What do Americans think about Scotland possibly splitting from the UK?

[Harriet Vane]

I tend to think that the people who live in a place, with that government, and who will live with the decision, are the ones who get to decide.

 

That said, it's such a big decision with such wide ramifications that I would want any vote to be one by a large, very clear majority. Like 75% or so.

[wintermom]

I think it's up to the people of Scotland, but I have to admit ignorance as to how strong their economy and other resources may be to weather things on their own.   Would it still be part of the Commonwealth, like Canada and Australia…or does it totally want to cut all ties?

 

I also wonder if successful, how that might affect Quebecois independence.  

 

I would have thought that Northern Ireland would be more interested than Quebec, but maybe I'm stuck in the past. Quebec has way too many perks by remaining in Canada than they'd ever get by being independent. 

 

If it occurs, it may have a domino effect for other regions. Though it's interesting that other splits (e.g., Czech Republic and Slovenia; Yugoslavia) in Europe haven't seemed to lead the way for more bids for independence. 

 

There certainly are a lot of factors to consider; economy, history, industry growth, unemployment, education, etc.

[trulycrabby]

I think it is up to the people of Scotland to decide. I can see certain advantages of remaining part of the UK, but it is not my decision to make.

[IfIOnly]

:lurk5:

[Cricket]

Live results

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/scottish-independence/11106917/Scottish-independence-live-results-as-they-happen.html

[IfIOnly]

Live results

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/scottish-independence/11106917/Scottish-independence-live-results-as-they-happen.html

 

Thanks!  It looks like they haven't tallied the majority of votes yet, but it's  a "no" so far. 

 

[IfIOnly]

I wonder if the tallying is being broadcast live in the UK through the night like the US presidential elections?  I've read quotes from some Scotts who will be up all night drinking and waiting.  I have no strong opinion on the matter, but too bad I'm not part Scottish (and voting for independence, most likely).  A party is always fun. :cheers2: 

[OneStepAtATime]

I have been watching with great interest.  And the kids and I have talked about it quite a bit, too.  With a 97% registration that shows how important this is to Scotland, even if the rest of the world barely notices.  But there WOULD be an economic impact world wide if this were to go through.  More, I think, than many realize.  Also, this is so important to Scotland that they have lowered the voting age to 16, as I understand it.  The kids and I have discussed that, too.  Honestly, whether the U.S. realizes it or not, this is really rather an important event, and has certainly been a very useful learning experience for the kids and I.

 

FWIW, my ancestors left Scotland 5 generations ago.  I have very limited contact with that side of the family.  But even though I have no dog in this hunt, I do very much care.  My heart says yes.  My head says no.  There are too many economic ties between them.  This would have quite a few ramifications, and not just for Scotland.  The U.K. is also quite tied to Scotland.  But I think that it won't go through.  It might have.  Polls were close heading in.  But it doesn't look like it will pass.

[IfIOnly]

I have been watching with great interest.  And the kids and I have talked about it quite a bit, too.  With a 97% registration that shows how important this is to Scotland, even if the rest of the world barely notices.  But there WOULD be an economic impact world wide if this were to go through.  More, I think, than many realize.  Also, this is so important to Scotland that they have lowered the voting age to 16, as I understand it.  The kids and I have discussed that, too.  Honestly, whether the U.S. realizes it or not, this is really rather an important event, and has certainly been a very useful learning experience for the kids and I.

 

FWIW, my ancestors left Scotland 5 generations ago.  I have very limited contact with that side of the family.  But even though I have no dog in this hunt, I do very much care.  My heart says yes.  My head says no.  There are too many economic ties between them.  This would have quite a few ramifications, and not just for Scotland.  The U.K. is also quite tied to Scotland.  But I think that it won't go through.  It might have.  Polls were close heading in.  But it doesn't look like it will pass.

 

Thank you for sharing, and I agree with you regarding the bolded.  And, yes it's been very educational here, as well.

[MrsMommy]

The voter turnout was just amazing. Can you imagine numbers like that in the US?!?

 

This vote came at a very good time for me. DH is out of town, and I never sleep well when he's gone, so I'll have something to do all night long when I'm wishing I could fall asleep!

[Mandylubug]

I'm watching! I can't imagine if we had such a large turn out at voting poles!

[AMJ]

I only heard about it just a few days ago, when an archaeology feed I follow said something about it.  The local morning news here didn't bother to say ANYTHING about it until today.

 

I am unaware of the issues that led to this issue coming up for a vote in Scotland, and so cannot have any expectation or opinion on whether they should or shouldn't.  Not that it's my place to judge one way or another.  I am interested, though, and plan on sharing whatever I learn with my kids, so they understand the significance of this no matter what the outcome will be.

 

Can anyone recommend a good source of info for us Americans who may be uneducated on the issue at hand, so that we can better understand the different sides and concerns involved?

 

[IfIOnly]

Dh and I just decided to use our $3 of a growler coupon tonight. :)  

 

A fascinating article I read reported how the younger kids (allowed to vote) have really stepped up to their voting responsibilities with regards to researching, weighing, and debating the issue.  School conversation has turned from pop culture/reality TV to government/politics/reality.  At first many thought (the build up to this vote has been two whole years!) the majority of the younger group would vote to make Scotland independent, but that's not necessarily so according to polls.   I found the article at npr.org.  It's not letting me copy and paste the link.

 

And, this, is hilarious and educational. MrsMommy, this might help a bit to fill the evening!

 

 

[IfIOnly]

I'm not sure why I can't link things, but the video is on YouTube  and it's called: Last Week Tonight with John Oliver: Scottish Independence.  It is so funny!

[hornblower]

BBC just tweeted they're predicting NO

[Spy Car]

Splitting the UK would be a disaster for the free-world. Glad to see the exit polls pointing toward unity.

 

I've been on edge.

 

Bill

[Moxie]

Splitting the UK would be a disaster for the free-world. Glad to see the exit polls pointing toward unity.

 

I've been on edge.

 

Bill

I'll admit to being pretty ignorant about most world politics. Can you please explain your statement?

[Guest]

It's being called "NO" now.  

 

Comedy moment of the evening:  "In a close vote..."  

 

It's 55-45 at the moment.  In American politics, that margin is called a "mandate" or a "landslide."  

 

My MIL is born and bred in Scotland.  I'm not sure whether to call her in the morning or not.  

 

[IfIOnly]

Yea, I hope those promises are kept.

[Laura Corin]

Ah, it's sensible from an economic perspective, but it's still :( Back under the English thumb. When almost half the population doesn't want to be there....

 

That's a very jaundiced view of a massively successful experiment in democracy.

 

Laura (who has never voted Tory)

[Guest]

Ooh, something I loved about the process - giving the right to vote to 16 and 17 year olds. I hope this sets a precedent for other democratic countries.

Not me!!! I go with Plato on this one--FORTY as the voting age. And that was when the life expectancy was 42 or something!!!

 

:0)

[creekland]

Not me!!! I go with Plato on this one--FORTY as the voting age. And that was when the life expectancy was 42 or something!!!

 

:0)

 

If there were a way to do it correctly, I'd want to see an intelligence test.  Correctly to me would be that they understand the issues at hand - not what side of the issues they believed (that's what the vote is all about, of course).  They wouldn't have to be able to read or write or whatever.  I just detest when I hear people (of any age) telling me they voted for a candidate because they loved their smile or hair or name or...

[creekland]

Good breakdown of the results, with maps:

 

http://m.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-29255449

 

Interesting to note how the youth vote went.

 

Thanks for that breakdown!  I think it's good to see the vote not quite as divided as it could have been, but yes, many of the youth are going to be disappointed.

[umsami]

I'm sad for the people who were voting for independence, but it sounds like there are still going to be a lot of changes so that hopefully both sides are somewhat happy.  

 

Hopes, prayers, magical fairy dust for the people of Scotland.  May this vote and the changes that come after lead to good things for all of them.

[horsellian]

I'm no more jaundiced about it than any other democratic event, which leaves a proportion of the population feeling disenfranchised. In any general election, for example, a large minority of the population are unhappy - sometimes extremely so. Of course one can focus on democracy in action, peacefully, and the high turnout (impressive) and that is a good thing. Just not the only thing...

 

This is probably the lowest percentage of the electorate that has feels disenfranchised in a UK vote ever!  Every vote counted.

 

Normally in a general election we use first-past-the-post, and nearly half the country don't vote at all and of those that do over 2/3 don't get the candidate they voted for.  Really, normally the MAJORITY are disenfranchised.

[AMJ]

Just a couple of days ago it was Constitution Day (Sept. 17th) here in the U.S., the anniversary of the signing of the U.S. Constitution.  This is a recently declared day of observance, not a big holiday like the U.S.'s Independence Day (July 4th), but I found the timing (just a day apart from the Scottish Independence voting day) eye-catching and worth noting to the kids.  Additionally, here in Texas Good Citizenship is a required topic for homeschoolers (though it has no set criteria, to my knowledge, of what constitutes good citizenship), so we have been using We The People to study the founding of our country.  I'm now trying to find materials on the Scottish Independence topic (issues and concerns on all sides) to blend in with our studies, since a) this is an important current event that deserves to derail, postpone, or augment our planned course of study, and b) while I need to cover the materials pertaining to our country and why it came to be I also want my kids better educated about the rest of the world than my generation here had been.  Besides, the conjunction of our studies with the date of this vote is too fortuitous to let slide by.

 

So, any recommendations, anyone?

[Leav97]

I'm just wondering if the South or Texas etc.. decided to "peacefully" vote to not be a part of the union what would happen? I know we have btdt, but that area is now quite a bit richer, more populous and most of the military comes from these places. 

 

\snip

 

http://wallethub.com/edu/states-most-least-dependent-on-the-federal-government/2700/

 

The south has some of the states most depend on $ from the federal government.  Aside from Texas it would be a financial disaster. 

[WagsWife]

Ooh, something I loved about the process - giving the right to vote to 16 and 17 year olds. I hope this sets a precedent for other democratic countries.

Ugh, no. A segment of society who are mostly (notice I said mostly-obviously there are exceptions)

A. Still relying on someone else to support them

B. Forms their political/social views by reading the Twitter feed of their favorite celebrity.

C. Whose biggest concern at the moment is how mean their parents are because they will not ___fill in the blank__.

 

should not be voting. Obviously there are adults whom the above also applies, but hopefully not as prevalent. There is also the...if you are old enough to serve your country in the military, you should be able to vote.

 

I have three very grounded, mature, responsible teens. They are far more mature than most in their age groups, but I still would not want them voting at 16.

[mommymilkies]

I'll admit, I kinda hoped they'd vote yes.  I had a Braveheart moment.  :lol:  I know that it's more complicated nowadays, and I totally support the Scots vote, so I'm not upset.  I don't have a dog in that fight anymore since my ancestors decided to cross the Atlantic.  

[AMJ]

http://wallethub.com/edu/states-most-least-dependent-on-the-federal-government/2700/

 

The south has some of the states most depend on $ from the federal government.  Aside from Texas it would be a financial disaster. 

 

An interesting aside:  Some years back (when I still worked my paycheck job at a corporation) one of the fad-ish interview questions making the rounds was "If one state had to be removed from the United States to stand on it's own, which one would you choose?"  This was discussed where I worked, and most seemed to agree that the only wrong answer would be to name the state in which the job (being interviewed for) was located.

 

I disagreed.  I flatly told them Texas (where we all were) should be the one to separate if anyone were stupid enough to try to force such a thing.  I got a lot of heat for that, until I got them to listen to my reasoning: 

• Texas is big enough, with enough of its own resources, to have a chance at maintaining independence.
• Texas has a good location strategically, with coast lines and a position between two countries who have strong interest in seeing Texas kept strong.
• Texans are bullheaded enough to make it work.  There's a reason Texas still has one star on the state flag.  I speak as a non-native Texan, comparing them to the people in the places where I lived before moving here.

Do I think it is likely that Texas would choose to secede?  Nope, not as things currently are.  Texans also know a good thing when they see it, and right now it is more advantageous to be a big state in a bigger country instead of a small country between two bigger ones.  If that ever changes, though,....

[Cricket]

My only thought was that if Scotland did vote for independence, whatever form of currency they used might make it more affordable to visit. :-)

[shawthorne44]

http://wallethub.com/edu/states-most-least-dependent-on-the-federal-government/2700/

 

The south has some of the states most depend on $ from the federal government.  Aside from Texas it would be a financial disaster. 

 

 

As a Texan, I am a little whimsically sad at how the vote went.  Although I am happy that it was decided by vote.   I disagree with the PP that said that Americans aren't aware of where Scotland is.  

I honestly think that economically it could have been beneficial for Scotland if they'd been free to make smarter decisions with their money.  Although, my brain might be a little blurred by the Texas and Scotland being similar in my brain.  

[hornblower]

We've been dealing with Quebec separatists for decades now so I think most Cdns followed this because separatism & independence votes are something we've btdt & might be doing again.

This is a good analysis of Quebec, Scotland & Catalonia http://www.montrealgazette.com/business/Editorial+Scotland+Catalonia+some+lessons+Quebec/10211725/story.html

[umsami]

As a Texan, I am a little whimsically sad at how the vote went.  Although I am happy that it was decided by vote.   I disagree with the PP that said that Americans aren't aware of where Scotland is.  

I honestly think that economically it could have been beneficial for Scotland if they'd been free to make smarter decisions with their money.  Although, my brain might be a little blurred by the Texas and Scotland being similar in my brain.  

 

Do Texans really want to leave the US or is that wishful thinking?  

 

Do they want to go back to Mexico (note: I was surprised learning about the Zimmerman Telegram watching the Roosevelts. That was something that was not covered in history as a kid in Michigan.)?

 

Texas receives more federal aid than in gets.  Would they export all the young, poor people? What would the plan be?  

[Cricket]

Do Texans really want to leave the US or is that wishful thinking?

I don't think most Texans really want to leave. It's just that they like to remind the rest of the country that they are here by choice, not force. :-)

[shawthorne44]

Do Texans really want to leave the US or is that wishful thinking?  

 

Do they want to go back to Mexico (note: I was surprised learning about the Zimmerman Telegram watching the Roosevelts. That was something that was not covered in history as a kid in Michigan.)?

 

Texas receives more federal aid than in gets.  Would they export all the young, poor people? What would the plan be?  

 

For me personally, maybe 10% of the time.  Although just because we get more money back from the feds than we give them does not mean that we'd be worse off economically as a nation.  As the article pointed out the money is going to entitlement programs and the large numbers of people on them.  As an independent country both those categories would see a Huge shift.  

[Dmmetler]

The New Yorker cartoon is cute. :)

[Laura Corin]

The breakdowns posted above are interesting. They confirm my impression that voting was more about class, wealth and deprivation than it was about attitudes to Britain or England. Places that are doing well - Edinburgh, Aberdeen and some country areas - voted no; areas of high unemployment voted yes.

[OneStepAtATime]

Do Texans really want to leave the US or is that wishful thinking?  

 

 

Do most Texans want to leave the Union? No, I doubt it.  But Texas, economically, would fare far better if we left than many states.  As a previous poster mentioned, as an independent country there would be a HUGE shift in how monies are allocated.

 

And Texas would not "go back to Mexican rule" as was mentioned.  It would be an independent country.

 

FWIW, actually, a whole lot of people who were living here LOOOONG before Texas became a state (including my in-laws) didn't really want Spanish rule or Mexican rule OR rule by another country if it meant no representation, no control, etc..   My in-laws have been here since before the U.S. was a nation or Mexico was separated from Spain.  They were not white settlers brought in to settle the area.  They were here long before that.  Spanish has been the primary language until DH's generation, but they also speak fluent English and consider themselves Texans and United States citizens, not Mexicans or Spaniards.  They have been here longer than any of my ancestors by many generations.  The border just kept hopping over them.  But if Texas were to break away, they would consider themselves Texans.  They do NOT want Mexican rule.   On a side note, if you study local history you find that when Santa Anna dissolved the Constitution of 1824 he hacked off quite a few Mexican/Spanish settlers.  They wanted to get rid of Mexican rule because of it (among other issues).

 

Texas history is far more complicated than a bunch of mean white settlers took over the land from the poor Mexican settlers, as is currently being taught in some schools.  In fact, that version is just as inaccurate as the version I was taught where the poor white settlers were attacked by that mean man Santa Anna and after the Alamo we finally rallied, won and became a state.   The history of this state is just far more layered than that.

 

But back to Scotland.... 

[mommaduck]

Not me!!! I go with Plato on this one--FORTY as the voting age. And that was when the life expectancy was 42 or something!!!

 

:0)

 

 

In my part of the US, where we need some changes, that would be horrifying.

[katilac]

I don't think most Americans think anything about it one way or the other.  We tend to decide that it's a bit unfair to have to keep Britain vs England vs the United Kingdom straight in our minds, and give up the whole thing as a bad business,  

 

If broadcasting BBC shows to America came up for a vote, however, we would be highly concerned.