Advice, resources re online predator and young adult

[Harriet Vane]

I need resources and advice for someone whose 20yo daughter has an online “boyfriend” who is abusive, has video. They have never met in real life. Daughter is not yet willing to cut contact but is crying a lot and intensely anxious. 

--Would it be helpful for her to talk to the police?

--Books, articles, resources?

 

Edited to add: To be crystal clear, this is not my daughter. This is the daughter of someone in my circle of acquaintance.

Edited May 13, 2023 by Harriet Vane

[Paige]

I'm so sorry you all are dealing with this. I don't have any BTDT advice, but wanted to offer sympathy.

I think if there's blackmail involved, then definitely police. Who knows how many people he's doing this to? I'd also reassure her that she's not in trouble, you support her, etc. I know a lot of young people think other people care or judge far more about whatever mistakes other people make than anyone does- and especially loved ones. 

[ScoutTN]

Yes, the police! They will be helpful, not mean. They will work on tracking the predator. They have officers that just do this. So important! 

Edited May 13, 2023 by ScoutTN

[bolt.]

It's complex, and I'm not sure about a whole plan -- but one thing that has been found to be powerful is to try to 'pull the claws' of the video.

If he wants to send embarrassing sexual videos (or non-sexual ones) to her loved one, make sure she knows that *no one* is interested in watching such a thing from beginning to end (who would?!!!??) and that anyone who loves her will feel empathy not judgement if they are the 'audience' for such revenge. And that many people who love her have seen at least a few glimpses of her naked body before this (ie during childhood, helping a child dress/wash/etc.) and it's nothing new to a mother especially.

So the mom of this young woman can say, "Tell him to go ahead and send me stupid videos of you! I'll watch the first second or two before I figure out what it is. Then I'll delete it. And so would anyone else! Nobody would watch it! And the first glimpses are no big deal. I changed your diapers! He can't surprise me!"

[Katy]

Yes, police

[Spryte]

Police.

But also — daughter needs a therapist on her side. A good one. Preferably someone good with trauma. The family of the daughter may have a hard time viewing what the daughter is living through as trauma because it was online, but it’s been real to her. She’s been victimized.

I would also be looking at deleting all accounts and opening new, anonymous SM accounts. Phone, too. 

So sorry she’s going through this.

Edited May 13, 2023 by Spryte

[fairfarmhand]

54 minutes ago, bolt. said:

It's complex, and I'm not sure about a whole plan -- but one thing that has been found to be powerful is to try to 'pull the claws' of the video.

If he wants to send embarrassing sexual videos (or non-sexual ones) to her loved one, make sure she knows that *no one* is interested in watching such a thing from beginning to end (who would?!!!??) and that anyone who loves her will feel empathy not judgement if they are the 'audience' for such revenge. And that many people who love her have seen at least a few glimpses of her naked body before this (ie during childhood, helping a child dress/wash/etc.) and it's nothing new to a mother especially.

So the mom of this young woman can say, "Tell him to go ahead and send me stupid videos of you! I'll watch the first second or two before I figure out what it is. Then I'll delete it. And so would anyone else! Nobody would watch it! And the first glimpses are no big deal. I changed your diapers! He can't surprise me!"

For real. Anyone at all who loves her might open the video and then go "Oh GEEZ! That's Susie!" Click it closed and then think badly of the weirdo disgusting pervert who would distribute something so mean. I guarantee no dad, brother, cousin, or friend will want to see the whole thing. They will all be enraged that someone was abusing her and using the video as blackmail.

[Bootsie]

I am sorry she is experiencing this.  Maybe I misread the post, but I didn't jump from "has video" to thinking that he has video that he may be using to blackmail her with.  I took "has video" as  her having video of his abusive behavior.  Did I misread this?

[El...]

I'm pretty sure distributing video of private behavior without consent is illegal in every state. Assuming that's the situation, I'd definitely call the non-emergency line and connect with a detective that handles that sort of thing. If that's what is going on. 

I'm so sorry. How messed up.

[KSera]

There was a news story about this today. It linked to this FBI site: https://www.fbi.gov/how-we-can-help-you/safety-resources/scams-and-safety/common-scams-and-crimes/sextortion

The focus is teens though , so I don’t know the repercussions in the case of adults. 

[Murphy101]

Yes to not worrying about family and true friends and the police and therapist.

But also. She needs a lawyer.

A lawyer will tell her all the many ways she can turn the tables to make him regret his behavior.

[ScoutTN]

Definitely a trauma therapist too! 

[Farrar]

I'm also unclear about the "has video." If it is a video that he's threatening to show to others or that could be revenge p*** then as I understand it, you can't always stop the person before it's out there. But the flip side is that an abuser is likely to send/release it regardless, so it's better to treat the situation as if that ship has sailed.

[Harriet Vane]

Guy has video of her.

[Harriet Vane]

57 minutes ago, Farrar said:

I'm also unclear about the "has video." If it is a video that he's threatening to show to others or that could be revenge p*** then as I understand it, you can't always stop the person before it's out there. But the flip side is that an abuser is likely to send/release it regardless, so it's better to treat the situation as if that ship has sailed.

Yup. He has video of her. Trying to deal with her feelings and also show her he is coercive, abusive. I won’t go into detail—this is not a boyfriend situation. It is a predator. 
 

Edited to clarify—She refers to him as her boyfriend. They have never met in real life. He is definitely a predator with all the classic, textbook behaviors of a predator.

Edited May 13, 2023 by Harriet Vane

[Not_a_Number]

Like an inappropriate video he could blackmail her with? I’m still not following.

She’s an adult and there isn’t a ton to do here but be supportive, I think. And maybe see if she can keep records of anything threatening?

[gardenmom5]

I would definitely report to the police.  There are *scammers* out there who do this to kids, then extort money from them.  Some of these kids have committed suicide since they are so embarrassed and can't see a way out.

Her parents are going to need to know everything she's sent to him, in order to protect her.  any bank numbers? anything?

[gardenmom5]

5 hours ago, bolt. said:

It's complex, and I'm not sure about a whole plan -- but one thing that has been found to be powerful is to try to 'pull the claws' of the video.

If he wants to send embarrassing sexual videos (or non-sexual ones) to her loved one, make sure she knows that *no one* is interested in watching such a thing from beginning to end (who would?!!!??) and that anyone who loves her will feel empathy not judgement if they are the 'audience' for such revenge. And that many people who love her have seen at least a few glimpses of her naked body before this (ie during childhood, helping a child dress/wash/etc.) and it's nothing new to a mother especially.

So the mom of this young woman can say, "Tell him to go ahead and send me stupid videos of you! I'll watch the first second or two before I figure out what it is. Then I'll delete it. And so would anyone else! Nobody would watch it! And the first glimpses are no big deal. I changed your diapers! He can't surprise me!"

It's questionable that he even has phone numbers or email addresses of friends/family members.  There's a lot of bluff in their garbage.

[gardenmom5]

1 hour ago, Harriet Vane said:

Guy has video of her.

That's pretty broad.  We're all assuming dirty video that he's using for sextortion.  More and more states are passing laws so they can more easily prosecute this type of stuff.

[Spryte]

There was a fairly recent long-form article on this topic. I’ll try to find it and link, if I can. My takeaway, though, was that often these predators will ask for more and more compromising videos, and threaten to send the ones they already have to friends, parents, etc if refused. So I would want to talk to daughter and make sure she doesn’t fall prey to that type of demand and send more. It’s a hole that gets deeper and deeper.

I know I already suggested a therapist, but wanted to add: if daughter is crying a lot and experiencing anxiety, I would consider meds, too. If she has a primary doc — go. Share the story, get more and more validation that she’s been victimized and more and more help. Get a therapist. Call the police. With each time she tells her story comes more and more validation that this was wrong, that she can get help, that’s there is a way out of this. She’s probably feeling pretty isolated, miserable and desperate right now, and the predator has played on all those feelings. My instinct is that daughter needs a huge support system building around her, like a protective wall.

[ScoutTN]

This is something to move quickly on. If she goes to meet him, she will be trafficked or killed. 

[gardenmom5]

Contact the police, the FBI may have people that specialize in this.  (it's usually interstate.)
NEVER talk to him without a *rational* adult present.

[Bootsie]

I am not sure that I am following the situation, but it sounds to me like she has a "boyfriend" that she has never met personally, who her family thinks is abusive and coercive.  She wants him to be her "boyfriend" and is not interested in ending contact with him.  If that is the case and she is 20 years old, I don't see that going to the police will be helpful.  I would be concerned that if she sees him as her boyfriend, thinking that her parents are trying to end the "relationship" by going to the police might drive her to meet with him.  

It sounds as if she needs a lot of family support, and probably the support of counselfor, to see that this is not a healthy relationship.  If she is choosing to remain in contact with him, there is not much that the police can do unless there is a specific crime that he can be charged with.  

[Not_a_Number]

Just now, Bootsie said:

I am not sure that I am following the situation, but it sounds to me like she has a "boyfriend" that she has never met personally, who her family thinks is abusive and coercive.  She wants him to be her "boyfriend" and is not interested in ending contact with him.  If that is the case and she is 20 years old, I don't see that going to the police will be helpful.  I would be concerned that if she sees him as her boyfriend, thinking that her parents are trying to end the "relationship" by going to the police might drive her to meet with him.  

It sounds as if she needs a lot of family support, and probably the support of counselfor, to see that this is not a healthy relationship.  If she is choosing to remain in contact with him, there is not much that the police can do unless there is a specific crime that he can be charged with.  

That's what I'm seeing as well, although I'm also not entirely clear on what's happening. 

It sounds like a hard and frustrating situation -- one of these situations where you can see more clearly than the person who is involved in it, but can't necessarily change the course of events immediately. (And even eventually, you may only get a few chances to help out, and they'd require very good judgment.) 

[Mrs Tiggywinkle Again]

47 minutes ago, gardenmom5 said:

Contact the police, the FBI may have people that specialize in this.  (it's usually interstate.)
NEVER talk to him without a *rational* adult present.

I can’t find any information though when the victim is over 18.  She sent the images willingly, it sounds like, and it’s perfectly legal to do so as an adult.  And it sounds like she thinks she’s in love with this person and doesn’t want to cut off contact.  It’s almost like the elderly women who have a long distance boyfriend or preacher or whatever who they send vast amounts of money too—you can’t stop them and it’s not technically illegal, but until/unless they’re threatened or harassed, everyone’s hands are pretty tied.

[stripe]

https://988lifeline.org for mental health crises

https://www.fbi.gov/how-we-can-help-you/safety-resources/scams-and-safety/common-scams-and-crimes/sextortion says “Contact your local FBI field office, call 1-800-CALL-FBI” and also recommends contacting Victim Services 

https://www.fbi.gov/how-we-can-help-you/victim-services

 

[Harriet Vane]

I appreciate all that you all have offered, most especially the specific links.

Suffice it to say this young woman is deeply and obviously unhappy, but does not fully realize how abusive this is and is reluctant to shut the door on the relationship. She is young and vulnerable and naive and he is a predator. I will not be offering more specifics.

I would greatly appreciate any articles, books, or links, particularly anything that might resonate with a young adult. 

Thanks.

[Teaching3bears]

Even though she is an adult and may have sent him the videos willingly, is it not illegal for him to threaten to send them to her family.  Can the police not stop him from doing so?  Can they not seize the videos before he sends them?  

[stripe]

Hope some of these help:

https://www.cnn.com/2023/05/13/us/brandon-guffey-gavin-sextortion-law-cec/index.html

https://abcnews.go.com/US/parents-teenager-died-by-suicide-after-sextortion-scam-urge/story?id=99047305

https://abc7chicago.com/what-is-sextortion-meaning-fbi-chicago/13096343/

https://www.justice.gov/usao-vi/pr/fbi-and-partners-issue-national-public-safety-alert-financial-sextortion-schemes

https://cyberbullying.org Including https://cyberbullying.org/sextortion-more-insight-into-the-experiences-of-youth

https://www.ice.gov/features/sextortion

https://www.missingkids.org/theissues/onlineenticement

https://www.missingkids.org/gethelpnow/isyourexplicitcontentoutthere

https://stopncii.org (For adult victims; version for minors at https://takeitdown.ncmec.org )

I don’t know if there are many novels about this, but I do remember Goodbye Stranger by Rebecca Stead, which is aimed at middle schoolers about the social media explosion when someone distributes racy photos a girl had shared of herself in a swimsuit.

These may or may not be appropriate, but in case they’re useful: the New York Times has a list of novels dealing with sexual assault and Bookriot has a list of three YA books about vigilante justice after sexual assault and another list of YA books about social media. 

[Jhwk21]

If he's threatening, harassing, or coercing her, she should absolutely ask the police about filing a report. I'm not sure why some people are saying that they wouldn't do anything due to her age; her age is irrelevant. If the threats involve the videos, it is irrelevant if she sent them willingly. A police report would also establish a record if he escalates and she eventually wants to get a restraining order or take other legal action to protect herself from him.

Asking the police if filing a police report is the correct course of action won't harm her in any way. The police or a knowledgeable lawyer should be the ones to advise her about her options. Not any of us. If she is discouraged from reaching out to authorities based on replies here, she may be wrongly kept from a source of real help.

Edited May 15, 2023 by Jhwk21

[Jean in Newcastle]

1 hour ago, Jhwk21 said:

If he's threatening, harassing, or coercing her, she should absolutely ask the police about filing a report. I'm not sure why some people are saying that they wouldn't do anything due to her age; her age is irrelevant. If the threats involve the videos, it is irrelevant if she sent them willingly. A police report would also establish a record if he escalates and she eventually wants to get a restraining order or take other legal action to protect herself from him.

Asking the police if filing a police report is the correct course of action won't harm her in any way. The police or a knowledgeable lawyer should be the ones to advise her about her options. Not any of us. If she is discouraged from reaching out to authorities based on replies here, she may be wrongly kept from a source of real help.

She thinks that she’s still in love. So it’s highly unlikely that she would cooperate with the police report. And more likely that she would go running to the abuser for comfort etc-  in person this time. The OP is asking for materials to help her to see the light and leave the online relationship but if done clumsily it can become manipulation. (I’m not saying that I don’t see the concern that her friends and family have for the girl.  It’s just really tricky when it involves someone’s will.). 

[Jhwk21]

50 minutes ago, Jean in Newcastle said:

She thinks that she’s still in love. So it’s highly unlikely that she would cooperate with the police report. And more likely that she would go running to the abuser for comfort etc-  in person this time. The OP is asking for materials to help her to see the light and leave the online relationship but if done clumsily it can become manipulation. (I’m not saying that I don’t see the concern that her friends and family have for the girl.  It’s just really tricky when it involves someone’s will.). 

I was answering the OP's direct question posed in the initial post where she asks "Would it be helpful for her to talk to the police?" If there are threats or harassment, still think the person should be advised to consult with police whether she is receptive to that advice at this point or not, especially since none of us know super specific details about this person's personality or situation. The police are likely to have resources and possibly some good advice.

Edited May 15, 2023 by Jhwk21

[Jean in Newcastle]

1 hour ago, Jhwk21 said:

If he's threatening, harassing, or coercing her, she should absolutely ask the police about filing a report. I'm not sure why some people are saying that they wouldn't do anything due to her age; her age is irrelevant. If the threats involve the videos, it is irrelevant if she sent them willingly. A police report would also establish a record if he escalates and she eventually wants to get a restraining order or take other legal action to protect herself from him.

Asking the police if filing a police report is the correct course of action won't harm her in any way. The police or a knowledgeable lawyer should be the ones to advise her about her options. Not any of us. If she is discouraged from reaching out to authorities based on replies here, she may be wrongly kept from a source of real help.

 

1 minute ago, Jhwk21 said:

Yes, but I was answering the OP's direct question posed in the initial post where she asks "Would going to the police help?" 

And I was answering your direct question where you said “I’m not sure why some people are saying that they wouldn’t do anything due to her age etc. “. Her age is not irrelevant. A report about a mentally competent adult usually requires their cooperation as the victim. 

[Jhwk21]

1 hour ago, Jean in Newcastle said:

 

And I was answering your direct question where you said “I’m not sure why some people are saying that they wouldn’t do anything due to her age etc. “. Her age is not irrelevant. A report about a mentally competent adult usually requires their cooperation as the victim. 

I think there was some confusion there about what I meant. I made that statement thinking that people were saying that because the daughter is an adult, the police wouldn't help her re: the videos. Maybe I interpreted some of those statements incorrectly. Sorry about that. I wasn't thinking it was about the mother filing a report on behalf of her daughter.

I still think police should be consulted. They would probably have the most accurate and helpful advice about what could and/or should be done since we don't have all of the details. Even if they end up telling the mother to go away and nothing can be done, asking doesn't hurt. They might have some advice, insights, or resources for her.  And even if the daughter doesn't want to report anything now, she may in future, so it would be good for the mother and/or daughter to at least be correctly and more fully informed.

Edited May 15, 2023 by Jhwk21

[mom2scouts]

On 5/13/2023 at 3:27 PM, gardenmom5 said:

I would definitely report to the police.  There are *scammers* out there who do this to kids, then extort money from them.  Some of these kids have committed suicide since they are so embarrassed and can't see a way out.

Her parents are going to need to know everything she's sent to him, in order to protect her.  any bank numbers? anything?

Yes, this recently happened in our community to a young man who ended up killing himself. The boy's parents made his story public to prevent any other person from committing suicide. The boy *thought* he was talking to an online girlfriend, but it was a scammer who extorted money and then continued to ask for more while threatening to release the video. After the story went public, numerous other teens from the same school came forward saying it was happening to them too. 

OP, there's likely no actual boyfriend. This needs to be reported to the police immediately!

[ktgrok]

My understanding is that if it involves email, or online, you can involve the FBI. they have a cybercrime hotline. 

Also, this group deals with revenge porn and sexual images specifically. https://cybercivilrights.org/

Definitely contact local police, but if they are less than helpful try the FBI cyber crime hotline, and definitely contact the cybercivilrights organization. 

[Clarita]

On 5/13/2023 at 2:15 PM, Bootsie said:

I am not sure that I am following the situation, but it sounds to me like she has a "boyfriend" that she has never met personally, who her family thinks is abusive and coercive.  She wants him to be her "boyfriend" and is not interested in ending contact with him.  If that is the case and she is 20 years old, I don't see that going to the police will be helpful.  I would be concerned that if she sees him as her boyfriend, thinking that her parents are trying to end the "relationship" by going to the police might drive her to meet with him.  

So, I would talk to the police about it, not because they will be able to actually do anything about it, but if there is real local help to seek about the situation chances are they would know about it. I think that would be helpful whether or not the parents want to involve the daughter in these talks or not, depends on how they feel she feels or is going to react by the situation. I know the organizations that are near me that work with victims of things let themselves be known to local police because the police is a good source of victims.

You don't always have to "go to the police" in an official capacity. So unless you have some concern about your local police department I would take that route first. The only other thing is if you live in a high crime area the local police may be too busy to just have a conversation, you can also go to neighboring towns/cities to ask for what to do and resources.     

[stripe]

I think the FBI is the right agency to contact, and I know someone whose experience with the FBI investigating cyberstalking and threats was uniformly positive, first and foremost because they took it VERY seriously.

I think the problem with the police is that they’re unlikely to do anything, BUT they may still have ideas, and would very likely be willing to tell her this is indeed suspicious behavior. It might be helpful to go to the police and try to find someone who is willing to talk to her in a sympathetic way, instead of just showing up and hoping to find such a person. I know someone else who had a very kind police officer assist in getting someone out of a domestic violence situation (permanently). So I would see if you or someone else could feel out these agencies, and see if they have other ideas as well. They might have tips and suggestions for YOU even if this person isn’t ready to file a report or talk to them.

Someone else I know of thought some male celebrity was madly in love with her and was ready to start their life together, and basically walked away from her family and job to await his arrival. Spoiler alert: he never showed up. She was devastated. People had been telling her it was a scam, but she didn’t believe it. It’s heartbreaking.

[gardenmom5]

49 minutes ago, stripe said:

I think the FBI is the right agency to contact, and I know someone whose experience with the FBI investigating cyberstalking and threats was uniformly positive, first and foremost because they took it VERY seriously.

I think the problem with the police is that they’re unlikely to do anything, BUT they may still have ideas, and would very likely be willing to tell her this is indeed suspicious behavior. It might be helpful to go to the police and try to find someone who is willing to talk to her in a sympathetic way, instead of just showing up and hoping to find such a person. I know someone else who had a very kind police officer assist in getting someone out of a domestic violence situation (permanently). So I would see if you or someone else could feel out these agencies, and see if they have other ideas as well. They might have tips and suggestions for YOU even if this person isn’t ready to file a report or talk to them.

Someone else I know of thought some male celebrity was madly in love with her and was ready to start their life together, and basically walked away from her family and job to await his arrival. Spoiler alert: he never showed up. She was devastated. People had been telling her it was a scam, but she didn’t believe it. It’s heartbreaking.

My niece is doing this.  She's a sheriff's deputy, and she spends a lot of time talking to women to help them understand what is ok, and what *isn't*.   Apparently, she can get graphic . . . . . (not that she wants to be graphic, but some of the females she's talking to, just don't "get it".)

That the above behavior has lots of red flags, and she may or may not even be talking to a boy, let alone a boy her own age.