Scarlett Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 Wow. Dh and I watched a lot of the disembarking last night....my mind is just blown that Carnival didn't have an emergency plan for waste removal. My dh said he would have figured something out..I mean there was an entire OCEAN just over the rails of that ship. Why did it have to stay ON the ship with 4000 humans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parrothead Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 I don't know. Fish do it. Why not humans. I mean, whale output has to be more than 200 humans put together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlett Posted February 15, 2013 Author Share Posted February 15, 2013 Dh said there must not have been any engineers on board. LOL. He said he would have rigged up one of those slides off into the ocean to be used for a toilet.....LOL....knowing dh I totally believe he would have figured something out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
momofkhm Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 I've been wondering if my head has been in the sand. Or have we truly not known it was this bad until they disembarked? I cannot imagine that something was not done to help those people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlett Posted February 15, 2013 Author Share Posted February 15, 2013 Well, it has been known how bad it was but there weren't many pictures since no one had cell service except for the few times another ship came near enough to them that they could get wifi....they brought in food and water and finally generators on the last day....I think if they had had a way to dispose of the waste it would have been tolerable. Seriously, I just can't figure out why there wasn't a plan for that. And if there wasn't a plan why didn't they just send another ship to get them all off..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanny Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 They did a lot better, with this problem, than with their ship the Costa Concordia. Problems of different magnitudes..... IMHO they could have done a lot of things differently. They had 2 other cruise ships nearby, giving them food, supplies, etc. Possibly, in retrospect, they should have off loaded the Triumph passengers, to those other cruise ships, using lifeboats or something to transfer them. I was puzzled, by their use of so many buses, to move the passengers from Mobile, to Houston/Galveston. I wondered why they didn't arrange for more charter flights, from New Orleans, or, preferably, from Mobile, but I suspect the Mobile airport doesn't have the capacity (gates and personnel) to handle a lot of extra flights. The photo that was on the Home page of FoxNews.com earlier today, of the young woman literally kissing the pavement, after getting off the Triumph in Mobile, says it all. I have that photo on my Facebook now. The great thing is that there were no injuries or deaths, although i suspect quite a few of the passengers are sick now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenbrdsly Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 What I'm wondering is about the poor cleaning crew who was working around the clock. Doesn't the bulk of their pay come through tips? Will everyone be too disgruntled to tip them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlett Posted February 15, 2013 Author Share Posted February 15, 2013 As a side note I am surprised by how many people go on cruises without their spouse! And children without parents....I told dh last night, 'I don't think I would go on a cruise without you and I KNOW you wouldn't be going without me.' Our vacation budget is nearly zero though so whatever we do we want to be together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlett Posted February 15, 2013 Author Share Posted February 15, 2013 What I'm wondering is about the poor cleaning crew who was working around the clock. Doesn't the bulk of their pay come through tips? Will everyone be too disgruntled to tip them? They got high praise from every passenger I saw interviewed. So who knows. I think they will be compensated by Carnival. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dandelion Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 I was wondering why they didn't disembark the passengers onto another ship as well. Since other ships were around to provide supplies, it seems like it would have been a fairly easy thing to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mama Geek Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 I don't know why they didn't put passengers on another boat. I do know that if you are close enough to shore that it is illegal to dump waste overboard. I don't know how close to land they were. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrincessMommy Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 As a side note I am surprised by how many people go on cruises without their spouse! And children without parents....I told dh last night, 'I don't think I would go on a cruise without you and I KNOW you wouldn't be going without me.' Our vacation budget is nearly zero though so whatever we do we want to be together. What?? There were children on the cruise without their parents!?! :confused1: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlett Posted February 15, 2013 Author Share Posted February 15, 2013 What?? There were children on the cruise without their parents!?! :confused1: Well, probably with one parent.....or grandparent. I just saw several moms waiting at the port to get their kids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SunnyDays Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 I've never been keen on the idea of a cruise anyway... I think I would feel clausterphobic in those tiny cabins, and sort of "trapped" in the middle of the ocean!! After seeing all this... no. No thank you. I cannot imagine the potential for illness with all that waste, lack of cleanliness, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlett Posted February 15, 2013 Author Share Posted February 15, 2013 I don't think the ship was close to shore....I think they were waaaay out there most of the time. Apparently transferring everyone from one ship to another in the middle of the gulf is not as easy as it sounds. And apparently the toilets were suppose to be working to some degree....but started backing up....again just seems like there should have been a better emergency plan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melinda in VT Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 As a side note I am surprised by how many people go on cruises without their spouse! And children without parents....I told dh last night, 'I don't think I would go on a cruise without you and I KNOW you wouldn't be going without me.' Our vacation budget is nearly zero though so whatever we do we want to be together. Now, see, your response surprises me. I'm happily married, but there are other relationships I value as well. I've never been on a cruise, but I have traveled with other relatives and with friends. I don't find it at all surprising that people take trips with people besides their spouse or that kids go on a vacation with their grandparents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlett Posted February 16, 2013 Author Share Posted February 16, 2013 Now, see, your response surprises me. I'm happily married, but there are other relationships I value as well. I've never been on a cruise, but I have traveled with other relatives and with friends. I don't find it at all surprising that people take trips with people besides their spouse or that kids go on a vacation with their grandparents. I too have relationships I value....I guess if I had enough money to take several vacations a year I would consider a trip with my family even if dh couldn't go...and yes I would let ds, almost 13 go on vacation with my parents.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delaney Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 I don't think the ship was close to shore....I think they were waaaay out there most of the time. Apparently transferring everyone from one ship to another in the middle of the gulf is not as easy as it sounds. And apparently the toilets were suppose to be working to some degree....but started backing up....again just seems like there should have been a better emergency plan Yes and without power the stabilization systems don't work. They were literally bobbing like ducks. No way to get them onto boats safely in that situation unless you airlifted each person by helicopter...and even then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlmiraGulch Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 Wow. Dh and I watched a lot of the disembarking last night....my mind is just blown that Carnival didn't have an emergency plan for waste removal. My dh said he would have figured something out..I mean there was an entire OCEAN just over the rails of that ship. Why did it have to stay ON the ship with 4000 humans. You can't just dump raw sewage at sea. It's illegal. Under normal operating conditions they treat and incinerate the waste at sea and then it's released into the ocean, but raw sewage is a no-no. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlett Posted February 16, 2013 Author Share Posted February 16, 2013 You can't just dump raw sewage at sea. It's illegal. Under normal operating conditions they treat and incinerate the waste at sea and then it's released into the ocean, but raw sewage is a no-no. Do you really think a passenger would be fined for dumping their poo at sea under those conditions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mom2scouts Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 Do you really think a passenger would be fined for dumping their poo at sea under those conditions? Yes, I think someone would be fined for that. Moving people to another ship would be *very* difficult. Using the lifeboats to do it would be risky. Also, the other cruise ships nearby were in use and would not have been able to take many passengers. They rarely have empty ships available. I've only been on one cruise in my life and it was aboard the Carnival Triumph. I'm glad I didn't really enjoy cruising and haven't had a "vacation" like those poor passengers. OTOH, I did laugh when I saw the bus taking them to their flights broke down. They just couldn't get a break. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stacia Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 Apparently transferring everyone from one ship to another in the middle of the gulf is not as easy as it sounds. I agree. I think it would have been much more dangerous for the passengers to risk transfer on the open seas vs. staying on the stricken ship. This article in Time explains that part a bit.... (It was not just the cruise line's decision not to evacuate, but the Coast Guard's decision too.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elegantlion Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 Do you really think a passenger would be fined for dumping their poo at sea under those conditions? An individual passenger, maybe not? An entire ship, I'll bet it would receive heavy penalties for dumping sewage. My assumption is that the lawyers were crunching numbers on passenger's suing over sewage vs. fines for environmental damage. Last I heard they were offering refunds, a free cruise and 500.00 for the passengers. I'm sure some will take that settlement and be fine to be rid of the experience. The others will probably end up settling at some point. Also, the reputation of the ship and cruise line was already damaged by the event. Dumping sewage would only serve to tick off more people and damage their reputation further. I'm sure it was a well-calculated (price and reputation) move. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
treestarfae Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 Wow. Dh and I watched a lot of the disembarking last night....my mind is just blown that Carnival didn't have an emergency plan for waste removal. My dh said he would have figured something out..I mean there was an entire OCEAN just over the rails of that ship. Why did it have to stay ON the ship with 4000 humans. Because you're clueless about how badly human feces and urine can ruin a coastal or ocean ecosystem? Do some research on how fecal pollution "dilutes" and what it exactly takes to clean the water. Same goes for any body of water. Dog, cat, goose poop is a major issue in fresh water. Maybe this can unblow your mind about human pollution? Dumping waste can literally kill a sizable area of life in the water. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joanne Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 I am friends with a couple who were on it. They got home today. They report that it wasn't as bad as the media made it out to be. But this friend has an awesome ability to chill/go with the flow and a great way to see the humor in life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samiam Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 Agree with all that has been said. They could not simply dump feces into the ocean as a company. That's against the law. If passengers did that, that was on their own choice, and probably unbeknownst to Carnival. It's not like they could just open a door and put a ramp across to another ship. Believe me, if it were that simple, they would have. We are not talking flat, calm pool water, we are talking ocean waves, and winds thrown in. Alot of this situation is not completely Carnival's choice in how things were handled....Coast guards, and laws come into play and Carnival must follow those laws. I think Carnival has been very upfront with everything, and doing the best they can in a situation that was 1. a freak accident/situtation, and 2. overblown in the media as most things are. Let's be honest, this is about as bad publicity as Carnival could get, and do you think that they weren't doing their absolute best to make it better to avoid the damage getting any worse? If there was ANYTHING they could have done to make it easier/better for those passengers during the crisis, they would have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlett Posted February 16, 2013 Author Share Posted February 16, 2013 Because you're clueless about how badly human feces and urine can ruin a coastal or ocean ecosystem? Do some research on how fecal pollution "dilutes" and what it exactly takes to clean the water. Same goes for any body of water. Dog, cat, goose poop is a major issue in fresh water. Maybe this can unblow your mind about human pollution? Dumping waste can literally kill a sizable area of life in the water. Ok, first ouch. And then, it was a emergency. I am not proposing we dump the waste of all America in the ocean. Good grief. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Mungo Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 The story about the couple in bed having the ceiling break and sewage dump on them was the stuff of nightmares. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlett Posted February 16, 2013 Author Share Posted February 16, 2013 The story about the couple in bed having the ceiling break and sewage dump on them was the stuff of nightmares. Ug. I had not heard that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Mungo Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 Ug. I had not heard that. It was mentioned on 20/20(? I think?) tonight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlett Posted February 16, 2013 Author Share Posted February 16, 2013 Yes, I think someone would be fined for that. Well they would have to find me and prove it was my poo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outdoorsy Type Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 I cruised on the Triumph last summer. I feel so sad for the passengers. :( it was such a lovely ship, always clean, and the food was excellent. What a horrible experience for them! As a side note I went without dh/kids as it was a ladies only family group. Best.thing. Ever. I didn't have to worry about anyone but myself for that 4 days. No cleaning. No deciding on meals for other people. Just a wonderful time hanging out with the lovely girls of my family. I encourage others to do the same if you can. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mom in High Heels Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 As a side note I am surprised by how many people go on cruises without their spouse! And children without parents....I told dh last night, 'I don't think I would go on a cruise without you and I KNOW you wouldn't be going without me.' Our vacation budget is nearly zero though so whatever we do we want to be together. I went on a cruise a few months ago with the boys and my mom because JB is deployed. If I hadn't gotten the kids for free with 2 paying adults, I wouldn't have taken my mom. I've been on vacations with friends before, I've taken Indy on vacations without JB, and Indy has gone on vacation with just my parents. I've never given it a second thought. I was puzzled, by their use of so many buses, to move the passengers from Mobile, to Houston/Galveston. I wondered why they didn't arrange for more charter flights, from New Orleans, or, preferably, from Mobile, but I suspect the Mobile airport doesn't have the capacity (gates and personnel) to handle a lot of extra flights. My family lives in Mobile (many of them went down to watch the cruise ship come in to port) and believe me, there is NO WAY the Mobile airport could have handled it. They have 7 (IIRC) gates and there are almost never more than 2 flights in or out at any given time. It's the emptiest airport I've ever been in. When we flew out this past April, it was the busiest I have ever seen it. There were 2 counters open, 4 people at security, and 18 people on our fight. I suppose the airlines could have bussed extra personnel in from NOLA or Pensacola, but I doubt it wold have helped. Getting through their lone security line would be a logistical nightmare. Also, Mobile has incredibly high gate fees, which is why there aren't a lot of flights in and out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nmoira Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 What I'm wondering is about the poor cleaning crew who was working around the clock. Doesn't the bulk of their pay come through tips? Will everyone be too disgruntled to tip them? Salon ran an article about their working conditions. http://www.salon.com/2013/02/15/cruise_from_hell_dont_pity_carnivals_passengers/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoughCollie Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 If what occurred was Carnival's emergency plan for something like this, I'd like to know if there was a better way to handle the situation. I know it was too dangerous for them to transfer the passengers ... but I don't know if they were prepared for this, and I think it is their job to have been better prepared, if possible. Also, that ship had been having problems, and I wonder if someone made the decision to use it and took that risk so they wouldn't lose money on the cruise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
readwithem Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 The name of the ship (Triumph) is ironic. :glare: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mama Geek Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 It is legal to pump raw sewage overboard if you are more than 3 miles offshore which puts you into international waters. Within 3 miles of shore you can pump out treated sewage. http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/WestAdvisorView?langId=-1&storeId=11151&page=Heads-Holding-Tanks#.UR98g45brS8 From my boating days you can pee overboard anytime you want to, but if you pee in a bucket you can't dump it unless you are 3 miles offshore. If I had to guess the cruise ship would need power to pump things overboard assuming they were 3 miles out and they probably didn't have the power to be able to do that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlmiraGulch Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 Do you really think a passenger would be fined for dumping their poo at sea under those conditions? If they were caught in the act, then yes, probably. The environmental laws don't just apply in ideal circumstances. Also, if you just throw something over the top of the deck, it's likely not going to end up in the ocean, but rather blown back into the deck below you. :ack2: The real issue, though, would be if the cruise line itself just started off-loading raw sewage into the ocean. That would be bad news. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenn- Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 Did you guys see that one of the buses broke down and then one of the airplanes had electrical problems and was delayed? I would want to draw a Ven diagram and write all the names into it. If you managed to be on the cruise, in the bus, and on that plane, please never travel with me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renthead Mommy Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 As a side note I am surprised by how many people go on cruises without their spouse! And children without parents....I told dh last night, 'I don't think I would go on a cruise without you and I KNOW you wouldn't be going without me.' Our vacation budget is nearly zero though so whatever we do we want to be together. Well this was just a quickie cruise. Only four days I believe. So it's just a girls weekend type trip. Perfect for bachelorette type parties or just a weekend away. Same thing as trips with Grandparents. Quick and easy trip, good for taking kids on. And Carnival is the cheapest of all lines. You can find such amazing deals it's not even funny. To quote my mom's husband "It's such a good deal we couldn't afford NOT to go!" LOL! But they don't sail Carnival. They prefer smaller boats, longer trips. We had decided we were done with Carnival after our last cruise as well. The cruise was fine, but in comparasion to other lines, really Carnival is the Walmart of cruising. If it was a longer trip, like 10-14 days and up you would probably find fewer couples on their own. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julie in CA Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 Because you're clueless about how badly human feces and urine can ruin a coastal or ocean ecosystem? Do some research on how fecal pollution "dilutes" and what it exactly takes to clean the water. Same goes for any body of water. Dog, cat, goose poop is a major issue in fresh water. Maybe this can unblow your mind about human pollution? Dumping waste can literally kill a sizable area of life in the water. Wow. Abrasive much? :blink: (Pro-cupcake & kilt/anti dog, cat, & goose living in the wild--it's clearly bad for the environment to have all of that nature stuff going on!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joanne Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 Did you guys see that one of the buses broke down and then one of the airplanes had electrical problems and was delayed? I would want to draw a Ven diagram and write all the names into it. If you managed to be on the cruise, in the bus, and on that plane, please never travel with me. My friends were on the bus that broke down. They are home and in good health and spirits. I hope to see them alter today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlmiraGulch Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 Ok, for a little levity, this made me laugh. I love The Onion. (Caution: Language, including the F word, but really funny). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
treestarfae Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 Wow. Abrasive much? :blink: (Pro-cupcake & kilt/anti dog, cat, & goose living in the wild--it's clearly bad for the environment to have all of that nature stuff going on!) No just saying facts. Ever hear of the health department testing the water in your town/city? Domestic pet waste is very damaging. Same goes for certain geese that don't migrate because they were introduced for hunting. They poop a pound a day and when they stay year round they contaminate areas quickly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murmer Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 I am friends with a couple who were on it. They got home today. They report that it wasn't as bad as the media made it out to be. But this friend has an awesome ability to chill/go with the flow and a great way to see the humor in life. I think a lot of how awful it was depended on a lot of things. If it were just me and I was on an upper floor and didn't have to go to work...then it would be like camping on a cruise. If it was my dh and I and kids were being watched by a family member then there may have been a bit of worry just wanting to make sure everyone home was ok. If it was my whole family and food could not be safe for my food allergic child and she was starving because she couldn't eat anything then it would have been a horrible experience. If medication had run out for dd (she has epilepsy) it would have been a very very scary experience. If I had a baby and had limited formula and diapers as some families were said to have experience it would have been a nightmare. So I think that experiences really depended on the situation per person on the ship. I think that the overall impression for the majority is that is was a very smelly mildly inconvenient adventure at sea. But there are families that had nightmare experiences because of things like med needs and older persons who couldn't handle the lines ect for food, of course the media is going to latch onto the nightmare experiences. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luanne Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 I don't know, but I think they need to change the name of the ship to "Blow-Up" or something. Triumph doesn't fit at all anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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