Quiver0f10 Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 (edited) Thank you everyone for discussing this and for the prayers. They mean the world to me! Edited August 26, 2012 by Quiver0f10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mommaduck Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 How about a third option. Salvation isn't something that is done and done or done, then undone, then redone. Instead, it's an entire journey that doesn't end until after this life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DianeW88 Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 How about a third option. Salvation isn't something that is done and done or done, then undone, then redone. Instead, it's an entire journey that doesn't end until after this life. :iagree:And the Atonement allows for repentance. Nobody lives a perfect life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avila Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 At any given time, we can choose to come closer to God or choose to walk away from him. He stands still. But all of the choices we make either bring us closer to him or further from him. I don't see salvation as a object, like a ball. I have the ball! :). I dropped the ball. :(. It is a process, according to my beliefs. And I believe that he who endures to the end will be saved, so until I have endured to the end, I don't 100% know what I will do between now and then. So I trust God, but not myself. God is merciful and just, and I try to walk with him daily and that is plenty for me to handle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crimson Wife Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 God is loving and merciful, and I have faith that He will not condemn someone for going through a period of doubt. We are all sinners and from time to time we will stumble. God helps us get back on our feet and forgives us "seventy times seven" as in Matthew 18:22 :001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris in VA Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 I don't think you can lose it, but I wonder if you can reject it. Esp for those of us who baptise infants--I'm hoping you can't become "unsaved," but I do believe God allows us to choose, and I don't think you can "do it for someone" by baptising them without their consent (as in infancy, for example). I believe, however, that baptism of infants is a lovely picture of us not earning our salvation, and that it is efficacious in the life of a believer. But honestly, I'm in a place in my walk with Jesus and His Body that makes me just have to be ok with "I don't know if one can lose salvation, but I hope not." I do think, at the Very End, we will not see God and find him lacking in either justice or mercy. I have to rest in that, right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dobela Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 If you walk away, and chose to stay away, I believe you lose your salvation. But if you repent and return to God, you have lost nothing. We all sin every day, and sin is what separates us from God. It is his grace while we actively seek him that saves us ultimately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dory Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 I hope not or else I'm hooped. I do agree that it is a journey and a process. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katy Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 If one was saved and then had doubts about God and whether he was real, sin, hell etc, but later repented for this unbelief, would they still be saved? I am thinking specifically in light of these verses: 2 Peter 2:20-22 Hebrews 6:4-6 Isaiah 53:6 Heb 10:29 Thoughts? First, it is not a sin to be tempted. Jesus was tempted. It sounds like this person was tempted to have unbelief, explored why, and chose God. There is no reason a temptation has to last for only a fleeting thought. It could last for decades. They chose right. Even if they spent a great deal of time away from God, the story of the prodigal son (amongst many others) suggests it doesn't matter. What matters is restoring the relationship with God. Are you certain that the person in question really knew and loved God to start with? Could it be that they got "saved" not because they had a heart of love and repentance but that they were doing what was considered the thing to do amongst the people in their life at that time? Your reference to 2 Peter 2 makes me wonder if the person you are speaking of decided (s)he was an atheist for a long time, and tried to convince Christians to walk away from their faith too? Hebrews 6 suggests to me that though that person may repent, it is impossible for us to induce him to do so. Isaiah 53:6 speaks of universal sin, not of individual sin. Heb 10:29 speaks of judgment; however in the context it does not seem to be warning of definite judgment as much as warning NOT to walk away because if you do and flaunt it you risk offending the Holy Spirit. The idea that having a salvation experience permanently binds you to a faith that you must take purely on faith (not reason) seems the antithesis of the context of most stories in the Bible to me - Adam and Eve knew God personally and still rebelled, many stories in the Bible are about rebellion and reconciliation to God. Finally, Jesus didn't get angry at repentant sinners. He got angry at religious leaders (who he had studied under) who were judgmental hypocrites. The reality is, we see through a glass darkly and we can't know the judgment of God. We can't see into someone's heart. No one knows if salvation is a once and forever thing or if it's a you have the freedom to come closer to God or stray from him thing because there are many verses to support both theologies. My theory on the confusion surrounding this is that it is a mystery because it doesn't matter. The Lord judges on the heart, and that is something we cannot see. What we can know is if we personally are repentant for our (daily) sins and if we personally are doing our best to know and love and serve God. We best know and serve God by first renewing our minds with the word, and then by loving and serving others. Especially others who do not know the truth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forget-Me-Not Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 How about a third option. Salvation isn't something that is done and done or done, then undone, then redone. Instead, it's an entire journey that doesn't end until after this life. :iagree: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paintedlady Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 I think that God chooses us, and if He has chosen us, we can't lose our salvation. I think it's normal to doubt and question your beliefs at some point in time. In fact I think it's healthy to seriously examine your faith so you know what you believe and why. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heather in Neverland Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 I think that God chooses us, and if He has chosen us, we can't lose our salvation. I think it's normal to doubt and question your beliefs at some point in time. In fact I think it's healthy to seriously examine your faith so you know what you believe and why. :iagree: ...it depends not on human will or exertion, but on God, who has mercy... Romans 9:16 I am saved. I am being saved. I will be saved. All are true and all of it depends on the will of God and the finished work of Christ and not on my paltry efforts. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DawnM Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 This is a question even the theologians still debate! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milovany Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 (edited) Salvation is not a one-time event, it's growing into communion with Christ. We walk toward Him. We mess up. We repent. He's merciful. We keep walking. Keep going. I was saved. I am being saved. I will be saved. "He who endures to the end will be saved." Edited August 25, 2012 by milovaný I got up at 4:30 this morning and was too tired to quote correctly. :-P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JenniferB Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 :iagree: He who endures to the end will be saved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justamouse Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 How about a third option. Salvation isn't something that is done and done or done, then undone, then redone. Instead, it's an entire journey that doesn't end until after this life. :iagree: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dory Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 Salvation is not a one-time event, it's growing into communion with Christ. We walk toward Him. We mess up. We repent. He's merciful. We keep walking. Keep going. I was saved. I am saved. I'm being saved. "He who endures to the end will be saved." What does it mean to endure to the end? I never understood that. What is the end, and how would it look to endure to it? If I follow God's word and yet hate Him, is that still enduring? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justamouse Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 What does it mean to endure to the end? I never understood that. What is the end, and how would it look to endure to it? If I follow God's word and yet hate Him, is that still enduring? Why would you follow His word and hate him? Why not just ignore it all? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DawnM Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 How could you follow His word and hate Him? His word says to love Him and follow Him, you can't do that if you hate Him. Dawn What does it mean to endure to the end? I never understood that. What is the end, and how would it look to endure to it? If I follow God's word and yet hate Him, is that still enduring? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dory Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 Why would you follow His word and hate him? Why not just ignore it all? Because while I know that it is true, I struggle with reality of where I've been in life. My life leaves me feeling abandoned by Him, or worse that he isn't who he says he is, and yet everything I read rings true to me. I keep going, because I know I need to. I still spend a lot of time screaming at Him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elfgivas Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 :grouphug: if one embraces God as the good parent.... children do say they hate their parents. they rebel against our guidance and rules. we still love them and feed them and care for them and tuck them in at night. where we are is their home. how much more so than for God our Father? :grouphug: ann Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avila Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 Because while I know that it is true, I struggle with reality of where I've been in life. My life leaves me feeling abandoned by Him, or worse that he isn't who he says he is, and yet everything I read rings true to me. I keep going, because I know I need to. I still spend a lot of time screaming at Him. But you keep going. That is enduring. The end is the end, when Jesus comes back and life here is over. As long as we have life, we suffer. And question and doubt. But it is not about how we feel at any given moment -- do I feel saved? It is about picking up our cross and following anyway. So scream all you like, but keep going. God is big enough to take it. JMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dangermom Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 Well, I think you can be angry at God. He can take it. That seems to me to be better than trying to ignore what you know to be true. Truth is true whether we like it or not. :001_smile: And I hope that things will get better for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CheerioKid Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 (edited) Because while I know that it is true, I struggle with reality of where I've been in life. My life leaves me feeling abandoned by Him, or worse that he isn't who he says he is, and yet everything I read rings true to me. I keep going, because I know I need to. I still spend a lot of time screaming at Him. I think "the end" is simply our own death or the return of Christ...whichever comes first. Job endured so many things, yet in "the end", God was glorified (and Job was rewarded), and that was the purpose of Job's relationship with God, as it is for all of us. Our reason for having been created was to glorify God. We know that He will take care of us, no matter what happens. Nothing can separate us from His love. Bad things happen, and not just to unbelievers. Sometimes life just isn't fair. Being a believer does not make us immune to tragedy, it means that we can cast all our cares on Him because He cares for us. He WILL carry us through, and we will be saved in the end if we trust Him, love Him, and obey His commands. Edited August 25, 2012 by CheerioKid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quiver0f10 Posted August 25, 2012 Author Share Posted August 25, 2012 (edited) First, it is not a sin to be tempted. Jesus was tempted. It sounds like this person was tempted to have unbelief, explored why, and chose God. There is no reason a temptation has to last for only a fleeting thought. It could last for decades. They chose right. Even if they spent a great deal of time away from God, the story of the prodigal son (amongst many others) suggests it doesn't matter. What matters is restoring the relationship with God. Are you certain that the person in question really knew and loved God to start with? Could it be that they got "saved" not because they had a heart of love and repentance but that they were doing what was considered the thing to do amongst the people in their life at that time? Your reference to 2 Peter 2 makes me wonder if the person you are speaking of decided (s)he was an atheist for a long time, and tried to convince Christians to walk away from their faith too? Hebrews 6 suggests to me that though that person may repent, it is impossible for us to induce him to do so. Isaiah 53:6 speaks of universal sin, not of individual sin. Heb 10:29 speaks of judgment; however in the context it does not seem to be warning of definite judgment as much as warning NOT to walk away because if you do and flaunt it you risk offending the Holy Spirit. The idea that having a salvation experience permanently binds you to a faith that you must take purely on faith (not reason) seems the antithesis of the context of most stories in the Bible to me - Adam and Eve knew God personally and still rebelled, many stories in the Bible are about rebellion and reconciliation to God. Finally, Jesus didn't get angry at repentant sinners. He got angry at religious leaders (who he had studied under) who were judgmental hypocrites. The reality is, we see through a glass darkly and we can't know the judgment of God. We can't see into someone's heart. No one knows if salvation is a once and forever thing or if it's a you have the freedom to come closer to God or stray from him thing because there are many verses to support both theologies. My theory on the confusion surrounding this is that it is a mystery because it doesn't matter. The Lord judges on the heart, and that is something we cannot see. What we can know is if we personally are repentant for our (daily) sins and if we personally are doing our best to know and love and serve God. We best know and serve God by first renewing our minds with the word, and then by loving and serving others. Especially others who do not know the truth. . Edited August 27, 2012 by Quiver0f10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crimson Wife Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 What does it mean to endure to the end? I never understood that. What is the end, and how would it look to endure to it? If I follow God's word and yet hate Him, is that still enduring? The opposite of love is not hate but indifference. Anger toward God is a common reaction to tragedy- the sufferer has difficulty understanding how God can be all-powerful but still allow bad things to happen. My heart goes out to those who feel anger and hatred toward God, and I pray that He will help them heal. And to those who hate Christianity for other reasons, I pray that God will help them see the error of their ways and change their hearts just like he changed Saul of Tarsus into St. Paul. :001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dory Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 The opposite of love is not hate but indifference. Anger toward God is a common reaction to tragedy- the sufferer has difficulty understanding how God can be all-powerful but still allow bad things to happen. My heart goes out to those who feel anger and hatred toward God, and I pray that He will help them heal. And to those who hate Christianity for other reasons, I pray that God will help them see the error of their ways and change their hearts just like he changed Saul of Tarsus into St. Paul. :001_smile: And that is probably one of the things that makes me keep trying. I still feel. As long as I feel I figure it's worth fighting for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juniper Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 What does it mean to endure to the end? I never understood that. What is the end, and how would it look to endure to it? If I follow God's word and yet hate Him, is that still enduring? Mind if I turn this question on its head? What does it mean to be saved "now?" Saved from what? Hell? Well, dosen't that come later? So, in essence I am not saved....yet. I will be saved.....later, I am being saved...sanctified, but when I endure to the end I will be saved. Right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dory Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 Mind if I turn this question on its head? What does it mean to be saved "now?" Saved from what? Hell? Well, dosen't that come later? So, in essence I am not saved....yet. I will be saved.....later, I am being saved...sanctified, but when I endure to the end I will be saved. Right? I'm confused. Are you meaning that one is not saved now? That the decisions made now simply mean we are saved at the end? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avila Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 And that is probably one of the things that makes me keep trying. I still feel. As long as I feel I figure it's worth fighting for. God loves you, and you are worth fighting for. Period. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I.Dup. Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 Mind if I turn this question on its head? What does it mean to be saved "now?" Saved from what? Hell? Well, dosen't that come later? So, in essence I am not saved....yet. I will be saved.....later, I am being saved...sanctified, but when I endure to the end I will be saved. Right? I like this! Honestly, the whole "got saved" thing bugs me. "1,000 people came to the front of the church at service last night and accepted Jesus Christ as their personal savior (whatever that means) and got saved! Let's hear a round of applause!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juniper Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 (edited) I'm confused. Are you meaning that one is not saved now? That the decisions made now simply mean we are saved at the end? I do not have salvation and sanctification separated out into two separate things. So, the answer is yes and no. ;) I believe it is as some describe, the gift exchange model. I give God myself and he gives me Himself. This process is lived out over a lifetime, and while I can be assured of God's love for me, know that I am in a relationship; I do not see "salvation" as a one time event. What I mean is that if salvation comes (from hell and an eternity of ****ation) it comes at the end. Does it not? If salvation means, healing of the wounded human soul and the ability to grow towards sanctification..then yes it starts now. It is both....and. Clear as mud? :D Edited August 25, 2012 by Juniper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milovany Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 Because while I know that it is true, I struggle with reality of where I've been in life. My life leaves me feeling abandoned by Him, or worse that he isn't who he says he is, and yet everything I read rings true to me. I keep going, because I know I need to. I still spend a lot of time screaming at Him. I'm sorry. :grouphug: I think enduring to the end is seeing ourselves really, knowing we need Him, knowing we need His church, holding on when it's hard, thanking Him when it's good, and purposing to keep on moving toward Him as we journey through life. The end is death (or the return of Christ). He who endures to the end will be saved. It's okay that you struggle. It's better than pretending everything is okay when it's really not. God is love, God is good. He's merciful -- He gives us what we need. :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TravelingChris Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 LIke some others here wrote, I think God chooses us, not that we choose God. So I don't think you lose salvation. HOwever, I guess I am different from some since I think GOd chooses many, even some who are confused and doubting maybe most of the time. NOw not all, at any rate. There are people who aren't trying to do good at all. There are people whose goal is how to get themselves ahead and get what they want regardless of any one else's desires, happiness, or what happens to others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dory Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 I do not have salvation and sanctification separated out into two separate things. So, the answer is yes and no. ;) I believe it is as some describe, the gift exchange model. I give God myself and he gives me Himself. This process is lived out over a lifetime, and while I can be assured of God's love for me, know that I am in a relationship; I do not see "salvation" as a one time event. What I mean is that if salvation comes (from hell) it comes at the end. Does it not? If salvation means, healing of the wounded human soul and the ability to grow towards sanctification..then yes it starts now. It is both....and. Clear as mud? :D That makes sense to me I think. In other words the process of walking it out (sanctification) is the working out of our salvation which is what we see at the end? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CheerioKid Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 (edited) I'm confused. Are you meaning that one is not saved now? That the decisions made now simply mean we are saved at the end? I'll take this one....The word "saved" is thrown around a lot. "The day I 'got saved'" is the day I was baptized and identified myself as a Christian. It means different things in different denominations obviously. In the New Testament, those who called themselves Christians had believed and been baptized, and by doing so were added to the church (the fellowship of Christians), by the Lord himself. Acts 2:41, 47 (ESV) 41 So those who received his word were baptized, and there were added that day about three thousand souls. 47 ...And the Lord added to their number day by day those who were being saved. Those whom have been 'saved' must endure to the end to be saved from eternal death/hell. Edited August 25, 2012 by CheerioKid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juniper Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 That makes sense to me I think. In other words the process of walking it out (sanctification) is the working out of our salvation which is what we see at the end? Yes, although some would then say, "Aren't you trying to earn your salvation?" To which I would say, "No." It is only possible to walk the path towards sanctification, because of the work Jesus did. He is the one who opens the path to holiness, who heals the wounded places, who makes walking towards deification (holiness) even possible. There is no hope of salvation outside of Him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dory Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 Yes, although some would then say, "Aren't you trying to earn your salvation?" To which I would say, "No." It is only possible to walk the path towards sanctification, because of the work Jesus did. He is the one who opens the path to holiness, who heals the wounded places, who makes walking towards deification (holiness) even possible. There is no hope of salvation outside of Him. Show me faith without works and I will show you my faith by my works? Isn't that what Paul said? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sahamamama Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 Well, I don't know, really. I had a dream once, and in it I was walking towards a lion. He roared, and I walked closer. He roared again, and I kept on walking. When I was close enough to touch him, he said, "Do you know who I am? I'm not a tame lion. I could go right through you, if you get closer." As I buried my face in his mane, I said, "Then I will die with your breath on my neck." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TranquilMind Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 :grouphug: if one embraces God as the good parent.... children do say they hate their parents. they rebel against our guidance and rules. we still love them and feed them and care for them and tuck them in at night. where we are is their home. how much more so than for God our Father? :grouphug: ann That's a good analogy. If you have ever had teens, you know that sometimes they "hate you". Does this mean they really don't love you? No. It means they are frustrated and going through an obnoxious phase. Just like us - we do this too, at times. God still loves us and wants us to come back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incognito Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 John 17:3 talks about eternal life- it is defined as knowing God. http://bible.cc/john/17-3.htm This passage encompasses the "now" and the "ongoing" nature of salvation in my mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mommaduck Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 I do not have salvation and sanctification separated out into two separate things. So, the answer is yes and no. ;) I believe it is as some describe, the gift exchange model. I give God myself and he gives me Himself. This process is lived out over a lifetime, and while I can be assured of God's love for me, know that I am in a relationship; I do not see "salvation" as a one time event. What I mean is that if salvation comes (from hell and an eternity of ****ation) it comes at the end. Does it not? If salvation means, healing of the wounded human soul and the ability to grow towards sanctification..then yes it starts now. It is both....and. Clear as mud? :D Those Sanctification was never separated from Salvation until later, Western Church History. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parrothead Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 Because while I know that it is true, I struggle with reality of where I've been in life. My life leaves me feeling abandoned by Him, or worse that he isn't who he says he is, and yet everything I read rings true to me. I keep going, because I know I need to. I still spend a lot of time screaming at Him. That is okay. God can take it. :grouphug::grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parrothead Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 God loves you, and you are worth fighting for. Period. :iagree: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bkpan Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 How about a third option. Salvation isn't something that is done and done or done, then undone, then redone. Instead, it's an entire journey that doesn't end until after this life. Yes. :iagree: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kathryn Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 Salvation is not a one-time event, it's growing into communion with Christ. We walk toward Him. We mess up. We repent. He's merciful. We keep walking. Keep going. I was saved. I am being saved. I will be saved. "He who endures to the end will be saved." How about a third option. Salvation isn't something that is done and done or done, then undone, then redone. Instead, it's an entire journey that doesn't end until after this life. I think "the end" is simply our own death or the return of Christ...whichever comes first. Job endured so many things, yet in "the end", God was glorified (and Job was rewarded), and that was the purpose of Job's relationship with God, as it is for all of us. Our reason for having been created was to glorify God. We know that He will take care of us, no matter what happens. Nothing can separate us from His love. Bad things happen, and not just to unbelievers. Sometimes life just isn't fair. Being a believer does not make us immune to tragedy, it means that we can cast all our cares on Him because He cares for us. He WILL carry us through, and we will be saved in the end if we trust Him, love Him, and obey His commands. I agree. It's a process, a journey, a goal. It's now and it's in the future eternal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parrothead Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 I agree. It's a process, a journey, a goal. It's now and it's in the future eternal. :iagree: I also believe one can walk away from the process, journey, goal at any time and lose salvation. I think one can walk the walk and talk the talk but at the last nanosecond turn one's back on God and thereby losing salvation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TCB Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 I am reading this thread with interest as I have always believed that one can not lose salvation but have someone very dear to me who believes otherwise. I am wondering - what does endure mean? Many have mentioned we must endure to the end but what does this mean? Also, what if one has walked away at some point and then suddenly dies, if by chance it happened while one was away from God does that mean that one is then condemned? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dobela Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 :iagree: I also believe one can walk away from the process, journey, goal at any time and lose salvation. I think one can walk the walk and talk the talk but at the last nanosecond turn one's back on God and thereby losing salvation. :iagree: And it would have to be a genuine turning away from God, rejecting him. God is going to reject those who reject him. I think we all have doubts. The apostle Thomas had doubts, but it doesn't say he lost salvation. Instead, working thru those doubts he became stronger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kathryn Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 I am reading this thread with interest as I have always believed that one can not lose salvation but have someone very dear to me who believes otherwise. I am wondering - what does endure mean? Many have mentioned we must endure to the end but what does this mean? Also, what if one has walked away at some point and then suddenly dies, if by chance it happened while one was away from God does that mean that one is then condemned? My views: Endure means life is hard and we must endure, with faith, to the end. I also believe that God wants all people reconciled to Him. I believe that physical death is not the end of our journey or our ability to accept Him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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