What did your kids think about being homeschooled after being done?

[regentrude]

22 minutes ago, freesia said:

I’m so sorry Maize. You are such a wise, caring, resilient person. I wish that could have been appreciated by your peers. My heart aches for you and @regentrude ‘s dd. 

It's ok. We never fit into the local homeschool scene either  and DD never made friends there, but she found one friend during her time at school. They stayed friends for a few years once she had been homeschooled, and she found community during her homeschooled high school years when she was taking college classes; her friends were all college juniors and seniors and 5-7 years older than her. She wouldn't have had that wonderful group if she had been in ps. The pervasive social culture of mediocrity sucks for profoundly gifted girls. 

Edited October 11, 2022 by regentrude

[wendyroo]

51 minutes ago, regentrude said:

It's ok. We never fit into the local homeschool scene either  and DD never made friends there, but she found one friend during her time at school. They stayed friends for a few years once she had been homeschooled, and she found community during her homeschooled high school years when she was taking college classes; her friends were all college juniors and seniors and 5-7 years older than her. She wouldn't have had that wonderful group if she had been in ps. The pervasive social culture of mediocrity sucks for profoundly gifted girls. 

Yeah, I think I would have been okay in high school if the rest of the kids just ignored me; I can deal with loneliness. It was the constant verbal and emotional harassment that got to me. I understand, I was an upstart outsider - I was too young to be there and doing far too well in (and caring too much about) my classes. In some ways the regular shoving and tripping and standard schoolyard physical bullying in elementary was much easier to deal with than the psychological warfare of the upper grades.

Elliot is at that sweet spot where he gets both physically and emotionally bullied...his classmates will all move to a different lunch table if he sits down near them, and he has come home with carpet burns from being shoved to the floor in the hallways. And this is a kid who falls under the protective auspices of resource, special ed, social work, G&T, etc, and never hesitates to tattle on kids who so much as swear in his presence. I imagine it is even worse for quirky kids who aren't surrounded by as many bodyguards, and who avoid snitching because they are trying to be accepted.

[Not_a_Number]

14 hours ago, Roadrunner said:

It has been for mine. The difference after putting him in high school is day and night. I regret not doing it sooner. 

I've noticed that people get very defensive about homeschooling and socializing, probably because people outside this world can be so critical.

I'm really glad it worked for you. Being lonely sucks. I'm happy your DS found friends at school. 

[Not_a_Number]

10 hours ago, wendyroo said:

I will never be smug about my kids blending in socially or getting along easily with friends, partly because those are unlikely to be traits my kids have, but more importantly because I don't think the lack of those traits indicates a character flaw.

I'm glad my kids can fit in socially. Not because I judge people who can't fit in (heck, I barely fit in myself), but because it makes life easier. And since my kids can, I see no reason why I shouldn't give them that advantage. 

That's not the same thing as saying that I'd expect an ASD kid to fit in. Different kids, different goals. 

[EmilyGF]

2 minutes ago, Not_a_Number said:

I've noticed that people get very defensive about homeschooling and socializing, probably because people outside this world can be so critical.

I'm really glad it worked for you. Being lonely sucks. I'm happy your DS found friends at school. 

I have two kids in high school now and I'd say it is a mixed bag. I think both of them would say they feel lonely at school, but neither would ask to homeschool during these high school years. OTOH, both highly value their homeschooling through 8th grade and are much more self-driven, independent learners because of it.

DS17 has found buddies on the cross-country team, but hasn't really connected closely with anyone. OTOH, he has learned a lot about interacting with people and has been mentored remarkably well by some of his teachers. He's found a 17-yo storm-chaser whom he deems "interesting enough" to spend time with. He often comes home with stories to tell of stupid and obnoxious stuff other students did. 

DD15 was so happy to finally go to school. She's super extroverted and loves all of her interactions with people all day long. She comes home brimming full of stories to tell of funny things people said. She's built a persona as a math and science whiz, which surprised me. I thought she'd blossom as a writer at school and away from our heavy emphasis on math.

The school is in the top 100 in the country and kids have to test in, but it is public and has a wide income diversity. There is no pressure towards mediocrity at their school, and the teachers range from "meh" to superb. 

It has been good for both of them (academically, socially, emotionally), though not perfect in any of those categories. 

 

[Not_a_Number]

3 minutes ago, EmilyGF said:

I have two kids in high school now and I'd say it is a mixed bag. I think both of them would say they feel lonely at school, but neither would ask to homeschool during these high school years. OTOH, both highly value their homeschooling through 8th grade and are much more self-driven, independent learners because of it.

DS17 has found buddies on the cross-country team, but hasn't really connected closely with anyone. OTOH, he has learned a lot about interacting with people and has been mentored remarkably well by some of his teachers. He's found a 17-yo storm-chaser whom he deems "interesting enough" to spend time with. He often comes home with stories to tell of stupid and obnoxious stuff other students did. 

DD15 was so happy to finally go to school. She's super extroverted and loves all of her interactions with people all day long. She comes home brimming full of stories to tell of funny things people said. She's built a persona as a math and science whiz, which surprised me. I thought she'd blossom as a writer at school and away from our heavy emphasis on math.

The school is in the top 100 in the country and kids have to test in, but it is public and has a wide income diversity. There is no pressure towards mediocrity at their school, and the teachers range from "meh" to superb. 

It has been good for both of them (academically, socially, emotionally), though not perfect in any of those categories. 

That sounds like it's working well for you, even though there are trade-offs! 

I keep wondering whether DD10 will want to go to high school. She definitely says she'll consider it, but she also really values her ability to learn what she likes. (And yes, she'll change a lot in the next few years, I'm sure!) We'll also have to see what her friends do, I guess. I can definitely imagine loneliness being an issue. 

Edited October 12, 2022 by Not_a_Number

[wendyroo]

5 minutes ago, Not_a_Number said:

I'm glad my kids can fit in socially. Not because I judge people who can't fit in (heck, I barely fit in myself), but because it makes life easier. And since my kids can, I see no reason why I shouldn't give them that advantage. 

That's not the same thing as saying that I'd expect an ASD kid to fit in. Different kids, different goals. 

Smug really seems like the wrong word then:

Quote

I sometimes feel smug about how my kids aren't weird, lol! 

When smug means:
smug
adjective
having or showing an excessive pride in oneself or one's achievements.

Which would imply that you view their non-weirdness as your accomplishment, something you give to them ("I see no reason why I shouldn't give them that advantage") as opposed to genetic luck.

It's like saying to a mom who has been laboring through Barton with her dyslexic child for years that you sometimes feel smug that your child learned to read easily...especially if you yourself were dyslexic and your child avoided it just by luck of the draw.

I maintain that being smug about something intrinsically means that you look down on individuals who don't have it or can't do it. Smugness implies a value judgement; it is different than saying you are happy or relieved they "aren't weird". And, for what it's worth, I think that calling your own kids "not weird", implying that other kids are "weird", is rude and tone deaf on its own. Possible alternatives might be "neurotypical" or "able to mask".

[Ellie]

22 hours ago, Rosie_0801 said:

For sure. Mine has turned out to be her friend group's agony aunt, much to the surprise of her uncle and I. 

I have never heard that term before. 🙂

[Roadrunner]

nm. I shared too much. 

Edited October 12, 2022 by Roadrunner

[Not_a_Number]

1 hour ago, wendyroo said:

Smug really seems like the wrong word then:

When smug means:
smug
adjective
having or showing an excessive pride in oneself or one's achievements.

Which would imply that you view their non-weirdness as your accomplishment, something you give to them ("I see no reason why I shouldn't give them that advantage") as opposed to genetic luck.

It's like saying to a mom who has been laboring through Barton with her dyslexic child for years that you sometimes feel smug that your child learned to read easily...especially if you yourself were dyslexic and your child avoided it just by luck of the draw.

I maintain that being smug about something intrinsically means that you look down on individuals who don't have it or can't do it. Smugness implies a value judgement; it is different than saying you are happy or relieved they "aren't weird". And, for what it's worth, I think that calling your own kids "not weird", implying that other kids are "weird", is rude and tone deaf on its own. Possible alternatives might be "neurotypical" or "able to mask".

I do judge people who don’t socialize their kids properly. I judge nurture and not nature.

[Arcadia]

37 minutes ago, Ellie said:

I have never heard that term before. 🙂

It is a British term. I think commonwealth countries also use that term. There are agony aunt columns in newspapers 

e.g. https://amp.theguardian.com/media/2021/jun/20/meet-philippa-perry-the-observers-new-agony-aunt-every-email-will-help-me

[Rosie_0801]

42 minutes ago, Ellie said:

I have never heard that term before. 🙂

I'd assumed it was an American term!

[Jean in Newcastle]

1 hour ago, Not_a_Number said:

I've noticed that people get very defensive about homeschooling and socializing, probably because people outside this world can be so critical.

I'm really glad it worked for you. Being lonely sucks. I'm happy your DS found friends at school. 

I don’t know about other people, but for me, it’s because each schooling option that I have attended or taught at, has had their own socialization pros and cons. Even public schools. So it’s not as easy as homeschool has bad socialization and public schools have good socialization. There’s potential for issues in any situation. There’s potential for workarounds in most situations (maybe all but I am not going to be that dogmatic). Covid affected all schooling options (unless they just ignored it but even then…). Covid didn’t affect my kid’s homeschooling but I worked extremely hard to provide alternative social opportunities for my kids. But I couldn’t guarantee that my kids would find friends. 

[Jean in Newcastle]

2 minutes ago, Rosie_0801 said:

I'd assumed it was an American term!

We have Anne Landers and Dear Abby. 

[Melissa Louise]

What does it mean to 'socialize kids properly'?

I mean, beyond the whole locked in the basement thing...

 

 

[LMD]

2 hours ago, Jean in Newcastle said:

I don’t know about other people, but for me, it’s because each schooling option that I have attended or taught at, has had their own socialization pros and cons. Even public schools. So it’s not as easy as homeschool has bad socialization and public schools have good socialization. There’s potential for issues in any situation. There’s potential for workarounds in most situations (maybe all but I am not going to be that dogmatic). Covid affected all schooling options (unless they just ignored it but even then…). Covid didn’t affect my kid’s homeschooling but I worked extremely hard to provide alternative social opportunities for my kids. But I couldn’t guarantee that my kids would find friends. 

Absolutely this.

Plus, the personality of the individual kid. I have one who wanted to go to school, because this one trends towards being a follower and had an extremely 'grass is greener' perspective. We said no, based on quite a few variables, and worked hard to get them involved with more social things. Did it work? 🤷🏻‍♀️ At the moment this kid is putting us through the wringer but I doubt it would have been better at school. I don't think there's such a thing as 'working' any more, especially for the upper high school ages, they have to make their own decisions and grow up A LOT. We'll see how they feel about life at 30 😄

[Roadrunner]

3 minutes ago, Melissa Louise said:

What does it mean to 'socialize kids properly'?

I mean, beyond the whole locked in the basement thing...

 

 

I guess when they are little, it’s easy. Park dates, play dates… you can get kids together and they will interact. But after a certain age, good luck. Either they have friends or they don’t. It’s not like you can schedule a play date for a 15 year old. 

[LMD]

8 minutes ago, Roadrunner said:

I guess when they are little, it’s easy. Park dates, play dates… you can get kids together and they will interact. But after a certain age, good luck. Either they have friends or they don’t. It’s not like you can schedule a play date for a 15 year old. 

Yes, I try to advise the parents in my homeschool group to focus on finding 'your tribe' when they're young and school doesn't take all day. Go to all the things, connect with people. Just a couple of like minded families where the kids get along can make such a difference as they grow.

[Melissa Louise]

28 minutes ago, Roadrunner said:

I guess when they are little, it’s easy. Park dates, play dates… you can get kids together and they will interact. But after a certain age, good luck. Either they have friends or they don’t. It’s not like you can schedule a play date for a 15 year old. 

I have grown up kids, so btdt (and we had a combo of school for one and homeschool for the others, so very flexible about that).

School can be a fix for loneliness for some; school can be a place of loneliness for others.

Some struggle with social connections in any context.

It can't all be nurture (environment).

I'm not good with judging kids on the basis of their place of schooling as insufficiently 'nurtured'.

Unless, as above, they are living a life of deliberate deprivation.

 

 

[Guest]

On 10/8/2022 at 10:21 PM, BronzeTurtle said:

But it really doesn't matter. My kids wanted to be in school until they didn't. They wanted to be homeschooled until they didn't. Kids get discontented for all sorts of reasons. They speak up or don't. THey act out or don't. Kids can be outwardly resentful and then 5 years later say they are so glad you did xyz. They can also go along and seem to love every moment they are doing something and come back 5 years later and tell you that they really wish you hadn't made them do that thing they seemingly loved. 10yo isn't old enough to understand all the implications of decisions you have to make on her behalf. Even 15 or 18, their brains and life experience aren't there to say that anything is definitively good or bad, although at those ages they should probably have more input in what they are doing academically and such. But there's a reason it's not legal to drop out of school until a certain age. Very few really want to be there doing the school stuff, even those who do well at it. The issue would be to deal with the discontentment even if it's not exacly what she wants to be doing. That's life and growing up and doing things you don't want to do and even not being grumpy about those things. That's hard to do even as adults.

Also, no one has easy kids. Easy kids are a myth. Even kids that seeem to go with the flow have their own issues. Kids that go to school happily and get good grades and seem to do everything right on the outside have issues. Happy-go-lucky kids have issues. Your kids and issues with them aren't special or special to homeschooling or having them in a school. I say this because it helps to remember that you're not alone.

This post really resonated with me. I see that it didn’t for others. 
 

I think there is a truth that some kids are easier than others for a lot of reasons - more agreeable, open to letting things unfold, more emotional intelligence, better communication abilities, etc.  But I have also seen an easier kid have a hard period and a challenging kid become easier as they matured. Hell, I have done this in my own life. 
 

I agree that sometimes we choose what we choose and the kids are going to have to muddle through. Maybe it’s a fabulous experience, maybe it’s not, but you’ve gotta pick *something*. I said this to my dd once when she asked, “Why did you send me to that school?” I said because it seemed like the best option at the time. I had to pick *something*, and dh was willing to have her go there, so that’s what we did. Life is full of decisions and that’s the one we chose. Nobody knows what was down the road not taken; maybe it would have been better, maybe it would have been worse. 
 

I think our society has, in some ways, swung from a philosophy where what kids desired didn’t matter at all (like, say, in the 1930s and 40s) to acting like every kid must never be unhappy or uncomfortable for a second. It’s like when my oldest kids were babies and the La Lèche League was militaristic about breastfeeding. It wasn’t enough to simply feed your child from the breast instead of bottles; you had to bf *exclusively*, spurn all artificial n!pples, stick a boob in every time they cried for any reason. Why was this promoted? It seemed like the goal was for the baby to never have a moment’s discomfort. 

[Carrie12345]

I’m interested to see what my kids say more years down the road.

3 are technically adults. My oldest hated homeschooling at the time and went back to school. He has some regrets. But I think he would have regrets the other way, too. We just can’t find out, lol.

My daughters are generally positive about it as the better option. They also went through a period of hating it, but then became glad they didn’t have to go to high school. Of my 5, so far, they had the fullest, widest extracurricular experiences, and I’m sure that helped. Sadly their Senior years (and dd#2’s Junior) were heavily impacted by Covid, and they were robbed of what should have been very special times.

My youngest two are still in it, but it’s almost as if they’re oblivious to the concept that traditional school exists. Even though they have ps friends!  Our 2 main homeschool groups closed during Covid, and they’re feeling that. It might heavily impact their eventual outlook, but we’ll see.

My kids all have different social needs. We’ve done the best that we could for each. Sometimes some of them got the right amount for them. Sometimes not.

I went to public school, and my activities were determined by our family’s needs and abilities at any given point. I mean… that’s just how life works!  I was “talks too much” in school, and that was considered a bad thing.  I couldn’t keep a sports schedule except for one year. My time with friends during the school year was limited, but they were a handful of really good ones!

[Soror]

4 hours ago, LMD said:

Yes, I try to advise the parents in my homeschool group to focus on finding 'your tribe' when they're young and school doesn't take all day. Go to all the things, connect with people. Just a couple of like minded families where the kids get along can make such a difference as they grow.

 

4 hours ago, Roadrunner said:

I guess when they are little, it’s easy. Park dates, play dates… you can get kids together and they will interact. But after a certain age, good luck. Either they have friends or they don’t. It’s not like you can schedule a play date for a 15 year old. 

I sympathize Roadrunner so much. I knew hs'ing older kids would be a challenge. I had seen other older kids go to school again and again. 

I did all the things. I spent countless hours organizing and leading the things (hs group, robotics, science club, lit club, scouts, etc). But when you live in a rural community there are limited options and hs population to begin with. There are no hs classes I can put him in. Just our small local group that I ran for years (up until Covid).

My son had maybe 5 kids his age but wasn't close friends with any of them (not for lack of trying).  Compound that with other kids going to school-- like all 3 of the boys ds was even somewhat friends with went to school. The ones left wouldn't acknowledge his existence (and both of them were only home because their parents wouldn't allow them to go to school). He'd made a few friends from Scouts but was kept a bit outside the friend circle as he wasn't in school all day with the rest of them. Dd had some friends but none were very close to her age. When puberty happened that divide was too big and she longed for similar aged/maturity level peers. 

There seems to be a narrative with a lot of hs'ers that you don't really socialize in school or make friends but that is untrue for lots of kids.

And while hs is a refuge for those quirky kids for the kids that aren't quirky they have a hard time finding their tribe with similar interests etc.

In our local hs group there are currently two groups for older kids. DnD and theatre, my dd2 has no interest in either. She does have a few friends but as with my older 2 as she's gotten older the divide has widened. I thought she'd made friends with one kid actually closer to her age but that relationship doesn't seem to be progressing. Her other close friends are younger and considerably more immature. She wants to go to school so I'll be allowing her to next year in 8th like I did her older siblings. I don't know if she'll find it worthwhile or not. At this point, I'm torn as to what I want to happen. I'd love for her to hs all the way through and I'm still very sad about leaving hs'ing behind but we're very limited in our area for friends, activities, opportunities etc.

I'm still holding out on ds 3 going to school although she'd really like to go. I would like her to wait until 7th grade at least but we'll see how it goes with just her home. 

 

Edited October 12, 2022 by Soror

[pinball]

58 minutes ago, Quill said:

This post really resonated with me. I see that it didn’t for others. 
 

I think there is a truth that some kids are easier than others for a lot of reasons - more agreeable, open to letting things unfold, more emotional intelligence, better communication abilities, etc.  But I have also seen an easier kid have a hard period and a challenging kid become easier as they matured. Hell, I have done this in my own life. 
 

I agree that sometimes we choose what we choose and the kids are going to have to muddle through. Maybe it’s a fabulous experience, maybe it’s not, but you’ve gotta pick *something*. I said this to my dd once when she asked, “Why did you send me to that school?” I said because it seemed like the best option at the time. I had to pick *something*, and dh was willing to have her go there, so that’s what we did. Life is full of decisions and that’s the one we chose. Nobody knows what was down the road not taken; maybe it would have been better, maybe it would have been worse. 
 

I think our society has, in some ways, swung from a philosophy where what kids desired didn’t matter at all (like, say, in the 1930s and 40s) to acting like every kid must never be unhappy or uncomfortable for a second. It’s like when my oldest kids were babies and the La Lèche League was militaristic about breastfeeding. It wasn’t enough to simply feed your child from the breast instead of bottles; you had to bf *exclusively*, spurn all artificial n!pples, stick a boob in every time they cried for any reason. Why was this promoted? It seemed like the goal was for the baby to never have a moment’s discomfort. 

LLL is a breastfeeding organization. That’s their raison d’être. Of course their advice will always center, begin, and end around nursing. 
 

Im sure you could have gotten different mothering advice from another mothering group, your family, your friends, your healthcare providers, etc, etc.

¡Baby the baby so you don’t have to baby the adult!

[Guest]

9 minutes ago, pinball said:

LLL is a breastfeeding organization. That’s their raison d’être. Of course their advice will always center, begin, and end around nursing. 
 

Im sure you could have gotten different mothering advice from another mothering group, your family, your friends, your healthcare providers, etc, etc.

¡Baby the baby so you don’t have to baby the adult!

Yes, I do know that. There are other ways to breastfeed besides 24/7 exclusive, on-demand bf for five years, though, which was not acknowledged by any LLL people I knew at the time. It’s analogous to homeschool groups who think it can only be Saxon math or Classical Conversations. 

[wendyroo]

7 hours ago, Not_a_Number said:

I do judge people who don’t socialize their kids properly. I judge nurture and not nature.

What a tolerant, inclusive sentiment. 🙄

"Screw different cultural and parenting goals. Screw mental illness, developmental delay and invisible disabilities (in both the child AND parent). Screw intrinsic personality traits that can't be "parented out" of a human being. I am so omnicient about parents, children, their neurochemistry, their family situations and their parenting efforts, that I can judge if the parent is nurturing properly. I can be the ultimate arbiter of whether a parent is presenting society with children who act "properly socialized", or if they are lazily/nefariously/ignorantly letting their kids turn into little weirdos."

[Rosie_0801]

5 hours ago, Melissa Louise said:

What does it mean to 'socialize kids properly'?

I mean, beyond the whole locked in the basement thing...

 

 

I've looked at it as how many environments dd can feel she can belong in, know how to operate in, empathise with(?) or something like that. 

[pinball]

19 minutes ago, Quill said:

Yes, I do know that. There are other ways to breastfeed besides 24/7 exclusive, on-demand bf for five years, though, which was not acknowledged by any LLL people I knew at the time. It’s analogous to homeschool groups who think it can only be Saxon math or Classical Conversations. 

So you’re saying the “LLL people” fed their children only breast milk for 5 years? Bc that’s what exclusive means. 

LLL believes that ideally, you breastfeed until the baby outgrows the need.

 

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, pinball said:

So you’re saying the “LLL people” fed their children only breast milk for 5 years? Bc that’s what exclusive means. 

LLL believes that ideally, you breastfeed until the baby outgrows the need.

 

Oh look! It’s pinball being pedantic! How unusual! 
 

[pinball]

4 minutes ago, Quill said:

Oh look! It’s pinball being pedantic! How unusual! 
 

Shrug. You exaggerated to the point of ridiculousness. 
 

 

 

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, pinball said:

Shrug. You exaggerated to the point of ridiculousness. 
 

 

 

*shrug* It’s not my fault you don’t understand hyperbole as a literary device. 

[Faith-manor]

13 hours ago, regentrude said:

It's ok. We never fit into the local homeschool scene either  and DD never made friends there, but she found one friend during her time at school. They stayed friends for a few years once she had been homeschooled, and she found community during her homeschooled high school years when she was taking college classes; her friends were all college juniors and seniors and 5-7 years older than her. She wouldn't have had that wonderful group if she had been in ps. The pervasive social culture of mediocrity sucks for profoundly gifted girls. 

Agreed! Same for our youngest son, but in some shades for all our kids because here the educational malaise is so bad that just bright, academically talented but not gifted students are shunned socially. The rocket team saved our kids and many local ones because it gave them a place, a club and team to come together and be challenged while having a social element. They all became very good friends and maintain those friendships as alumni through their own rocket team, alumni private social media chat group. Without that, it would have been awful. Over the eleven years we mentored that team, we had 39 teens go through the program or through our sister program in engineering, and after 4H pulled the plug on it during covid and then refused to let it start up again because "these programs detract attention from agricultural science", there had been nothing else. Anything that even came close to giving kids who need this kind of challenge, who need to be grouped together and challenged, was scrubbed by schools and never allowed to come back. The amount of money for boys' football and basketball as meanwhile grown practically exponentially. Class D schools too. Not a sport's coach in the land coming to check out these kids. 😠

 

[pinball]

12 minutes ago, Quill said:

*shrug* It’s not my fault you don’t understand hyperbole as a literary device. 

Oh, I do…but misrepresenting a beneficial organization that you do not agree with on a message board is not the place for using hyperbole.

You either don’t know or don’t care what LLL stands for and supports, but that didn’t stop you from disparaging them.

I’d rather be pedantic and ignorant about literary devices than badmouth LLL which has helped millions of babies, moms, and families in the decades it has been around. 

 

[Guest]

@pinball, I am finished engaging with you. 

[pinball]

2 minutes ago, Quill said:

@pinball, I am finished engaging with you. 

Thank God

[mom2scouts]

7 hours ago, LMD said:

Yes, I try to advise the parents in my homeschool group to focus on finding 'your tribe' when they're young and school doesn't take all day. Go to all the things, connect with people. Just a couple of like minded families where the kids get along can make such a difference as they grow.

This doesn't always help either. Some of the homeschoolers we connected with when my children were young changed dramatically as they entered their teens and are no longer a good fit for teen friendships and many others sent their kids to public school. We've had to start over in the teen years and Covid made it worse.

[Roadrunner]

1 hour ago, Faith-manor said:

Agreed! Same for our youngest son, but in some shades for all our kids because here the educational malaise is so bad that just bright, academically talented but not gifted students are shunned socially. The rocket team saved our kids and many local ones because it gave them a place, a club and team to come together and be challenged while having a social element. They all became very good friends and maintain those friendships as alumni through their own rocket team, alumni private social media chat group. Without that, it would have been awful. Over the eleven years we mentored that team, we had 39 teens go through the program or through our sister program in engineering, and after 4H pulled the plug on it during covid and then refused to let it start up again because "these programs detract attention from agricultural science", there had been nothing else. Anything that even came close to giving kids who need this kind of challenge, who need to be grouped together and challenged, was scrubbed by schools and never allowed to come back. The amount of money for boys' football and basketball as meanwhile grown practically exponentially. Class D schools too. Not a sport's coach in the land coming to check out these kids. 😠

 

Where we live, we don’t know a single high schooler who is homeschooled. Kids from our tiny group all went back to school by high school or middle school. No outside classes, no clubs, nothing for homeschoolers beyond elementary age locally. I think some homeschool groups exist but are exclusively religious and won’t accept us. 
I really wish we had lived in a city with tons of opportunities. 

[teachermom2834]

4 minutes ago, Roadrunner said:

Where we live, we don’t know a single high schooler who is homeschooled. Kids from our tiny group all went back to school by high school or middle school. No outside classes, no clubs, nothing for homeschoolers beyond elementary age locally. I think some homeschool groups exist but are exclusively religious and won’t accept us. 
I really wish we had lived in a city with tons of opportunities. 

Yeah people that live in thriving homeschool communities or even just bigger cities don’t always get it or believe you when you say you just couldn’t provide enough opportunities for your homeschooled teen. That was me, actually. I lived where there was tons of stuff. I moved where there was still alot but I couldn’t sign the statement of faith (which of course also meant we were a poor fit). So while on paper there were all kinds of opportunities for homeschoolers there really weren’t for my dd. I tried really hard to find a community, or even one friend actually, for my dd before I gave up and put her in high school. 
 

It wasn’t that I just didn’t try hard enough. I am spending a ton of money and time driving my dd for her to go to school. I would have happily put that money and effort into homeschooling support but it just wasn’t in the cards and it wasn’t because I didn’t try. 
 

[Faith-manor]

17 minutes ago, Roadrunner said:

Where we live, we don’t know a single high schooler who is homeschooled. Kids from our tiny group all went back to school by high school or middle school. No outside classes, no clubs, nothing for homeschoolers beyond elementary age locally. I think some homeschool groups exist but are exclusively religious and won’t accept us. 
I really wish we had lived in a city with tons of opportunities. 

I get it. We live rural. Class D schools. Neither of us set out to teach science and mathematics in 4H. We just were pretty desperate for something for our kids, and ended up taking on the responsibility to get a program together. The 4H science club had 32 kids on a regular basis, and an awful lot of the time, ours were the only homeschool kids in it. The rocket team was mostly public school kids who schools refused to provide any outlet for science minded students, and so I can honestly say the bulk of my kids socialization was with public and some private school kids, but only occasionally with other home schooled kids. I am thankful for my grandsons that Huntsville offers so much. They have public school friends, a very secular homeschool group, and a wide variety or community offerings for all children. They live outside the city and have to drive in, but it is well worth it. The added bonus is that when they need dual enrollment, UAH is a hop, skip, and jump away. Here we had to use online or drive 1.5 hrs each way for the good university for in person courses.

[Roadrunner]

22 minutes ago, Faith-manor said:

I get it. We live rural. Class D schools. Neither of us set out to teach science and mathematics in 4H. We just were pretty desperate for something for our kids, and ended up taking on the responsibility to get a program together. The 4H science club had 32 kids on a regular basis, and an awful lot of the time, ours were the only homeschool kids in it. The rocket team was mostly public school kids who schools refused to provide any outlet for science minded students, and so I can honestly say the bulk of my kids socialization was with public and some private school kids, but only occasionally with other home schooled kids. I am thankful for my grandsons that Huntsville offers so much. They have public school friends, a very secular homeschool group, and a wide variety or community offerings for all children. They live outside the city and have to drive in, but it is well worth it. The added bonus is that when they need dual enrollment, UAH is a hop, skip, and jump away. Here we had to use online or drive 1.5 hrs each way for the good university for in person courses.

We have invested time into public school friendships from the neighborhood, but as soon as those kids hit middle school, they dumped my kids. They had their own world with their own friend groups. 
And all life here is around school - mock trial, robotics teams, sports. 
 

[Jean in Newcastle]

The socialization thing was one reason why we let our kids decide about whether to homeschool high school or not. I laid out what I could teach and how, what I could provide and not provide. Could I predict every bump in the road?  No, of course not. But I feel like I did fulfill my end of the bargain. 
 

btw- for mental health reasons I did look into enrolling ds into online school for his junior and senior year. But they said that he would be put back into 9th grade despite having already done honors level subjects well beyond 9th grade courses. Again, we discussed it extensively. He decided to keep going with homeschooling. We did research and provided some “ala carte” online classes and in person tutors in higher subjects where I lacked expertise. And he did a work-study program outside the house. 
 

Could my kids still decide that I railroaded them despite the high level of involvement they had in the decision?  Sure. Kids do that sometimes. But we did our best, and as Quill pointed out, we did have to make actual choices. Even though we could also tweak our choices. 

[regentrude]

1 hour ago, Roadrunner said:

Where we live, we don’t know a single high schooler who is homeschooled. Kids from our tiny group all went back to school by high school or middle school. No outside classes, no clubs, nothing for homeschoolers beyond elementary age locally. I think some homeschool groups exist but are exclusively religious and won’t accept us. 
I really wish we had lived in a city with tons of opportunities. 

We live in a small rural town and there are quite some opportunities for homeschoolers, but the large religious group wasn't a fit for us, and neither was the smaller secular group beyond occasional park days for DS. There were absolutely no academic homeschool opportunities that worked for my kids (the coop was a joke)

However, they both did activities that were not specifically geared towards ps nor homeschool kids. DD rode horses at a barn, and DS did martial arts through a private fitness studio, and there they were both part of mixed-age groups that included ps kids, homeschoolers, college students, and adults - and the kind of schooling didn't play any role.

Edited October 12, 2022 by regentrude

[Faith-manor]

16 minutes ago, regentrude said:

We live in a small rural town and there are quite some opportunities for homeschoolers, but the large religious group wasn't a fit for us, and neither was the smaller secular group beyond occasional park days for DS. There were absolutely no academic homeschool opportunities that worked for my kids (the coop was a joke)

However, they both did activities that were not specifically geared towards ps nor homeschool kids. DD rode horses at a barn, and DS did martial arts through a private fitness studio, and there they were both part of mixed-age groups that included ps kids, homeschoolers, college students, and adults - and the kind of schooling didn't play any role.

Had she been interested, I would have loved to have your Dd on our rocket team. Sadly, we did not live near.

[Soror]

10 minutes ago, regentrude said:

We live in a small rural town and there are quite some opportunities for homeschoolers, but the large religious group wasn't a fit for us, and neither was the smaller secular group beyond occasional park days for DS. There were absolutely no academic homeschool opportunities that worked for my kids (the coop was a joke)

However, they both did activities that were not specifically geared towards ps nor homeschool kids. DD rode horses at a barn, and DS did martial arts through a private fitness studio, and there they were both part of mixed-age groups that included ps kids, homeschoolers, college students, and adults - and the kind of schooling didn't play any role.

My kids have been in MA for 5 years but that hasn't resulted in PS friends. It's been the same with every other EC group (dance, scouts, 4h, etc). It's worse the older they get. Kids are friendly they talk outside class on SM but it never gets very deep. Dd2 has been continually blown off by PS kids. She wants to hang out with other kids, not just talk. Supposed friends hang out with PS friends but she gets forgotten. Dd2 is not quirky, she has good social skills, she's sweet. My older 2 dealt with the same. Now in PS Dd1 makes friends easily and is reasonably popular. DS is not but he has a group of friends which he never did while hsing. We tried lots of avenues to make friends. 

[Jean in Newcastle]

18 minutes ago, Soror said:

My kids have been in MA for 5 years but that hasn't resulted in PS friends. It's been the same with every other EC group (dance, scouts, 4h, etc). It's worse the older they get. Kids are friendly they talk outside class on SM but it never gets very deep. Dd2 has been continually blown off by PS kids. She wants to hang out with other kids, not just talk. Supposed friends hang out with PS friends but she gets forgotten. Dd2 is not quirky, she has good social skills, she's sweet. My older 2 dealt with the same. Now in PS Dd1 makes friends easily and is reasonably popular. DS is not but he has a group of friends which he never did while hsing. We tried lots of avenues to make friends. 

It’s not wrong for you to have found what works for your kids. Just as it’s not wrong for us to have found what’s worked for our kids while still homeschooling. 
 

Not everyone has all opportunities. Not all opportunities end up with friends. We’re all doing the best we can in our particular circumstances. 

[Roadrunner]

54 minutes ago, Soror said:

My kids have been in MA for 5 years but that hasn't resulted in PS friends. It's been the same with every other EC group (dance, scouts, 4h, etc). It's worse the older they get. Kids are friendly they talk outside class on SM but it never gets very deep. Dd2 has been continually blown off by PS kids. She wants to hang out with other kids, not just talk. Supposed friends hang out with PS friends but she gets forgotten. Dd2 is not quirky, she has good social skills, she's sweet. My older 2 dealt with the same. Now in PS Dd1 makes friends easily and is reasonably popular. DS is not but he has a group of friends which he never did while hsing. We tried lots of avenues to make friends. 

That has been our exact experience. 

The only homeschool kids here we knew who made friends through activities were theatre kids. Somehow theatre lands well to friendships. Sports (mine did soccer, tennis) and music (orchestra) did not. 
 

I thought maybe DE would have resulted in some friendships, but no. Mostly everything was online, but even in person, students there had life and friends and cared very little to even say hi to mine. 
 

 

I am glad homeschooling works out for most people. And I hope with growth in homeschooling population, there will be even more opportunities for homeschooling kids because academically it’s the best option.
But sadly it didn’t fully work for mine. I still would do it over again until high school and then work 24/7 to find a private school that fit my kids. As you can see, I am not a fan of public education at all either for many reasons people mentioned along with really mediocre academics. 

[Jean in Newcastle]

6 minutes ago, Roadrunner said:

That has been our exact experience. 

The only homeschool kids here we knew who made friends through activities were theatre kids. Somehow theatre lands well to friendships. Sports (mine did soccer, tennis) and music (orchestra) did not. 
 

I thought maybe DE would have resulted in some friendships, but no. Mostly everything was online, but even in person, students there had life and friends and cared very little to even say hi to mine. 
 

 

I am glad homeschooling works out for most people. And I hope with growth in homeschooling population, there will be even more opportunities for homeschooling kids because academically it’s the best option.
But sadly it didn’t fully work for mine. I still would do it over again until high school and then work 24/7 to find a private school that fit my kids. As you can see, I am not a fan of public education at all either for many reasons people mentioned along with really mediocre academics. 

I don't know if homeschooling high school does work out for most people?  That's when (unofficially, just in my experience) 90% of homeschoolers around here go to public school.  A smaller number start earlier during middle school.  But could it have worked out for them if they had given it a try?  Maybe, maybe not.  They did the calculus for their own family's needs.  But for those of us in the 10% who stayed the distance, I would think (hope?) that we really did look at all options and made a decision based on what was best and not on ideological "homeschool is always best" reasons.  And we knew that it really was a four year decision and like I stated in my situation, had to tweak it to make it work.  (The main difference is that we don't have much control to tweak public or private schooling when it doesn't work well.) 

[LMD]

4 hours ago, mom2scouts said:

This doesn't always help either. Some of the homeschoolers we connected with when my children were young changed dramatically as they entered their teens and are no longer a good fit for teen friendships and many others sent their kids to public school. We've had to start over in the teen years and Covid made it worse.

True, of course it's not a guarantee. I just meant it more in the sense that instead of parents of little kids ignoring 'socialization' as a homeschool myth, they should be encouraged to build communities and connections while they have more free time. Like you say, much harder to start from scratch when they're older. Neither guarantees a specific outcome.

Covid destroyed a lot of homeschool groups here too, many left the state/country. Some homeschooled highschoolers straight up lost their entire friendship circle in one fell swoop. We have had to build ours back up and it's slow going. 

But I will still say that the odds increase if the community is built when the kids are younger & the parents support each other through the difficulties.

[Roadrunner]

14 minutes ago, LMD said:

True, of course it's not a guarantee. I just meant it more in the sense that instead of parents of little kids ignoring 'socialization' as a homeschool myth, they should be encouraged to build communities and connections while they have more free time. Like you say, much harder to start from scratch when they're older. Neither guarantees a specific outcome.

Covid destroyed a lot of homeschool groups here too, many left the state/country. Some homeschooled highschoolers straight up lost their entire friendship circle in one fell swoop. We have had to build ours back up and it's slow going. 

But I will still say that the odds increase if the community is built when the kids are younger & the parents support each other through the difficulties.

This a thousand times! 
 

 

Of course nothing guarantees any outcome. I know a kid who was pulled out of school because she was suicidal (they called her dumb fat girl for bing in special Ed), and I know kids who were put into school because they were depressed. Sometimes kids need different things at different times. I do think one thing I learned is try to be flexible. I did things I never thought I would do twice this year with two different kids. We responded to the needs. 
 

I am curious though what my kids will think once they are over 30. Maybe they will thank me and maybe they will hate me. I know in my heart though that I did the best that I could do. 

[rebcoola]

12 hours ago, LMD said:

Yes, I try to advise the parents in my homeschool group to focus on finding 'your tribe' when they're young and school doesn't take all day. Go to all the things, connect with people. Just a couple of like minded families where the kids get along can make such a difference as they grow.

 

5 hours ago, mom2scouts said:

This doesn't always help either. Some of the homeschoolers we connected with when my children were young changed dramatically as they entered their teens and are no longer a good fit for teen friendships and many others sent their kids to public school. We've had to start over in the teen years and Covid made it worse.

Yeah we had a large community and it just kind of dwindled. People moved, went to school or got more intense with activites.  Their is still a fair group of middle schoolers and I think  more are going to homeschool than in past.  The high school ODD has chosen actually has most of her old homeschool tribe.  

[regentrude]

12 hours ago, LMD said:

Yes, I try to advise the parents in my homeschool group to focus on finding 'your tribe' when they're young and school doesn't take all day. Go to all the things, connect with people. Just a couple of like minded families where the kids get along can make such a difference as they grow.

Yes, absolutely - but that also requires the parent to fit the mold. I never I fit in with the other moms in our homeschool group because I wasn't the "typical" homeschool mom - I worked a regular day job while everyone else was either SAHM or had a little part-time side hustle. So there as never a "tribe" for me.