WWYD, co-op teacher used the "F" word to my daugther

[AngelBee]

Nope. She is supposed to enforce the standards of the co-op, not her own, especially outside of her classroom.

 

It is ludicrous that this person was so horribly offended by an ambiguous phrase that she needed to drop the f-bomb on the OP's daughter.

:lol: She didn't drop the f-bomb.

 

I think it is funny we are all coming up with these dramatic renditions of how this played out. :D

 

The teacher was obviously concerned about the discussion and therefore discussed it with you personally.

 

And I believe you said she was your friend. Cut her some slack. You discussed it with your dd. Let it go.

 

Learn from it and move on.

 

If it happens again, then go buck wild.

 

I just see this causing way more damage than it is worth. Especially if you are truly "friends".

 

:grouphug: It is hard as a mom. We want to protect our children. I just don't think this situation has malice that needs to be righted.

[Joanne]

I disagree with a lot of the posts here for this reason - your friend did not have to use the term outright to educate your daughter about the expression. She should have given your daughter the benefit of the doubt, and assumed she didn't understand the connotation of her words. If your daughter was in fact being vulgar, then perhaps the shock value would have had a purpose. Had the woman felt that for your daughter's sake she needed to be more informed, the adult could have referred to the word without saying it outright. All she has done in this case is alienated your daughter unnecessarily. I think the woman should be told in polite terms that you would have preferred her be a bit more gracious.

 

People today throw vulgarity around much too casually. I hear adults saying it to children in common speech and it should really give us pause. It is a term that refers to an abusive attitude toward women and shouldn't be taken lightly. My two cents.

 

The people who disagreee with the OP are not posting in favor of casual use of vulgarity. The cultural reality with regard to speech isn't the issue. Indeed, the teacher referenced by the OP was trying to help the OP's dd from appearing as if she were using such terms.

 

Hearing the "f" word in the context described by the OP isn't vulgar. It's made vulgar by the USE, the vulgarity isn't inherent.

 

I do not use the word, but I have to say that your last 2 sentences are debatable.

[AngelBee]

She approached me during our assembly time. I was busy passing out papers and collecting money, it was basically a "hey I wanted to let you know..." I had no time to really chat with her about it. Why is it shocking that dds father (my dh) wants to talk to with her? He has a right to talk to anyone that is teaching his child let alone someone who opts to say/use the f word no matter how it was meant no? Quite frankly I am shocked that you are shocked ;)

 

Saying this gently....I am shocked because I think you are blowing this out of proportion.

 

She spoke to you. Whether in passing or not. She brought it to your attention.

 

I think it is intimidating to then corner her and have a sit down with you and your dh. Not because he is a he or your dh.

 

I just think this is being made into a much bigger deal than need be.

[Guest bananafeet]

We had our first day of co-op yesterday and during break a mom takes the kids outside for some leg stretching. During the course of their play my dd (11) uses the phrase "What the?" in our household it is short "what in the world?" I see now after yesterdays incident that it could be misconstrued for something vulgar. I will be stopping my children from saying it. Anyhow, the teacher who is also my friend took dd aside and asked her if she knew what that meant. Dd does not like confrontation and immediately felt threatened by this woman so she clammed up. The teacher tells her "It means, what the f---, so don't use it around me" My dd of course was embarrassed and horrified that an adult used that kind of language around her. She had no idea that it could mean that.

What would you say to this woman or would you just let it slide?

Not a good start for our first day of co-op.

I've just joined. hi! this was my first sight.

I had very strict parenting and not alowed to say oh God or anything like that but out in the world I was taunted and developed the swear like a navvy approachin order to conform and rebel at the same time.

I think in this situation the teacher should have bowed to you and let you tell her not to or whatever as you were present. She may have felt pushed to respond on seeing your face, however. You seem upset by the daughter saying " what the?" and also somewhat embarrassed that she said it on first day so the teachers explanation was nicely done and this is the most important thing. not the language used ( and i think she needs to know so people don't taunt her later.)

Ultimately I think both of you over-reacted. When your child was 4 or 5 or 6 and may have picked up "silly mommy" or "stupid daddy" or things like that did you not just ignore? I can imagine your shock but I would hope in this case I'd wait for any swear words to come out 3 times and then explain calmly please don't say that it's not a nice thing to say. try not to get bogged down in words though.

For kids, listening to words and trying them out is just like us taking note of how someone ties their scarf and consciously or subconsciously copying.

I thnk it's a difficult time of adapting for you and the teacher but this incident may stick - my gut says you're both on the same page morally but really I think if you are there it best to suggest that you maybe have ultimate authority when present . why not say to her " I wasnt sure how I felt about you using the actual word the otherday as i think it confused the issue for dd but anyway the kids have really warmed to you.."

When my kid wasjust 3 he at esome fresh snow off a wall when I was saying goodbye to his playgroup leader. She told him not to because he might get germs in his tummy and have a bad tummy. He was saddened that his rare opportunites to fell and experience snow was spoilt so I told him go right ahead and eat it. I did not share the same ideas as the lady at all but I felt this was my domain. A pre-school nursery was even worse at trying to usurp my authority by giving him chocolate and e-numbers etc against my wishes. Thats why I homeschool now. It will take some adapting but ask to deal with specifics yourself when you are present or absnet yourself entirely because you have such an in-depth knowledge of your kid that u will always find things like this. This person will change things in your life. good and bad.

[Laurie4b]

Yes, but there's more to communication than words. Context and relationship matter, too, as well as tone of voice, etc. Also, words can have more than one meaning. Some in this thread have stated that they, and those they know, don't imply or infer vulgarity (certainly not the "f word") when they use or hear "what the -". So stating that there is only one meaning is inaccurate. We need to give each other the benefit of the doubt. If the phrase offends you, ask your friend (or your student) not to use it. But don't insist they mean something they don't. On the other hand, try to be aware of additional meanings and inferences of words/phrases you use, and if you become aware that some may be offended by a word/phrase, consider the context when you use it. :001_smile:

 

Wendi

 

Very well said.

[*Lulu*]

I've been thinking about this for awhile, (because this is far more interesting than the football game my family is trying to force me to watch), and I have reached some shocking conclusions.

 

1. I wouldn't be upset if my pre-teen said "what the".

2. I wouldn't be upset if an adult gave them a highly used definition of the phrase.

3. I would not quit using said phrase, nor would I stop my children from using it.

4. I would be momentarily embarrassed that my child was called out, but would just be resolved to broaden his/her knowledge of "colorful" vocabulary.

5. This thread has inspired me to make a list of all the colorful substitutions we use in our house.

 

 

I think DH and I might be bad influences on the kids. :tongue_smilie:

 

Truly this isn't a hill I'm willing to die on.

[AngelBee]

Off to bed.

 

Just wanted to wish you the very best regarding the situation. Pray about it and sleep on it. :grouphug:

[AngelBee]

I've been thinking about this for awhile, (because this is far more interesting than the football game my family is trying to force me to watch), and I have reached some shocking conclusions.

 

1. I wouldn't be upset if my pre-teen said "what the".

2. I wouldn't be upset if an adult gave them a highly used definition of the phrase.

3. I would not quit using said phrase, nor would I stop my children from using it.

4. I would be momentarily embarrassed that my child was called out, but would just be resolved to broaden his/her knowledge of "colorful" vocabulary.

5. This thread has inspired me to make a list of all the colorful substitutions we use in our house.

 

 

I think DH and I might be bad influences on the kids. :tongue_smilie:

 

Truly this isn't a hill I'm willing to die on.

:iagree: with everything you said. Including the bad influence part ;) :lol:

[sagira]

Ds8 says "what the" and it means "what the heck". I would not be happy and be pissed off at the teacher. Bye, bye co-op. Dh would be livid.

[classics4us]

Saying this gently....I am shocked because I think you are blowing this out of proportion.

 

She spoke to you. Whether in passing or not. She brought it to your attention.

 

I think it is intimidating to then corner her and have a sit down with you and your dh. Not because he is a he or your dh.

 

I just think this is being made into a much bigger deal than need be.

 

My dh and I are going to talk to her along side her dh, we aren't going to light torches and carry pitch forks to her house :lol:. I think she needs to know our boundries, she crossed over one of them. I don't see anything wrong with letting her know that. If she is a true friend, she will understand that what she did was offensive to us.

[Laurie4b]

Me too!

 

Okay, I'm only on page 11 of this thread, but I'm surprised to see the number of people who think this girl (who did not swear) did something horribly wrong, and that the teacher (who actually USED the "f" word) was completely justified in doing so?:confused:

 

:iagree:

[Love HSing]

I think it was totally inappropriate of the teacher/mom and it wasn't her place to explain it to your dd. She said, "It means, what the f---, so don't use it around me." What does that mean? She doesn't want the phrase, with the F word cut-off, used around her (when there are other possible endings)...but she can say the full word out loud to your dd?? NOT cool! :thumbdown: I would definitely say something about it. She could have said, "Ask your mom what it means." She could have said, "It means the F word" (and not say the word). She could have just approached you and not pull dd off to the side to teach her what it means (again....I don't think it's her place). I think it's really uncalled for and I'd be mad. I really do think something needs to be said to the woman or one of the co-op leaders. My answer: No...don't just let it slide.

:iagree:

[Imprimis]

:iagree:

 

I can honestly say I am stunned that some are so offended by "What the...?" that they support someone using outright vulgarities with a child.

 

I'm with you. It strikes me as...quite bizarre.

[GingerPoppy]

 

Hearing the "f" word in the context described by the OP isn't vulgar. It's made vulgar by the USE, the vulgarity isn't inherent.

 

I would extend that--the vulgarity of the non-uttered, supposed "ending" to the phrase ISN'T INHERENT either. If it's made vulgar by USE, then *not* using it would certainly not be vulgar. What's fair for the adult should be fair for the child.

 

_____________________

 

So, let me get this straight. In many minds here, it's perfectly ok to substitute words that are derived from the originals--it's ok for the kids to say "heck" or "hey". But it's not ok to simply leave a blank space and say nothing? I don't get it.

 

I'm on the side of those who say we hear "heck" or "stink" or something like that in our minds. I occasionally use the f-word, but even so, that's not what comes into my mind when someone says "what the?" I would argue that it has become a stand-alone phrase--to me, "what the" is a lot like "my bad". My bad WHAT? That phrase is not finished! And yet people use it all the time (blech!!) and it has simply come to mean, "I'm sorry; my fault." To me, "what the" is the same. I like it. I think it sounds funny.

 

I also have a problem with people getting their underwear all tied up in knots (yes, I said "UNDERWEAR", and we all know what that covers up!!) about the f-word. I don't like it much--and have to be extremely angry to utter it--but people are running around in circles because it means copulation. Oh noes! Not THAT act! Why, that's foul! That's disgusting! Wait a minute...

 

So why the deep, deep offense over a word that means such a useful and wonderful thing?

 

Offense is in the eye of the beholder, so to speak. We can't tiptoe around everyone in the world. Maybe it offends me that so many people kill kittens with their apostrophes, but you don't find me all up in arms about it, do you? :chillpill:

Edited September 16, 2011 by GingerPoppy

[classics4us]

Off to bed.

 

Just wanted to wish you the very best regarding the situation. Pray about it and sleep on it. :grouphug:

Me too.

I wanted to lyk that "Pray about it" is the best advice I have gotten all day. :)

[classics4us]

I would extend that--the vulgarity of the non-uttered, supposed "ending" to the phrase ISN'T INHERENT either. If it's made vulgar by USE, then *not* using it would certainly not be vulgar. What's fair for the adult should be fair for the child.

 

_____________________

 

So, let me get this straight. In many minds here, it's perfectly ok to substitute words that are derived from the originals--it's ok for the kids to say "heck" or "hey". But it's not ok to simply leave a blank space and say nothing? I don't get it.

 

I'm on the side of those who say we hear "heck" or "stink" or something like that in our minds. I occasionally use the f-word, but even so, that's not what comes into my mind when someone says "what the?" I would argue that it has become a stand-alone phrase--to me, "what the" is a lot like "my bad". My bad WHAT? That phrase is not finished! And yet people use it all the time (blech!!) and it has simply come to mean, "I'm sorry; my fault." To me, "what the" is the same. I like it. I think it sounds funny.

 

I also have a problem with people getting their underwear all tied up in knots (yes, I said "UNDERWEAR", and we all know what that covers up!!) about the f-word. I don't like it much--and have to be extremely angry to utter it--but people are running around in circles because it means copulation. Oh noes! Not THAT act! Why, that's foul! That's disgusting! Wait a minute...

 

So why the deep, deep offense over a word that means such a useful and wonderful thing?

 

Offense is in the eye of the beholder, so to speak. We can't tiptoe around everyone in the world. Maybe it offends me that so many people kill kittens with their apostrophes, but you don't find me all up in arms about it, do you? :chillpill:

Exactly

Edited September 16, 2011 by classics4us
editing to let everyone know that I am really going to bed this time...lol

[EJCMom]

My kids say, "What the?!" fairly regularly. My youngest will usually include the "heck" at the end, but the older two rarely add the "heck." It never occurred to me that someone might think that a 7, 6, and 3 year old were implying the f-word at the end. :confused:

[StephanieZ]

As awkward as it may be, I think the co-op teacher may have saved your child from some future embarrassment; in short, I think she did your dd a favor. "What the..." really does mean WTF. Your child needed to know.

 

Be thankful your dd didn't say it in church or somewhere else.:001_smile:

 

Although it was awkward, I agree. I have a potty mouth, and although I kept it PG when my kids were really little, I've let it slide in recent years (now that they are old enough to know that they can't get away with using the same language that I can, yeah, bad Mom).

 

Anyway, my kids started in with "What The?" and my 8 year old seemed really fixated on it. I've had that same conversation with them numerous times to get them to NOT use it, because I know exactly what it implies. (They've gotten the message pretty well, but it took a LOT of hassles from me.)

 

If one stranger could have said that to them and taught them not to use that phrase ever again, I'd have been thrilled. Would have saved me a LOT of work!

[StephanieZ]

Really? Strange. When someone says "What the heck?" I, oddly enough, hear them say "What the heck?"

I have no idea how "what the heck?" is rude. Frankly, WTF isn't even rude in some settings.

 

The most straight laced, clean talking folks I have ever met are the Mormons I lived among when I lived in the old part of town Logan, UT for grad school. My neighbors were awesome families and old folks who'd lived there FOREVER and were incredibly straightlaced.

 

The STANDARD expression of surprise was "Oh My Heck!" They (adults, teens, kids, all of them) said it ALLLL the time. It was adorable.

 

So, really, I think Heck is definitely a clean word. Because, if my UT Mormon neighbors would say it, I KNOW it's clean!

 

:)

[Abigail4476]

All I know is that my ds8-almost9 has said "What the...." and he isn't even aware of the F-word yet. He couldn't possibly finish the phrase with a word he doesn't know. It isn't any other adult's place to apprise my children of vulgar words. When we deem it necessary, we will inform him of certain words and their meanings and perhaps an admonition on why he shouldn't use them (as we have done with his older sisters). That's our job as parents; it's no one else's job. Even if another adult thinks it's warranted, and even if they think I'm overprotective and they're doing me a "favor", it still isn't their job. To me, this is akin to explaining sexuality to a child without parental permission. Because these words are "adult" words, it is the parents' job to inform the child of the words, explain the meanings and offer guidelines for their use.

 

FYI, we told him not to say "What the..." because it's usually finished with "heck" or "hell" and that's unnecessary slang. I have seen "wtf" used online, but I guess when I hear the phrase IRL I always mentally assume "hell" or "heck." I haven't actually heard anyone say "wtf." Maybe I have in a movie. I don't remember for sure.

 

If the child were a teenager, I would find the situation more palatable because I would assume they had probably heard the word anyway. It isn't necessarily true that at 11 the child has probably heard the word. We have kept our kids very sheltered in regard to vulgar language and adult content. Our teenagers have been slowly introduced to some language and adult content in movies and books, but they still don't watch movies that contain the F-word, listen to music with obscenities in the lyrics or read books with lots of cuss words. I simply don't see a need for it and we have protected them from it. We don't (rarely :lol:) use any slang or vulgarities, so their chances of hearing certain words are very slim.

 

I don't find it terribly odd that an 11 year old wouldn't know about the F-word. And because it isn't all that odd, a teacher should have more wisdom than to introduce the word to a child.

[Shawna in Texas]

Was your friend offended that your dd said "What the...", or was she trying to tell your dd what people may assume she means? It seems like if she were offended by the word she would have said "f-word" instead of the actual word. If this woman is your friend, she might have felt comfortable explaining this to your dd and felt that she could because of your friendship. And she was honest with you about it. I wouldn't have an issue with any of my friends explaining something like that to my dd if she had said something they thought should be addressed. Whether or not I agree with the assessment is beside the point.

 

I'm always reluctant to give advice about stuff like this, but gosh, if I were in that woman's shoes, and I was trying to discourage my friend's dd from using that phrase or educating her on what other people thinks it means, I'd be mortified to be reprimanded later especially after I told her mother face to face what happened.

[HappyCrazyMama]

My kids say, "What the?!" fairly regularly. My youngest will usually include the "heck" at the end, but the older two rarely add the "heck." It never occurred to me that someone might think that a 7, 6, and 3 year old were implying the f-word at the end. :confused:

:iagree: I guess I need to teach my nearly 2 year old to put the word "hey" at the end as I've heard her say, "what the?" a few times lately and I wouldn't want people to think she meant "what the ****". Truly it is said often in our house and I am one that thinks "what in the world?" when I hear "what the?" unless an ending word is added. I tend to only think people are saying "what the ****" when they say "what the ****".:ohmy: Really, I am glad to know this but it surprises me!:001_huh: I'm going back under my rock.

[MamaJo]

As awkward as it may be, I think the co-op teacher may have saved your child from some future embarrassment; in short, I think she did your dd a favor. "What the..." really does mean WTF. Your child needed to know.

 

Be thankful your dd didn't say it in church or somewhere else.:001_smile:

 

 

WSS

[Word Nerd]

But it doesn't...not around today's teens, young adults, um, most of the population. If a person says "what the ..." the F is implied. The child needed to know.

 

And you know this how?

[Janie Grace]

If the child were a teenager, I would find the situation more palatable because I would assume they had probably heard the word anyway. It isn't necessarily true that at 11 the child has probably heard the word. We have kept our kids very sheltered in regard to vulgar language and adult content. Our teenagers have been slowly introduced to some language and adult content in movies and books, but they still don't watch movies that contain the F-word, listen to music with obscenities in the lyrics or read books with lots of cuss words. I simply don't see a need for it and we have protected them from it. We don't (rarely :lol:) use any slang or vulgarities, so their chances of hearing certain words are very slim.

 

I don't find it terribly odd that an 11 year old wouldn't know about the F-word. And because it isn't all that odd, a teacher should have more wisdom than to introduce the word to a child.

 

 

:iagree: My 12yo dd has never heard that word. I'd be upset if it was introduced to her at co-op. Just explaining that the phrase she said makes people think of a cuss word, and directing her to me if she had more questions, would have been appropriate. I can understand why it bothered you. At the same time, it's not the end of the world. I would just move on and not say anything about it.

[In The Great White North]

As a separate issue with this situation, I would have a problem with the teacher humiliating my dd for something dd did not even know was wrong. If it had been a violation of stated co-op policies, correction (in a more acceptable manner) would have been appropriate.

 

Making up your own rules and humiliating the kids for breaking them, before you've even told them the rule exists, is not OK.

[unsinkable]

The phrase "what in the world" went to "what the world" to "what the"

In our house Grammarland has a little place in it called the Grammarslums :D

 

If it makes you feel any better (:tongue_smilie: are you even still here?) I asked my homeschooled teenaged DD -- who is exposed to swearing -- this question:

 

"If you heard a homeschooled 11 yo girl say, "What the --?" what would you (my DD) think the 11 yo meant?"

 

My DD's answer was "What the heck?" or "What in the world?"

 

Then I asked her if she heard the phrase in general, out in public, anywhere, what she thought the speaker meant. Her answer was -- in order -- What the f---? What the h---? and (this one kills me) What the sh--?

 

My DD knew nothing about this thread. This was just her gut reaction based on my questions.

[JulieH]

If it makes you feel any better (:tongue_smilie: are you even still here?) I asked my homeschooled teenaged DD -- who is exposed to swearing -- this question:

 

"If you heard a homeschooled 11 yo girl say, "What the --?" what would you (my DD) think the 11 yo meant?"

 

My DD's answer was "What the heck?" or "What in the world?"

 

Then I asked her if she heard the phrase in general, out in public, anywhere, what she thought the speaker meant. Her answer was -- in order -- What the f---? What the h---? and (this one kills me) What the sh--?

 

My DD knew nothing about this thread. This was just her gut reaction based on my questions.

 

I asked my 19 year old dd who went to a Christian high school and spent her first year of college in a very secular party university town in Spain what she thinks "what the?" means and she thought I was weird for asking. She said "what the heck? or what the hay? or what in the world?"

 

In fact, she laughed when I told her so many people here insisted it meant the F word. She said "mom, TRUST me..there are a lot of things that mean the F word..'what the?' is NOT one of them!"

[stripe]

I was reading Mercy Watson to the Rescue to my daughter last night. As the couple's bed began to fall through the floor, the man screamed, "What the --?"

 

For what it's worth, my kids "invented" a word, which happens to be the same as a racial slur (that I am certain they'd never heard before), and I told them it was inappropriate and would make people upset. I did not assume they had bad intentions. This, to me, is really key. Why assume a child is trying to offend? And then why say the thing that is supposedly so awful?

 

I remember saying the word "sucks" when I was about 13 and my very conservative Christian playmates gasped and asked if my parents let me talk like that. I really had no clue what any "implications" of the word might have been or that it was scandalous. But again, I actually said it!

Edited September 16, 2011 by stripe

[unsinkable]

I asked my 19 year old dd who went to a Christian high school and spent her first year of college in a very secular party university town in Spain what she thinks "what the?" means and she thought I was weird for asking. She said "what the heck? or what the hay? or what in the world?"

 

In fact, she laughed when I told her so many people here insisted it meant the F word. She said "mom, TRUST me..there are a lot of things that mean the F word..'what the?' is NOT one of them!"

 

I am NOT insisting it means the "f - word." I am saying that it CAN mean the f-word to some people. That is what I said from the very beginning.

 

I don't think that means I have a dirty mind or that my mind goes to the gutter automatically. You didn't say that but others in this thread have.

 

In YOUR DD's experience, it doesn't mean that. In my DD's experience, it means different things depending on who is saying it and where they are saying it.

 

ETA: :D:):grouphug: my post might read snippy and I don't mean it to.

Edited September 16, 2011 by unsinkable

[JulieH]

I was reading Mercy Watson to the Rescue to my daughter last night. As the couple's bed began to fall through the floor, the man screamed, "What the --?"

 

For what it's worth, my kids "invented" a word, which happens to be the same as a racial slur (that I am certain they'd never heard before), and I told them it was inappropriate and would make people upset. I did not assume they had bad intentions. This, to me, is really key. Why assume a child is trying to offend? And then why say the thing that is supposedly so awful?

 

I remember saying the word "sucks" when I was about 13 and my very conservative Christian playmates gasped and asked if my parents let me talk like that. I really had no clue what any "implications" of the word might have been or that it was scandalous. But again, I actually said it!

 

This is exactly what initially struck me when I read the OP. The other woman just assumed the worst. I feel that is a worse offense than her having said the word. She automatically assumed the worse and gave no benefit of the doubt. Anyway, that would bother me even more.

[JulieH]

I am NOT insisting it means the "f - word." I am saying that it CAN mean the f-word to some people. That is what I said from the very beginning.

 

I don't think that means I have a dirty mind or that my mind goes to the gutter automatically. You didn't say that but others in this thread have.

 

In YOUR DD's experience, it doesn't mean that. In my DD's experience, it means different things depending on who is saying it and where they are saying it.

 

Oh dear! I'm sorry..I wasn't saying that YOU are insisting anything. It was a collective thing amongst many in this thread. I was more in agreement with you on the first half of your post giving another example of someone who asked their dd and the dd responded with "what the heck". That's why I quoted you. I should have bolded that part. I'm sorry.

[JulieH]

The phrase "what in the world" went to "what the world" to "what the"

In our house Grammarland has a little place in it called the Grammarslums :D

 

That's a good one!!! I may have to snag that to use with my kids!

[unsinkable]

Oh dear! I'm sorry..I wasn't saying that YOU are insisting anything. It was a collective thing amongst many in this thread. I was more in agreement with you on the first half of your post giving another example of someone who asked their dd and the dd responded with "what the heck". That's why I quoted you. I should have bolded that part. I'm sorry.

 

No need to apologize. I didn't mean for my response to sound snippy. I am sorry if it does. :)

 

I think that both our answers reflect the wide range of what people think when they hear the phrase.

[JulieH]

No need to apologize. I didn't mean for my response to sound snippy. I am sorry if it does. :)

 

I think that both our answers reflect the wide range of what people think when they hear the phrase.

 

I also think I would have gotten so much more school work done with my kids if I hadn't been thinking about this so much over the last 24 hours! :lol::lol:

 

Sorry..feeling a little loopy this morning!

[stripe]

I also think if a teacher thinks a kid has a potty mouth, she might be advised to work with the parents instead of having a confrontation with the kid.

 

Besides, the next kid she screams, "'What the --?' means 'What the f---'" at, might simply smile and say, "I know!" It seems to me that she is relying on the shock factor, and is relying on your daughter NOT wanting to say something "bad."

[unsinkable]

I just searched for the Oreo commercial b/c I had never seen it.

 

What is the grandpa saying? :confused:

[Socalmom]

I'm only up to page 15 of the replies. :001_smile: I just wanted to add that since the teacher is also a friend, could she have been speaking to your DD as she would to one of her own children? It wouldn't bother me as much coming from a teacher that is also my friend. I would give her the benefit of the doubt that she had my child's best interest in mind.

 

My neighbor's 12 yo tried to convince her parents that "WTF" means "What the Facebook" because that's how all the kids from school use it.:lol:

 

Margie

[CAMom]

I asked my 19 year old dd who went to a Christian high school and spent her first year of college in a very secular party university town in Spain what she thinks "what the?" means and she thought I was weird for asking. She said "what the heck? or what the hay? or what in the world?"

 

In fact, she laughed when I told her so many people here insisted it meant the F word. She said "mom, TRUST me..there are a lot of things that mean the F word..'what the?' is NOT one of them!"

 

:iagree: i just asked my non sheltered teens the same thing. One of them is a freshaman on the campus of a major secular university and just spent 6 weeks in the dorms for summer session.

 

Dd said, "Depends on who is saying it." Ds said, "i wouldn't assume anything."

 

I certainly don't assume f--- at the end.

 

It's not universal.:)

[Ria]

:tongue_smilie:

And you know this how?

 

Because I'm a mom of young adults, two of whom are Marines. I work with teens and young adults. I work retail. I hear lots of stuff.

[DesertDweller]

I think the teacher was wrong to assume that your dd would have finished this with the F word. I've heard it used other ways. I've said 'what the heck' before. I've heard people say 'what the hay'. I think it's a stretch to assume that an eleven year old would say this.

 

I also think she crossed the line in repeating it back to her and then feeling that she needed to educate her on the usage. She should have asked your dd first how she would normally finish her statement.

 

That said, I would probably not make a huge deal about it. I would talk to the teacher and explain to her that your dd doesn't use that type of language and that she misunderstood what your dd's intent was when she said it. I would let her know that it may have been better to ask before assuming.

[Ria]

I think she needs to know our boundries, she crossed over one of them. I don't see anything wrong with letting her know that..

 

You put your child in a co-op. You agreed that the teacher was in charge of the class. Now, because she acted well within her authority to correct your child at said co-op, you are going to tell her that she crossed your boundaries?

 

I'm sorry. She was the teacher. She had the authority then, not you. She handled the situation as she saw fit. If you cannot handle letting someone in a position of authority correct your child when she's under their supervision, well, perhaps you should keep your child at home.

[Joker]

You put your child in a co-op. You agreed that the teacher was in charge of the class. Now, because she acted well within her authority to correct your child at said co-op, you are going to tell her that she crossed your boundaries?

 

I'm sorry. She was the teacher. She had the authority then, not you. She handled the situation as she saw fit. If you cannot handle letting someone in a position of authority correct your child when she's under their supervision, well, perhaps you should keep your child at home.

 

Why is it not ok to tell a teacher of an 11 yr old that they crossed a boundary? I think a teacher using the F word if front of my 11 yr old (for any reason) is crossing a boundary and I would say something. I don't think allowing someone to teach my child means they get to do whatever they want. My 11 yr old returned to ps this year and I've had an uncomfortable situation with one teacher already ~ but she apologized not only to me but to my dd so we're good now.

[Ria]

Why is it not ok to tell a teacher of an 11 yr old that they crossed a boundary? I think a teacher using the F word if front of my 11 yr old (for any reason) is crossing a boundary and I would say something.

 

As others have pointed out, I think one needs to look at intent. The teacher intended to make the child aware that the phrase she used implied a swear word. Saying the word does not make the teacher a bad person or mean she intended harm to the child.

 

Had the teacher used the word at the child it would be a different matter. She used it to educate. Eleven is old enough to hear the word. It's not like just hearing it is going to cause a person to be scarred for life.

[Joker]

As others have pointed out, I think one needs to look at intent. The teacher intended to make the child aware that the phrase she used implied a swear word. Saying the word does not make the teacher a bad person or mean she intended harm to the child.

 

Had the teacher used the word at the child it would be a different matter. She used it to educate. Eleven is old enough to hear the word. It's not like just hearing it is going to cause a person to be scarred for life.

 

I agree it won't scar. I've told my dds what the word means but I would still have a problem with a teacher using it. I guess it's because I do curse sometimes and we use a lot of substitutions but I don't use that word. It actually does bother me and I just don't say it so I would be seriously peeved if a teacher used it with my dds.

[Ria]

I agree it won't scar. I've told my dds what the word means but I would still have a problem with a teacher using it. I guess it's because I do curse sometimes and we use a lot of substitutions but I don't use that word. It actually does bother me and I just don't say it so I would be seriously peeved if a teacher used it with my dds.

 

Saying it or telling a child it means the f-word...either way, the child knows what the word is. I'm just confused why actually saying it in this context is any more upsetting than just calling it the f-word. The kid knew which word was in question. Is it really that bad to hear it spoken? Worse than seeing it written? Really?

[texasmama]

Had the teacher used the word at the child it would be a different matter. She used it to educate. Eleven is old enough to hear the word. It's not like just hearing it is going to cause a person to be scarred for life.

 

This is your opinion. I don't share it. As a parent, I should get to decide when my child hears certain language, not a co op teacher, friend, neighbor or relative.

 

The adult who used the word (for any reason) to someone else's 11 year old child used bad judgment. I don't recall reading anywhere in this thread that someone felt the child "would be scarred for life".

[Kathleen in VA]

As others have pointed out, I think one needs to look at intent. The teacher intended to make the child aware that the phrase she used implied a swear word. Saying the word does not make the teacher a bad person or mean she intended harm to the child.

 

Had the teacher used the word at the child it would be a different matter. She used it to educate. Eleven is old enough to hear the word. It's not like just hearing it is going to cause a person to be scarred for life.

 

Ria,

 

I'm not sure it's possible to truly know the teacher's intent. That's where I take issue. Her remark, imo, sounded like she was annoyed or irritated. What I suppose (and others are free to suppose what they want) is that she didn't want to hear the phrase because in her own mind she kept filling in the blank with the f word and it caused her to be irritated. To say "don't do that around me" just sounds like she was thinking of herself - not necessarily wanting to keep this young girl from embarrassment at a later date. I propose that her intent was selfish and therefore rude and uncalled for. It's absolutely ridiculous that she actually used the offensive word in order to instruct the child not to use it. Absolutely insane (again, imo).

 

I also disagree that eleven years old is old enough to hear the word. Neither my 15 yo or my 11yo has ever heard that word. We live in a much different world that you and many others on this board do. Of course, my 18yo, 23yo and 24yo have heard it and they know its meaning and they know what WTF means when they see it on message boards, etc. I wish they didn't, but as you know, there comes a time when they must become aware, like or not. I choose to delay that time as long as possible. I'm the mom and I have that authority.

 

This teacher definitely overstepped her bounds - authority or not. She did not do it kindly either. She was wrong and she should be told she was wrong and she ought to apologize.

[Ria]

This is your opinion. I don't share it. As a parent, I should get to decide when my child hears certain language, not a co op teacher, friend, neighbor or relative.

 

 

Yes, you can decide, as long as you control the situation. In this case, the OP chose to enroll her child in a co-op. That infers that the mom is not going to be able to control everything. Welcome to reality.

 

The only way to maintain the sheltering you describe is to keep a child at home and carefully vet everyone who comes into contact with said child.

[AngelBee]

Me too.

I wanted to lyk that "Pray about it" is the best advice I have gotten all day. :)

 

:grouphug: