How Long After Closing Will a Restaurant Kick You Out?

[Jean in Newcastle]

If a restaurant has hours posted does that mean they will only serve new customers up until that time?  Kick everyone out at that time?  What?  The restaurant in question is Panera, if that makes a difference.

[JustEm]

They'll serve new customers until that time generally and won't kick you out.

[Jean in Newcastle]

Good.  'Cause I'm sitting here (with lots of  other customers) and none of us want to move!

[Peaceful Isle]

:) that's awesome.

[jenn-]

Just remember some of those workers have families to get home to.

[Jean in Newcastle]

They are washing dishes and doing other work.  Obviously if someone asked us to leave, we would, but no one has even come out to clean some of the tables near me.

[Jean in Newcastle]

OK - last sip of Hibiscus tea drunk.  Last problem of Latin graded.  What good timing!  Now they are working out here so I'm going to clear out for them.

[Liz CA]

Still there?  :)  Order more dessert...

[Jean in Newcastle]

LOL .  I'm home now.  

[TGHEALTHYMOM]

You gave me a great idea!!! I have a BAM card for free wifi... Panera is directly in front... hmmm... Hibiscus tea sounds divine...

 

[Jean in Newcastle]

Panera has free wi-fi too.  Just saying. . . 

[Samiam]

Poor minimum wage workers, just want to finish their shift and get on with their lives for the day. Rest assured, regardless of how nice they treated as you sat there after hours, they did not appreciate it, and it's kinda selfish on your part. Come earlier if you want to partake in the ambiance, and then be courteous and leave at closing hours.

[Arcadia]

Usually they lock up about 30mins after the posted closing time. Some places will chain their outside tables and chairs after closing but I don't remember if Panera does that. Most places I went to, it is the branch/franchise manager that locks up so the other staff gets to go home on time. Some establishment do expect staff to stay for 30-45mins after closing and do pay them for that.

[unfrumpable.]

I always hated waiting for those last customers to leave after the place was closed when I waited tables. No, I have never asked anyone to leave nor witnessed anyone asking anyone to leave, but I'm sure the customers were aware the place was closed and that they were the last people there.

 

I am not sure how it is awesome to stay past closing time or to be encouraged to order more after the restaurant is closed.

[Jean in Newcastle]

Oh for Pete's sake.  I ordered before the place was closed.  They had no problem taking my money.  I sat and ate my food.  I did not sit around a minute after I finished eating.  They did lock the doors at 9 pm.  I did not stay even a half hour past that and there were still at least 15 people in the restaurant when I left.  I asked because I wanted to be able to finish my food without having to bolt it down and get indigestion.  I also did not want to be embarrassed by making an inadvertent faux pas.  I wasn't asking to see if I could make anyone suffer.  

[BugsMama]

When I worked in a restaurant, we weren't allowed to start cleaning the front of the house until everyone left. On days when no one showed up at 9:58 to order, I could be mopping and re-stocking and wiping up at 10 on the dot, and be home by 10:30. On days when people camped out past closing, I couldn't even start until they were gone, and I was home much later than I wanted to be. To make it worse, we weren't supposed to take overtime, so now I had to decide if I wanted to get talked down to for staying late, punch out and continue working, or not do the job to my standards and possibly be in trouble for that.

 

Ideally, we'd all get paid and get the job done, but in reality, you've got minimum wage workers who will do what the boss says or be replaced, which means most of the time, we worked for free when people came in at closing.

 

Point of the story- try to not make a habit of it, or take the food to go if you must order at closing.

[Elfknitter.#]

Fwiw, not Panera but the closing time posted for my library is at the top of an hour. Doors are locked from outside by the top of an hour and workers are not paid for time past closing. So for us, if closing is say 7:30pm, we expect you out.

 

That said, I would not expect retail staff to allow me to stay anywhere past 20 minutes of their closing hour-though I do realize many workers stay at least an hour or more to tidy/straighten things up.

[Laurie4b]

Poor minimum wage workers, just want to finish their shift and get on with their lives for the day. Rest assured, regardless of how nice they treated as you sat there after hours, they did not appreciate it, and it's kinda selfish on your part. Come earlier if you want to partake in the ambiance, and then be courteous and leave at closing hours.

 

I worked in restaurants for years. Closing time means the time they will serve the last meal, not the time customers should leave. So if the hours say 5-10, they will still take your order if you arrive at 10:00, but if you arrive at 10:15, they won't take your order even though customers will still be there eating. They expect you to stay past closing time--how else would you eat your meal? Their closing time figures in the time it takes normal people to eat meals. Generally, it's at least an hour. It might be somewhat shorter in a place like Panera--maybe 30-45 minutes. If Panera posts its closing time as 10:00, I would still expect to see people in there at 11:00 and would not consider them rude at all.

 

The situation the OP was describing wasn't selfish at all. The workers were still working in the kitchen and there were still uncleared tables in the dining room. Once those tables in the dining room are cleared, then yes, it's polite to leave.

 

Minimum wage workers get paid by the hour, not by the job, so it's no harm to them if a customer stays long. The people it can hurt are wait staff who are paid primarily by tips (not applicable in Panera) and the restaurant owner who has to pay the minimum wage people. Rest assured, however, that most managers will politely let people know that it's time to leave when money is going to be lost for the establishment if people stay.

 

[Laurie4b]

When I worked in a restaurant, we weren't allowed to start cleaning the front of the house until everyone left. On days when no one showed up at 9:58 to order, I could be mopping and re-stocking and wiping up at 10 on the dot, and be home by 10:30. On days when people camped out past closing, I couldn't even start until they were gone, and I was home much later than I wanted to be. To make it worse, we weren't supposed to take overtime, so now I had to decide if I wanted to get talked down to for staying late, punch out and continue working, or not do the job to my standards and possibly be in trouble for that.

 

Ideally, we'd all get paid and get the job done, but in reality, you've got minimum wage workers who will do what the boss says or be replaced, which means most of the time, we worked for free when people came in at closing.

 

Point of the story- try to not make a habit of it, or take the food to go if you must order at closing.

 

A library or retail store is not comparable to a restaurant. The restaurant builds into its closing time the time necessary for people to actually eat the food. It is not rude to stay and eat your food. That's what restaurants are for.

[trudence1]

When I worked fast food back in high school, we expected people to be in the restaurant for at least 30 minutes past closing.  Didn't always like it when I would rather be home, but it was expected and we were paid for it.  If we closed at 11 and a bus-load of people showed up at 10:59 we served them. 

[creekland]

Oh for Pete's sake.  I ordered before the place was closed.  They had no problem taking my money.  I sat and ate my food.  I did not sit around a minute after I finished eating.  They did lock the doors at 9 pm.  I did not stay even a half hour past that and there were still at least 15 people in the restaurant when I left.  I asked because I wanted to be able to finish my food without having to bolt it down and get indigestion.  I also did not want to be embarrassed by making an inadvertent faux pas.  I wasn't asking to see if I could make anyone suffer.  

 

I'm with Laurie - you were not a problem at all.  Youngest works at Chick-fil-A and often works closing.  His place closes at 10 and he's usually not home until 11:30 or later - NOT due to customers who stay and eat their food (they're definitely WELCOME to do so).  It's due to all the cleaning they have to do.  They are allowed to clean the front as well as the back after closing.  There's never been a customer they had to "kick out" (or even wanted to) because they've stayed so long they had to wait for them.  He gets paid until he clocks out - which is when he's done.

 

You wouldn't have been able to order more food after closing.  At that point they shut stuff down.  Employees often eat after closing, but they know they have to have whatever they want ordered by 9:45 (15 minutes prior to closing).

 

I'm glad you enjoyed your food/tea/time!

[bolt.]

I worked fast food. Closing up the kitchen took at least 30 minutes. I think it's only after that frame that you would begin to sense at all that your welcome had been overstayed. I imagine in bigger / more full service places the window would be even longer. I can't imagine it being shorter.

[swellmomma]

At the diner I work at, we stop taking new orders at our closing time.  We generally give an extra 30 minutes after closing to allow people to finish eating and had to yesterday but it is a pain.  Everyone is waiting to go home, usually staying after closing puts them into overtime hours (which are usually not paid like overtime hours because even if you end up with a 10 hour day that day no one works enough in the week total to get paid those overtime hours at time & a half, they are just straight time), the dishwasher has it is the hardest waiting for those last dishes to trickle in.  Last night I got there for my cleaning shift and had to wait 45 minutes before I could even start.  I had already worked all morning and part of the afternoon, and was eager to get my cleaning done and get home to my kids but had to wait. Which meant the boss was paying 3 of us to stand around doing nothing after closing waiting to do our jobs.  Last night we had all the tables cleared and chairs stacked up 30 minutes after closing and this one table continued to just sit and drink their coffee and visit for another 15 minutes.  While we want customers to be happy and enjoy their meal, we also want to finish up our tasks and get home to our families. 

[creekland]

 

Maybe Panera operates differently, but um yeah it's not like these places tend to treat their employees well and that the employees are fine with staying longer because they can make more money. 

 

I'd be curious to know about actual names of places as they appear to be fairly different.

 

As mentioned, my guy currently works for Chick-fil-A and not only does he get paid until the end - whenever the end is - anyone who needs or wants to leave sooner can (once past their official hours).  Only those who want to stay until it's all done stay.  He stays as he likes the $$.  Sometimes there are only a couple - that extends the time, but he doesn't mind.

 

McDonalds around here are open 24 hours, so staying there shouldn't be a problem.

 

I have no idea about some of the other places, but would like to know.

[creekland]

I worked at McDs.  At that time there really wasn't any such thing as 24-7 for McDs.  And no, not all McDs are open that late.  I would get yelled at if it took too long to get out of there.  We had a zillion things to do before getting out of there and if you didn't work your tail off with no interruption you didn't get it done.  And if you didn't get it done, too bad you clocked out and got yelled at the next time.

 

We don't have Chick fil A around here. 

 

Among workers at school, those at Chick-fil-A love it (allowing that it's still a fast food job).  Those at McD's all tell me they do it just for the $$.  Some of the Chick-fil-A employees came from McDs.

 

I suspect there is a management difference - plus, of course, many like having Sundays off (whether religious or not).

[catz]

Poor minimum wage workers, just want to finish their shift and get on with their lives for the day. Rest assured, regardless of how nice they treated as you sat there after hours, they did not appreciate it, and it's kinda selfish on your part. Come earlier if you want to partake in the ambiance, and then be courteous and leave at closing hours.

I used to work in food service. It would take us 1-2 hours after closing to finish up everything and get out of there. Obviously, if someone asks you to leave, it's time to go. But it never bothered me if someone took a little longer. The managers would take orders and new customers up until closing. Having people linger was part of the deal.

[unsinkable]

"Closing time...you don't have to go home but you can't stay here. I know who I want to take me home. I know who I want to take me home, take me home."

 

Ahem. Well, that's out of my system!

 

I think establishments handle closing time differently. Obviously, there's bar time where the clocks are literally set 15 or 20 minutes ahead and Last Call is crystal clear.

 

It sounds like Jean's Panera has a culture where people are free to stay after the doors are locked. 15 people is a bunch...and I'd bet half of them are regulars who know the culture and when they are expected to leave.

 

DS works at a sub chain...not Subway...and they bust themselves to get out ASAP after closing time. The biggest dread they have is a grill order after the grill is cleaned. The unwritten rule is to suggest cold subs at the end of the night, :lol:

 

As for timing...there are some nights they get done within 15 minutes of the doors being locked. It is usually closer to 30.

[Excelsior! Academy]

I have worked fast food.  It always took us 30+ minutes just to shut down the kitchen.  I would be occasionally encouraged to work off of the clock, usually during my lunch break.  It was wrong and (I think) illegal.  We would have people come in and stay.  It was mildly annoying if I wanted to go home, but loved the paycheck later.  If you take orders until closing time, it is unrealistic to not allow another 20ish+ minutes to allow them to eat.  You can't have it both ways.  Either stop taking orders earlier or allow people time to eat.  Most people will willingly and kindly leave if asked politely.  If you are in a big hurry to go home, ask the customer when they order if they want to take it to go.

[unfrumpable.]

In my restaurant experiences, it was the cooks that were the most pissed off if someone walked in within the last 15 minutes because they had already cleaned everything up, especially on slow nights. Obviously the customer never knew that, but they let the wait staff know! These were regular sit down restaurants and we were allowed to clean front and back, chairs up, then stand around and do nothing while people sat there and talked. Not eat, talk. Eating, fine. Hanging around talking, not fine. Go somewhere else to talk.

 

Sure, you can go in someplace up until closing time and order. People do that all the time and justify it by saying the employees expect it. Which I suppose they do. I still think it's rude though, that's just me. I've worked enough time in retail to see people linger shopping after the store was closed, several announcements had been made, and the lights were off.

 

I suppose management does play a part too. I currently work at Kroger's. On Thanksgiving, the manager was very proactive about walking the store and getting people out so we could be out of the store by 4:15. We closed at 4. I appreciate a manager who is thinking of his employees.

[mommymilkies]

Poor minimum wage workers, just want to finish their shift and get on with their lives for the day. Rest assured, regardless of how nice they treated as you sat there after hours, they did not appreciate it, and it's kinda selfish on your part. Come earlier if you want to partake in the ambiance, and then be courteous and leave at closing hours.

Maybe for some places.  But my Mom was a waitress most of my life, my best friend owns a restaurant here in town, and my dh worked fast food when we were together through high school/college and that was never the case.  Sure when he worked Taco Bell he wanted to be out as fast as possible, but that time is the last served, not when they expect you out.  I'm sure it depends on restaurant and manager, but I have never seen it otherwise.  I don't see it as selfish.  It's part of service to be serviceable and follow the rules of the institution. 

 

I worked in restaurants for years. Closing time means the time they will serve the last meal, not the time customers should leave. So if the hours say 5-10, they will still take your order if you arrive at 10:00, but if you arrive at 10:15, they won't take your order even though customers will still be there eating. They expect you to stay past closing time--how else would you eat your meal? Their closing time figures in the time it takes normal people to eat meals. Generally, it's at least an hour. It might be somewhat shorter in a place like Panera--maybe 30-45 minutes. If Panera posts its closing time as 10:00, I would still expect to see people in there at 11:00 and would not consider them rude at all.

 

The situation the OP was describing wasn't selfish at all. The workers were still working in the kitchen and there were still uncleared tables in the dining room. Once those tables in the dining room are cleared, then yes, it's polite to leave.

 

Minimum wage workers get paid by the hour, not by the job, so it's no harm to them if a customer stays long. The people it can hurt are wait staff who are paid primarily by tips (not applicable in Panera) and the restaurant owner who has to pay the minimum wage people. Rest assured, however, that most managers will politely let people know that it's time to leave when money is going to be lost for the establishment if people stay.

 

:iagree:   

 

FWIW, I've been booted from a coffee shop 5 hours before they closed while I was eating/drinking because they decided they wanted the room I was in (and others) because a group was coming.  So they were rude and passive aggressive before they finally asked us to leave.  Needless to say, I don't go back there if I don't have to. A company should post notices about things like this, or "last served at xyz PM" to be more clear for customers, probably.  But it's only rarely an issue. 

[Laurie4b]

In my restaurant experiences, it was the cooks that were the most pissed off if someone walked in within the last 15 minutes because they had already cleaned everything up, especially on slow nights. Obviously the customer never knew that, but they let the wait staff know! These were regular sit down restaurants and we were allowed to clean front and back, chairs up, then stand around and do nothing while people sat there and talked. Not eat, talk. Eating, fine. Hanging around talking, not fine. Go somewhere else to talk.

 

Sure, you can go in someplace up until closing time and order. People do that all the time and justify it by saying the employees expect it. Which I suppose they do. I still think it's rude though, that's just me. I've worked enough time in retail to see people linger shopping after the store was closed, several announcements had been made, and the lights were off.

 

I suppose management does play a part too. I currently work at Kroger's. On Thanksgiving, the manager was very proactive about walking the store and getting people out so we could be out of the store by 4:15. We closed at 4. I appreciate a manager who is thinking of his employees.

 

Perhaps there are regional differences, but I worked in restaurants for over 10 years, probably longer, all over the East Coast and I have never worked in one in which 5-10 pm meant anything other than last possible time to order food is 10 pm with the expectation that the patrons would of course stay and eat it. I did not work at McDonald's type places. In those, I would see a shorter window, but still a window to sit and eat.

 

I would see it as rude of the employees to work in a business in which the restaurant hours were advertised and then get all peeved when customers come in during those hours if that sense of being peeved is communicated in any way whatsoever to the customers.  That's just a very poor service mentality.  I've never worked in a restaurant where anyone, including owner, cook, dishwasher, or wait staff, thought that 5-10pm meant that everyone was supposed to be out the door by 10. So sure, it's a hassle if you've had a slow night and you have started thinking you'll get off early and a customer comes in. But it's a hospitality industry!

 

Again, restaurants are different than retail because it's expected that you consume the product (not browse) on the premises after ordering. With retail (except grocery stores), I have never been in a store at closing where it is not abundantly clear that you are not to continue browsing and in fact you cannot in most. Big department stores lock all but one door, and their cash registers are shut down. Places like craft stores do a count down: "Michael's will be closing in 5 minutes. Please take your final purchases to the cash register."

[Jean in Newcastle]

I ordered a toasted bagel with cream cheese and a Hibiscus unsweetened iced tea.  The bagel was sliced and went through a toaster.  I'm sure someone did have to clean the slicer (knife perhaps?) and the toaster during their kitchen clean-up.  There were no dishes for them to clear from my table or to wash because my bagel was given to me in a paper bag with cream cheese in a plastic cup thing.  I had a plastic knife.  My iced tea was in a plastic cup that I threw out as I went out the door.  I left as soon as someone started to clean in the dining area.  No one else moved but I felt like it was right for me to go even though I still had to wait a bit in my car for my daughter's event to end before I picked her up.  No workers, minimum wage or otherwise, were harmed.  The way the restaurant worked (a little less than 30 min. of kitchen cleaning before coming out into the dining area) seems to align with what some of you like Laurie4b have said.  

[mommymilkies]

 

Again, restaurants are different than retail because it's expected that you consume the product (not browse) on the premises after ordering. With retail (except grocery stores), I have never been in a store at closing where it is not abundantly clear that you are not to continue browsing and in fact you cannot in most. Big department stores lock all but one door, and their cash registers are shut down. Places like craft stores do a count down: "Michael's will be closing in 5 minutes. Please take your final purchases to the cash register."

I hate that countdown when you're at stores!  I mean, I appreciate it, but having to fly through Target with 5 minutes left.  That's torture!  :lol:

[Cosmos]

You were fine, Jean. And I like the idea of hanging out at Panera by myself in the evening to do some school planning or something. Sounds very nice to my introverted self.

[Jean in Newcastle]

You were fine, Jean. And I like the idea of hanging out at Panera by myself in the evening to do some school planning or something. Sounds very nice to my introverted self.

I did get my Latin grading finished - the very last bit of a Latin grading marathon I was doing all day.  And I had my laptop with me so I (obviously!) came to the WTM site for a few minutes.  

[creekland]

DS works at a sub chain...not Subway...and they bust themselves to get out ASAP after closing time. The biggest dread they have is a grill order after the grill is cleaned. The unwritten rule is to suggest cold subs at the end of the night, :lol:

 

 

A local sub shop from my youth (still operating) has a sign posted saying the grill closes 15 minutes before closing time.  This is for fries as well as hot subs.  It seems like the ideal solution for places where it matters.

[Crimson Wife]

I used to be on the board for the local Mothers' Club and they held their board meetings at the local Panera. The meetings started at 7 and Panera closed at 9. There were a few times where the meeting ran long and we were asked by the manager to leave at 9 P.M. on the dot. Now perhaps that was because we had ordered our drinks (paid for by the club) & any food well before 9 and we were just sitting there finishing up our meeting.

[Jeannie in NJ]

I have a couple of stories.  First, last summer we went to this non-chain place on the Boardwalk that is counter service and serves pulled pork, roast chicken, etc.  It is made ahead of time, nothing is made to order.  The Boardwalk has about a 10 week busy summer season and almost all places stay open until 10 or 11 at night.   Well we went to this place at 7:25 and they would not let us come in the door.  They said they close at 8 but lock the doors at 7:30 so no new customers can come in.  Okay?  so we came back a few days later at 7 pm, came in and were eating our food at a table when at 7:30 an employee locked the door and all the rest of the employees came out to sit at the tables to eat.  They were very loud and some started stacking tables on chairs and vaccuming the floor, it was not 8 o'clock yet.  We scarfed down our meal and left and never went back.  They obviously don't care if they have customers or not.  We will go to the Boardwalk eateries that stay open as late as possible and welcome latecomers.

 

2nd story.  A few nights ago we decided to try another place in the town where we just moved.  It is a very nice, Italian place.  We called to check on their hours.  They said they close at 9 so could we try to get there by 8:45.  THe place was small, only 7 tables and most of those were for 2 people.We got there at 8:30 and after waiting 10 min. we told them it was getting too close to their closing time so we would come back another time.  The owner came out , asked us to please stay and in just a couple of min. we had a table.  It was a place where everything was made to order.  They brought us apetizers on the house,  our entrees were wonderful and they even had us order dessert .  The waiter did not hurry us up, in fact, he was very chatty and it was def. a family place.  There was a couple that stayed almost as long as us and it was obvious that they were regulars.We not for an instant felt anything but welcome and yes, we did leave our waiter a large tip and we will be going back there.

[Jean in Newcastle]

I like that second place, Jeannie!  

[Mergath]

Here, closing time is the time most restaurants want you out.  They'll actually come around and tell you, "Hi, just wanted to let you know we're closing in five minutes, thanks."  I worked fast food as a teen, and if you stayed late cleaning up because people hung around forever, you just didn't get paid.  They paid you for the time you were on the schedule, not the time you actually worked.  But you still had to get everything on the closing list done, or you were fired.

[unsinkable]

It is against the law not to pay hourly wages for hours worked. It is part of the Fair Wages Standard Act and it was passed in the 1930s sometime. It's nothing new.

[Catwoman]

I don't think Jean did anything wrong, and I have to admit that I thought this was going to be a fun, lighthearted thread. I didn't expect Jean to be scolded for not being out of Panera at 9:00 on the dot.

 

I assume that, if they didn't want her to hang around for a while, they would have said something when she didn't order her food "to go." She only stayed for a short while afterward, anyway, and she wasn't even among the last people to leave, so I don't understand why anyone would suggest that she was being inconsiderate.

[QuirkyKapers]

My experience with Panera is that they will let you stay while they are cleaning.  In fact, they have never kicked me out.   As long as they are working, the workers have always told us stay until we are done cleaning.  I have no idea how long that would be since I usually have left within 30 to 45 minutes after they say they are closed.  The staff really doesn't seem to care. 

[Tess in the Burbs]

Our panera will ask you to leave at closing :-(

[Farrar]

My experience is also that places will just clean around you and then, when they've done everything they can, politely say that it's time for you to go.  I have been in several places at closing and never felt it was rude.  They're obviously working still so I can't see how I possibly kept anyone late.  And the idea that anyone is working for free if people stay late is mystifying to me.  Don't most workers at restaurants punch a clock?

[Catwoman]

My experience with Panera is that they will let you stay while they are cleaning.  In fact, they have never kicked me out.   As long as they are working, the workers have always told us stay until we are done cleaning.  I have no idea how long that would be since I usually have left within 30 to 45 minutes after they say they are closed.  The staff really doesn't seem to care.

 

The Paneras near me are the same way. I have gone there on more than one occasion for coffee and pastry shortly before they closed and said I would take it to go because I knew they were getting ready to close, and each time they have said it was fine to stay there and eat.

[unfrumpable.]

I can only speak for myself, but I was not scolding anyone on this thread. I was sharing my experience as a restaurant and retail worker and how I choose to conduct myself in the same situation. Obviously, if one orders food close to closing time, it is expected that one will sit and eat said food. However, if one is still sitting there chatting it up 30-45 minutes after said food is done, that is just rude IMO.

 

I certainly never let a customer know I was peeved they were still sitting there, if that is what is being taken away from what I said. I was working for tips, why would I do that? That doesn't mean that I can't have an opinion on the rudeness of said customer though.

 

Yes, there are announcements in retail stores for closing times, as I mentioned. People do choose to ignore those though and the registers are not closing until everyone is out of the store.

 

Honestly, I can only remember a handful, if that, of times that someone stayed that late after closing. Fortunately most people are considerate and don't hang around that long after eating when the place is closed. :)

[jenn-]

I wasn't trying to give Jean a hard time either. She asked a question and I was giving her something to think about.

[reign]

It is rude and horrible and gross but sometimes cooks get mad at the late orders and they do have control of the food. I like to order 30 minutes prior to closing just to make sure. I may be paranoid due to past employment. Staying a half hour after closing is totally except able in all of my past restaurant experience.