At what point do you say, "OK, now it's all up to you" ?

[creekmom]

DS is in public high school now (I hsed him through 8th grade).  He earned a 221 index score on his PSAT in KY which will hopefully qualify him to be a national merit semi finalist.  I think he has a good shot at earning some scholarship money, but the problem is that I have really had to push him to get to where he is now.  I looked into which study books would help him achieve high scores, I pushed him to study for half an hour a day in the weeks before the test, I check his class grades online, I give out consequences and rewards for grades, I helped him find extra curricular activities to add to his college applications, etc.  I am the one doing a lot of the work that he should be doing.

 

He was in the National Honor Society this year, but we just received a notice that he was invited to join for next year (strange bc I thought he was already in).    After reading the notice, I realized he was supposed to do community service, attend 10 meetings he never went to, pay money to join, etc.  He did NONE of this.   When I asked him about it, he said, "I thought I gave you those papers last year.  You never told me I had to do those things."  I told him it was his responsibility to keep up with that stuff - not mine!  It was at this point that it hit me that dh and I have helped him way too much.  My question is how do we back off at this point without having him crash?  He doesn't seem motivated at all to do any of this for himself!  I'm so tempted to tell him that it's all on his shoulders now, but I worry that he will mess up his chances at earning a scholarship (and we can't afford to pay for his college).  How do I get him to care?  How much should we be helping him navigate these foreign waters?  How and when do we let go?!  

[SparklyUnicorn]

Well I have no BTDT.  I don't have any clue what is the best way, but I would probably still get on him.  Maybe I'd get on him not so much in the sense of you keeping track of his details, but in the sense of keeping track that he is keeping track.  Does that make sense?

 

I think too that it's ok to back off somewhat, but that you don't necessarily have to completely back off.  He's still learning these things and I bet lots of other kids his age are also. 

 

And I have some idea what is nice about being in an honor society, but damn sometimes I think these things are more punishments than anything else.  Meetings, community service, etc. etc... As if they don't have enough going on.  Maybe he is just not all that interested in it. 

[Amateur Actress]

The sooner you get him independent, the better, IMO. In a few short years, he is away at college and completely on his own and he needs to know how to keep his life together without mom nagging at him. He may need to sink a few times and deal with consequences, but better that happens at home than on his own. I would sit down and have a big conversation with him about it. Ultimately, it's his life and he has to decide what's important and what's not.

[OnMyOwn]

Honestly, if he will cooperate, then I would do what I could to help him.  Yes, I would encourage independence, but I wouldn't let him fail with so much on the line.  With my own 16 year old boy, I have been requiring him to make a daily schedule as well as using a calendar.  This seems to be helping some, but I do have to push him to do this.

[Grantmom]

I think some of those executive function skills just come naturally and instinctively to some people.  Others of us have to learn them.  But I really believe they can be learned.  You know, some people are born organized and some aren't.  But for those of us who aren't, we just need someone kind and patient to help us learn them.  So, I think if it were my child, I wouldn't be doing things for him, I would be having him do them, but I would still stay on top of things and continue to guide him, so he can learn how to do them for himself.

 

Honestly this is one thing that I think is a great benefit about homeschooling, that kids aren't just told what to do all day long and that they have the opportunity to learn how to manage their time and schedules. 

 

[foxbridgeacademy]

I don't think I'd "back off" at all.  8th grade? So 13-14 years old?  Way to young to be held responsible for the entirety of their future.  I think it's crazy that we put so much pressure and responsibility for our future lives on the shoulders of a teenager and then we're surprised when they crack or fail.  My 40 year old self is kicking the cr*p out of 15 year old me for failing Algebra for the second time but when I was 15 I could care less.  So no, I won't be letting my children "sink or swim", the currents are too rough and there's too much at stake.  That doesn't mean we aren't taking steps to independence.  They both have their own projects and activities they are wholly responsible for (I drive).  But school?  Stupid tests that count for more than they should?  You bet I'll be on them to get stuff done, they might whine and complain now but they'll thank me when they're 20 :glare: ... maybe 30.

[SparklyUnicorn]

Well and you can't really tell him what to join and back off completely.  Can't have it both ways.  If you want him to choose everything himself and be responsible for it, then he gets to choose if he is in the honor society or not. 

 

Mine is in 8th.  Not in school (just one class).  I still have to keep on top of him.  He is starting to be independent with some things, but if I let it go too long without checking in, forget about it. 

 

 

[Miss Tick]

Can you take one step back by getting him a planner and then nagging him to get the stuff in there. At the same time have him pick a time, like during breakfast or before eating dinner, when he will regularly check it. Then every day for a month ask him what is on there for tomorrow, then two out of three days the next month, etc. Ideally it will include a few things that would be embarrassing to forget, but not necessarily crisis-level (like your birthday, or perhaps a volunteer commitment) and then see what happens when those roll around.

 

I would also be sure to have a frank discussion about the fact that this is a skill he will need to have mastered before he leaves home and you want to help him get it. If your family culture allows for humor, you could draw parallels between this and potty training. I would also emphasize that I am old and can no longer remember everything for everybody anymore - my 11yos already hear this often.

 

Make the planner hard top lose - an electronic device perhaps?

 

Every single time you can fit it in, ask what the planner says.

 

Good luck!

[Tsuga]

I have no idea so this is me ruminating on it.

 

It is my experience watching kids now that boys get those skills later and stay in a fog longer than girls. This could be a huge disadvantage and would explain why fewer boys go to college. Earlier in life I would have said "back off, he has to learn, it's his life". But now I think our society is set up such that people with tons of support or exceptional executive function and planning skills, but not high-potential late bloomers, succeed. I also understand now more why people were so amazed at me. I thought other kids just didn't want to go to college. I now see that I was really exceptionally motivated--I did all that stuff. My sister did not! She was too shy and though it all worked out, her life was probably quite different because she didn't do the SATs (though she has the same IQ and test potential as I do) and so on.

 

So, right now, as far as I can see, if I were you I'd choose the things that you think he needs for life: good state school admission, good scholarships or savings, good education and one good activity with a mentor, for example, and plan to do that and keep up with it and demand he do it, but then back off of the other things. State expectations but if he lets it fall through, so be it. In other words, I'd back off from things that take him from a good college education potential to "top scholarship material", but I wouldn't back off from the things that he will need to push through those hard years and have a good foundation for adulthood.

 

I might consider demanding that if he's not going to do extracurriculars, he get a job, though.

[JanetC]

I don't think you can say it's "all" on you, pretty much ever, for the high school years. It's more like "this little piece that used to be on me is now on you." And then when that habit's established, "this next piece is now on you" and so forth and so on.

 

I agree with Tsuga that (a) the demands on high school students are much higher than they used to be and (b) the consequences for not keeping up with those demands are high as well.

 

You can't say "sink or swim" without "sink" being an option, and for a most parents, watching your kids "sink" is unlikely and the kids (alas) know it.

 

[EKS]

I helped--meaning I anticipated stuff and ran interference--until my son was dual enrolled at the CC.  Then nothing, unless he asked, and then it depended on what it was.

[MerryAtHope]

Some kids just step up and take over. You know with those kids--they've got it.

 

Others really need more help, and for those, I don't think there is simply a day when you suddenly stop helping and say, "it's up to you." Instead, I think you scaffold to that point. For example, have them show you paperwork but also tell you what they think needs to be done. They get that sense of being in charge by telling you what they see needs to be done--and you clearly see how much they do or don't understand by the things they leave unsaid/undone.

 

Have them make daily task lists but show them to you--or goal lists, and the steps they plan to take towards that goal, laid out on a planner. Check up to see if they are keeping up--you can back off if it's obvious they've got it, but help if it's obvious they are forgetting.

 

Have real conversations. I actually say to my son, "My goal is to be a help, and not to be a nag. I want you to have xyz [skill, advantage, whatever], and to take the steps to get there--but I don't want you to feel you have to walk this road alone either. Is it helpful when I [intervene, remind, check up on you daily/weekly etc...]?" 

 

If it's not helpful--what would be helpful?

 

We scaffolded by independent work by laying out a course with a syllabus in high school. First I totally backed off--asked my son to make a plan but didn't follow up with him. After a month, I knew he was way behind--so I asked questions. "When is your test? What chapters will it cover? How much do you need to read each day?" and so on. When he realized he'd dug a hole, I had him get a calendar and figure out how to dig himself out of the hole--but this time he had to show me his plan. So, he got to do one test the stressful way, and one with a much more measured-out plan--and got to experience both at home. He did a much better job at college with studying as a result. 

 

Life skills, finances--all of these things are things that some kids will just seem to "get" and others really won't and are going to need some scaffolding, unless you are willing to walk the road of "hard knocks" with them. The stakes are huge with college these days though--it's not like when I went to school and the financial burden was actually doable. 

[Miss Bean]

I don't think you can say it's "all" on you, pretty much ever, for the high school years. It's more like "this little piece that used to be on me is now on you." And then when that habit's established, "this next piece is now on you" and so forth and so on.

 

I agree with Tsuga that (a) the demands on high school students are much higher than they used to be and (b) the consequences for not keeping up with those demands are high as well.

 

You can't say "sink or swim" without "sink" being an option, and for a most parents, watching your kids "sink" is unlikely and the kids (alas) know it.

[Miss Bean]

I think parents should let their kids swim or sink. Especially in the middle/high school years. How can you learn to swim on your own if you never get the opportunity to sink some? We grow through failure and we are not letting our kids fail. (I am guilty of that too) ...

[Laura Corin]

I wouldn't step back at this stage. Teenage brains tend to be in the present; we can be there to help them to prepare for the long term.

 

Yes, they will be on their own soon, but my Calvin at 14 needed help that my Calvin at 17, when he went away, no longer did.

Edited April 24, 2016 by Laura Corin

[LisaKinVA]

My son is a sophomore.  He has had a very busy year trying to juggle too many competing schedules (some of which is my fault, some of which is his).  He has been 100% on his own with his "at school" classes.  He is mostly on his own with his "at home" classes.  This year's theme should be called, "tell me when you have a problem."  He's been struggling with the juggling, but instead of telling me when he's feeling overwhelmed and asking for my advice, he's hidden it...the problem snowballs.  He is fully capable of accomplishing what he's set out to achieve, but once that snowball grows to a certain point, he's lost in how to fix it.  I've gone in to help him re-prioritize, and then build what I suppose is the scaffolding to help him dig himself out.  Each year gets better in many ways, but there is still a lot he needs to learn how to accomplish on his own.  He's going to help plan out his course schedules for next year (instead of simply planning his calendar based upon the course schedule).  We have two years left to help him learn how to self-plan his time, and I'm doing my best to make sure he has the organizational skills in place before he leaves for whatever school he'll attend.  He has sunk a lot this year, and we've built from that.  He has also achieved very well in other areas.  It's definitely a mixed bag with this one.

 

My oldest daughter needs far less "scaffolding" than my son does at the same age, as does my younger son.  So, I'm certain some of it is very dependent upon individual personality traits.  

 

In short, the children need to experience failure.  They need to know we support them, but that we won't excuse poor decisions/choices.  They need to know we are there to help them figure out what THEY should do to fix it (if it can be fixed) or how to move past it and learn from it, if it can't be fixed.  

[Lolly]

There is no correct answer. Unless when they seem to be ready is correct. Dd23: I let go when she was about 10. DD21a: pretty much around 16. Dd21b: 18.

 

Ds19: began the process/not there yet. And, the funny thing is that ds has graduated and is soon going to be self supporting. I anticipate that by the end of the year I will have let go completely. As it stands right now, he is allowed to make his own decisions. However, I do give guidance and reminders. I still have to move his laundry and finish it occasionally. I no longer wake him for events, but I do say something in passing about the next day's events to make sure he remembers them. We will be guiding him through separating his paycheck out at first. We have set up an appointment for him to talk with our financial advisor so that we know he fully understands how much he needs to be setting aside for his future and how to accomplish it. He plans to live at home in order to bulk up his savings and retirement funds quickly.

Edited April 24, 2016 by Lolly

[wintermom]

I think that he is 100% responsible for sitting his exams and doing his school work. The amount of money he can squeeze out of the system for scholarships is for your benefit, too. So support him with that. It's a time and energy suck, that doesn't necessarily contribute to helping his school marks at all. If the time and energy isn't worth it for you, either, then just pay for college, or go with student loans. He's obviously a good student, and this process is overwhelming and stressful for him and you, as well.  I think most parents go through this "trauma" at this period in our kids' lives.  

Edited April 24, 2016 by wintermom

[Guest2]

In ninth grade, college is something that happens to other people. I don't think most of them can picture themselves there, or even want to. I know there are exceptions, but in general, I believe they just want to/ can focus on the present. I would model how to calendaring out current high school assignments and SAT study , ect. You can have him doing this independently in a few years ( in college).

 

I think you sink or swim when you don't have anyone to take you to swimming lessons. It takes a while, but he can learn to swim gradually. I wonder if high school freshman remember something that we forget...they sometimes want to just enjoy the last bit of childhood and life at home.

Edited April 24, 2016 by Silver Brook

[J-rap]

I think starting in high school especially, I encouraged them to take charge but still stepped in when I thought I should.  I never had to step in with my ds.  He was completely self-motivated and independent as a teen, and I never had to step in and do one thing, ever.  I thought, "This is easy!"

 

But I learned that he was an anomaly when none of his four sisters were like that.

 

So, I'd push them to a point.  I helped them lay out a plan, and helped write out a time frame to do things by.  I helped them research, and they knew I was there to assist with almost anything, really!  But I still expected them to meet me partway.  So when they were taking the SAT (which I'm pretty sure I arranged for them), I encouraged them to study and bought them a study manual and offered my time to help.  But if they didn't take that last step of saying, "Okay" to studying, I wasn't going to force them.  

 

Or if they were applying to colleges and only applied at one safe college nearby instead of the one they had expressed interest in for several years, and probably had a chance of getting into because of their SAT scores/grades, yet somehow lacked the motivation to apply there, I wasn't going to force them, as long as they at least had that one safe college.  I might print up the application for them and set it on their desk, but I wasn't going to fill it out for them.  :)

 

I did try and do everything I could think of to help guide and make it easier for them to take charge.  Then, it was up to them.

 

There were a couple exceptions along the way.  For example, one of my dd's had no plan at all and seemed to be at a stalemate in her senior year.  Then I pretty much took the lead and practically filled out the application for her myself (except for the signature line) for a gap year type experience.  It changed her life and from then forward, she never needed me to push her into anything again.  That really helped me learn that sometimes you have to completely steer them for a bit, and that it's okay.  

[Haiku]

In my opinion, you don't say "Now it's all up to you" until your children are independent from you. My dd is going to be 22 this year, and I still help her with things if she needs it.

 

As regards your honor society paperwork scenario, you can't just up and decide that it's all the kid's responsibility (apparently without informing him of this) and expect it to happen. Were it me, I would go over the paperwork with the kid so he knows what he needs to do and then check in with him periodically to see whether he is doing it. I wouldn't make him do it, because it's truly his responsibility to want it enough to do it, but I would certainly show an interest and give some reminders. Kids this age are still learning how to balance everything.

 

When my dd was a junior in high school, we started having her schedule her own doctor appointments and refill her own medication. We went over all actionable paperwork that she received from anywhere (school, job, internship, doctor, etc) and made sure she understood what she needed to do. We checked in weekly to see whether she was accomplishing what needed to be accomplished. We never just said, "Now it's all up to you."

 

I'm rarely involved with her day-to-day stuff now, but when she needs help, I provide it. She wanted to take an EMT class this summer, but she was busy with schoolwork and her jobs and wasn't getting to looking into it. I looked up information, found a class, and gave her the number to call. She called, took the test, and made it into the program with top scores. She didn't mention any of that to me until it was a done deal (less than a week after I gave her the info). I'd have followed up with her in a week if I hadn't heard anything, and a week later if there was still no news. After that I would have figured it wasn't important enough to her.

 

Because dd tends to wait until the last minute to start things, such as looking for a summer job, and then misses out for being too late, I usually remind her in January, February, and March to begin looking. By the time April rolls around, I figure she's either done it or she isn't going to. After I reminded her in February this year, she applied to a bunch of places, and she had some interviews in late March. She now has a summer job lined up.

 

Once dd graduates from college, then it will truly be "Ok, now it's all up to you." Although we will, of course, help her with any unusual or traumatic things that might happen, the day-to-day will all be on her. I figure if she can get a biology degree, she can handle daily life. ;)

[creekmom]

Thank you for such great advice! He is actually a junior this year. I guess some of you thought since I said I homeschooled him through 8th grade that he is now a freshman. So, I don't know if you feel that changes things or not. I recently read an article about helicopter parenting, and it really hit home with how much I seem to be helping him out. I am requiring that he keep up in classes by writing things down and/or putting them on a calendar. I think the bottom line is that I just need to find a way to stay on top of him, but still encourage him to make the decisions. I miss when he was younger and the hardest part of my day was figuring out when to put him down for a nap!

[brookspr]

This is a hard one for sure. Something that all parents grapple with, whether their children are homeschooled or in public/private school. I don't necessarily think there is one right answer, every child is different and some need more help than others.

 

Having said that, this is what we find works for us; we give our children the tools they need in order to become independent. We don't expect independence overnight, but I want to see them work toward independence over the course of about 12yrs of age on. What that means for us is learning/trying different tools to help with organization and responsibility and seeing what works. It took my daughter, who is almost 16, about a year to figure out what kind of planner/schedule works for her. She goes to the public high school part time, takes two online courses, and does the rest at home, but also does marching band, pep band and the district orchestra, girl scouts and venture scouts, so she has a lot to juggle. She needs to be very organized and she tried several different ways to keep her schedule before she found what worked for her. I must have bought her three planners before she found one she liked, plus a white board calendar for her room and an app that helps with goal setting. Lots of communication back and forth and evaluation of how things are going, what she might want to ease up on or do more of also occasionally happen. This is all driven by her, though, and if she wants to take a break from something and has good reasons why, she knows we will support that.

 

Some other things I expect around high school age are to set an alarm and get up with enough time to be ready for school/activities, being ready to walk out the door when needed to get to said activity without reminders, asking for help when needed (don't let things "snowball" as someone mentioned above), make decisions about whether or not they should attend things like scout campouts, parties, youth group activities, etc...based on what work they need to do for academic classes.

 

Now my son is 13 and we have been trying to figure out what will help him be more organized with his daily and weekly schedule. We've tried a few things and think we know what works best. Getting him to implement it is another thing. His motivation is that I will not let him attend the public high school part time like his sister unless he shows me he can stay on task with his work each week and get things done in a timely manner, i.e. not procrastinate. So next year we will try an online class and he will be responsible for keeping up with assignments on his own. He has to show me he can be ready for drum lessons, boy scouts, and other activities without having to be reminded three times that we need to leave at X time and get a move on. I know the process will be much slower with him than with my daughter, but having clear expectations, giving him different tools to use to stay organized, and offering help if asked is about all I can do without feeling like I'm doing the work and should be getting the grade instead of him.

 

Edited April 24, 2016 by brookspr

[MerryAtHope]

Thank you for such great advice! He is actually a junior this year. I guess some of you thought since I said I homeschooled him through 8th grade that he is now a freshman. So, I don't know if you feel that changes things or not. I recently read an article about helicopter parenting, and it really hit home with how much I seem to be helping him out. I am requiring that he keep up in classes by writing things down and/or putting them on a calendar. I think the bottom line is that I just need to find a way to stay on top of him, but still encourage him to make the decisions. I miss when he was younger and the hardest part of my day was figuring out when to put him down for a nap!

 

I think helicopter parenting is doing everything for the child and never allowing the child to fail. That is much different from walking alongside your child and scaffolding towards independence. In the latter model, you do allow the student to succeed or fail--but the consequences of falling one level of a scaffold or one rung of a ladder are much different than falling off the top of a building. Helicopter parenting never allows the student to experience any type of failure, doesn't have the student making decisions along the way, doesn't walk alongside and show the student the consequences of serious and significant decisions but instead makes those decisions for the student who is pretty blind to all of the processes, and so on. There is a lot of wisdom that can be passed on if a student is willing to avail himself of it and a parent is willing to take the extra time it takes to allow the student to lead the process with parent as coach, sounding board, and sometimes silent partner.

 

I learned to ask questions, such as, "What's your plan for xyz?" You hear within the plan whether the student understands all of the details involved. You can ask questions if the student doesn't, and you can check in again later if the student does. This looks much, much different than stepping in and taking over for the student, or not even letting the student know something needs to be done at all because you've done it for them, or not letting the student know there are any consequences out there because you stepped in, and so on. 

[SparklyUnicorn]

It's hard because of the whole helicopter parenting comments.  It's like parents can't win.  They are either doing too much or not enough. 

[regentrude]

DS is in public high school now (I hsed him through 8th grade).  He earned a 221 index score on his PSAT in KY which will hopefully qualify him to be a national merit semi finalist.  I think he has a good shot at earning some scholarship money, but the problem is that I have really had to push him to get to where he is now.  I looked into which study books would help him achieve high scores, I pushed him to study for half an hour a day in the weeks before the test, I check his class grades online, I give out consequences and rewards for grades, I helped him find extra curricular activities to add to his college applications, etc.  I am the one doing a lot of the work that he should be doing.

 

I find that teens need a lot of support in managing the college application process, and I am happy to help mine navigate this very complex process. My situation is a bit different since I am homeschooling and thus am completely responsible for their education.

As soon as they take outside classes, however, they get to be completely responsible for those. My DD insisted on that when she started taking classes at the university at age 14 (I was not even allowed to ask whether she had homework), and my DS is quite adamant that he want to handle all issues surrounding his DE classes by himself. I offer assistance IF they ask. I think it is very important that they get the chance to try on their own, because otherwise it sends the message that I do not have the confidence they can succeed without my help.

 

There are a few things I would not do for a student in school: I would not give rewards for grades or push a 17 y/o to study - and most definitely not micromanage his extracurricular activities! The last is something I feel very strongly about. I want my teens to choose extracurriculars that enrich their lives - not do something because I find it looks good on a college application.

 

He will have to take ownership of his education in a year when he leaves for college, so he needs to learn now. I would help with the important stuff like discussing possible colleges, helping make lists, giving structure , but I would completely back off things he can, and needs to, handle himself.

 

Edited April 24, 2016 by regentrude

[Guest2]

Regentrude has a point. I ask DD Very little about her CC, and she started at 16. I felt like I had to be much more involved with DS with his online stuff in homeschool hs( not DE..just classes he found pretty boring).Other than helping him register and giving advice here and there, we haven't been asked for help in college. Perhaps kids know these are college classes and "they count"?

 

Helicopter parents ? I guess they exist, but I don't think I have ever met them. It is sort of a catch all judgemental comment designed to bring a family down. It seems like every parent is afraid of being called this. It is just like every thing else you do as a parent. Some people are not going to approve and will feel free to tell you so. I would bless their heart Texas style. They don't need to know you, they can make snap judgments. It hurts because it is designed to. Whatever. You still just finish the race doing the best you know and can do to raise your people.

Edited April 24, 2016 by Silver Brook

[Julie of KY]

It's a hard to place to be when you know you need to push independence, yet they still need mom's organization. My 14 year old (freshman) is great. I can tell him do x, y, and z and do it in the next month. He can plan it out, schedule it and get it done. No problem. My 16 year old (junior) on the other hand needs lots of help managing his schedule. It's somewhat scary knowing that he needs to be more independent for college. He's becoming more independent by leaps and bounds so I hope it all comes together.

 

I'd say follow your instincts and push the independence -  choose what you want to him to sink or swim in, but choose other things that you will help manage so that he doesn't utterly fail. Push independence in smaller obtainable goals that he is allowed to fail at. Teach him there are consequences for not meeting those goals. Extracurricular decisions are a great place to definitely let them fail. I would not back off on helping him manage at the expense of failing at schoolwork, college applications, scholarship applications, etc.

 

Rather than giving him the plan, ask what is your plan for this? Initially, I'd make them verbalize/write down the plan, but as they get better just mention that I hope you have a plan for this and back off.

Ask him if he'd like to make the plan or if he needs help. Help him become more independent.

 

For the first time in his academic career, I AM actually giving rewards for managing his time wisely enough to finish in a timely manner. I've said if you can manage your schedule and get it done in a timely manner you get rewarded, otherwise I will step in and help micromanage his time somewhat. He can ask for help as much as he wants, but this has been the push he needed to manage his time better.

 

Overall, follow your instincts; push independence, but know some kids just need more help getting there than others. Pick areas that you allow him to fail in if he doesn't get it all together - this might be academic, extra-curricular, job, sleep, etc.Offer to support him whenever he asks. What works for one family or another child may not be the best for you and your son.

[JanetC]

I think parents should let their kids swim or sink. Especially in the middle/high school years. How can you learn to swim on your own if you never get the opportunity to sink some? We grow through failure and we are not letting our kids fail. (I am guilty of that too) ...

 

Some kids grow through failure, others just learn not to take risks. Without a safety net, some kids will play it "too safe" and not take on challenges needed to grow.

[Bluegoat]

My kids aren't that old yet, but when I think back I can see probably three different things that are considerations.

 

Actually taking responsibility for work.

 

Having the skills to manage doing that.

 

And knowing where I wanted to go with it.

 

The first and third are related, and apart from getting some by-in from the kid I think there is only so much you can do.  You can point out that they might want more options later, but if they don't see it, forcing the issue isn't likely to be very helpful.  You can remind them that they are responsible for themselves and what the consequences are, but they still have to pick it up for themselves.

 

Skills to manage are another thing - I think people have really different levels of natural ability with this and helping to point out what needs to be done and how it might be made to work can be really helpful.  I remember being older and having someone show me how to divide up my scehdual for writing a paper - it made a big practical difference. 

 

So - I might be inclined at this point to be thinking of working with him to aquire the skills to help him manage his own affairs.  For example - why didn't he know what needed to be done for that group besides the papers?  How could he have stayed on top of it?  If he has that skill, and you remind him if you really think he is being absent-minded, it may be up to him to then take action.

[BlsdMama]

I think some of those executive function skills just come naturally and instinctively to some people.  Others of us have to learn them.  But I really believe they can be learned.  You know, some people are born organized and some aren't.  But for those of us who aren't, we just need someone kind and patient to help us learn them.  So, I think if it were my child, I wouldn't be doing things for him, I would be having him do them, but I would still stay on top of things and continue to guide him, so he can learn how to do them for himself.

 

Honestly this is one thing that I think is a great benefit about homeschooling, that kids aren't just told what to do all day long and that they have the opportunity to learn how to manage their time and schedules. 

 

 

Someone just recommended the book Smart but Scattered - you might want to look into it.  She said it was a game changer.

[BlsdMama]

I think parents should let their kids swim or sink. Especially in the middle/high school years. How can you learn to swim on your own if you never get the opportunity to sink some? We grow through failure and we are not letting our kids fail. (I am guilty of that too) ...

 

 

I'd have to disagree.

 

This is a whole future here.

You learn to swim on your own, not by drowning, but by having swim lessons.   ;)  I don't mean to be contrary, but my folks were sink and swim parents.  God bless 'em, I STILL like them to this day.  But I'm darn lucky none of my sink moments had life long consequences.   We don't always learn through failure - or even come out of it unscathed and a better person... I'd say most of us who were very smart but couldn't get assignments in on time, categorize what needed to be done, plan, etc., were this way NOT because we were lazy and useless, but that we lacked the skills to make everything come together and frankly, in this day, everyone just labels people "spacey" or "organized" like they are red-headed and unchangeable.  I had NO idea where to begin.  We always thought our DD was incredibly naturally well organized.  Turns out?  No.   I had put her in charge of her things early, but also gave her the skills to plan, do calendars, write things down, make lists, how to plan, how to divide up books into chunks, etc.  She admitted last year that she is surprised she has to work at juggling and organization.  Now, DS does come by it naturally - however, these are SKILLS not personality types nor are they instinctive or intuitive for all people.  

Edited April 25, 2016 by BlsdMama

[JanetC]

Someone just recommended the book Smart but Scattered - you might want to look into it.  She said it was a game changer.

 

Another good one is "That Crumpled Paper was Due Last Week."

[BlsdMama]

Another good one is "That Crumpled Paper was Due Last Week."

 

That deserves to be bought for the title alone. :D

[GoodGrief]

I haven't read all the replies, but I will say that I think some kids need more help than others, and it is really okay to do so. Of course, you do risk the dreaded Controlling Mother label, but, eh! ;-)

 

That said, re: NHS, I might start out helping him understand the structure and requirements, but if he's requiring a lot of pushing to check off the boxes, I would not work so hard for that particular honor. It's nice, but not particularly valuable for college apps, assuming he is doing some other type of community service and demonstrating academic excellence in other ways.

[G5052]

I find that teens need a lot of support in managing the college application process, and I am happy to help mine navigate this very complex process. My situation is a bit different since I am homeschooling and thus am completely responsible for their education.

As soon as they take outside classes, however, they get to be completely responsible for those. My DD insisted on that when she started taking classes at the university at age 14 (I was not even allowed to ask whether she had homework), and my DS is quite adamant that he want to handle all issues surrounding his DE classes by himself. I offer assistance IF they ask. I think it is very important that they get the chance to try on their own, because otherwise it sends the message that I do not have the confidence they can succeed without my help.

 

There are a few things I would not do for a student in school: I would not give rewards for grades or push a 17 y/o to study - and most definitely not micromanage his extracurricular activities! The last is something I feel very strongly about. I want my teens to choose extracurriculars that enrich their lives - not do something because I find it looks good on a college application.

 

He will have to take ownership of his education in a year when he leaves for college, so he needs to learn now. I would help with the important stuff like discussing possible colleges, helping make lists, giving structure , but I would completely back off things he can, and needs to, handle himself.

 

 

I'm a little pickier on DE and outside classes, basically asking about deadlines and grades here and there. Not every week though, and far less by 11th-12th grade. I realized the other day that I hadn't asked DD about Geometry since January. Thankfully she's doing well!

 

I involve them in planning and the college application/scholarship process. My older one did a 2-year college plan his first semester that we tweek when he registers for the next semester. Frankly I don't trust the advisors, sad to say. He's on a very specific transfer track to a structured major and minor at a competitive 4-year.

[Miss Bean]

I'd have to disagree.

 

This is a whole future here.

You learn to swim on your own, not by drowning, but by having swim lessons.   ;)  I don't mean to be contrary, but my folks were sink and swim parents.  God bless 'em, I STILL like them to this day.  But I'm darn lucky none of my sink moments had life long consequences.   We don't always learn through failure - or even come out of it unscathed and a better person... I'd say most of us who were very smart but couldn't get assignments in on time, categorize what needed to be done, plan, etc., were this way NOT because we were lazy and useless, but that we lacked the skills to make everything come together and frankly, in this day, everyone just labels people "spacey" or "organized" like they are red-headed and unchangeable.  I had NO idea where to begin.  We always thought our DD was incredibly naturally well organized.  Turns out?  No.   I had put her in charge of her things early, but also gave her the skills to plan, do calendars, write things down, make lists, how to plan, how to divide up books into chunks, etc.  She admitted last year that she is surprised she has to work at juggling and organization.  Now, DS does come by it naturally - however, these are SKILLS not personality types nor are they instinctive or intuitive for all people.  

 

I really like your insight - and your outcome is wonderful too. Could it be that your parents knew you would figure it out anyway? They had faith in your abilities? My parents never micro-managed me either. Throughout elementary school I got training on responsibility, then through middle school, the only updates on my schoolwork my parents would get were my mid term report and end of year report. I had some epic fails and some successes too. I took responsibility for them, if I failed, I knew I had to work harder next the next year. My teachers played a big part in my education and as students we had to be answerable to them. But like you and all the other postings say, its all very subjective. I always fear though that too much scaffolding can lead to laziness, lack of effort, and that kind of thing. The child has to want to do well too, and as a parent you have to let them know too that the drive to do well, and become a contributing member of society has to come from them, and never from you. Once you reach high school you should not rely on your parents to remind you to fill out forms, complete your homework, etc. By the time a child reaches college, parents should not be involved in scheduling classes at all, and talking to the advisors etc. The one thing that was a constant for me was that my parents accepted me always. Whether I was doing good in school or not. I am no where near dealing with a high schooler yet, I might change my tune when I get there.

[VANURSEPRAC]

Someone just recommended the book Smart but Scattered - you might want to look into it.  She said it was a game changer.

That book was awesome. It really helped me understand D12.