Drinking while pregnant - can we have a discussion?

[aggieamy]

DH and I are trying to adopt and occasionally we have the opportunity to be shown to an expectant mother who has drank during her pregnancy. I've researched FAS and birth defects online but there is so much information and some of it is rather confusing. It would be so helpful to have a discussion here. Does anyone have experience with a child that was exposed to alchohol before they were born? Anyone have a child with FAS? What questions should I ask when these situations come up?

 

Thanks so much!

[Elinor Everywhere]

My son's mother drank regularly while she was pregnant. He has no facial symptoms of FAS. He does have mild Aspie tendencies and processing issues, but so do lots of kids from non-drinking mothers. I was worried about it when we adopted him, and I read a ton of books, websites, and blogs. I remember several mentioning that if the mother was young, chances are greater for better health of the child. My son's mother was 24, so perhaps that has something to do with it.

 

I'm sure you'll get help here - it can be a very stressful time.

[Impish]

Wolf, and all his known sibs, except the youngest, have FASD.

 

It's a huge, huge, HUGE spectrum.

[aggieamy]

Elinor - thank you for sharing your experience. It is so stressful to know what kind of decision to make. DH and I are self-employed so we don't have fantastic insurance and that's something we have to consider when agreeing to be considered for the different adoption scenarios. There was one situation where the baby was going to be 10 weeks early and we wouldn't have been able to afford the hospital stay.

 

It's also kind of exciting. I mean ... we could have a baby in the house soon! Eek!

[lavender's green]

There is a world of difference between a baby exposed to a small glass of wine with a big dinner once or twice a week a week (like I did), and a baby of an alcoholic or drug abuser. My son has always been a healthy weight, very bright (if I may say so), ahead of most milestones, very verbose, very happy, and has a normal and definitely non-FAS face.

 

Try to find out how much she's been drinking and when, then assume she's actually drinking a bit more than that, and go from there.

 

Good luck! What an exciting time!

[Parrothead]

A mother who drinks moderately is probably not doing harm. The mother who is an active alcoholic risks a baby with FAS.

 

So the question becomes how much did this particular mother drink? If the baby has FAS to what degree is the damage? Like with most things FAS, canbe very mild, or it can be profound.

[Ottakee]

our oldest has FAS. He is one of 6 sibs by mom.

Oldest---no effects

#2--graduated highscool but low average IQ and has trouble with common sense things

#3--does pretty good

#4 no effects

#5 (my ds) has a moderate mental impairment, mild CP, ADD but great social skills

#6--very minor affects

 

There can be huge differences based on when mom drank, how much she drank, how often she drank, etc. Some kids can have the physical features but not much of the brain damage where other kids don't have the "look" but really struggle.

 

Our son has great social skills, is a very good athlete and great with electronics but will never be on his own totally, can't manage money and at times, can't find the window or fridge in the house.

 

one main thing with FAS syndrome is to get those good healthy fats into the brain ASAP. With learning it tends to be teach, reteach, teach again, repeat again and again. It often takes a long time for things to stick and math seems to be harder than language.

[Elinor Everywhere]

There is a world of difference between a baby exposed to a small glass of wine with a big dinner once or twice a week a week (like I did), and a baby of an alcoholic or drug abuser. My son has always been a healthy weight, very bright (if I may say so), ahead of most milestones, very verbose, very happy, and has a normal and definitely non-FAS face.

 

Try to find out how much she's been drinking and when, then assume she's actually drinking a bit more than that, and go from there.

 

Good luck! What an exciting time!

 

 

Yes, this is what I did when I was pregnant with my dd. She sounds a lot like your son...she's very bright, very social, very passionate, very happy...perhaps that glass of wine per week relaxed us both. :D

[Murmer]

DS's birthmother told us she had 2 occasions in the 1st trimester in which she drank. DS has no negative effects. That said there are no guarantees in adoption....DD's birthmother was 100% clean, took care of herself and received full prenatal care...DD has delays while DS's birthmother did not get prenatal care, did have some substance abuse and did admit to alcohol and he is typically developing. Personally we prayed a lot about whether a situation was appropriate for us and once the decision was made we were all in. Consider the worst case scenario and determine if you could deal with it as you make the decision, IE if the child did have full FAS would your family be able to care for a child with those needs.

[NotSoObvious]

I agree with Murmer. Consider the worst case and decide if you can handle that. Also, I would consider FAS as one of many, many possibilities. Adoptions are filled with unknowns. I'm glad we said yes to a situation we might have said no to if given too much time to "research." ;) by all means, know your limitations, but also remember that there are always surprises.

My girls were not drug or alcohol exposed (yet we still have SN) but we've had lots of FAS kids in the schools I've taught in. Some have had serious behavioral problems, and others just seem like mild ADHD.

[Kaleidoscope]

It has a lot to do with when the alcohol was consumed. It also has to do with the genetic make-up of the child. Just like not all adults become alcoholics not all babies will develop FAS. But there is no safe magic number of drinks that a mother can have. I have 3 children with FAS and fostered several more who had FAS.

[BigMamaBird]

There is a world of difference between a baby exposed to a small glass of wine with a big dinner once or twice a week a week (like I did), and a baby of an alcoholic or drug abuser. My son has always been a healthy weight, very bright (if I may say so), ahead of most milestones, very verbose, very happy, and has a normal and definitely non-FAS face.

 

Try to find out how much she's been drinking and when, then assume she's actually drinking a bit more than that, and go from there.

 

Good luck! What an exciting time!

 

:iagree:

My OB told me he'd rather see me drinking a glass of wine than a glass of Diet Coke. Scared me off the pop while pregnant.

[aggieamy]

Thank you for all the personal experiences and sharing your wisdom. If anyone would like to pray that the aggieamy family gets a call to the hospital this week that would be fantastic also. We aren't the only family interested in this baby but maybe they'll like us best.

[clarkacademy]

My mother drank like a fish with me. I really don't wanna hear about how bad that is back then it really was not. That being said, I have no issues at all. I was always in advanced classes and there are no facial things either. That being said, I have worked with FAS kids and one who stole my heart. His mother had a glass of wine. A GLASS of wine before she found out she was pregant. She was never a drinker and had went to her husbands family New Years party and had her first glass of wine at 23.

 

Her boy had major issues including facial deformities. You never know who or how it will affect anyone.

[Kaleidoscope]

My mother drank like a fish with me. I really don't wanna hear about how bad that is back then it really was not. That being said, I have no issues at all. I was always in advanced classes and there are no facial things either. That being said, I have worked with FAS kids and one who stole my heart. His mother had a glass of wine. A GLASS of wine before she found out she was pregant. She was never a drinker and had went to her husbands family New Years party and had her first glass of wine at 23.

 

Her boy had major issues including facial deformities. You never know who or how it will affect anyone.

 

 

That's what is so frustrating about FAS.

 

We actually had twins as our first foster placement. One ended up with an FAS dx and the other did not. How crazy is that? You can never know how alcohol will effect a person.

 

My son has FAS and is working 2 years ahead of grade level in pretty much every subject. He has all the physical traits and very few neurological ones. He had neurological issues at a younger age but seems to have overcome them. One of my dd's with FAS throws tantrums that last several hours at a time and is about 5 years behind academically. The spectrum for how affected a child will be is just huge.

[jujsky]

DH and I are trying to adopt and occasionally we have the opportunity to be shown to an expectant mother who has drank during her pregnancy. I've researched FAS and birth defects online but there is so much information and some of it is rather confusing. It would be so helpful to have a discussion here. Does anyone have experience with a child that was exposed to alchohol before they were born? Anyone have a child with FAS? What questions should I ask when these situations come up?

 

Thanks so much!

 

 

It can be assumed that DS's birth mother drank while she was pregnant because it's VERY common in Russia. He started showing pronounced sensory issues when he was about 2. His neurologist at the time said that he didn't have significant facial features of a child with FAS/D, but she felt based on his overall issues and some of his measurements, that he did have it. He went through therapy which helped quite a bit, but we always had difficulty with his impulsiveness and attention span. He also continued to have sensory issues and some mild learning disabilities.

 

Last year, when he was 8, I couldn't take the behaviors anymore and we moved towards obtaining a more formal diagnosis. We brought him to our school district to conduct some educational testing (they were all incredibly nice and supportive) and they found a significantly large discrepancy between his verbal IQ and his other IQ score (can't remember what it's called). It wasn't a diagnosis, but explained why he's an excellent reader, but so poor in math. We took him to Children's Hospital in Boston to have a neuropsych screening/testing. They concluded that he has ADHD (combination type), developmental coordination disorder, and the least helpful diagnosis ever -- learning disability not otherwise specified (really points us in the right direction getting help for our kid). They could not confirm FAS/D without proof that the mother drank during pregnancy. They said they couldn't find any physical abnormalities that would indicate FAS/D.

 

I won't lie to you -- he has not been an easy kid and has brought me to tears more times than I can count. I wouldn't trade him though. He's funny, sweet, and smart (even though math will probably never be his thing -- it's not mine either so I can't judge). After trying everything else, we did consent to putting him on a trial run of medication to control his ADHD this summer. It has made all the difference in the world for him. All of his good attributes shine through, and most of his difficult attributes are stifled. He says he can think now because before all the thoughts were jumbled up in his head.

 

Some drinking in pregnancy probably won't cause FAS/D. Extreme drinking in pregnancy could. FAS/D kids have a very difficult time connecting consequences and actions/ cause & effect. They are difficult and sometimes have trouble bonding. I guess I would do what I could to find out how much the birthmother drank during pregnancy. Personally, if I knew for sure the birthmother was a heavy drinker, I wouldn't take the risk, but you have to do what your heart tells you. FAS/D has a broad spectrum and can manifest in many ways. DS's issues, if they are in fact related to maternal alcohol consumption, are all things we can deal with. I don't know that I could handle a child with more extreme disabilities. Some people can, and do it almost like that's what they were born to do. It's important to figure out your limits. FAS/D doesn't HAVE to be insurmountable, but sometimes it is. You never know how a child will be affected.

[caroljenn]

I have a friend who adopted her now 8 year old son from a teenage mother, who has admitted to "partying" before she knew she was pregnant. The boy has sensory issues and learning disabilities as well. He looks fine on the outside, but he has problems with auditory learning and hearing in general. When he was a toddler, they knew something was wrong because he would start screaming and cover his ears when the vacuum was on. They took him to the doc and apparently this child hears sounds much more loudly than a regular person would, almost like an autistic person would, except that he is not autistic. He is also kind of clumsy and they have him practicing to walk in a straight line with a piece of tape stretched down the hallway. He now goes to a (very expensive) learning center that helps him with his auditory learning issues.

 

Not counting mothers who drink way too much the entire pregnancy, I have read that if you drink or do drugs during one crucial development, it will be that one that's affected. Obviously this mostly applies to the first trimester, but I think if the child is unlucky enough for you to drink on the day that XYZ is developing, it will be that XYZ that is affected.

[Kaleidoscope]

Just wanted to come back and add as hard as the FAS effects can be to deal with it's not the hardest issue we've faced with our children. The attachment issues have been much harder on a day to day basis.

[Anne in CA]

My step dd's mother drank A LOT before the birth of her third child, and he was born early and small, but his intelligence for school work type of things was not damaged. I know for a fact she drank at least a six pack of beer a day because I saw her all the time when dd would go visit her. He learned Japanese and French in addition to carrying a full course load in high school. He does not have a job at the age of 20 because he has so many tattoos and piercings that no one would ever hire him, so maybe his common sense was damaged, but that could have just been growing up with a very irresponsible mother too.

[DyslexicParent]

Despite doing all our due diligence including asking a doctor specializing in adoptions to first check for FASD, 11 years later, our child from a Russian orphanage has just received the devastating diagnosis of full-blown FAS! :cursing: We are still in the mourning/numb stage so we don't know what to do next. If I have the luxury of being able to meet the mother and finding out that she has been doing something that is harmful to the baby such as drinking, I would probably wait for another adoption.

 

Since there is no known safe amount of alcohol or safe time to drink alcohol during pregnancy, the recommendation of the health agencies of the US, Canada, Australia, England, etc. is to drink no alcohol at all if one is pregnant or planning to become pregnant. I'm surprised that many women are willing to play Russian Roulette that their drinking may or may not harm their child FOR LIFE.

Does anyone have experience with a child that was exposed to alchohol before they were born? Anyone have a child with FAS? What questions should I ask when these situations come up?

[Susan in TN]

No personal experience because I don't drink, but my OB always told me he was fine with a glass of wine or similar per day, "just don't overdo it". I suppose it may be difficult to know if the birth mother has overdone it or not?

[LibraryLover]

One of my bio kids screamed (when an infant) each and every time the vac was turned on. Totally freaked out. The dc also hated buttons, whatcanIsay?

Still does, but will wear a t underneath. DC is highly sociable, and without 'issues', unless you count dc is at the age where the young know everything.

I ate a veg heavy, healthy & organic diet, and no alcohol while pregnant, nor weeks before we started 'trying'. Child was 100% bf for 7 mos, and then only fed organic veggies and proteins.

You get who you get.

Although, I know I could not manage, at this point in time, a full -blown FAS sweetie. Although who knows how I would feel about it if I was 25.

Best wishes to your family, and your potential new baby. That is very exciting. :)

[Lisa in Jax]

We brought him to our school district to conduct some educational testing (they were all incredibly nice and supportive) and they found a significantly large discrepancy between his verbal IQ and his other IQ score (can't remember what it's called). It wasn't a diagnosis, but explained why he's an excellent reader, but so poor in math.

 

 

The "other" IQ score is called the Performance IQ, but it might as well be called "Nonverbal" IQ, b/c that's what the two parts of the test measure: "Verbal" skills/abilities and "Nonverbal" skills/abilities.

 

If your son's Verbal IQ is 10-15 points (or more) higher than his Performance/Nonverbal IQ, the diagnosis is "Nonverbal Learning Disability" - NVLD. It's sometimes called "Nonverbal Learning Disorder," as well. It's not common, so there's not a ton of stuff out there about it, but there are some really good books, written mostly by parents, about how NVLD looks, and how to help a child with NLVD.

 

DS (also adopted, but with no known FAS/FASD issues) has a 35 point discrepancy between his Verbal IQ and Performance/Nonverbal IQ. (His Verbal IQ is much higher than his Nonverbal IQ.) Math and abstract learning are much harder for him than reading/phonetics.

 

His rote memory is very good; his ability to "see the forest for the trees" is poor. Because of this, we find that he can "know" a rule or concept, but can't always apply it or generalize it. So, he knows not to put paper plates in the oven, for example, but it never occurred to him that he shouldn't put the (paper) cardboard pizza box in the oven, b/c to him, "paper" and "cardboard" are totally different things.

 

I'm gray for a reason. ;)

[Laura Corin]

The "other" IQ score is called the Performance IQ, but it might as well be called "Nonverbal" IQ, b/c that's what the two parts of the test measure: "Verbal" skills/abilities and "Nonverbal" skills/abilities.

 

If your son's Verbal IQ is 10-15 points (or more) higher than his Performance/Nonverbal IQ, the diagnosis is "Nonverbal Learning Disability" - NVLD. It's sometimes called "Nonverbal Learning Disorder," as well. It's not common, so there's not a ton of stuff out there about it, but there are some really good books, written mostly by parents, about how NVLD looks, and how to help a child with NLVD.

 

 

 

That's very interesting - Calvin meets that diagnostic threshold. Both of the scores were above average, however, so I just worked at different paces when teaching different aspects.

 

I probably had some drinks before I knew I was pregnant with him - he was a complete surprise to this 'infertile' couple - but I don't think his difficulties are very far from my own strengths and weaknesses, so I'm not convinced that they are symptoms of damage.

 

L

[SKL]

The only one I know about for sure is slow to learn and is immature for her age. She (a teen) can read some and is laboriously learning basic life skills such as those needed to transact at a store, but she will probably never be able to drive or navigate really difficult challenges on her own. In short, she will never be a truly independent adult. Of course not all kids with FAS are in this situation, but consider the possibility that this may be more than an 18-year commitment.

[ktgrok]

Drank how much? Recent studies show that 1 drink per day, 2 days per week, is safe. So some alcohol wouldn't worry me. Drunk would worry me. (and yes, I know the quote you hear is "no amount of alcohol is proven safe" but the truth is there are new studies, and that level IS proven safe.)

[mumto2]

I think it all depends upon the timing of the drinking. I was told by my specialist that he felt he could always trace the damage back to before most women know they are pregnant. I think he said afer 6 weeks gestation it was pretty hard to do much damage in his opinion.

 

A good friend spent roughly 3 months receiving IV's of hard alcohol to prevent contractions. She was literally passed out in a stuper for that time. He was born around 34 weeks and just graduated college with honors. He does have a small build but since his Uncle is 5'5" probably genetic. He is not dramatically different then her three other children who were born without this treatment so our (yep, he was her doc too!) Specialist probably had a point. By the time ds came along the treatment had changed but I still had many medications I would have preferred to skip because I was so afraid of damaging him.

 

I'll be praying!

[unsinkable]

 

 

The "other" IQ score is called the Performance IQ, but it might as well be called "Nonverbal" IQ, b/c that's what the two parts of the test measure: "Verbal" skills/abilities and "Nonverbal" skills/abilities.

 

If your son's Verbal IQ is 10-15 points (or more) higher than his Performance/Nonverbal IQ, the diagnosis is "Nonverbal Learning Disability" - NVLD. It's sometimes called "Nonverbal Learning Disorder," as well. It's not common, so there's not a ton of stuff out there about it, but there are some really good books, written mostly by parents, about how NVLD looks, and how to help a child with NLVD.

 

DS (also adopted, but with no known FAS/FASD issues) has a 35 point discrepancy between his Verbal IQ and Performance/Nonverbal IQ. (His Verbal IQ is much higher than his Nonverbal IQ.) Math and abstract learning are much harder for him than reading/phonetics.

 

His rote memory is very good; his ability to "see the forest for the trees" is poor. Because of this, we find that he can "know" a rule or concept, but can't always apply it or generalize it. So, he knows not to put paper plates in the oven, for example, but it never occurred to him that he shouldn't put the (paper) cardboard pizza box in the oven, b/c to him, "paper" and "cardboard" are totally different things.

 

I'm gray for a reason. ;)

 

 

I'm pretty sure the other test can be called "perceptual reasoning." Someone correct me if I am wrong.

 

There are a few threads about NLD/NVLD on the board lately.

 

(I just feel the need to add I did not drink at all while pregnant.)

[SpecialClassical]

First, OP please read the end of my post! For anyone who reads this please read it with an understanding that it is not a response to any one poster, but to ideas that are prevalent about FAS. I don't want to come off as a know it all or rude, but it is very hard for me to read some of these posts. Yes, everyone's experience is different and I am happy for those who drank a little and their kids are fine. I truly am. Especially since their doctors told them it was okay or they didn't know they were pregnant.

 

Very few doctors know about the true causes and effects of FASD. The research is ongoing. Knowledge and treatment are in the beginning stages. An OB is not likely to be studying all the latest research; that isn't possible for one doc to do for all the different problems a baby could have. And it isn't his/her field of specialty.

 

But please, please don't spread the message that drinking during pregnancy is okay. Yes, doctors say a little bit is no big deal. But as some up thread said, drinking at the wrong time during pregnancy or with the "wrong" genetic makeup or, as I've read, a lack of folic acid can lead to FAS effects. It is a gamble for anyone.

 

There was an article out this year trumpeting the idea that, hey, new research shows alcohol consumption does not affect IQ! But it was a terrible piece of journalism that could cause many children to suffer. Children with FASD do not necessarily have a lower IQ, but they have physical problems, sensory issues, learning disabilities, mood disorders and more.

 

Our birth mom reported no drinking. Our neuropsychologist said that she probably stopped drinking when she realized she was pregnant. Or it could have been around 4 months along when the birth mom was placed in care. Our daughter was affected and we have no idea when or how much alcohol was consumed. What I do know is that I have a firmly attached and loved child who suffers from learning disabilities and a mood disorder. As Ottakee said, she learns and re-learns an re-learns the same information. She has had years of rages that have brought me to tears and despair for her future. She has physically assaulted those she loves. Before she was placed on her current medicine the poor child was in a state of almost constant agitation( think PMS and worse). Can you imagine how hard it was for a little person to try to control herself felling like that? This medicine has turned our lives around and revealed her true sassy,hilarious personality.

 

I am sharing our story to emphasize that it does matter and that the act of refraining from alcohol is the only way to guarantee no effects from alcohol. Could our children still have problems? Absolutely. But if it is under our control to prevent possible problems, that is what we should do.

 

To the OP- We specifically marked on our disability worksheet that we could handle almost any disability but FAS. I am so glad our daughter was given to us anyway! She is a sweet, nurturing, funny 9 year old. She has been through more in her short life than most children, but she is loved and adored by her family and friends and she knows it. We have grown in ways we would not have chosen and endured some very dark days, but through the hardest times we knew that she was placed in our family not only by her birth mom, but God himself. The birth mom was praying and we were praying about the match. The birth mom refused all family profiles given to her because none seemed right to her. Our profile was given only because a call went out from our former social worker that a family was needed. We had no home study, little money, and other obstacles. We watched in amazement as every wall between us and our child were broken down! We are not some special, especially patient couple so it isn't like it was logical for us to be chosen.

 

She is a joy and we do not know what the future holds, but we will be right there with her on the journey because she is our girl.

 

As far as questions to ask, I don't know what to tell you. Many moms will not self-report drinking because they feel shame or they know it will limit their pool of families. There are ways to ask in order to get an idea, but professionals are usually better at discerning that. Also, I want to note that I am not angry with our birth mom for drinking or saying she didn't. She was from a difficult situation doing the best she could to handle life.

 

May God bless you in your journey.

 

 

ETA: We now have evidence of a drinking problem, so that confirmed our Dr.'s assessment.