are speaking something your mouth isn't.