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Gift tree rant...


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OK, so every year we take an envelope off of the gift tree at our church. Each envelope has a gift request. The expectation is that we fulfill the request, and bring the wrapped gift back to the church in time for Christmas.

In the past, the gift requests have been things like, gloves, toiletries, sketchpad, things like that.... around $20.... not extravagant.

This year the request was for "A set of ceramic knives". Huh? What's that? So I do an internet search and learn that a set of ceramic knives cost around $85-$90!! Whaaaaat??? I think that is an inappropriate gift to request on a gift tree. These gifts are supposed to be for needy people in the community. Nobody "needs" ceramic knives, which I learned today are special because they can be made to hold an exceptionally sharp edge. Beautiful. I would love to be able to have special kitchen gadgets like that. But I guess I'll just keep using my 30 year old Chicago knives!! Also learned today that once it is no longer possible to keep the sharp edge on a ceramic knife, the idea is that they are thrown away. Whaaatttt?? This whole thing irks me!! I am going to give the person a reasonable ($25) gift certificate to a nice kitchen products store downtown. I love the store, but cannot actually afford to shop there. :rant:

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I'm trying to imagine who made this request. Where are the names coming from, do you know?

 

It makes me incredibly sad to think there's some foodie out there who lost their job this past year or something but who asks for a set of knives? If you spluged and just got one, would they be disappointed??

 

The dark side of me wonders if this is a serial killer... :lol::001_huh:

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I'm trying to imagine who made this request. Where are the names coming from, do you know?

 

It makes me incredibly sad to think there's some foodie out there who lost their job this past year or something but who asks for a set of knives? If you spluged and just got one, would they be disappointed??

The dark side of me wonders if this is a serial killer... :lol::001_huh:

 

A single, nice ceramic knife might be reasonable. It could be a 14 year old with big dreams.

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I use to participate in the Angel Tree done by our local YMCA. People put their kids names on it requesting EXPENSIVE electronical gadgets.. The latest and greatest nintendo machine, cds, videos, etc.

 

I was touched by someone who took THREE. She came back with EVERYTHING on 2 lists. New ds and games to go with it, fancy cd players, etc. The third child had asked for a new coat. She brought back some dopey gift and I was so angry I called my house and asked someone to bring up one of the new coats from the closet.

 

I will never understand how someone can buy those expensive things for a charity tree but not the NEEDED items. For someone to request a coat they must have needed it. I can see getting the NEEDS and then spicing it up with a few little fun gadgets but to totally ignore it! I was soooo angry. Never participated again. The stuff that came in was unreal.

 

Even had a family member with serious greed issues sign their child up. Their child didn't NEED stuff, but "everyone else does it.." :mad:

Edited by kolamum
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My bad for not looking on Amazon. Yes, I can get a single ceramic knife for around $20. But do you think that actually can be classified as a "need"? We live in a small town. I looked at Wal Mart and Kmart. They don't carry the knives in their stores (in our town). They're only available on-line. The specialty kitchen store downtown had a single ceramic vegetable peeler for $10. I guess if this person wants to start their "set" they can do so with the gift certificate they'll be receiving... Sheesh!

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I use to participate in the Angel Tree done by our local YMCA. People put their kids names on it requesting EXPENSIVE electronical gadgets.. The latest and greatest nintendo machine, cds, videos, etc.

 

I was touched by someone who took THREE. She came back with EVERYTHING on 2 lists. New ds and games to go with it, fancy cd players, etc. The third child had asked for a new coat. She brought back some dopey gift and I was so angry I called my house and asked someone to bring up one of the new coats from the closet.

 

I will never understand how someone can buy those expensive things for a charity tree but not the NEEDED items. For someone to request a coat they must have needed it. I can see getting the NEEDS and then spicing it up with a few little fun gadgets but to totally ignore it! I was soooo angry. Never participated again. The stuff that came in was unreal.

 

Even had a family member with serious greed issues sign their child up. Their child didn't NEED stuff, but "everyone else does it.." :mad:

 

We also "adopt" 4 kids each year from the tree at the local DFS. We assume these children are actually needy since they are screened by DFS. We try to get each kid a coat, a set of school clothes, and a nice toy. About $100/child. Somehow that seems different than a "needed" kitchen gadget request from (I thought) an adult. Maybe all my assumptions are wrong..... Just needed to vent!

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I've found that it is the church and who organizes it is usually behind whether the Angel Tree like programs are a good program. I've seen programs where they go through reputable agencies and do a good job about talking to the families and find out what is needed. Then I've found other programs where they get names from where ever it is easiest and put anything down. I've worked behind the scenes and given to both - delivering the gifts and interviewing people.

 

So it is either a sincere need or who ever is in charge of your program is not doing a good job. I would not blame the needy family. Often they don't know what to say when asked what they need. They will list whatever they or their kids seen on TV and have no concept of the price.

 

Also I've found that the "newly' poor will ask for more expensive things. When they go from middle class to poor, it takes a while to adjust.

 

Another thought is - Could it be that the gift is for someone in your own church that has hit a rocky patch?

 

I always try to assume that they need to true and give in the spirit of love and charity.

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I guess I agree with you. If these are designed for "needs" I think a knife set falls into that category. A specific kind of knives is a preference, not a need.

 

If they are at the point where they don't have "needs" but want someone to participate in acquiring their "wants" perhaps they shouldn't be in the gift exchange. I'm assuming this is set up for people in actual need of items, not just a general exchange.

 

If this is a general gift exchange, I can see the request, and hopefully the gift card will be well received. I guess I've never seen a random gift exchange like that through a church. I've only seen where churches help those in real need.

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I've seen them around for much, much less than $80-90. I don't own any, so I can't speak to the quality, but ime, $20-30 is a common price. I do know there is a food prep/cooking program in MA for low income families. Many folks have not learned to cook at the knees of a parent, so this instruction can be help to many; good chopping knives make fruit and salad prep easier, so there is that. :001_smile: Give what you can give in peace, and try not to worry whether the person is 'worthy' of certain cutlery. There are a lot of really greedy things going on in the world, and maybe a couple of good knives in this instance is filling a need as well as a 'want'.

Edited by LibraryLover
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Christmas can be fun. Why should $20.00 items necessarily need to be "needed"? Most of what we all buy for our families isn't really "needed".

 

I don't think all items should be needs, but this gift exchange must be not what I'm thinking. I thought most gift exchanges set up like this were done through an organization where people in need qualified for them. It must be different from what I am thinking though.

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My bad for not looking on Amazon. Yes, I can get a single ceramic knife for around $20. But do you think that actually can be classified as a "need"? We live in a small town. I looked at Wal Mart and Kmart. They don't carry the knives in their stores (in our town). They're only available on-line. The specialty kitchen store downtown had a single ceramic vegetable peeler for $10. I guess if this person wants to start their "set" they can do so with the gift certificate they'll be receiving... Sheesh!

 

 

I guess I look at Christmas differently. I like to buy wants and not needs. Not that there is anything wrong with thinking the other way around. Even on an Angel Tree and being poor doesn't mean that having wishes granted is a bad thing. I know when money was really tight for us, I could afford the needs, it was wants I always went without so that my kids could have what they wanted. Needs are also easier to find at thrift shops. I would feel thrilled to be able to make someone really feel special on Christmas morning, and I love that they asked for something they really wanted instead of something that will be forgotten or added to the junk pile.

 

I just remembered something....when I was divorced and struggling I never bought hair conditioner because it was a luxury and I couldn't justify the cost in my own mind. I felt like I had finally left that behind when I could buy it without feeling guilty.

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I don't think all items should be needs, but this gift exchange must be not what I'm thinking. I thought most gift exchanges set up like this were done through an organization where people in need qualified for them. It must be different from what I am thinking though.

 

I think most of these programs the people are on a very limited income but they might be told to ask for something they "want". Often a basket of food will be given at the site as well.

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I am going to give the person a reasonable ($25) gift certificate to a nice kitchen products store downtown. I love the store, but cannot actually afford to shop there. :rant:

 

If you can't afford to shop there, your gift recipient probably can't, either. Why not make it a $25 gift certificate to Walmart or Target, so the person can buy something useful with it, and not just a vastly overpriced gadget? Sadly, $25.00 doesn't go very far in a nice store, and your recipient might not be able to get anything he or she wants there.

 

If you can't find an affordable ceramic knife set, I'd definitely suggest giving a gift card to a department or discount store, rather than to an expensive place.

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we did some stuff like that in the past.

we got a family late in the game so to speak, there were some pretty outrageous gifts on the list.

 

so I called the pic and asked about it.

come to find out the mom sort of felt like nothing would happen, no gifts, what ever (really that was heartbreaking to hear) so she just wrote down what they kids said they wanted. thinking that was it.

 

She was totally shocked and then VERY VERY reasonable in what she asked for her children. Truly needed gifts etc.

 

the other thing we learned was some of the parents want the kids to have the video game things so that they will be in the house and safe instead of outside in the danger.

 

the family we helped, our ss classes ended up helping for several years. and the request were always reasonable and thoughtful.

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Personally, I think that if you are going to get angry at people for requesting something through this type of program, you probably shouldn't participate.

 

It seems like such a weird double-bind to tell people that they can ask for what they want, but then have an unspoken expectation that they are going to ask for a properly humble gift. Something that shows that they understand they are poor recipients of charity.

 

You don't have to buy what they asked for, although if the ones people are linking on Amazon are within your expected price range, I'm not sure why you wouldn't. You don't have to buy an Angel Tree kid a DS or whatever. But don't load it up with all kinds of baggage about whether the person deserves it, or should have dared to hope that someone would buy it, or whatever.

 

My daughter asked for an American Girl doll for Christmas. I told her that it cost more than her father and I would want to spend, and that she could ask Santa but who knew what he would do. I would say the exact same thing if my child's Santa was an Angel Tree. I would prepare her not to expect an AG doll, but I wouldn't tell her that she didn't deserve to be like other little girls and ask for one.

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Sam's Club has a set for $30

 

http://www.samsclub.com/sams/shop/product.jsp?productId=prod5540032&searchTerm=ceramic%20knives

 

Perhaps the requester had seen a similar (or even cheaper) set somewhere and didn't think they were very expensive.

 

You could get a very small set if available. Just one large chef's knife and one paring knife is a good basic set, IMHO.

 

I found several other small sets for $30=40 or so on amazon.

 

HTH

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If you can't afford to shop there, your gift recipient probably can't, either. Why not make it a $25 gift certificate to Walmart or Target, so the person can buy something useful with it, and not just a vastly overpriced gadget? Sadly, $25.00 doesn't go very far in a nice store, and your recipient might not be able to get anything he or she wants there.

 

If you can't find an affordable ceramic knife set, I'd definitely suggest giving a gift card to a department or discount store, rather than to an expensive place.

 

 

I agree. I think the OP simply didn't know how inexpensively they could be had at a Costco etc. If I picked a gift tree envelope w/ a request for something I couldn't afford, I'd exchange the envelope for another. And I'd not have a bad thought about it.

Edited by LibraryLover
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If you can't afford to shop there, your gift recipient probably can't, either. Why not make it a $25 gift certificate to Walmart or Target, so the person can buy something useful with it, and not just a vastly overpriced gadget? Sadly, $25.00 doesn't go very far in a nice store, and your recipient might not be able to get anything he or she wants there.

 

If you can't find an affordable ceramic knife set, I'd definitely suggest giving a gift card to a department or discount store, rather than to an expensive place.

 

:iagree:

 

A $25 gift certificate to an expensive store might even mean it goes wasted, if they can't afford to make up the difference.

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It seems like such a weird double-bind to tell people that they can ask for what they want, but then have an unspoken expectation that they are going to ask for a properly humble gift. Something that shows that they understand they are poorsnip

 

 

It does seem like a double-bind. Does an *adult* have an actual present *need*? I have need to feed my family, and to see my children happy, but if someone asked me if I *needed* something for myself, what would I ask for that that wasn't about them? I suppose I could push the limits and think of something for them that was for me...something for the kitchen, perhaps? Knives? lol Trying to be light here. I suppose I could use a new pair of Yoga pants, but that sounds so me-ish, as opposed to knives, which sound very family-ish.

 

Tough stuff, charity.

Edited by LibraryLover
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Personally, I think that if you are going to get angry at people for requesting something through this type of program, you probably shouldn't participate.

 

:iagree:

The OP is demonstrating the opposite of the spirit of charity, it appears? She really doesn't understand this may be the only nice thing the person gets for themselves -- why throw a fit and be controlling? If it bothers her, do not participate.

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My church is doing this also however some of the request are OUTRAGEOUS. I ignore those and move on to the simple request such as earings, belt and jeans, toileteries and so on. I have read some that were very specific such as a bed spread from bed, bath and beyond that was over $100. Also pillows from the same store that was over $60 to $100. Those tags are the only ones left over past Christmas so those people do not get their wishes fulfilled. Only the simple request get ful filled. One card my mom picked up was jeans (1 pair).... :(

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Maybe you're right..... but maybe not. When I participate in these types of giving programs, I expect to be giving to people in need. I have participated in them for over 20 years and have never had a problem with any of it.... until today. Or maybe I should be signing up for these programs, lol. There are lots of things I would like to have, but cannot afford to buy. Granted, I make my own choices about how to spend my money, and I am happy with these choices. But I don't ask others to provide for my "wants". I think that our society as a whole does not understand true poverty any more. What do you expect when you hear that someone needs charity? Do you expect them to be needy in the sense that they are having difficulty making ends meet, and just need a little help? Or do you expect them to be looking for someone to fulfill their "wants"?

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Yes, I see your point. I was just thinking that since that was the only store in town that had anything like what the person requested, I would get the gift certificate there. They do carry a ceramic vegetable peeler for $10, so clearly they do have some kitchen gadgets that the person might be able to afford. Last year, the person asked for toiletries, so I got them a gift certificate to Wal Mart, because that's where I feel you can get the best value in toiletries, and it seemed to me that the person would appreciate that. This person is not asking for anything that Wal Mart carries, and doesn't really seem to be interested in run-of-the-mill kitchen things. I thought that even if I couldn't afford the whole "set", that maybe I could at least help them to get a start on a set.... kwim?

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It seems like such a weird double-bind to tell people that they can ask for what they want, but then have an unspoken expectation that they are going to ask for a properly humble gift. Something that shows that they understand they are poor recipients of charity.

 

 

No, I don't think their "poor-ness" dictates they ask for properly humble gifts. But, I do think it's a poor choice to turn in a gift request of only 1 expensive item. If there is a severe need, like a coat, put that by itself. But if it is a want, like a kitchen knife, list a few choices. And I don't say that because they're poor.

 

It's like my nephew who wouldn't make a Christmas list, because all he wanted was an x-box. My sister was finally very blunt about the need to come up with some other things, or he wouldn't have anything under the tree.

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Maybe you're right..... but maybe not. When I participate in these types of giving programs, I expect to be giving to people in need. I have participated in them for over 20 years and have never had a problem with any of it.... until today. Or maybe I should be signing up for these programs, lol. There are lots of things I would like to have, but cannot afford to buy. Granted, I make my own choices about how to spend my money, and I am happy with these choices. But I don't ask others to provide for my "wants". I think that our society as a whole does not understand true poverty any more. What do you expect when you hear that someone needs charity? Do you expect them to be needy in the sense that they are having difficulty making ends meet, and just need a little help? Or do you expect them to be looking for someone to fulfill their "wants"?

 

Maybe a little of both? In these programs, we don't know the recipients. They may be milking the system. Or these may be the only presents they get. I concentrate on the latter idea. I can be cynical or I can do the best I can do and know that MY intentions were pure.

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I think this is probably an issue of the gift request being something that the charity-giver wouldn't be able to buy for herself. My family growing up moved past poor once my dad graduated from his PhD program, but money was tight with six kids living on one income. Our needs were met. Our wants? Only sometimes. So, if my family wanted to give charity and got a request for a Nintendo, it would feel gross since that wasn't something we could afford for ourselves.

 

In this case, I would buy as many ceramic knives as I could get for the expected ~$30 and be done with it.

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The Angel Tree program we participate in has a price limit of $30 for the gifts. The recipients can request something up to $30 and purchasers are asked not to go over that amount. It is asked that if you wish to spend more than that, please consider taking more than one request. :)

 

I hate when the "needy" <hate that word!!> start getting judged for daring to desire anything above basic food and shelter. :(

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I believe that when you open a wish list, you should be prepared to give with an open heart. Deciding whether or not something is necessary or properly asked for is not your job. By taking the wish list you've already decided to give - don't judge what they are worthy of, judge what you are worthy of giving.

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Maybe you're right..... but maybe not. When I participate in these types of giving programs, I expect to be giving to people in need. I have participated in them for over 20 years and have never had a problem with any of it.... until today. Or maybe I should be signing up for these programs, lol. There are lots of things I would like to have, but cannot afford to buy. Granted, I make my own choices about how to spend my money, and I am happy with these choices. But I don't ask others to provide for my "wants". I think that our society as a whole does not understand true poverty any more. What do you expect when you hear that someone needs charity? Do you expect them to be needy in the sense that they are having difficulty making ends meet, and just need a little help? Or do you expect them to be looking for someone to fulfill their "wants"?

 

:iagree:

 

I have been on the other end of the stick, so to speak. It never dawned on me at the time to ask for help from others, especially for gifts at Christmas. If I didn't have it to spend, then we didn't get it. Our happiness at holiday time was not dependent upon whatever material "things" we had. If I could have asked for one thing, it would have been for help with buying propane for heating for the upcoming winter. I would never in my wildest imagination have asked others for anything I would have day-dreamed for. I would have realized that I didn't really need it at that time. There were other much more pressing needs.

 

I say this having lived off of soup and cereal for several months at a time during a very lean period of my life. Do I think I missed out on anything by not having had a few "nice" Christmas gifts? No, of course not. I'm probably a better person for having gone through a season of poverty. I'm very thankful that my life has changed (financially) for the better, but I can definitely say that I have walked a mile in others shoes for a time. It just seems that today's attitude seems to be that getting some wanted material goods (at Christmas) will make it all better. It does not.

 

Before you throw tomatoes at me, I've bought for Angel Trees, and contributed to other organizations who help the needy around here. I have decided to stop for now, as there is so much abuse of the system here. I feel that giving happens when my heart either "hears" or "sees" a need, and that isn't always at Christmas. There are too many other days in the year when people have real needs. I'm not too sure anyway that all the commercialization of Christmas is what the holiday was meant for.

 

 

Editing to add...

 

If you want to give during the Christmas season, check with a local nursing home or home health agency.

Edited by Poke Salad Annie
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I think it's poor form to ask for outrageously priced items from a giving tree charity. If you are in that program, then yes, you should be modest in your requests. Otherwise, it is pretty greedy. I agree with the OP. Having worked with charities...the most demanding, rude behavior I've seen is from people getting something for free. It is unreal. Being poor is not an automatic virtue. And I say these things as someone who grew up poor. My parents told me "no" if we couldn't afford it. Often!

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Well, you could have a person asking for a pair of jeans and so it sounds like a need, but in reality they have 30 pair of pants in the closet at home and just like clothes. Needy or greedy?

 

Then you can have a person asking for knives because they really want to go to chef school after losing their job, and that's on the required tools list. Or perhaps there's a teen out there who asked for ceramic knives to gift to his mother, who never gets anything for herself but has been wanting knives forever. Or or or...

 

Who knows what motivates people? When in doubt, assume the best of a person's intentions. I think if we can't do that, we shouldn't participate in these types of things. Not that I don't understand some of the frustration... I just think when we're easily frustrated should we either work on that, or chose another service/charity option that we can participate in with a light heart.

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Maybe you're right..... but maybe not. When I participate in these types of giving programs, I expect to be giving to people in need. I have participated in them for over 20 years and have never had a problem with any of it.... until today. Or maybe I should be signing up for these programs, lol. There are lots of things I would like to have, but cannot afford to buy. Granted, I make my own choices about how to spend my money, and I am happy with these choices. But I don't ask others to provide for my "wants". I think that our society as a whole does not understand true poverty any more. What do you expect when you hear that someone needs charity? Do you expect them to be needy in the sense that they are having difficulty making ends meet, and just need a little help? Or do you expect them to be looking for someone to fulfill their "wants"?

 

If I wanted to make sure that I was donating to fulfill people's desperate needs, I would give to an organization that provided food baskets, or donate toiletries to a battered women's shelter, or put hats and gloves on my church's mitten tree, or donate coats and blankets to an organization for the homeless. There is no shortage of charities that exist only to meet the most basic needs of the most desperate people.

 

If I were donating to an organization that provided Christmas presents, I would expect to give something present-like. A present is something to brighten someone's life and make them feel happy and cared for. I think that presents are almost by definition "wants," rather than "needs." In that case I would be giving to provide a little joy and Christmas cheer in the life of someone who might have the bare essentials but not much more.

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Yes, I see your point. I was just thinking that since that was the only store in town that had anything like what the person requested, I would get the gift certificate there. They do carry a ceramic vegetable peeler for $10, so clearly they do have some kitchen gadgets that the person might be able to afford. Last year, the person asked for toiletries, so I got them a gift certificate to Wal Mart, because that's where I feel you can get the best value in toiletries, and it seemed to me that the person would appreciate that. This person is not asking for anything that Wal Mart carries, and doesn't really seem to be interested in run-of-the-mill kitchen things. I thought that even if I couldn't afford the whole "set", that maybe I could at least help them to get a start on a set.... kwim?

 

I guess I'm just thinking that a ceramic vegetable peeler isn't a knife, and if the recipient needs a peeler, he or she can get one at the dollar store. My thought is that someone in need would probably feel it was a waste of money to shop at an expensive store, when perfectly serviceable kitchen stuff can be bought for far less money in a discount store.

 

I was curious about the ceramic knife thing, so I checked Walmart.com and found this for $19.88:

 

http://www.walmart.com/ip/Yoshi-Blade-Ceramic-Knife/14248104

 

I think I have seen the same thing at Bed, Bath & Beyond, too, but I didn't pay attention to the price.

 

I know others have already mentioned the nice set at Costco, so I won't try to find a link to those knives, but Sam's Club has a set of Cuisinart ceramic knives for less than $30:

 

http://www.samsclub.com/sams/shop/product.jsp?productId=prod5540032&searchTerm=ceramic%20knife

 

Ikea might have them, too, but again, I haven't been there in a while, so I'm not sure.

 

How abut Kohl's? If you had a really good coupon, you might find a good deal there, too.

 

(Of course, after all of us are trying to find a set of ceramic kitchen knives, we'll ultimately find out that the person actually needed knives to use in their ceramics class, and we will all have been tragically mistaken... ;) )

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Who knows what motivates people? When in doubt, assume the best of a person's intentions. I think if we can't do that, we shouldn't participate in these types of things. Not that I don't understand some of the frustration... I just think when we're easily frustrated should we either work on that, or chose another service/charity option that we can participate in with a light heart.

 

Absolutely. If we can't assume the best of people at Christmas time, then when?

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