Farrar Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 I am 57. My parents did not get social security numbers for us until the third or fourth child was born, so I was either 9 or 14. We have sequential social security numbers, as if we are triplets or quadruplets. And they didn't need to put them on their taxes then, either. That was a later requirement. Right. My brother and I didn't get them until I was a young teen and I'm not even that old. But it's different now. My step-sibs are just a little younger and I believe they had them from birth. My children had them from birth, certainly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bettyandbob Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 I'm wondering how old you are, because I'm 51 and my parents got my social security number for me when I was a baby. I don't recall any of my friends needing to apply for SSNs when we were applying for our first jobs or getting our driver's permits or licenses, either. I'm pretty sure everyone already had their SSNs. I'm 49. My parents got my SSN when I was young, but most of my friends didn't get one until 15-16, for driving and jobs. Now, most get it as infants because your dc must have one if you claim him/her on your taxes. I don't know when that started, but it was required when I had my oldest (20). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKL Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 I'm wondering how old you are, because I'm 51 and my parents got my social security number for me when I was a baby. I don't recall any of my friends needing to apply for SSNs when we were applying for our first jobs or getting our driver's permits or licenses, either. I'm pretty sure everyone already had their SSNs. I was born in 1966. My younger sister (1968) didn't have an SSN until 16 either. Not sure about my much younger siblings. I didn't go around telling everyone I was applying for my SSN. It was such a minor thing, it wasn't worth a conversation that would be remembered 35 years later. (I had a bank account at age 13 despite having no SSN. I don't know if they require SSN to open a bank account nowadays.) If you had taxable income of your own at a younger age, or trusts, or anything like that which might have required a filing of tax info, then maybe your parents got you a SSN earlier for that reason. Or maybe in your family / community, that was what was done. I know I remember a lot of moaning and groaning when they made the rule that you needed to get your kids SSNs to take them as dependents. It took me years to get my kids' SSNs, because I had to do some other formalities first in order for their SSN to be in their current name. I filed a couple years' taxes without their SSNs. Nowadays you can get a temporary SSN in that situation. I don't know if there is a temporary SSN option for Alecia's situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean in Newcastle Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 I got mine when I was 16 too. Mine was a big deal because I had to get time off of school to go to the embassy but that was only because it was official hooky! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChocolateReignRemix Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 I'm wondering how old you are, because I'm 51 and my parents got my social security number for me when I was a baby. I don't recall any of my friends needing to apply for SSNs when we were applying for our first jobs or getting our driver's permits or licenses, either. I'm pretty sure everyone already had their SSNs. Many people didn't used to get SSNs until they entered the work force. I got mine when I was 15 or so and the tax laws changed to require one to claim a child as a dependent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MFG Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 I'm 49. My parents got my SSN when I was young, but most of my friends didn't get one until 15-16, for driving and jobs. Now, most get it as infants because your dc must have one if you claim him/her on your taxes. I don't know when that started, but it was required when I had my oldest (20). The requirement of SSN to claim a child as a tax deduction went into effect during the time I had young children. My guess is @1987. ETA: guess my memory is pretty good. http://money.usnews.com/money/blogs/planning-to-retire/2011/05/06/why-we-assign-social-security-numbers-at-birth The Tax Reform Act of 1986 required that every dependent age five or older listed on a tax return have their own Social Security number, which led to a spike in demand for Social Security numbers for children at earlier ages. The Social Security Administration developed an enumeration-at-birth process in 1987, which quickly became the way the majority of people apply for Social Security numbers. Now parents indicate on the birth certificate form whether they want a Social Security number assigned to their newborn child. When the state vital statistics office receives the request with the birth registration data from the hospital, it forwards the information to the Social Security Administration and a number and card are issued for the child. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sneezyone Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 FTR, bank accounts these days do require SSNs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justasque Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Yeah, and what about college kids who pay for school on their own because their family can't afford to help, but have to live with less financial aid because aid is mainly calculated on PARENTS' income? It doesn't matter if the kid is even living at home or not. The government still requires parental information until around 24 unless the kid is married. Seriously?!?!? 24???? The FAFSA is messed up. Is there a viable alternative? Unless we move to a system where the neighbors/taxpayers pay for everyone's college education regardless of income, then we have to have some way to sort out who is most in need of the limited amount of need-based funding made available by the students' neighbors (taxpayers). Since most students don't have much, if any, personal income, we look to the parents' income. The FAFSA is an imperfect way to sort out "we can't afford it because we never had the money in the first place" from "we can't afford it because we spent it all on the $20K kitchen upgrade last year" and "we can afford it but we want to milk the government (neighbors) for as much as we can before spending our own money". Any time you try to create a process like the FAFSA, you end up with people whose circumstances aren't a good fit for the formula. A family's financial life on paper doesn't always reflect their reality. However, it's a balance between being able to more precisely identify those students most in need of the limited funding, and having to ask for much, much more information about how a family's money has been earned and how it has been spent. There are circumstances under which a student can bypass the need for the parents' info for the FAFSA, but the guidelines are very tightly drawn, presumably to protect the neighbors (taxpayers) from being asked to fund the education of children whose parents have chosen to spend money that could have been used for college on other things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arcadia Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 (I had a bank account at age 13 despite having no SSN. I don't know if they require SSN to open a bank account nowadays.) The bank did need a birth certificate or passport when I opened my kids ITF accounts. Their ITIN or SSN was not required. A child opening a non-custodial account would need their SSN. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eternalsummer Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 I don't agree with any of the parents' past choices that I know about. However, I don't think we have enough facts to say there was "abuse," and I really hate the whole "get it out on the internet" thing. It stinks. (Not the same thing, but the "public shaming" thread is somewhat applicable here.) Sure, it coerces people to do things, but that's no better than what the parents were allegedly doing to this girl. I guess that's what she's learned from them, perhaps. Sad. But she's coercing them to do something that is their absolute moral obligation to have done already - the very first time she asked, regardless of how she had behaved toward them in the past. She would not have had the opportunity to coerce them via public shaming if they had done the correct thing in the first place. There is no excuse for not providing an adult with their legal paperwork. I mean, if you had someone's passport and drivers license and birth certificate and social security card that they had left at your house accidentally, and they called to say "can you send me my documents," it wouldn't matter how they had treated you when they were at your house or afterward - you'd have to send it, right? And that is for someone who left their things at your house! This girl, because of her parents, had no documents to leave. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Word Nerd Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 I'm wondering how old you are, because I'm 51 and my parents got my social security number for me when I was a baby. I don't recall any of my friends needing to apply for SSNs when we were applying for our first jobs or getting our driver's permits or licenses, either. I'm pretty sure everyone already had their SSNs. I'm in my early 40s and didn't have one until I was a tween or so. My younger sisters and I got them at the same time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farrar Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Really what it comes down to is that doing anything that will severely limit a person's functionality in the world for their whole lives is abusive. SSN's and birth certificates are necessary in the world now. End of story. Just because they weren't at one point doesn't really change that. Just because some people distrust the government doesn't change it either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 I don't know about being full of crap, but I was certainly surprised that she needed more. I was able to obtain documentation with a baptismal record and a a well-child checkup paper when I was about 17. The difference is I was under age, I suppose. It was a hassle, but doable in my case. I was also in another state, which may matter. Anyway, I hope she is able to get what she needs. It's difficult being 19 and unable to start a life. I'm not surprised. I got a letter from the Healthcare Marketplace asking me to prove that one of my children and I are citizens (I posted about it). DS has all the proper legal documents but nothing from the "approved document" list. The government is crazy most of the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joker Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Read on Facebook that she asked people not to bash her parents' reputation. I think she opened that door by taking to social media. I actually think the parents opened that door by not doing the right thing from the beginning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eternalsummer Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Really what it comes down to is that doing anything that will severely limit a person's functionality in the world for their whole lives is abusive. SSN's and birth certificates are necessary in the world now. End of story. Just because they weren't at one point doesn't really change that. Just because some people distrust the government doesn't change it either. I can see not having filed the paperwork when she was born, if they were concerned about government this or that. That's their thing, whatever. But once she is an adult and wants to get registered, become part of the system - then they have the immediate obligation to make that possible for her, since they didn't before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caroline Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 I'm wondering how old you are, because I'm 51 and my parents got my social security number for me when I was a baby. I don't recall any of my friends needing to apply for SSNs when we were applying for our first jobs or getting our driver's permits or licenses, either. I'm pretty sure everyone already had their SSNs. I'm in my mid forties. I know I had one before my younger sister was born because my older sister's and mine are sequential and my younger sister's is not. So before I was three and my older sister was five. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anne in CA Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 I heard somewhere that the difference between bad parenting, and evil parenting is that an evil parent deliberately limits what their child can do as an adult. I know some very awful parents, but most of them were/ are just ignorant. When a parent, for any reason at all, limits the future of their child deliberately, in my mind it crosses the line of abuse. My mom hates paperwork. But she and my dad filled out FAFSA for four kids. It didn't work, none of us got financial aide because my dad is a rancher and always had a lot of gross income and they only counted that, they never counted the fact that he lost money as many years as he made money in the eighties and nineties, but he always had a high gross income. But they always made the effort. My mom was not a great parent to me in many ways, but she never tried to stop me from getting a job or going to college. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardenmom5 Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 ChocolateReign, on 13 Feb 2015 - 12:33 PM, said: Odds a midwife has kept records from a birth 19 years ago? Slim. there is also the fact texas requires midwives to be licensed. midwives in texas are required to file birth certificates - and it is apparent this one did NOT. maybe the parents requested none be filed (as they are against registration - none of the kids have a bc) and maybe she didn't because she would potentially be in trouble with the state for not being licensed. maybe she has the same weird beliefs as the parents about tinfoil gov't. the midwife was contacted, and she refused to help. reason was not given. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farrar Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 You know what I hope? And it probably has not happened, but I suspect that the Penningtons have been in a complete echo chamber where everyone around them has been nodding and supporting their decisions, saying what great parents they are and so forth. I hope this is holding a mirror up for them. Because it does seem that they love their kids, they're just also abusive and controlling. They think they're controlling to help their kids when actually it's damaging them. I guess I hope the outrage the world feels toward them right now is making them question themselves. I mean, it's not likely, but I can hope. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKL Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 But she's coercing them to do something that is their absolute moral obligation to have done already - the very first time she asked, regardless of how she had behaved toward them in the past. She would not have had the opportunity to coerce them via public shaming if they had done the correct thing in the first place. There is no excuse for not providing an adult with their legal paperwork. So do you think a 19yo daughter does not have a moral obligation to speak to her parents and show some respect for them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardenmom5 Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 ChocolateReign, on 13 Feb 2015 - 12:53 PM, said:Many people didn't used to get SSNs until they entered the work force. I got mine when I was 15 or so and the tax laws changed to require one to claim a child as a dependent. and if people really want to go to the beginning of ssns . . . . it used to be only certain types of employment required ssns. I do genealogy, and there are a lot of deceased from old age people out there with no ssn, even though they died in the 40s, or even the 50s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lang Syne Boardie Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 So do you think a 19yo daughter does not have a moral obligation to speak to her parents and show some respect for them? Strawman. Nobody's business. Let's not confuse our personal opinions about family togetherness with our understanding of a legal citizen's rights to her own papers and information. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ipsey Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 So do you think a 19yo daughter does not have a moral obligation to speak to her parents and show some respect for them? No. I certainly would not make a blanket statement "a 19yo daughter has a moral obligation to speak to her parents and show some respect for them." Absolutely not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKL Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Really what it comes down to is that doing anything that will severely limit a person's functionality in the world for their whole lives is abusive. SSN's and birth certificates are necessary in the world now. End of story. Just because they weren't at one point doesn't really change that. Just because some people distrust the government doesn't change it either. Her older siblings supposedly don't have BCs and they seem to be getting by. So I don't know if "necessary" is the right word. Expedient, certainly. Honestly I can't personally imagine not having those basic documents for my kids, but that doesn't mean it's "abuse." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardenmom5 Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 SKL, on 13 Feb 2015 - 1:30 PM, said:SKL, on 13 Feb 2015 - 1:30 PM, said:So do you think a 19yo daughter does not have a moral obligation to speak to her parents and show some respect for them? so, do you think parents of ADULT children have the right to demand subservient behavior from their ADULT children? that their ADULT children should live in their house, and abide by their rules? that parents of ADULT children should be allowed to dictate that ADULT child's every action - including forbidding/inhibiting moving out of the parental home and living an independent life? alecia attempted to speak with her parents. they *said* they were willing to give her what she wanted - but they also wanted her to move back home and do exactly what they said. those are NOT the actions of *reasonable* or loving parents who want their child to have a successful life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardenmom5 Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 SKL, on 13 Feb 2015 - 1:38 PM, said: Her older siblings supposedly don't have BCs and they seem to be getting by. So I don't know if "necessary" is the right word. Expedient, certainly. Honestly I can't personally imagine not having those basic documents for my kids, but that doesn't mean it's "abuse." they all live at home. that's hardly living an adult life. attempting to control/manipulate another person against their will IS abusive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eternalsummer Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 So do you think a 19yo daughter does not have a moral obligation to speak to her parents and show some respect for them? Not on the same level that the parents have to provide essential legal documents to their rightful owner (the daughter). They would have the same obligation if they somehow had the legal documents for someone they weren't related to. Their obligation to provide these documents to her has NOTHING TO DO with how she behaves towards them. Trying to insist that they will provide the documents (that she needs to get a job, a bank account, a place to live, independent transportation, be able vote, etc.) when she behaves a certain way is indefensible. This is not something they get to trade for something from her. It's almost like (although much worse than, honestly) if your kid had some sort of money that you were the guardian/caretaker of until they came of age. Maybe you were taking care of a foster kid? And they had $200,000 in a bag in the basement that was theirs by inheritance, or something, but you were holding for them until they came of age. And then the kid comes of age, and moves out, and you get in a fight with them about whatever because the kid is being rebellious/rude toward you. And the kid has no $, so they call to say, please send me the $200,000 that is legally mine. And you say, no, I'll give it to you when you start being respectful. !!! I think not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farrar Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Her older siblings supposedly don't have BCs and they seem to be getting by. So I don't know if "necessary" is the right word. Expedient, certainly. Honestly I can't personally imagine not having those basic documents for my kids, but that doesn't mean it's "abuse." They're all living at home where the parents have gone and vouched for them with other documents because they're abiding by the rules the parents have set out. If they were to leave, they might encounter the same problems. It might take them longer, but eventually they would hit up against the need for a birth certificate. They can't get a passport and leave the country without one, for example. It's not expedient. It's necessary. And the only reason the other kids are "getting by" is that they're playing nice so the parents are helping them. I find it shocking and deeply wrong that anyone should think that it's okay to purposefully prevent your child from having one of the basic identity documents that would allow them to get a job, pay taxes, prove their citizenship so they won't be deported to nowhere, and attend college without their parents. This thread just keeps going in circles. People keep raising the same objections over and over and over and they've been clearly answered. The government - the judge - told her she needed this document. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eternalsummer Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Her older siblings supposedly don't have BCs and they seem to be getting by. So I don't know if "necessary" is the right word. Expedient, certainly. Honestly I can't personally imagine not having those basic documents for my kids, but that doesn't mean it's "abuse." Well, without one, can she get a driver's license? Can she vote? Can she open a bank account? Can she get a job? If the parents are deliberately keeping her from doing any of these things, as an adult, what is it? Just okay? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joker Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Her older siblings supposedly don't have BCs and they seem to be getting by. So I don't know if "necessary" is the right word. Expedient, certainly. Honestly I can't personally imagine not having those basic documents for my kids, but that doesn't mean it's "abuse." They are getting by because the parents helped them get the documents they needed. They refused to do this for the daughter who dared to move out. They say they will help now after she went public, so we'll see. I'm baffled that anyone thinks what they've done is okay or not really that big a deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChocolateReignRemix Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Her older siblings supposedly don't have BCs and they seem to be getting by. So I don't know if "necessary" is the right word. Expedient, certainly. Honestly I can't personally imagine not having those basic documents for my kids, but that doesn't mean it's "abuse." Her older siblings are also living at home and don't hold employment outside of the home. If this girl wants to go to college, get a job, a bank account or whatever else then she needs a SSN. I have no idea why this concept is so difficult for you to grasp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChocolateReignRemix Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 This thread just keeps going in circles. People keep raising the same objections over and over and over and they've been clearly answered. The government - the judge - told her she needed this document. But if we don't hear the judge say that why should we believe her? Obviously she is lying for...reasons. smh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eternalsummer Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 I might question her if the parents said, hey, she doesn't need this stuff, we gave her a BC a long time ago and she's just making this up but that's not what they said they said (basically) she's right, we need to give her these documents and we will! just as soon as she does what we demand Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
umsami Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 I'm glad that her Dad appears to be willing to cooperate. I also think it's good that she's asking people not to trash her parents on Facebook, even though it's very tempting. I honestly never knew there were people who avoided SSNs and birth certificates. I know people who were a bit late in registering a home birth, but at least among the people I know, even my more off-the-grid type friends, they recognize the need for a birth certificate for DLs, etc. I do wonder what is going to happen with SSNs now with all the cyber theft and such. Will it become easier to change one? How would that work? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lang Syne Boardie Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Honor your parents. If you aren't honoring them (for life), it's your fault, you're bad, and there is no chance at all that they are not being honored because they aren't honorable. It's not them. It's you, Bad Seed. And of course, parents, by rights get to define, what they want "honor" to look like, reason and law notwithstanding. Handed down from God and goes double for homeschooling families. QED. As long as these presuppositions hold, the threads about children's rights will always go in circles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChocolateReignRemix Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 I'm glad that her Dad appears to be willing to cooperate. I also think it's good that she's asking people not to trash her parents on Facebook, even though it's very tempting. I honestly never knew there were people who avoided SSNs and birth certificates. I know people who were a bit late in registering a home birth, but at least among the people I know, even my more off-the-grid type friends, they recognize the need for a birth certificate for DLs, etc. I do wonder what is going to happen with SSNs now with all the cyber theft and such. Will it become easier to change one? How would that work? There is a variety of birth certificate woo. There are some who believe that if they do not register a child's birth, then the child is not a "subject of the state" and the state has no jurisdiction over them and they can never be removed by social services. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
umsami Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 There is a variety of birth certificate woo. There are some who believe that if they do not register a child's birth, then the child is not a "subject of the state" and the state has no jurisdiction over them and they can never be removed by social services. Bizarre, but interesting...thanks for posting. I'm assuming if CPS sees a child in need, they're not going to care about a SSN/birth certificate. Heck, they'd probably use that as further evidence in the case of neglect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TranquilMind Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 And what seems to be her parent's decision to sacrifice their children's futures on their altar of "alternative" and conspiracy theories? https://homeschoolersanonymous.wordpress.com/2015/02/10/when-your-very-identity-is-held-hostage-alecia-pennington-and-identification-abuse/ How did they manage not to get a SSN for her? The IRS demands that info every year. That's just crazy on their part not to ever get ID for her. At any moment in her childhood, the parents could have been requested to present a birth certificate for any of a number of reasons, and risk losing her if they didn't have one. Who knows what is really going on here? I read the parents' accounts linked down at the bottom, and of course, they contradict her version and say that they are perfectly willing to sign anything to help her get a birth certificate and other ID. It does seem odd that they never made sure to get copies and an SSN, so that she could be claimed as a dependent on taxes, though. They state that their other children have this documentation. She does need to talk to them to get their assistance. Apparently, she abruptly left without any warning at all. A copy of the blog post says that Alecia sent her parents a list of requests to which they agreed to comply and she still refused to return home. So who knows.... I would think that the daughter would get her ducks in a row and somehow manage to get her parents to help her get a birth certificate, at least before she took off. She could have told them that she was hoping to get a part time job to help out, or something. I'm sorry this happened to her. Hopefully, someone in government will help her out. I've never heard of any parent not getting a birth certificate, ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TranquilMind Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 There is a variety of birth certificate woo. There are some who believe that if they do not register a child's birth, then the child is not a "subject of the state" and the state has no jurisdiction over them and they can never be removed by social services. That's just silly. I can't imagine anyone would believe that actively refusing to get a birth certificate somehow means your child is beyond the reach of police powers of the state. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 So do you think a 19yo daughter does not have a moral obligation to speak to her parents and show some respect for them? Not all parents deserve respect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TranquilMind Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Her older siblings are also living at home and don't hold employment outside of the home. If this girl wants to go to college, get a job, a bank account or whatever else then she needs a SSN. I have no idea why this concept is so difficult for you to grasp. In the mom's posted (archived) blog post, she said the other kids DO have documentation. Hard to tell whom to believe here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TranquilMind Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Do you have a link? i can't seem to find their response. It is at the bottom of the OP's link. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imagine.more Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Why is there no way for an adult to get the necessary documents without parental assistance? There are lots of crazy parents, there should be a way for their children to cut ties and move forward. Yes, this is a big problem for children all the way up to age 24 and beyond. My parents, mainstream public schoolers all the way and typical secular suburban parents, didn't want to meet with me to give me my records either after my mother kicked me and my 2 sisters out at ages 18, 19 and 20 in a drunken tantrum. We all were enrolled in college and struggled so much to get these basic documents. I was able to get my documents after a few months thankfully! But FAFSA was a nightmare every year tracking my dad down and trying to persuade him that I truly needed him to fill it out or I would get no financial aid. I looked into emancipation but it would have been a huge hassle and cost money that I didn't have. So yeah, it's a bit frustrating that the article is touting this as a homeschool issue when it's not really. Though I will say the whole not having a birth certificate at all is super odd and does seem to be more common among extremist homebirthers and homeschoolers. And I say this as a homebirther and homeschooler, lol! My baby has a birth certificate for sure, I can't see any reputable midwife not doing that basic service as part of the birth process. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TranquilMind Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Well, go ahead with your denim jumper bad self, but I am sticking to yoga pants.......yup, you heard that right, YOGA PANTS! You Floozie! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrairieSong Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 How did they manage not to get a SSN for her? The IRS demands that info every year. That's just crazy on their part not to ever get ID for her. At any moment in her childhood, the parents could have been requested to present a birth certificate for any of a number of reasons, and risk losing her if they didn't have one. Who knows what is really going on here? I read the parents' accounts linked down at the bottom, and of course, they contradict her version and say that they are perfectly willing to sign anything to help her get a birth certificate and other ID. It does seem odd that they never made sure to get copies and an SSN, so that she could be claimed as a dependent on taxes, though. They state that their other children have this documentation. She does need to talk to them to get their assistance. Apparently, she abruptly left without any warning at all. A copy of the blog post says that Alecia sent her parents a list of requests to which they agreed to comply and she still refused to return home. So who knows.... I would think that the daughter would get her ducks in a row and somehow manage to get her parents to help her get a birth certificate, at least before she took off. She could have told them that she was hoping to get a part time job to help out, or something. I'm sorry this happened to her. Hopefully, someone in government will help her out. I've never heard of any parent not getting a birth certificate, ever. It was said earlier in the thread that the parents haven't been paying taxes for quite some time. Such a bizarre story in so many ways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TranquilMind Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 I'm wondering how old you are, because I'm 51 and my parents got my social security number for me when I was a baby. I don't recall any of my friends needing to apply for SSNs when we were applying for our first jobs or getting our driver's permits or licenses, either. I'm pretty sure everyone already had their SSNs. I'm older than you by a few years, and I got it before I applied for a job, at about 14. That's how it was done then, in these parts, anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joker Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 In the mom's posted (archived) blog post, she said the other kids DO have documentation. Hard to tell whom to believe here. Actually, two of the siblings have actually also stated they do not have all the documentation. The older have been helped in getting some things (not a birth certificate). One sister said she was in the process of getting help getting some documents too (again, not a birth certificate). The difference being those children agree to stay home while this daughter did not. There's no excuse for what the parents have done. There is also a news article that states nine of the other children are not documented as of yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TranquilMind Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 It was said earlier in the thread that the parents haven't been paying taxes for quite some time. Such a bizarre story in so many ways. I haven't yet gotten through all posts. That's pretty stupid. The IRS doesn't mess around. They will be nailed soon, if not already. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TranquilMind Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Actually, two of the siblings have actually also stated they do not have all the documentation. The older have been helped in getting some things (not a birth certificate). One sister said she was in the process of getting help getting some documents too (again, not a birth certificate). The difference being those children agree to stay home while this daughter did not. There's no excuse for what the parents have done. There is also a news article that states nine of the other children are not documented as of yet. Well, if several siblings are saying it, it is probably true. They need to get this done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TranquilMind Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Not all parents deserve respect. Yes, they do. Like in the military, you respect the rank, if not the person. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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