Boys with late birthdays (again)

[teachermom2834]

I know this issue has been discussed before.

 

Here's my situation. Ds was 9yo on May 3rd. He is in 4th grade right now. He is academically ahead, hard worker, good boy. Goes to co-op and while he does not have excessive behavior issues he does have some talking/ wiggly issues. Not a big deal but I would like to see better behavior :)

 

The age cut off here is Sept 15th. So, he is technically in the correct grade. What we have found, however, is that culturally very few boys with spring/ summer birthdays go when they are 5 yo. So he really is always the youngest in every group he is in. I see how this will come up later on as I watch my older boy with a spring birthday head into middle school type activities. They are athletes and the size/ physical maturity issue does matter. My older ds (a 11 yo 6th grader) is playing middle school baseball with boys who are pushing 15 yo. My older boy is fine in this situation but I know the younger boy does not need to be so far out of his age/ depth maturity wise or physically. I feel like he is at a disadvantage all the time because he is a year younger than most other boys his grade.

 

I made a mistake not waiting and starting him a year late. If he was in school I figure I would be stuck with that but I don't feel like I have to keep on that track while he is home and basically no one really knows or cares what grade he is in. I figure I will register him as a 4th grader again next year. We will continue to progress academically where he is. I figure that just gets him with his correct peer group when he does ultimately enter public school (likely 9th grade).

 

Am I missing anything here? Any problems I'm not foreseeing with my plan? Has anyone done something similar and regretted it?

 

BTW, we have talked to ds about it and he seems to understand and be OK with it. He isn't thrilled but doesn't seem like he much cares either way.

 

Marie

[sixglides]

We 'waited' with our son, who is now 17 & a junior. He has athletic friends who are his age, are a grade ahead & wish they had another year as their bodies are just catching up.

[johnandtinagilbert]

Makes perfect sense to me. I have several friends who waited, and I waited too for one ds and it was well worth it. Your reasons seem on the money. I didn't wait for another and ended up repeating many things b/c he was ready for some things, but not others. Wish I would have waited! As for grades, it hasn't mattered yet, but if I foresee a problem, I always have the option b/c of home schooling.

 

BTW I have a May 3 b-day too :)

[elegantlion]

Makes perfect sense to me. I have several friends who waited, and I waited too for one ds and it was well worth it. Your reasons seem on the money. I didn't wait for another and ended up repeating many things b/c he was ready for some things, but not others. Wish I would have waited! As for grades, it hasn't mattered yet, but if I foresee a problem, I always have the option b/c of home schooling.

 

BTW I have a May 3 b-day too :)

 

My birthday is May 3rd too, how funny.

 

My ds is an "old" 6th grader, he just turned 12. He turned 6 just after starting K. It was private school and we didn't have a choice, their cutoff was July.

 

Academically he is all over the board, physically he is smaller and gets in better with younger boys. In many respects I'm glad he is not considered a 7th grader.

 

I think if you are going to change his grade level it's better to do it now than wait.

 

My ds will be almost 19 when he heads to college and I'm hoping the extra year of maturity will be good for him.

[Only me]

I think it is a good idea. My son has a March 31st birthday. Last summer he was the youngest on his baseball team. He just turned 11 and was playing with kids turning 12 and 13. He did fine with it but he is smaller then most of the kids. Here the cutoff for baseball is the end of April. He does really well but I'm wondering if it will be tougher in the next few years because some of his teammates are getting really big. My ds is still only 80 pounds and less then 5 feet tall. He plays with kids that are almost the size of an adult.

 

My dd has a late July birthday. She is bright but has always been a little shy. She has definitely come out of her shell over the last year or two but at times she seems much younger then a lot of the girls in her class. She is a senior and will be 17 when she graduates. A lot of the girls she knows will be almost 19 when they graduate. Sometimes I think that being one of the oldest in class would have its advantage. Many of the older kids seem to have more self confidence. She is also tiny (90 pounds) so many people think she is a freshman. She was quite ready academically to start kindergarten when she just turned 5 but I often wish that I had started her a year later.

[Ellie]

I know this issue has been discussed before.

 

Here's my situation. Ds was 9yo on May 3rd. He is in 4th grade right now. He is academically ahead, hard worker, good boy. Goes to co-op and while he does not have excessive behavior issues he does have some talking/ wiggly issues. Not a big deal but I would like to see better behavior :)

 

The age cut off here is Sept 15th. So, he is technically in the correct grade. What we have found, however, is that culturally very few boys with spring/ summer birthdays go when they are 5 yo. So he really is always the youngest in every group he is in. I see how this will come up later on as I watch my older boy with a spring birthday head into middle school type activities. They are athletes and the size/ physical maturity issue does matter. My older ds (a 11 yo 6th grader) is playing middle school baseball with boys who are pushing 15 yo. My older boy is fine in this situation but I know the younger boy does not need to be so far out of his age/ depth maturity wise or physically. I feel like he is at a disadvantage all the time because he is a year younger than most other boys his grade.

 

I made a mistake not waiting and starting him a year late. If he was in school I figure I would be stuck with that but I don't feel like I have to keep on that track while he is home and basically no one really knows or cares what grade he is in. I figure I will register him as a 4th grader again next year. We will continue to progress academically where he is. I figure that just gets him with his correct peer group when he does ultimately enter public school (likely 9th grade).

 

Am I missing anything here? Any problems I'm not foreseeing with my plan? Has anyone done something similar and regretted it?

 

BTW, we have talked to ds about it and he seems to understand and be OK with it. He isn't thrilled but doesn't seem like he much cares either way.

 

Marie

I wouldn't worry about it. May is *NOT* a "late birthday," I don't care what the other boys' birthdays are. You did NOT make an error by not starting him a year later. Under no circumstances can I imagine holding him back a year. No way, José. In a few years he'll have "caught up," whatever you think that means, and then we'll be having the opposite conversation: how to skip him a year to where he should have been all along.

 

DON'T DO IT.

 

Mr. Ellie's birthday is in September, and he grew up in a state where the cut-off was Dec. 2. I would consider September a "late" birthday, not May. Mine is July, and I grew up in a state where the cut-off is September 1--definitely a "late" birthday. No problems for me (and I'm not convinced that it was because of being a girl and therefore more mature).

 

You're right: you're homeschooling and grade level doesn't matter. So why mess with it? Your ds is fine. He'll be fine when he reaches high school age. Let it go.

[angela in ohio]

I posted a question about this a few months back. We ultimately decided that we will hold ds back. His birthday is June 29. He will be going off to high school (and possibly junior high at a private school in the area,) so we were most concerned about the social aspects of it. My mother held my brother (Aug. 2) back, and she said it was the best decision she ever made. I also know two families locally with really smart dc (one boy, one girl) who have each held back a summer birthday, which helped ease my mind about "appearances." Because we homeschool, his "official" grade and the work he does won't necessarily correspond anyway, so I can call him this grade, and then we'll do whatever is a fit.

Edited October 15, 2009 by angela in ohio

[EKS]

DON'T DO IT.

 

 

 

I completely agree with this.

 

If he is academically ahead there is absolutely no reason to hold him back. If when he gets to high school and wants to play on a sports team, *he* can decide at that point if he wants to enter 9th grade a year later.

[hsmom3tn]

My DS has a Sept. b'day, very close to the cut-off. I started him in K shortly before his 5th b'day. I didn't realize that the law here says they have to be in school by age of 6, so I could have waited another year. I was truly ignorant of the laws and homeschooling, but knew that I didn't want to send him to PS. A friend of mine told me it was time to register him for school, so I called the BOE and they told me what forms to fill out and send in so that he would be registered as a homeschooler, but they also never told me that he didn't have to start yet.

 

My DS did 5th grade in the 2007-2008 school year. He was struggling with math, grammar, writing, and IMO not mature enough to go into the 6th grade. When my DH and I separated, I had to consider the fact that my kids might have to go to public school. I knew he was not ready for middle school, so I held him back for another year of 5th grade.

 

He wasn't happy about it at the time, but he soon got over it. He is now in the same grade as all of his friends that are the same age. He still struggled a bit in math during that second year of 5th grade, but overall his academics greatly improved. I also noticed a huge change in his personality over the summer before starting 6th grade this year. I am so glad that I held him back. I still hope not to ever have to put them in public school; but if necessary, I think he would be just fine in middle school now.

[Carrie12345]

Maybe I can't fully relate because my kids aren't very sports oriented, but they do have 2 birthdays in May, 1 in July and 1 in August. Their size has no bearing on their brains/academic ability. School (home or other) is about academics. I personally cannot imagine basing their registered grade level on their physical size.

 

For the record, I have 2 smallish children and 2 average sized children - a boy and girl each!

[SonshineLearner]

Just stick with the age that he is... Isn't that the beauty of homeschooling? But, with testing and such... that's where I am stuck; my son's bd is July3. So, although I stick him with 1st grade...when I register him... I think I'll register him in the lowest grade available. I'm looking at the options though...if I put him back in school... I wouldn't want to have him as an 18yr old Senior!

On another note, I have seen this... with our co-op... I've heard too much of the "I'm holding my child back... a year...." So, next year, I'm just putting ages and no grades. After all, if I don't.... I'll have a really bent out of shape 1st grade.... I mean... if it's because of not wanting to hold the bar up to grade level... my son would be behind... He's a wiggle squiggly little boy:-)

Carrie:-)

[Tree House Academy]

I WISH I had started my older son in school when he was 6 and NOT 3 days after he turned 5 (Aug birthday). He is now in 5th grade, but emotionally and physically, he is much more like a 4th grader. It would be tough for him in ps. Here at home, we are just working on his level in various subjects. If he were to go back to ps, though, I am not sure what I would do.

[lgm]

Redshirting is common here too. Whether it is advisable depends on the student, the sport and how well the academics meet the child's instructional needs.

 

It also depends on the cohort he's joining. How widespread is redshirting? Are the majority of the youngest held back, or are they going on time? Puberty has a wide age range. Emotional and social development varies widely too.

 

Most varsity athletes here are coming from significant travel league or private club experience -- and travel leagues/some clubs are age based, not grade based. Most redshirted 8th graders that have developed their athletic talent are playing up, on the JV or the V depending on the sport and where they are in puberty plus emotionally. There is not a big advantage in holding back academically if the student is going to play up.

 

The people I know that regret redshirting are those whose children did not make the cuts once high school started. The students usually aren't challenged significantly by their coursework, and the effort they have put into sports now has to be redirected for something else that will give them a way to stand out in college admissions.

 

For the record, I started one of mine as oldest. School decided they couldn't meet his academic needs and asked to grade skip. We did it. He looked young in some grades, but once puberty kicked in, he fit just fine. His sport is age based club, so the grade doesn't matter. And he could care less whether he plays for the varsity team in 8th grade or continues with his club...the coaches don't vary that significantly in their ability to develop an athlete and he doesn't care to socialize with 10-12th graders. Since we aren't aiming for the Olympics, this situation is fine.

Edited October 15, 2009 by lgm

[teachermom2834]

I don't think it would be an issue if the majority of parents went with the age cutoff. He wouldn't seem so immature if there were other boys his age. He is typical for the other boys his age BUT the other boys his age are the next grade behind. So a typical 9 yo boy is immature for 4th grade because all the other 9 yo boys are in 3rd grade!

 

It's been an ongoing frustration. Now, my older ds (with the same birthday) is very mature and really could skip a grade and be fine. It has been very difficult to see that ds #2 is not the same.

 

I really wish the other parents just followed the cut off date. But they don't. So holding him back a year does not make him a year older than his classmates. It actually is just placing him with his age mates and not with all a year older than him.

 

I know it sounds foolish that sports would have anything to do with this. I would have felt the same way 10 years ago. Now I have kids that are athletic and competitive and it is a big part of who they are. It does make a difference when you try out for a ball team that you are just turned 11 against boys that just turned 14. It does make a difference when you are 11 and hanging out in the dugout with 14 year olds. An extra year there would close the gap a little and get him with his age mates.

 

Thank you for the opinions. I have been wrestling with this for many years now and have been resistant to holding him back that year. I just am growing weary of him having to be the youngest in every situation. He's a good kid and does fine but maybe it doesn't have to be so hard. I feel like he's always got the deck stacked against him and I'm just not sure it has to be that way all the time or where the advantage is to keep pushing him with the older kids.

 

Marie

[athena1277]

:lurk5:

 

Red-shirting is such a hard choice. We will have to make it in a few years as ds has a summer birthday.

 

I always think about dh and myself. We both had late birthdays and were red-shirted before K (we both went to ps). In my situation, I think it was a good thing as I did well in school and think I would have struggled if I had not been held back. Dh, on the other hand, was basically bored in school. He's also the type who can listed to what the teacher says and ace the test with no studying. Everything was so easy that he never "learned how to learn". He never had to work for it, so when things would get hard, he didn't know what to do.

 

Granted, if we hs all the way through as we plan to, our kids will be challeneged and I have made it a goal to teach them skills to learn, whether they are in a classroom or not. But still it's a tough call to start ds at 5 or 6.

 

To the original poster, I would recommend continuing to teach him at his level, and decide what grade to put him in if/when he begins ps. Making him repeat stuff he already knows sounds like a waste of a year.

[SilverMoon]

I completely agree with this.

 

If he is academically ahead there is absolutely no reason to hold him back. If when he gets to high school and wants to play on a sports team, *he* can decide at that point if he wants to enter 9th grade a year later.

 

This is what I'd do if it were my boys, who are "a year ahead" because of a birthday that's past the kindy cut-off. To me it seems like it would be easier on the boy, and more simple to arrange, to remember to keep the option of knocking one down a grade available, should the need arise. Changing it up at this point, just in case it's needed in the future, would insult both of my boys.

 

My boys both started kindy just before turning five. For all intents and purposes they were kindy kids that year. Academically they were both ahead of their same age peers as it was. We haven't once regretted it.

 

Granted my oldest isn't much for sports, so I have no experience with that. Socially he holds his own quite well. He is the shortest in his social circles, but dropping him a year wouldn't fix that. His growth was stunted as a young child, unfortunately he's used to being the shortest. His good friends are quick to cover his back if it comes up though. And, well, dynamite comes in small packages. :)

 

For every "glad I kept him back a year" story there's another "I wish I hadn't" story, in my experience. It really is a personal matter. I was held back as a kid because of an October birthday. Being the oldest in class was no picnic and brought it's own set of challenges.

[teachermom2834]

For those who think holding him back a year is a bad idea, what are your specific concerns?

 

Academically we will keep progressing as long as we are at home. When he enters public high school he will be placed academically where he needs to be. Our public high school has a large number of advanced placement opportunities. Honestly, I suspect he'd test into all of these regardless. If we don't hold him back a year and they bump him ahead academically then he is even more than one year younger than classmates. Socially, I don't think this kid would thrive on that. I can't see that keeping him back would stunt him academically. If anything the extra maturity would make him better equipped to handle rigourous courses. Maybe??

 

My concern really comes in that senior year. He will be 18yo his entire senior year. That seems old to me. Like he might be really restless, etc. being an 18 yo senior. Again, all his classmates will be. Is it better for him to be an 18 yo senior or to be just 17 hanging around with a bunch of restless 18 year old seniors???

 

Then again, I am willing to homeschool high school/ do dual enrollment/ get him graduated early if he ends up being ready for college at 18.

 

I feel like I just can't squeeze a square peg in a round hole here.

[Jugglin'5]

I have "redshirted" both of my summer birthdays, who happen to both be girls. I have no regrets so far. My oldest has always gravitated to younger rather than older friends, and was academically gifted but rather socially immature. Now that she is a high schooler, her confidence levels have skyrocketed. I still think it will be better for her to graduate at 18 rather than 17, so I don't plan to move her back up a grade at this point. It certainly hasn't hurt her sports, either, especially since she got a late start.

 

With my younger child I am taking a wait and see approach. She has a July birthday, and most of her closest friends are September- November. So she could be the youngest 4th grader, away from her friends in activities, or she could be an older 3rd grader with her friends. If she wants to graduate at 17 rather than 18 we'll see. She is more socially mature than her older sister was at that age. We'll re-evaluate when she gets to be an 8th grader.

 

If I had summer birthday boys who played sports and weren't naturally huge, and redshirting was common in my area, it would be a no-brainer for me. Another year of maturity is not a bad thing before college, and it is just that much more time you get with them before they are gone.

[Carrie12345]

For those who think holding him back a year is a bad idea, what are your specific concerns?

 

Academically we will keep progressing as long as we are at home. When he enters public high school he will be placed academically where he needs to be. Our public high school has a large number of advanced placement opportunities. Honestly, I suspect he'd test into all of these regardless. If we don't hold him back a year and they bump him ahead academically then he is even more than one year younger than classmates. Socially, I don't think this kid would thrive on that. I can't see that keeping him back would stunt him academically. If anything the extra maturity would make him better equipped to handle rigourous courses. Maybe??

 

My concern really comes in that senior year. He will be 18yo his entire senior year. That seems old to me. Like he might be really restless, etc. being an 18 yo senior. Again, all his classmates will be. Is it better for him to be an 18 yo senior or to be just 17 hanging around with a bunch of restless 18 year old seniors???

 

Then again, I am willing to homeschool high school/ do dual enrollment/ get him graduated early if he ends up being ready for college at 18.

 

I feel like I just can't squeeze a square peg in a round hole here.

 

If your local high school really will place him in an academically appropriate schedule, then maybe there isn't much to worry about.

 

*I* don't have that much faith in my local high school. ;)

Also, my goal is to homeschool all the way through, so future placement isn't something I give much thought to.

 

One thing that probably merits some consideration could be the fact that the advanced placement opportunities you mention will probably be filled with older kids anyway, no?

 

My oldest would be 17 for his entire senior year if we went by the cut off dates. 16 (or younger :001_huh:) if he were placed "appropriately". Personally, I don't think either of those scenarios would be good for HIM in a public school, which is why I'm glad he's home.

 

Thinking about keeping him in high school until he's 18 kind of makes me twitch, lol. Unless he hits a wall between now and then, he's completely capable of earning an associate's degree at 19. I don't intend to push him into doing so, but I'd hate to take that opportunity away now, while he's still so young and the future is still so unpredictable.

[teachermom2834]

I'm just trying to forsee the future scenarios here. If they bump him up a year in some things academically at the high school (as I suspect will happen regardless) he will then not only be one year younger than most kids but two years younger than most. I don't think I'd like that as he is socially immature and more of a follower by nature.

 

I do not know what the future holds. He will likely play sports. He will likely go to high school. He will likely remain academically strong. He will likely retain his quirky personality :) I can't know how all that is going to play out EXACTLY but I am trying to best prepare him for however things roll.

 

I feel like the decision needs to be made sooner rather than later. Sixth grade is a big year for middle school activities (some of which homeschoolers have access to). I would not hold him back in 8th when his teammates etc. are going on to the high school. Right now only about six people even know what grade he is in so I don't have a social stigma thing going on. By 8th grade it will be obvious to the whole town that he is "failing" 8th grade. I'm not willing to go there. Once he starts 6th grade I'm going to stick with where he is as long as he is in the school system. If he ends up not going to public high school I feel like I can adjust my plan according to his needs.

 

For better or worse, I think proper placement in public high school is not only academic. Sad, but true, in my opinion.

 

I'm 95% comfortable with keeping him back. It has been a very hard decision and I really appreciate everything everyone has given me to think about.

 

Thanks,

Marie

[DarlaS]

Thinking about keeping him in high school until he's 18 kind of makes me twitch, lol. Unless he hits a wall between now and then, he's completely capable of earning an associate's degree at 19. I don't intend to push him into doing so, but I'd hate to take that opportunity away now, while he's still so young and the future is still so unpredictable.

 

I was an 18 yo senior (Oct. birthday) and remembering those days makes me twitch! It was an election year, and I remember getting out of school and going to vote! :D

 

I was SO SO SO sick of school. I had gone to pre-k (already reading), taken a year off, and started kindy right before turning 6.

 

It doesn't have to be an irreversible decision though does it? Or one that is made right now?

[Dobela]

I say don't hold him back just because of sports. My son was 9 on May 11th, and we held him back a couple of years ago. On paper anyway. He will say he is 4th but on paper we have him as 3rd. But he had other issues including academic troubles. For a lot of boys I do say hold them back (I am a former teacher as well), but not all boys need holding back.

 

Yes, he may be the smallest/youngest but why punish him more just because of that? You are sending him a message that size and sports are more important than just being himself. Odds are he will be just fine.

 

You should do a study on retention of students. I know the studies were done in public schools, but the emotional repercussions are huge for children held back. If you hold him back now, and he is advanced grade wise, what are your academic plans for the future? Say he finishes high school early- will you make him repeat courses until he reaches a magical age??

[teachermom2834]

I suspect that it will be difficult to reverse the decision if he is in school. I do feel like if I really need to reverse the decision I could do that by bringing him home and having an alternative plan (dual enrollment/ early graduation, etc.)

 

If he's in school I'm not going to be able to get him out early, I don't think. Then again, if school was working for him I wouldn't need to get him out early.

 

I do feel like I need to make the decision in the next year because he will be in more grade determined activities with public schoolers.

 

Honestly, he doesn't really "fit" perfectly into either grade. I need to figure out which direction is better if you're going to be out of step either way :)

 

If I knew he would never end up in school it wouldn't be an issue. I just can't say that will never happen.

[Beth in Central TX]

I have a May 3rd birthday too!

[teachermom2834]

I just want to clarify.

 

We will NOT repeat work he has mastered. We have talked about it and he knows it is not academic and he doesn't feel stupid or anything. We are academically oriented and I would never have him repeat coursework just to be better at sports. We will keep going academically (we don't pay any attention to grade levels anyways).

 

I really is all about social fit/ confidence/ maturity. It is about placing him with his age mates for social and developmental reasons. I always figured we would provide for him academically as we always have. The public school does place kids out of grade level in appropriate courses when necessary. It is about what class we would put him with if he enters school. Kids a year older than him in class is not a big deal. To me, going to high school where activities are not age segregated means you end up being on teams, etc. with kids in upper classes. The age gap just grows and grows. He would be a 14 yo Freshman thrown in with 16 yo sophomores. I just think that is socially a little dicey for this particular child (though not for my older ds). I do see both sides of it.

[cougarmom4]

This has always been a topic that bugs me a little bit. I have two ds who have been academically advanced...but with late summer birthdays. I still put them in kdg that fall. They were both still far ahead of many of their peers. I cannot imagine having them wait a year. I have had several close friends who chose to hold theirs back a year...for sports reasons. That just bugs me to no end. One said it was because her son was 'immature,' and I said, of course he is...he's 5...they are all immature...to which she responded, well, my husband thinks it will be better for him in sports if he's bigger than everyone.

 

I'm not sure when the 'trend' to hold kids back started. But it seems to me that this is the problem...and the 'playing field' will never be fair because of it. I realize there are times when holding a child back are important & would be best for the child...but I am opposed to those who do so based on maturity or size for sports. Don't mean to offend, simply stating my opinion. :D

 

HOWEVER, having said that, I am experiencing the effects of this trend....we are now at a point where ds12 is playing football with other '7th graders' and most of them are 13, a few even 14. So it has become an issue...as ds12 is not the most physically gifted in the world as it is (not that I tell him that...he has a lot of passion & desire to be good, but not a lot of natural ability, iykwm)...but adding to that that he is one of the smallest & youngest doesn't help matters much. Just the other day I helped him make this connection--had him imagine he was playing with the 6th graders--and he was like, wow...I'd be pretty good, wouldn't I?

 

So for the first time, I started wondering...hmm...how would things have been different if we had held him back a year. He might have been the first string quarterback rather than the 2nd string qb sitting on the bench. He also might have been bored out of his mind sitting through the letter of the week when he could already read chapter books. I guess it all depends on the individual child--as they will learn life's lessons regardless of which route they take.

 

As I mentioned, our biggest reason for not holding the boys back was because they were academically ahead. But our perspective on age at graduation also played into our decision. Our boys will be going off on two-year missions for our church when they turn 19...if we held them back, they'd leave shortly after graduation--seriously like 2 months later. If they graduated at 17 & soon turned 18, they'd be able to get in a year of college & working to save money before they left---and we feel that is a crucial year to grow up a little bit before going off to Taiwan or Brazil as a missionary. (By grow up, I mean experience living away from Mom & Dad when they can come home every weekend if needed...and they learn to be a little more self-reliant while we are still reasonably close--as compared to half-way around the world!).

 

Good luck in your decision-making process. I agree that one of the benefits to homeschooling is you are able to teach them at whatever level they are on and not be so defined by the grade level. And I can really see why you would be considering the grade level change. I'm not sure what I'd do if I were in your situation! There are so many factors to consider here...and I suspect the answer will be different for each child...so take all of these opinions, consider the ideas that apply to your situation, and you'll know what would work best for your family.

[Tidbits of Learning]

I don't think it would be an issue if the majority of parents went with the age cutoff. He wouldn't seem so immature if there were other boys his age. He is typical for the other boys his age BUT the other boys his age are the next grade behind. So a typical 9 yo boy is immature for 4th grade because all the other 9 yo boys are in 3rd grade!

 

It's been an ongoing frustration. Now, my older ds (with the same birthday) is very mature and really could skip a grade and be fine. It has been very difficult to see that ds #2 is not the same.

 

I really wish the other parents just followed the cut off date. But they don't. So holding him back a year does not make him a year older than his classmates. It actually is just placing him with his age mates and not with all a year older than him.

 

I know it sounds foolish that sports would have anything to do with this. I would have felt the same way 10 years ago. Now I have kids that are athletic and competitive and it is a big part of who they are. It does make a difference when you try out for a ball team that you are just turned 11 against boys that just turned 14. It does make a difference when you are 11 and hanging out in the dugout with 14 year olds. An extra year there would close the gap a little and get him with his age mates.

 

Thank you for the opinions. I have been wrestling with this for many years now and have been resistant to holding him back that year. I just am growing weary of him having to be the youngest in every situation. He's a good kid and does fine but maybe it doesn't have to be so hard. I feel like he's always got the deck stacked against him and I'm just not sure it has to be that way all the time or where the advantage is to keep pushing him with the older kids.

 

Marie

 

Yep, redshirting is a big problem here. There are kindergarteners that are 7. The first graders are 7 turning 8. The 2nd graders are 8 turning 9. The 3rd graders are 9 turning 10. When my girls and son were in public school, they were the smallest and youngest b/c I had started them in school when they were supposed to start.

My small for their age kids do have a rough time in these situations. In fact, one of the reasons we began homeschooling is because my dd9 was picked on and called munchkin and midget by her classmates and shoved around by almost 10 year old boys in 3rd grade when she was 8. Some of the kids in an elementary school that only went to 3rd grade were as big as me (5'6").

My ds 6.5 was 6 in kindergarten b/c of Dec. b-day and they wanted me to hold him back b/c of immaturity. I brought him home instead. There were a lot of 7 year old kindergarten boys who were academically ready for 1st grade being held back in kindergarten. It was insane. So I know by middle school my ds would have the cards stacked against him sports wise with kids that are 2 yrs. older than him. He is only in the 12th percentile height and weight.

Field day was horrible. My children were competing against kids almost 2 years older than them. It was awful and they had no chance of even placing. It was depressing and it really hurt their self-esteem.

I would definitely use a grade lower for sports and co-op when I can or in situations where it would benefit my child.

[hsmom3tn]

I can see how it would be an upsetting or frustrating for children to compete with other children who have an advantage because they are bigger, or to be bullied by children that are bigger; but, children develop differently and at different rates, so that could happen even with children that are the same age.

 

What about the children who academically are not ready to be promoted to the next grade? Should they be promoted anyway just so that they won't be bigger than the other kids in their class?

[teachermom2834]

I would suggest nothing along the lines of promoting a child based on size.

 

Sure, there will always be variations in development. That is why there is often a good reason for someone to be held back. There will always be kids that will be exceptionally big or small.

 

I think what gets very frustrating is when redshirting has become so culturally expected in some areas that a child with a spring or summer birthday attends the "correct" grade they are saddled with the baggage of being younger as though they had "skipped" a grade. At least a child who skipped a grade would have been evaluated and deemed academically/ developmentally ready for the skip. When 90% of the population is redshirting you end up with "average" kids effectively skipping ahead. Academically, maybe not, but I really believe that there is more to successful placement in public school than academics. I wish that wasn't the case.

 

Okay- I've gotten off topic now. I really was just looking for any extra insight (and I've gotten some good stuff :). I didn't intend to vent against redshirting as I have been for years now. It looks as though I'm going to be in that camp myself. If you can't beat 'em , join 'em. I guess that's what I'm coming to. So not my personality! Not sure I need to sacrifice up my dear sweet middle child to make a statement.

 

Just trying to do what is best for him.

[hsmom3tn]

I remember when I was trying to make the decision about my DS. I had many people telling me to do it and probably just as many telling me not to do it. It was a tough decision.

 

Think long and hard, pray if you pray, and you'll make the decision that's best for your child. :001_smile:

[FairProspects]

Sorry, but a big part of our decision to redshirt ds (well maybe not so applicable since we homeschool) is because of the increasingly inappropriate expectations placed on children in our school district. First grade curriculum is now kindergarten curriculum. All the play kitchens & art supplies have been removed from the classrooms and recess is given only twice a week.

 

I have nothing against academics, but not every child (and certainly not ds) is ready for three uninterrupted hours of seat work everyday starting at age 5 so that they can pass a state test when they reach 4th grade. If schools and everyone else want us to stop redshirting, then they need to make their expectations a little more age appropriate. Taking upper level curriculum and shoving it down a few levels does not improve the quality of education, or a rigorous education make!

 

Given the way the schools are, it is no wonder that parents would want to give their kids an extra year of experience & maturity before having to face all that pressure!!

[Ellie]

I completely agree with this.

TYVM.:001_smile:

 

If he is academically ahead there is absolutely no reason to hold him back. If when he gets to high school and wants to play on a sports team, *he* can decide at that point if he wants to enter 9th grade a year later.

OTOH, I don't understand this at all. He'd be graduating a full year behind other students *his age* just because he wants to be a year older than the other students, so that he can play sports??? I don't get it, especially because he does NOT have a "late" birthday.:001_huh:

[teachermom2834]

Okay-

 

He WILL NOT be a year older than his classmates. We know many, many boys his age. ALL of them are 3rd grade, not 4th. Keeping him back a year will get him with his age mates instead of kids a year older than him.

 

What I didn't understand (and still don't like) is that nearly everyone in this area redshirts. So he is not staying back to be a year older than classmates to have an advantage at sports. He would be staying back to be with the rest of the town that redshirted. By being in the correct grade (legally, technically, whatever) he is actually a year younger than the other boys. Now for ds #1 this is no issue whatsover. But for this particular child being the youngest/ smallest/ least mature does not feel right. He would not be older than all his classmates if he stays back. He will be the same age. He is the only boy in his 4th grade church class that is not 10. For this particular child I feel like I am setting him up for frustration by asking him to skip a grade age wise.

 

I really am just frustrated by the whole thing. I think 4th grade would be fine for him but not when it is populated by kids that should have been 5th grade.

 

Thanks for everything. I actually agree with both sides.

 

Marie

[SweetPea]

and I went to kindergarten in 1977.....

 

Most of the boys in my graduating class were 18 most of our senior year.

 

I see it has having them home one more year. It is also a big difference when going off to college. 19 on your own at school sounds better than barely 18.

[Ellie]

So, he was 9 in May, and started 4th grade in the fall. This sounds reasonable to me under any circumstances I can think of. Regardless of when a child's birthday is, some children will be younger or older than other dc in their classes. Such is life.

 

I don't understand the problem.

 

It would never have occurred to me that May was a "late" birthday (both of my dc are May birthdays, mine is July, Mr. Ellie's is September), and I would never consider starting a child "officially" a year later, or hold him back now that he's in fourth grade.

[Kimberly in IN]

This is a topic near and dear to us. My ds, 9, has a June 1 bday. In our state, the year he was 5, the k cut-off was July 1. All good. Went to a meet and greet at local grade school (olders were at a private school, not placing him there, long story) Anyway, teacher and principal both tell NO BOY w/ his birthday would be ready for k and would be held back. All of this w/out ever meeting my ds. Figured ds would be have to walk on water to change their minds. So, decided to hs him.

 

Great idea, we could red shirt for sports. Thing is, ds is HUGE. Not fat, but quite tall and medium build. He participates in Cub Scouts from school w/ boys from original cut-off. Ds is the youngest by 3 mos and is the tallest by a few inches. Ds plays travel hockey. We have actually been asked to provide birth certificate from opposing teams b/c of his size.

 

Academically, ds would be bored beyond belief if he was in a classroom a year behind him. We currently hs to ability, not grade level. Can't imagine the trouble he would be in if placed in such a class.

 

Here is the kicker. Allowed dd, 10, to attend ps this year. The year she turned 5, cut-off was June 1. Her birthday is at the end of April. When we registered her for school, they wanted to place her in grade behind her b/c of her so-called late b-day. We said no. She is literally the youngest 5th grader in her school of over 1100 students (k-5th) She is also quite petite, she is even petite compared to other girls adopted from China. Academically, she is doing fine, straight As first grading period. Seems to be quite popular, teacher has emailed me repeatedly w/ how surprised she is that a homeschooled child could be so socially adept and popular. Dh and I have a mtg w/ teacher & principal next week b/c they t are certain we "misled" them about the hs thing b/c of S's ability to fit in both socially and academically. Um, no, she has been in hs since end of k year.

 

So, long way of saying, dh and I find this type of thread very interesting. We school to ability, but where to place kids in outside activities can be tricky. We have chosen to place kids based on true cut-offs for our state. Now, if we move to another state w/ different cut-off dates, I guess it will be a whole different story.

[teachermom2834]

Ellie,

 

I appreciate that you have taken the time to respond and do consider everything that has been written (why else would I have asked?).

 

I don't know how else to explain it. Ds was 9 in May. In school grades he is probably 3 months - 15 months younger than the other kids. It is not the handful of kids that are 3-5 months older than him that bother me. It is the very large (not just a couple kids) that are 12- 15 months older. I understand that some kids will always be younger. I don't consider May to be late either (I was a Sept that moved 1500 miles away for college at 17). I get that. I am not looking for him to be the oldest in his class. I would like him in the most similar age grouping available and he is not there right now.

 

I have just found myself in a situation where is in with kids mostly a whole year older all the time. For this particular kid who is a follower and sometimes lacking in confidence I am just not sure why it is necessary that I push him ahead with all older kids all the time. I realize that legally he is in the correct grade but the reality of the situation is one in which every test he takes, every competition he participates in, every team he trys out for he is being forced to compete against all older kids. Not some older kids or kids a little bit older but the majority of kids one year plus older. Socially I don't think he benefits from having to deal with all the nonsense out there a year ahead of his age.

 

Thanks again. I am considering all options. Obviously I was resistant to do this for us to have gotten to 4th grade in this boat. As I see more of the middle school experience with my oldest son I am able to see what was a small issue in the elementary grades becoming a big issue in the next couple of years.

 

Just trying to meet the needs of this kid. We do not baby our dc and I certainly do understand that all kids will not be exactly the same age all the time. That is not lost on me. I am just failing to see the advantage, at this point, of pushing him ahead. I would never have chosen to grade skip this particular child but that essentially is the situation I am in.

 

Thanks. I promise I will stop trying to explain it now.

[camibami]

I am facing this with my youngest, a girl with a summer birthday. She would never had been ready for ps K at just barely 5, cutoff was Aug 1 in that state. But since we hs, I thought- K, no problem! My oldest has the same birthday, and always been fine (in fact is taking an 8th grade class at the middle school as a young 6th grader). But this kid is different. She only started reading fluently this summer. Her math skills are a little above grade level, but we only just started spelling as she only just started really reading. She is immature and shy. And, most of the kids in 3rd grade I meet are 9 or about to turn 9, not just barely 8. She is truly a year younger than 90% of the kids in her grade.

 

We messed up. She needs to be a 3rd grader again next year. But how to tell her?? We won't, we'll just register her a grade behind for middle school when we get to that point and if we live somewhere she can take classes at ps. There is no testing at the moment for us, but if there was, I'd just order the 3rd grade test 2 years in a row to get an accurate picture of how she is doign compared to her real peers, not the arbitrary cut off of the state we happened to be in when she started school.

 

Yes, if everyone started their kids according ot the dates, we would be with age-mates, they would all be her age. But it is what it is, and it may harm her (and your child), IMO to be the only to be so much younger.

 

Her sport goes by year of birth, but physically bigger is a disadvantage there, so sports is not a consideration at all. This is purely for academic and social reasons.

[Ellie]

I see that you have a problem, and it's just weird. I don't know how to fix it. I wonder if you "hold him back," though, if there might be some problems with folks who will be critical because he "flunked" fourth grade? Just thinkin' out loud with you. The others who are so much older must have been held back--started a year later--than your ds. That's just weird. I never heard of anyone's doing that back when my dc were young.

 

I'd have to also think about down the road. As it is, he'll be 18 when he graduates; if you hold him back, he'll be 19. That would bug me, and it would have *really* bugged my May-birthday dds.

 

Of course, eventually, none of this will matter. Wish we could all look ahead and know what the right answer is *now*!

[katilac]

Disclaimer: The rant that follows is not directed at the OP or anyone in particular.

 

How much do I wish that school sports would go by age, not grade? I hate that it's such a consideration for people, and yet I can see how important it can be for a sporty family. Sports is not the only reason for holding kids back, but I think it's been the driving factor in starting the trend.

[teachermom2834]

It is weird-and annoying I have to admit.

 

While it is not the norm, it is reasonably common to stay back that year even with winter birthdays. I guess that means the fall birthdays are actually the youngest! Where will it end?

 

I honestly will give him a say at this point. While dc do not make important decisions around here I will listen to what he has to say. If I thought he was going to feel like he "failed" and was humiliated I wouldn't do it. I wouldn't do it if I thought it was going to have a negative effect on him at all. If he chose to go ahead and continue in his current grade and put himself at that disadvantage for sports, etc. then I would support that. We have talked about it some and he definitely understands and knows that the kids his age are a year behind. He also knows he is very bright and he gets that isn't the problem. I think alot of it for me is his own social comfort and he is capable of telling me where he is more comfortable.

 

As much as I've agonized about this it probably isn't that big of a deal. There will be pros and cons of each. None of them will be that life altering I suppose. If I keep him where he is and it is a problem I can take him out and homeschool him. If I hold him back and that becomes a problem I can take him out and homeschool him :)

 

Thanks for the discussion. I appreciate the sounding board. I'm sure I'll be back and forth on it some more before I finally decide.

[athena1277]

You know, all this discussion may be less an issue if the "powers that be" succeed in lowering the required age for attendance, as has been proposed is many places. Then parents will not be allowed by law to keep their kids home until they are older, they will have to begin sooner. I wonder how that would affect things at schools, with younger students in K and eventually younger kids on those high school teams?