Totally freaked out (long)

[LibraryLover]

As a child care provider, aren't you a mandated reporter? A visit from CPS, while traumatic, could get the ball rolling for services. CPS can do things other than remove the child, especially if they see no signs of abuse.

 

She probably doesn't have RAD given the circumstances, but she sounds that there is some sort of mental illness that needs to be addressed.

 

How sad.

Edited July 27, 2011 by LibraryLover

[Denisemomof4]

:iagree: The 3 main signs of sociopath behavior in children is harming/killing animals for fun/without empathy, pyromania, and bed wetting. Most adults sociopaths had 2/3 in their childhood. It dosen't mean that all children who do 2/3 of those things will grow up to be sociopaths, but they are early warning signs of possible problems.

 

As to the sexual awareness, because of some abuse in my history (I was taken away from my parents when I was 4 but I have a LOT of memories from that time...) I was kissing boys in preschool. I really hope I didn't mess them up....

 

 

 

I think by spiritual issue they may be referring to demonic influence or possession.

 

but ALL the behaviors you mention above, INCLUDING sexual acting out are also symptoms of RAD. Just a FEW of them.

 

I'm not trying to diagnose, not my place and not helpful. I'm just point out the facts. Bedwetting (or peeing/pooping pants - this is the FIRST summer my RAD hasn't done that. PROGRESS!!!!!), harming/killing animals with no remorse, setting fires, sexual acting out are only 4 of MANY of the behaviors a RAD child has.

[Denisemomof4]

Um...you mean the 7yo talked about being a lesbian or that her mother was a lesbian? Either way, my red flag went up when I read that she comments a lot about kissing. You can bet there is something going on or she has had some traumatic experience she is acting out...or indiscriminate exposure to TV with no guidance.

 

while that could be true, RAD kids, YOUNG kids, act out sexually, are flirtatious, etc. I've gotten a handle on that for the most part with MY dd, and she was only 14 months old when I got her. I had to teach her what was appropriate and what wasn't. I couldn't believe what I saw when she was younger.

 

Again, she's come a long way.

 

This child could know from experience, but RAD kids just somehow know. I find it puzzling. I'm sure SOME RAD kids were sexually harmed in some way, but not all for sure.

 

AGAIN, not trying to diagnose, but people just don't understand and I'm the one to speak out on this. From experience.,

[kwickimom]

Um...you mean the 7yo talked about being a lesbian or that her mother was a lesbian? Either way, my red flag went up when I read that she comments a lot about kissing. You can bet there is something going on or she has had some traumatic experience she is acting out...or indiscriminate exposure to TV with no guidance.

 

The 7YO said shes a lesbian, not the mom.

 

but ALL the behaviors you mention above, INCLUDING sexual acting out are also symptoms of RAD. Just a FEW of them.

 

I'm not trying to diagnose, not my place and not helpful. I'm just point out the facts. Bedwetting (or peeing/pooping pants - this is the FIRST summer my RAD hasn't done that. PROGRESS!!!!!), harming/killing animals with no remorse, setting fires, sexual acting out are only 4 of MANY of the behaviors a RAD child has.

 

 

I am going to read more about this, although not much I can do.

 

As a child care provider, aren't you a mandated reporter? A visit from CPS, while traumatic, could get the ball rolling for services. CPS can do things other than remove the child, especially if they see no signs of abuse.

 

She probably doesn't have RAD given the circumstances, but she sounds that there is some sort of mental illness that needs to be addressed.

 

How sad.

 

 

I really only have to report the death of the fish which is my word against hers. I do not have any evidence of abuse, can only speculate.

[Jean in Newcastle]

No one will agree with me, but it sounds like a spiritual issue to me.

 

Comments like give zero practical help.

[Plucky]

Is this child seeing a mental health professional? The kids that I have known that were even close to being like you described this little girl, have to see a therapist or doctor and often need meds.

 

Where is she learning some of the things she talked about? While she may be precocious there may be someone behind the scenes influencing her negatively.

[HeidiKC]

I'm most bothered by the fact that the mom was NOT bothered by what her DD did. No advice... but I share your concern!

 

:iagree:

[Geo]

Sounds like Conduct Disorder. Harming pets is certainly a symptom of that.

[mcconnellboys]

Yes, I have read that sociopaths do this sort of thing in childhood. I would be very concerned. As a nurse, her mother should know that this is very concerning behavior, too.

 

As an aside to all this, I think it's hard to get soap residue out of a fish tank. Before I'd replace a fish in the same tank, I'd talk to the pet store about how to get soap residue out of the tank so the next one won't go belly up, too....

 

Are you sure she didn't do anything to the bird? Put anything inappropriate in its cage, etc.?

 

From just the two examples you've given, I wouldn't class her bahavior as "experimental." I'd class it as destructive and dangerous. I think I'd talk to the mother further and try to find out other examples of behavior to see if all/most of them fit the same sort of pattern....

[Denisemomof4]

What I typed above makes it look like my RAD dd yas all those symptoms. She doesn't.

 

I needed to make sure I clarified that!

[Denisemomof4]

for anyone interested, here is a checklist of symptoms for RAD kids:

 

http://www.reactiveattachmentdisordertreatment.com/childattachchecklist.pdf

[Mommy22alyns]

I'm sorry about your fish. That is very disturbing and sad.

[theYoungerMrsWarde]

for anyone interested, here is a checklist of symptoms for RAD kids:

 

http://www.reactiveattachmentdisordertreatment.com/childattachchecklist.pdf

 

Thank you for this information. I wasn't sure what "RAD" stood for, though I did guess from the context. My heart goes out to the parents dealing with this :grouphug:

[Wendi]

No one will agree with me, but it sounds like a spiritual issue to me.

 

 

How so?

 

Wendi

[gardenmom5]

I babysat for 4 girls this summer. One of them has "issues" and the mom warned me to keep a close eye on her because she does "weird" things..... Well yesterday she kept asking me if I liked my fish (the tank is in the bathroom) and my bird. Asked me like 20 times, but she does that a lot.

After they leave I go to the bathroom to find out...she DID kill my fish.

 

I explained that she had asked me all day if I loved my fish and that she was hysterical laughing and happy as can be when she told me she killed it. .

 

she sounds just like a number of the kids in my SPD/ASD support group. sensory-processing-disorder.com has great FAQ's and autism spectrum disorder.

does she have asperger's? does she have serious food intolerances? (most parents are oblivious to this one unless they've actually done testing. it's unbelievable what a food intolerance will do to a personality. gluten/casein/yeast/soy are the biggies, and they can act like opiates. taking the intolerant food away - and after the child goes through physical withdrawal - can literally bestow an entirely different child.)

 

yes - she needs lot of help, but the help is there if she can go to the right place. A developmental pscyhologist or DAN!naturopath is a good start. (DAN! stands for Defeat Autism Now!)

Edited July 27, 2011 by gardenmom5

[Harriet Vane]

As a child care provider, aren't you a mandated reporter? A visit from CPS, while traumatic, could get the ball rolling for services. CPS can do things other than remove the child, especially if they see no signs of abuse.

 

She probably doesn't have RAD given the circumstances, but she sounds that there is some sort of mental illness that needs to be addressed.

 

How sad.

 

There is currently nothing to report--there are just big red flags. Nothing about what she has posted here meets DCFS criteria for investigation.

 

Since the OP will no longer be babysitting this child, I recommended that she tell another mandated reporter who will have more regular access to the child and who can therefore continue to monitor for abuse concerns.

[kwickimom]

I dont know if she has food intolerances or aspergers. She is very heavy and eats a lot (even fifnishes the other kids food). I know the girls have a 16YO half brother that lives in the house too. All they tell me is that they hate him and their father because they are mean to them. I even heard the mother say she knew the father was mean and she was sorry.

 

Its stinks all around. I am just happy I am not going to have them in my home ever again. I feel like I should be doing more, and I am going to talk to the school counselor, but thats all I can do I guess. I dont know how things would go if I talked to the mother again. Its just sad and scary.

 

I just keep thinking thank God it wasnt my bird or puppies or cat. Of course we liked the fish and I hate to see animal suffer, but I would have been totally devastated if it was any of the other animals. I took my parrot out of his cage immediately and changed out his food and water bowls and scrubbed his cage. I didnt see anything suspicious. I thinks he did that because she knew that was the one place I couldnt watch her...the bathroom. I should have checked right away, but I think she watched him die because she ran around saying "I killed your fish" I just wish I had caught her right away and was able to confront her in front of her mother.

 

UGH. I have got to et over this. It just creeps me out so bad.

[gardenmom5]

She has told me she is a lesbian, that she makes out with girls and has made a few s*xual comments. The sisters told me she has gotten them kicked out of a few activities and about some weird things she has done.

 

since it is only this one child, and the other's are fine, I wonder if at some point she has been s3xually molested by a woman? those ideas came from somewhere. . .

Some of the other does sound like (unfortunately) typical "obsessesd with death and killing" behavior of too many Aspie kids I've known. (and more severe than what I'm dealing with with my SPD/ASD little one.) Help is there, and things can get better.

[Jennifer3141]

I am so sorry about your fish. I have a betta I feel that way about. This sounds like a family with some problems. :(

[gardenmom5]

one more thing. Eventually the school will probably get involved, first with their own counselor, then likely recommending that the parents get help for the child. That will be very good for her.

 

I never leave my dd8 unattended in our home because of the damage she causes to the home AND our animals. And one therapist told me, "She doesn't MEAN to do that to *such and such animal* she just feels bad inside." :001_huh: And now I can only find therapists to help ME deal with dd's problems. Nobody will work with HER.

 

it's stupid.

 

 

has she ever been tested for food sensitivities? are there foods she craves all the time? food intolerances can cause an opiate reaction where the child wants it, but it's like a drug and adversely affects behavior by affecting them chemically. I dont' have the studies on hand - gluten is usually the worst, and can mimic both bipolar and schizophrenia. take away the gluten/ getting it out of the system can take months and every infraction resets the clock to zero, but kids with the sensitivity can become an entirely new person after it's out of their system. there is a test a ped would do, but it only tests for celiac not sensitivity associated with gluten that causes other problems.

[Dobela]

since it is only this one child, and the other's are fine, I wonder if at some point she has been s3xually molested by a woman? those ideas came from somewhere. . .

Some of the other does sound like (unfortunately) typical "obsessesd with death and killing" behavior of too many Aspie kids I've known. (and more severe than what I'm dealing with with my SPD/ASD little one.) Help is there, and things can get better.

While I thought about s(x abuse, I wouldn't expect it from the mom. The anger could be if she feels the mom is not protecting her from the dad or brother or some other male. But really, all we are diong is speculating here, and our theories are jumping exponentially with each post.

 

OP, I think letting the school know you have concerns is good. Make sure you let them know the stories the mohas told you, the stories from all the girls, the reports of acting out sexually (even if it is second hand), and let the counselor be on alert.

[gardenmom5]

While I thought about s(x abuse, I wouldn't expect it from the mom. The anger could be if she feels the mom is not protecting her from the dad or brother or some other male. But really, all we are diong is speculating here, and our theories are jumping exponentially with each post.

 

OP, I think letting the school know you have concerns is good. Make sure you let them know the stories the mohas told you, the stories from all the girls, the reports of acting out sexually (even if it is second hand), and let the counselor be on alert.

 

It doesn't have to be the mom, and I don't think it is either. aunt, grandmother, mom's friend, neighbor, babysitter, etc. are all possibilities. I'm sorry they coudn't define "step-brother and dad are mean".

 

It sounds like mom is overwhelmed and following the "if I ignore it long enough it will go away" method of problem solving. (which doens't work.) Not uncommon if she's over-stretched and doesn't even know where to begin looking for help.

 

the fact this child's mother stated she needs to be watched at all times and does odd things, are not in dispute, is a big flag. so there isn't evidence of abuse, there is evidence something is seriously wrong and this child needs help.

[lakotajm]

This sounds like a child with RAD. And that doesn't get better. I have a good friend who has BTDT.

OK, I know this is a serious thread, but I chuckled a bit at this one, not knowing what BTDT is, because my mind immediately jumped to Been There Done That syndrome. I think I have it!;) So many acronyms, so little clarity (for those of us without an acronym dictionary).

Lakota

[Orthodox6]

I don't know FiveOaksAcademy.

 

If she belongs to one of the Christian groups that understands illness -- whether physical, mental, or combined -- to have both a physical and a spiritual component, then she has offered a fair and reasonable observation. If a reader disagrees with FOA, just peacefully accept that she comes from a different perspective. :)

 

Meanwhile, I feel so deeply sorry for OP, as well as respectfully impressed that she has offered child care for so long to this incredibly messed-up child.

 

Agreeing with everyone else who suggests immediate, profound professional help for both child and mother -- if not for the entire family. I won't hazard a guess as to what specific diagnoses would emerge, other than to expect more than one.

 

 

 

 

No one will agree with me, but it sounds like a spiritual issue to me.

Edited July 27, 2011 by Orthodox6

[gardenmom5]

OK, I know this is a serious thread, but I chuckled a bit at this one, not knowing what BTDT is, because my mind immediately jumped to Been There Done That syndrome. I think I have it!;) So many acronyms, so little clarity (for those of us without an acronym dictionary).

Lakota

 

The full acronym is actually BTDTGTTS.

 

(been there, done that, got the T-shirt) ;)

[lakotajm]

My eight year old son with autism killed our hamster. He saw a stupid commercial on TV so he tried that home so to speak. he put the hamster in the ball and rolled him down the stairs.

 

He really didn't get why the thing would not wake up.The hamster on TV came out turning summer saults GRRR. The neighbor called the police on me and child services investigated that. He didn't understand. He loved that little hamster. But to be happy about it that is horrible. I wouldn't think she needs to be around younger children or pets. At 7 you know not to squirt soap in a fish bowl.

 

 

First, you pointed out your 8 yo(autistic) innocently killed a hamster and didn't understand how his actions caused its death, then said a 7 yo would know not to put soap in a fish bowl. I would not say this is categorically accurate. The maliciousness is what is freaky, not the action itself. Because I have a dd8 that has ADHD symptoms and tends to do stuff without even thinking of consequences. If it pops in her head, she does it. She has just in the past 6 months begun to get better control of that to where it happens 80% of the time instead of 95%. She had to be supervised very tightly up until this past year. So there are probably quite a few 7 yo out there who may not realize that if you squirt handsoap into a fishbowl it spells disaster, and ther are some who may vaguely get this and yet not be able to control their impulses well enough to tell themselves not to do it. My dd8 would be in that crowd. She would probably only be slightly remorseful, because she sets up defenses when she sees that she has screwed up. But gleeful?-Yeah, that's weird!

 

Lakota

[butterflymommy]

Just wanted to chime in that if the girl has been sexually abused it is not necessarily from an adult. Peer abuse (child to child sex abuse) is a very real and damaging phenomena. She may even turn "predatory" herself. While it is true some children are born disturbed, most need some "help" to get to a the point of inappropriate, scary behavior. I would assume she has been abused in one form or another until proven otherwise. As far as what you can do, probably there isn't much. CPS won't investigate over a fish killing incident, and unless she specifically said that someone is having her do sexual things, promiscuous talk or behavior won't warrant an investigation either. Protect your own kids from her, definitely do not have them interact with this child again.

[Harriet Vane]

I dont know if she has food intolerances or aspergers. She is very heavy and eats a lot (even fifnishes the other kids food). I know the girls have a 16YO half brother that lives in the house too. All they tell me is that they hate him and their father because they are mean to them. I even heard the mother say she knew the father was mean and she was sorry.

 

Its stinks all around. I am just happy I am not going to have them in my home ever again. I feel like I should be doing more, and I am going to talk to the school counselor, but thats all I can do I guess. I dont know how things would go if I talked to the mother again. Its just sad and scary.

 

I just keep thinking thank God it wasnt my bird or puppies or cat. Of course we liked the fish and I hate to see animal suffer, but I would have been totally devastated if it was any of the other animals. I took my parrot out of his cage immediately and changed out his food and water bowls and scrubbed his cage. I didnt see anything suspicious. I thinks he did that because she knew that was the one place I couldnt watch her...the bathroom. I should have checked right away, but I think she watched him die because she ran around saying "I killed your fish" I just wish I had caught her right away and was able to confront her in front of her mother.

 

UGH. I have got to et over this. It just creeps me out so bad.

 

Just wanted to give you another :grouphug:.

[FiveOaksAcademy]

:)

Edited July 30, 2011 by FiveOaksAcademy

[unsinkable]

I don't know FiveOaksAcademy.

 

If she belongs to one of the Christian groups that understands illness -- whether physical, mental, or combined -- to have both a physical and a spiritual component, then she has offered a fair and reasonable observation. If a reader disagrees with FOA, just peacefully accept that she comes from a different perspective. :)

 

Meanwhile, I feel so deeply sorry for OP, as well as respectfully impressed that she has offered child care for so long to this incredibly messed-up child.

 

Agreeing with everyone else who suggests immediate, profound professional help for both child and mother -- if not for the entire family. I won't hazard a guess as to what specific diagnoses would emerge, other than to expect more than one.

 

I respect F.O.A.'s opinion about what might be happening to this girl as much as I respect everyone else's keyboard diagnosis in this thread.

 

What I thought was unnecessary was the "No one will agree with me" part.

 

Give the board a chance before you paint everyone with a broad brush. I KNOW there have been threads here about demons and spiritual warfare.

[kwickimom]

She knew the soap would kill the fish. And she plotted it out, asked me how much I liked my fish and if my kids liked the fish, and then she killed it and ran around gleefully proclaiming she killed it. If she didnt think it would kill it she would have said nothing, or told me she tried to wash the fish or would have been sorry or something like that. She lied to her mom about not touching the fish. So she is covering up with lies. She kept telling her mom she had nothing to say sorry for. (shiver)

[Jean in Newcastle]

She knew the soap would kill the fish. And she plotted it out, asked me how much I liked my fish and if my kids liked the fish, and then she killed it and ran around gleefully proclaiming she killed it. If she didnt think it would kill it she would have said nothing, or told me she tried to wash the fish or would have been sorry or something like that. She lied to her mom about not touching the fish. So she is covering up with lies. She kept telling her mom she had nothing to say sorry for. (shiver)

 

You are right that it was deliberate. The fact that she ran to poke at the bird before leaving, so that she could complete her agenda is disturbing as well.

[FiveOaksAcademy]

:)

Edited July 30, 2011 by FiveOaksAcademy

[ma23peas]

She knew the soap would kill the fish. And she plotted it out, asked me how much I liked my fish and if my kids liked the fish, and then she killed it and ran around gleefully proclaiming she killed it. If she didnt think it would kill it she would have said nothing, or told me she tried to wash the fish or would have been sorry or something like that. She lied to her mom about not touching the fish. So she is covering up with lies. She kept telling her mom she had nothing to say sorry for. (shiver)

 

 

I am so sorry for both you and this family. A part of me seems to think that you should report this to the school guidance counselor if she's in public school...that is all I can think of...as long as there is a report, her first transgression at school may be taken more seriously. I'm all for teaching lessons, I almost would ask her mother to have her come to your house for a burial of your family pet....go all out...be sincere but have a eulogy for the little thing and see if it 'breaks' her and some sort of remorse shows through or if she'll giggle at the funeral..then maybe her mother will take it more seriously....that's all I've got on this one....sorry for your family and hers :(

[Forget-Me-Not]

Identifying herself as a lesbian and "making out" with girls at 7 strikes me as unusually precocious behavior. In combination with the other behaviors you describe, I think these claims warrant further investigation by a professional who can identify exactly what she means by "making out." It could be a reference to relatively innocent, childlike behavior, but then again, it may not be.

 

:iagree:

 

I am concerned about this too. Unfortunately I doubt DCFS would investigate based on the concerns raised in this thread.

 

Lack of a reason to investigate isn't necessarily equivalent to lack of a reason to report. Sure they may not be able to investigate based solely on THIS information. But what if it's a few more small pieces of a very large picture?

 

I had reason to be concerned for a child in my acquaintance, but wasn't sure if the information I had was enough to warrant investigation. I ran it by a friend of mine who works for DFS and she told me to report it anyway, because even if it didn't result in investigation, it would be filed and more information might eventually trickle in and give them enough to go in and investigate later.

[Ginevra]

but ALL the behaviors you mention above, INCLUDING sexual acting out are also symptoms of RAD. Just a FEW of them.

 

I'm not trying to diagnose, not my place and not helpful. I'm just point out the facts. Bedwetting (or peeing/pooping pants - this is the FIRST summer my RAD hasn't done that. PROGRESS!!!!!), harming/killing animals with no remorse, setting fires, sexual acting out are only 4 of MANY of the behaviors a RAD child has.

 

That is true, none of us can diagnose the girl from the board. We can speculate and we can give the OP ideas, but we can't really know. :grouphug: I have learned about RAD and I can't think of many more distressing issues to cope with as a parent.

 

I think it's enough to say what the OP already knows - that the girl has several alarming and abnormal behaviors that need serious attention by professionals.

[ThatCyndiGirl]

I am so sorry for both you and this family. A part of me seems to think that you should report this to the school guidance counselor if she's in public school...that is all I can think of...as long as there is a report, her first transgression at school may be taken more seriously. I'm all for teaching lessons, I almost would ask her mother to have her come to your house for a burial of your family pet....go all out...be sincere but have a eulogy for the little thing and see if it 'breaks' her and some sort of remorse shows through or if she'll giggle at the funeral..then maybe her mother will take it more seriously....that's all I've got on this one....sorry for your family and hers :(

 

 

Good idea. Except,....it could be emotionally damanging/upsetting for OP's kids if the girl who did this shows glee about it, kwim?

 

You DO have reason to report to Child Welfare based on what you wrote here:

 

1) Killed an animal without remorse.

 

2) Step-father and step-brother are "mean", unknown what that means, but concerning.

 

3) Step-father and/or mom leaves them unattended while sleeping. (of course, based on ages that may not be of concern?)

 

4) Behavior issues in multiple venues: school/babysitting/activities/home.

[Orthodox6]

I'm unclear as to whether your last paragraph is directed to me, or to FOA. I posted as I did because of the hideous thread which was removed yesterday. I worried that there could be a repeat performance. The burst of similar threads (nudism, modesty, and so forth) make me uncomfortable. Their presence make me worry about a possible willingness, even a desire, to squabble.

 

FOA's later clarification sounds close to a position which I, personally, cannot accept. I'll just refrain from responding to it directly.

 

This thread, though, is way calmer than the one referenced above. Thanks be for that! :)

 

I respect F.O.A.'s opinion about what might be happening to this girl as much as I respect everyone else's keyboard diagnosis in this thread.

 

What I thought was unnecessary was the "No one will agree with me" part.

 

Give the board a chance before you paint everyone with a broad brush. I KNOW there have been threads here about demons and spiritual warfare.

[Alicia64]

 

 

I texted her mom immediatley (she is a nurse and sleeps/works weird hours so I didnt want to wake her) and she called me later and made the child apologize and told me this child said she didnt do anything and that maybe she was trying to "wash" the fish.

 

I haven't read the other posts.

 

Personally, I am getting sick of parents who don't want to see how bad their kid's behavior is. I'm coming across it often. And give me a break: a seven year old knows that you don't "wash" a live fish.

 

Denial.

 

I'm so sorry. :grouphug:

 

Alley

Edited July 27, 2011 by Alicia64

[kwickimom]

Good idea. Except,....it could be emotionally damanging/upsetting for OP's kids if the girl who did this shows glee about it, kwim?

 

You DO have reason to report to Child Welfare based on what you wrote here:

 

1) Killed an animal without remorse.

 

2) Step-father and step-brother are "mean", unknown what that means, but concerning.

 

3) Step-father and/or mom leaves them unattended while sleeping. (of course, based on ages that may not be of concern?)

 

4) Behavior issues in multiple venues: school/babysitting/activities/home.

 

Numbers 2-3 are just heresay from kids ages 4 to 9. I have never witnessed anything. I am not sure number 1 or 4 requires a call. I thought DCFS/CPS is for abuse or neglect isusses? Her mom is in denial thats for sure, but I dont think she is abusive and I am not sure about neglectful. I should say that mom has been wonderful and seems like a good, involved mom, but she works a lot. I think maybe she was in shock and in denial when she found out this onfo and she told me she did not know what to say. Idk if neglectful includes ignoring a possible mental health issue? And I dont know for sure that the child is not in counseling. I dont think she is because I figured someone would have said something, but I cannot be sure.

[QuirkyKapers]

Wow- I would be freaked out too! It sounds like you handled the situation diplomatically. :grouphug::grouphug::grouphug:

[ThatCyndiGirl]

Numbers 2-3 are just heresay from kids ages 4 to 9. I have never witnessed anything. I am not sure number 1 or 4 requires a call. I thought DCFS/CPS is for abuse or neglect isusses? Her mom is in denial thats for sure, but I dont think she is abusive and I am not sure about neglectful. I should say that mom has been wonderful and seems like a good, involved mom, but she works a lot. I think maybe she was in shock and in denial when she found out this onfo and she told me she did not know what to say. Idk if neglectful includes ignoring a possible mental health issue? And I dont know for sure that the child is not in counseling. I dont think she is because I figured someone would have said something, but I cannot be sure.

 

To your bolded: yes, it does. As to numbers 2 and 3, the fact that those reports are from the other kids, to me, gives credence to their veracity. I'm not saying that this is a cut-and-dried case, but perhaps you could just call the hotline and outline your concerns with the disclaimer, "I don't know if this is even what qualified as abuse or neglect, but I am CONCERNED".

 

And you can do so anonymously. :grouphug:

 

ETA: Please understand that I am not seeing this as a way of "punishing" the mother's behaviour, but one of getting services into the home and getting more eyes looking at this child and her situation. It sounds like perhaps the mom really doesn't KNOW how to deal with her daughter's issues.

[Joanne]

Some of the other does sound like (unfortunately) typical "obsessesd with death and killing" behavior of too many Aspie kids I've known. (and more severe than what I'm dealing with with my SPD/ASD little one.) Help is there, and things can get better.

 

My understanding of Aspies is that the bold is not common. Hyperfocus/addictive like behavior around video or computer games that may include killing is common in spectrum kids. But I am not personally aware of death and killing being associated with aspies.

 

What the OP described is *classic* precursor to conduct disorder (to antisocial/sociopath). Denise is correct that it is also RAD-like, but RAD rarely emerges from intact, biological situations.

[Orthodox6]

Asperger's ?!?! This is not part of Asperger's, but could belong to a comorbid condition. Definitely should be evaluated.

 

Some of the other does sound like (unfortunately) typical "obsessesd with death and killing" behavior of too many Aspie kids I've known. (and more severe than what I'm dealing with with my SPD/ASD little one.) Help is there, and things can get better.

[Joanne]

Just a note about "reporting". It's important to remember that you don't have to decide, evaluate, or judge validity to report. Getting more information and evaluating is up to CPS, not individuals who are not professionals.

[LibraryLover]

I think the OP does have significant indication of trouble to report. Killing animals is a big deal, the sexual talk is another. At any rate, one makes the call, but it is up to CPS to decide to investigate. Let them decide, or not. They can also keep a report on file even if they do not investigate. If there is already one report on file, any more reports will put the child on their radar and could make a difference, for the better, for the family.

 

It is an imperfect system, but sometimes it takes an investigation to get a child help.

[Joanne]

I think the OP does have significant indication of trouble to report. Killing animals is a big deal, the sexual talk is another. At any rate, one makes the call, but it is up to CPS to decide to investigate. Let them decide, or not. They can also keep a report on file even if they do not investigate. If there is already one report on file, any more reports will put the child on their radar and could make a difference, for the better, for the family.

 

It is an imperfect system, but sometimes it takes an investigation to get a child help.

 

:iagree:

 

Many situations that require intervention don't get help because people try to do CPS' job before they call. It's a *report*. CPS does the investigation.

[LibraryLover]

:iagree:

 

Many situations that require intervention don't get help because people try to do CPS' job before they call. It's a *report*. CPS does the investigation.

 

 

I see you already mentioned this well. I hadn't read through to the end. You're so right.

[Guest Dulcimeramy]

I think the OP does have significant indication of trouble to report. Killing animals is a big deal, the sexual talk is another. At any rate, one makes the call, but it is up to CPS to decide to investigate. Let them decide, or not. They can also keep a report on file even if they do not investigate. If there is already one report on file, any more reports will put the child on their radar and could make a difference, for the better, for the family.

 

It is an imperfect system, but sometimes it takes an investigation to get a child help.

 

:iagree:

 

I'm usually in the don't-call-CPS crowd, but I would over this. I can imagine that I'd call Mom to come get the child immediately, but after I hung up I'd call the authorities. It isn't about the size of the life (goldfish) but about her deliberate and pre-meditated taking of a life at your house.

 

I would see the fish-killing as an emergency on its own, but then she headed for the bird! I would be fearful for her safety and for the safety of humans in her life. I'm afraid for her to go to school without someone knowing about this.

[Jennifer3141]

Am I the only person who wonders if this girl isn't just a plain old jerk? Can't we just have jerks in the world anymore or do they all need an official DX?

 

I think the OP is totally justified in cutting contact with the kid and family but I'm not sure diagnosing someone at the age of 7 as a sociopath for killing a fish is the way to go. Maybe she's just a jerk? Or a bigger jerk that day? Maybe she does feel gay but lives in one of the kinds of families who thinks she is going to hell for it?

 

I have called CPS on someone but I'm not sure I'd call on a dead fish or a little girl telling me she thinks she's gay.

 

I'd cut contact with the family because of the mom's response just as much as the kid's behavior. Wow. Way to teach respect of life and other people's property!!