A question pertaining to teaching creationism, evolution, any-faith-ism.....

[againstthegrain]

I did not have faith growing up, though not due to lack of effort on my part.

 

I am finding myself questioning faith and exploring Christianity (bible groups, church, personal devotionals). I don't know what I believe and that creates a problem. I don't know what to teach in terms of faith. I am not confident in my explorations so far to state that I believe in any form of God. And that's ok - I have plenty of time to learn and explore. DH is a stark believer in evolutionism. 

 

However, we have used predominantly Christian teaching homeschool coursework. Should I avoid it or offer a selective platter or give my children an overview on everything - not preaching one thing to be correct vs. another? I'm so stuck. They have been attending Awana Bible Youth Group and really enjoy the group and talk fondly of God often, asking me many questions - and I am just stuck on what to TEACH them. I have a super scientist (DS8) that is asking me HARD questions about creationism vs. evolutionism --- and I'm worried about directing him in one or the other.

 

I don't want "believe this!" guidance here, I am working on that on my own. I need more general guidance..... Can anyone help?

[The Girls' Mom]

I am a Christian, and believe God created the world.  I still taught evolution.  It needs to be known.  Certain aspects are observable fact.  To dismiss all evolution is to dismiss a huge chunk of science.  The how and why we got here is up to debate.  I taught what we believed while still teaching what is taught in every public school and most colleges.  I have a very Christian daughter that is headed into the STEM field.  She knows about a wide range of scientific theory and it doesn't affect our faith in a negative way.

[The Girls' Mom]

(BTW, evolution/creationism threads tend to go downhill fast here)

[maize]

I would keep science and other academic subjects separate from religion. The vast majority of religious people in the world, Christians and others, do not find any great conflict between their faith and standard scientific discoveries, theories and understanding. There is a relatively small minority of Christians, and a few from other faiths such as Muslim, who are convinced that their particular interpretation of the Bible is the only possibly accurate one and since that interpretation (Young Earth Creationism) contradicts standard science they twist themselves into pretzels working to contradict the vast body of mainstream science.

 

I personally find this entirely unnecessary, I am personally convinced that God works in ways that are vaster and grander than the limitations of human imagination, and that we should not insist on narrow interpretations of scripture. Generally my point of view is what is sometimes termed theistic evolution, accepting the evidence for the great age of the earth and universe and the evolution of life on earth, but believing that God played and plays a guiding and directing role in it all.

 

In the past, when I wasn't sure yet which interpretation of science and revelation I believed, I have simply explained the different viewpoints to my kids and expressed my own unsureness about the ways they really intersect but my conviction that ultimately everything that is true will be found to be in agreement. In the meantime, we are dealing with only partial information both in science and theology and we can explore at will but not be over stressed about our inability to attain perfect understanding of all truth right now.

[againstthegrain]

(BTW, evolution/creationism threads tend to go downhill fast here)

I figured it may and I'm ready if it needs closed - but DH suggested I come here and ask you guys for some advice. Even if I get 3 pieces of advice before the thread caves, it may be worth it? :/ Just so stuck!

[againstthegrain]

 

In the past, when I wasn't sure yet which interpretation of science and revelation I believed, I have simply explained the different viewpoints to my kids and expressed my own unsureness about the ways they really intersect but my conviction that ultimately everything that is true will be found to be in agreement. In the meantime, we are dealing with only partial information both in science and theology and we can explore at will but not be over stressed about our inability to attain perfect understanding of all truth right now.

 

 

This is a great suggestion and may fit us well! Thank you!!

[Runningmom80]

I would keep science and other academic subjects separate from religion. The vast majority of religious people in the world, Christians and others, do not find any great conflict between their faith and standard scientific discoveries, theories and understanding. There is a relatively small minority of Christians, and a few from other faiths such as Muslim, who are convinced that their particular interpretation of the Bible is the only possibly accurate one and since that interpretation (Young Earth Creationism) contradicts standard science they twist themselves into pretzels working to contradict the vast body of mainstream science.

 

I personally find this entirely unnecessary, I am personally convinced that God works in ways that are vaster and grander than the limitations of human imagination, and that we should not insist on narrow interpretations of scripture. Generally my point of view is what is sometimes termed theistic evolution, accepting the evidence for the great age of the earth and universe and the evolution of life on earth, but believing that God played and plays a guiding and directing role in it all.

 

In the past, when I wasn't sure yet which interpretation of science and revelation I believed, I have simply explained the different viewpoints to my kids and expressed my own unsureness about the ways they really intersect but my conviction that ultimately everything that is true will be found to be in agreement. In the meantime, we are dealing with only partial information both in science and theology and we can explore at will but not be over stressed about our inability to attain perfect understanding of all truth right now.

This is such a great reply.

[Reefgazer]

Our pastor gave a sermon a few months ago title "The Power of And".  In other words, religious beliefs don't have to be one *or* the other, but can be one *and* the other.  For example, you could teach scientific facts (evolution) and teach about belief in God; the two are not exclusive.

Edited February 1, 2016 by reefgazer

[Kiara.I]

I do teach from a faith viewpoint--and I don't know what to teach either!

So what we've been teaching so far is, "God made the world.  Maybe it was a really, really long process of billions of years (we haven't actually covered evolution yet.  But 'punctuated evolution' is an option here...)   Maybe he made it in 6 24 hour periods just like our days, and just made it LOOK like it took billions of years.  Or maybe the 6 "days" were more like 6 ages.  We don't really know which, and people argue about which one it must be.  But anyway, God made it, however God chose to."

 

We will cover evolution.  Because it NEEDS to be understood to have a science background.

But I'm not interested in teaching my children that this is an issue that should divide them from other people of the same faith.  So they'll learn evolution, and they'll learn that not all Christians accept evolution and there are some other viewpoints on it.  But I hope to teach them to deal graciously with people of any opinion--debate it, maybe, but keeping the *people* in mind, not just the theory.

And they're welcome to come down on whichever side of the argument they choose, and hopefully to understand each of the arguments (though that will take some serious legwork on my part, as I currently don't understand the main "camps".)

[Farrar]

I would say please teach evolution - and real evolution, not the creationists' straw-man evolution - just because it's essential to understanding biology. It underlies nearly every basic concept in biology.

[kiwik]

Teach religion as religion and science as science.  They will have to come to their own point of view when older so the more information the better.

[Loesje22000]

DH and I have different views on this topic, so we used a creationistic lifescience during middle school to show how a creationistic text teaches creationism. We skipped their evolution theory chapter ( I thought it was written poorly)

But the book already told that there were several options between christians available.

The book considered one option 'right' which dd and I disagreed (who am I to judge an others opinion/faith).

 

In highschool we use a secular text with a decent explanation of the evolution theory from evolution theory point.

It will be a huge part of dd's 12th grade science exam, so I want to teach it properly.

 

I'm not sure it was/is/will be the best way.

But it is what we do...

[MotherGoose]

Be honest with your kids about your confusion. You can all grow together. Tell them what different people believe, and tell them your views, even if they are changing. Letting them know early own that parents did not awaken one day as all-knowing beings but are willing to explore and make decisions will be good models for the future.

[againstthegrain]

Be honest with your kids about your confusion. You can all grow together. Tell them what different people believe, and tell them your views, even if they are changing. Letting them know early own that parents did not awaken one day as all-knowing beings but are willing to explore and make decisions will be good models for the future.

 

We liked this response.

 

And we shared our confusion and our progress in any faith. Our children were not only very receptive but had great input and enjoyed sharing how the rectified the different aspects. They made requests to have science taught from an evolutionary standpoint yet to continue their involvement in Bible Club/Church. We decided we are happy to honor this request - thank you ladies (all of you!) for giving us some encouragement and simple guidance. Too often we feel the weight of fear on our shoulders that we will make the wrong choice when we really need to embrace the simplicity of just talking to our kids. THANK YOU.

[Rosie]

We liked this response.

 

And we shared our confusion and our progress in any faith. Our children were not only very receptive but had great input and enjoyed sharing how the rectified the different aspects. They made requests to have science taught from an evolutionary standpoint yet to continue their involvement in Bible Club/Church. We decided we are happy to honor this request - thank you ladies (all of you!) for giving us some encouragement and simple guidance. Too often we feel the weight of fear on our shoulders that we will make the wrong choice when we really need to embrace the simplicity of just talking to our kids. THANK YOU.

 

It sounds like you made a great decision for your family! I've struggled with this whole issue for years. There are a few resources that have helped me more than others, and I think you and your husband may find them helpful....

 

Phil Vischer Podcast Episode #9 (Episodes 80, 89, 94, 136, 146, 160, and 167 also deal with this topic)

The Lost World of Genesis One

The Lost World of Adam and Eve

The Language of God

Biologos

The Meeting House - Debating Darwin

The Meeting House - Debating Darwin, Drive Home

The Meeting House Roundtable - Phone Interview with Denis Lamoureaux

 

 

Also, an EXCELLENT book for those curious about God or doubting God is Letters From a Skeptic. Seriously, one of the best books I've ever read.

[8filltheheart]

We are devout Christians who believe in evolution.  We find no conflict between science and theology.  "Truth cannot contradict truth."  We believe that creation followed the path as designed by God and that path was evolution.  When evolution progressed to humans, at that point, man was infused with an immortal soul in the image and likeness of God.  

 

 

I am delighted with the first theme which you have chosen: the origin of life and evolution—an essential theme of lively interest to the Church, since Revelation contains some of its own teachings concerning the nature and origins of man. How should the conclusions reached by the diverse scientific disciplines be brought together with those contained in the message of Revelation? And if at first glance these views seem to clash with each other, where should we look for a solution? We know that the truth cannot contradict the truth. ....

 

The magisterium of the Church takes a direct interest in the question of evolution, because it touches on the conception of man, whom Revelation tells us is created in the image and likeness of God. The conciliar constitution Gaudium et Spes has given us a magnificent exposition of this doctrine, which is one of the essential elements of Christian thought. The Council recalled that "man is the only creature on earth that God wanted for its own sake." In other words, the human person cannot be subordinated as a means to an end, or as an instrument of either the species or the society; he has a value of his own. He is a person. By this intelligence and his will, he is capable of entering into relationship, of communion, of solidarity, of the gift of himself to others like himself....

 

 It is by virtue of his eternal soul that the whole person, including his body, possesses such great dignity. Pius XII underlined the essential point: if the origin of the human body comes through living matter which existed previously, the spiritual soul is created directly by God...

 

With man, we find ourselves facing a different ontological order—an ontological leap, we could say. But in posing such a great ontological discontinuity, are we not breaking up the physical continuity which seems to be the main line of research about evolution in the fields of physics and chemistry? An appreciation for the different methods used in different fields of scholarship allows us to bring together two points of view which at first might seem irreconcilable. The sciences of observation describe and measure, with ever greater precision, the many manifestations of life, and write them down along the time-line. The moment of passage into the spiritual realm is not something that can be observed in this way—although we can nevertheless discern, through experimental research, a series of very valuable signs of what is specifically human life. But the experience of metaphysical knowledge, of self-consciousness and self-awareness, of moral conscience, of liberty, or of aesthetic and religious experience—these must be analyzed through philosophical reflection, while theology seeks to clarify the ultimate meaning of the Creator's design.

 

[Peaceful Isle]

Maybe you should study more yourself, and then decide what to teach your kiddos. Take your time.

That way you can feel confident in which path you will take.

 

It sounds like they are getting a lot of good stuff about God from Awanas. You could let them enjoy that, and even discuss with them what they have learned.

There are plenty of "neutral" science curriculum you could use for your kids. That way you don't have to re-teach them later if you change your views.

Your kids are still young. You could always use Real Science 4kids or something like that.

[Ellie]

IMHO, it's better to start with *something* than to leave everything open-ended. Your dc will still make their own decisions when they're old enough; giving them *something* gives them a better direction than floating around pointlessly.

[Targhee]

I would keep science and other academic subjects separate from religion. The vast majority of religious people in the world, Christians and others, do not find any great conflict between their faith and standard scientific discoveries, theories and understanding. There is a relatively small minority of Christians, and a few from other faiths such as Muslim, who are convinced that their particular interpretation of the Bible is the only possibly accurate one and since that interpretation (Young Earth Creationism) contradicts standard science they twist themselves into pretzels working to contradict the vast body of mainstream science.

 

I personally find this entirely unnecessary, I am personally convinced that God works in ways that are vaster and grander than the limitations of human imagination, and that we should not insist on narrow interpretations of scripture. Generally my point of view is what is sometimes termed theistic evolution, accepting the evidence for the great age of the earth and universe and the evolution of life on earth, but believing that God played and plays a guiding and directing role in it all.

 

In the past, when I wasn't sure yet which interpretation of science and revelation I believed, I have simply explained the different viewpoints to my kids and expressed my own unsureness about the ways they really intersect but my conviction that ultimately everything that is true will be found to be in agreement. In the meantime, we are dealing with only partial information both in science and theology and we can explore at will but not be over stressed about our inability to attain perfect understanding of all truth right now.

<3

[Milknhoney]

An evolutionary, secular, humanistic viewpoint dominates most every mainstream curriculum, book, media, you name it. You'd have to build a pretty big bubble around your home in order to shield your kids from learning this worldview. Not so with Christianity. People have their own presuppositions about what Christians believe, especially as it pertains to creationism, but if you are truly seeking to understand this belief system, then you have to go beyond that and be intentional about studying what the tenets of faith are and the scientific evidence for biblical creation. I would encourage you to continue with the Christian materials that you have as well as Awana, and also to get some books or videos to find out what the actual scientific evidence is that creationists believe support their viewpoint. Then use it as an opportunity to have a family discussion while you critically evaluate what you see and decide if the evidence is valid. This would fit well for students who are in the logic stage and are learning how to identify fallacies, etc. 

[J-rap]

I

 

Also, an EXCELLENT book for those curious about God or doubting God is Letters From a Skeptic. Seriously, one of the best books I've ever read.

 

I agree!  Loved that book.

[Chris in VA]

There are lots of faith traditions that don't find a conflict between the Bible and evolution, because of the way they explain Genesis.

The argument that, "if Genesis isn't factually true, how can you believe the rest of the Bible" doesn't hold water in those traditions. I encourage you to do more research.

 

[Bluegoat]

I would be careful not to set this up as an either/or thing for your kids.  In some other Christian traditions, the presuppositions of the creationist worldview would be considered the theological problem, not evolution!

 

 

[justasque]

......if you are truly seeking to understand this belief system, then you have to go beyond that and be intentional about studying what the tenets of faith are and the scientific evidence for biblical creation. I would encourage you to continue with the Christian materials that you have ...to find out what the actual scientific evidence is that creationists believe support their viewpoint. Then use it as an opportunity to have a family discussion while you critically evaluate what you see and decide if the evidence is valid. This would fit well for students who are in the logic stage and are learning how to identify fallacies, etc.

I think the basic premise here is a good one, regardless of your starting point. Study Creationism using materials authored by Creationists, and Evolution using materials authored by those who believe the science points to evolution.

[Monica_in_Switzerland]

I agree with 8.  There does NOT need to be a conflict here.  You can be Christian and accept evolutionary theory.  

[happypamama]

I only skimmed the other replies, but this is my approach. I'm a long term Christian who struggles to find a church where I fit in well. I'm wary of both Christian resources that discount scientific discoveries and secular resources that discount a divine Creator. I personally have not much interest in how the earth/people/etc. came to be, so I largely ignored that in school, parroting back what I needed to to pass ninth grade honors biology, and that was it. But I mostly want better for my children.

 

So whenever we confront something that is controversial, I say, "Is there a way that this could happen and still fit in with what the Bible says, whether that's a literal or figurative interpretation?" I come from a YEC background, but I have found interpretations that make sense with an OEC interpretation. I'm still not sure what I actually believe about some of that stuff, but I do tell my kids that there are multiple ways to see things, and especially as they get older, we point out different viewpoints and talk about what's backing up those viewpoints. They're going to have to decide for themselves at some point what they believe, but there's no substitute for going right to the Source, IMO.

 

(Fwiw, there ARE a few issues where I absolutely believe the Bible is very clear, and it's not at all a question of interpretation. I teach those things as absolutes to my children. They might decide that they believe differently later, but certain things I do believe are right or wrong, so that's what I teach them. Things like stalking, murder, adultery, and abortion fall into that category for me. Things like the age of the earth or how the universe came to be or how exactly humans were created do not fall into that category for me.)

[FloridaLisa]

I did not have faith growing up, though not due to lack of effort on my part.

 

I am finding myself questioning faith and exploring Christianity (bible groups, church, personal devotionals). I don't know what I believe and that creates a problem. I don't know what to teach in terms of faith. I am not confident in my explorations so far to state that I believe in any form of God. And that's ok - I have plenty of time to learn and explore. DH is a stark believer in evolutionism. 

 

{snip}

 

I don't want "believe this!" guidance here, I am working on that on my own. I need more general guidance..... Can anyone help?

 

Can you explore with your kids? Can you tell them honestly that these are good questions, great questions worth exploring and explore together?  Can you answer what you know to be true about science using good materials and also explore together what the Bible has to say? 

Books are good, and there are some really good ones that explore the topics of reason and faith, but I would also go straight to the Bible and just read through one of the gospels to see what Jesus had to say and teach.