To sneak a baby-conception over on a husband or not

[Guest submarines]

There's no trust and respect in their relationship anyway. I can't imagine these kind of ultimatums. It is not like the wife is saving her marriage by not having another child. Not with these kind of issues. If she wants another baby (and I believe women have a much stronger need, for their psychological well being, to have babies than men not to have babies), then she should go for it. She shouldn't expect that this would help their marriage, but nothing can reall help it at this point anyway.

 

:leaving:

[JessReplanted]

No sneaking. It sounds like they need to have another serious conversation about this though.

[KidsHappen]

No she shouldn't trick him and yes they need to talk it out and come to a firm resolution. Not only could an unplanned pregnancy in those circumstances be disasterous for the marriage it could be incredibly hard on the possible child. What if the father doesn't come around? What if he still doesn't want another baby?

 

I know of two people who were conceived by unwilling fathers. In both cases, the parents ended up divorced and the children grew up knowing that they weren't wanted by their fathers, thinking that they were the reason for their parents divorce, and feeling unloved by a parent. A mother's love is not enough to soothe away all of the possible pain that could arise from a situation like this. In my opinion, a woman who would do this to a child is not the best mother material.

[QuirkyKapers]

Nope. I wouldn't. I don't know how you work something like this out easily. Lots of talking together. Counseling with a 3rd party if it can't be worked out among themselves. Difficult situation.

[mommaduck]

I guess I see this less as being controlling and more as being naive. It's quite possible that a first time father knew absolutely none of what a woman's body actually goes through during pregnancy and how arbitrary his timing preferences were.

True, but by now he should know something and decide how to re-evaluate (of course, there are those that it can take a few children before they catch on...in that case, someone needs to have a birds and bees conversation with him, beyond DtD). PP mentioned nursing and cycles. The same was true for me. I always start the month my child turns a year and all my children are about 18mos-24mos apart, except the couple of cases that are 3yrs apart due to stillborn and miscarriages. There was nothing else preventing pregnancy.

 

That all said: It is entirely understandable if her husband does not want to have children past a certain age. Women may know when they are "done"...so do men. There needs to be understanding here on both parts and an agreement met. Emotional desire for a child should not override all else (though I entirely understand...we had a lot of trouble getting pregnant early in our marriage, though you wouldn't know it now). Also, there is NOTHING wrong with having an only child...there are many wonderful families, especially here on the board, that have an only child. There are blessings to be said about only children, blessings to be said about "average size" families, and blessings to be said about large families. Each is unigue and have their strengths and weaknesses. She needs to focus on the strengths of the family she currently has, imo.

 

Many prayers for this couple.

Edited May 4, 2012 by mommaduck

[scrappyhappymama]

What? No. No way.

 

While I understand the temptation to do this, I don't think it is OK for anyone to deceive their partner in order to have a child. With that said, I do think it is perfectly fair for her to say "I want another child. I understand that you don't, but I will no longer be taking any responsibility for birth control-no charting, no keeping track for NFP, nothing, so if you do not want another, you need to be 100% responsible for that." Then if he asks if he needs protection or not, she should just always answer 'I don't know, I told you I'm not keeping track anymore." If he is lackadaisical about it, he understands that a possible pregnancy could result (and likely will at some point.)

 

I'm not sure I'd go about things exactly like this, but I do think it would be fair for her to expect her husband to take more of an active role in contraception, since it is so important to him.

 

After our fourth child, my husband was ready to be done, but I was non-committal. I just didn't feel ready to say we were done for sure. Once my fertility returned, I charted like usual, and would warn my husband when we had to abstain. But he knew up front that I would be perfectly happy to have another baby. And that if he decided not to abstain, that he was taking a big risk, and that I was leaving it up to him. I never tried to manipulate him into making the decision I wanted, but I did place the burden of responsibility upon him, while openly providing him with the information he needed to make an informed decision. Our fifth baby is due in June. ;)

 

That said, I agree completely with all the other posters that it would be an incredible betrayal to make a conception decision alone, without considering the concerns of the other partner.

[ocelotmom]

It's not necessarily a control issue. It's more a matter of the ultimatum being a bit ridiculous in timing. Close together siblings is one thing. TTC within the same year as having just had a child (within that child's first year...particularly the initial, within the first 6mos) is not rational. Yes, it happens, but to set that as the ultimatum, that is just wrong. A woman's body needs a chance to heal. Technically, that can take up to two years and should not rushed into in the first year.

Especially since she had a c-section the first time.

 

His attitude is, at best, uneducated and unempathetic, and at worst, cruel and manipulative.

 

While I understand the temptation to do this, I don't think it is OK for anyone to deceive their partner in order to have a child. With that said, I do think it is perfectly fair for her to say "I want another child. I understand that you don't, but I will no longer be taking any responsibility for birth control-no charting, no keeping track for NFP, nothing, so if you do not want another, you need to be 100% responsible for that." Then if he asks if he needs protection or not, she should just always answer 'I don't know, I told you I'm not keeping track anymore." If he is lackadaisical about it, he understands that a possible pregnancy could result (and likely will at some point.)

 

I agree with this. However, it might force a permanent "no" on his part. Until he takes permanent steps, he is open to a change of heart.

 

No, I don't think it's respectful to one's partner. If he poked holes in a prophylactic device and didn't tell her about it until later and she conceived, then she'd (rightly) feel betrayed and violated. It's the same thing if the roles are reversed.

 

I don't think either scenario is "right", but I think there is a major difference between these two scenarios, in that the woman is the one having her body, including her life, put at risk by the deceit.

Edited May 4, 2012 by ocelotmom

[HLDoll]

1) No. There is no place for this kind of dishonesty in a marriage.

 

2) Sounds like she takes for granted the things he does right. If she does this in complete disregard of his wishes, she may lose what she has.

 

3) I do feel for her. But it's not just up to her. Would she like it if he forced her to get pregnant when her son was an infant, as originally planned? Sounds like he completely respected her wishes at that time and she needs to be equally respectful.

 

:iagree: I can't imagine seriously considering that kind of deception, or encouraging someone to consider it.

[beccad777]

While I understand the temptation to do this, I don't think it is OK for anyone to deceive their partner in order to have a child. With that said, I do think it is perfectly fair for her to say "I want another child. I understand that you don't, but I will no longer be taking any responsibility for birth control-no charting, no keeping track for NFP, nothing, so if you do not want another, you need to be 100% responsible for that." Then if he asks if he needs protection or not, she should just always answer 'I don't know, I told you I'm not keeping track anymore." If he is lackadaisical about it, he understands that a possible pregnancy could result (and likely will at some point.)

 

:iagree:This is what I would do.

[gardenmom5]

I have a friend who's strongly considering tricking her husband into making a baby with her. What do you think?

 

1) Any "extenuating" circimstances are 100% totally irrelevant.

2) she wants to trick a man into parenthood. THAT'S despicable.

 

 

is this woman pro-choice or pro-life? she's denying a man a choice about being a parent. in either case, she's a hypocrite.

 

parenthood is supposed to be a two-person job, and both people should have a say in an intentional conception. she is denying him his ability to choose. seriously he NEEDS to be warned so he knows she's even thinking about this. Then he can choose how to handle things.

[gardenmom5]

While I understand the temptation to do this, I don't think it is OK for anyone to deceive their partner in order to have a child. With that said, I do think it is perfectly fair for her to say "I want another child. I understand that you don't, but I will no longer be taking any responsibility for birth control-no charting, no keeping track for NFP, nothing, so if you do not want another, you need to be 100% responsible for that." Then if he asks if he needs protection or not, she should just always answer 'I don't know, I told you I'm not keeping track anymore." If he is lackadaisical about it, he understands that a possible pregnancy could result (and likely will at some point.)

this made me :lol:.

[gardenmom5]

How about if she coneived with someone else? Would he mind that?

 

I'm sure if she was no longer married to him if/when she conceived with someone else - he wouldn't care. if they were married, he'd have grounds for lots of sympathy in divorce court.

[Harriet Vane]

Sounds to be like they both have issues.

 

Husband: the demand that she be pregnant by the time the first child is one year or no more babies at all?! Good grief!

 

Wife: Wanting to sneak a pregnancy on a husband, especially one that is pretty adamant...and she had cancer, which places her at an increase risk of having cancer again (I'm not certain what all the risks are with her type of cancer, recurrence, and pregnancy are, but something about that would concern me and I'm sure it probably concerns her husband).

 

:iagree:

[DusksAngel]

While I understand the temptation to do this, I don't think it is OK for anyone to deceive their partner in order to have a child. With that said, I do think it is perfectly fair for her to say "I want another child. I understand that you don't, but I will no longer be taking any responsibility for birth control-no charting, no keeping track for NFP, nothing, so if you do not want another, you need to be 100% responsible for that." Then if he asks if he needs protection or not, she should just always answer 'I don't know, I told you I'm not keeping track anymore." If he is lackadaisical about it, he understands that a possible pregnancy could result (and likely will at some point.)

:iagree:I also think they need to really discuss this, possibly in a counseling situation. Until they can talk and come to a decision together, there are going to be hard feelings and they will only get worse.

Edited May 4, 2012 by DusksAngel
typo

[justamouse]

While I understand the temptation to do this, I don't think it is OK for anyone to deceive their partner in order to have a child. With that said, I do think it is perfectly fair for her to say "I want another child. I understand that you don't, but I will no longer be taking any responsibility for birth control-no charting, no keeping track for NFP, nothing, so if you do not want another, you need to be 100% responsible for that." Then if he asks if he needs protection or not, she should just always answer 'I don't know, I told you I'm not keeping track anymore." If he is lackadaisical about it, he understands that a possible pregnancy could result (and likely will at some point.)

:iagree:

[stripe]

I'm sure if she was no longer married to him if/when she conceived with someone else - he wouldn't care. if they were married, he'd have grounds for lots of sympathy in divorce court.

 

I wasn't serious.

[Rivka]

Is this question for real?

 

IMO, nope.

 

Eight whole posts and this question.......:glare:

I think of this as one of those perennial "let's stir up trouble on the Internet" questions. As if the Hive didn't have enough exciting real-life drama going on right now!

[Haiku]

I think reasonable people don't trick anyone into having a baby, regardless of the reason.

 

Tara

[Sara in PNW]

I saw your reply and glad she is not planning to trick him. I am not sure what her beliefs are but my encouragement would to pray, pray for peace and pray that her desire be increased or to be taken and for her husband to have that desire placed on his heart or not.

[Alte Veste Academy]

For the first time, ever, I'm posting without reading the other posts. Frankly, I didn't even need to read your post beyond the title.

 

No, no, no. The answer is no!

[sewingmama]

I knew a woman who did this. Her DH did not want another (for financial and health reasons) and his wife snuck one in by lying about being on birth control. Her DH retaliated by getting a vasectomy without asking her :001_huh:

 

They ended up divorced -she was mad at him for the vasectomy and he was mad at her for sneaking in the baby (which in the end he accepted and loved) but the damage was already done.

[kalanamak]

Has she tried the Lysistrata approach?

 

Anyone using NBC should expect a baby any month now.

 

I think he's not fully committed to no more children.

 

Depending on the husband, I'd be tempted. My hubby didn't want #2, but he changed his mind as soon as the test was positive. :)

(FYI, I am not the mother of 1 and 2, but of 3, which he was no longer afraid about. :D)

[5 Hikers]

:iagree:This is what I would/did do too. I refused to take anything after our first was born. It was left to him to take care of it. We have 3 kids. :001_smile:

 

 

While I understand the temptation to do this, I don't think it is OK for anyone to deceive their partner in order to have a child. With that said, I do think it is perfectly fair for her to say "I want another child. I understand that you don't, but I will no longer be taking any responsibility for birth control-no charting, no keeping track for NFP, nothing, so if you do not want another, you need to be 100% responsible for that." Then if he asks if he needs protection or not, she should just always answer 'I don't know, I told you I'm not keeping track anymore." If he is lackadaisical about it, he understands that a possible pregnancy could result (and likely will at some point.)

[mytwomonkeys]

tricking spouse equals bad idea. that's a rule we kinda live by in my marriage.

[besroma]

No. No, no, no. Never.

 

:iagree:, but read my next post below.

Edited May 22, 2012 by besroma
Not sure this is for real

[besroma]

Eight whole posts and this question.......:glare:

 

 

And here are the threads she started which seem questionable to me: :glare:

 

Need advice on gender preference for our upcoming adoption

 

To sneak a baby-conception over on a husband or not

 

If your husband has a sibling.....

 

Can you tell me about what sort of relationship he has with his siblings?

I'm curious about how adult men keep in contact with their adult siblings.

 

-------------------------------

Sounds like a graduate student trying to gather information for a college paper!

[stripe]

I was suspicious of the gender preference thread, but it never really got to be a wild thread.

[Tapasnaturalles]

I will always stay honest about it, that's a fact.

But if I want another child and he doesn't, it's his responsibility to not have one.

I would stop all birth control from my side. It's his thing to make sure we do not have other kids.

I'm sure I would trick him in having daily sex or something, just to make sure he got sick of taking care of it and having an accident, but at least he would know about it and it would be his own fault if I conceived. :D

A woman needs to know her tricks.

 

Here, I am the woman in the house, he has no say in the whole kids-thing. If I want another child, I'll get one, whatever tricks I have to use and he knows that, I'm always open about it. I'm responsible enough to not have the rest of the family in trouble financially or whatever, so he just nods and gives me what I want ;)

Even better, right now it is he that wants another one :p he started the whole idea of going for our 4th. Normally, we start trying in September.

[stripe]

Here, I am the woman in the house, he has no say in the whole kids-thing.

 

Well, ultimately he does have a say. If he went on strike, you wouldn't get pregnant. I also know men who have gotten a vasectomy without consulting their wives.

 

I don't know how one "tricks" one's husband into having sex, unless he is very, very innocent and doesn't understand reproduction yet.

[twinmami01]

While I understand the temptation to do this, I don't think it is OK for anyone to deceive their partner in order to have a child. With that said, I do think it is perfectly fair for her to say "I want another child. I understand that you don't, but I will no longer be taking any responsibility for birth control-no charting, no keeping track for NFP, nothing, so if you do not want another, you need to be 100% responsible for that." Then if he asks if he needs protection or not, she should just always answer 'I don't know, I told you I'm not keeping track anymore." If he is lackadaisical about it, he understands that a possible pregnancy could result (and likely will at some point.)

:iagree:

[Tapasnaturalles]

Well, ultimately he does have a say. If he went on strike, you wouldn't get pregnant. I also know men who have gotten a vasectomy without consulting their wives.

 

I don't know how one "tricks" one's husband into having sex, unless he is very, very innocent and doesn't understand reproduction yet.

 

Just a figure of speech. He would know exactly what I was trying to do and it would be his responsibility to not get pregnant.

But then... I guess that not being open for another baby when I really really really want to would be one of those rare things to end our marriage. It would kill me if he kept saying no, that would be the end of us.

But he won't ;) he knows how important it is to me, so we don't have that problem.

[SunnyDays]

Just a figure of speech. He would know exactly what I was trying to do and it would be his responsibility to not get pregnant.

But then... I guess that not being open for another baby when I really really really want to would be one of those rare things to end our marriage. It would kill me if he kept saying no, that would be the end of us.

But he won't ;) he knows how important it is to me, so we don't have that problem.

 

Okay, I have to respond to this... so you're saying that even though you have three kids, if he said that no he didn't want anymore, you'd break up your existing family over him not wanting more? I guess I disagree with husbands having "no say in the whole kids thing."

 

As for the OP... good grief. Let's look at this in a different light. Here, I am the one who didn't want more children after our first. My husband would have liked to have more. If he said to a friend, she definitely says she's done, but gee I know she'd love another and would be a great mom to another, so I just have to make sure she gets pregnant... you'd all be lining up to hit him with a frying pan.

 

Does the woman's opinion factor in a bit more, especially if the husband is wishy-washy? Yes, I'd say it does, since she's the one going through pregnancy and childbirth, and will, in the vast majority of circumstances, handle more of the child care. But having a child takes two "yes" votes but only one "no" vote. I don't care what his reasons are, if he is adamant about not having more, he should not be made a parent through trickery. I'm glad your friend decided this as well.

[Haiku]

Okay, I have to respond to this... so you're saying that even though you have three kids, if he said that no he didn't want anymore, you'd break up your existing family over him not wanting more? I guess I disagree with husbands having "no say in the whole kids thing."

 

 

Yeah ... I was thinking the same thing. You'd break up your family and harm your kids over a non-existent kid?

 

Tara

[Tapasnaturalles]

I think my family/relationship works different than most then.

My husband and I will always stay together for the kids. There's just no doubt about that. Even if our relationship would end. We would not come home with another person, we will not be in fights every day, we would just be grown ups and work ourselves through the years the kids are at home. That's the responsibility we choose when we got kids. I don't get people with kids who divorce or fight or whatever. If you have kids, get over it and move on. As a parent you don't matter, the only thing that matters is that your kids are happy.

But that's us.

And I know for sure that my husband would not decline me another child if I want one. He knows that the only thing I live for is being a mom. He loves me too much to do that to me.

[stripe]

My former neighbor suddenly left her husband one day. As in, no warning, while the husband was out, she cleared out all her stuff. Supposedly because she wants more kids. She had almost nothing to do with the one she had! I don't quite understand how she has moved closer to her goal of more kids since she is still single and uninvolved, five years later, with no more kids.

[BakersDozen]

But then... I guess that not being open for another baby when I really really really want to would be one of those rare things to end our marriage. It would kill me if he kept saying no, that would be the end of us.

 

And I know for sure that my husband would not decline me another child if I want one. He knows that the only thing I live for is being a mom. He loves me too much to do that to me.

 

I get it. At least I think I do. My dh knows full well how I feel about having dc. If he made noise about not having more there would be a very, very big problem. If he took it upon himself to prevent more babies "we" - meaning our relationship and everything that makes it up - would change. We would not divorce, we would not live in a constant fight, yet things would not be the same. We would have to work through a major upheaval in our relationship and it might not be pretty.

 

He has a life topic he feels strongly about as well and I know that if I tried to step in and stop it from happening/change it, he would respond the same way. We respect these feelings in each other and are careful to tread lightly and lovingly.

[besroma]

I'm guessing TROLL!

 

She posted this on the fourth, really wasn't part of the conversation, and hasn't signed back in since the 4th.

[Jennifer3141]

I think my family/relationship works different than most then.

 

Why, yes. Yes it is different. I don't play games or lay down the law with my DH. I don't have to. We communicate like ADULTS.

 

And I would never bring a child into the world with a man who didn't want one. Blech.

[besroma]

I was suspicious of the gender preference thread, but it never really got to be a wild thread.

 

I was too. I really don't believe that anyone would ask that question here. It seemed fabricated.

[StephanieZ]

While I understand the temptation to do this, I don't think it is OK for anyone to deceive their partner in order to have a child. With that said, I do think it is perfectly fair for her to say "I want another child. I understand that you don't, but I will no longer be taking any responsibility for birth control-no charting, no keeping track for NFP, nothing, so if you do not want another, you need to be 100% responsible for that." Then if he asks if he needs protection or not, she should just always answer 'I don't know, I told you I'm not keeping track anymore." If he is lackadaisical about it, he understands that a possible pregnancy could result (and likely will at some point.)

 

:iagree:

 

I do understand the temptation. I was in the same struggle with dh, but it was about a #4, and it was really hard for me, so I can imagine it would have been so much harder if it had been over a #2.

 

That said, I think it is terribly wrong to deceive your spouse about something as vital as being a parent. ESPECIALLY when the spouse is a good, loving, involved parent. My dh is and always has been a very wonderful dad (and husband), and my respect for how important he takes his roles in the family is what made it possible for me to accept his decision. It would be terribly unfair to put a father in a position of being less able to be HIS vision of the wonderful dad he wants to be, and giving him a child he doesn't want does this. And dooms the marriage.

 

After years of struggling, I finally made him responsible for b/c and I actually pushed him towards the vasectomy just so I could close the door mentally, because having it open a crack (by maintaining fertility) was a source of constant pain and disharmony. I just couldn't drop it. Once I intellectually accepted that his mind was not going to change, I really needed a permanent solution so that I could begin to let go emotionally. I really hated it, but it was a good decision for us, because the vasectomy was the turning point for me, and, in time, I finally accepted the end of child bearing.

 

So, no, she should NOT NOT NOT do this. She should get counseling herself, and she should show her husband respect and love for who he IS and stop punishing him for his limitations.

[Haiku]

He loves me too much to do that to me.

 

So because your husband loves you, he would have to agree to having kids he didn't want to have?

 

Hmmm.

 

Tara

[Rivka]

So because your husband loves you, he would have to agree to having kids he didn't want to have?

 

Hmmm.

 

Tara

 

Low-ish post count (although not as low as the other).

Extreme opinion, blithely expressed.

Showed up in the thread after people failed to get incensed over the initial bait.

 

I can't really commit to a definite opinion, here, but I wouldn't get all incensed.

[Tree House Academy]

One of my dear friends decided to do this with a man she wanted to marry about 6 years ago. It ended so badly. The man freaked out and asked her to have an abortion. She did so to save the relationship. A year later, they married and got pregnant. She gave birth this time to a healthy child (who is now 4 years old). Every.single.day, the choice she made haunts her...and it has almost destroyed her marriage on more than one occasion. I really hope your friend decides against this plan.

[Trish]

Stuff like this makes me glad I'm Catholic. Husbands don't get to overrule God. Nor do wives.

[Slartibartfast]

If my husband gave me that ultimatum I would tell him to get his head examined. I was NOT ready to be pregnant when dd was one. :lol:

 

I wouldn't lie to him but I would insist on counseling. It isn't just his decision, it should be both. I don't think that demanding you get your way is any better than sneaking your way.

 

Marriage is about compromise and mutual respect not being a bully and not lying.

[Trish]

So because your husband loves you, he would have to agree to having kids he didn't want to have?

 

Hmmm.

 

Tara

 

I would expect so.

[tex-mex]

Sounds to be like they both have issues.

 

Husband: the demand that she be pregnant by the time the first child is one year or no more babies at all?! Good grief!

 

Wife: Wanting to sneak a pregnancy on a husband, especially one that is pretty adamant...and she had cancer, which places her at an increase risk of having cancer again (I'm not certain what all the risks are with her type of cancer, recurrence, and pregnancy are, but something about that would concern me and I'm sure it probably concerns her husband).

:iagree::iagree:

 

Something about the whole thing that just seems amiss? I think they need counseling, to be honest.