cops should leave good teens (like my dd and her boyfriend) alone

[QueenCat]

Whatever the situation, these poor kids learned a hard lesson about who and what policemen are.  Bullies.  You have to wonder about the psychological makeup of a human who wants to do that for a living.  Protect and serve my foot.

 

Seriously? Most police officers do have a desire to protect and serve, and they are most certainly not bullies. The few bad apples are not typical of all police officers. That is extremely offensive to a group of men and women who put their lives on the line every day, for what is often substandard pay.

[Onceuponatime]

I would like to address the statement that "there was no reason to cry." This is totally unrealistic. For many people, especially of the female persuasion, the automatic response to sudden stress, especially being yelled at, is crying. This has happened to me many times. I am a very rational person and I wish I could stop it, but I can't.

 

Yes, she shouldn't have gotten out of the car, but that doesn't mean she could have done anything about the tears.

[Lanny]

Many "routine" traffic stops in the USA have resulted in police officers being killed. When your DD stopped, without them ordering her to stop, that was, IMHO, her first mistake. She should have continued driving. I understand she was concerned about her boyfriend, but I believe it was a very serious mistake, for her to stop. Then, she got out of her car... Her second mistake...

 

When someone is stopped, they are more or less "under arrest" and must obey the police officer. 

[gingersmom]

I think you've been watching too much tv.

I think not. I got my ticket for "disturbing the peace" in high school.

 

My crime...learning to drive a stick shift badly.

 

I was surrounded by 10 cop cars.

 

I had every expectation I was going to be arrested and taken to police station.

 

Police kept coming to my car to ask if I knew what I was being charged with.

 

It was a bizarre scene and still makes no sense 30 years later.

[Ravin]

So you would consent out of fear?

 

Most traffic stops are being filmed. And most cops (not all, of course) actually try to do their jobs legally and correctly. It's absolutely legal and fine for them to ask to search a car. If there is no probably cause to search without consent, then they can ask but can't search without it. Of course, it is easy for them later to say, "Gee, I thought I smelled pot," which would, if true, create cause. But I would never just roll over and consent.

It's not true that most stops are filmed. Many, probably most, LE agencies can't afford that. Here, if you're really lucky, they do audio recordings, but most officers here seem only to bother in domestic violence calls.

 

Otoh, in my state at least, it's not illegal for a private citizen to record an encounter. In Russia it's becoming a common tool to combat police corruption. When it comes down to defendant vs. Officer, most people, even if they think they can be fair, will trust the officer's word.

 

To OP: I hope your DD is ok, and that her bf files a complaint. It was a weak excuse for a stop and without consent or probable cause, an illegal search.

[Moxie]

It's not true that most stops are filmed. Many, probably most, LE agencies can't afford that. Here, if you're really lucky, they do audio recordings, but most officers here seem only to bother in domestic violence calls.

 

Otoh, in my state at least, it's not illegal for a private citizen to record an encounter. In Russia it's becoming a common tool to combat police corruption. When it comes down to defendant vs. Officer, most people, even if they think they can be fair, will trust the officer's word.

 

To OP: I hope your DD is ok, and that her bf files a complaint. It was a weak excuse for a stop and without consent or probable cause, an illegal search.

I would assume the cops asked him if they could search his car and he said ok.

[mommaduck]

I didn't say slowly. I said too slow. Driving too slow for the conditions ( whatever they may be) is a red flag.

 

Drunk drivers sometimes drive too slowly. Texting drivers sometimes drive too slowly. Distracted drivers sometimes drive too slowly.

 

I drive too slow because I'm driving an old van and have something suspicious going on with my front end. It would be ridiculous to be pulled over by a cop for going ten to five under the limit (we also live in an area where they get you very quickly for going over the limit, so driving under it is safer).

[mommaduck]

Seriously? Most police officers do have a desire to protect and serve, and they are most certainly not bullies. The few bad apples are not typical of all police officers. That is extremely offensive to a group of men and women who put their lives on the line every day, for what is often substandard pay.

 

It may depend upon context of where one lives. Where you live, you may have ethical cops that aren't bullies and only intent on doing their job. Where that person may live...well, let's just say that I've lived in an area that was KNOWN for their white PD intentionally targeting black drivers, targeted a friend of mine in the middle of NOWHERE for supposedly a too loud radio (friend's passenger was black and they were playing rap in the middle of the Ozarks on the way back to the base)...the officer even went on to question what the passenger was doing in HIS district. In the town I lived in in the midwest near the two area mentioned, we had a "good ole boy" cop that was uncle to a good friend of mine...yeah, I hate to tell you what he did to female teenagers he pulled over. I had one cop swear up and down I was going faster than I was and he had nothing to show...he "clocked" me by counting seconds, no radar. I was speeding, admitted it, but not the amount he said (I was not able to go to court to fight it because of my children. My letter to the magistrate was rejected with a letter stating that I would have to show up if I wished to argue the case). I was sitting there dealing with a nasty cop while I was soaking my blouse with breastmilk. I was in a hurry to get home to nurse the baby. I explained why I was in rush and he took even longer than necessary to do his work. By the time I got home, I was soaked and my blouse was ruined.

 

On the other hand, we've run into very nice cops or cops that were very serious, but just doing their job.

[Murphy101]

When someone is stopped, they are more or less "under arrest" and must obey the police officer.

I agreed with your first parts.

 

However, no they are not more or less under any kind of arrest and no they are under no obligation to obey the police officer, or even cooperate with him. (Tho it's generally good advice to obey the guy with a gun and that certainly factors in it.)

[unfrumpable.]

I've never had a bad experience with a cop.  The one time I was pulled over for running a stop sign he was just business like, but not screaming or anything like that.  I just remained calm and he remained calm.  He only gave me a warning. Other encounters the cops were very nice to me.

 

I've been pulled over several times in my younger years. I even had to go to court once for being in a park after dark. Yep. Me and three friends in court and that's what we had to say when asked what we had done. lol I've been to driving school about three times and I've done community service twice. The last time I was pulled over was about three years ago in the middle of BFTexas somewhere between San Antonio and El Paso. I was doing 10 miles over the posted speed limit.

 

Out of all my experiences, of which I think are a decent amount including when I was a teen, I've never had a bad experience. That is my experience.

 

Even the time when my friend was pregnant and the father of the child was seeing someone else who worked at Checkers and we went to Checkers and she made quite a scene and we were banned from said Checkers, even then when the cop dumped my purse out, I don't consider it a bad experience.

 

I can only imagine the inane amount of crap that police officers have to deal with on a daily basis. I would think it makes retail look like heaven. That's not saying that there aren't bad cops. I'm sure there are just like there are assholes in every job and situation. But I don't like to see people dissing cops when you know that is who they're going to call if they are in a situation where a police officer is needed. When I was held up and robbed at my job once, the police officers were amazing. When I had a roommates friend drunk and trying to push his way into my house when roommate was not home, the officer was amazing.

[Mergath]

I think not. I got my ticket for "disturbing the peace" in high school.

 

My crime...learning to drive a stick shift badly.

 

I was surrounded by 10 cop cars.

 

I had every expectation I was going to be arrested and taken to police station.

 

Police kept coming to my car to ask if I knew what I was being charged with.

 

It was a bizarre scene and still makes no sense 30 years later.

 

So... you got a ticket once, and lots of cops responded, and they made sure you knew what you were being charged with, and so all cops are corrupt liars?  Sorry, but that really doesn't add up.

[beaners]

And I would bet If you don't consent to search you will b in back or police car in cuffs on a trumped up charge that will later b dismissed.

 

Yep.  Of course not every officer is like that, but it doesn't matter if you get the one that is.  Heck, my BIL is a nice enough guy, but he has openly said that there a lot of laws he has used as an excuse to pull over a car even if they haven't done anything wrong.  (Hint: Don't hang anything from your rearview mirror.)

 

 

Refusing to consent is not illegal.

Trumped up charges ARE illegal.

If it is dismissed, then the checks and balances worked and the defendant may have cause to file complaint/suit against the officer/department.

 

People who see wrong must have the courage to act and to speak up. Citizens must not tolerate injustice. This is not always going to be an easy or quick thing to do. It is the price of constant vigilance to protect freedoms.

 

See, you need to be able to afford a lawyer to have a chance of getting a fair shake here.  I have seen, firsthand, people accused of inaccurate charges because they weren't cooperative enough.  If you can't afford a lawyer, or a good lawyer, you might need to take a plea.  Even an unprosecuted arrest as a minor can stick with you for the rest of your life. Just because it's dismissed doesn't mean it disappears.  For example, if you are filling out immigration paperwork or applying to some licensing boards, you would need to include a dismissed arrest that had also been expunged.  The court can even say that there was a wrongful arrest, but you would need to disclose all of the events.

 

It isn't so simple as saying that they dismissed the charges, so nothing changes for you.

[gingersmom]

So... you got a ticket once, and lots of cops responded, and they made sure you knew what you were being charged with, and so all cops are corrupt liars? Sorry, but that really doesn't add up.

Corrupt liars?

 

Please show me where I said that.

 

Having a bad day?

[Murphy101]

See, you need to be able to afford a lawyer to have a chance of getting a fair shake here. I have seen, firsthand, people accused of inaccurate charges because they weren't cooperative enough. If you can't afford a lawyer, or a good lawyer, you might need to take a plea. Even an unprosecuted arrest as a minor can stick with you for the rest of your life. Just because it's dismissed doesn't mean it disappears. For example, if you are filling out immigration paperwork or applying to some licensing boards, you would need to include a dismissed arrest that had also been expunged. The court can even say that there was a wrongful arrest, but you would need to disclose all of the events.

It isn't so simple as saying that they dismissed the charges, so nothing changes for you.

Wait. If they dismissed the charges, then yes, nothing should change for them.

 

However, I whole-heartedly agree that our justice system should provide lawyers regardless of whether it is a criminal offense or not. People's lives are just as ruined by civil litigation and CPS, it's a horrid injustice that only those who can afford a decent attorney can afford genuine justice.

 

ETA: okay, "nothing would change" in the sense that you might need to show paperwork. Very much like a bankruptcy means you don't owe the debt any longer, but you might need to show the paperwork occassionally to prove that.

[beaners]

Wait. If they dismissed the charges, then yes, nothing should change for them.

 

However, I whole-heartedly agree that our justice system should provide lawyers regardless of whether it is a criminal offense or not. People's lives are just as ruined by civil litigation and CPS, it's a horrid injustice that only those who can afford a decent attorney can afford genuine justice.

 

ETA: okay, "nothing would change" in the sense that you might need to show paperwork. Very much like a bankruptcy means you don't owe the debt any longer, but you might need to show the paperwork occassionally to prove that.

 

A dismissed arrest still needs to be disclosed to certain licensing boards and to immigration. Depending on the charge, it may or may not affect approval. I can think of a lot of charges that would make immigration think twice, even if the case had been dismissed.

[8circles]

I'm sorry your dd and her bf had such an experience. I would have cried, too. that's my reaction to sudden stress.

 

But how on earth would anyone know the "good" teens from the "bad" teens as they're driving by?

[Catwoman]

Whatever the situation, these poor kids learned a hard lesson about who and what policemen are. Bullies. You have to wonder about the psychological makeup of a human who wants to do that for a living. Protect and serve my foot.

What a horrible thing to say.

 

You have to wonder about the psychological makeup of someone who would make such a hateful blanket statement.

 

Do you teach your children to be as accepting and tolerant of others as you are?

[Elfknitter.#]

But how on earth would anyone know the "good" teens from the "bad" teens as they're driving by?

Just felt this needed to be reposted.

[PinkyandtheBrains.]

But how on earth would anyone know the "good" teens from the "bad" teens as they're driving by?

I've been thinking this ever since I saw the thread title.

[Catwoman]

Just felt this needed to be reposted.

  

I've been thinking this ever since I saw the thread title.

My interpretation was that she meant that they shouldn't have treated the teens so poorly, not that they shouldn't have pulled their car over at all, but hopefully Jeannie will come back and clarify.

[8circles]

  

My interpretation was that she meant that they shouldn't have treated the teens so poorly, not that they shouldn't have pulled their car over at all, but hopefully Jeannie will come back and clarify.

Except they weren't treated poorly.  Given their actions, it seems the police did what they should have.  The police may have done something wrong, but even the OP doesn't know as she wasn't there.  From what we know, they followed procedure, even though it was a traumatic experience for the teens.  

[NASDAQ]

What the police did sounds somewhat unfortunate, but reasonable. It actually sounds like they were worried about your daughter's safety --a young lady driving alone at night, being followed by a young man. When the man is pulled over, she gets out of the car, and then she reacts out of proportion to events. It sounds like your dd was perhaps in a vulnerable state of mind that evening, but they have no way of knowing that this is her boyfriend and she just came from therapy.

 

I go over the US/Canadian border a lot. When I was 18, I went over with my brother. I look young for my age (he is actually younger) and I was sleeping when we approached. We were all pulled in by immigration, because they were concerned that he may have drugged me, and/or I might not have consented to be there, and/or did my parents know where I was, &c.

 

On the way back we got pulled over and the car was tossed over with drug-sniffing dogs. I have no idea why. It could have been that they were told to look out for a car that fit this description, or people who fit our description. Or they thought I was smuggling milk over the border. Who knows.

 

Inconvenience of modern life.

[Catwoman]

Except they weren't treated poorly. Given their actions, it seems the police did what they should have. The police may have done something wrong, but even the OP doesn't know as she wasn't there. From what we know, they followed procedure, even though it was a traumatic experience for the teens.

I'm sorry -- I wasn't clear.

 

I meant that Jeannie thought the teens were treated poorly.

[8circles]

I'm sorry -- I wasn't clear.

 

I meant that Jeannie thought the teens were treated poorly.

No apology necessary.  I guess I'm confused.  That's what I thought you meant.  I think I should just go to bed.  I don't think the teens were treated poorly, it was just an unfortunate situation.  Maybe I'll think differently in the morning.  

 

Anyhow, Jeannie - i hope your DD has recovered.  That experience would put me on edge for a while.

[Catwoman]

No apology necessary. I guess I'm confused. That's what I thought you meant. I think I should just go to bed. I don't think the teens were treated poorly, it was just an unfortunate situation. Maybe I'll think differently in the morning.

 

Anyhow, Jeannie - i hope your DD has recovered. That experience would put me on edge for a while.

I just re-read my post and I definitely wasn't clear, so you weren't confused at all. (I think I'm the one who should get some sleep! :))

 

I hope Jeannie's dd is OK, too. I can also understand why Jeannie was so upset when she posted -- her dd was so upset that she cried on the phone all the way home, and I'm sure any mom would be angry if their teenager was so traumatized. It's hard not to feel all Mama Bear-ish when your child is scared and upset, no matter what the cause or whom was at fault.

[Berta]

Did this happen in NJ? I have lost all respect in the police in NJ after several dealings with them. I now have my own dashcam (best $45 I ever spent!) in my car and I record EVERYTHING.

 

And... NO, you are absolutely NOT under any type of arrest at a traffic stop. You do NOT have to answer questions like "Where are you coming from?" and "Where are you going?". The only thing you should say at a traffic stop is "Am I being detained?". If you are told no, say "Am I free to go?", then leave.

 

And... NEVER consent to a search of your car or yourself. If the police have reasonable suspicion they won't ask for permission, they will just search. They are asking for permission because they have NO reasonable suspicion.

 

And... saying "if you have nothing to hide" is total BS. It's not a matter of hiding anything, it's your CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT to not be searched without a reason.

 

And... it is NOT illegal to video a police officer (or any public servant) while they are on duty. In some states you cannot AUDIO record without permission, but you do not need permission to video.

[brehon]

Did this happen in NJ? I have lost all respect in the police in NJ after several dealings with them. I now have my own dashcam (best $45 I ever spent!) in my car and I record EVERYTHING.

 

And... NO, you are absolutely NOT under any type of arrest at a traffic stop. You do NOT have to answer questions like "Where are you coming from?" and "Where are you going?". The only thing you should say at a traffic stop is "Am I being detained?". If you are told no, say "Am I free to go?", then leave.

 

And... NEVER consent to a search of your car or yourself. If the police have reasonable suspicion they won't ask for permission, they will just search. They are asking for permission because they have NO reasonable suspicion.

 

And... saying "if you have nothing to hide" is total BS. It's not a matter of hiding anything, it's your CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT to not be searched without a reason.

 

And... it is NOT illegal to video a police officer (or any public servant) while they are on duty. In some states you cannot AUDIO record without permission, but you do not need permission to video.

 

While I agree with much of what you wrote (with the exception of the NJ bit only because I've never been to NJ), the bolded may depend on state and/or local statue.  There was a case last year in the city near where I live where a young man (20s) was arrested because he used his phone to video officers arresting someone else.  I don't remember all the details of the case or how it ended (if it has yet); but, I do remember that the man was 10s of feet away from the arresting officers (so not interfering with the arrest) and was still had charges brought against him for interfering with an arrest or whatever the official term is. 

 

Having written this I have to admit that I don't know if what the young man did was illegal or if the cops were over reacting to a situation. 

[ErinE]

While I agree with much of what you wrote (with the exception of the NJ bit only because I've never been to NJ), the bolded may depend on state and/or local statue. There was a case last year in the city near where I live where a young man (20s) was arrested because he used his phone to video officers arresting someone else. I don't remember all the details of the case or how it ended (if it has yet); but, I do remember that the man was 10s of feet away from the arresting officers (so not interfering with the arrest) and was still had charges brought against him for interfering with an arrest or whatever the official term is.

 

Having written this I have to admit that I don't know if what the young man did was illegal or if the cops were over reacting to a situation.

Bringing charges doesn't mean videotaping police is illegal. It just could mean the prosecutor and police are harassing a citizen. I'm of the firm belief that police officers have no expectation of privacy in the performance of their public duty.

[Berta]

While I agree with much of what you wrote (with the exception of the NJ bit only because I've never been to NJ), the bolded may depend on state and/or local statue.  There was a case last year in the city near where I live where a young man (20s) was arrested because he used his phone to video officers arresting someone else.  I don't remember all the details of the case or how it ended (if it has yet); but, I do remember that the man was 10s of feet away from the arresting officers (so not interfering with the arrest) and was still had charges brought against him for interfering with an arrest or whatever the official term is. 

 

Having written this I have to admit that I don't know if what the young man did was illegal or if the cops were over reacting to a situation. 

 

State and local statutes do not trump the Constitution. It is NOT illegal in any state to video or photograph public servants. Some states have laws regarding AUDIO taping, but VIDEO is allowed. If you are legally allowed there, you are legally allowed to video.

 

https://www.aclu.org/free-speech/know-your-rights-photographers

 

[unsinkable]

 

And... NO, you are absolutely NOT under any type of arrest at a traffic stop. You do NOT have to answer questions like "Where are you coming from?" and "Where are you going?". The only thing you should say at a traffic stop is "Am I being detained?". If you are told no, say "Am I free to go?", then leave.

 

There are places in the US where you can be arrested for certain driving misdemeanors, like reckless driving. You can also be arrested for refusing to sign the ticket. It's an appearance ticket, and if you won't sign it, you're not agreeing to appear.

[Berta]

There are places in the US where you can be arrested for certain driving misdemeanors, like reckless driving. You can also be arrested for refusing to sign the ticket. It's an appearance ticket, and if you won't sign it, you're not agreeing to appear.

 

The officer must have a reason and place you under arrest. Just being pulled over for a traffic stop is not being under arrest.

[unsinkable]

The officer must have a reason and place you under arrest. Just being pulled over for a traffic stop is not being under arrest.

 

But being pulled over for a suspected misdemeanor traffic violation can lead to your arrest. That's my point.

[Berta]

Many "routine" traffic stops in the USA have resulted in police officers being killed. When your DD stopped, without them ordering her to stop, that was, IMHO, her first mistake. She should have continued driving. I understand she was concerned about her boyfriend, but I believe it was a very serious mistake, for her to stop. Then, she got out of her car... Her second mistake...

 

When someone is stopped, they are more or less "under arrest" and must obey the police officer. 

But being pulled over for a suspected misdemeanor traffic violation can lead to your arrest. That's my point.

I was responding to the post by Lanny who said you are more or less "under arrest" while stopped and must obey the police officer. This is NOT true. You are not under arrest unless the police officer has a reason to arrest you and tells you that you are under arrest. Just being pulled over is not being under arrest.

[unsinkable]

I was responding to the post by Lanny who said you are more or less "under arrest" while stopped and must obey the police officer. This is NOT true. You are not under arrest unless the police officer has a reason to arrest you and tells you that you are under arrest. Just being pulled over is not being under arrest.

 

i agree that just being pulled over does not mean you are under arrest.

[Wheres Toto]

Did this happen in NJ? I have lost all respect in the police in NJ after several dealings with them. I now have my own dashcam (best $45 I ever spent!) in my car and I record EVERYTHING.

 

And... NO, you are absolutely NOT under any type of arrest at a traffic stop. You do NOT have to answer questions like "Where are you coming from?" and "Where are you going?". The only thing you should say at a traffic stop is "Am I being detained?". If you are told no, say "Am I free to go?", then leave.

 

And... NEVER consent to a search of your car or yourself. If the police have reasonable suspicion they won't ask for permission, they will just search. They are asking for permission because they have NO reasonable suspicion.

 

And... saying "if you have nothing to hide" is total BS. It's not a matter of hiding anything, it's your CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT to not be searched without a reason.

 

And... it is NOT illegal to video a police officer (or any public servant) while they are on duty. In some states you cannot AUDIO record without permission, but you do not need permission to video.

 

Why would you want to immediately be confrontational and adversarial?    Every time I've been stopped, they would ask where I was heading, then mention why I was stopped, ask for license/registration/insurance, and then either go back to their car to check or let me go with a warning.   Does having to give your papers and wait for them to check things out count as "being detained"?   Can you just refuse to give them your license, etc.?  Why would you want to? 

 

FWIW, most of my experience with police have been non-traumatic and fairly straightforward.  I don't see just the act of getting pulled over/asked a few questions as upsetting or traumatic, whether I know why or not. 

 

[brehon]

Bringing charges doesn't mean videotaping police is illegal. It just could mean the prosecutor and police are harassing a citizen. I'm of the firm belief that police officers have no expectation of privacy in the performance of their public duty.

 

 

State and local statutes do not trump the Constitution. It is NOT illegal in any state to video or photograph public servants. Some states have laws regarding AUDIO taping, but VIDEO is allowed. If you are legally allowed there, you are legally allowed to video.

 

https://www.aclu.org/free-speech/know-your-rights-photographers

 

 

I didn't say it was illegal to video public servants.  I said that this type of episode has very recently happened to someone where I live.  I also said that I was unsure of the disposition of the case - it might have been thrown out of court or the DA might have chosen not to prosecute and dismissed the charges for that very reason (i.e, that what that young man did was not illegal). 

 

I do understand Con Law and its varying applications. 

[Berta]

Why would you want to immediately be confrontational and adversarial?    Every time I've been stopped, they would ask where I was heading, then mention why I was stopped, ask for license/registration/insurance, and then either go back to their car to check or let me go with a warning.   Does having to give your papers and wait for them to check things out count as "being detained"?   Can you just refuse to give them your license, etc.?  Why would you want to? 

 

FWIW, most of my experience with police have been non-traumatic and fairly straightforward.  I don't see just the act of getting pulled over/asked a few questions as upsetting or traumatic, whether I know why or not. 

 

Refusing a search and not answering questions is not confrontational or adversarial. When asked where I was going, my polite response was "why do you ask?". His answer.. "just curious". I have never advocated being confrontational or adversarial. When you know your rights, you do not need to become confrontational. It's actually the opposite.

 

Where I have been and where I am going has nothing to do with my being pulled over and is none of their business. Handing over your license is required in most states but responding to questions is not. Being detained is a lot different then being pulled over, handing your credentials over and then leaving.

[Catwoman]

Did this happen in NJ? I have lost all respect in the police in NJ after several dealings with them. I now have my own dashcam (best $45 I ever spent!) in my car and I record EVERYTHING.

 

And... NO, you are absolutely NOT under any type of arrest at a traffic stop. You do NOT have to answer questions like "Where are you coming from?" and "Where are you going?". The only thing you should say at a traffic stop is "Am I being detained?". If you are told no, say "Am I free to go?", then leave.

 

And... NEVER consent to a search of your car or yourself. If the police have reasonable suspicion they won't ask for permission, they will just search. They are asking for permission because they have NO reasonable suspicion.

 

And... saying "if you have nothing to hide" is total BS. It's not a matter of hiding anything, it's your CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT to not be searched without a reason.

 

And... it is NOT illegal to video a police officer (or any public servant) while they are on duty. In some states you cannot AUDIO record without permission, but you do not need permission to video.

You have lost the respect for every single policeman in an entire state?

 

Wow. Nice of you to make such a blanket judgment based on "several dealings with them."

 

And I can't help but wonder what you've been doing to have had so many experiences with the NJ police that have turned out so badly. Are we talking about traffic stops here?

 

Have you ever thought that your uncooperative and negative attitude may have had something to do with the officers' attitude toward you? :glare:

[Berta]

Politely declining to give up my rights is not uncooperative or negative. I have never advocated for anyone to be anything other then polite and knowing your rights.

 

Edited to add:  I thought it was this thread but it's the other thread that I explained what happened with my son. He was accused of a crime he did not commit. He was arrested/booked/photographed and their evidence was "him" getting into his car and speeding away. My son has autism and has never been behind the wheel of a car in his entire 21 yrs. It took a year before they caught the real guy and all charges were dropped against my son.

 

My older son used to work in security with a large department store and routinely had to testify in court on the stores behalf regarding store theft. He had first hand experience with the local PD and he could tell you more than one story about the corrupt PD. According to my younger sons police report a "witness" identified him. After the real criminal was caught, we found out that he was identified by a DETECTIVE that said it was him, from seeing him out on walks with his older brother, who used to work for security and knows the officers.

 

I believe we were targeted by the PD from that point on. We have been out for a walk and followed by police officers. This is how I got interested in what my rights are and aren't.

 

Also... My daughter witnessed a death/crime at the young age of SEVEN. The adult involved has stalked her (she is now 18) and I have had to deal with numerous detectives and police officers. I am thoroughly DISGUSTED with what I have seen. I had enough and we moved 600 miles away.

 

I should have clarified that I have lost respect for all the police in the township where I used to live in NJ. When you deal with things like I have, you tend to lose faith that they are there to "protect and serve". My son is TERRIFIED of police now. We were out in a restaurant and police came in the door and he panicked and hid under the table. I do not think he will ever trust anyone in uniform. It is hard for someone with autism to build relationships, it's never going to happen with someone that has broken his trust.

[Catwoman]

Politely declining to give up my rights is not uncooperative or negative. I have never advocated for anyone to be anything other then polite and knowing your rights.

 

Edited to add: I thought it was this thread but it's the other thread that I explained what happened with my son. He was accused of a crime he did not commit. He was arrested/booked/photographed and their evidence was "him" getting into his car and speeding away. My son has autism and has never been behind the wheel of a car in his entire 21 yrs. It took a year before they caught the real guy and all charges were dropped against my son.

 

My older son used to work in security with a large department store and routinely had to testify in court on the stores behalf regarding store theft. He had first hand experience with the local PD and he could tell you more than one story about the corrupt PD. According to my younger sons police report a "witness" identified him. After the real criminal was caught, we found out that he was identified by a DETECTIVE that said it was him, from seeing him out on walks with his older brother, who used to work for security and knows the officers.

 

I believe we were targeted by the PD from that point on. We have been out for a walk and followed by police officers. This is how I got interested in what my rights are and aren't.

 

Also... My daughter witnessed a death/crime at the young age of SEVEN. The adult involved has stalked her (she is now 18) and I have had to deal with numerous detectives and police officers. I am thoroughly DISGUSTED with what I have seen. I had enough and we moved 600 miles away.

 

I should have clarified that I have lost respect for all the police in the township where I used to live in NJ. When you deal with things like I have, you tend to lose faith that they are there to "protect and serve". My son is TERRIFIED of police now. We were out in a restaurant and police came in the door and he panicked and hid under the table. I do not think he will ever trust anyone in uniform. It is hard for someone with autism to build relationships, it's never going to happen with someone that has broken his trust.

Thanks for clarifying, Berta. Based on those experiences, I wouldn't trust or respect the police in that township, either. I'm sure there are some good, honest officers there, but if I'd been through the things you've described, I would have a hard time giving any of them the benefit of the doubt, too.

 

I'm so sorry those awful things happened to your family. :(

[Guest submarines]

Politely declining to give up my rights is not uncooperative or negative. I have never advocated for anyone to be anything other then polite and knowing your rights.

 

Edited to add:  I thought it was this thread but it's the other thread that I explained what happened with my son. He was accused of a crime he did not commit. He was arrested/booked/photographed and their evidence was "him" getting into his car and speeding away. My son has autism and has never been behind the wheel of a car in his entire 21 yrs. It took a year before they caught the real guy and all charges were dropped against my son.

 

My older son used to work in security with a large department store and routinely had to testify in court on the stores behalf regarding store theft. He had first hand experience with the local PD and he could tell you more than one story about the corrupt PD. According to my younger sons police report a "witness" identified him. After the real criminal was caught, we found out that he was identified by a DETECTIVE that said it was him, from seeing him out on walks with his older brother, who used to work for security and knows the officers.

 

I believe we were targeted by the PD from that point on. We have been out for a walk and followed by police officers. This is how I got interested in what my rights are and aren't.

 

Also... My daughter witnessed a death/crime at the young age of SEVEN. The adult involved has stalked her (she is now 18) and I have had to deal with numerous detectives and police officers. I am thoroughly DISGUSTED with what I have seen. I had enough and we moved 600 miles away.

 

I should have clarified that I have lost respect for all the police in the township where I used to live in NJ. When you deal with things like I have, you tend to lose faith that they are there to "protect and serve". My son is TERRIFIED of police now. We were out in a restaurant and police came in the door and he panicked and hid under the table. I do not think he will ever trust anyone in uniform. It is hard for someone with autism to build relationships, it's never going to happen with someone that has broken his trust.

I'm so sorry your family went through this. 

[mommaduck]

I should have clarified that I have lost respect for all the police in the township where I used to live in NJ. When you deal with things like I have, you tend to lose faith that they are there to "protect and serve". My son is TERRIFIED of police now. We were out in a restaurant and police came in the door and he panicked and hid under the table. I do not think he will ever trust anyone in uniform. It is hard for someone with autism to build relationships, it's never going to happen with someone that has broken his trust.

:grouphug:

[Tammyla]

Op, I'm going to discuss this with my two. 

 

I was always taught to cooperate with the police for their safety and mine.   I've never specifically discussed getting out of the vehicle and to keep your hands visible to the police officer.  Reacting emotionally is something a number of teens are known for. 

 

 

[Wheres Toto]

((hugs)) Berta.  I can see why you feel the way you do and understand better where you are coming from now. 

 

I just felt your first post was......adamant, and it did seems that it could be advocating confrontational behavior.

[Plink]

A cop pulled bf over, dd pulled over to. ...

My dd got out of the car ...

THe cop then called for 4 backup police cars and they proceeded to pretty much strip the boyfriend's car, said they were looking for drugs.

 

I know this has been said many times, but I don't see any problem with the officer's reaction to this situation.

 

The police officer was busy doing their job with a routine traffic stop and your dd acted inappropriately.  This caused the officer to need to both look more closely at the bf, and juggle dealing with your dd who was OUT OF THE CAR and approaching him! 

 

Of course he yelled - he saw her as a threat.  

Of course back-up was needed - he couldn't watch both people at the same time (one of whom was acting irrationally).  

Of course he requested a search - it is rare for non-drugged-out people to act like that.  

 

I'm sure this situation was not what the cop envisioned when he pulled the bf over, and I can guarantee he was glad when it was over.  What a mess.