Car seats reduce number of children?

[barnwife]

Well, we are about to put a car seat for our newborn in our van. This baby officially fills up the van. Currently, it seats 7. We could replace the 2 captain's chairs in the middle with a bench seat, but that would make getting in back very difficult.

As it happens, this is our last child. Is the size of the van a factor? Certainly, although not the most important one. It's actually way down the list, behind things like age and finances and just generally feeling like our family is complete. Also, this fifth pregnancy was by far my most difficult physically. At the end of the others, I was still going on walks (slowly, but going). This time, just getting up and down our stairs took a lot of effort. I couldn't even walk to the corner. Heck, I barely ever went outside because I was just so physically uncomfortable. 

And the reality is that in another 2 years, things probably wouldn't be easier. Add all of that up, and this is our last kid, regardless of what size vehicle we currently drive/would need in the future.

 

[Frances]

1 hour ago, MercyA said:

Anecdotal: A friend was told by a couple entering an abortion clinic that they were there because 1. their car was not big enough for another child and 2. they would not be able to afford vacations to places like Disney World if they had another child. I was there, but didn't hear the conversation myself.  So, yes, vehicle size was a consideration in that particular case. 😞 

I wonder how many and which methods of birth control they were using?

[maize]

My van seats 15.

 

I guess this means I could have six more children?

😁

[Junie]

18 minutes ago, maize said:

My van seats 15.

 

I guess this means I could have six more children?

😁

Go for it!

And you could actually have more depending on when your older kids move out... 😉

[katilac]

 

1 hour ago, hippiemamato3 said:

My 11.5 year old DD is finally just barely over the height requirement 

My two young adults are just barely over the height requirement 😂

1 hour ago, MercyA said:

Anecdotal: A friend was told by a couple entering an abortion clinic that they were there because 1. their car was not big enough for another child and 2. they would not be able to afford vacations to places like Disney World if they had another child. I was there, but didn't hear the conversation myself.  So, yes, vehicle size was a consideration in that particular case. 😞 

I think there's at least a fair to middling chance that this response included a heavy dose of sarcasm. 

[MercyA]

2 minutes ago, katilac said:

 

I think there's at least a fair to middling chance that this response included a heavy dose of sarcasm. 

One might think so, but we did not have that impression, and we were very well acquainted with all manner of responses. 

[MercyA]

40 minutes ago, Frances said:

I wonder how many and which methods of birth control they were using?

I would not want to venture a guess. Some clients did use abortion as birth control and were on their third or fourth abortion. I don't think this couple was likely in that category.

I am always surprised by the number of "oops, we didn't use birth control" babies in my own circles. 

This was about 15 years ago.

[MercyA]

1 hour ago, hippiemamato3 said:

Those might have been the easy things to talk about. 

Possibly, yes.

[maize]

2 hours ago, Junie said:

Go for it!

And you could actually have more depending on when your older kids move out... 😉

I think the fact that I am 42 is a bit of a limitation. Maybe I can have sextuplets?

[sassenach]

On 10/2/2020 at 1:39 PM, Arcadia said:

My aunt could squeeze 7 people in a Toyota Corolla (5 kids without car seat and seatbelts, 2 adults) while we could only drive 4 people (2 adults and 2 kids in car seats). I could seat on my aunt’s lap on front passenger side when I was a toddler (those were the days). 

I have distinct memories of a family road trip with 7 adults and me in my parent’s 7-person, full-sized van. I just rotated laps the whole way. 

[ElizabethB]

3 hours ago, maize said:

My van seats 15.

 

I guess this means I could have six more children?

😁

 

3 hours ago, Junie said:

Go for it!

And you could actually have more depending on when your older kids move out... 😉

See, I knew there would be more children in the world if more people read WTM!! 

[rebcoola]

My circle of friends is definitely helping with replacement numbers.  Hesitation is definitely in going from 5 to 6 and having to move upto a 12 passenger vans.  Than they eventually get a 12 passenger for space and usually add another kid.  We are lagging behind with only 3 but we have an 8 passenger suburban and 6 bedroom house so it seems inevitable they will get filled 

[kiwik]

On 10/3/2020 at 9:56 PM, maize said:

Boosters do not nest easily between carseats in my experience; having a car seat next to a booster can make it almost impossible to buckle the seat belt for the booster child.

I found you have to put the kids in in the right order to manage seatbelts.  I used to carry an extra booster in case I took an extra child.

[kiwik]

On 10/4/2020 at 12:22 PM, MercyA said:

I would not want to venture a guess. Some clients did use abortion as birth control and were on their third or fourth abortion. I don't think this couple was likely in that category.

I am always surprised by the number of "oops, we didn't use birth control" babies in my own circles. 

This was about 15 years ago.

I am inclined to think most accidental pregnancies aren't really.  You say oh that's unfortunate with birth control being so good these days and they say they don't use it.  Careless and thoughtless  more accurate.  I am surprised about multiple abortions in the US - wouldn't it be a very expensive method?

[Carrie12345]

4 hours ago, kiwik said:

I found you have to put the kids in in the right order to manage seatbelts.  I used to carry an extra booster in case I took an extra child.

It’s way too early in the morning for me. I read this as “in case I had an extra child.”  Like one was just going to fall out of the sky at any time, lol.

4 hours ago, kiwik said:

I am inclined to think most accidental pregnancies aren't really.  You say oh that's unfortunate with birth control being so good these days and they say they don't use it.  Careless and thoughtless  more accurate.  I am surprised about multiple abortions in the US - wouldn't it be a very expensive method?

I’ve had legitimate BC failures and a... mostly careless but “should have been in the clear” baby.  I really don’t second guess anyone’s story after all that. It’s an awful feeling trying to “legitimize” one’s circumstances. It also stinks remaining paranoid even after permanent measures, lol.
I can’t speak to costs, but it’s incredibly difficult to acquire an abortion in my area. I had researched it awhile back during another conversation and got frustrated myself, while not in the emotional state of seeking one. And I’m not in a location where it would automatically assumed to be difficult.

[Guest]

On 10/3/2020 at 10:00 PM, maize said:

I think the fact that I am 42 is a bit of a limitation. Maybe I can have sextuplets?

When I watch TLC, I find out the answer to this is yes. 

[Guest]

4 hours ago, kiwik said:

I am inclined to think most accidental pregnancies aren't really.  You say oh that's unfortunate with birth control being so good these days and they say they don't use it.  Careless and thoughtless  more accurate.  I am surprised about multiple abortions in the US - wouldn't it be a very expensive method?

Yes, that’s what I always think when I hear about multiple abortions. Even just the medical side of it; i mean, that would deter me because that’s not a procedure I would want to repeat from a medical standpoint. 

Having said that, though, I have personally known several people who had at least two. So clearly such a demographic exists or has existed. 

[MercyA]

7 hours ago, kiwik said:

I am inclined to think most accidental pregnancies aren't really.  You say oh that's unfortunate with birth control being so good these days and they say they don't use it.  Careless and thoughtless more accurate.  I am surprised about multiple abortions in the US - wouldn't it be a very expensive method?

(Also replying to @Carrie12345 and @Quill)

In the U.S. in 2016, 56.9% of women obtaining abortions had no previous abortions, 35.2% had one or two previous abortions, and 7.9% had three or more previous abortions. (CDC, Abortion Surveillance — United States, 2016)

In 2014, about half of women obtaining abortions had used a contraceptive the month they became pregnant. (NCBI, Journal of Contraception, Reported contraceptive use in the month of becoming pregnant among U.S. abortion patients in 2000 and 2014.)

Edited October 5, 2020 by MercyA

[Guest]

20 minutes ago, MercyA said:

(Also replying to @Carrie12345 and @Quill)

In the U.S. in 2016, 56.9% of women obtaining abortions had no previous abortions, 35.2% had one or two previous abortions, and 7.9% had three or more previous abortions.

In 2014, about half of women obtaining abortions had used a contraceptive the month they became pregnant. 

Thank you for that info. Where is this info sourced? 

[MercyA]

2 minutes ago, Quill said:

Thank you for that info. Where is this info sourced? 

The underlined bits in my post are links. Sorry; I'll edit to make that more clear! 

[Guest]

Just now, MercyA said:

The underlined bits in my post are links. Sorry; I'll edit to make that more clear! 

Oh, yes, thank you. That should have been obvious to me. 

[MercyA]

1 minute ago, Quill said:

Oh, yes, thank you. That should have been obvious to me. 

I should have listed the sources in case someone didn't want to click the links! Thanks for the reminder. 

[Katy]

If anyone is curious about how to find out what an abortion costs in your area, I had a college roommate get one.

She called Planned Parenthood and said, "I'm pregnant and I don't want to be.  What do I do?"  They told her which clinic to call for an appointment and what it would cost.  Hers was 100% covered by insurance.  Abortions are much cheaper and safer for the mother than pregnancy so many insurance programs cover them at 100%.  At that time (around August 2000), I think the cash pay cost was between $350-400.  Her parents were supportive, I think her mom took her.

Note that unlike ALL news sources from the right would like to imply, most planned parenthood clinics do not provide surgical abortions.  They mostly do pap smears, birth control, and other common gynecological services.  They are typically staffed by nurse practitioners, not OBGYNs trained to do surgery.

Someone I went to high school with did use them as birth control.  3 before she graduated.

[MercyA]

1 hour ago, Katy said:

If anyone is curious about how to find out what an abortion costs in your area, I had a college roommate get one.

She called Planned Parenthood and said, "I'm pregnant and I don't want to be.  What do I do?"  They told her which clinic to call for an appointment and what it would cost.  Hers was 100% covered by insurance.  Abortions are much cheaper and safer for the mother than pregnancy so many insurance programs cover them at 100%.  At that time (around August 2000), I think the cash pay cost was between $350-400.  Her parents were supportive, I think her mom took her.

Note that unlike ALL news sources from the right would like to imply, most planned parenthood clinics do not provide surgical abortions.  They mostly do pap smears, birth control, and other common gynecological services.  They are typically staffed by nurse practitioners, not OBGYNs trained to do surgery.

Someone I went to high school with did use them as birth control.  3 before she graduated.

I'm not on the political right and don't obtain any of my news from them. 🙂 

Re: the first bolded point. The key phrase here is safer for the mother. Very unsafe for the other human being involved. Not trying to be snarky or stir the pot; just pointing out why many have such serious issues with Planned Parenthood.

Re: the second bolded point: I was unable to find data on how many Planned Parenthood clinics conduct chemical / medical abortions. However, Planned Parenthood as a national organization was, according to their own annual report, responsible for 345,672 abortions in 2018-2019, about 40% of all abortions in this country.

Edited October 5, 2020 by MercyA

[bethben]

When we filled our ramp van with three kids smushed in the back row and my son’s wheelchair taking up the second row of our minivan, we were certain we were done.  We had no more room.  It’s a thing!

[Terabith]

I did have a friend get pregnant years ago (with twins) while on birth control pills (used dutifully and no antibiotic use involved), after her husband had a vasectomy, and while they were using condoms.  

God clearly meant for those kids to be born.  

[MercyA]

1 hour ago, Terabith said:

I did have a friend get pregnant years ago (with twins) while on birth control pills (used dutifully and no antibiotic use involved), after her husband had a vasectomy, and while they were using condoms.  

God clearly meant for those kids to be born.  

Wow! 

Fun story: we have some Amish relatives. One dear cousin said that she always wanted non-identical twin boys, one with blue eyes and one with brown. Oddly specific, I know. They had a difficult time conceiving, but when they finally did, guess what they got? Made to order. 😉 And as far as I know they never had any other children. 

Edited October 5, 2020 by MercyA

[ElizabethB]

3 hours ago, Terabith said:

I did have a friend get pregnant years ago (with twins) while on birth control pills (used dutifully and no antibiotic use involved), after her husband had a vasectomy, and while they were using condoms.  

God clearly meant for those kids to be born.  

We have friends who had a 3rd child while she was nursing and on birth control...1 month before the husband's scheduled vasectomy.

They said only half jokingly that God clearly intended for them to have a 3rd child.