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One of my students recently began working on reading comprehension and writing with me. He is a 12yo sixth grader. The mother wanted to know how he was doing, and I said that one of the areas of concern I have is that he seems lacking in general world knowledge and that I felt it was a huge road block preventing him from really understanding much of what he reads. For example, when we were reading about the first satellites and probes sent into space, he didn't have background knowledge of the word "orbit", of the 1950s as a decade, of the fact that we are one planet of eight in this solar system, what a solar system is, and quite a bit more that would shock most of you.

 

His mother responded that they weren't the kind of family to discuss things like that, and so he hadn't learned it. She implied that knowledge is just knowledge--a collection of facts that doesn't have much impact on anything else. I tried to present the argument that knowledge is a base for understanding what you read so that you can place things in context, create visuals in your mind, understand vocabulary, and make connections that aren't spelled out by the passage. I don't think she believed me. :(

 

So, what do you say? How important is a general world knowledge to reading comprehension?

 

What are the best ways to build this knowledge?

 

Further, if you had to build it in a child through books only, which books or series would you recommend? (Assume there is very basic knowledge lacking in the majority of areas.)

 

And finally, help me convince the mother that this is important (if it indeed is). I will, of course, be teaching comprehension skills as well.

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You probably want to check out ED Hirsch's books about Cultural Knowledge. And maybe buy one of his mother. Yeesh, that kid sounds like he's in a pretty pickle... what is his mother's problem? There's the Dictionary of Cultural Knowledge, and then a kid's version. They're very nicely done, imo.

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You probably want to check out ED Hirsch's books about Cultural Knowledge. And maybe buy one of his mother. Yeesh, that kid sounds like he's in a pretty pickle... what is his mother's problem? There's the Dictionary of Cultural Knowledge, and then a kid's version. They're very nicely done, imo.

 

 

I agree with you, but this sounded like to me not to be a cultural lack as much as a fact-of-life, the-world-is-not-flat and the sun-does-not-go-around-the-earth lack.

 

But then, I haven't yet read Cultural Knowledge (it's on my to-do list.) I could be wrong about that.

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I think it's very important.

One of the preschool in which I taught thought so, too; they believed one of the finest purposes for field trips was to build literacy knowledge. I think the director was sort of Whole Lang, but she stressed how kids who have had many real-world experiences bring that experience to their reading. It helps enormously!

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One of my students recently began working on reading comprehension and writing with me. He is a 12yo sixth grader. The mother wanted to know how he was doing, and I said that one of the areas of concern I have is that he seems lacking in general world knowledge and that I felt it was a huge road block preventing him from really understanding much of what he reads. For example, when we were reading about the first satellites and probes sent into space, he didn't have background knowledge of the word "orbit", of the 1950s as a decade, of the fact that we are one planet of eight in this solar system, what a solar system is, and quite a bit more that would shock most of you.

 

His mother responded that they weren't the kind of family to discuss things like that, and so he hadn't learned it. She implied that knowledge is just knowledge--a collection of facts that doesn't have much impact on anything else. I tried to present the argument that knowledge is a base for understanding what you read so that you can place things in context, create visuals in your mind, understand vocabulary, and make connections that aren't spelled out by the passage. I don't think she believed me. :(

 

So, what do you say? How important is a general world knowledge to reading comprehension?

 

What are the best ways to build this knowledge?

 

Further, if you had to build it in a child through books only, which books or series would you recommend? (Assume there is very basic knowledge lacking in the majority of areas.)

 

And finally, help me convince the mother that this is important (if it indeed is). I will, of course, be teaching comprehension skills as well.

Was this a test? A diagnostic assessment?

 

Or part of the overall lesson? I used to teach inner city kids who were low performing (below grade level) and this was a common scenario. But you have to teach. Why not simply bring in a common technique like a vocabulary list (i.e. "orbit") and go over the terms as part of the pre-reading lesson with setting, author bio, etc. That would help.

 

Sounds like using Wordly Wise 3000 series would be helpful in your situation for building vocabulary. :confused:

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She is nuts. This video explains it very well:

 

 

 

I would start checking out a few books from the nonfiction shelves at his reading level starting at 0.00 and ending at 999.99. Cover the scope and see what sticks. Honestly, I'd throw every Magic Schoolbus book I could at him - they would be below his reading level, but are packed full of facts.

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She wants him to have good reading comprehension skills but doesn't care if he knows stuff? :confused:

 

Anyway, I'd also consider adding in lots of DK Eyewitness books and big, glossy books with lots of fabulous quality photos. Nice pics capture attention and a person has to learn something even if they only read the captions.

 

Rosie

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You probably want to check out ED Hirsch's books about Cultural Knowledge. And maybe buy one of his mother. Yeesh, that kid sounds like he's in a pretty pickle... what is his mother's problem? There's the Dictionary of Cultural Knowledge, and then a kid's version. They're very nicely done, imo.

 

I checked it out on Amazon, and am definitely interested in having a look in real life. I wonder if I could get a fairly non-motivated kid to read through something like that over time?

 

I agree with you, but this sounded like to me not to be a cultural lack as much as a fact-of-life, the-world-is-not-flat and the sun-does-not-go-around-the-earth lack.

 

But then, I haven't yet read Cultural Knowledge (it's on my to-do list.) I could be wrong about that.

 

Yep, you're right. Some extremely basic facts are missing. For another example, he thought that people live "inside" the Earth and that the North Pole is in the very middle, and that the Earth is in a "valley" in space. I should point out that he is not learning disabled or anything like that. It's more like he's never been introduced to basic facts and/or hasn't cared about them or retained them. He's just your average sport-loving, tv-loving, text-loving kid.

 

I think it's very important.

One of the preschool in which I taught thought so, too; they believed one of the finest purposes for field trips was to build literacy knowledge. I think the director was sort of Whole Lang, but she stressed how kids who have had many real-world experiences bring that experience to their reading. It helps enormously!

 

I wish I could share some field trip experiences with him!

 

Was this a test? A diagnostic assessment?

 

Or part of the overall lesson? I used to teach inner city kids who were low performing (below grade level) and this was a common scenario. But you have to teach. Why not simply bring in a common technique like a vocabulary list (i.e. "orbit") and go over the terms as part of the pre-reading lesson with setting, author bio, etc. That would help.

 

Sounds like using Wordly Wise 3000 series would be helpful in your situation for building vocabulary. :confused:

 

No, it was not a test or an assessment. This is just my opinion--lack of basic knowledge is a major underlying issue that I believe affects his reading comprehension, which his mom wants me to improve. I also hoped to have a lively discussion with the Hive because I'm curious whether people commonly identify basic knowledge as a factor in reading comprehension. (I did a bunch of Googling for reading comp strategies, just to see what was out there, and mostly found fairly useless "tips".)

 

Wordly Wise might help, but I feel that he would respond better to something more organic, and the results would be more lasting.

 

I agree that going over terms before the reading would help, and that's certainly a strategy I'll be using with him. But, I think the problem goes deeper. Even if I could share the meanings of individual words, it doesn't help him place the word within his larger store of knowledge. He's not just missing the vocab words, he's missing all the connectors between them. I spent some time giving him a context for the passage, but it eats away at our time pretty quickly.

 

She is nuts. This video explains it very well:

 

 

I would start checking out a few books from the nonfiction shelves at his reading level starting at 0.00 and ending at 999.99. Cover the scope and see what sticks. Honestly, I'd throw every Magic Schoolbus book I could at him - they would be below his reading level, but are packed full of facts.

 

Thanks! I actually just watched this tonight. I completely agree with it, although I feel they could have used better examples. Would it be weird to send the link to the mother? She'll be hard to get on board--she expects miracles from once-weekly tutoring sessions, but doesn't require reading at home, unless it's a school assignment.

Edited by GingerPoppy
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She wants him to have good reading comprehension skills but doesn't care if he knows stuff? :confused:

 

Anyway, I'd also consider adding in lots of DK Eyewitness books and big, glossy books with lots of fabulous quality photos. Nice pics capture attention and a person has to learn something even if they only read the captions.

 

Rosie

 

I know; it's surprising, isn't it? I think that she felt a bit offended that I suggested he was lacking in any way, so she was "defending" him.

 

I think the DK Eyewitness books would be a great way to go, as long as I can get him to read or look through them on his own. I'll suggest those, as well as the Magic School Bus books a pp mentioned.

 

P.S. I'm reading Heidi right now, too... last chapter tomorrow!

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Was this a test? A diagnostic assessment?

 

Or part of the overall lesson? I used to teach inner city kids who were low performing (below grade level) and this was a common scenario. But you have to teach. Why not simply bring in a common technique like a vocabulary list (i.e. "orbit") and go over the terms as part of the pre-reading lesson with setting, author bio, etc. That would help.

 

Sounds like using Wordly Wise 3000 series would be helpful in your situation for building vocabulary. :confused:

 

Wow, that's too bad! Twelve years old? Wow.

 

Agreeing with the Wordly Wise suggestion. I found it very helpful for my young advanced readers who lacked context/comprehension at skill levels that were above their age/life experiences.

 

I'd get your student reading lots of interesting stuff - I'm thinking of Usborne type books. Perhaps they would seem too young for him, but they do pack a lot of information into easy to read chunks. I might also gift him with a pocket dictionary, if he doesn't already have one, and teach him to look up unfamiliar words he comes across as he reads.

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Yep, you're right. Some extremely basic facts are missing. For another example, he thought that people live "inside" the Earth and that the North Pole is in the very middle, and that the Earth is in a "valley" in space. I should point out that he is not learning disabled or anything like that. It's more like he's never been introduced to basic facts and/or hasn't cared about them or retained them. He's just your average sport-loving, tv-loving, text-loving kid.

 

That's just bizarre. What sports does he play, what tv shows does he watch, & what is he texting???? :confused: I would have thought that watching tv (to a certain extent) would help build cultural knowledge & references.

 

The thing that popped into my head is that he needs to read a set of encyclopedias. Of course, I know that's not helpful nor is it practical for the situation. Maybe something like a Usborne Children's Encyclopedia?

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What I do in a case like that is start the lesson by reading together a bit of nonfiction about the relevant topic in the selection to be "comprehended." If you don't have an age-appropriate book on the topic, a good kids' encyclopedia can be useful. Or google.

 

I'd also try to figure out the areas he's interested in and choose books in those fields of interest.

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That is too weird!

 

I agree with what other posters have suggested, regarding starting out with books like DK, Usborne, and even series like Magic School Bus!

 

The weird thing to me is that the topics you mention are not just "family discussion topics" but is knowledge that is taught in every day science, history, geography, etc., courses. It makes me wonder what he is being taught? Does he do any science at all, for example? It doesn't really sound like it!

 

I wonder if there are other issues going on.

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General knowledge is completely important for reading comprehension. If you have no knowledge of something other things won't make sense. I can't imagine how he's never picked up on at least such basic things through watching TV. What in the world is he watching?!?!

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General knowledge is completely important for reading comprehension. If you have no knowledge of something other things won't make sense. I can't imagine how he's never picked up on at least such basic things through watching TV. What in the world is he watching?!?!

 

I agree with the others that you have to get background knowledge in order to help with comprehension. It is very important.

 

I have worked with comprehension issues with many students over the years. Time and time again I see that students who struggle with comprehension (but can read all the words on the page and who are not dyslexic) also struggle to pick up basic facts from a typical education, tv or even from their environment.

 

It is very possible that his lack of knowledge his because of poor teaching (lack of reading, etc.) but it is also possible that it is tied into his difficulties with understanding what he is reading. Many of these students don't make connections without direct instruction.

 

My dd11 struggles mightily in this area -- understanding what she is reading and general knowledge. My other two children (dd9 and ds6) the younger of which has many signs of dyslexia and my dd9 have a lot of general knowledge and can show all of it. In contrast my dd11 can appear that she hasn't a clue -- at times she would probably appear on Leno's on the street segment or whatever it was called. She has done the most traveling of all of my children and has been more places than either of my other children. She just doesn't pick up things as easy as the other two do.

 

Yes, you will need to teach background (general knowledge) but if you find it is harder than you think you would expect to be it might be tied into the reading issues.

Edited by Mandamom
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Dh did his Master's research in remediating reading skills. He read study after study that found that context - the knowledge a student brings to the piece they are reading - is the highest indicator of comprehension. Ruth Beechick talks about this, too, I believe, in her works on reading for homeschoolers.

 

I feel very bad for this child. I don't even know if it is a lack of formal education. Most kids know these things by the time they start formal schoolwork because of exposure in their family environment. I'd say she has bought into an extreme version of the homeschool mantra about not filling the bucket. :glare: Poor boy.

 

I would suggest the DK and Usborne books, too, as well as some of the picture books about science and history that children normally read.

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She is nuts. This video explains it very well:

 

 

I would start checking out a few books from the nonfiction shelves at his reading level starting at 0.00 and ending at 999.99. Cover the scope and see what sticks. Honestly, I'd throw every Magic Schoolbus book I could at him - they would be below his reading level, but are packed full of facts.

 

:iagree: Excellent advice!

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Thanks for the suggestions, everyone!

 

A couple of people seemed to think he's a homeschooler... he's not. He's a public schooled kid. As to what he's been taught there, I really don't know. I suspect it's a combination of material not being covered at school, combined with the fact that he seems to tune out.

 

Unfortunately, I only have him for an hour a week, although that may go up to twice a week in the summer. I'm concerned about how much I can cover in that limited amount of time. I plan to use a lot of non-fiction while helping him with his reading comp and writing, but I'll have to assign some reading as homework. Ideally, though, I'd like to get him more interested in the world in general, so that he'd maybe pick up a book on his own.

 

Someone mentioned that his knowledge lack may stem from a difficulty with processing information in general (even from tv). That may be. I get the feeling he just doesn't care about things outside of his realm. He did say to me, "I only like new stuff," meaning he wasn't interested in the past. If I could find a way to ignite an interest in the world, I think it would help. But it's difficult in the amount of time I have--I have to offset a family lifestyle that is quite opposite to that.

 

I think he is quite weak in conceptualizing, too. Before I started working with him (in math, a year ago), he had no idea what it meant to divide something; every fraction he saw, he called a "half", and so on. He was extremely weak. His understanding of math concepts has improved tremendously. Anyway, part of my goal is to help him understand concepts and think more deeply about things.

 

I will definitely try the book suggestions!

Edited by GingerPoppy
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So, what do you say? How important is a general world knowledge to reading comprehension?

 

Extremely. My oldest (17) was raised in an orphanage until she was a pre-teen. She lacks huge amounts of background knowledge, and it definitely, absolutely affects her reading comprehension.

 

Tara

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This conversation is making me think of an article I read a few years ago. I think it was in the Horn Book. It was written by a woman who had taught at a school in a remote area of Alaska. She wrote about how when they prepared for standardized test prep, they had to teach the kids about what everyday life is like in the lower 48 states, because so much is different up there, and the kids would be so thrown by the mention of, for example, a phone booth that they wouldn't even know where to start answering the question.

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My thought is, it doesn't matter what he reads, just as long as he is reading. Vocabulary and knowledge of the world around you are built by experience. You can experience it in person, or in print. The more books he reads, the more thoughts, ideas and vocabulary he will gain. It doesn't have to be non-fiction. Fiction books include a great deal of cultural vocabulary. Real people, places, events, and ways of doing things are all built into fiction.

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Are you sure he has no learning disabilities? It seems fairly odd that at 12 years old he would not have a concept of our solar system. I'm pretty sure even the worst public schools would have introduced the solar system by now.

 

ITA.

 

IMO there are a few options here:

1) he's pulling an elaborate practical joke on you

2) he's never watched television, never been to school, never had any friends, and never overheard any conversations by other people.

3) he just arrived in the year 2012 in a time machine from 1400, and has picked up the modern day language pretty well without learning any context

4) he has some sort of processing delay.

 

My best bet is actually #4 with a little bit of #1 thrown it... not so much a practical joke but a feigning ignorance on some things. He may have discovered early on that the best way to cover up the difficulties he has understanding and remembering things is just to play dumb about everything so that adults just eventually throw up their hands and leave him alone.

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I read an article by E. D. Hirsch, and he began with a great example of the importance of background knowledge in reading comprehension: Descriptions of the progression of two different sport games. One was baseball. I could understand the passge because I know what "over the wall" refers to, what "homer" is, and what is meant by bases, runners, pitcher. The other sport was cricket. I know nothing about cricket, so I had NO idea what the passage was actually describing.

 

I'd suggest reading through Hirch's What Your ___ Grader Needs to Know series. There's a book for each grade level, beginning with kindergarten, and the series covers what Americans consider to be basic background knowledge in science, history, geography, language and literature, mathematics.

 

Cat

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ITA.

 

IMO there are a few options here:

1) he's pulling an elaborate practical joke on you

2) he's never watched television, never been to school, never had any friends, and never overheard any conversations by other people.

3) he just arrived in the year 2012 in a time machine from 1400, and has picked up the modern day language pretty well without learning any context

4) he has some sort of processing delay.

 

My best bet is actually #4 with a little bit of #1 thrown it... not so much a practical joke but a feigning ignorance on some things. He may have discovered early on that the best way to cover up the difficulties he has understanding and remembering things is just to play dumb about everything so that adults just eventually throw up their hands and leave him alone.

 

Attempting to stifle laughter so I don't wake the napping 2yo. I agree though, there HAS to be some underlying issue.

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I agree with the others that you have to get background knowledge in order to help with comprehension. It is very important.

 

I have worked with comprehension issues with many students over the years. Time and time again I see that students who struggle with comprehension (but can read all the words on the page and who are not dyslexic) also struggle to pick up basic facts from a typical education, tv or even from their environment.

 

It is very possible that his lack of knowledge his because of poor teaching (lack of reading, etc.) but it is also possible that it is tied into his difficulties with understanding what he is reading. Many of these students don't make connections without direct instruction.

 

My dd11 struggles mightily in this area -- understanding what she is reading and general knowledge. My other two children (dd9 and ds6) the younger of which has many signs of dyslexia and my dd9 have a lot of general knowledge and can show all of it. In contrast my dd11 can appear that she hasn't a clue -- at times she would probably appear on Leno's on the street segment or whatever it was called. She has done the most traveling of all of my children and has been more places than either of my other children. She just doesn't pick up things as easy as the other two do.

 

Yes, you will need to teach background (general knowledge) but if you find it is harder than you think you would expect to be it might be tied into the reading issues.

 

Are you sure he has no learning disabilities? It seems fairly odd that at 12 years old he would not have a concept of our solar system. I'm pretty sure even the worst public schools would have introduced the solar system by now.

:iagree: I agree with both of these posts.

 

 

If this child were a 5 or 6, then maybe I would think that his parents just hadn't spent a lot of time talking to him about the world/everyday life. But having been in school for 6 years....... it would seem he's not picking up the general information that he should.

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That is indeed very troubling, and I think it is definitely of concern. I try to expose my kids to various situations, concepts, and so on in life and in books, including sending them to the movies when I thought it was just something they should do and try. In addition to regular books (novels, non fiction related to educational pursuits) I also read them from Childcraft volumes (I've got an older set) so they know about various places and things that might not have come up. They have an odd mishmash of useful knowledge, I would say.

 

But there is a part of me that thinks this is very possible and that there are lots of kids like this. It's like all the adults who are surprised there are fifty states and have no idea about the most basic things but know a lot about celebrities and tv shows.

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I like the What your ____ grader should know. I've checked them out of the library and *I* find them interesting. They aren't overly expensive either.

 

I would also consider some good documentaries, not stuff like Ancient Aliens. Do you think he'd comprehend easier while watching a DVD?

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That is indeed very troubling, and I think it is definitely of concern. I try to expose my kids to various situations, concepts, and so on in life and in books, including sending them to the movies when I thought it was just something they should do and try. In addition to regular books (novels, non fiction related to educational pursuits) I also read them from Childcraft volumes (I've got an older set) so they know about various places and things that might not have come up. They have an odd mishmash of useful knowledge, I would say.

 

But there is a part of me that thinks this is very possible and that there are lots of kids like this. It's like all the adults who are surprised there are fifty states and have no idea about the most basic things but know a lot about celebrities and tv shows.

 

Yup, and that is exactly what Hirsch has written extensively about... pretty much every response here has been one of his books! I think that's pretty cool, because I'm a huge fan of his.

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I am not sure I am a believer in some pre-established set of exactly what people need to know, but certainly he has put forth some suggestions worth considering in a situation where there is a deficit of this type. But how does one get up to speed on so many things? It reminds me of people who immigrate to a country but know nothing of its culture or history, so don't understand a lot. I had a friend in college who was a one semester exchange student from Japan. She did not understand -- at all -- why people kept talking about OJ Simpson (current event of the time was his acquittal).

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I am not sure I am a believer in some pre-established set of exactly what people need to know, but certainly he has put forth some suggestions worth considering in a situation where there is a deficit of this type. But how does one get up to speed on so many things? It reminds me of people who immigrate to a country but know nothing of its culture or history, so don't understand a lot. I had a friend in college who was a one semester exchange student from Japan. She did not understand -- at all -- why people kept talking about OJ Simpson (current event of the time was his acquittal).

 

Well, that's where the Dictionary of Cultural Knowledge comes into play ;) It's not just pop culture: it also covers literary references, common sayings, historical events, etc. It's a really interesting collection. I'm sure anyone who looks at it could find 10 things they don't think are important, and another 10 things that should have been included... but overall it's a really interesting attempt to gather up all the random strands of information that float around the atmosphere and which people in educated/cultural environments just kind of pick up as they go through life... but which people who don't grow up in such an environment have maybe not been exposed to, and thus they are lost when these things come up. I know that I certainly learned a few things when I paged through it.

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No, it was not a test or an assessment. This is just my opinion--lack of basic knowledge is a major underlying issue that I believe affects his reading comprehension, which his mom wants me to improve. I also hoped to have a lively discussion with the Hive because I'm curious whether people commonly identify basic knowledge as a factor in reading comprehension. (I did a bunch of Googling for reading comp strategies, just to see what was out there, and mostly found fairly useless "tips".)

 

Wordly Wise might help, but I feel that he would respond better to something more organic, and the results would be more lasting.

 

I agree that going over terms before the reading would help, and that's certainly a strategy I'll be using with him. But, I think the problem goes deeper. Even if I could share the meanings of individual words, it doesn't help him place the word within his larger store of knowledge. He's not just missing the vocab words, he's missing all the connectors between them. I spent some time giving him a context for the passage, but it eats away at our time pretty quickly.

 

 

 

 

 

Thanks for the suggestions, everyone!

 

A couple of people seemed to think he's a homeschooler... he's not. He's a public schooled kid. As to what he's been taught there, I really don't know. I suspect it's a combination of material not being covered at school, combined with the fact that he seems to tune out.

 

Unfortunately, I only have him for an hour a week, although that may go up to twice a week in the summer. I'm concerned about how much I can cover in that limited amount of time. I plan to use a lot of non-fiction while helping him with his reading comp and writing, but I'll have to assign some reading as homework. Ideally, though, I'd like to get him more interested in the world in general, so that he'd maybe pick up a book on his own.

 

Someone mentioned that his knowledge lack may stem from a difficulty with processing information in general (even from tv). That may be. I get the feeling he just doesn't care about things outside of his realm. He did say to me, "I only like new stuff," meaning he wasn't interested in the past. If I could find a way to ignite an interest in the world, I think it would help. But it's difficult in the amount of time I have--I have to offset a family lifestyle that is quite opposite to that.

 

I think he is quite weak in conceptualizing, too. Before I started working with him (in math, a year ago), he had no idea what it meant to divide something; every fraction he saw, he called a "half", and so on. He was extremely weak. His understanding of math concepts has improved tremendously. Anyway, part of my goal is to help him understand concepts and think more deeply about things.

 

I will definitely try the book suggestions!

 

I have only read up to here, so forgive me if this has been mentioned already. The (red) bolded parts are huge "signs" of a possible processing or input/output issue. Has the child ever been tested officially for a learning disability? You may not be able to help him for only one hour a week if this is the case. :confused: He needs remediation daily.

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Are you sure he has no learning disabilities? It seems fairly odd that at 12 years old he would not have a concept of our solar system. I'm pretty sure even the worst public schools would have introduced the solar system by now.

:iagree::iagree::iagree:

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