how important is vocabulary...

[angelmama1209]

as it's own subject? we've been doing wordly wise but are really fizzling out AND i'm trying to simplify our school time.

[angelmama1209]

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[Rachel]

My oldest is 6 but I don't intent to teach it as a separate subject. We keep our children's dictionary nearby when we are reading and look up words my son doesn't know. As he gets older I may have him start a notebook or card file to help him reinforce definitions.

[Farrar]

Not very.

 

I think most people prefer to integrate it with literature, spelling and writing.  I'm sure some kids benefit from a separate program, but I don't think it's needed for most.

[madteaparty]

I agree with "not very". That said, vocabulary is one of the only things that can be done independent of me here, so DS is going through the Sadlier-Oxford books. FWIW, I also work, so vocabulary is one box I can check when I am away from him.

 

[OneStepAtATime]

If you are exposing your children to rich literature, including read alouds or audio books that are more advanced than their current reading level, that might be more effective and important than focused vocabulary training but it does help to also extract some of the more advanced vocabulary and concepts and pursue those further, IMHO.  I did not do that enough when they were younger.  When we do read alouds now, even with my 13 year old, we discuss words as we go, and concepts and sometimes write down those words for study later.  It has helped a lot.

[regentrude]

Not important, not necessary. We never used a vocabulary program.

Reading a variety of quality literature from various periods and genres, listening to high quality audio recordings and live conversations of people with a varied, sophisticated vocabulary were entirely sufficient and effective to create an impressive vocabulary and stellar results in standardized tests.

[Arcadia]

My kids like vocabulary workbooks because of the word searches. The workbooks take them 10mins a day usually. We started with Wordly Wise because that was what their K12 VA gave for k to 3. Then the K12 VA gave Vocabulary Workshop from 4th grade onwards and my kids prefer that.

If my boys no longer enjoy vocabulary, I'll skip it since they read well and use their dictionaries when needed.

[SkateLeft]

There was a time when I'd have said, "Not very." But now, I think it depends on the kid.

 

My ds needs explicit vocabularly instruction in a way that neither of my girls did. He just doesn't pick up vocabulary organically from his reading. He was a delayed reader, and while he's totally caught up, I can still see the ramifications of the delay in his vocabulary development. He doesn't have the Latin background that my girls had either, and I think that's part of the difference as well.

 

Spelling is the same way. Some kids need instruction and some kids just naturally pick it up from their reading.

 

Personally, I'm not a fan of vocabulary workbooks. I don't see my kids learning much from an arbitrary word list. However, vocabulary through word roots has been much more effective for us. My ds is working through English From the Roots Up.

 

Once something has just become busy work, and is no longer a benefit, I drop it.

[Crimson Wife]

While I'll be the contrarian and say that formal vocabulary study has been extremely valuable in aiding reading comprehension. By the time my DD was in 2nd grade, she could decode anything but because she didn't know the unfamiliar vocabulary, it might have well have said, "The garglezonk fribbered with the zopes."

 

Reading helps build vocabulary, but formal vocabulary study has helped my kids' reading.

[FO4UR]

Vocab is something we get through reading, as we work on spelling, through Latin, as we work on history and science, etc...

 

 

 

[nature girl]

Hmm, I hear what you're saying, Crimson Wife, but I've always felt like unless a word is used and reused many times it's probably not going to stick long term. I don't know if what I think of as typical vocab study, where you're thrown obscure words that aren't usually used in conversation, maybe need to use them throughout the week but then never again, really would help most kids retain them a year later. I think coming across words in your reading and looking them up and digesting the meaning that way seems just as useful. I don't remember formal vocab study until I was in high school, and even then it was minimal, but now I have a huge vocabulary just because I've always read a ton. My DD is still young, but she also has an amazing vocabulary, probably 3rd grade level or above, just because we read for hours a day and I define the words as we go. They feel like a useful part of life to her, rather than just something she'd have to study for a test.

[Acadie]

I don't do formal vocabulary study for younger grades, just lots of discussing words as we read across subject areas.  

 

It did start to seem important to starting in about 5th grade, though.  Dd11 is old enough to enjoy learning about Greek and Latin roots, so it's meaningful to fun to see the common roots as she learns Spanish.  We started with Rummy Roots and are doing Caesar's English now.  Also she picks out key science and history terms to study on her own.

 

Amy

[madteaparty]

While I'll be the contrarian and say that formal vocabulary study has been extremely valuable in aiding reading comprehension. By the time my DD was in 2nd grade, she could decode anything but because she didn't know the unfamiliar vocabulary, it might have well have said, "The garglezonk fribbered with the zopes."

 

Reading helps build vocabulary, but formal vocabulary study has helped my kids' reading.

 I agree with this and stated as much in another thread.

Frankly it is not very conducive to literature enjoyment to stop and review vocabulary every other sentence. When I learned English as a second language, I absolutely learned some words from context, especially the more nuanced meanings, but vocabulary was learned for its own sake as well. The two are not mutually exclusive, anyway.

[Caclcoca]

I think it depends on the child.  My oldest is not going to pick up vocabulary organically from reading, being read to, or from listening to audio books.  I think that my other children pick up a lot of vocabulary from reading. I regret not doing a formal vocabulary program with my oldest sooner.

[SilverMoon]

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Edited July 9, 2022 by SilverMoon

[basketcase]

I switch to vocabulary study once spelling is solid, but don't pursue them concurrently. If nothing else, vocab study helps my kids pronounce advanced words correctly. They pick up so many words from books, but sometimes have only a partial understanding of the definitions or a totally mistaken idea of pronunciation.

[CrunchyGirl]

We are focusing on high quality literature and Latin. I figure we can study vocabulary separately if at some point down the road the current plan clearly isn't getting us adequate results.

[Ad astra]

I'm currently using a picture dictionary to build vocabulary for my DS4. English is his second language, so he needs to study vocab separately. When he gets older, I'm going to teach him how to look up new words in a dictionary as he comes across them in reading, and have him write them down in a notebook. Speaking from my experience in learning English as a second language, vocabulary is best learned in context, so we won't use any vocab workbook.

[KrissiK]

Not very, as a separate subject. My kids have a pretty good vocabulary and that's just because i've read to them vocabulary rich books fom day 1.

[Chrysalis Academy]

I've gone back and forth with this over the past couple of years.  I really liked the approach in Caesar's English - learning the words most commonly used in the literature I am trying to enable them to read - but I have to confess that at this point, vocab - stem/root study- is teetering toward the edge of the plank and may be cut off in the very near future.

 

I only wish I could say the same for spelling  :glare:  :001_rolleyes:

[HS Mom in NC]

We do Latin and Geek Word Roots in 1st-3rd doing simple matching/memory games.  We do 5-10 a week depending on the child's age and then we break down and decode longer, more complicated words that are made up of the word roots the child has already mastered starting in 4th grade and we continue to learn more of them. Other than that, we integrate most of our vocabulary with excellent literature.

[Hunter]

Vocabulary is like spelling. Some children will learn it on their own, and those that do will move ahead exponentially, leaving those who don't in the dust. Even if the instructor starts teaching these subjects explicitly, there are only so many hours in the day, and the instructor cannot close this gap, and can do more hard than good trying to.

 

Explicit teaching often requires expensive materials. And takes a LOT of time. Time that often is better spent elsewhere.

 

Whatever you choose to do, we wise and be bold, while looking at the big picture and being REALISTIC about what you see. Triage unmercifully and you will be showing more mercy in the long run. Accept that some children will move FAR ahead of others in certain areas and that is okay. Help your own find the areas that they shine in, and give them room and time to move ahead exponentially in their areas of strength.

 

For those with large and those with small vocabularies, substituting a vocabulary workbook for real books is often not a good idea. Books are food. 

[Crimson Wife]

I've gone back and forth with this over the past couple of years.  I really liked the approach in Caesar's English - learning the words most commonly used in the literature I am trying to enable them to read - but I have to confess that at this point, vocab - stem/root study- is teetering toward the edge of the plank and may be cut off in the very near future.

 

Caesar's English is the vocab program I start my kids in. My oldest moved into Sadlier-Oxford Vocabulary Workshop Level B (7th grade) after CE 2, but I'm going to give Vocabu-Lit Level E (5th grade) a try for DS. His working vocabulary isn't as large as hers was so I think he would do well with a somewhat easier program for now.

[In The Great White North]

Never used one.

 

FWIW, it's helps to use Shakespeare's 54,000 words in every day speech, instead of the 3000 the Three Little Pigs guy claimed Americans use today, not just read good books.

[Chrysalis Academy]

Well, just to show that I'm putting my money where my mouth is, I decided to drop formal vocab study for next year . . . we'll be doing Lively Art of Writing & LLLoTR and they both have incorporated vocab, which we'll go over just to make sure she knows all those words . . . but I gotta drop something, and I'm convinced that dropping formal vocab and spending more time on lit is the way to go.

[Crimson Wife]

Well, just to show that I'm putting my money where my mouth is, I decided to drop formal vocab study for next year . . . we'll be doing Lively Art of Writing & LLLoTR and they both have incorporated vocab, which we'll go over just to make sure she knows all those words . . . but I gotta drop something, and I'm convinced that dropping formal vocab and spending more time on lit is the way to go.

 

I haven't seen LLLoTR, but DD used LAoW last fall and I don't recall it including vocabulary aside from explaining a few writing terms like "thesis" and "metaphor". There was a section on using a thesaurus to find synonyms. But certainly I didn't personally feel that it would be reason enough to drop a formal vocab program. YMMV.

[Chrysalis Academy]

The workbook that someone here put together has a vocab lesson each week - a short list of words, and they are supposed to look them up and then find a synonym and antonym.  Looking at the list, they're all good words I think she probably knows, but if she doesn't she ought to . . . often I think that the synonym/antonym exercises are more useful than anything else, because they give you a chance to discuss the nuances of word meaning and usage.  Anyway, we'll see how it goes.   

[Roadrunner]

I think for those kids who are bilingual or studying another Latin based language, it might not be as important. My kids picked up more English vocab last year studying French than I ever hoped. Yet, I plan on studying vocab separately through middle school, because I see tangible benefits. My third grader zipped through TLOTR and he kept pointing out all the words he picked up in Caesar's English. While I think reading is ultimately what builds a vocabulary, doing vocab concurrently has improved the reading ability. They go hand in hand. I might change my mind in time, but at this stage, my kids are benefiting from it.

[angelmama1209]

The workbook that someone here put together has a vocab lesson each week - a short list of words, and they are supposed to look them up and then find a synonym and antonym.  Looking at the list, they're all good words I think she probably knows, but if she doesn't she ought to . . . often I think that the synonym/antonym exercises are more useful than anything else, because they give you a chance to discuss the nuances of word meaning and usage.  Anyway, we'll see how it goes.   

 

where is this?

[C_astelle]

I think for those kids who are bilingual or studying another Latin based language, it might not be as important. My kids picked up more English vocab last year studying French than I ever hoped. Yet, I plan on studying vocab separately through middle school, because I see tangible benefits. My third grader zipped through TLOTR and he kept pointing out all the words he picked up in Caesar's English. While I think reading is ultimately what builds a vocabulary, doing vocab concurrently has improved the reading ability. They go hand in hand. I might change my mind in time, but at this stage, my kids are benefiting from it.

 

I have never actually considered looking at the two seperately because I have always been considered that it would be too hard to make vocabulary as a subject on its own interesting. However I am very serious about the literature and reading development, so maybe I should rethink, if as you say, the former helps the latter as much as the latter feeds into the former.

[Roadrunner]

I have never actually considered looking at the two seperately because I have always been considered that it would be too hard to make vocabulary as a subject on its own interesting. However I am very serious about the literature and reading development, so maybe I should rethink, if as you say, the former helps the latter as much as the latter feeds into the former.

Look at Caesar's English. It's very interesting. :)

We also have Sandlier Oxford vocab books. They are workbooks, but we don't use them as written. Mostly we just read through stories and if there are new words, we talk about them and make vocab cards. We try to use new words in writing, and I try to incorporate them in conversations. We spend maybe 20 minutes a week on Sandlier and I think it's worth the time. We devote much more time to Caesar's English. 

[Elisabet1]

I had trouble with Wordly Wise. I thought it was just us, but then heard from some other parents that they had trouble too and switched. I plan to try it again though eventually. 

 

I would not use Vocab along side spelling through. It would be one or the other. Have you tried Vocabulit? Or Vocab from Classical Roots? We use Spelling Workout through the H level and then move on. 

 

Another thing...I have heard of parents doing...is get the Barron's SAT study guide and use their Vocab lists for studying.

[Dory]

We swing all over the map with how much vocabulary teaching happens in our home. Sometimes the only vocabulary is us talking about the books we are reading and looking up words that they didn't know. I ALWAYS try to use a good vocabulary on a constant basis around my kids so that they are hearing the words used in different scenarios and will be comfortable with them. I was graced with a mother that had a verbose vocabulary. Sometimes we have an actual workbook, curriculum, or game that we play regularly (like Marie's Words, or Word Roots or something like that). For awhile we had a word of the day type calendar that the kids enjoyed and we would try and use that word throughout the day. Basically, we do whatever we can fit in without stressing us but if the schedule is full, it's something that I don't feel guilty about pushing off because I know we do have some vocabulary sprinkled throughout everything that we do.

[Tanikit]

I think if one is going to teach vocabulary then you need to know what you aim to achieve by teaching it - do you want understanding (when reading something) or do you want a child who can write interesting and varied papers/articles? Vocabulary can be taught in many ways - reading good quality books (both fiction and non-fiction) is usually the first place to start.

 

Studying roots and doing a second language (any second language though there are specific languages that will teach more English vocabulary than others) can also teach a lot about vocabulary. 

 

Vocabulary is also acquired by access to certain professions/sports/activities where jargon specific to that profession/sport/activity will be learnt very easily.

 

I wouldn't totally discount vocabulary exercises entirely - but I would probably not teach them separately - certain language arts exercises can be used to teach vocabulary along with another concept - grammar or creative writing can easily be used to teach further vocabulary. Spelling also lends itself to vocabulary teaching.

[Crimson Wife]

Look at Caesar's English. It's very interesting. :)

 

I heartily concur :-)

[kiwik]

I love words. The problem is that most of the time if you use words of more than two syllables or a little unusual people look at you as if you have two heads. My spoken vocabulary has decreased since I reached adulthood because I have constantly had to simplify.

[JadeOrchidSong]

We used Caesar's English 1 and part of 2. Then I followed Crimson Wife's route and started Sadlier-Oxford Vocabulary Workshop. As a pp said, this is the subject done independently consistently. They both have rich vocabulary and use them in their novel writing. I plan to go on with this series.

[JadeOrchidSong]

Dp

[C_astelle]

Look at Caesar's English. It's very interesting. :)

We also have Sandlier Oxford vocab books. They are workbooks, but we don't use them as written. Mostly we just read through stories and if there are new words, we talk about them and make vocab cards. We try to use new words in writing, and I try to incorporate them in conversations. We spend maybe 20 minutes a week on Sandlier and I think it's worth the time. We devote much more time to Caesar's English. 

 

Thanks Roadrunner, I will check it out!