660 sf too small for 5 people?

[5Youngs]

Don't laugh.

I'm serious!

We've downsized from 2400 sf to 1500.

It's been fine, as we sold 1/2 of our stuff before moving.

No one has missed a thing!

We found a recreational property that is 20+ acres and a 660 sf log cabin.

It's adorable.

Very Little House on the Prairie. :D

The crazy thing is we are actually SERIOUSLY thinking about doing it!

We get DWELL magazine and I've been reading for a year about families living in NYC apts of 500-600 sf and making it.

Families in other countries would love to have 600 sf.

We would add on, obviously, but don't want to finance it.

We want to do it ourselves.

 

Coincidentally, maybe, there is a story in Dwell this month about a family of six that lived in a tent for two years and a shed for 10, so that the dad could build a 'green' house with his own two hands.

 

Has anyone done this?

Are we out of our minds? :D

Well, don't go THERE, keep to the house size~ :lol:

[4kiddies]

If the location will make it worthwhile than go for it! It's all about loction, location,location! Good luck!

[Orthodox6]

Can't help branching out from the house size. Please forgive !

 

Are there any utilities to this property? Electricity? Water (including a working well as a choice) ?

 

County services for fire and 911 ?

Distance to nearest hospital ?

 

For me, those are more "deal breakers" than the house size.

 

Sounds beautiful. Don't -- please don't ! -- tell me there are mountains and a lake included.

[Melinda in VT]

I would say yes, it's too small.

 

But we're up to our eyeballs in adding on to our 900 sq ft. We've been here almost 6 years and are now a family of 6, with kids ranging from 3-13.

 

How old are your kids? Would you have year-round use of outdoor space? How quickly could you add on? Do you have a pressing need to reduce your housing expenses and would this accomplish that goal?

 

I am a fan of small homes, sustainable living, etc., but I found that no matter how much I reduced our stuff, our small house size was getting in the way of how we wanted to live our lives.

[5Youngs]

It is 1/2 mile from public access to a HUGE, gorgeous lake with endless kayaking possibilities.

And in the Ozark mtns, which are more like large, rolling hills.

 

My hubby and I lived in MT for 2 yrs and L.O.V.E. the mountains.

We went on a fly fishing trip to WY a few weeks ago and decided that we like it better here.

The Rockies are gorgeous, but a little more rugged than I remembered.

I must have the four distinct seasons to be happy! :001_smile:

 

We want to buy a place now where we can retire later on.

It must be in the country and it must be a log or cedar cabin.

We can always build a bigger place or add on later.

 

15 minutes from a town with a hospital and all the 10,000 population amenities.

30 minutes from a 70,000 pop city.

[Orthodox6]

Give me a tent, and I'll come cook for you. I'm quite talented, people tell me.

 

Btw -- which "Ozarks" -- MO or AR ? (While growing up, I went with my parents to the AR section every summer.)

 

It is 1/2 mile from public access to a HUGE, gorgeous lake with endless kayaking possibilities.

And in the Ozark mtns, which are more like large, rolling hills.

 

My hubby and I lived in MT for 2 yrs and L.O.V.E. the mountains.

We went on a fly fishing trip to WY a few weeks ago and decided that we like it better here.

The Rockies are gorgeous, but a little more rugged than I remembered.

I must have the four distinct seasons to be happy! :001_smile:

 

We want to buy a place now where we can retire later on.

It must be in the country and it must be a log or cedar cabin.

We can always build a bigger place or add on later.

 

15 minutes from a town with a hospital and all the 10,000 population amenities.

30 minutes from a 70,000 pop city.

[Scuff]

Does it have a basement? How's the layout? We're in ~860sqft It's snug, but we have quite a bit of living space with the layout and using the basement. If we just had the upstairs or if it was laid out like a regular house with a hallway, I don't know. (It's basically a big rectangle cut into 4 rooms) Having a basement gives us a playroom/schoolroom/office. And that allows us to easily cram 3 kids into one room and have uncluttered, open living space upstairs.

 

I will add that it's not as bad as it sounds. If you get rid of all your extraneous things and just keep what you use regularly, love or really want, it can be quite livable. You can get pretty creative with storage too. I've learned that vertical storage is my friend.

Edited September 10, 2009 by Scuff
more thoughts

[5Youngs]

It has all utilities.

 

We would be living under our means.

That's the whole idea.

We had the 'American dream, complete with perfect backyard and professional range' and I was not any happier.

It was actually a disappointment that it wasn't a big deal to us once we achieved it! :001_huh:

 

I grew up a bohemian lifestyle in 900 sf for 5 people and it didn't seem that small.

 

Three boys, 12, 11 and 6 yrs old who actually get along.

There are two huge covered porches that could be screened in immediately.

And we would spend a LOT of time outside.

That's half of the reason that we want to be there~

 

You guys are awesome!!!!!!!

[BikeBookBread]

Much of the world does it! Why not you? :) I'd say go for it. Pick up a copy of "The Not So Big House" or any of Susanka's books for inspiration and practical info on how to eek every square inch out of it.

 

Though much larger than your cabin, the four of us do quite well in 1700...much smaller than any of our friends. It keeps us light on our feet. I could easily go smaller. We only live in three of the four bedrooms anyway, (two for sleeping, one as a gym/office/bookshelves/storage). I think we could all go much smaller if we put our minds to it!

[gingersmom]

I live in NYC for many years and my family still lives there. My apartment was 800 square feet and that was for me, 2 large dogs and a cat. I can't imagine 5 people living there. I would not be sure where we would all sleep.

 

I don't know anyone in NYC who is a family of five living in 500 square feet. That is about the size of the average studio in NYC.

[5Youngs]

Give me a tent, and I'll come cook for you. I'm quite talented, people tell me.

 

Btw -- which "Ozarks" -- MO or AR ? (While growing up, I went with my parents to the AR section every summer.)

 

Arkansas~

You are MORE than welcome.

We'll lay on hammocks and read all day, okay?! :D

[happygrrl]

We did this! 20 acres off the grid, tiny cabin hand built in the early '70s. My kids were small, though, but then again one summer we had many long-term adult guests; 3 all the way to 8 extra!

I have to say it was very hard in moments, but we look back on that as an amazingly sweet time. Now we have the land paid off and the green house my husband is building is almost finished. Worth every drop of sweat, I promise you.

 

I have to get back to school now- please PM me if I don't get back to this thread again (it means I have lost it, I am pretty busy right now with said house project!)

[5Youngs]

I live in NYC for many years and my family still lives there. My apartment was 800 square feet and that was for me, 2 large dogs and a cat. I can't imagine 5 people living there. I would not be sure where we would all sleep.

 

I don't know anyone in NYC who is a family of five living in 500 square feet. That is about the size of the average studio in NYC.

 

The articles are ALWAYS architects who strip the apt bare and custom design the space. I'm talking floor boards that come up and there is storage for all of the toys, etc. It always baffles me~

[Laura Corin]

We've had four in 750 square feet and no outdoor space. It had two bathrooms, so with just one bathroom it would have been closer to what you are talking about. It was pretty tight, but an outdoor space would have made all the difference.

 

Laura

[5Youngs]

We did this! 20 acres off the grid, tiny cabin hand built in the early '70s. My kids were small, though, but then again one summer we had many long-term adult guests; 3 all the way to 8 extra!

I have to say it was very hard in moments, but we look back on that as an amazingly sweet time. Now we have the land paid off and the green house my husband is building is almost finished. Worth every drop of sweat, I promise you.

 

I have to get back to school now- please PM me if I don't get back to this thread again (it means I have lost it, I am pretty busy right now with said house project!)

 

YOU GUYS ARE MY HEROES!

And LCCers too?!

Kindred spirits~

[phathui5]

There are two huge covered porches that could be screened in immediately.

 

 

I think that would really help.

[AuntieM]

It is 1/2 mile from public access to a HUGE, gorgeous lake with endless kayaking possibilities.

And in the Ozark mtns, which are more like large, rolling hills.

 

My hubby and I lived in MT for 2 yrs and L.O.V.E. the mountains.

We went on a fly fishing trip to WY a few weeks ago and decided that we like it better here.

The Rockies are gorgeous, but a little more rugged than I remembered.

I must have the four distinct seasons to be happy! :001_smile:

 

We want to buy a place now where we can retire later on.

It must be in the country and it must be a log or cedar cabin.

We can always build a bigger place or add on later.

 

15 minutes from a town with a hospital and all the 10,000 population amenities.

30 minutes from a 70,000 pop city.

 

I'd try to cram us all in for that setting!

 

Honestly, I would say yes if you don't need a lot of "stuff." Sounds like you have already learned to simplify and it would just be another step along that road. I would so love that minimalist style of life, just make mine a cottage at the beach...

 

One thing to consider is teaching/schooling time. I have 3 Jr/Sr High kids who need quiet space, plus a 4yodd who bounces around looking for adventure. On top of that dh who must maintain an office at home and spend appx 50% of his work week therein. If we could fit into 660 square feet, it would have to be 660-perfectly-floorplanned square feet.

 

If you feel you could do it and have the proper study space, go for it! Sounds absolutely charming!

 

ETA - Here I am sounding sexist again, but I honestly think it would be easier to endure with your three boys than with daughters. At least my girls seem to be the packrats of the family...

Edited September 10, 2009 by AuntieM
got the #s wrong the first time

[Renee in NC]

It has all utilities.

 

We would be living under our means.

That's the whole idea.

We had the 'American dream, complete with perfect backyard and professional range' and I was not any happier.

It was actually a disappointment that it wasn't a big deal to us once we achieved it! :001_huh:

 

I grew up a bohemian lifestyle in 900 sf for 5 people and it didn't seem that small.

 

Three boys, 12, 11 and 6 yrs old who actually get along.

There are two huge covered porches that could be screened in immediately.

And we would spend a LOT of time outside.

That's half of the reason that we want to be there~

 

You guys are awesome!!!!!!!

 

I think you absolutely could do it! As long as you have a shed or some other storage building, it wouldn't be that hard.

[TammyinTN]

I would do it in a heartbeat. :001_smile:

[SeekingSimplicity]

I would! And take nothing with me but a few changes of clothes for everyone and some basic kitchen supplies. Well, a few other things you can't live with out... toiletries, etc... you know what I mean :P

 

We've been talking about building a 600 sf house, one we can pay for as we build it. Then planning it to where we can add on as we're able too and have built in furniture to save space. It'll be barn shaped and built in stages. The first will be a storage/bath/kitchen/dining/living area-- a long rectangle. The next will be the same size and shape as the first, but will be divided into 3 bedrooms. There will be an open courtyard in the middle, that'll be our porch to start with, but we'll have the option of closing it in for a living room or whatever. Then we'll eventually build a loft for extra storage and beds.

Finally we're going to buy a (500-600 sf) log cabin from some Amish people that live around here. We can build it and have it moved for about $4000. It will be attached to the front of the house so it looks more like a log cabin from the front than a barn. When we're done we'll have lots of space, and it will all be paid for.

Now whether or not all this actually happens is another story. But that's our plans.

[5Youngs]

It's a beautiful plan, seekingsimplicity!

I hope it comes to fruition for you~

[lionfamily1999]

It has all utilities.

 

We would be living under our means.

That's the whole idea.

We had the 'American dream, complete with perfect backyard and professional range' and I was not any happier.

It was actually a disappointment that it wasn't a big deal to us once we achieved it! :001_huh:

 

I grew up a bohemian lifestyle in 900 sf for 5 people and it didn't seem that small.

 

Three boys, 12, 11 and 6 yrs old who actually get along.

There are two huge covered porches that could be screened in immediately.

And we would spend a LOT of time outside.

That's half of the reason that we want to be there~

 

You guys are awesome!!!!!!!

Who gets to sleep on the porches during the summer?!?

 

 

So LUCKY!

[*********]

Dh and I have dear friends that recently returned to the US after being missionaries to India. They live out of a RV. They travel the US. They don't have a house, just a truck that pulls their RV. They homeschool. Oh, and they have four children, ages 8 down to 1.

 

The wife told me how much nicer the RV is than their place in India was. She was VERY grateful for it.

 

They are sweet, wonderful, beautiful people, who don't need 'things' to be happy. Their children are literally the most wonderful children I know, next to my own. :001_smile:

 

The lived in their RV in our driveway for a month. Not sure the neighbors loved it, but it was a great time for all of us. I learned a lot from them.

 

I think you could do it, for sure.

[Tutor]

I would do it in a heartbeat! Sounds lovely. And with three boys able to help out with expanding or building out-buildings - even better!

[elegantlion]

You can always make a house bigger, but you can't add land. I say go for it. Our first house was 600sf, no basement.

 

buy a tent, buy a small travel trailer if necessary, but it sounds wonderful.

[Quiver0f10]

I would do it in a heartbeat. We will be doing something similar eventually.

[babysparkler]

I would do it in a heartbeat! Sounds lovely. And with three boys able to help out with expanding or building out-buildings - even better!

:iagree:

[Macrina]

We're in a 300 sq foot area right now, we're on month 6. We're building green and will be in a 600 sq foot by fall 2010. We'll add on and have 900 sq ft by Fall 2011. Were building green and going to be debt free by 2018.

 

I wonder about your situation in the winter. 600 sq ft in the winter may be OK for one winter but it will get old quickly- will you be able to add on? A yurt even, just another 300 sq ft within a year?

[CatMomof3]

If you don't take I will :D

[aggieamy]

It sounds just wonderful. If it was me with that opportunity I'd start packing and holding garage sales to get rid of the extra stuff. Lucky girl! Go for it and enjoy your adventure.

[Happy]

We lived in a two bedroom furnished apartment in Belgium just about that size. We had two teenagers and the two of us. We left most of our worldly goods in storage in Texas and moved with our clothes, a few dishes, a big pile of books and homeschool material. The boys had bunk beds. The kitchen was TINY, and we still cooked up a storm.

 

We had a small balcony and a giant window to the world. We had terrific friends who lived upstairs and a small playground. Best of all we lived within walking distance of not one, but three French bakeries. :0) And, it was Brussels, an amazing city. When we got cabin fever, we traveled. I loved that my family had to learn to share one bathroom. ;)

 

To me, having the great outdoors at your disposal makes a LOT of difference. The big porches sound ideal! The lake, drool worthy.

 

Also...we had a couple of parties in our Brussels apartment. For my youngest son's birthday there were 23 people in there. It was cozy, and oh so much fun. I really hate it now when my friends who live in 3000 sq. ft. places say they don't have room to host a few people. :001_huh:

 

Have an escape route if this doesn't turn out to be something you can embrace, but I'd say give it a whirl.

[amanda]

I would do it in a heartbeat as well. My husband and I are currently going back to school. We are in a 800 sf. apartment with 4 kids. It can be done.

[5Youngs]

We're in a 300 sq foot area right now, we're on month 6. We're building green and will be in a 600 sq foot by fall 2010. We'll add on and have 900 sq ft by Fall 2011. Were building green and going to be debt free by 2018.

 

I wonder about your situation in the winter. 600 sq ft in the winter may be OK for one winter but it will get old quickly- will you be able to add on? A yurt even, just another 300 sq ft within a year?

 

Hooray for you!:D

The winter would be interesting.

We're used to entertaining ourselves, no tv except for dvds and lots of books and projects.

Sticks, wooden swords and their bows keep my boys entertained for days.

Legos are their most valued possessions.

My books and wooden knitting needles are mine!

And my artisan jewelry business that I run out of the home.

We'll build a little studio for me and I'll be ecstatic~

I go to shows a few times a month, so it's not like we'll be stranded there or anything.

Plus, the grandparents live within a couple of hours from the cabin.

 

We actually talked about a yurt.

There is another 600 sf storage bldg on the property.

It is an older cabin.

Haven't seen the inside of it yet.

We will tomorrow~

[unsinkable]

Who gets to sleep on the porches during the summer?!?

 

 

So LUCKY!

 

I think the porches should be utilized for the WTM 2010 Summer Camp Extravaganza that 5Youngs should host.

 

:lol:

[justamouse]

I have a family of 9 in 1100 SF and it is a NIGHTMARE. We are moving, so there is that, but are you going to be able to hang tough till you get the space you need? What if you want to can and don't have the room? Room for all the kids winter stuff not being in front of the door? THAT's the kind of space you need.

[KingM]

We are 6 people in 950 square feet and it's tough. Our mixed gender twins are sharing a room at almost 10 and our oldest son is almost fourteen and sharing a room with his preschooler youngest brother.

 

We all have deadlines and fight for the single bathroom every morning. I really just want privacy when I'm in there taking my shower, but kids are coming and going, using the bathroom and brushing teeth.

 

We're currently building an addition with an extra bedroom and bathroom, so the problem should be permanently resolved in just a few more weeks.

[SonshineLearner]

Triple bunkbeds:-) Of course, I'd want air conditioning. No heating bills, cuz you'll have wood...and a wood stove, right? And that'll be easy to heat up!. If I was gonna stay there, I'd think basement being put in...might be a good way to add on.... Just one large room for when the weather isn't good:-) And, to keep all the school stuff in...

Carrie:-)

[aggieamy]

I think the porches should be utilized for the WTM 2010 Summer Camp Extravaganza that 5Youngs should host.

 

:lol:

 

I agree. Is it too soon to RSVP for this fun? I'll bring cookies or brownies - your choice!

[Pamela H in Texas]

I think it just depends. We had 7 in about 800 sq ft and were perfectly happy. These days, I feel I need more than 2400 for just 4 of us. But I also liked the idea of one of those mini homes or an RV which would have us (and two dogs) in just a couple hundred sq ft total.

 

I think it's more about attitude.

[Orthodox6]

Don't people choose those geodesic domes anymore ? Not "colonial" or "pioneer" style enough for a beautiful mountain property ?

 

http://www.monolithic.com/

 

We drive past this place every time we visit in-laws (mine or his).

[Melinda in VT]

Hooray for you!:D

The winter would be interesting.

We're used to entertaining ourselves, no tv except for dvds and lots of books and projects.

Sticks, wooden swords and their bows keep my boys entertained for days.

Legos are their most valued possessions.

My books and wooden knitting needles are mine!

And my artisan jewelry business that I run out of the home.

We'll build a little studio for me and I'll be ecstatic~

I go to shows a few times a month, so it's not like we'll be stranded there or anything.

Plus, the grandparents live within a couple of hours from the cabin.

 

We actually talked about a yurt.

There is another 600 sf storage bldg on the property.

It is an older cabin.

Haven't seen the inside of it yet.

We will tomorrow~

 

The items I've bolded are the ones that would give me pause. We had to get rid of a lot of books to fit into our space. Would you have room for bookshelves?

 

And what kind of projects? Where would you work on them? We have one table, so projects all need to be moved or cleaned up when it's time to eat. Where will they go then?

 

And this goes double for your jewelry business. Will you be able to immediately build the studio? If not, what will you do in the meantime? Will you have need to haul your material in from the storage building every time you want to make a piece of jewelry? Will you have room for your business paperwork?

 

And I would carefully consider where all the boots and jackets will live.

 

On the one hand, it sounds wonderful. But I'm a firm believer in thinking through the day-to-day practicalities and making sure you can live with those.

[Cera]

Go to Ikea and pick up triple bunks (or Flexa which has a full size triple) and you could put all three boys in one room. They sound like the perfect ages to really enjoy the space to roam and not be too bothered by the close quarters inside. Also, once you screen the porches you have livable space for dining and relaxing and a 600sf outbuilding would make a great jewelry studio/schoolroom if you finished it.

 

I would go for it but I am a bit sick of scrubbing three bathrooms every week and living in a city with all the people and traffic.

[5Youngs]

I agree. Is it too soon to RSVP for this fun? I'll bring cookies or brownies - your choice!

 

You are ALL invited if we buy it!

How about a fall retreat instead?

We homeschool year round so that we can take the fall off when we are itching to be outside~

[5Youngs]

The items I've bolded are the ones that would give me pause. We had to get rid of a lot of books to fit into our space. Would you have room for bookshelves?

 

And what kind of projects? Where would you work on them? We have one table, so projects all need to be moved or cleaned up when it's time to eat. Where will they go then?

 

And this goes double for your jewelry business. Will you be able to immediately build the studio? If not, what will you do in the meantime? Will you have need to haul your material in from the storage building every time you want to make a piece of jewelry? Will you have room for your business paperwork?

 

And I would carefully consider where all the boots and jackets will live.

 

On the one hand, it sounds wonderful. But I'm a firm believer in thinking through the day-to-day practicalities and making sure you can live with those.

 

I got rid of all of the books that didn't have to have when we moved here.

The kitchen table doubles for whatever we need it for.

 

My business can be done anywhere, right now it's the kitchen counter, a work bench and the coffee table. ;)

We would build the studio right away.

Paperwork is contained in a nice, neat file box and on my computer.

 

You guys are so great for thinking about the little things that I would overlook! I really appreciate you~ :001_smile:

 

***Hubby is there looking at it and says that there is an older hunting cabin on the property that could easily be fixed up and made livable. It could be used as storage and my studio.

[EKS]

I'm sure you could swing it. You would need to use space very creatively. Have you read Hard Times in Paradise by the Colfaxes of homeschooling fame? I think it's out of print but your library might have it. I think they had either two or three kids at the time and they were living in a tent trailer.

 

This sounds like an exciting opportunity! Let us know what your decision is.

[Scuff]

Go to Ikea and pick up triple bunks (or Flexa which has a full size triple) and you could put all three boys in one room. They sound like the perfect ages to really enjoy the space to roam and not be too bothered by the close quarters inside. Also, once you screen the porches you have livable space for dining and relaxing and a 600sf outbuilding would make a great jewelry studio/schoolroom if you finished it.

 

I would go for it but I am a bit sick of scrubbing three bathrooms every week and living in a city with all the people and traffic.

 

 

Ikea has triple bunk bed?! Are the expensive?

[lionfamily1999]

I always wanted a bed like they had in the Mickey Mouse cartoon where they went on the trip in the camper. If you could hook the house up like that camper was set up, I would live there with you happily.

 

 

 

I can't remember the name of the cartoon, but it was Donald, Goofy and Mickey going on some trip. The bathtub was zipped closed at the top, the alarm clock ripped the blankets off Donald, spanked his feet and then closed the bed up... that's going to drive me crazy now :P

 

 

Oh, and I can always do a retreat. Are we allowed to camp and have fires? There's nothing like tasteless mush cooked over a fire during cold, we weather (whenever we camp it is cold and wet, be forwarned).

[HRAAB]

You can do it. My dh grew up in a family of 14 kids. I can't tell you the square footage, but the ground level had a very, very small kitchen, eating area big enough for a table, living room, one small bathroom and one small bedroom. The basement had two bedrooms: one for the boys, one for the girls. The house was small although bigger than 660 sq. ft. but there were 16 people in it. But they had 6 acres outside; that is where they spent their time. They all survived quite nicely, too.

 

It sounds like an absolute dream to me. For a long time we've been looking for something similar, but can't find anything affordable. So maybe we should check out the Ozarks?

 

Janet

[ereks mom]

I think it just depends. ...These days, I feel I need more than 2400 for just 4 of us. But I also liked the idea of one of those mini homes or an RV...

 

I think it's more about attitude.

 

How many bedrooms? Is there a space (indoors, I mean) where the kids could go to get away from one another when they need some space? Any place YOU can go for privacy from all those males? LOL! ;)

[Orthodox6]

The musings about beds makes me want to go pull out our copy of the Marx Brothers film, "The Big Store". Anybody else love that scene where they are selling beds, and children disappear into the walls, offspring are swapped between families, and so on down the madcap routine ?