Parenting a grown child dilemma....what would you do?

[Guest Virginia Dawn]

Please, no more replies. I'm exhausted and I can't read any more. I appreciate the the comments.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I thought of waffling and putting this question hypothetically, but I guess I'll just come out and ask. This is kind of complicated so you don't have to read any further.

 

Here is the pertinent info.

 

* My grandson is 4yo.

 

*I think my daughter needs lessons in "get off your butt" parenting.

 

*I'm almost positive that she doesn't see it that way.

 

*She and her husband and child will be visiting multiple times this summer, sometimes for an extended stay of up to a week.

 

*She and I have opposite personalities, which can cause conflict and make me feel like I need to tiptoe around important issues.

 

* When they are here, she abdicates her responsibilities as a parent and I find myself taking responsibility because I love my grandchild.

 

Example: She assumes, when she leaves a room for any length of time, that whoever is in the room will be responsible for him, with out asking if anyone will. I found him wandering outside alone (we live on a busy street) and when I found him she only said, "how did he get out there?" Well, he just opened the door and walked out.

 

*I have kept my cool. Truly I have. Once, I said *calmly* something about making decisions that were in the best interest of the child and she froze

me out for 3 hours.

 

*The child blossoms with positive discipline and structure, but he's not really getting any.

 

Example: He *asked* his mother if he could go to bed last night when I was putting my youngest to bed. She was on the computer and just said, "not right now?????" So, I got him ready for bed and took him up. She never seemed to even notice and said nothing about it.

 

* The example list could go on and on, but you get the picture.

 

*I would dearly love to give her a parenting lecture, but I also do not want to alienate them. So I thought maybe someone had a book idea, something along the lines of Wake Up and Take Care of Your Child In The Way He Needs and Deserves. Sigh.

 

* Then part of me wonders if I should just leave the whole thing alone and just go on doing what I can, when I can, even though I have to practice not feeling frustrated. Maybe I'm making too big a deal of this in my own mind?

 

*I don't want to be the interfering mother or mother-in-law that we all hear about often, but is it sometimes okay to interfere?

 

* Ugh.

Edited July 13, 2010 by Virginia Dawn

[Pamela H in Texas]

JMO but it's her child and she can do (or not do) as she pleases. It would drive me absolutely batty, but....

 

The only situation I find very problematic is the one where he left the house. I know VERY few people who really think about leaving the room when they have a 4yo, but the child needs to have clear safe boundaries (go outside only when he's asked or has an adult to go with him).

 

Well, not that I don't consider the rest problematic, just that, again, she has the right to do as she pleases with her kid and you will likely only progress in tearing down the relationship to address it.

 

Sorry, I'd LIKE to tell you to have the discussion and she'll step up and parent well, but that probably isnt' the case. Sorry.

[mysticamethyst]

That is a tough place to be in. I have no words that will help you just wanted to offer some :grouphug:. My sister in-law is like this with her children and its very hard to watch and hear about. Maybe its different when they are at home vs. when they are at grandmas house. Maybe she assumes because she is at home mom will do it for her. Just a thought.

[nono]

:grouphug:

 

I'm pretty certain my Mom would feel somewhat similarly as we have very opposite personalities. Difference is, I'm 45, and when she says things, I hear my Mom addressing me as an adult, not as a child. I don't think I heard the difference until my late 30s. ;)

 

The only advice I have is to do what you are doing, and talk with very emotionally neutral tone. In the first instance, where your gs ended up outside, perhaps a response along the lines of, "Oh, I don't know how he got out there. Who did you have watching him?" (definitely asked in a concerned, not sarcastic manner...) Then, I'd have also reminded my gs about house rules. After all, you are another authority figure, so I think you have the right to remind him. :)

 

On the second, maybe an, "Oh hon, I see your decompressing at the computer. I'll take him up and get him to bed." Try to do it without resenting the extra work. Easy on some days. Hard on others!

 

She may not have another place where she feels like she can go "off-duty." But even if that's so, she hasn't articulated that to you, and hence you are not sure why she is acting this way. Plus, because you are still raising a family, it is harder as you don't have your hands free to just pitch in and help! Again, :grouphug:

[katemary63]

I would have a devil of a time not going off on her. I have gone off on my adult kids for less. However, I agree that it may cause a rift and that wouldn't be worth it. What torture to have to watch your adult daughter be a neglectful mother.....I'm so sorry. I don't know of a book that will teach someone to care. You'd have to care first in order to be motivated to read the book......At this point I think about things like her faith. I really believe that only the workings of the Holy Spirit can move someone away from a life of self centeredness to self sacrifice. Are you/ is she a Christian? I would be on my knees for her daily and for the boy. :grouphug:

[Mom in High Heels]

JMO but it's her child and she can do (or not do) as she pleases. It would drive me absolutely batty, but....

 

The only situation I find very problematic is the one where he left the house. I know VERY few people who really think about leaving the room when they have a 4yo, but the child needs to have clear safe boundaries (go outside only when he's asked or has an adult to go with him).

 

Well, not that I don't consider the rest problematic, just that, again, she has the right to do as she pleases with her kid and you will likely only progress in tearing down the relationship to address it.

 

Sorry, I'd LIKE to tell you to have the discussion and she'll step up and parent well, but that probably isnt' the case. Sorry.

 

:iagree: When Indy was 4, I would never have thought to announce I was leaving the room so someone else could watch him. At 2, and maybe even 3, but not by 4, especially if there were other people in the room. If I were leaving the house, I would (and make sure it was okay that I left him), but not just to leave the room.

I would question how the child got out if he was at your house and make sure there was a lock that the he couldn't open out of his reach.

You may not agree with her parenting style, but he is her child, not yours. I really think the only thing you can do is set a good example. As long as the child is not in any danger, I think you should stay out of it.

[FaithManor]

I think that if you lecture her, it won't do any good and she'll just be angry and alienated.

 

That said, it is YOUR home and you don't have to put up with some of these irresponsible behaviors. So, make it clear that she needs to keep an eye on him because if there is another incident of wandering out into the road, which is a safety issue, then you will take action.

 

When she goes to leave the room, say loudly, "Who is watching X ? Are you expecting me to? I don't mind but you must ask because he's your child and I don't know what your plan is and how long you will be gone!"

 

Role model good parenting to her but always give her the option to make the right choice...."X is very tired and is going to be very cranky tomorrow if he doesn't get to bed soon. He is not my child so I can not make that decision for him. Do you want to put him to bed? I am going to be very busy tomorrow so I am afraid that I might not be available to help you with him if he is having a bad day? But, if you'd like him to go to sleep now, I don't mind tucking him in for you. He's such a sweety-pie!" Even if she says, "yes, please tuck him in"...she isn't doing it herself but you just put her in a position of making the right choice which is a step in the correct direction.

 

Try to approach it as asking questions in which it sounds like you are letting her take the lead and put it to her in such a way that there is clearly a good answer and a bad answer. But, if she chooses the bad route, make her own that decision and don't interfere. If she doesn't want X put to bed at a decent hour, lock the doors, and go to bed yourself. She must deal with him. I know that's scary...but you aren't going to get anywhere just taking over. Unless....her goal is to convince you that she is such a bad parent, that you offer to take him. I have seen that once within our extended family. My aunt is raising a grandson because her daughter felt overwhelmed with the three she already had (by three different men and never married...two were just one night stands). She kept coming to her mother's house for long visits, paying reasonable attention to the other three kids, and completely ignoring the last one until it was painfully obvious that she was hinting at something. My aunt asked her outright and her daughter asked to leave him with her. He's been there three years now. So, I suppose, maybe she has this on her mind.

 

I just don't think that a lecture will do anything except possibly get you cut-off from your grandson. If the neglect is boarding on or actually criminal, then when she gets home, you could call social services. If she cares about the child and is just immature, I DSS investigation might be the thing that makes her wake up. Our local DSS offers some very good parenting classes and usually in cases like this, the parents don't lose custody of the child on the first investigation as long as the child is not in imminent danger. Instead, they must complete the parenting classes which are three Saturdays of four hours and then there would be year of impromptu, weekly visits by the caseworker.

 

Faith

[CalicoKat]

Time to put a kybosh on her long visits, seriously.

 

Some kids never get over the "going home to ma so I can be a kid again."

 

Either that or you or your husband need to set some very clear expectations before they arrive. When you come for a visit you're not taking a vacation from parenting, cooking or cleaning. If you want that kind of a vacation you may need to go someplace else. Grandma's are for loving and spoiling the littles but we can't do that if we have to step in and parent.

 

I love my ma, and she gave this message my sibs and I simultaneously 4 years ago. It was rough. DH and I decided that both of us need to be there for a visit and the visit's need to be short. We tag team when we're there just like we do at home.

 

It's not a vacation and it's not relaxing. It's kind of nice though to go and know I don't have to feel badly about leaving in a couple days. I did feel a certain pressure to stick around for a whole week before and that was hard on my schedule too.

 

She does invite one kid over for a week visit now and then and it's a completely different thing.

 

The relationships has to evolve. Time for a new chapter.

[jld]

I wouldn't say anything and just keep helping the best I could. If you two got along better, I think you could talk to her, but you don't want to end up losing the relationship altogether.

 

Were you always as good a mom as you are now? Maybe your daughter will improve, too.

[TeenagerMom]

FWIW, this is just my opinion and the way that things work in our large extended family. When there are children around, EVERYONE watches and takes care of the children. If one of us sees a toddler getting into trouble, we take care of the problem. Someone needs a drink, then an adult (doesn't matter who) gets them a drink. To us, it's called taking care of our family regardless of which parent gave birth to which child.

 

I would not ask another adult to watch my child when I left the room. I would assume that the child would continue what they were doing and if they were getting into harm's way, that the adult in the room would take care of it.

 

As far as putting him to bed, you were already going up right? So was she even given the opportunity to finish what she was doing to take him up or did you jump right in and take him? I don't meet my children's demands the minute they ask. Sometimes they DO have to wait.

 

It sounds like your DD has a different parenting style than you do, but from the few examples you have given, it doesn't sound like she's a BAD parent either. Your way isn't always right and neither is her's. If you don't want to take care of your grandchild while he's there, then don't. But don't chastise her for not taking care of him the way YOU think he should be.

Edited July 12, 2010 by DrStix

[Guest Virginia Dawn]

Thank you for all the replies so far, they have given me a lot to think about. My daughter does have some immaturity and selfishness issues, but I know she loves her child. I also know that she feels like she is on vacation when she comes here.

 

I think I will try the suggestions about asking her to step up and make individual decisions as they arise, before I do anything myself.

 

The thing about leaving the room is that she is often gone for more than 15 minutes- she goes to the bedroom and reads or spends time on the computer. In other words she is not just going to the bathroom or attending to something, she is checking out.

 

They don't have a permanent home till August so they are spending time at SIL's parents and here. We were told that they would be "living" at SIL's parent's home for the summer, but it isn't turning out that way. They seem to be expecting to split their time between us. SIL's parents have no children at home, I have 5.

 

I will continue to keep my parenting lecture to myself....

[2squared]

I'm not trying to be snarky, but rather am genuinely curious. Why would a 4yo need to be directly supervised at all times? Does this 4yo have special needs or does your house have a lot of breakables/untouchables?

 

I wouldn't think twice about leaving any of my kids over 2yo without an assigned caretaker inside a house, particularly an environment they are familiar with.

[Denisemomof4]

this is a difficult situation. One one hand, I think she knows you'll step in and take care of things, so she's lazy about things in your presence. And by your stepping in to take care of things, you're enabling her.

 

On the other hand, how can you, as a grandmother, NOT step in and do what's in your grandchild's best interest???

 

The poor kid. Do you think she's like this with him at home? How sad.

 

In your house, can you clearly define the rules BEFORE they come?

[Rebecca VA]

I agree with FaithManor -- she needs to be reminded that the child is HERS and that she must ask if she wants help. She shouldn't be allowed to "veg out." She may be young, and she may be under stress, but she put herself into an adult position by getting pregnant, and she has to take responsibility for her little boy.

 

FaithManor's hypothetical questions are very gracious, because you're offering to help, but continuing to remind your daughter that the child is HER RESPONSIBILITY and not yours.

[Denisemomof4]

Thank you for all the replies so far, they have given me a lot to think about. My daughter does have some immaturity and selfishness issues, but I know she loves her child. I also know that she feels like she is on vacation when she comes here.

 

I think I will try the suggestions about asking her to step up and make individual decisions as they arise, before I do anything myself.

 

The thing about leaving the room is that she is often gone for more than 15 minutes- she goes to the bedroom and reads or spends time on the computer. In other words she is not just going to the bathroom or attending to something, she is checking out.

 

They don't have a permanent home till August so they are spending time at SIL's parents and here. We were told that they would be "living" at SIL's parent's home for the summer, but it isn't turning out that way. They seem to be expecting to split their time between us. SIL's parents have no children at home, I have 5.

 

I will continue to keep my parenting lecture to myself....

 

this changes things for me. I'd loving tell her you love it when they're in your home and you want them to keep coming, but that you need her to step up and take FULL responsibility for her child so that you can continue to focus on your own responsibilities. Let her know that you're more than willing to help, you just need her to ASK you so that you know you need to keep an eye on him.

 

Let her know that you expect her to supervise him at ALL times unless you've agreed on other arrangements. Just tell her that it makes you so nervous and you don't want him to get outside again.

 

She should have NO issues with this. It's tricky, I know. My oldest is now 18 and graduated high school so he thinks he's his own boss. WRONG. You're your own boss when you're not living under someone's roof. :glare:

[Wheres Toto]

FWIW, this is just my opinion and the way that things work in our large extended family. When there are children around, EVERYONE watches and takes care of the children. If one of us sees a toddler getting into trouble, we take care of the problem. Someone needs a drink, then an adult (doesn't matter who) gets them a drink. To us, it's called taking care of our family regardless of which parent gave birth to which child.

 

I would not ask another adult to watch my child when I left the room. I would assume that the child would continue what they were doing and if they were getting into harm's way, that the adult in the room would take care of it.

 

 

 

For the most part I agree with this. If there are adults in a room with my 4 year old I wouldn't think I needed to ask someone to keep an eye on him because he is mostly beyond the stage of needing someone to watch him constantly. I do think it's reasonable to expect that any adult who notices a child doing something dangerous would step in and stop it without having been asked to.

 

Is she used to a house being more "baby-proofed" so she's used to being able to be distracted? For example, at my house I never have to worry about kids wandering outside because the entry-way is gated off, the door is always locked and the lock is too high for them to reach. I do sometimes forget that I can't have the same comfort level at someone else's house.

 

I agree with a PP that it can often take a long time for a child to be able to accept guidance from a parent on their own parenting choices. I've only recently been able to accept my mother's "suggestions" without immediately feeling defensive and I'm almost 41 and on my second time around. Before I would often barely acknowledge the comments to avoid making waves so it probably appeared to my mother that I was just ignoring her.

[fairfarmhand]

"Sweetie while you are here at the house I need to know what you expect of me/us. Some parents get offended if you correct their child at all, while others expect family members to sort of pitch in and do a little parenting. What are your expectations of me? I just want you to know that I am tickled pink to have you and the grandson here, but we need to know where we stand so we don't have any misunderstandings. Here is what I am willing to do.... Here is what I am not willing to do....."

[Guest Virginia Dawn]

FWIW, this is just my opinion and the way that things work in our large extended family. When there are children around, EVERYONE watches and takes care of the children. If one of us sees a toddler getting into trouble, we take care of the problem. Someone needs a drink, then an adult (doesn't matter who) gets them a drink. To us, it's called taking care of our family regardless of which parent gave birth to which child.

 

I would not ask another adult to watch my child when I left the room. I would assume that the child would continue what they were doing and if they were getting into harm's way, that the adult in the room would take care of it.

 

As far as putting him to bed, you were already going up right? So was she even given the opportunity to finish what she was doing to take him up or did you jump right in and take him? I don't meet my children's demands the minute they ask. Sometimes they DO have to wait.

 

It sounds like your DD has a different parenting style than you do, but from the few examples you have given, it doesn't sound like she's a BAD parent either. Your way isn't always right and neither is her's. If you don't want to take care of your grandchild while he's there, then don't. But don't chastise her for not taking care of him the way YOU think he should be.

 

You have assumed a lot from this post. Suffice it to say that you do not have an accurate picture of what is happening. It would take me too long to explain, so I'll just leave it at that.

[Care]

I'm going to agree with Fairfarmhand. Her suggestion for pre-visit instruction from your daughter is going to likely be the best way to handle this without too much turbulence.

 

I have a WILDLY different parenting style from my mother. My mother believes that, at two, my son should have structured playtime, and that every moment he is awake, I should be entertaining him. This includes while I'm cooking and/or cleaning, and when I have to use the bathroom. Playpens, swings, and jolly jumpers are perfect child-monitoring and safety systems, to be used whenever necessary. She believes in bedtime at eight, and waking up with the birdies in the morning, just to do it all again.

 

I, on the other hand, think that some time for my son to explore his environment (and the freedom to do it) is a good thing. So, while we have time we play together, when I need to cook (particularly since our oven is so incredibly old that it gets as hot on the outside as it does on the inside and I have to gate myself in the kitchen to use it!), have to pee, or need to just decompress for a minute, he plays with his toys. I have made the house as safe for him as I can, and we both survive and thrive this way.

 

Visiting my mother, though... while she is willing to say I must be doing SOMETHING right, as my child is sweet, kind, and independent, she can never seem to FIND that something while we're there. I am more active in parenting at their house, knowing it is not as toddler-proof as my own. But my not actively supervising his every waking moment stresses her out. Her comment at the time was that SOMEONE needed to parent my child, as I obviously wasn't. I told her flat out she'd HAD her chance to raise kids, and I was raising mine, thanks, took my son and left. Why? A) Because my son doesn't need the toxicity that comes from two grown adults fuming at each other and trapped in the same house together, B) because I seriously needed to get away before I told my mother exactly where to get off, and C) I know myself well enough to know that staying would only make things worse. As we were visiting from out of the country at the time, there wasn't far to go, but we did have other plans for the day, so we kept them. After a while, when we'd both cooled off, we were able to have a discussion that boiled down to almost EXACTLY what Fairfarmhand proposed. Boy, would I have preferred to have that discussion BEFORE the screaming that I neglect my son because I do not feel the need to entertain him every moment.

[Lovedtodeath]

:grouphug:

 

I'm pretty certain my Mom would feel somewhat similarly as we have very opposite personalities. Difference is, I'm 45, and when she says things, I hear my Mom addressing me as an adult, not as a child. I don't think I heard the difference until my late 30s. ;)

 

The only advice I have is to do what you are doing, and talk with very emotionally neutral tone. In the first instance, where your gs ended up outside, perhaps a response along the lines of, "Oh, I don't know how he got out there. Who did you have watching him?" (definitely asked in a concerned, not sarcastic manner...) Then, I'd have also reminded my gs about house rules. After all, you are another authority figure, so I think you have the right to remind him. :)

 

On the second, maybe an, "Oh hon, I see your decompressing at the computer. I'll take him up and get him to bed." Try to do it without resenting the extra work. Easy on some days. Hard on others!

 

She may not have another place where she feels like she can go "off-duty." But even if that's so, she hasn't articulated that to you, and hence you are not sure why she is acting this way. Plus, because you are still raising a family, it is harder as you don't have your hands free to just pitch in and help! Again, :grouphug:

:iagree:

 

I am reading a parenting book from 100 years ago and it basically says to pick your battles. There is an example of a father telling his daughter to close the door. It was a frequent problem that it was left standing open, and when she was told to close it she just stood there, passively refusing. So the father said, "You don't want to close the door darling? Okay, I will take care of it." That comment reached her more than anything else.

 

When I read the OP I get the distinct feeling that #1 You are probably wrong. She is likely not a terrible parent and you just have different personalities. #2 Even if you are right, trying to say something about it will only make her angry and do no good.

[Ellie]

MYOB. When your grandson is with you, correct him.

 

She gets to be the parent, even if you think her parenting skills are lacking.

[TeenagerMom]

You have assumed a lot from this post. Suffice it to say that you do not have an accurate picture of what is happening. It would take me too long to explain, so I'll just leave it at that.

 

And I willingly concede that I am NOT in your situation therefore I don't know the whole story. I stated my thoughts from the examples that you specifically stated.

 

But it really could be a difference in parenting ideas. FWIW, my mother often thinks I'm insane/horrible/etc. because I allow my handicapped child to do things like play organized sports. Her stance? He could get hurt. My stance? His surgeon says he's fine to do it and he wants to play them.

If she parented him, he wouldn't be allowed to do any sports. I was also crazy because I breastfed and my children are for the most part Free Range (which is the way I was raised, she just seems to have forgotten that:confused:). BUT my mom is/was a fabulous mother to us. And I'm a good parent to my kids.

 

Now if she is really just being lazy & expects you to do everything, like I said, just don't do it. You don't have to have a talk with her about her parenting skills. Just don't pick up the slack so to speak. Don't put her son to bed, even if he asks. She can do it. I would only interfere unless he is being disruptive to your household or getting into danger. In those cases, I'd just say "Hey, would you come get so-and-so out of the (insert situation here)?" or "Your DS needs you to get him a drink," etc.

[Guest]

My honest opinion? This is silly. IMO, she should get to feel like she is on vacation when at your house. She should be able to leave the room for 15 minutes for a breather. It's silly to make her ask someone to watch her child when there are other people in the room when she leaves it. It's your grandchild... watch him! No biggie! If she left him in a room with other people, and he got outside, well it's the fault of the people that were in the room, IMO! I hope this doesn't sound harsh, I'm just giving my honest opinion.

 

I agree with the other poster who said if you were going up, anyway, you should have put your grandchild to bed, too. If you have young children, and need a break, she can return the favor a different time.

[EmilyK]

"Sweetie while you are here at the house I need to know what you expect of me/us. Some parents get offended if you correct their child at all, while others expect family members to sort of pitch in and do a little parenting. What are your expectations of me? I just want you to know that I am tickled pink to have you and the grandson here, but we need to know where we stand so we don't have any misunderstandings. Here is what I am willing to do.... Here is what I am not willing to do....."

 

I think this is good. I wouldn't do those indirect questions where you point out through your question what's going on that you think is wrong -- I had that going on with a family member (not over parenting) and I wished that she would come out and say her criticism, so that I could tell her (nicely) why I didn't feel it was her business.

 

I like raising the question directly and without rancor. She may expect that you help her. That may not be your expectation -- which is fine -- but it needs to be raised. When my parents or in laws were with me, and my kids were little and I felt overwhelmed, I think everyone's expectation was that part of the reason they were there (or we were visiting) was so that they could help me with the kids. Different dynamics in that they were in their 60s and weren't raising their own kids, and they were all so thrilled to have a grandchild/ren they wanted to help.

 

In our family it is expected that we adults stay out of each other's life decisions, and we wouldn't tear into each other in almost any situation. I can't think of a time there has been yelling, or even harsh words with my parents or inlaws. So for my parents or in laws to tear into me over a parenting issue would be very out of character (not meaning you OP, but sounds like that might be what happens in other families, and that's OK by me if it works for everyone). But family cultures are so different that it is hard to know what's right in this situation.

[Guest]

...Now if she is really just being lazy & expects you to do everything, like I said, just don't do it. You don't have to have a talk with her about her parenting skills. Just don't pick up the slack so to speak. Don't put her son to bed, even if he asks. She can do it. I would only interfere unless he is being disruptive to your household or getting into danger. In those cases, I'd just say "Hey, would you come get so-and-so out of the (insert situation here)?" or "Your DS needs you to get him a drink," etc.

 

I just don't understand grandparents not helping with this stuff. If she lived there, I would understand, but she is visiting for a week, tops, from the way it sounds, or am I mistaken? Why can't the grandparents enjoy the time with their grandchildren... putting then to bed seems like something most grandparents enjoy. I just don't get it. I just can't see my mom telling me to come get my kids a drink when she is standing right there. She would just happily do it. :confused:

[jld]

I would also try to find things to compliment (sincerely) my dd on if we didn't get along well. That appreciation could probably begin some healing in your relationship.

 

Really, an adult child doesn't need to be parented anymore, but treated like an adult friend, imo.

[secular_mom]

Sounds to me like she may be depressed. Sounds like she's assuming that your home is a safe place for them to be, and that she doesn't NEED to watch him 24/7. I wouldn't assume that she parents him this way at home. Maybe she is nervous about parenting in front of you, since you say you are basically polar opposites, so she just 'lets' you do what you feel is right since it's your home.

IMO, you need to decide what is most important to you.

1) You can have your say, and possibly cause very hard feelings.

2) You can just 'grand-parent' him when he's there, and be thankful that you get to spend the time with him.

3) You can ask her what's going on with her, is she feeling well, is she depressed, does she just feel overwhelmed, etc. in a concerned for HER way, not in a "You are a BAD mother" way.

4) Something else. :)

[Laurie4b]

You have assumed a lot from this post. Suffice it to say that you do not have an accurate picture of what is happening. It would take me too long to explain, so I'll just leave it at that.

 

Virginia,

 

I think the response of the pp whom you quoted is reasonable given what you wrote. Your answer to her sounds as if you're offended. Perhaps you're not, but it sounds that way. I thought her answer was reasonable and am not sure what was offensive in it myself.

 

If I'm wrong that you are offended here, I apologize. Such is the nature of internet communication. If you were offended, however, it doesn't really seem fair to not have time to write out everything and then get annoyed when someone takes the time in good faith to try to answer.

[Carrie12345]

Example: She assumes, when she leaves a room for any length of time, that whoever is in the room will be responsible for him, with out asking if anyone will. I found him wandering outside alone (we live on a busy street) and when I found him she only said, "how did he get out there?" Well, he just opened the door and walked out.

 

 

Example: He *asked* his mother if he could go to bed last night when I was putting my youngest to bed. She was on the computer and just said, "not right now?????" So, I got him ready for bed and took him up. She never seemed to even notice and said nothing about it.

 

* The example list could go on and on, but you get the picture.

 

Based solely on those examples, I don't really see a big problem with the picture. I leave my 3yo alone in a room without arranging for someone to

watch him, and he's fully capable of putting himself to bed *if need be*. Of course, a story and a cuddle is preferable if he can wait a few minutes.

 

It's obvious that the two of you have differing parenting styles, but that doesn't automatically make hers BAD or wrong. Walking out of the house is certainly a problem but, if it's a common one, I'd be more worried about the child's impulse control than an indication of bad parenting.

 

Still, you have every right to make rules in your own home. I'd focus on that, rather than judging her parenting.

[Barry Goldwater]

You are in a really challenging spot, so :grouphug: first.

 

I have a mom who had 3 boys...we have 4 girls...there was 27 years of pent-up GRANDMA TO GRANDDaughter LUVIN' unleashed.:scared: Most of it great, some of it...not so much...for example, Mom was/is an immaculate house keeper...DW and I, not so much...Mom lived in 'suburbia.' We live on a farm, with a 'stinky old barn (her words),' mud, dirt, manure. I wasn't allowed to do team sports when young (you might get hurt!). My girls have done outdoor/indoor soccer against boys, full contact karate, raised steer, goats, chickens, ridden horses at full gallop, ride the sickest rollercoasters, etc.

 

TO HER CREDIT, Grandma has gotten used to some of this, and recognizes that we only bring in experiences that they are ready for, and respects our parenting approach...but it was/is bumpy, and there have been days when my/DW's patience was severly tested...OT, but today my Mom qualifies as 'elderly,' so she gets A LOT more slack in this department now!

 

AS HARD AS I'M SURE IT IS FOR YOU, my thought is to hold back your opinion/advice/book buying and everything...she's not dumb. She'll know exactly what you are doing if you get her a book or even leave it laying around. She won't like it.

 

As far as the safety aspect (BTW, 3 of my DD could be 100% trusted to NOT run out the front door...DD#4, wow, not so much, she's a tough one!) maybe a very non-chalont, even keel request like, 'hey, if you need a break from watching the kid, just give me a quick heads-up, so I don't miss anything important.'

 

Good luck.

[kwickimom]

I think maybe you both might have different expectations or ideas of what is going on when she is at your house. When I visit my mom and dad (there are also my 3 sisters, 1 brother, gram, 2 aunts, and an uncle that live there) iti is for a break and we all just pitch in. If I am leaving for the day or want some peace and quiet for a big chunk of time, I ask someone specifically to watch my 3 kids, but other than that if someone sees a kid going outside, they go with or bring them in. It is never a given that I am watching them, or any one single person is for that matter LOL Ultimately my mom and dad are responsible for them and I am considered "on vacation"

 

Now that being said my family lives 5 hours away, doesnt get to see my kids a lot and they beg me to leave my kiddos for a week or two at a time. They all try and work it out where they are not working or doing many activities unless they can take the kids with. It is a big family and so it is easy on everyone because they switch off days or half days doing things with them. If it was just my mom and dad though, they would still take on the responsibility.

 

Maybe your daughter sees herself on vacation and assumes you will take care of your grandson. I am NOT saying that is right or anything, but maybe its an asusmption and your assumption is the opposite. My mom always tells me to just drop the kids off and go do what I want so I know my place is.

 

I know it has to be a dicey situtation since you say you two are opposites. In my family we just say whatever we want to say and no one takes offense. we are pretty open. If my sisters get sick of my kids they tell me they need a break. I think you will just either have to bite the bullet and take care of him while he is there and let your DD be lazy, or you will have to confront her and see how it goes. Maybe saying "I LOVE having you guys around, but I have other responisiblilties. I will take care of "grandkid" X days so that you can relax, but I wont be able to do it X days and you will need to watch him then"

 

Good luck. I hope you can find a middle ground!

[kathkath]

I don't think you should say anything negative. But how about watching for times when she IS responsible and does do the right thing--then praise her specifically for what she does in those situations. That can have a greater impact than not saying anything or lecturing her.

 

"I thought you did a good job doing X because Y."

Edited July 12, 2010 by kathkath
forgot the s in specifically

[OH_Homeschooler]

IME, no one likes unsolicited advice. Sorry, I don't think there is a way to give any without causing some tension. That doesn't mean you need to keep your mouth shut, but I do believe you need to be prepared for that eventuality.

[AHASRADA]

How old is your daughter? How long has she been on her own/out of the house/married/in her own place? I know the transition from child to adult can be long and confusing, as can becoming a parent to a young child. She is likely exhausted and overwhelmed with motherhood, as well as the chaos involved with not having her own place, everything in storage, etc. She likely sees staying with you as a chance for there to be a trusted adult to supervise her son so she can get some down time, coupled with the fact that you are her mom, in her childhood home, and it is so easy to revert to childish ways, especially if she hasn't been gone that long.

 

I think the idea of setting ground rules is important. If SIL's parents don't have any kids at home, and you have 5, they really should be spending most of their time there. Maybe she doesn't feel comfortable "checking out" to the same extent at their house, so she comes to yours for a break. If you are willing and able to provide her that break, wonderful. But, she needs to know your limits.

 

I don't know her personally, but I imagine that this is less of an issue of bad parenting, and more of a need/expectation on her part to "take a break" from her 24/7 role as mom while she's under your roof. If you don't help her to understand that you are also overwhelmed and need a break from your own 5 from time to time, not to mention adding her son, she won't know. Could you agree on days and times to exchange child care? You watch her son, and in exchange, she stays with her siblings so you can get out once in a while too? Just a thought.

[SonshineLearner]

I have to say, I understand your concern. To be honest, I'd just include the 4 year old in with your routine. Ok, see who can get in the restroom to brush your teeth.... to get upstairs for stories.... to go to bed.... etc. Sounds like a sweet boy, just no routines. My husband lets my 4 year old stay up way too late... but luckily.... we have olders to watch him till Daddy gets around to putting him to bed....

[Rosy]

"Sweetie while you are here at the house I need to know what you expect of me/us. Some parents get offended if you correct their child at all, while others expect family members to sort of pitch in and do a little parenting. What are your expectations of me? I just want you to know that I am tickled pink to have you and the grandson here, but we need to know where we stand so we don't have any misunderstandings. Here is what I am willing to do.... Here is what I am not willing to do....."

 

:iagree:

 

Also, keep in mind that it is REALLY hard to watch your kids at someone else's house. At my house, it's perfectly fine for my 4-year-old (who is now 5, lol) to play in the other room without me. At someone else's house, I have to make sure she's behaving according to someone else's standards and I don't feel like I can leave her unsupervised, but she might just need to play by herself for a little bit. Not to mention being at someone else's mercy for food, entertainment, etc...and when it's your parent, you tend to let them take the lead. I don't doubt (from what you've shared) that she might be being lazy/selfish (I have a SIL that stopped being a parent the second she walked in my MIL's house)....but it also might be nice for her to have a part of the house where she can relax and go about their normal way of life. In addition to the aforementioned talk, maybe you could give her a couple hours of the day where you're not there and they can have their own time?

 

I wouldn't give her the lecture, and I also wouldn't do everything for her. And if she can't care for him in a way that works for you, you shouldn't feel bad telling her she isn't welcome. Some boundaries would be good for all three of you, it seems.

[Lovedtodeath]

Sounds to me like she may be depressed. Sounds like she's assuming that your home is a safe place for them to be, and that she doesn't NEED to watch him 24/7. I wouldn't assume that she parents him this way at home. Maybe she is nervous about parenting in front of you, since you say you are basically polar opposites, so she just 'lets' you do what you feel is right since it's your home.

IMO, you need to decide what is most important to you.

1) You can have your say, and possibly cause very hard feelings.

2) You can just 'grand-parent' him when he's there, and be thankful that you get to spend the time with him.

3) You can ask her what's going on with her, is she feeling well, is she depressed, does she just feel overwhelmed, etc. in a concerned for HER way, not in a "You are a BAD mother" way.

4) Something else. :)

:iagree:

 

I must add that when I am at my mother's house she and my dad (who is handicapped) always do more parenting of my kids than I do. It just naturally happens that way and it is the only time I get a break. In addition, my mother is the type of person that cleans up dinner before you are done eating it and whisks away my drink when I am still thirsty, where as I am a person that needs a lot of time/ slow to move.

[hana]

I write this as someone who is in your exact.same.position as I write (one-week visit ends tomorrow). The best advice I ever received was from a minister who told me (about a different daughter), "Give only what you can give gladly." Since then, I've worked a lot on grace, which has perhaps expanded what I can give gladly, but the advice still fits on a regular basis.

For me, I could not "give" my space, time, and energy gladly during visits without setting up some boundaries. Here those boundaries are that either one actively parents or one accepts that all adults will parent as needed. (So if my daughter is actively engaged with her daughter and discipline or whatever needs to happen, it's her call. If she's on the computer, and something happens with her daughter, my response--whether it's the one my daughter would have chose or not--is the one that happens. Now that works with us, because they lived with us until six months ago. Only you can know what your boundaries are and what rules you might need to establish.

 

Good luck--I know it's a tough spot to be in!

[Impish]

I don't see how visiting family = break from parenting. How is that fair to the grandparents/extended family? You're already in their home, being provided with meals, etc, and then assume that *you* (general you) should also be provided with a break from parenting too?

 

Its one thing when its offered. Its a whole 'nother to assume that folks are there to serve you.

[Lolly]

Maybe I'm making too big a deal of this in my own mind?

 

*I don't want to be the interfering mother or mother-in-law that we all hear about often, but is it sometimes okay to interfere?

 

* Ugh.

 

I think you are feeling put out. You have plenty of work on your plate with your own kids. Adding in another may be too much for you to handle.

 

Is it okay to interfere? In some circumstances, yes. In all the examples you have given, no. I am not at your home, but from your examples, I really don't see where your dd is doing anything particularly wrong or harmful to her child. It simply is not done in your style or to your standards.

 

I'm one of those who goes home and grandma takes over with the kids. She volunteers to do everything with them when we are there. She delights in putting them to bed. She jumps when they want a drink. She gets in the floor and plays with them. She has told me that she wants me to be able to take a break from intense mothering while I am with her. Plus, she enjoys doing these things with/for her grandkids. I feel very comfortable with my kids in her home. I don't feel the need to watch over them like hawks. By the age of 3, there is no need to have constant in the room supervision at my home or my mother's home. (Mil's house was a different story!) Then again, my kids also knew better than to go outside without asking an adult.

 

Did I read that this dd is bouncing around staying with different family? If so, I would be very tempted to just say no or at the very least, limit the visit/s tremendously. I would also be considering telling dd that I would provide a place for them to live, an apartment not my home, for X amount of time. After that, dd has to find a way to provide for her family. If necessary, I would be helping her to find govt. assistance programs to get her out and on her own.

[Jen500]

MYOB. When your grandson is with you, correct him.

 

She gets to be the parent, even if you think her parenting skills are lacking.

 

:iagree:

Said gently, from your posts you sound a little...controlling. If you are really, really uncomfortable with something specific going on in your house, let her know, and try to come up with a solution that works for both of you.

[Guest Virginia Dawn]

Some more background:

 

We didn't invite them. We didn't plan for them. We are not on vacation. They call the day before they come, we always say,"sure, come on." They get here and they stop parenting, period. They do nothing but read and spend time on the computer, period. They do not pitch in, they do not help out. When grandson asks for something he is always put off. He often throws fits because of this.

 

He does need supervision. He is extremely active. He will act out when he is tired or hungry. He gets put in time out for this, but the original problem is still not addressed. He likes routine and structure. Our family is structure oriented, but not rigid by any means. DD and SIL have *no* routine at all. They do what ever they feel like, whenever they want. If they are not hungry, they don't think about feeding him till he has a melt down.

 

I never say anything about any of this. I just do my best to be positive and cheerful. Sometimes it just gets to me though. Why should a child have to beg his parent to play outside with him, or even to get him ready for bed? Why should I have to ask my daughter to give her own son some of her attention?

 

They will be here on and off all summer. They have not told us this, but they have told other people who told us . I am cooking and taking care of house for 9 people. I do not agree with letting them be on vacation from parenting while they are here. I am not unreasonable. Of course I do things for my grandson if I am available and he asks. But I am not always free to do everything, if I send him to his mother, and she does nothing, he throws a fit. I believe in parents doing the parenting and grandparents doing the grandparenting. There is a difference. I would never have taken advantage of my mother or assumed that she would do what I should be doing.

 

In other words, I feel as though I am the only adult here. My teenage boys work and do other things. Dh goes to work everday.

 

Clearly, I will have to find a way to work through these issues. I appreciate many of the comments, especially those that give specific ideas or dialog. Thanks

[Guest Virginia Dawn]

I don't see how visiting family = break from parenting. How is that fair to the grandparents/extended family? You're already in their home, being provided with meals, etc, and then assume that *you* (general you) should also be provided with a break from parenting too?

 

Its one thing when its offered. Its a whole 'nother to assume that folks are there to serve you.

 

Thank you.

[Guest Virginia Dawn]

.

Edited July 15, 2010 by Virginia Dawn

[Mom0012]

My honest opinion? This is silly. IMO, she should get to feel like she is on vacation when at your house. She should be able to leave the room for 15 minutes for a breather. It's silly to make her ask someone to watch her child when there are other people in the room when she leaves it. It's your grandchild... watch him! No biggie! If she left him in a room with other people, and he got outside, well it's the fault of the people that were in the room, IMO! I hope this doesn't sound harsh, I'm just giving my honest opinion.

 

I agree with the other poster who said if you were going up, anyway, you should have put your grandchild to bed, too. If you have young children, and need a break, she can return the favor a different time.

 

Oh gosh, I wasn't going to post until I read this. Really? An adult child enters the house with her child and she is suddenly entitled to a vacation while every other adult in the house is now responsible for her son? The OP has 5 children of her own, so I don't agree that she should now be responsible for one more just because her daughter has decided to visit. Now, if this were a once a year trip, I think that would be one thing. However, it sounds like this daughter is splitting her time between OPs house and OPs SIL for the summer.

 

When I visited my parents with young children, I always cared for them myself unless it was clear that a grandparent wanted to do something for them or unless I asked. I didn't just drop all responsibility at the door. Even now, with an 8 and 10 year old, if I want to run out to the store real quick with my mom, I always ask my dad if he would mind watching them. It's just common courtesy.

 

My sister on the other hand has just dumped her kids on me or my parents for years. I can remember finding her 1 year old baby climbing around in my car because she had left to chill out and didn't tell anyone (per usual). There were many adults in the room, but everyone assumed someone else was "in charge" of him.

 

And, no, a 4 year old doesn't need constant monitoring but they often do have lots of needs and wants that have to be attended to and can't always be trusted to make great decisions, especially in a house that is not their own where the rules may be different.

 

To me, it sounds like the OP wants to be grandma and does things to help, but that her daughter is not fulfilling her responsibilities. I would also wonder if this is something that just goes on when visting or if this is how she always cares for the child. Again, thinking of my sister, I know her behavior wasn't much different in her own home.

 

And to the OP, I know my own mother has been in the same situation many times. She does say something sometimes and my sister will step up, but it does make her angry. I know it only changes things temporarily because the same issues crop up again and agaiin. It certainly doesn't affect her parenting in her own home. So, I think I would only say something about the issues that are either really annoying to you or which you feel are a safety issue. Otherwise, I think you are probably going to have a lot of conflict with your daughter.

 

Lisa

Edited July 12, 2010 by LisaTheresa

[EmilyK]

Virginia Dawn, thanks for the longer explanation. It does sound like a really tough situation, and different from what I was initially imagining.

 

I hope this isn't upsetting to ask, but has your daughter or son-in-law shared what motivated them to become parents? From what you are sharing, it doesn't seem that they enjoy doing parenting tasks. (Not saying that I love all of them, but...) Did they enjoy it more previously?

[laundrycrisis]

ITA with this:

:iagree: When Indy was 4, I would never have thought to announce I was leaving the room so someone else could watch him. At 2, and maybe even 3, but not by 4, especially if there were other people in the room. If I were leaving the house, I would (and make sure it was okay that I left him), but not just to leave the room.

 

 

and this:

 

FWIW, this is just my opinion and the way that things work in our large extended family. When there are children around, EVERYONE watches and takes care of the children. If one of us sees a toddler getting into trouble, we take care of the problem. Someone needs a drink, then an adult (doesn't matter who) gets them a drink. To us, it's called taking care of our family regardless of which parent gave birth to which child.

 

I would not ask another adult to watch my child when I left the room. I would assume that the child would continue what they were doing and if they were getting into harm's way, that the adult in the room would take care of it.

 

IMO she is not "abdicating her responsibilities" unless she is also not participating in basic care such as making sure he is fed and dressed (in her own way, not yours); if that is what is happening, that is another level. Assuming she can leave the room without a formal hand-off to another adult who is in the room IMO isn't irresponsible.

However, if you do not feel comfortable sharing in the minute-to-minute responsibility for a child who is visiting your home, you should make that clear to her, so she will not assume it anymore. She may choose not to visit anymore, or not for as long. At least the terms of the visit would be clear.

 

Some more background:

 

We didn't invite them. We didn't plan for them. We are not on vacation. They call the day before they come, we always say,"sure, come on." They get here and they stop parenting, period. They do nothing but read and spend time on the computer, period. They do not pitch in, they do not help out. When grandson asks for something he is always put off. He often throws fits because of this.

 

It sounds like you feel you are being taken advantage of. I don't blame you. IMO it would be good to clear the air with what your expectations are when they are there, and setting some boundaries for the use of your home. There would not be anything wrong about you doing that.

Edited July 12, 2010 by laundrycrisis

[Lovedtodeath]

Some more background:

 

We didn't invite them. We didn't plan for them. We are not on vacation. They call the day before they come, we always say,"sure, come on." They get here and they stop parenting, period. They do nothing but read and spend time on the computer, period. They do not pitch in, they do not help out. When grandson asks for something he is always put off. He often throws fits because of this.

 

He does need supervision. He is extremely active. He will act out when he is tired or hungry. He gets put in time out for this, but the original problem is still not addressed. He likes routine and structure. Our family is structure oriented, but not rigid by any means. DD and SIL have *no* routine at all. They do what ever they feel like, whenever they want. If they are not hungry, they don't think about feeding him till he has a melt down.

 

I never say anything about any of this. I just do my best to be positive and cheerful. Sometimes it just gets to me though. Why should a child have to beg his parent to play outside with him, or even to get him ready for bed? Why should I have to ask my daughter to give her own son some of her attention?

 

They will be here on and off all summer. They have not told us this, but they have told other people who told us . I am cooking and taking care of house for 9 people. I do not agree with letting them be on vacation from parenting while they are here. I am not unreasonable. Of course I do things for my grandson if I am available and he asks. But I am not always free to do everything, if I send him to his mother, and she does nothing, he throws a fit. I believe in parents doing the parenting and grandparents doing the grandparenting. There is a difference. I would never have taken advantage of my mother or assumed that she would do what I should be doing.

 

In other words, I feel as though I am the only adult here. My teenage boys work and do other things. Dh goes to work everday.

 

Clearly, I will have to find a way to work through these issues. I appreciate many of the comments, especially those that give specific ideas or dialog. Thanks

That is tough. :grouphug: It sounds like she does need some guidance. She at least needs to realize that he is throwing a fit because of being hungry, or constantly ignored. I also don't think most of us realized that they are staying there, or the extent of the situation. Like I said, my mom takes over whether I want her to or not due to my "slowness". :tongue_smilie:

[Guest Virginia Dawn]

.

Edited July 15, 2010 by Virginia Dawn

[TeenagerMom]

She is married, they are temporarily without a home. They do not need govt. assistance. We have just enough money for our family to live frugally.

 

I don't understand why someone who is doing nothing needs a break, and I should giver her one but expect no break of my own?

 

 

Is there a particular reason that they are temporarily without a home? Are they in a position to rent a small apartment for the time being?