What if your dd didn't want to shave her legs or armpits?

[StephanieZ]

so long as it isn't dangerous (morally or physically) or crude, I'd let my growing-up kids decide what is best for their own bodies. If she's old enough to shave, she's surely old enough to choose whether or not to, IMHO.

 

If the body-choice could cause some harm to her (such as dressing too provacatively, piercing a tender part, etc.), then I'd step in. But if it is just going to be mildly embarassing to me (ugly clothes, too much hair in the wrong places), then I'd surely do my very best to let it go, even if I had to grit my teeth the whole time.

 

I think it makes sense to ask dc to dress in appropriate ways in certain situations (weddings, church, grandma's birthday, job interviews, etc.) so they learn that sometimes we sacrifice our "style" for a greater goal (showing respect for older folks's comfort, our employer's expectations, etc.) and I think it is good to talk to our dc about how their appearance sends messages and that they are sending the messages they want. . . We wear "uniforms" all the time in life to send certain messages or fit in to certain groups. . . For isntance, I wear my diamond earrings and an Ann Taylor jacket when meeting with business bankers during the work week but I wear flip flops and pony tails when carting kids to the soccer fields (and I look askance a bit at ladies who wear their diamond earrings at the soccer fields Saturday mornings, UNLESS they are also wearing cheap flip flops, which negate the "I'm important" diamond message with the "I am so not a snob" Target flip-flop message. We all understand these messages intutively (well most of us) and I do think it is reasonable to try to help our dc understand that they are communicating with the world by how they present themselves. So long as the child understands and accepts that. . . fine (to a point and so long as the message is an OK one).

 

Surely, hair cuts, clothes, hairy legs. . . those are all temporary and correctable when they grow out of their (temporary if you don't push too hard) phases. . . So, I'd let them express themselves as they wish so long as the expressions aren't permanent or sending ugly or dangerous messages. Icky is OK, tho'.

[LibraryLover]

Would not be an issue for me at all. It wouldn't even register on my radar.

[Fourmother]

That would be fine with me.

 

(And since she'd still be wearing deoderant every day and showering I don't see the b.o. issue as a problem.)

 

:iagree:

Men who don't shave, wash daily and use deodorant properly don't stink. The same is true for women. I know this for a fact because I rarely shave and I don't happen to stink. Neither does dh.;) My mother only discussed shaving with me when it came to wearing swim suits or sleeveless tops. Legs were never an issue at all. I'll be the same way.

[Harriet Vane]

I would talk with her about the cultural expectation, reactions she may get, questions she may be asked.

 

Not in an influential way, but to prepare her for making a slightly counter cultural decision.

 

My mom "forbid" me from shaving my legs. I felt so violated. I imagine making a similar decision for my dd would feel like a violation as well.

 

It helps that I don't believe it's necessary for hygiene and I see it as a culturally accepted practice rather than one rooted in practicality.

 

It was downright embarrassing--I had thick, dark hair, and my mother forbid me from shaving my legs. She said I was too young. She was "saving" me from a lot of hassle and inconvenience until I was an adult. I didn't appreciate it at all--I was mortified, and I was teased for it. Eventually I started shaving anyway, in direct disobedience.

[Jennifer in NH]

I find this story too funny to not pass along! as I said earlier I was not allowed to shave until about 16 or so. I had very blond hair so no big deal really. My older sister has black hair. I have no idea what was in her head, but she decided to partially shave her legs...she actually shaved them in strips (or stripes)! She said she was hoping that Mom wouldn't notice!:lol:

[KidsHappen]

until they were a little older to make that decision. Something about an 11 yr. old with a razor makes me nervous. I started all of mine out with an electric for just that reason.

 

But this is a decision that they get to make themselves. I consider this a body integrity issue. I would no more tell a kid that they have to shave or not than to tell them what kind of sanitary care products they have to use. Simply too personal for anyone else's business. I have four girls at that age or older. Two started shaving as soon as they could, two waited a while before starting.

 

I feel the same way about the bra issue. As long as things are adequately covered (no color or shape showing) then that is a decision that they get to make themselves. Four of my five started either before or as soon as they started developing. One didn't wear a bra until she was 14 and really needed the support.

 

In any case these are definitely not hills worth dying on. Too many other biggies to worry about.

[Melissa in Australia]

 

Note - this is from a mom who has a teen boy with hair past his shoulders now - nice kid, but he looks like a commie pinko hippie freak (as my Dad will say when he sees him in June!)

 

 

Ha :lol: sounds just like my son. I didn't know what to do about the long hair, so asked DH. He said so he did at that age to, he will grow out of it!:lol::lol:

MelissaL

[Pamela H in Texas]

I'd be like "whatever."

 

My daughter wanted to shave pretty early and we let her. However, that soon got old and she was no longer interested. There have been times when I wish she would, but I figure it's her business, not mine. Thankfully, most of her clothes (jeans, capri, dresses, skirts) are fairly long.

 

One thing that does work better with my daughter is using a Nair-like product and a false razor. We can sit together chatting, there are no cuts, and it lasts longer.

 

BTW, and to show my total weirdness. I do insist she waxes her eyebrows and upper lip especially since her illness at the beginning of the school year and more prolific growth.

 

BTW, my daughter is 15 and has been shaving since 9.

[LadyR]

I think it makes sense to ask dc to dress in appropriate ways in certain situations (weddings, church, grandma's birthday, job interviews, etc.) so they learn that sometimes we sacrifice our "style" for a greater goal

I agree with this. I personally (I said personally) believe that seeing long dark hair in someone's armpits is socially unacceptable - especially in ballet performances, church settings, etc. I can imagine my dd in her ballet performance, lifting her arms, and hearing a collective gasp from the audience...hahaha! It would definitely be viewed as unacceptable where I live. People would be talking. Now if I put a ring in my nose and got tattoos, that would be acceptable...:lol:

 

For those wondering how I would make my dd shave, I would say "go shave." Just like I say "go floss". :001_smile:

[OnTheBrink]

I wouldn't care one way or the other. God made us with hair, so if she chooses to keep it on her body, fine by me. I couldn't care less what the social norms are in this situation, or whether someone else liked it. What a personal thing to be commenting on anyway! I couldn't imagine myself saying something to someone about whether they have hairy pits and legs. Not my business, imo.

[my2kidsmom]

I would definately support her. In fact, I think it's great.

[Laura Corin]

My first reaction is EWWWWWW! I have always liked the feel of my nice, soft freshly shaved legs. With armpits, you have to consider others. More hair there means more odor.

 

I don't shave, but I shower once or twice a day and use deodorant.

 

Laura

[Eleni]

I was the dd who never shaved....'

Once my mom got frustrated with me...and said "OH...Just GO braid your leg hair!!":lol: Totally in jest....

For Christmas that year she gave me a HUGE bag of razors in my stocking as a joke...I wound up shaving part of my hair, and she commented that i shaved the wrong body part.

 

For us it was all in good fun. I still have issues with shaving...and only do it if my legs will be exposed. Dh doesnt care. Uh...i dont shave my head anymore though....:glare:

[Susan in TX]

I agree with this. I personally (I said personally) believe that seeing long dark hair in someone's armpits is socially unacceptable - especially in ballet performances, church settings, etc. I can imagine my dd in her ballet performance, lifting her arms, and hearing a collective gasp from the audience...hahaha! :lol:

 

Basically, the rule around here is you don't have to shave (I don't) but what isn't covered MUST be shaven (out of consideration for others).

 

Susan

[PG4WOODS]

I would leave it alone but when she wanted to shave her legs then, I would ask why?

 

My best friends' mother is German so I grew up with it. No big deal...

 

If your son had a hairy back would you ask him to shave it?

[Joanne]

I personally (I said personally) believe that seeing long dark hair in someone's armpits is socially unacceptable - especially in ballet performances, church settings, etc. I can imagine my dd in her ballet performance, lifting her arms, and hearing a collective gasp from the audience...hahaha! It would definitely be viewed as unacceptable where I live.

 

I hear you. And I believe you about the preferences where you live.

 

But it's an *arbitrary* standard that does not have merit in terms of hygiene (flossing, for example, does). It's associated with "femininity" but that's subjective.

 

It's not a must for health or even for odor. In certain circumstances, I might feel awkward for my dd; but I would not impose an arbitrary standard on her. I would explain, coach, and share info with her, but I could not insist a person *shave* because culture says they should. To me, it's really no different than the current pants down to the upper thighs look.

[Storm Bay]

Ha :lol: sounds just like my son. I didn't know what to do about the long hair, so asked DH. He said so he did at that age to, he will grow out of it!:lol::lol:

MelissaL

 

 

Almost all the boys/guys had long hair when I went to high school (the 1970s). If not long, then at least touching their shoulders. (save a few). I wouldn't worry about that as long as he can take care of it himself. Whenever my 7 yo wants to grow his hair long I tell him how much work it is and how much more rinsing and he almost always changes his mind on his own.

[Storm Bay]

I agree with this. I personally (I said personally) believe that seeing long dark hair in someone's armpits is socially unacceptable - especially in ballet performances,

 

I think even men shave some of their parts for ballet!;) At least when I've gone--no hairy chests, for eg.

[Unicorn.]

I would actually prefer that my dd's never start shaving. I wish I hadn't. Would it help you to remind yourself that the tradition came from french, umm, "women of the evening" during a certain, very large, world war. Before that, women didn't shave. I hate shaving!

 

Ummm, I hope that didn't sound snarky, I really didn't mean to be!

[GailV]

Basically, the rule around here is you don't have to shave (I don't) but what isn't covered MUST be shaven (out of consideration for others).

 

Susan

 

Just out of curiosity, is this the rule for both males and females? Thinking in terms of going to the swimming pool -- who has to shave what in order to go?

[Mommy22alyns]

I find this story too funny to not pass along! as I said earlier I was not allowed to shave until about 16 or so. I had very blond hair so no big deal really. My older sister has black hair. I have no idea what was in her head, but she decided to partially shave her legs...she actually shaved them in strips (or stripes)! She said she was hoping that Mom wouldn't notice!:lol:

 

 

Here's another funny shaving story... when I was 12-13 or so and wanted to start shaving my legs, I didn't exactly realize that one needed some kind of water/lather/lubrication. So I just shaved - total dry shave. I had razor burn on every inch of my legs! :001_huh:

[LadyR]

 

To me shaving is part of a hygiene routine.

So men are dirty? I don't equate shaving with hygiene.

I said "part of a hygiene routine", which to me includes hair brushing, clipping fingernails & toenails, (husband shaves beard every day), etc, etc. Things I routinely do to take care of myself. Among other things, my routine includes shaving.

[Peela]

I'd be proud of her too.

I was like that as a teenager. Being blonde helped though. I still don't shave any where near often enough. In winter I don't at all.

[Colleen]

I understand where you're coming from, Nancy. But when you get right down to it, can you actually force someone to follow a particular hygiene routine? I'm talking about an older "someone" ~ a young person who is now taking care of himself or herself as far as hygiene is concerned. What if, for example, a teenager stopped brushing his/her teeth for some inexplicable reason? We can demand that s/he brush, but in all honesty, how can we force the issue short of phsyically manhandling the person? We'd essentially have to let the young person absorb the consequences, perhaps going so far as to make him/her pay for dental care.

[Pamela H in Texas]

Well Colleen, I do think we can compel our teens in nonphysical ways to do things our way. I just don't know why we'd WANT to in this kind of case. If it were something important, I'd get it, of course, but....

 

It just seems that some people want to exert WAY too much control over the choices of their teenagers and I think that is not only stealing away peacefulness in the family but just possibly dangerous. Again, there just seems to be too many 16-23yos who get some freedom or get out on their own and make really poor choices. I think part of that is because they don't know how to exercise better self-control because they weren't allowed to and part is that they rebel because they weren't allowed any freedom as a preteen/teen. Controlling to the extent of deciding things like shaving seems absolutely crazy to me. There are bigger fish to fry. I'll save my "pulling rank" for things that really matter. In the meantime, I want my kids to practice thinking for themselves.

[LadyR]

It just seems that some people want to exert WAY too much control over the choices of their teenagers and I think that is not only stealing away peacefulness in the family but just possibly dangerous.

Since I seem to be the only one in this thread that is "controlling the choice of my teenager and stealing away the peacefulness in the family" (oh, brother) I guess that was meant for me. I'll leave now. But not before I tell you that I also make my kids eat healthy food, use good manners, and clean up after themselves when they make a mess. Bad mom, bad mom.

 

Oh, and I have the most loving, peaceful, gentle dd you could ask for. We are BEST FRIENDS.

 

All done. Leaving now.

[Joanne]

I'll leave now. But not before I tell you that I also make my kids eat healthy food, use good manners, and clean up after themselves when they make a mess. Bad mom, bad mom.

 

These seem different to me than making a child conform to an arbitrary standard. Healthy food contributes to health. Manners is a matter of respect - although there are some arbitrary behaviors attached to it (thinking of the "wearing hats inside" discussion). Cleaning up after themselves is respect - at minimum and could certainly at an extreme lead to bugs, vermin, etc.

 

Oh, and I have the most loving, peaceful, gentle dd you could ask for. We are BEST FRIENDS.

 

All done. Leaving now.

__________________

 

OK. I'm sorry you've felt so attacked by the questions to you in this thread. I've felt that way before - where one aspect of my life and choice with my kids was focused on and (erroneous) assumptions made.

[Pamela H in Texas]

Since I seem to be the only one in this thread

 

1) I didn't read the whole thread so I wouldn't know that you were the only one.

 

2) I see PLENTY of over-controlling, over-manipulating, micromanaging, etc in various threads. You aren't the only one even if you are the only one on THIS issue in THIS thread.

 

And of course, as others have said, there is a huge difference in requiring decent, even high, standards and insisting on shaving. I have no doubt that most homeschool parents, yourself included, are plenty bright enough to tell the difference between requiring respect or healthy eating vs shaving.

[Colleen]

Since I seem to be the only one in this thread that is "controlling the choice of my teenager and stealing away the peacefulness in the family" (oh, brother) I guess that was meant for me. I'll leave now.

 

I'm sorry Pamela's words hurt you. I am sure it wasn't her intent to judge you, or to address you specifically, but to simply engage and share one perspective. Running away isn't necessary or helpful.

 

Fwiw, I absolutely didn't intend to imply your daughter is not loving or gentle, or that the two of you don't get along well. I have no idea how old your daughter is and no idea if this is even an issue for you yet. I was attempting to engage in an honest, interesting discussion. I think sometimes, when our children or younger or when our children have a particular personality or preferences, we assume we would be able and willing to do "X" with them no matter what. I am thinking through how one might respond if one's older son or daughter makes a choice about his or her body that is not necessarily damaging, but also not in keeping with our preferences.

 

I also make my kids eat healthy food, use good manners, and clean up after themselves when they make a mess.

 

Good for you! So do I, as do many (most? all?) others who have responded here.:)

[Pam "SFSOM" in TN]

Basically, the rule around here is you don't have to shave (I don't) but what isn't covered MUST be shaven (out of consideration for others).

 

Susan

 

I wonder how you feel about my arms? I don't shave them, but I don't cover them, either.

 

I know there are women around me who feel it's gross that I have so much hair on my [fore]arms. What say you?

 

(Full disclosure: I shave legs and underarms, but I'm fully aware that it's to preserve a young girl ideal body, not a woman's body. I don't like it idealistically, but I don't swim against the tide in that regard.)

[Heather in the Kootenays]

I'm amazed at the passion felt over this issue.

[Pam "SFSOM" in TN]

I'm amazed at the passion felt over this issue.

 

The thing with me, I guess, is that I had to sneak and shave at the point that it became a social issue. It made for some bad memories. I wouldn't want my dd's to go through the angst I did.

 

However, like the hypothetical in the OP's question, if my dd came to the conclusion that she would not shave, I guess I would support that. I'd honestly be ambivalent, though. I'm a product of my acculturation, I'm afraid. If we LIVED in Europe, it would not be the least bit an issue.

[nmoira]

 

If we LIVED in Europe, it would not be the least bit an issue.

Or in certain pockets of the US. :)

[Mrs Mungo]

Er...I said that I wouldn't require my daughter to shave. However, I'd like to clarify that I'm not going to judge another parent for what *they* require for *their* home. I'm plenty control-freakish in my own ways, I'm in no position to judge anyone else, believe me!