Do I just ignore this? Continuation of the changing due date thread

[planner]

Please don't quote and I'm going to delete because I'm going to be using a word that I'm sure would come up in a google search.

 

 

If you read the changing due date thread, you know my 4th grade dd's teacher moved up a due date on an assignment from Monday to Friday.  He made the change on Thursday.  Dd was unhappy because she hadn't started the assignment as she planned to do it over the weekend.  I emailed the teacher to let him know that dd had budgeted her time and it was unfair to change the due date.  He responded that he had changed the date because he wanted to grade the papers over the weekend.  He did make an allowance for dd to turn in the paper on Monday, but she had already completed the assignment.

 

Dd went to a friend's house after school and I didn't see her until 9PM last night.  As soon as we got in the car, she started to tell me about the vocabulary word of the day at school.  She has never told me about the vocabulary word of the day.  She told me she didn't remember it exactly but she had written it down and she was sure the teacher had chosen the word because of her.

 

The word is XXXXXXX.  Yes, a word so obscure that spellcheck thinks I've misspelled this word.  I personally had never heard the word before yesterday.  Next to the definition and the quote, she wrote, "Is he trying to be rude?  Really?  Is he trying to be rude?  He might be doing it because of mom."  (She's referring to my email to the teacher.)  (PARAGRAPH EDITED TO REMOVE ACTUAL WORD)

 

The word of the day is presented first thing in the morning.  It's informational only and not tested material.  I feel horrible that my daughter was thinking about his all day.  I tried to tell her that since she had told me many of her classmates were arguing the due date with the teacher that it couldn't have been personal.  I'm not so sure.  The teacher made a point to tell me that I'm the only one who complained about the due date change.

 

I'm definitely not emailing the teacher on this one.  It's clear to me that he's passive aggressive and has no issue with bullying children.  Even if it was innocent, my daughter feels like he bullied her.  Dh is ready to speak with the principal on Monday.  My mom thinks I should request a teacher change.  A friend of mine who's child had this teacher last year says this is typical of him and is wondering why I haven't yet sent an email requesting a conference with the principal.  I have requested educational testing for dd so the principal will have to speak with me within the next two weeks.  I feel like I should wait until I speak with him about the testing to see if any further issues arise.  I really don't want to be seen as a problematic parent.  I've never addressed the principal about any issue regarding dd.  

 

What I really want to do is say nothing and wait until a need to email the teacher arises and somehow work XXXX into my message.  Then the teacher would know that I know without me having to say anything.

 

Of pure curiosity, are you familiar with this word?

[KathyJo]

I would be a problem parent. I would throw a hissy fit in the middle of the principal's office, and my first sentence would start with, "How dare he?" And I would request a new teacher, too.

 

He did a wrong thing, then he made it worse by his passive aggressive attack through the children. What a louse. 

 

ETA: Nope, never heard that word. 

[bolt.]

Not familiar with the word.

 

Probably wasn't a "one kid" issue, but something he feels about many children, who planned to do a weekend project instead of getting ahead during the week. He probably likes the word, and thinks about it many times a year, whenever things like this come up -- that 4th graders prefer to do homework on weekends, or that they do tend to procrastinate.

 

Maybe he thinks he is drawing their attention to an area of their character that could use improvement.

 

But, actually, he is being a bully. He doesn't like the kids he teaches. They are too immature to be up to his standards, and each year he gets a new crop. It must be frustrating to him -- and yes, it's passive aggressive. (Which is really confusing and upsetting to kids who are just barely old enough to catch it and find it both threatening and baffling -- and all the more threatening because it is so baffling.)

 

All of that is an overall unhealthy attitude towards his students and his job -- but I don't think he's out to humiliate your daughter in particular.

 

I don't know what I'd do about it, really. It's a tough call -- how not to make it worse, since there is so little chance of it getting better; and how to get through a year of this sort of thing, or maybe to try and get out of his class. Tough call.

[unsinkable]

You might not be the only mom who complained. So it might be directed at a few kids...

[planner]

 

But, actually, he is being a bully. He doesn't like the kids he teaches. They are too immature to be up to his standards, and each year he gets a new crop. It must be frustrating to him -- and yes, it's passive aggressive. (Which is really confusing and upsetting to kids who are just barely old enough to catch it and find it both threatening and baffling -- and all the more threatening because it is so baffling.)

 

 

I think you are on to something.  He used to teach junior high.  I think he still thinks he does.

[planner]

You might not be the only mom who complained. So it might be directed at a few kids...

He told me I was the only one who complained.

[Little Nyssa]

I had not heard of that word.  It really does not sound like a nice word, but I'll take your word for it that it has a real definition!

 

I would not make a fuss about the one word.  DD was not procrastinating, she was budgeting time, so I would not see that it applied to her.  And if there were others who also complained, it's not like she was singled out.

 

I didn't read your thread about the changing due date, but since he accommodated your DD, I would say you won that one.

 

I would not make a fuss about the vocabulary word.  But I would watch how things go in the next couple of weeks.  Since you'll be seeing the principal anyway, you have that time all set in case there are more things to report.  

 

Choose your battles.  You've already shown the teacher that you will speak up for her, and he has shown that he will accommodate you, so I would wait unless/until you have bigger fish to fry.  :)

[Jean in Newcastle]

How committed are you to this school?  How you handle this will depend a lot on how you answer that one sentence.  Realizing that you are asking this on a homeschool board, many of us would make this a "line in the sand" situation - not the word-of-the-day itself, but the passive aggressive bullying and lack of professionalism in his teaching.  If my child was there, I would definitely talk to the principal and ask for a teacher change while I was there.  

[unsinkable]

He told me I was the only one who complained.

Oh, rats!

 

Either way he is an unnecessary feminine hygiene product that rhymes with swoosh.

[KathyJo]

How committed are you to this school?  How you handle this will depend a lot on how you answer that one sentence.  Realizing that you are asking this on a homeschool board, many of us would make this a "line in the sand" situation - not the word-of-the-day itself, but the passive aggressive bullying and lack of professionalism in his teaching.  If my child was there, I would definitely talk to the principal and ask for a teacher change while I was there.  

 

:seeya: Oh, I'm so guilty here. If only they knew, even the most anti-homeschooling of the local teachers would probably be happy that my kids are homeschooled since it means that they don't have to deal with me.

[planner]

How committed are you to this school?  How you handle this will depend a lot on how you answer that one sentence.  Realizing that you are asking this on a homeschool board, many of us would make this a "line in the sand" situation - not the word-of-the-day itself, but the passive aggressive bullying and lack of professionalism in his teaching.  If my child was there, I would definitely talk to the principal and ask for a teacher change while I was there.  

Unfortunately, more committed than I want to be.  It really is an excellent school.  I haven't had a single issue until this teacher.  

 

Bringing her home isn't really an option because ds requires all my attention during the day.  He will not do his schoolwork unless I am sitting over him.  I can't provide dd the education that her school is providing her.  She wants to stay with her friends and since it's a charter with a long waiting list, pulling her for this year only isn't an option.

[kitten18]

He told me I was the only one who complained.

Just because he said that, it doesn't make it true. ;)

 

 

I would definitely have my hackles up but I agree with Jean.

[Wheres Toto]

He told me I was the only one who complained.

 

Given what you wrote here and in the other thread, I wouldn't necessarily believe him.  He may just be trying to justify what he did by saying no one else had a problem with it, even though they really did.  In other words, making it seem like you are the problem instead of him.

 

FWIW, my oldest always went to B&M school.  She had good teachers and not so good teachers.  I would request a different teacher given this guys behavior.

[kitten18]

If you read the changing due date thread, you know my 4th grade dd's teacher moved up a due date on an assignment from Monday to Friday.  He made the change on Thursday.  Dd was unhappy because she hadn't started the assignment as she planned to do it over the weekend.  I emailed the teacher to let him know that dd had budgeted her time and it was unfair to change the due date.  He responded that he had changed the date because he wanted to grade the papers over the weekend.  He did make an allowance for dd to turn in the paper on Monday, but she had already completed the assignment.

 

And this, he has some nerve to insinuate that they were procrastinating when he changed the due date because he decided he "wanted" to grade the papers over the weekend.  I guess he should have had a better plan for next week. :glare:

[KathyJo]

Yeah sometimes when people ask me why I homeschool I tell them there would be a Wanted poster with my picture on it down at the school.

 

Ha! Or a "Not Wanted" poster, complete with a sign on the door that says, "Go home, Kathy Jo. The principal took out a restraining order."

[zoobie]

I think you are on to something. He used to teach junior high. I think he still thinks he does.

Or he thinks he's still in junior high.

 

The word choice was passive aggressive and unkind. Saving a project to do over a weekend instead of during the week is not procrastination, and I highly doubt your DD is the only child who hadn't started! I hope he grades the project fairly.

[Annie G]

I'm betting the word wasn't aimed just at your daughter- your dd said other students were arguing the due date with him. It was probably directed at all of them, and it was uncalled for. 

The fact that he used to be a junior high teacher might not be a trivial component to his behavior.  What caused him to no longer be teaching junior high- his decision or the school's?  When I was in junior high I had a teacher who had just been 'demoted' to the junior high. He was NOT happy to be at the junior high and he took it out on us- his attitude was awful and he expected us to be able to do the same work he'd taught to 10th graders.   It was a long year... I'm 52 and still vividly recall much of the crap he pulled on us...that crummy teacher really stuck with me. 

[planner]

And this, he has some nerve to insinuate that they were procrastinating when he changed the due date because he decided he "wanted" to grade the papers over the weekend.  I guess he should have had a better plan for next week. :glare:

Personally, I can't wait to see next week's plan.  I'm hoping it says due Friday.  Even if it says Monday, she'll have it done for Friday because this is too much drama for my liking.

[planner]

What caused him to no longer be teaching junior high- his decision or the school's?  

I don't really know but he came to our school the first year it was open.  I imagine it was a step up the career ladder from the parochial school he taught at previously.

[Harriet Vane]

While his behavior certainly seems both passive aggressive and rude, I don't see how you can build this into a convincing case for the principal. It will be easy for the teacher to paint you as emotional. With just this incident, I have a hard time seeing how any administrator is going to receive this as compelling enough to switch classes, especially since you "won" the battle and got the extension for your dd. The administrator may see this as he-said-she-said. As such, I would advise letting it blow over. Choose your battles wisely, and bring out the big guns for behavior that is more clear-cut.

[nmoira]

I'd suggest "capricious" for word of the day. :)

[KathyJo]

I'd suggest "capricious" for word of the day. :)

 

I'd suggest... Oh, wait. What I was thinking is inappropriate for 4th graders.

[planner]

While his behavior certainly seems both passive aggressive and rude, I don't see how you can build this into a convincing case for the principal. It will be easy for the teacher to paint you as emotional. With just this incident, I have a hard time seeing how any administrator is going to receive this as compelling enough to switch classes, especially since you "won" the battle and got the extension for your dd. The administrator may see this as he-said-she-said. As such, I would advise letting it blow over. Choose your battles wisely, and bring out the big guns for behavior that is more clear-cut.

Can't say I fell like I won the battle when he extended the offer of accepting the assignment on Monday after 10AM on Friday.  It was too late at that point.

 

I'd suggest "capricious" for word of the day. :)

Great idea.  Arbitrary and capricious may be an even better choice and two words in one!

[Ali in OR]

I think I'd be working on developing a network with parents of your dd's classmates. Just be friendly, get to know them, chat when you drop off or pick up dd, have their phone numbers, etc. Then when something fishy happens you can clarify what other parents hear from their kids, what they think of capricious due dates, etc. There is strength in numbers. But otherwise I would do my best to get along with the teacher, make sure dd stays caught up, know what's going on in the class, etc. I would encourage dd to do her best and not take him too personally--some folks are quirky and she can learn how to succeed in spite of his behavior.

[NicAnn]

I'd send another email.

"I wanted to thank you for challenging DD! What a unique and rarely heard word you gave them! Even spellcheck doesn't recognize it." something to that effect....

 

Dude sounds like an ass. Sorry you guys deal with that!

[Mommy22alyns]

I don't think I'd believe him that you were the only one who complained.

[duckens]

Trying hard to not quote.

 

Daughter feels teacher may have chosen word because of her.  [i wonder if there was body language to make her feel this way.]

 

And the teacher has made it clear that you are the only one who complained (defending your daughter's procrastination)  *rolling eyes*

 

Because you were the only parent to complain, it is less likely that the teacher was directing this word towards the whole class.  According to him, your family is the only one that had issues with the assignment.

 

It is also possible that he has a list of words at the beginning of the year, and the word used has been recorded to be used on that day since the middle of summer.  It is possibly that this is an unfortunate coincidence.  I wouldn't die on this hill.

 

-------------------------------------------------

However:

 

Today is September 14th.  School has been in session for less than a month, and we're not off to a good start, are we?  It is possible that the vocabulary word is a harmless, but your daughter has a bad taste in her mouth over this teacher.  A LOT would have to change for her world to not be colored badly for the rest of the year.

 

If I was speaking to the principal, I would DEFINITELY be asking for a teacher change.  If this is ANY indication of how the school year is going to go, it is better to move her now rather than later.

 

Whether you choose to ask for a teacher change or not at this time, I would certainly be sharing with the principal:

 

1) The deadline change.

 

2) "My daughter feels --real or imagined -- that the word of the day was chosen because of her (and because of my complaints)."  

 

And just leave issue number 2 at that.  This sets a history in case more issues, big or small, arise in the coming months.

 

---------------------------------

I would also be sharing this with the principal because, irregardless of what happens with your daughter, the principal would want to know.

 

The principal has an opportunity to mentor this teacher to not blow his classroom currency (ability to lead kids and have them follow) in the first few weeks of school.

 

--------------------------------------------------

 

I would also start a Word file with dates and details for your own reference.  If this drags out to February, and another situation arises, Documentation is Your Friend.

 

I have used documentation when complaining of unfair treatment in the past so that I can express myself consistently and clearly (with the best word choice).  When telephoned, I have even paused to get my notes so I would not forget the most important points.

 

In one situation, I didn't get anyone fired, but I did bring the Feds in to investigate a local governmental office, and changed the policies of the office.  In another, I scared a department chair, embarrassed a college dean, and got the attention of a college vice president.  They never expected me to start reeling off dates and developments in order and with accuracy.

 

[DawnM]

When I worked as a counselor I got to see things from a more administrative perspective.   It was interesting to see the reputation different teachers had.  You knew who the ones were who causes issues.  The students would repeatedly say, "Mr. So and So is mean or doesn't like me or is unfair."   After 20 times of this, you got the idea that this particular teacher had problems.  The same was true for the positive.  Over and over again the same names would come up as being Johnny's favorite teacher.

 

That said, if this guy is like this, I am 100% sure it isn't just with you.  The principal may not relay this info when you call, but I am sure he will be rolling his eyes (not at you) and think, " Oh great, ANOTHER complaint against Mr. X!"   Believe me, you will NOT be the only one who has ever complained if he does this regularly.

 

The TRUTH is, he SHOULD have realized he wanted the weekend to grade it and planned accordingly in advance.  Pulling a fast one on a bunch of 4th graders and their families is HIS laziness.  And heck, have the kids turn it in Mon and grade it the FOLLOWING weekend.  What is the big deal?

 

Have you ever seen that sign that says, "Your lack of planning does not constitute an emergency on my part?"  Many of our admins and counselors had that on their walls.

 

Dawn

[planner]

When I worked as a counselor I got to see things from a more administrative perspective.   It was interesting to see the reputation different teachers had.  You knew who the ones were who causes issues.  The students would repeatedly say, "Mr. So and So is mean or doesn't like me or is unfair."   After 20 times of this, you got the idea that this particular teacher had problems.  The same was true for the positive.  Over and over again the same names would come up as being Johnny's favorite teacher.

 

That said, if this guy is like this, I am 100% sure it isn't just with you.  The principal may not relay this info when you call, but I am sure he will be rolling his eyes (not at you) and think, " Oh great, ANOTHER complaint against Mr. X!"   Believe me, you will NOT be the only one who has ever complained if he does this regularly.

 

The TRUTH is, he SHOULD have realized he wanted the weekend to grade it and planned accordingly in advance.  Pulling a fast one on a bunch of 4th graders and their families is HIS laziness.  And heck, have the kids turn it in Mon and grade it the FOLLOWING weekend.  What is the big deal?

 

Have you ever seen that sign that says, "Your lack of planning does not constitute an emergency on my part?"  Many of our admins and counselors had that on their walls.

 

Dawn

 

With your experience of working in a school, do you think it's worth saying something about or do you think I should just document and wait for the next incident?  Of course, I really hope there isn't a next incident.

[Kalmia]

In one of the movies about the crisis in the school system (can't remember which one, but one along the lines of Waiting for Superman), they mentioned the "Turkey Trot." That was when the school administrators shuffled the known "bad" teachers to different schools in the district each year to sort of spread out their influence and perhaps make them annoyed enough to leave (since many had tenure and couldn't be fired). Might your demoted former junior high teacher be a shuffled turkey?

[Jan in SC]

I would find someone who had his class last year. I wonder if he does this every year as a lesson about the dangers of procrastination. It seems too planned, especially with the vocabulary word.

[planner]

I would find someone who had his class last year. I wonder if he does this every year as a lesson about the dangers of procrastination. It seems too planned, especially with the vocabulary word.

Wow!  This makes me look at the situation in an entirely different way.  Now I really don't know what to think.

[AMJ]

In my experience the teacher and/or school won't always say if someone else has complained, too, and might actually say no one else did. Either way, take your concerns to the principal. Insist on being heard out, and insist on a change of teacher (if that's what you want).

 

Either way, don't let this go into limbo. If the principal says they will handle it insist on knowing how and when, and then follow up later to see what they did and when. Don't give them wiggle room to cop out.

 

Be the problem parent, if that's what it takes. This is your child's education. And start the conversation by asking the principal to define that vocabulary word -- he/she should, after all, know the stuff the teachers are teaching, right?

[AMJ]

In my experience the teacher and/or school won't always say if someone else has complained, too, and might actually say no one else did. Either way, take your concerns to the principal. Insist on being heard out, and insist on a change of teacher (if that's what you want).

 

Either way, don't let this go into limbo. If the principal says they will handle it insist on knowing how and when, and then follow up later to see what they did and when. Don't give them wiggle room to cop out.

 

Be the problem parent, if that's what it takes. This is your child's education. And start the conversation by asking the principal to define that vocabulary word -- he/she should, after all, know the stuff the teachers are teaching, right?

[Mary in VA]

How old is this teacher?  Is he single, or married with no kids?  If so, I would cut him more slack about the due date switch.  I think a lot of young teachers with no kids, particularly male ones, have no clue what is happening in families after the kids leave school.  They don't understand that kids have outside activities, sports, music lessons, and siblings with those that they have to go with. And then of course there are meals and family time, and family plans on the weekend. . . .  Now if he isn't young and clueless, then he is just being selfish-his time is more important than his students' and their families' time.  The vocabulary word comes across as subtle bullying, although again if he is young and a fairly new teacher he could think he is being "cute."  Something that would create unease in a middle schooler can really mess with the mind of a 4th grader.  It can destroy the respect a child has for their teacher.  Either way, I think it would be good to discuss this with the principal.  If the teacher is young I might take the tack that you just want to help the teacher become more understanding of the impact of his actions on the students and their families to make him a better teacher.  If he is an experienced, mature teacher I'd be more forceful in how I addressed it.  In that case, it does come across as bullying.

 

Mary

[planner]

How old is this teacher?  Is he single, or married with no kids?  If so, I would cut him more slack about the due date switch.  I think a lot of young teachers with no kids, particularly male ones, have no clue what is happening in families after the kids leave school.  They don't understand that kids have outside activities, sports, music lessons, and siblings with those that they have to go with. And then of course there are meals and family time, and family plans on the weekend. . . .  Now if he isn't young and clueless, then he is just being selfish-his time is more important than his students' and their families' time.  The vocabulary word comes across as subtle bullying, although again if he is young and a fairly new teacher he could think he is being "cute."  Something that would create unease in a middle schooler can really mess with the mind of a 4th grader.  It can destroy the respect a child has for their teacher.  Either way, I think it would be good to discuss this with the principal.  If the teacher is young I might take the tack that you just want to help the teacher become more understanding of the impact of his actions on the students and their families to make him a better teacher.  If he is an experienced, mature teacher I'd be more forceful in how I addressed it.  In that case, it does come across as bullying.

 

Mary

He's older than I am.  I'd guess middle forties.  He really should know better.  I do know what you mean though.  Ds had a second year teacher who thought she could tell me what to do with him at home.  That's when I started homeschooling him.

 

I'm feeling much calmer about the situation today.  I'll have to see how dd is when she gets home.  Hopefully, today will go well.

[TheReader]

no additional advice/comment, everything's been said that I would say, *but* I wanted to let you know that the original word is still in your last paragraph of your OP, and since you went back and edited out of the other places in your post, I thought you might want to remove it from the end as well. 

 

I'm glad to read you are feeling better about things today, though. 

[planner]

no additional advice/comment, everything's been said that I would say, *but* I wanted to let you know that the original word is still in your last paragraph of your OP, and since you went back and edited out of the other places in your post, I thought you might want to remove it from the end as well. 

 

I'm glad to read you are feeling better about things today, though. 

Thank you!  I edited it out.

[goldberry]

Ok....I have to know what the word was.  Somebody pm me please?

[Little Nyssa]

After thinking it over, I really don't think that the word is appropriate as a vocabulary word at all.. for 4th grade?  

It bothers me that it is a word hardly any adult knows, and also that it has a similarity to a very offensive word, particularly to women.  I bet in Jr high he got a laugh from certain of the students, and a double-take from the rest, and that he thought that was amusing.  Yuck.  

 

[Callie]

 and also that it has a similarity to a very offensive word, particularly to women.  I bet in Jr high he got a laugh from certain of the students, and a double-take from the rest, and that he thought that was amusing.  Yuck.  

This was my thought when I first read the thread several days ago.