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I say "Yay for the lunch ladies"


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at a local high school that has been having big food fights in the cafeteria (the latest one on Tues, resulted in 5 students being suspended) the school notified all the parents that Wed, Thur and Fri that only cheese sandwiches (2 pieces of bread plus 1 piece of cheese) would be served. One parent was in the paper today saying that her dd went all day without eating because she would not eat the sandwich. Good thing I was not the reporter since I would have smacked the mom and said "Then why didn't you send her to school with a packed lunch?'' . The high school art teacher made up t-shirts for the lunch ladies that saays "DON'T MESS WITH THE LUNCH LADIES" and had a picture of a cheese sandwich on it.

 

I say Yay, lunch ladies, great action taken.

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Yeah, but all the kids have to suffer the consequences of the actions of a few kids. It won't kill them, but that is what happens all the time.

 

As a ps mom, I like the lunch ladies attitude also, BUT I know that all the kids are having to deal with the consequences of a few kids. This happens all the time.

 

For example, my dd was no longer allowed to have ketchup packets (previously provided by the school as a condiment) to go with her cafeteria food because some kids had been squirting them all over. I don't neccesarily think I should have to go buy ketchup packets to send with my dd to school.

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The consequences of taking for granted those who feed you. It seems perfectly reasonable. These kids are all old enough to pack a lunch if they didn't want a cheese sandwich, and they had warning. Go lunch ladies!

The issue of behavior problems aside, those children who are participants in the free lunch program, may not actually have the money/supplies to make their own lunch. And some families are shockingly low on the "nutritional IQ" scale. I had a friend in high school whose lunch was usually Cheetos or Doritos.

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HIGH FIVES TO THE LUNCH LADIES!!

 

Plus, I want one of those t-shirts. I'm not a lunch lady, nor do I ever plan to be a lunch lady, but hey, I'll bet it's a cool graphic!

 

astrid

 

Don't you ever feel like a lunch lady making food for your family :001_smile: I think these shirts would be perfect for anyone who has to cook for sometimes ungrateful family members.

 

Kelly

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The issue of behavior problems aside, those children who are participants in the free lunch program, may not actually have the money/supplies to make their own lunch. And some families are shockingly low on the "nutritional IQ" scale. I had a friend in high school whose lunch was usually Cheetos or Doritos.

 

This was my first thought as well.

 

I'm all for cracking down on the kids causing or participating in food fights. But what about the kids who NEED the lunch the school provides? Perhaps that's the only meal they actually get in a day, and for three days, that one meal was two slices of bread and a slice of cheese. I know that would certainly be the case for at least some of the kids in the major city that we live near.

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The kids on the free lunch program can have cheese sandwiches, too. I'm willing to bet provisions will be made for the rare instance that a child is allergic to cheese.

 

I think the lunch ladies are completely right. It's completely ridiculous to allow these students to make a horrendous mess and waste food, and expect someone else to clean it up for them.

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I want the t-shirt too!! If the child's family truly has no food at home to pack for a lunch, you'd think the kid would gratefully enjoy a cheese sandwich and try to find a way to discourage food fights so this didn't happen again... not turn up her nose at a cheese sandwich (much less mom going to reporters to whine).

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While I appreciate the spunk of the lunch ladies, I'm not really sure how their action is going to change *anything at all*. The issue isn't what's being made for lunch, but rather appears to be unruly, uncontrolled, under-supervised children, doing what kids do when they really need more attention.

 

ETA: I probably answered on a more serious note because I just find it really sad how many kids aren't getting what they need from public schools overall.

Edited by Julie in CA
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The issue isn't what's being made for lunch, but rather appears to be unruly, uncontrolled, under-supervised children, doing what kids do when they really need more attention.

 

These "kids" are in high school, and they shouldn't need to be supervised so that food fights don't break out.

 

Tara

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These "kids" are in high school, and they shouldn't need to be supervised so that food fights don't break out.

 

Tara

"Kids" who've had the lovely nurturing environment of their public school for probably a minimum of 6-7 hours every day for most of their lives. Sheesh. Not only are many of those kids statistically not likely to be equipped with the academic skills they need, but they haven't even *in 6-7 hours per day* been taught adequate social skills? :glare: Where's the "socialization" that's supposed to be going on? :confused: ;)

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"Kids" who've had the lovely nurturing environment of their public school for probably a minimum of 6-7 hours every day for most of their lives.

 

I went to public school and never participated in a food fight. Somehow I managed to figure out that it was not socially acceptable. I must be a genius or something. :D

 

Tara

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The kids on the free lunch program can have cheese sandwiches, too. I'm willing to bet provisions will be made for the rare instance that a child is allergic to cheese.

 

 

 

But that wouldn't be enough food-especially considering many of those kids probably don't get dinner when they get home-or if they do, it is a very small one. I just looked in my fridge-a slice of kraft cheese is 60 calories and 2 slices of bread are 160 calories. Even if the kids also got some milk (maybe another 150-200 cal), that isn't enough food for lunch for highschoolers. They'd be hungry by the end of the next class period. A cheese sandwich isn't very filling. Now maybe this school doesn't have one single free/reduced price lunch student, but we don't know that. I wonder if the school could lose its Fed lunch funding for doing something like this, I know the guidelines are quite strict on what has to be served at each meal.

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I think the Ladies are hoping that peer pressure might make the behavior change. A few food flingers got the entire school "in trouble"....and perhaps the next time some idiot starts to throw food the more intelligent in the group will shout out "remember the Cheese" instead of "Food Fight".

 

Ahhh, reason 1,432,393,283 why I homeschool. Though I am seriously considering bread and cheese next time my kids get unruly. Wonder if it will work?

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I went to public school and never participated in a food fight. Somehow I managed to figure out that it was not socially acceptable. I must be a genius or something. :D

 

Tara

 

Yeah, and my kids don't throw food at school either. I asked ds 14 if he thought the actions of the lunch ladies would stop them. Although he liked their spunk, too, he said the kids would maybe stop for awhile but would find other ways to cause trouble if they are stopped at lunch. Their actions are serving a function and until their needs are met they will find some way to satisfy that.

 

My kids get weary of suffering consequences of others. Yes, that is life. Yes, that sometimes happens at home as well. But, it is a bummer when all kids have to stay in for recess on a beautiful spring day because of the usual few. The "good" kids get sick of it. Some of the kids who cause the trouble actually *thrive* on this negative attention.

 

The notion that the kids who are *not throwing food* will somehow try to find a way to stop the food fights is absurd.

 

I also agree that there are students whose families rely on the lunch provided. Although my children do not get free/reduced lunches, I do use the school hot lunch program because it is convenient and cost efficient for me to do so. Therefore, I don't regularly keep "lunch supplies" for brown bagging during the school year. I pay in advance, so I'd be more than a little irritated to have to make a grocery store trip to buy that stuff.

 

Sadly, for many it *is* the only nutritious meal they may receive all day. The kids who are truly in this position (hungry) eat every bite and would not throw it (seeing is believing, and I've seen it).

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But what about the kids who NEED the lunch the school provides?

 

They eat the cheese sandwich. Nobody made them go WITHOUT food of any kind.

I can't imagine that a cheese sandwich is the worst thing-nutritionally speaking-that any of those kids have ever eaten.

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Perhaps a more appropriate consequence would be to lock the offenders in and make them clean it up. Though that wouldn't have worked in my old high school, since there were 3 seperate lunches and the next batch of kids would be waiting to get in and eat.

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They eat the cheese sandwich. Nobody made them go WITHOUT food of any kind.

I can't imagine that a cheese sandwich is the worst thing-nutritionally speaking-that any of those kids have ever eaten.

 

 

Ok-tomorrow, eat nothing but a cheese sandwich and maybe some milk at lunch and see how you feel. Would you be able to concentrate on anything but how hungry you were? Of course, you wouldn't get the full experience because you would have had decent food for weeks before this. Many of these kids haven't. Many of them only get a meal during school lunch (and maybe school breakfast if they are lucky). (Note, I don't mean this to sound snarky)

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They eat the cheese sandwich. Nobody made them go WITHOUT food of any kind.

I can't imagine that a cheese sandwich is the worst thing-nutritionally speaking-that any of those kids have ever eaten.

 

No, I'm sure that kids who rely on free or reduced lunches at school have eaten worse things, nutritionally speaking, than a cheese sandwich. Good grief, my own kids sure have, and none of them are getting school lunches. :tongue_smilie:

 

That wasn't my point.

 

My point was that there are plenty of kids whose families are so poor that school lunch very well may be the ONLY meal they get in a day.

 

I sure wouldn't want to have just two slices of bread and a slice of cheese to eat all day, for three days straight, just because some other unruly kids were throwing food. And I don't think I'd do that to a child, either. Or a person of any age, for that matter.

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Ok-tomorrow, eat nothing but a cheese sandwich and maybe some milk at lunch and see how you feel.

 

:001_huh:

 

I could tell you exactly how it feels without having to do it all over again.

I didn't grow up in a family that had much money and sometimes my best meal was wonderbread with margarine and a sprinkle of sugar.

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Sounds a lot like life.

 

Tara

:iagree:

The issue of behavior problems aside, those children who are participants in the free lunch program, may not actually have the money/supplies to make their own lunch. And some families are shockingly low on the "nutritional IQ" scale. I had a friend in high school whose lunch was usually Cheetos or Doritos.

They'll still get breakfast though. Mmmm, I remember free breakfast, sausage and pancake on a stick, cereal, burnt toast, every once in awhile some fruit.

 

I had to learn a lot of hard lessons growing up. Something like this would've been a drop in the bucket, but it would've contributed to one thing I was absolutely sure of by the time I was a teen. My children would always have options. I know that not everyone learns that from the humiliation of being the poorest kid in the room, but dh and I both did.

 

One day, one meal, will not cause long lasting health issues. There are plenty of people in this world that would be overwhelmingly grateful for one cheese sandwich. All the same, my money's on at least a few of these kids have learned that even being in the same building as slackers can screw things up for you.

This was my first thought as well.

 

I'm all for cracking down on the kids causing or participating in food fights. But what about the kids who NEED the lunch the school provides? Perhaps that's the only meal they actually get in a day, and for three days, that one meal was two slices of bread and a slice of cheese. I know that would certainly be the case for at least some of the kids in the major city that we live near.

Again, they will survive going hungry for one day. They must be starving all summer long, one school day won't break the camel's back.

 

I'm sorry, but the lunch ladies are trying to make and serve food to many many many people. I wouldn't expect them to pick out the culprits (some of whom, I'm sure would point fingers to fellow culprits and blame them). They're tired of watching their hard work flung all over the place, :shrug: it could've been worse, they could've just gone on strike.

 

Yeah, and my kids don't throw food at school either. I asked ds 14 if he thought the actions of the lunch ladies would stop them. Although he liked their spunk, too, he said the kids would maybe stop for awhile but would find other ways to cause trouble if they are stopped at lunch. Their actions are serving a function and until their needs are met they will find some way to satisfy that.

 

My kids get weary of suffering consequences of others. Yes, that is life. Yes, that sometimes happens at home as well. But, it is a bummer when all kids have to stay in for recess on a beautiful spring day because of the usual few. The "good" kids get sick of it. Some of the kids who cause the trouble actually *thrive* on this negative attention.

 

So, what should they have done?

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I sure wouldn't want to have just two slices of bread and a slice of cheese to eat all day, for three days straight, just because some other unruly kids were throwing food. And I don't think I'd do that to a child, either. Or a person of any age, for that matter.

 

:iagree:

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The problem that I would have with this is that *all* of the students were punished for the actions of specific ones.

 

I don't agree with that - yes, I know that "it's life" and it happens to us as adults yada yada yada ~ but I don't agree with it there either.

 

I think a better solution would have been to have the students who were involved in the food fights WORK in the cafeteria during lunch for a week or something.

 

If they have to serve others, they may gain a little more respect for those who are serving them. ;)

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:001_huh:

 

I could tell you exactly how it feels without having to do it all over again.

I didn't grow up in a family that had much money and sometimes my best meal was wonderbread with margarine and a sprinkle of sugar.

 

You guys had wonderbread? Dang! :tongue_smilie:

 

In all seriousness, there were times growing up that I can remember walking the roads and parking lots looking for loose change to buy a loaf of bread at the bread store. (Remember, half-price, day-old, freeze it now or eat it now because tomorrow it'll start to get moldy?) We ate a lot of ketchup and mayo sandwiches. (The mayo is for fat, ketchup was just for flavor.) I can remember being offered a bologna sandwich when I was 8 and asking if they had ketchup and mayo.

 

I frequently remind my daughter that the government says I have to feed her, but they don't say I have to feed her expensive take-out. PB&J is a perfectly adequate lunch. (Of course, she acts all wounded while she eats her whole-grain bread, all natural PB, all-fruit preserve sandwich. Which she chases with bgh-free milk and a banana or yogurt.)

Edited by dansamy
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I went to public school and never participated in a food fight. Somehow I managed to figure out that it was not socially acceptable. I must be a genius or something. :D

 

Tara

I don't think we're disagreeing about this. I have no big problem with what the lunch ladies are doing, I just think it's a waste of time/energy/food. The cheese sandwiches will likely be wasted, and it will not have done one thing to affect the behavior of the kids (and they *are* kids, whether you choose to define them as such or not) who are the offenders. I think a better solution would be for the administration of this school to step up and do what it takes (it is, after all, their job) to regain some measure of control over their own student population. Why is discipline of student behavior even a concern of the ladies who've been hired to prepare/serve food? :confused:

 

I guess it boils down to the simmering frustration I have about the cost of "education". One of the larger expenses in many school districts is administrative salaries, and our schools are failing on many fronts, notably academics. I guess I'm angry that if they often aren't doing the job of equipping students for academic success, *at least* teach them to behave a bit better than animals during the many, many hours these kids spend at school. :glare:

 

(I'm ok with it if you disagree with me on that...:001_smile:)

Edited by Julie in CA
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I had to learn a lot of hard lessons growing up. Something like this would've been a drop in the bucket, but it would've contributed to one thing I was absolutely sure of by the time I was a teen. My children would always have options. I know that not everyone learns that from the humiliation of being the poorest kid in the room, but dh and I both did.

 

One day, one meal, will not cause long lasting health issues. There are plenty of people in this world that would be overwhelmingly grateful for one cheese sandwich. All the same, my money's on at least a few of these kids have learned that even being in the same building as slackers can screw things up for you.

 

Again, they will survive going hungry for one day. They must be starving all summer long, one school day won't break the camel's back.

 

First of all, it wasn't one meal on one day. It was over multiple days. Secondly, it's not much of an argument to say "people survive with worse" as a reason to not do better. Yes, some people survive being beaten within an inch of their lives and raped by their uncle and eating a few bugs for dinner; that doesn't mean that it should be our POLICY to starve, abuse, and neglect children.

 

I think it's not correct to deprive kids who did NOTHING of food, particularly given that at least some of them really don't have other food options. I don't think it will endear those "good kids" to the school administration, any more than it would endear the police to you and make you more likely to "behave" if everyone got a ticket for drunk driving because some people in your town were overdoing it on the weekend. I just don't think that does anything other than make everyone band together against the "system." The school has proven that it doesn't care about individual students and sees them as a big group to be dealt with.

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My point was that there are plenty of kids whose families are so poor that school lunch very well may be the ONLY meal they get in a day.

 

 

 

Having worked with poor families in inner-city Philadelphia, I really don't think this is true. I think families that are so destitute that their kids get one meal a day, at school, are few and far between.

 

Tara

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First of all, it wasn't one meal on one day. It was over multiple days. Secondly, it's not much of an argument to say "people survive with worse" as a reason to not do better. Yes, some people survive being beaten within an inch of their lives and raped by their uncle and eating a few bugs for dinner; that doesn't mean that it should be our POLICY to starve, abuse, and neglect children.

 

I think it's not correct to deprive kids who did NOTHING of food, particularly given that at least some of them really don't have other food options. I don't think it will endear those "good kids" to the school administration, any more than it would endear the police to you and make you more likely to "behave" if everyone got a ticket for drunk driving because some people in your town were overdoing it on the weekend. I just don't think that does anything other than make everyone band together against the "system." The school has proven that it doesn't care about individual students and sees them as a big group to be dealt with.

At lunch, that's just what they are.

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Having worked with poor families in inner-city Philadelphia, I really don't think this is true. I think families that are so destitute that their kids get one meal a day, at school, are few and far between.

At my school, children also could get breakfasts, and perhaps a snack as well as lunch.

 

At any rate, a cheese sandwich does not meet the nutritional guidelines for food served, per the program requirements.

 

I don't think discipline issues and food should be combined -- refusing to feed a child is unlikely to result in better behavior. I don't believe in punishing someone for someone else's crime.

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Having worked with poor families in inner-city Philadelphia, I really don't think this is true. I think families that are so destitute that their kids get one meal a day, at school, are few and far between.

 

Tara

 

You're right. Destitute families usually qualify for enough social welfare programs to be able to feed themselves more than just the school lunch. The families on the cut-off lines are the ones truly at risk. The ones who don't make enough to be food secure, but make too much t get any significant assistance. Those are the kids who may eat only the school lunch/breakfast and nothing else, because there isn't anything else.

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Yeah, and my kids don't throw food at school either. I asked ds 14 if he thought the actions of the lunch ladies would stop them. Although he liked their spunk, too, he said the kids would maybe stop for awhile but would find other ways to cause trouble if they are stopped at lunch. Their actions are serving a function and until their needs are met they will find some way to satisfy that.

 

My kids get weary of suffering consequences of others. Yes, that is life. Yes, that sometimes happens at home as well. But, it is a bummer when all kids have to stay in for recess on a beautiful spring day because of the usual few. The "good" kids get sick of it. Some of the kids who cause the trouble actually *thrive* on this negative attention.

 

The notion that the kids who are *not throwing food* will somehow try to find a way to stop the food fights is absurd.

 

I also agree that there are students whose families rely on the lunch provided. Although my children do not get free/reduced lunches, I do use the school hot lunch program because it is convenient and cost efficient for me to do so. Therefore, I don't regularly keep "lunch supplies" for brown bagging during the school year. I pay in advance, so I'd be more than a little irritated to have to make a grocery store trip to buy that stuff.

 

Sadly, for many it *is* the only nutritious meal they may receive all day. The kids who are truly in this position (hungry) eat every bite and would not throw it (seeing is believing, and I've seen it).

 

I respectfully disagree. I was a counselor/social worker in my previous life, and one of the most effective programs I ever worked with used exactly this kind of peer pressure with this same age group. We worked with teenage boys who were court ordered to a lvl 6 Juvenile Justice program, so not the kind of kids who are naturally compliant, especially with adults/authority figures. But if they all missed lunch because of a few kids acting out and had to eat cold sandwiches instead, it didn't take them long to convince those few to knock it off. Usually by talking it out, occasionally by the rest of the group giving them the cold shoulder. A high school is a larger setting with a larger group, but the same principal applies.

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Ok so I just had to google this story. It appears they did this back in April as well in response to a cell phone coordinated food fight. Here is a link to the story in April.

 

http://www.pressofatlanticcity.com/news/breaking/article_a27fc050-48f3-11df-a883-001cc4c002e0.html

 

According to this article "Students are divided into six lunch groups, with three separate lunch periods in each of the two wings of the schoolĂ¢â‚¬â„¢s cafeteria. Nickles said only the group in which the food fight occurred was punished."

 

This seems fair to me. Not the entire school eats a only cheese sandwich, just the group of kids that were involved in the food fight.

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I went to public school and never participated in a food fight. Somehow I managed to figure out that it was not socially acceptable. I must be a genius or something. :D

 

Tara

 

I remember a kid once threw food in my high school cafeteria. The football coach who was monitoring picked him up and deposited him in the garbage can. Imagine the lawsuit if that happened today. :001_rolleyes:

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After reading the posts and the article that was posted I think most of the posts that feel sorry for the kids are not relative. In the article it says that the food fight was coordinated using cell phones. Excuse me if you are telling me that parents are providing kids with cell phones but can't provide food, we have serious issues. I am siding with the lunch ladies on this one.

I realize that some of the kids were punished that did not partake in the food fight and that is not fair. Get over it, life is not fair. At least you are getting something.

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I remember a kid once threw food in my high school cafeteria. The football coach who was monitoring picked him up and deposited him in the garbage can. Imagine the lawsuit if that happened today. :001_rolleyes:

 

No kidding! But I bet he didn't do that again. Now everyone's so worried about fragile little psyches being humiliated. I'm not advocating abuse by any means, but I'm sorry...a little humiliation and/or natural consequences can go a long way in deterring bad behavior!

 

I'm 100% behind the lunch ladies! As for the entire school being punished for the actions of a few, I'm not crying any tears over these kids. (And I was one of those who frequently had my best meal of the day at school, not because my parents couldn't afford to feed us, but because my dad worked out of town and my clinically-depressed mother made us eat cereal for breakfast and dinner.)

 

Not only is that kind of punishment reflective of real life in general, but it serves as a warning to the kids who might've wanted to participate in the food fight, but didn't: There's a consequence for bad behavior.

 

I also agree with the PP who said that this is actually a pretty effective way of handling such a situation. Just ask anyone who runs a military school or a boot-camp type of rehab program--it works.

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Having worked with poor families in inner-city Philadelphia, I really don't think this is true. I think families that are so destitute that their kids get one meal a day, at school, are few and far between.

 

Tara

 

Having worked with the poor in the inner city of Detroit, I can tell you that it unfortunately is not so rare here.

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I respectfully disagree. I was a counselor/social worker in my previous life, and one of the most effective programs I ever worked with used exactly this kind of peer pressure with this same age group. We worked with teenage boys who were court ordered to a lvl 6 Juvenile Justice program, so not the kind of kids who are naturally compliant, especially with adults/authority figures. But if they all missed lunch because of a few kids acting out and had to eat cold sandwiches instead, it didn't take them long to convince those few to knock it off. Usually by talking it out, occasionally by the rest of the group giving them the cold shoulder. A high school is a larger setting with a larger group, but the same principal applies.

 

If I'm reading this correctly, you used peer pressure from teenage boys who were 'in trouble' to exert the pressure? I could see that working, for sure, but I'm seeing that this lunchroom population is a heterogenous mix. I'm certainly not against discipline, far from it, but I don't agree that it is up to the kids doing the "right thing" to be responsible for exerting peer pressure. Perhaps this could work in in the lower elementary grades, but this is high school we are talking about.

 

The article someone linked quoted the admins to say this is effective and has been used for many years. If it is all that effective, why does it have to be used again? I guess for the new crop of high schoolers?

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I went to public school and never participated in a food fight. Somehow I managed to figure out that it was not socially acceptable. I must be a genius or something. :D

 

Tara

 

We figured out how to start the food fight without throwing food and then be all innocent as to why the fight started. :D that was fun! Until they really did lock us in and tell us to get it clean before we left. That wasn't fun! But could you imagine any school getting away with locking kids in a lunch room and making them do work???? That would create as much of an outrage as denying food.

 

And our high school coach would pick up your desk and slam it back down with you in it. :001_huh: God forbid what happened if you went to sleep!

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I'd like to give those lunch ladies a pat on the back but I just can't. There are much more appropriate consequences for those who participated in the food fight.

 

I was one of those girls in high school who usually skipped lunch to hang out in the quad with my boyfriend. I knew there was a kitchen full of food waiting for me when I got home. No biggie. There were kids in my school who had no food waiting on them, who depended on those free breakfasts and lunches to get them through the week. They were not the ones wasting food.

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