Can we discuss what retirement does to marriage?

[regentrude]

It's been a long thread and I lost track: but I thought you had said she is hesitant to ask him about the finances and hasn't done it? So it's not that he refuses to give her info, but she simply won't ask?
There isn't any way around it. She needs to actually ask him and have the discussion, whether she feels comfortable about that or not. 

Edited February 7, 2023 by regentrude

[KungFuPanda]

I don’t think he’s going to change his personality or his business practices because his wife suddenly became interested. It sounds shaky for her and I agree she should be managing her own money and setting up a nest egg when she’s handed large sums of cash. The relationship doesn’t sound good and may have run it’s course.
 

She needs to plan for contingencies and that could mean scaling back her lifestyle. Fretting accomplishes nothing. She can woman up and have a hard conversation and just cope with feeling ignorant about things she knows nothing about. That’s not bad. It’s how you learn. If she’s hesitant to rock the boat for fear of getting cut off, then her life is probably headed that way anyway. Being the second, young, trophy wife to a rich jerk generally has a time limit. If he doesn’t respect her and is displaying sustain/disgust in front of people it’s likely the beginning of the end. she has to bring more to the table than stress and angst. She has to make moves to build up her own confidence independent of her husband. It could actually be good for them both and rejuvenate the marriage. 
 

 

[Scarlett]

On 2/7/2023 at 3:40 PM, marbel said:

OK, sorry, my bad on that. I thought you had said that. But isn't she afraid she will be cut out of his estate if he dies?  By his daughter and brother, I think? Sorry if I'm muddling everything up. 

In any case, it would have been smart for her to have some investments of her own, under the care of a professional financial advisor. Taking friends on trips is nice and all, but not for someone who may be financially vulnerable. And anyone can be financially vulnerable if they don't have money in their name, or might have some, but don't know about it and don't know how to get it.

 

Edited February 9, 2023 by Scarlett

[regentrude]

14 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

She is interested in being a partner to her husband—to have access to the big picture. to feel like he values her and thinks the money is hers too.  

so has she told him that and outright asked him to give her the info?

[Carol in Cal.]

I’m wading into this with some trepidation because it could sound like blaming the victim, but I’m wondering whether how she is approaching her husband is part of the problem.  If she is just always expressing vague doubts, or tossing shade on his ideas for investments, that is a lot different from what we are advocating for here, which is, hey, I want to get an overview of our finances so that I can know what to expect in the event of adverse circumstances like you become incapacitated or worse.  We are not getting any younger, and it is in both of our best interests for me to understand this.

And, just in general, if she saw a good financial advisor she could work with him to come up with a list of If Then type questions as well as a simple way to organize their financial information and lay it out understandably as an overview.  

It’s very possible that all the details would be too much for her to fully grasp, but she should be able to get her arms around the basics.  It is super important not to sound critical or whiny while doing so though.

Edited February 7, 2023 by Carol in Cal.

[Scarlett]

On 2/7/2023 at 3:44 PM, KungFuPanda said:

I don’t think he’s going to change his personality or his business practices because his wife suddenly became interested. It sounds shaky for her and I agree she should be managing her own money and setting up a nest egg when she’s handed large sums of cash. The relationship doesn’t sound good and may have run it’s course.
 

She needs to plan for contingencies and that could mean scaling back her lifestyle. Fretting accomplishes nothing. She can woman up and have a hard conversation and just cope with feeling ignorant about things she knows nothing about. That’s not bad. It’s how you learn. If she’s hesitant to rock the boat for fear of getting cut off, then her life is probably headed that way anyway. Being the second, young, trophy wife to a rich jerk generally has a time limit. If he doesn’t respect her and is displaying sustain/disgust in front of people it’s likely the beginning of the end. she has to bring more to the table than stress and angst. She has to make moves to build up her own confidence independent of her husband. It could actually be good for them both and rejuvenate the marriage. 
 

 

. 

Edited February 9, 2023 by Scarlett

[Clarita]

2 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

I think a lot of this is her issue to solve.  They went to NYC a month or so ago for a big financial meeting…..I told her to sit in on the meeting and try to learn some stuff…..but she just said no way.  *I* know she is just too intimidated and insecure.  It certainly is not that she is shallow and just wanted to go shopping., 

That's why it would be great for her to take her own little pile of cash and get her own investment/financial advisor to chat with would be good. She would be the client and there is no big husband to tell her to sit quietly in the corner. 

If she were my friend when she told me no way I'd probably tell her well I don't know why you expect your husband to treat you like a financial partner if you won't even attend a meeting about it.

[Scarlett]

Just now, Carol in Cal. said:

I’m wading into this with some trepidation because it could sound like blaming the victim, but I’m wondering whether how she is approaching her husband is part of the problem.  If she is just always expressing vague doubts, or tossing shade on his ideas for investments, that is a lot different from what we are advocating for here, which is,, I want to get an overview of our finances so that I can know what to expect in the event of adverse circumstances like you become incapacitated or worse.  We are not getting any younger, and it is in both of our best interests for me to understand this.

And, just in general, if she saw a good financial advisor she could work with him to come up with a list of If Then type questions as well as a simple way to organize their financial information and lay it out understandably as an overview.  

This is exactly what she told me today that she wants to say to him.  Hopefully she will just do it.  

[Scarlett]

1 minute ago, Clarita said:

That's why it would be great for her to take her own little pile of cash and get her own investment/financial advisor to chat with would be good. She would be the client and there is no big husband to tell her to sit quietly in the corner. 

If she were my friend when she told me no way I'd probably tell her well I don't know why you expect your husband to treat you like a financial partner if you won't even attend a meeting about it.

I did express to her she is being her own worst enemy. She agrees.  Lol

[KungFuPanda]

11 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

I know it is difficult to get things across in this format….and I think I am failing….but she isn’t afraid to scale back her lifestyle if she needs to. She also isn’t afraid he is going to divorce her.  She just does not like that his brother is involved in their money and she doesn’t like that she doesn’t have access to or knowledge of their money…BUT some of this is her fault because she is so conflict avoidant and she won’t just ask the hard questions.  

So she just has to call their accountant, set up an appointment without her husband, and ask him to “Explain it to me like I’m a second grader.”  She  just has to tell him that she’s at the stage of life where she feels she should understand her full financial picture and she does not  There’s no point in regretting not doing it sooner. She can ask  “What happens if I die? what happens if Dh dies? Who do I call first? Maybe she should pre plan their funerals so there is no family conflict when the time comes. This way it’s her and her Dh making the decisions and not the rest of the family putting their two cents in. 
 

 

 

[Scarlett]

On 2/7/2023 at 4:08 PM, KungFuPanda said:

So she just has to call their accountant, set up an appointment without her husband, and ask him to “Explain it to me like I’m a second grader.”  She  just has to tell him that she’s at the stage of life where she feels she should understand her full financial picture and she does not  There’s no point in regretting not doing it sooner. She can ask  “What happens if I die? what happens if Dh dies? Who do I call first? Maybe she should pre plan their funerals so there is no family conflict when the time comes. This way it’s her and her Dh making the decisions and not the rest of the family putting their two cents in. 
 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 9, 2023 by Scarlett

[Laura Corin]

1 hour ago, Scarlett said:

There is no way she will call any of their financial people.  But all the questions you suggested definitely should be asked of her husband.  It is almost word for word what she was telling me yesterday that she knows she needs to say to him.  I hope she will just do it.  
 

I think what happens in her mind (and I have been best friends with her since we were 11) is she starts thinking how it will go and she starts thinking how she wants his brother off of the trust and she gets mad in her mind and then she just gives up and doesn’t talk to him at all.  Rinse and repeat.

I am going to suggest that she ask him some very specific questions and then sit on the info for a few days or weeks.  Then go back and tell him how she feels about his brother’s involvement. 
 

 

Would it help if she had a single, specific thing to ask?  Other things might come later, but right now she needs to know where the money is, in case her husband dies and any financial reps only have a partial view.  If I were her, I would say,

'Please give me a list of all the account numbers for all the accounts, including current, savings, brokers, etc.' 

'Why do you need that?' 

'I need it because in your father's day, there would have been a filing drawer full of statements, but now that so much is online, I wouldn't know where to start looking if you weren't around.'

'That's not secure'

'I'm not asking for the passwords, just the account numbers written on a piece of paper.'

And just keep asking for that one thing.  It's not everything, but it's something.

[livetoread]

 

1 hour ago, Scarlett said:

I am going to suggest that she ask him some very specific questions and then sit on the info for a few days or weeks.  Then go back and tell him how she feels about his brother’s involvement. 

I agree with this. They are two different issues. Her having some feelings about the brother when she doesn't even understand what's going on does put her in a real disadvantage when negotiating. Asking her dh to dump the brother which is likely to cause big family issues needs to be based on something more than a feeling coming from a place of insecurity. Maybe if she had a more thorough understanding of the situation, she'd either feel better about the brother or have some concrete objections to work with. 

She doesn't want to be dismissed, but she also can't expect to be taken really seriously if she is so ignorant about what's going on. Dh should never belittle her or anything, but I am somewhat sympathetic to him not necessarily wanting to jump at her vague insertions. 

[regentrude]

20 hours ago, Harriet Vane said:

I do find it to be a terrible response, to be honest. 

My major in college was English and Rhetoric, whereas my dh is an actuary. Yes, he can do the math infinitely more skillfully than me, and he understands financial investments far more intuitively than I do. But if he ever--ever!--blew off a request for more information or invested our money after I expressed curiosity or concern, you can bet I would haul him into therapy. That type of disdain is so very, very destructive.

But she is not requesting information, and never has in many years. She is expressing an opinion without having first obtained information and attempted to understand the situation.

It is a similar situation to a husband who has not shown any interest in homeschooling materials and left his wife to handle everything to do with schooling and who now suddenly expresses opinions on a piece of curriculum before asking for information and understanding what is going on. His opinion would not be useful because he does not have the context to form a well-founded opinion. He gets to have an opinion once he has asked for, and processed, the necessary information.

Edited February 8, 2023 by regentrude

[KungFuPanda]

Maybe she could approach it differently.  They're likely old enough to have seen a friend or family member widowed.  

Wife:  When James died, Susan didn't know where to even begin to sort out their finances.  Can you walk me through the assets so I'm informed and nobody can take advantage of me? I don't even know what's in the will and the uncertainty makes me nervous.  I'll be more relaxed if I just know what's going on.

or

When James died Susan knew exactly what to do and I realize I don't

 

Also, is there a reason she doesn't trust the brother?  She needs something other than a vague feeling.  Her dh may be trusting the brother to manage the estate so his wife doesn't have to worry about it.  The brother may be much more qualified than the wife.  I'm not sure there's a great way to question his judgement with finances when he clearly has everything under control. She doesn't just mistrust the BIL, she mistrusts her own husband.  That's a tough place to live.

[Storygirl]

About the brother being "on the trust" : It's entirely possible and even probable that the brother does not have any access at this time to their financial matters. He is likely named as the trustee who will manage the accounts when/if the husband dies.

My brother is named as the trustee of the accounts that we have set up for our children, but he is not at all involved with our current finances.

The way that our trust works is that if DH dies before me, the trustee does not take control; I retain control. Only after we both die will the trustee take over.

Your friend needs to know the structure of the trust. The brother may manage the trusts for the adult children, but I think it would be unusual for the marital money to go into a trust for the wife after the husband's death and that she should inherit her share of the estate outright.

She should definitely know these things. But the brother being a trustee is not necessarily something to be alarmed about. I assume that she would not WANT to manage the trusts for her stepchildren, and that it's better for the brother to do it.

[Jean in Newcastle]

I have the sense that the title of this thread should really be "What Anxiety Does to Marriage".  Your friend sounds extremely anxious.  And while I think that her husband definitely should have taken some initiative in helping her to stay on top of their finances, if she's being so avoidant with him to the point where she can't ask a simple question, I can see why he might think that reassuring her that "he has it under control" might be his way of dealing with her extreme anxiety instead of just being a jerk.  (Which way I think it is, depends on how much more you tell me about him or her.  Neither of them come off as the healthiest personalities.) 

[JennyD]

23 minutes ago, Storygirl said:

t would be unusual for the marital money to go into a trust for the wife after the husband's death and that she should inherit her share of the estate outright.

This sort of trust arrangement is pretty common in high-net-worth families.  It's a way to minimize estate taxes.   I think it's more typical that the spouse is both the trustee and the beneficiary, though, as opposed to having an outside trustee (in this case, the brother).  However, given her overwhelming anxiety and avoidance, I can see why the husband might worry that she just wouldn't be up to the job of administering her own trust.  

 

 

[Arcadia]

10 minutes ago, JennyD said:

 However, given her overwhelming anxiety and avoidance, I can see why the husband might worry that she just wouldn't be up to the job of administering her own trust.  

Or if she becomes too sick to manage her own trust. 
 

I thought the brother being the trustee wasn’t as high an issue as the husband involving his brother in financial decisions. However it is hard to really tell from the outside as siblings could be discussing stuff and using it as sibling bonding time. 

[Bootsie]

What were the concerns that she voiced regarding the international investment opportunity?  Were they specific?  I can see how a ""Darling, I am really nervous about international investments.  I don't think it is a good idea.  Are you really sure?"  being met with a response of "So far I have done well".   This would have been how a discussion like this went with my parents--my mom knows nothing about finance and does NOT really have an interest in learning (she refers to the financial news network as the "TV station that has all those little numbers on the bottom of the screen."  My dad would not be condescending to reply with "so far I have done well"--he would have been responding to her anxiety--not to a concern about a particular investment deal.

Now, if I told my husband, "I have concerns about the investment possibility in Mexico.  The Mexican government has been borrowing heavily and I have concerns that the value of the peso will decline, making it difficult for us to earn a positive return any time in the next 5 years." and his response was simply "so far I have done well"--I would take that as unwilling to listen to and consider my concerns.  

Or, if I said, "I am not fully understanding this investment possibility, can you provide me some additional information regarding the initial cost and the projected revenues...." and the response was "so far I have done well"--I would take that as unwilling to provide me information and have me be part of the conversation.  

[Scarlett]

22 hours ago, regentrude said:

But she is not requesting information, and never has in many years. She is expressing an opinion without having first obtained information and attempted to understand the situation.

It is a similar situation to a husband who has not shown any interest in homeschooling materials and left his wife to handle everything to do with schooling and who now suddenly expresses opinions on a piece of curriculum before asking for information and understanding what is going on. His opinion would not be useful because he does not have the context to form a well-founded opinion. He gets to have an opinion once he has asked for, and processed, the necessary information.

She does have a general sense of what they invest in.  And she doesn’t have to be a financial whiz to have had a concern about this particular thing he was going to do.  

Edited February 9, 2023 by Scarlett

[Scarlett]

20 hours ago, Bootsie said:

What were the concerns that she voiced regarding the international investment opportunity?  Were they specific?  I can see how a ""Darling, I am really nervous about international investments.  I don't think it is a good idea.  Are you really sure?"  being met with a response of "So far I have done well".   This would have been how a discussion like this went with my parents--my mom knows nothing about finance and does NOT really have an interest in learning (she refers to the financial news network as the "TV station that has all those little numbers on the bottom of the screen."  My dad would not be condescending to reply with "so far I have done well"--he would have been responding to her anxiety--not to a concern about a particular investment deal.

Now, if I told my husband, "I have concerns about the investment possibility in Mexico.  The Mexican government has been borrowing heavily and I have concerns that the value of the peso will decline, making it difficult for us to earn a positive return any time in the next 5 years." and his response was simply "so far I have done well"--I would take that as unwilling to listen to and consider my concerns.  

Or, if I said, "I am not fully understanding this investment possibility, can you provide me some additional information regarding the initial cost and the projected revenues...." and the response was "so far I have done well"--I would take that as unwilling to provide me information and have me be part of the conversation.  

 

Edited February 9, 2023 by Scarlett

[Bootsie]

6 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

She does not trust the person pushing this investment. 

Did she express specific concerns about the person pushing the investment?  Or did she express concerns about the investment itself?  While related, those are really two separate issues.

"Darling, I don't trust Bobby.  You know he swindled X in the deal in France.  Are you sure this isn't the same type of deal?'

"Darling, I am nervous about this deal."   or 

"Darling, I have reservations about a deal in Mexico if Bobby is the one pushing the idea." 

could all be interpreted as questions of "Do you really know what you are doing here?" (which, a mention of track record may be appropriate) rather than wanting to be part of a discussion of whether this is an appropriate investment for them to make at this time.  

If I were concerned about an international investment DH was interested in, and I thought someone I didn't trust was influencing that decision, I would put forth every effort to participate, be involved, and become educated about the situation.  I wouldn't respond that I don't want to be out of the country for two weeks in May.  Perhaps there is a reason for not being out of the country then; but, a response of "if you are really wanting to check this out, I think it would be good for us both to be there to look this idea over.  That time in May really doesn't work well for me because of Sally's graduation, could we schedule the trip for a couple of weeks earlier or a couple of weeks later."  That shows interest in hearing and learning about the idea--not simply a desire to veto the idea.

 

[Scarlett]

19 hours ago, Bootsie said:

Did she express specific concerns about the person pushing the investment?  Or did she express concerns about the investment itself?  While related, those are really two separate issues.

"Darling, I don't trust Bobby.  You know he swindled X in the deal in France.  Are you sure this isn't the same type of deal?'

"Darling, I am nervous about this deal."   or 

"Darling, I have reservations about a deal in Mexico if Bobby is the one pushing the idea." 

could all be interpreted as questions of "Do you really know what you are doing here?" (which, a mention of track record may be appropriate) rather than wanting to be part of a discussion of whether this is an appropriate investment for them to make at this time.  

If I were concerned about an international investment DH was interested in, and I thought someone I didn't trust was influencing that decision, I would put forth every effort to participate, be involved, and become educated about the situation.  I wouldn't respond that I don't want to be out of the country for two weeks in May.  Perhaps there is a reason for not being out of the country then; but, a response of "if you are really wanting to check this out, I think it would be good for us both to be there to look this idea over.  That time in May really doesn't work well for me because of Sally's graduation, could we schedule the trip for a couple of weeks earlier or a couple of weeks later."  That shows interest in hearing and learning about the idea--not simply a desire to veto the idea.

Edited February 9, 2023 by Scarlett

[BusyMom5]

My DH has been managing my MILs accounts for the past several years.  He felt like he needed to talk to her about pros and cons of every single movement of money and give her choices. What that did was stress her out.  She wants him to just do it- make the choices.  Let her know ahead of time, but not talk specifics.  She avoids things that cause stress.  Money, banks, etc.  For example if we decide to set up a CD at the bank, I call around and find rates.  We (dH and I) decide where she should set it up.  I all the person who does CDz and give them all the information so that all MIL has to do is go in and sign.  I’ve went with her several times so she "doesn't mess up"  If your friend is like my MIL, her DH may think that having his brother take care of everything is best.  My MIL  isn't very old.  She has always been like this- we started doing this as soon as FIL passed in her early 60s  She just avoids things that make her uncomfortable.   I'm wondering if your friend is like this?  If so, you may be giving her the wrong advice.  Her DH may have set things up this way to help her.  Its easy for someone like me, who has always been right in the middle of our finances,  to say "Oh,fo this!  Know that thing.  Learn how XYZ works. "  But it really may be more than she can do or cause a lit more anxiety.  

[Scarlett]

7 minutes ago, BusyMom5 said:

My DH has been managing my MILs accounts for the past several years.  He felt like he needed to talk to her about pros and cons of every single movement of money and give her choices. What that did was stress her out.  She wants him to just do it- make the choices.  Let her know ahead of time, but not talk specifics.  She avoids things that cause stress.  Money, banks, etc.  For example if we decide to set up a CD at the bank, I call around and find rates.  We (dH and I) decide where she should set it up.  I all the person who does CDz and give them all the information so that all MIL has to do is go in and sign.  I’ve went with her several times so she "doesn't mess up"  If your friend is like my MIL, her DH may think that having his brother take care of everything is best.  My MIL  isn't very old.  She has always been like this- we started doing this as soon as FIL passed in her early 60s  She just avoids things that make her uncomfortable.   I'm wondering if your friend is like this?  If so, you may be giving her the wrong advice.  Her DH may have set things up this way to help her.  Its easy for someone like me, who has always been right in the middle of our finances,  to say "Oh,fo this!  Know that thing.  Learn how XYZ works. "  But it really may be more than she can do or cause a lit more anxiety.  

Yes you are right she has never cared to know all the ends and outs but now she is feeling resentful and insecure about an entire host of things that are stacking on top of each other.  My advice to her has been, ‘ talk to your husband or learn to live with this situation because this limbo you are in, wanting to talk to him/but not doing so is going to drive you insane.’  
 

Knowing about the money is not what will cause her stress though. It is how he treats her or how she perceives he will treat her that is causing her stress. 

Edited February 8, 2023 by Scarlett

[Catwoman]

37 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

Yes you are right she has never cared to know all the ends and outs but now she is feeling resentful and insecure about an entire host of things that are stacking on top of each other.  My advice to her has been, ‘ talk to your husband or learn to live with this situation because this limbo you are in, wanting to talk to him/but not doing so is going to drive you insane.’  
 

Knowing about the money is not what will cause her stress though. It is how he treats her or how she perceives he will treat her that is causing her stress. 

It also sounds like she's very quick to anger, too, though. Maybe he avoids discussing these things with her because she gets upset, rather than actually trying to understand what he's telling her and trying to ask intelligent questions.

After many years of her sticking her head in the sand and always pretending she was too dumb to understand their finances, he may have lost patience with trying to explain things to her.

I'm not saying he should be rudely dismissing her, but I'm also not convinced that some of his attitude might have been brought on by your friend's attitude over the years. She sounds pretty exasperating, to be honest.

Edited February 8, 2023 by Catwoman
Stupid typo

[Scarlett]

1 hour ago, Catwoman said:

It also sounds like she's very quick to anger, too, though. Maybe he avoids discussing these things with her because she gets upset, rather than actually trying to understand what he's telling her and trying to ask intelligent questions.

After many years of her sticking her head in the sand and always pretending she was too dumb to understand their finances, he may have lost patience with trying to explain things to her.

I'm not saying he should be rudely dismissing her, but I'm also not convinced that some of his attitude might have been brought on by your friend's attitude over the years. She sounds pretty exasperating, to be honest.

No she is not quick to anger at all.  That is why she is so upset lately…..because she DOES feel anger now and she doesn’t like it. 

Edited February 8, 2023 by Scarlett

[Catwoman]

40 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

No she is not quick to anger at all.  That is why she is so upset lately…..because she DOES feel anger now and she doesn’t like it. 

Ok, but her anger is not a reasonable response. 

Her dh isn't a mindreader. She needs to be open with him and have a calm discussion. Avoiding the discussion because she's afraid she'll get angry is just an excuse -- not entirely unlike her lame excuses about how she never asked much about the financial information. She acts like she couldn't have understood the financial stuff, yet it also sounds like she never actually tried.

It feels like she likes spending the money, but doesn't want to put any effort into understanding the family finances.

I know she's your best friend and I'm sure she's a nice person, but I'm having a lot of trouble feeling sorry for her. I'm not saying her dh isn't difficult, because he does sound kind of overbearing, but she can't have this both ways. If she really wants to know what's going on with the money, she's going to need to educate herself -- and stop making excuses about how it's just too hard for her.

I don't think you would be best friends with a dimwit, so while I can understand how your friend might be feeling a little intimidated about learning something new, I also think she has spent years being too lazy to bother being involved in the finances and now it's coming back to bite her, because now her dh doesn't take her seriously. And really, unless she expresses a genuine interest in learning the nitty gritty details of their finances, why would he bother to involve her in the decision-making?

It sounds like he sort of pats her on the head and tells her he'll handle everything so she doesn't need to worry her pretty little head about it, and I think we will all agree that it's incredibly condescending, but if she has always accepted that attitude in the past, I can kind of understand why he's not bothering to explain things to her now. It may also be quite a blow to his ego if he thinks she is suddenly questioning his decisions after decades of prosperity that he has been entirely responsible for engineering.

Don't get me wrong -- I'm not excusing his behavior!  I'm just saying that the way he's acting is not entirely surprising if she has always enjoyed having him take care of everything while she played dumb about the finances. He might also think he's doing her a favor by having his brother involved, because he might worry that if something happens to him, your friend won't know how to handle the money, so he figures his brother will be able to help her.

I think your friend needs to calm down, stop making excuses, figure out what she actually wants to know, and then sit down and have a serious discussion with her dh so he knows she's truly interested in becoming more involved. Otherwise, I don't think things are going to change -- and that would be very bad because she needs to step up and protect her own interests. I don't have any opinion about his brother, but I don't trust his kids at all!

 

 

[Clarita]

It seems like what she really needs is someone she trusts (and thinks is competent) enough to be there with her to have the conversation with the husband. I think she lacks the confidence to have this conversation on her own with her husband (it doesn't matter if that fear is or is not justified). I don't know if that person is you or not. I know it can get tricky with a higher net worth, because people can get weird about that stuff. Not necessarily just asking for money but also acting weird about hearing the amounts.  

[Catwoman]

6 minutes ago, Clarita said:

It seems like what she really needs is someone she trusts (and thinks is competent) enough to be there with her to have the conversation with the husband. I think she lacks the confidence to have this conversation on her own with her husband (it doesn't matter if that fear is or is not justified). I don't know if that person is you or not. I know it can get tricky with a higher net worth, because people can get weird about that stuff. Not necessarily just asking for money but also acting weird about hearing the amounts.  

I can't imagine that the dh would agree to an outsider being part of that conversation, unless it was their own CPA or financial advisor. I know I sure wouldn't. 

[Clarita]

4 minutes ago, Catwoman said:

I can't imagine that the dh would agree to an outsider being part of that conversation, unless it was their own CPA or financial advisor. I know I sure wouldn't. 

Maybe it could just be for the initial conversation? I mean it's kind of hard since she is so insecure about the whole thing. So I know it's kind of a shot in the dark. 

My husband and I do have a person we both trust that could mediate a conversation of that sort between us (no account numbers get exchanged my husband can give me a piece of paper with that information later). So I know it can be nice to have either a neutral party or someone whom you feel is "on your side".

[Scarlett]

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Edited February 9, 2023 by Scarlett

[Scarlett]

14 hours ago, Clarita said:

Maybe it could just be for the initial conversation? I mean it's kind of hard since she is so insecure about the whole thing. So I know it's kind of a shot in the dark. 

My husband and I do have a person we both trust that could mediate a conversation of that sort between us (no account numbers get exchanged my husband can give me a piece of paper with that information later). So I know it can be nice to have either a neutral party or someone whom you feel is "on your side".

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Edited February 9, 2023 by Scarlett

[Catwoman]

3 hours ago, Scarlett said:

@Catwoman The money questions have come about in her head due to MANY other issues that have happened over the last couple of years.  She is not over reacting overall….there have been some fairly infuriating things that have gone down and it has really changed her perspective and her feelings.  HE has changed in how he behaves in general and toward her and it has really affected her. 

It is t just about the money.  Not at all.  

Are you sure there isn't another woman involved? Or do you think it's mainly his kids' interference (and possibly his brother's, as well?)

[Scarlett]

11 hours ago, Catwoman said:

Are you sure there isn't another woman involved? Or do you think it's mainly his kids' interference (and possibly his brother's, as well?)

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Edited February 9, 2023 by Scarlett