s/o another thread - girlfriends as "family"

[Rosie_0801]

Please read my original post. I never said that non family members could not be in family pictures. I simply said that they should wait to be invited to be in the picture. As I also said earlier (in a different post), if a pattern is established that includes a specific person in family pictures, that the person is no longer presuming that they are welcome, they know that they are welcome.

 

I should have worded it differently. (And as far as I know this woman you are objecting to hasn't produced kids yet, so this is hypothetical to your situation.)

 

To me, it seems odd that an unmarried womb who grew some family members shouldn't presume she is family. To me it is like saying, your partner is family, your children are family, your uterus is kind of an honorary aunt, but the rest of you doesn't count so who do you think you are, Wench?

 

Fwiw, in my family non-blood, non-married relatives count providing we like them. :lol: My aunt was traumatised when she realised my partner had been booted by the photographer, from the wedding photos for not being family. But Mum's partner is family to her, and to the rest of us, he's Mum's partner and that's all! But unfortunately has to be included in photos. On the other hand, my brother's best chick friend (he's asexual and she's a lesbian) is practically my SIL. :lol:

 

I'm not sure if marrying my partner would make me family in his family's eyes, but if I'm not family after being around for 9 years and producing two grandkids, they are not family I want to have! (But putting that issue aside, we don't like each other anyway.)

 

My take is that if you ever going to want access to a woman's kids, you're better off treating her like family. But I'm unmarried, with unpleasant inlaws so I would say that. :tongue_smilie:

 

Rosie

Edited November 28, 2011 by Rosie_0801

[Homemama2]

You could hand her the camera and ask her to take a few pictures. My mom takes alot of pictures with "just certain" people in them b/c she wants close ups of people, and certain 'poses' for her scrapbooking pages. So at holidays, we hear alot of "Ok, let's get a pic of just the siblings. Now just the grandparents and grandkids. Now just the cousins. Now everyone. Now each family individually." Everyone ends up behind the camera at some point, and nobody feels excluded.

[myfunnybunch]

I see photos as a slice of life at the time.

 

Yes, this. This is how we view our family photos. A picture of the family at that time, the good, the bad and the unpopular girlfriends....If you're at a family event, you're family.

 

We have many family photos that include my sister's long-time boyfriend, now an ex. We had a relationship with him too, a loving and friendly one, and we miss him. I am so glad that we didn't exclude him, because even though he is no longer a regular part of our lives, we still have fond memories.

 

I know, I know, your family didn't feel the love toward this woman the way we did toward my sister's ex. But really is the point that nephew's gf should have been excluded because she was not family, or because she was not popular? Honestly, even though it's difficult now, I think you all made the right choice at the time, to honor your nephew's feelings and include her. We don't know the future...at that time, you (and they) didn't know if they'd be together for their lifetime or not. It could have stirred up a lifetime of resentment and hurt to exclude her.

 

I like Mrs. Mungo's suggestions, and at our own family events we often rotate photographers....I do think it's appropriate to take two or three rounds of a group photo and as a part of that ask, say, a not-so-popular girlfriend to step out to take a few shots so that the person taking the photos can be in a few pictures.

 

:grouphug: I am so sorry for your losses. :grouphug:

 

Cat

[Haiku]

Because *she* gets to tell me who her family is, not the other way around.

 

Yup. If the law is what defines us as married, why bother with religious ceremonies? If the law is what defines us as family, do we boot out our step-relatives if our blood relative dies? If the law is what defines us as family, do we tell foster kids that the foster families who raised them aren't actually their families?

 

I am related to my kids by law only. The law doesn't concern me one darn bit. My kids are my kids because I love them and they love me.

 

Tara

[kiana]

Eliana, your post, as always, was both beautiful and well-said.

[kimnc]

The OP's point is simply that non-family members should wait to be asked before including themselves in family photos. The girlfriend and nephew were not engaged and had no children - they were simply cohabitating. (In his parents' house.)

 

It was simply bad manners for the girlfriend to include herself without being invited.

 

I think the best solution is to take lots of various photos, some with spouses, some without, some with just siblings, etc., as people have previously mentioned.

[kimnc]

...but who gets to decide who is family and who is not?

 

When a relative of mine had a girlfriend w/him at a family event (recently cohabitating girlfriend), she and he considered her family... and she joined in the family photos. To them, she *was* family, and had no need to wait for an invitation to be included... it was, to them, as implicit as my inclusion was to me at the b-day party this summer.

 

The difference here is that the girl was not considered family by the rest of the family. She was not liked by the immediate family, she was tolerated for the son's sake.

 

It wasn't about her... it was about him. And rejecting her would have been rejecting him and his estimation of her value in his life... and, honestly, it would have made him feel that *his* value to us was less than he had thought...

 

 

This is a good point, and bears consideration.

Overall, I think that if the family didn't want the gf there they should have made that clear to the son. Of course this might have meant other hurt feelings and a rift in the family. There isn't a really easy way to handle that sort of situation.

[Rosie_0801]

Hey, at least these exclusions weren't happening at this girlfriend's house when the rellies had come to visit her new baby! That's when my SIL was excluding me from photos, bless her heart. :lol:

 

Rosie

[Mrs Mungo]

The difference here is that the girl was not considered family by the rest of the family. She was not liked by the immediate family, she was tolerated for the son's sake.

 

That has *zero* bearing on the situation or my BIL (married to my sister for 9 years, even if they were separated for several of those years) would never be in a photo.

[Mrs Mungo]

Hey, at least these exclusions weren't happening at this girlfriend's house when the rellies had come to visit her new baby! That's when my SIL was excluding me from photos, bless her heart. :lol:

 

Rosie

 

You are too kind. :grouphug:

[mommaduck]

The difference here is that the girl was not considered family by the rest of the family. She was not liked by the immediate family, she was tolerated for the son's sake.

 

So the combination of not married plus not liked makes it acceptable, but married but not liked would have made it acceptable? How far into their relationship would they have had to have been to be accepted?

[La Texican]

Or it may not matter at all.

If only I had more photographs of my brother from the final years of his life, I wouldn't care who else might be in the picture.

Old girlfriends of second cousins? Fine.

Co-workers of Uncle Henry? Okay.

Sister's friends from high school? No problem.

After all, they were each important in this life for one reason or another.

Of course, they'd all just be background decoration. So long as the one I'm missing IS in the picture, I would cherish it.

 

:iagree:

[YLVD]

I find this..insulting, to be honest.

 

As I just posted in another thread, I've been married before and I'm currently partnered and living with someone, and have been for two years. He is the stepdad to my daughter and we have more of a commitment than I had in my marriage.

 

Sure, my ex DH is in tons of family pictures with me but he was an abusive cheater. My partner is my true life partner in every way. He is my family, no matter how it's legally defined. We have been living together for two years. We were best friends for 11 years prior to dating. So, it was okay to have my cheating ex in those pics simply because we were legally "family". That's crazy.

 

I'm not sure if I want to marry again. It changes nothing. We are partnered either way.

 

My mom and stepdad were together for 7 yrs before marrying. He was my stepdad that whole time. They finally decided to make it legal. Nothing changed, he was always my dad..always my family. Marriage didn't change it at all.

Edited November 28, 2011 by YLVD

[Amira]

Hey, at least these exclusions weren't happening at this girlfriend's house when the rellies had come to visit her new baby! That's when my SIL was excluding me from photos, bless her heart. :lol:

 

Rosie

 

You are too kind. :grouphug:

 

No kidding, Rosie. I can't even imagine.

[mommaduck]

I find this..insulting, to be honest.

 

As I just posted in another thread, I've been married before and I'm currently partnered and living with someone, and have been for two years. He is the stepdad to my daughter and we have more of a commitment than I had in my marriage.

 

Sure, my ex DH is in tons of family pictures with me but he was an abusive cheater. My partner is my true life partner in every way. He is my family, no matter how it's legally defined. We have been living together for two years. We were best friends for 11 years prior to dating. So, it was okay to have my cheating ex in those pics simply because we were legally "family". That's crazy.

 

I'm not sure if I want to marry again. It changes nothing. We are partnered either way.

 

My mom and stepdad were together for 7 yrs before marrying. He was my stepdad that whole time. They finally decided to make it legal. Nothing changed, he was always my dad..always my family. Marriage didn't change it at all.

I've always been big on marriage, but this is one thing that I've learned about the older I've gotten. My mother also lived with my stepdad before marrying him. He raised me and I knew no different till I was nine. My dad has been married six times and is currently with a live in girlfriend (don't get me started, and let me say that it's not because they are living together). My husband's uncle was in a common law marriage. As far as the family is concerned, they were married and she is his widow. They had been together off and on since highschool.

[YLVD]

I am well aware of this & have been for years. It does not change the fact that by this family's definition (which is a culturally acceptable, traditional and legal definition), this girl is not family.

 

 

I believe that if a traditional male/female relationship is truly committed in our culture, then there should be no problem legally formalizing the relationship.

 

I disagree.

 

 

So if they haven't committed to be family, then why would they want to be in a family photo?

 

 

No, it says a lot of things, but it doesn't mean they necessarily consider themselves to be family.

 

I find your view to be incredibly insulting and narrow minded. My SO is my family, we are committed life partners. He is far more my family than my ex husband ever was. We are committed for life, for the long haul. We will probably end up married but it will change nothing.

 

In fact, these kind of ridiculous assertions make me never want to get married.

[YLVD]

I've always been big on marriage, but this is one thing that I've learned about the older I've gotten. My mother also lived with my stepdad before marrying him. He raised me and I knew no different till I was nine. My dad has been married six times and is currently with a live in girlfriend (don't get me started, and let me say that it's not because they are living together). My husband's uncle was in a common law marriage. As far as the family is concerned, they were married and she is his widow. They had been together off and on since highschool.

 

Yep, I've seen a lot of different situations in my own family. I think that marriage can be a wonderful thing but not the only way to go.

 

I know that not all live in situations are true life long partnerships, but many are. I have an uncle in a common law situation. My favorite cousin is partnered with a woman (lesbians), they have kids..they are a family. :001_smile:

[mommaduck]

I am well aware of this & have been for years. It does not change the fact that by this family's definition (which is a culturally acceptable, traditional and legal definition), this girl is not family.

 

 

I believe that if a traditional male/female relationship is truly committed in our culture, then there should be no problem legally formalizing the relationship.

 

I disagree.

 

 

So if they haven't committed to be family, then why would they want to be in a family photo?

 

 

No, it says a lot of things, but it doesn't mean they necessarily consider themselves to be family.

At what point would she be considered family? Only after marriage? After engagement? After a certain period of dating? She shouldn't be in ANY photos during their relationship prior to marriage?

[mommaduck]

Yep, I've seen a lot of different situations in my own family. I think that marriage can be a wonderful thing but not the only way to go.

 

I know that not all live in situations are true life long partnerships, but many are. I have an uncle in a common law situation. My favorite cousin is partnered with a woman (lesbians), they have kids..they are a family. :001_smile:

In many cultures throughout history, marriage was not defined by a piece of paper, but rather by commitment.

[TechWife]

If they are living together publicly, and presenting themselves as family at a family reunion, that says something pretty clear about whether they consider themselves to be a family.

 

Clearly it wasn't the definition of your relative who brought his live in gf to the family function.

 

Did they have a household together, or were they just roommates with benefits? It would be impolite to ask, and if it were the latter situation, he really ought not to have introduced her or brought her to the family reunion.

 

The family reunion took place at the house in which she lived. She wasn't brought to the reunion, she was just there. She spent the day in the basement playing video games and yelling at anyone who asked her to help w/any aspect of the day or who encouraged her to come join in the fun. Nephew did not present her as family, in fact, he did not present her at all. He fully participated in the reunion.

 

 

Unless you want to ask them right out, you have to go by the signs they are giving you. Are they presenting themselves as family, or not.

No, they did not present themselves as family, except when she jumped into all of the pictures.

 

Given that many long term couples who are madly in love are not even legally allowed to marry in most states, I can't imagine rejecting someone just because they aren't married yet. Love is love, and that piece of paper doesn't change much in my eyes.

 

At what point would she be considered family? Only after marriage? After engagement? After a certain period of dating? She shouldn't be in ANY photos during their relationship prior to marriage?

 

Have you read the original post?

 

I like Mrs. Mungo's suggestions, and at our own family events we often rotate photographers....I do think it's appropriate to take two or three rounds of a group photo and as a part of that ask, say, a not-so-popular girlfriend to step out to take a few shots so that the person taking the photos can be in a few pictures.

 

I actually suggested that multiple photos be taken, some with and some without. Really, I did. Check out the original post.

 

:grouphug: I am so sorry for your losses. :grouphug:

 

Cat

Thank you, I appreciate this.

 

I should have worded it differently. (And as far as I know this woman you are objecting to hasn't produced kids yet, so this is hypothetical to your situation.)

No, there are no kids between these two. This hypothetical situation is not relevant to my original post. Please read the part where I said that people should wait to be asked, not that they can't be in family pictures.

 

 

It was simply bad manners for the girlfriend to include herself without being invited.

Thank you.

I think the best solution is to take lots of various photos, some with spouses, some without, some with just siblings, etc., as people have previously mentioned.

Thank you. I also brought this up in my original post.

 

...but who gets to decide who is family and who is not?

The family, perhaps?

 

That's how you and I see it, but, it sounds as if, to them, they were family.

No, I don't think nephew would have defined them as a family. They certainly didn't act as a family.

 

It wasn't about her... it was about him. And rejecting her would have been rejecting him and his estimation of her value in his life... and, honestly, it would have made him feel that *his* value to us was less than he had thought...

 

Not being included in a photo does not equal rejection of a new family member. Wow. That would be pretty immature on her part. I was together w/my family this past weekend and am only in a few photos.

 

 

I place an enormously high value on family peace and unity. ...on family being the people who are there for you and love you unconditionally... the people who have your back.

I love family unity (she's in the photo's, isn't she?).

Well, she barely acknowledged us, so that isn't loving unconditionally. The only back she had was hers.

[mommaduck]

All I can say is that if your nephew didn't consider her family, then HE could have spoken with her. If it was an issue, then you could have spoken with HIM. It sounds like there were a lot of hard feelings, she knew you all didn't like her, and she was kicking back (doesn't make her actions right irt how she treated people that day).

[FaithManor]

It's a tough one. I don't think anyone wants a family picture album maintained that has all of their ex-boyfriends and girlfriends filling it.

 

But, one can't deny and shouldn't ignore long term relationships.

 

My parents rule of thumb was that boyfriends and girlfriends (ie. dating relationships) did not get into family photos. Now, if the couple wanted to have a picture of just them taken, no problem, my dad was quick with the camera. For those pictures that were "family" pictures, the non-committeds need step aside.

 

Additionally, though my parents are traditional conservatives of the era and not fond of live-in relationships, they also wouldn't ignore a long term one. So basically, if you lived together for more than two years, you'd end up being invited into family photos. Less than two years, well, in their eyes that's still just dating and not necessarily committed so therefore still not part of the family.

 

Ultimately, it's dicey. We have an awesome zoo pic of dh and I and the kids plus my sister and her ex and his daughters. Our family looks amazing in that photo. But, my boys don't like looking at it anymore because ex-uncle B is in it and he did some terrible things to their most favorite aunty for which my 14 year old, in particular, would like to deck him or smash up the man's light blue mustang! So, dh photoshopped the others except aunty out of it and the boys like to conveniently ignore the actual memory which would have included the jerk.

 

Life is messy. I don't think we can sanitize it for our convenience. Certainly, if a couple is going to be together for a long time, I think one needs to acknowledge that and not drive wedges over things like "family pictures" if possible. It is also not feasible to destroy all family photos after a divorce. That life happened too for good or for bad...should all memories be denied? I've been through this. My brother was so angry at his ex-wife's infidelity (during their 16 years of marriage) that he destroyed every single photo he had with her in it. His sons now have almost NO baby, toddler, pre-school year photos since she was so often in those shots. My niece-in-law has only seen two pictures of her husband from the ages of newborn -eight years of age. I think that's pretty awful!

 

Faith

[Murphy101]

All I can say is that if your nephew didn't consider her family, then HE could have spoken with her. If it was an issue, then you could have spoken with HIM. It sounds like there were a lot of hard feelings, she knew you all didn't like her, and she was kicking back (doesn't make her actions right irt how she treated people that day).

 

That's pretty much my view too.

 

If nephew didn't want her in the picture, then he should have said something.

If nephew did want her in the picture, then as family, we would accept that. It's a casual family picture. It's just not worth stressing over.

[CalicoKat]

Can't she be photoshopped out of a photo now?

 

This happened in dh's family too with his old girl friend. It still is a point of contention even to this day and I, the married wife, am tired of the family constantly bringing up this former girl friend and spending horrible amounts of time discussing it. They've talked more about this former girlfriend than they've ever discussed me. :001_smile:

[TechWife]

All I can say is that if your nephew didn't consider her family, then HE could have spoken with her. If it was an issue, then you could have spoken with HIM. It sounds like there were a lot of hard feelings, she knew you all didn't like her, and she was kicking back (doesn't make her actions right irt how she treated people that day).

 

That's pretty much my view too.

 

If nephew didn't want her in the picture, then he should have said something.

If nephew did want her in the picture, then as family, we would accept that. It's a casual family picture. It's just not worth stressing over.

 

I never said nephew didn't want her in the picture. You are reading a lot into this, really. There are no hard feelings. Really, there aren't. The entire concept of hard feelings is foreign to this family. There is no family drama, there are no grudges. We are all adults who choose what to say and what not to say in a reasonable mature manner. Really.

 

This discussion has gone far from it's original intent. The intent was to ask others to be polite and not assume that they are welcome in family photos unless they are family. That is all. Manners, common sense, putting others before yourself, etc.

 

Quite honestly, the folks responding to this thread have made more out of the situation than anyone in our family ever dreamed of doing. No one stressed out over it at the time, no one continues to stress out over it (including me).

[Lady Florida.]

that when you are with someone for a long amount of time they become part of the "extended" family. Had they been married she would have been expected to be in the pictures. If they had divorced you'd still be upset that she was in them. Photoshop does work wonders now.

 

 

 

:iagree: DSS was married for less than a year to someone none of us cared for. Her pictures are in my scrapbooks. She was, whether we liked it or not, family. Now we're stuck with pictures of her.

[TechWife]

Can't she be photoshopped out of a photo now?

 

This happened in dh's family too with his old girl friend. It still is a point of contention even to this day and I, the married wife, am tired of the family constantly bringing up this former girl friend and spending horrible amounts of time discussing it. They've talked more about this former girlfriend than they've ever discussed me. :001_smile:

 

I suppose she could be, but it wouldn't be the same. Also, discussing the photo wasn't the intent of my original post, it was an example to support my request that people who are not family wait to be invited into family pictures.

 

This photo has never come up in family discussions & I don't expect it to. My husband's family is a drama free family, really. We are not petty people and have better things to do with our time together. Above all, we have learned over the past two years that life is to be treasured.

[mommaduck]

I suppose she could be, but it wouldn't be the same. Also, discussing the photo wasn't the intent of my original post, it was an example to support my request that people who are not family wait to be invited into family pictures.

 

This photo has never come up in family discussions & I don't expect it to. My husband's family is a drama free family, really. We are not petty people and have better things to do with our time together. Above all, we have learned over the past two years that life is to be treasured.

 

I guess each family is different. If it was a family that I was new to and unaware of the dynamics, yes, I would wait till invited...it's a natural courtesy. If I was considered family by my partner, whether by long term relationship, marriage, engagement, whatever, then I would take my partner's lead on it. But again, every family is different and you were asking that everyone make it a point to treat it as though all are the same. I think due to this being a touchy subject with so many variances nowadays, it did spark off discussion into what constitutes a family.

[OnTheBrink]

The OP's point is simply that non-family members should wait to be asked before including themselves in family photos. The girlfriend and nephew were not engaged and had no children - they were simply cohabitating. (In his parents' house.)

 

It was simply bad manners for the girlfriend to include herself without being invited.

 

I think the best solution is to take lots of various photos, some with spouses, some without, some with just siblings, etc., as people have previously mentioned.

 

I agree.

[Haiku]

it was an example to support my request that people who are not family wait to be invited into family pictures.

 

 

 

Perhaps that was your intent, but it came across as being about the fact that you didn't like her more than anything else.

 

Tara

[Lady Florida.]

The intent was to ask others to be polite and not assume that they are welcome in family photos unless they are family.

 

But many of us are saying we don't agree with that. We think it's up to the SO family member to decide if the girlfriend/boyfriend is "family". Unless this was a JAWM thread. If that's the case, I apologize.

[TechWife]

Perhaps that was your intent, but it came across as being about the fact that you didn't like her more than anything else.

 

Tara

 

Then you either did not read carefully or you read a lot into the situation. :chillpill:

[TechWife]

But many of us are saying we don't agree with that. We think it's up to the SO family member to decide if the girlfriend/boyfriend is "family". Unless this was a JAWM thread. If that's the case, I apologize.

 

 

I think that a lot more goes into being family than someone deciding that they are family. As I said, I have no problem w/a family member inviting a SO to be in their family picture, but there are two operative words: family and invite. If the person is considered family and they are invited to be in the picture (either specifically or by established custom), then I don't see a problem. I don't think that it is up to just one family member, however. Whenever possible, the family member needs to defer to their elders and/or family custom. Why? Because unless it is harmful, it's the right thing to do.

 

I find it hard to believe that there are so many people in the world who would be mortally wounded at not being in a photo. Really? I mean, photoshop is a wonderful thing (as so many have pointed out), you could just add someone after the fact.

 

That is all.

 

 

 

 

 

[Desert Rat]

At what point would she be considered family? Only after marriage? After engagement? After a certain period of dating? She shouldn't be in ANY photos during their relationship prior to marriage?

 

:iagree:This is what I was thinking.

A good family friend just found out her mom and dad were actually married 2.5 years before their actual wedding. She was in nursing school and it was the school's rule that women didn't marry while in school, so they hid it. They always celebrated the day of the wedding. She was cleaning out her mom's house and now can't ask.

I know it's splitting hairs, but if no one knew they were married, but they were, could she still be in the pictures.

I'm playing devil's advocate.

As far as the OP, in the digital age, take as many pictures as you want. Keep the ones you want. Photo shop the rest. Or put her on the outside and bend her out of the pic, like they did in Uncle Buck. It's your picture. But it certainly isn't worth hurt feelings. After all, she may very well be family soon enough.

[Danestress]

 

And even if she's gone two weeks later, he's in my life for always, and it is my relationship with *him* that I building by respecting his rating of his relationships.

 

 

 

 

 

That is very well put!

[myfunnybunch]

discussing the photo wasn't the intent of my original post, it was an example to support my request that people who are not family wait to be invited into family pictures.

 

I think that what most people are reacting to isn't the photo either. The event was held, if I am understanding correctly, in your nephew's girlfriend's home. On some level this woman (and your nephew) considered herself family. You didn't.

 

I think the crux of the matter is how do we determine who is family and who is not. And if you don't consider a person a part of the family and others do, who gets to decide which people get to be in the family photos?

 

And, gently, your example was about your family and your determination of who is and isn't family, and, whether it was your intent or not, your dislike of the young woman was very clear and colored your post. Of course you're entitled to feel the way you feel about photos and family and the nephew's ex-girlfriend. :grouphug: But to post a request that others handle family photos in a particular way is certain to get people thinking about how we might handle the idea of family and photos of events in our own families, and of course we all have opinions about that, which is probably why the thread took an unexpected direction.

 

Cat

[simka2]

No one stressed out over it at the time, no one continues to stress out over it (including me).

 

The military girlfriend thread stirred up some memories, thoughts, feelings for me.

 

Three years ago, we had a family reunion (my husbands' family). Of course, many family pictures were taken. Our nephew's live-in girlfriend is in every single one that she could get into. This includes the large group picture, the siblings w/their families (their parents are deceased) and the individual family photos. This young girl was & is not liked by my nephew's immediate family, nor by the extended family for a variety of reasons, but she assumed she should be in the photos and worked her way in. No one wanted to offend our nephew, so she stayed in the groups for the photos. Three years later, she is not a part of his life.

 

Why does this matter so much? Because there were to be no more opportunities to take family pictures. Less than one year after that photo was taken, my brother-in-law died (my husband's brother & the father of the nephew w/the live-in girlfriend). One and one half years after his death, my other brother-in-law died.

 

The last family pictures that were truly family pictures were about twelve years old at the time of that first death. My son wasn't in them, however, as he had not been born (I was expecting). So there is no picture of the family as it was at the time my brother in law passed away.

 

So, when your young men & women are seriously dating someone, living with them or even engaged to them, please encourage them not to step into a family picture without being invited. Also, when it comes to your own family, don't be shy about asking people who aren't in the family to step aside for a minute if that is what you want to do. You can always take a second shot with the person in the frame.

 

It might matter more than you think it ever will.

These seem very contradictory :confused:. It mattered enough for you to post a thread about it, discuss why it "matters so much," but now it is nothing to stress over.

 

It sounds to me like she was invited by your nephew. Therefore in her eyes she was invited into the photos. This whole thread is very confusing. :001_huh:

[TravelingChris]

I'm with Eliana on this.

 

I also don't have to worry about this and haven't had to for years- I don't have any family other than a brother and he never brings anyone. My oldest had a gf for a while but hasn't had one for a number of years now. Middle doesn't have a bf. So there is just us. I think that maybe people who worry about who is and isn't in pictures might reflect on how it is nice to have some family. My kids haven't had any cousins, and had really no relationships with their grandparents (only one survives and he has been the only survivor in 15 years).

[Desert Rat]

:iagree: Reading Eliana's posts are timely and well spoken. She says what I should. I'm slowly learning to accept my family and my dh's family and bite my tongue for the greater good.

Thank you, Eliana.

[Guest]

...This whole thread is very confusing. :001_huh:

 

:iagree:

 

I'm also put off by OP's attitude! Wow! I have an opinion about the whole thing, but geez, this thread is too crazy and weird, so forget it.

[Lady Florida.]

But to post a request that others handle family photos in a particular way is certain to get people thinking about how we might handle the idea of family and photos of events in our own families, and of course we all have opinions about that, which is probably why the thread took an unexpected direction.

 

Cat

 

:iagree: Many of us have said we don't mind at all. Some of us have been in that position and speak from experience, others are explaining how they would react if it came up in their families. It's okay for you to feel it's not appropriate within your family. Truly, it is. And it's okay for others to feel that it is appropriate within their families.

 

I'm with Eliana on this.

 

I think that maybe people who worry about who is and isn't in pictures might reflect on how it is nice to have some family.

 

:iagree:

[NanceXToo]

Just not a big deal to me. You still have the people you love in the photo and if someone down the road asks "and who is this?" a simple "so and so used to date her" is answer enough. In the event Photoshop and such doesn't work. ;)

 

It is more important to refrain from offending a relative and/or their current partner than it is to have some "perfect" photo.

[Rosie_0801]

Quite honestly, the folks responding to this thread have made more out of the situation than anyone in our family ever dreamed of doing.

 

Well, yes, of course. We think we are helping you plan for potential future events. You hold a strong view, don't you? Not everyone shares it, do they? If you've already considered how you would behave in the case of any of our hypothetical scenarios, you're not put on the spot when they happen.

 

Rosie

[ereks mom]

Yes, married is the operative word.

 

:iagree:

[Pretty in Pink]

I would rather err on the side of caution than risk offending someone by asking them to step out of a photo. It feels good to be part of a family and to be included in family photos.

 

My sister and her long-term SO are breaking up after ten years together. That young man is in so many of our family photos. I've known him since he was 15. He is like an uncle to my boys. I guess I could sit around bemoaning the fact that our albums are tarnished with his memory, but instead I am choosing to be grateful for the times we shared together. I think it's pretty special that we welcomed him into our family and that he wanted to be included. I know that he would have been hurt had he been asked to step out of family photos.

[TechWife]

I think that what most people are reacting to isn't the photo either. The event was held, if I am understanding correctly, in your nephew's girlfriend's home. On some level this woman (and your nephew) considered herself family. You didn't.

No. The event was held in my brother in law's home (my husband's brother). Girl friend and nephew were living as a couple in his house.

 

As I said before, I don't think my nephew considered her to be family.

 

I think the crux of the matter is how do we determine who is family and who is not. And if you don't consider a person a part of the family and others do, who gets to decide which people get to be in the family photos?

I think I've answered this elsewhere.

 

And, gently, your example was about your family and your determination of who is and isn't family, and, whether it was your intent or not, your dislike of the young woman was very clear and colored your post. Of course you're entitled to feel the way you feel about photos and family and the nephew's ex-girlfriend. :grouphug: But to post a request that others handle family photos in a particular way is certain to get people thinking about how we might handle the idea of family and photos of events in our own families, and of course we all have opinions about that, which is probably why the thread took an unexpected direction.

 

 

I actually didn't request that anyone handle photos in a particular way. I just asked that people wait to be asked before they presume they are welcome in a family photo. That is all. Conversely, they could double check to see if they were welcome if they thought they were.

 

Would people feel differently about the photo situation if the nephew and girl friend were, say, maybe 16 years old and professed a forever love, considering themselves engaged?

[Heather in Neverland]

When I was the girlfriend I ALWAYS bowed out of family group pics on my own. No one ever had to ask me to.

 

Even as a wife I step out of some family pics to make it easier for them to take some minus in-laws.

 

My dh was married before and he does not like seeing his ex-wife in old family photos.

[TechWife]

Well, yes, of course. We think we are helping you plan for potential future events. You hold a strong view, don't you? Not everyone shares it, do they? If you've already considered how you would behave in the case of any of our hypothetical scenarios, you're not put on the spot when they happen.

 

Rosie

 

Yes, I hold a strong view. Yes, I am teaching my son not to assume he should be in the family pictures of a family that is not his own. If/when he marries, his wife's family will be his own. I am intentionally teaching him a traditional, conservative view of family.

 

I think that you can see by the fact that SHE IS IN THE PICTURE, I have already determined how to behave. I also have family pictures from my side of the family that include live in boyfriends and long term boyfriends.

The difference is, they were invited to take part in the family photo (some at that point in time, some because they had always been included, but all because they were wanted).

[TechWife]

These seem very contradictory :confused:. It mattered enough for you to post a thread about it, discuss why it "matters so much," but now it is nothing to stress over.

 

 

 

All things that matter are not stressful. As I said, this has never been a stressful situation. It's looking back and saying "It would have been nice to have a picture with just family."

[TechWife]

:iagree:

 

I'm also put off by OP's attitude! Wow! I have an opinion about the whole thing, but geez, this thread is too crazy and weird, so forget it.

 

Yes, it is a crazy and weird thread. I truly had no idea people would get so up in arms about this. Perhaps if this had been a face to face conversation, things would have proceeded differently, but perhaps not. I haven't been offended by them or put off by the other posters though, just because they differ with me. They are all interesting people who are passionate about a wide variety of things.