family get together and lice

[liber]

If you were having a large family gathering and one of the family members found out two days before the gathering that her children had lice, would you expect the family member with lice to stay home?  Said family member is treating it so would it be safe for the family member to bring her children?

 

[Ravin]

No, I would not expect them to stay home. I WOULD expect her children to arrive having been treated, VERY thoroughly combed, and well-oiled. And I would probably oil my own kids' hair and my own, just to be on the safe side.

[justasque]

I found a My Big Book of Kindergarten at Wal Mart- School Zone maybe? It was the perfect supplement to Singapore Math Essential K. In fact I think it did a better job in a lot of places. 

 

I also found this old public school work text at a Salvation Army called Mathematics in Action. I picked it up for my 1st grader to explore on his own. It came with punch out paper math manipulatives etc. It's really good. It is sort of pushing Miquon and MM out of the front place as our spine. He asks to do it. 

 

Evan Moor Skills Sharpeners were kind of fun, although I don't think I'd buy any more.

 

I really like Evan Moor Daily Language Review. 

 

I do like The Complete books as well. I'm not as big a fan of the Presidents/States one however and will likely not use that one again.

 

I would not expect the family to stay home.  However, I would probably have my own children braid and cover their hair (as I would do for mine), because we just don't have time to deal with lice.  If the kids were little I'd also review things like not sharing combs or hats, etc.  

 

I'd hope that the infected family would also braid and cover, but I would not expect it.  I might bring a bag'o'bandannas along in case anyone in the extended family expressed a desire for one (after seeing my kids covered), to help it not become a drama thing so everyone can relax and enjoy the event.

Edited August 12, 2016 by justasque

[liber]

well the family member who is hosting(it's a house warming) is 8 months pregnant with her 5th child, all under the age of 8.  She just moved into a new home and is still unpacking.  She doesn't want to run the risk of having something else to deal with.  If it were my kids with lice I would probably just stay home.

[bolt.]

If the treatment is approved and effective: whatever the directions say about how soon contact is safe are most likely correct. I'd expect the family member to follow the instructions on the box, then not worry about it (unless she had reason to believe she was dealing with super lice).

 

If you are uncomfortable even if she is fine according to the box, you could say, "Hey, to be on the safe side I'd rather postpone. I'm sorry, I know it's not the best, but, I've decided to be better safe than sorry. How about (date) instead?"

 

If she's doing home remedies, oil of idiocy, or anything other than the pharmacist's best recommendation, I'd definitely postpone. (With the same 'better safe than sorry / I've made up my mind' rhetoric as above, not engaging on efficacy debates.)

 

Edited to add; with pregnancy and unpacking as discribed, I'd lean very far towards 'better safe than sorry' and advise the infected family to warm the house in a couple of weeks when they can be absolutely certian they aren't bringing even a single stow away.

Edited August 12, 2016 by bolt.

[Tap]

It depends on the family treating.  If they are fastidious and really put effort in, then I would be fine with it. If they are a bit on the laid back side of things, I would ask them to stay home.  

 

DD9 has had lice several times due to family,  school and daycare.  I have wiped it out each time with a single treatment, lots of combing and clean up. 

 

My nieces, had lice for years.  They got it once and never got rid of it.  My mom insists that their type was the more resilient kind, but since dd9 got it from them once, and I was able to get rid of it, I don't think it was the issue.  I think they were missing a source of contamination.  When dd9 got it, everyone in our house was treated, even though she was the only one with nits. Everyone's rooms, bathrooms and common areas where treated just the same as if they had it also.

 

 If the parents aren't willing to treat everyone or everything, I honestly wouldn't risk it. It is sooooo much work to deal with and at 8mo pg, it would be horrible to do all that bending over to clean little heads and all the surfaces. 

[Ausmumof3]

Given that not all the treatments are safe when you are pregnant I think the pregnancy makes this a no not a yes. Otherwise it would be OK.

[redsquirrel]

I would expect them to stay home. I know I would not want to attend, that is for sure.  We had lice last year, caught from a friend of ds2. By the time I figured it out we all had it.  We were actually lice free in 3-4 days, but we kept to ourselves for 2 weeks just to make sure. It was also a big undertaking to deal with the lice in that amount of time. And, thing is...I didn't know for sure that we were lice free until days had passed with zero lice on our daily checks. I didn't trust that a day or two of treatment had made us safe to be in public.

[nd293]

No. I had a mother offer to keep her child away from my dd's birthday party many years ago. That seemed excessive to me - we went with braid hair and wear a scarf headband thing.

[kiwik]

Usually once it is treated it is fine to go back to school etc. But in this case I think I would stay home just because it would be so hard to deal with if you were heavily pregnant, had a bunch of littles and had just moved. The washing alone would be appalling.

[SpecialClassical]

In only two days time? Absolutely not. how could the mom be sure that fast?

[Melissa in Australia]

No way.

 

We have had head lice once. Major problem for us as DH has multiple chemical sensativaties that are so bad he is on a disability pension. We cannot use any chemical treatment at all. And have to use the conditioner and twice daily fine comb for 2 weeks treatment. A real nightmare.

Edited August 12, 2016 by Melissa in Australia

[whitestavern]

I would expect them to stay home, yes. I just read an article recently about how most lice cases are now resistant to OTC treatment. You can Google for info on this.

[Gentlemommy]

The only time we had lice, we had it taken care of in a few hours. We had a de-lousing company come and comb us all. After two hours, they proclaimed us lice free and said we could go about our normal activities. I wouldn't trust the chemical solutions, but the combing companies take care of it immediately. If the mom is pregnant, this might be worth mentioning to her.

[kroe1]

She needs to stay home. Lice are now resistant to most over the counter box treatments. She needs to wait at least 7 days and at, least one second treatment before risking exposure to others.

[catz]

We've had lice twice. With a good metal nit comb and a lot of conditioner,we never saw a live louse after 24 hours. We kept hair oiled and covered for several days. You keep combing after that to catch eggs. Eggs are not contagious. Only live active adult lice are. We do not use the toxic chemicals.

 

The kid you know that has lice is not the kid dangerous to you. Lice don't jump or live long off the head. You know not to be doing head to head selfies with them or sharing combs. It's the kid that you don't know has lice that you will get it from.

 

 

The vast majority of the time people are reinfected, it is because they are not following up long enough to make sure all nits are eliminated on the head. That takes 2-3 weeks. That does not mean you need to be quarantined for that long. Read up on how the experts eliminate and on the lice life cycle. Experts can get nits off the head efficiently and quickly. We can do these the same with good follow up. If you miss an egg or 2 you can find yourself with full blown lice again in 4-6 weeks.

 

If someone requested a date change, that would be fine. I wouldn't think to cancel.

 

And now my head itches!

Edited August 12, 2016 by WoolySocks

[Bluegoat]

I've never seen lice that the box treatments kill, at best they slow them down so they are easier to catch.  And from what I've read, that is typical.

 

I think one of the problems people are having is that boxed treatments are just giving a false sense of security these days because they tell people the lice will be dead after one treatment, and it just isn't true.  The only way to really get rid of them is daily combing, in combination with something to slow down the lice and loosen the eggs.

 

However, if you know about them it isn't hard to avoid them at an event like you describe - something like camp or a sleep over would be a different story.  But I also would not think it is far out if the host wasn't keen, especially with so much already on her plate - I would offer to keep my kids home for sure, and maybe just visit another time.  If it was something like a once a year opportunity to see grandparents, I would try and figure out a solution that worked for all.

[Bluegoat]

If the treatment is approved and effective: whatever the directions say about how soon contact is safe are most likely correct. I'd expect the family member to follow the instructions on the box, then not worry about it (unless she had reason to believe she was dealing with super lice).

 

If you are uncomfortable even if she is fine according to the box, you could say, "Hey, to be on the safe side I'd rather postpone. I'm sorry, I know it's not the best, but, I've decided to be better safe than sorry. How about (date) instead?"

 

If she's doing home remedies, oil of idiocy, or anything other than the pharmacist's best recommendation, I'd definitely postpone. (With the same 'better safe than sorry / I've made up my mind' rhetoric as above, not engaging on efficacy debates.)

 

Edited to add; with pregnancy and unpacking as discribed, I'd lean very far towards 'better safe than sorry' and advise the infected family to warm the house in a couple of weeks when they can be absolutely certian they aren't bringing even a single stow away.

 

Pharmasists have given me terrible advice about lice that meant we didn't get rid of it.  The year there was a lot of lice in our neighbourhood I had to look to other information to find something that worked reliably.

[Valley Girl]

If it were me, I'd keep the kids home. I just saw some headlines about most lice being resistant to treatment. Even if treatment were working, I would not want to risk inadvertently making making more work for the pregnant mom of many who is unpacking a new home. Why give her one more thing to have to worry about?

[catz]

Pharmasists have given me terrible advice about lice that meant we didn't get rid of it.  The year there was a lot of lice in our neighbourhood I had to look to other information to find something that worked reliably.

 

I think this is a good point.  There is quite a bit of misinformation out there about lice.  I feel like I could do a dissertation on it now. 

 

When my kids were younger after sleep overs, I'd have them shower and I would do a single quick comb through.  Pretty easy way to get rid of a stray lice or 2 that might lead to a full blown case.  Both times our family had lice, I suspect it was from sleep overs.

 

Anyway, it helps to know the family and what kind of follow up they'd do.  Someone who really understood the lice life cycle and had a good metal nit comb should definitely be able to be not contagious within 48 hours easily. 

 

I can understand why someone 8 months pregnant would be hesitant and twitchy. 

[ktgrok]

Pregnant mom of that many kids? If I were that mom, I'd reschedule. I'd be diplomatic, and say "oh, I know I'm being way overprotective, but pregnancy hormones have my anxiety peaking and I just cannot handle worrying about one more thing. I'm sure we can't actually catch it, but I'd be up half the night worrying, you know how hormonal you get. Can we just reschedule?"

[JonesinIndiana]

They need to stay home!!!

 

We've had it twice and been professionally combed both times. Expensive but worth it. In one of the incidents, we were flying out of town a few days later to see family. (Elderly, nursing home parents and my sister who had cancer.) There was NO WAY I was going to risk bringing lice. I combed everybody infected the whole time we were there. There weren't any nits or lice. Girls had hair up w lots of spray and products in it. We didn't transmit it to any family, I would have known about it. I'm the lice expert in the family. 😉

[Ravin]

If she's doing home remedies, oil of idiocy, or anything other than the pharmacist's best recommendation, I'd definitely postpone. (With the same 'better safe than sorry / I've made up my mind' rhetoric as above, not engaging on efficacy debates.)

 

I will reiterate what others have said about not all pelicucides being particularly effective, and that the right home remedy (repeated combing twice a day for several weeks and oil or conditioner on hair) is.

 

If it's my one sister's version of a home remedy, I would tend to agree with you. She twice has shaved her own and her son's hair, and cut short and bleached her daughter's hair as the "cure". But that's as much because I wouldn't want to embarrass her poor kids with pictures as fear of catching lice.

 

My mom relies on the pharmacy solution and my littlest sister had a case of lice that took months of cycling through this with several recurrences.

 

We have caught lice twice (once from my littlest sister which then spread to my sister mentioned above's kids thanks to mine before we caught it because mom had supposedly had littlest sister's case licked). One of the times, I used the shampoo. Both times, combing and keeping hair oiled (I used a blend of olive and coconut oil with a few drops of tea tree oil in it, but some kinds of conditioner work too) ensured we got rid of them quickly and for once and all.

 

I DID use pelicucide spray on a few surfaces I couldn't wash (car upholstery) and washed EVERYTHING I could; anything that couldn't be washed but could, remotely, maybe hide a louse for five minutes was bagged in plastic for a full month to ensure they were all dead, dead, dead.

[Bluegoat]

I've actually never had much luck with combing - my kids hair just slips through all the combs.  I have to very carefully sort through their hair and remove everything by hand.  I try and imagine that I am a chimpanzee.

[redsquirrel]

I've actually never had much luck with combing - my kids hair just slips through all the combs.  I have to very carefully sort through their hair and remove everything by hand.  I try and imagine that I am a chimpanzee.

 

My friend had the same problem combing out her kid's hair. He was the kid who gave us lice, lol.  She had been combing through after a shower or even with dry hair but saying his hair was so fine it just slipped through.  I suggested she goop his hair up with conditioner or cetaphil cleanser, anything thick, and then comb it out.  Basically, the comb should be coming off each swipe of the hair with a load of conditioner and lice and nits. Or, just conditioner if you are lice free. That is how much you need.  But you do it with a comb in one hand and a paper towel in the other, and you comb and wipe, comb and wipe.  Occasionally swish your comb in water to get a better grip, but there should be enough conditioner than it comes off with the comb. I use clips to keep whatever I am not combing up out of the way and do the hair section by section.

 

For her, combing the hair out while it was heavily coated with conditioner did the trick. It gave the comb something to work with and the conditioner trapped the lice. She still had to do it a couple times, but the comb was able to do its job.

 

Oh, and a good comb also makes a difference. That thing that comes with the shampoo is useless.  I got a licemeister and it worked beautifully. No hand cramping from a too small handle, and it didn't slide around in my hand with all the conditioner.

 

[zoobie]

If I were the infested family member, I'd stay home unless I knew I'd gotten everything. Not used the bottle of pointless shampoo, but combed like a psychotic chimpanzee and been clean or been to one of the professional services. If she goes and shares the love, I hope she comes back to comb all those heads for endless hours later or pays for a service for them and arranges transport. 

[Bluegoat]

My friend had the same problem combing out her kid's hair. He was the kid who gave us lice, lol.  She had been combing through after a shower or even with dry hair but saying his hair was so fine it just slipped through.  I suggested she goop his hair up with conditioner or cetaphil cleanser, anything thick, and then comb it out.  Basically, the comb should be coming off each swipe of the hair with a load of conditioner and lice and nits. Or, just conditioner if you are lice free. That is how much you need.  But you do it with a comb in one hand and a paper towel in the other, and you comb and wipe, comb and wipe.  Occasionally swish your comb in water to get a better grip, but there should be enough conditioner than it comes off with the comb. I use clips to keep whatever I am not combing up out of the way and do the hair section by section.

 

For her, combing the hair out while it was heavily coated with conditioner did the trick. It gave the comb something to work with and the conditioner trapped the lice. She still had to do it a couple times, but the comb was able to do its job.

 

Oh, and a good comb also makes a difference. That thing that comes with the shampoo is useless.  I got a licemeister and it worked beautifully. No hand cramping from a too small handle, and it didn't slide around in my hand with all the conditioner.

 

 

I'll keep my fingers crossed that I won't have to try this.

 

A friend of mine told me she has had good luck with using a mouthwash rince on for an hour under a bag before combing to really loosen the eggs.

[catz]

My friend had the same problem combing out her kid's hair. He was the kid who gave us lice, lol.  She had been combing through after a shower or even with dry hair but saying his hair was so fine it just slipped through.  I suggested she goop his hair up with conditioner or cetaphil cleanser, anything thick, and then comb it out.  Basically, the comb should be coming off each swipe of the hair with a load of conditioner and lice and nits. Or, just conditioner if you are lice free. That is how much you need.  But you do it with a comb in one hand and a paper towel in the other, and you comb and wipe, comb and wipe.  Occasionally swish your comb in water to get a better grip, but there should be enough conditioner than it comes off with the comb. I use clips to keep whatever I am not combing up out of the way and do the hair section by section.

 

For her, combing the hair out while it was heavily coated with conditioner did the trick. It gave the comb something to work with and the conditioner trapped the lice. She still had to do it a couple times, but the comb was able to do its job.

 

Oh, and a good comb also makes a difference. That thing that comes with the shampoo is useless.  I got a licemeister and it worked beautifully. No hand cramping from a too small handle, and it didn't slide around in my hand with all the conditioner.

 

 

My kids have fine hair and this is what worked for us.  TONS of conditioner.  Dry combing does not work at all.  I noticed after a few days of conditioner, nits would just slip off if we'd still physically see any at that point.  And if you follow up with the comb for 3 weeks every few days, you'd catch anything before they became able to reproduce or move much on the head.  

 

Comb quality makes a big difference.  I would use a pick, then a plastic fine tooth comb to detangle and arrange the hair into sections.  Then I had 2 high quality metal nit combs and would rotate which one I used.  The first couple days would take an hour on my dd's long hair.  We fully eliminated with no reinfection both times we had it. 

 

Here's a combing schedule I used.

http://www.microscopy-uk.org.uk/theliceprogram/

 

ETA - Ladibugs makes my favorite lice comb.  Isn't that a fun thing to say.  It's a double row of very fine metal tines.  It was hard to get through my kids fine hair.  And it has a good handle.  We have used their hair product too.  I really think the combing does the trick, but this does work as good comb through and works as a first defense to "deactivate" a newly discovered case.

http://www.ladibugsinc.com/lice-elimination/

Edited August 12, 2016 by WoolySocks

[redsquirrel]

I'll keep my fingers crossed that I won't have to try this.

 

A friend of mine told me she has had good luck with using a mouthwash rince on for an hour under a bag before combing to really loosen the eggs.

 

Lice glue is one of the strongest in nature. I doubt alcohol, which is what is in most mouthwash, is going to do a thing.  I was able to get a BAD lice infestation under control in 3 days with a good comb, some clips and conditioner.  To be clear, I didn't know it was under control in three days until time had passed. But after three days, three of the four of us didn't have anything show up with combing and the fourth was cleared up maybe by day 5.  And his head was infested...I cannot stress how bad it was.  It had been going on for quite a while and he was a little itchy, but he's an itchy kid. He's got excema etc. Even he discounted the idea of lice.  It wasn't until I caught it, and I am allergic to lice, that we knew. By then my son had been living with it for a while.  I felt like such a bad mom.  I still feel guilty just thinking about it.  I should have known or done a better job of checking his head. 

 

I did learn a lot though.  Like you don't have to do all that washing and cleaning.  A louse off a human head is going to die quickly. We did change pillow cases and sheets daily, but that was it.  I did take his stuffed animals off his bed, but I put them on the floor for a week. Lice aren't like fleas.  I think a flea infestation is much worse.

[Bluegoat]

Lice glue is one of the strongest in nature. I doubt alcohol, which is what is in most mouthwash, is going to do a thing.  I was able to get a BAD lice infestation under control in 3 days with a good comb, some clips and conditioner.  To be clear, I didn't know it was under control in three days until time had passed. But after three days, three of the four of us didn't have anything show up with combing and the fourth was cleared up maybe by day 5.  And his head was infested...I cannot stress how bad it was.  It had been going on for quite a while and he was a little itchy, but he's an itchy kid. He's got excema etc. Even he discounted the idea of lice.  It wasn't until I caught it, and I am allergic to lice, that we knew. By then my son had been living with it for a while.  I felt like such a bad mom.  I still feel guilty just thinking about it.  I should have known or done a better job of checking his head. 

 

I did learn a lot though.  Like you don't have to do all that washing and cleaning.  A louse off a human head is going to die quickly. We did change pillow cases and sheets daily, but that was it.  I did take his stuffed animals off his bed, but I put them on the floor for a week. Lice aren't like fleas.  I think a flea infestation is much worse.

 

My dd11 had them really badly like that.  I had checked but didn't really know what I was looking for, and so then I foolihly assumed we were in the clear.  By the time I caught on they were the size of ponies.

 

That was our lice year - dd kept getting them from the kid up the street, who I think was getting them from school.  I became pretty good at clearing them out once I figured out not to believe what the box directions said.

 

I agree about the cleaning and fleas.  Flea infestations in the house are so difficult to get rid of, they are tough little buggers.  They seem to be much less common now that most people use the drugs for pets.

[momacacia]

Stay home, for heavens sake! The host is 8mo pregnant and unpacking?! Give the woman a break. The last thing she needs is the "head plague" to deal with, and frankly I'd be mortified if my kids had lice and we knowingly gave it to someone else.

[QueenCat]

They need to stay home and not attend. And they shouldn't be suggesting they are coming or that the host should cancel (unless these guests are the only guests).

[cjzimmer1]

If you were having a large family gathering and one of the family members found out two days before the gathering that her children had lice, would you expect the family member with lice to stay home?  Said family member is treating it so would it be safe for the family member to bring her children?

 

I've never had lice but just thought of of having to deal with it gives me the heeby jebbies.  I don't know how long it takes to get rid of lice but personally if I knew someone had it just two days ago, I'd be keeping myself and my kids a far distance away from anyone of them.  I'd probably skip the event if other family was coming.

well the family member who is hosting(it's a house warming) is 8 months pregnant with her 5th child, all under the age of 8.  She just moved into a new home and is still unpacking.  She doesn't want to run the risk of having something else to deal with.  If it were my kids with lice I would probably just stay home.

with this update, yeah there is no way I'd let infected family in my house.  I'm sure some would consider that mean but it's also pretty unkind of infected family to expected this mom to take the risk that they have truly eliminated every possible lice.  I would hope everyone involved would realize that sometimes the risk of infecting others outweighs your own desires.

[catz]

Stay home, for heavens sake! The host is 8mo pregnant and unpacking?! Give the woman a break. The last thing she needs is the "head plague" to deal with, and frankly I'd be mortified if my kids had lice and we knowingly gave it to someone else.

 

I think why is the 8 month pregnant lady with 4 little kids hosting is a better question.  LOL.  She should just cancel for any reason at this point.

 

But as someone who has had very successfully treated lice twice and knows a professional lice lady, with GOOD treatment, kids would not be carriers of live lice at 48 hours.   It would not occur to me to cancel or even inform.  I'd be informing people I'd been with for the previous week or 2 in any intimate way.  And that's not playing outside at a park.  That would be curled up on couches watching movies, sharing clothes, sleep overs, in our space for a significant amount of time, etc.   It was nice of her to inform.   Less than 24-36 hours and time for 2-3 comb throughs, I would cancel.  I'd expect the last comb through to be "clean" - no live lice found.

 

I do think there a lot of misconceptions about lice and how you catch them and their life cycle.  A flea infestation is WAY worse this way. 

 

ETA

Q. What makes someone contagious?

A. What makes someone contagious with head lice is having a mature, egg-laying adult female louse on your head that could travel to another head. After the first treatment, when the egg-laying lice are eliminated, you are no longer contagious. (blah blah blah about eliminating nits in an ongoing way ...)

 

Edited August 12, 2016 by WoolySocks

[Melissa in Australia]

Lice can absolutely jump. We have seen it happen with our own eyes. When we had our lice I got the kids to sit still for their hour or so of daily combing by putting a microscope in front of them so they could look at the lice as we found them. We discovered that conditioned only renders the louse unconscious and after about five minutes they can jump right off the slide. One jumped about 30 cm. very scientific descoverythat shocked us all here

[zarabellesmom]

As someone who spent all last weekend dealing with lice... They were discovered Saturday morning and by Sunday (complete second combing) we appear to be lice free(checking everyday obviously)...48 hrs was all it took to clear them. I never want to deal with that again. It makes my head itch just thinking about it. I would ask them to stay away.