What do you feel is lacking in homeschool curriculum?

[CalicoKat]

A really good music history curriculum that starts from Gregorian chant, rather than the late Baroque, and is centered on actual music, not the lives of composers.

 

oooo, I'd like that too! MFW does a pretty good job of doing the classics with their deluxe package. My kids enjoyed Beethovan, Motzart & Hayden this year.

[tearose]

Check college music history texts. Both Stolba and Grout fit this requirement, and I suspect others do as well.

 

I'd use Grout for high school, but I have a really little one, so college texts wouldn't really work at that stage. :)

[Chelli]

A really good music history curriculum that starts from Gregorian chant, rather than the late Baroque, and is centered on actual music, not the lives of composers.

 

:iagree:I had a course like this my freshman year in college. I LOVED it! I wonder if I sold that book back...

[YLVD]

I always used the curriculum as my guide. I was never successful at fly-by-the-seat-of-my-britches homeschooling. I wanted something to tell me what to cover and when to cover it because otherwise it was all so overwhelming that I didn't know where to begin. Science was really the worst because the only science the kids ever found interesting was natural disasters like earthquakes, tornadoes, etc. They could tell you all about that stuff. But if we tried to read regular books on any other science topics, they were bored. Of course we did experiments, but without a guide telling me what we're supposed to be seeing, they were rarely helpful. And nature stuff was just plain stupid. :tongue_smilie: We would go outside and see a rock, tree, grass, an ant, and then go 'okay, there they are, now what?'

 

It's all about styles really. I wouldn't have been able to homeschool without curriculum to help me along. I used to feel stupid when someone would say how much better they did without curriculum, but I really did finally figure out that it's just different strokes for different folks. So yeah, some of us really do NEED to use a curriculum.

 

ITA with all of this. My DD has always loved the natural disaster stuff and honestly taught me a lot on it.

 

However, I have to have a curriculum to help me. I tried without it and failed miserably. I can deviate from the curriculum but need that framework.

 

I have decided to create my own for science this fall. Due to the lack of secular interesting science, and my own expertise and DD's interests, I will be doing some sort of forensic science class of my own making I think.

 

DD loves forensics and I happen to have a degree in criminology and forensics. So, it's a win! lol. I could not do that with most subjects though.

[Virg]

A few Bible curriculums that get beyond Bible stories and basic reading and into theology but do not use KJV, many of us believe that for in depth study it is not as well translated as other versions. A really good German program that didn't cost a ton and did more with grammar and translation.

[rlugbill]

What bugs me are the curriculums where you have to go back and forth between about 5 different books and various materials. Teacher's Manual, answer key, textbook, workbook, separate writing book, various materials for science projects, cds, reference book, dvds, etc.

 

It makes it impossible for children to just sit down and do the work independently when you have to jump back and forth between various books. It would be easy to combine it into workbooks that you just work through a la the Spectrum workbooks or CLE Lightunits.

 

Two things is ok, such as workbook plus answer key or workbook plus dvd. But, if it gets more complicated than that, it almost requires constant parental attention.

 

You have to pay more for all the hassle and the extra books. And it just makes more work for the parent instead of teaching the child to learn to work independently.

 

What's missing for me is more of this type of workbook format for various subjects, especially for high school.

 

Workbooks rule!

[Jennifer3141]

I'd love an integrated one-year North American history program, including Mexico, to use as an overview.

 

 

I'd love this and a REALLY good secular science program.

 

I would also love some program that discussed world religions without proselytizing. Explain why you believe that but don't try to make us believe it.

[Desert Rat]

Secular science is difficult for me to find. Although, we're heading into physics and that's much easier than chemistry or biology.

[usetoschool]

My I gently make a suggestion?

 

Just as your children do not need a classroom in order to learn, they also do NOT need a curriculum or program in order to learn. Instead of fretting over finding the perfect curriculum, hit the library, google a topic, search Amazon. There are so many wonderful titles already published, so many teaching guides and plans on the internet that you can easily find material to cover any topic for any child.

 

Have some excellent reference books on your shelves. A history and science encyclopedia, local field guides to birds, bugs, critters and plants. Organize your internet bookmarks by subject. Then start reading together and stop to look something up, stop to explain a word to ask questions and comment on the story. Get outside and start observing the things around you and identify them. Keep a nature journal. Do copy work, dictation and narration from the things you read. Diagram an interesting sentence. Then read some more. Talk. Think.

 

I did not use a single text book or curriculum, except for math, until my kids were in high school. We read books, loosely following the history cycle, but sometimes following interests instead. We read aloud, they read independently. We traveled, visited museums, watched documentaries, listened to radio programs and podcasts. Are there gaps in their knowledge? Of course there are! But they have a lifetime in front of them to continue learning. They are engaging and wonderful young men. Articulate, too. Knowledgeable and inquisitive.

 

I have two main complaints about textbooks and packaged programs. First they give the illusion that education is finite. I don't believe everything a 3rd grader, for instance, needs to know about a topic can be defined and packaged. I don't believe that the only questions that can be raised about a book or a topic are the ones found in a teacher's guide, and that the only acceptable answers are those imagined by the publishers. I homeschool to give a individualized education and to nurture my children's curiosity. I'm not here to check off boxes. My second complaint is pre-packaged curricula perpetuates the myth that all learning has to be handed down on high from an "expert". I can teach myself how to crochet or fix the dishwasher. I can learn about The Iliad or about quantum mechanics. I certainly do turn to and value experts, but I don't need them guiding every single step of the way.

 

So there's my soap box speech. You don't need a curriculum, you just need to apply that same energy to finding good books and internet sites and you will have everything you need.

 

I like your soap box. :001_smile: As I was reading through this thread, having just come from the high school thread about dumbed down curriculum, I kept answering every question with, well, yes, that information already exists, just get the books, find a time line/scope and sequence and start learning. You said it better and more politely than I did or could.

[DarlaS]

Secular science. I am having to buy a public school textbook for biology this year because the choices in HS curriculum are unacceptable.

 

Have you looked at the Holt book used by Oak Meadow? It's the previous edition of the book sold under Saxon Science at Rainbow Resource. (And how kind of them to put the isbn on the webpage, so we can get it cheaper from amazon. :001_smile:).

 

This is what we'll be using this year. I have a microscope from years ago when my eldest did Apologia biology, and will also be adding (or subbing depending on the time factor) some of the labs from the Holt book itself.

 

I bought the syllabus from Oak Meadow and the book used from amazon. I also bought OM's biology kit. (Kind of pricy for what you get though.) The discussion questions seem pretty good, and they do schedule labs. As far as I can tell though, there are no microscope labs (which is why I'm adding some labs from the book). There are also no dissections, but I'm not sure how (or if :tongue_smilie:) I'm going to address that.

 

I think I did pretty well spending just over $100 (so far!). I'm busily adding it into HST and making lists for the supplies for additional labs.

[micheller1]

My I gently make a suggestion?

 

Just as your children do not need a classroom in order to learn, they also do NOT need a curriculum or program in order to learn. Instead of fretting over finding the perfect curriculum, hit the library, google a topic, search Amazon. There are so many wonderful titles already published, so many teaching guides and plans on the internet that you can easily find material to cover any topic for any child.

 

Have some excellent reference books on your shelves. A history and science encyclopedia, local field guides to birds, bugs, critters and plants. Organize your internet bookmarks by subject. Then start reading together and stop to look something up, stop to explain a word to ask questions and comment on the story. Get outside and start observing the things around you and identify them. Keep a nature journal. Do copy work, dictation and narration from the things you read. Diagram an interesting sentence. Then read some more. Talk. Think.

 

I did not use a single text book or curriculum, except for math, until my kids were in high school. We read books, loosely following the history cycle, but sometimes following interests instead. We read aloud, they read independently. We traveled, visited museums, watched documentaries, listened to radio programs and podcasts. Are there gaps in their knowledge? Of course there are! But they have a lifetime in front of them to continue learning. They are engaging and wonderful young men. Articulate, too. Knowledgeable and inquisitive.

 

I have two main complaints about textbooks and packaged programs. First they give the illusion that education is finite. I don't believe everything a 3rd grader, for instance, needs to know about a topic can be defined and packaged. I don't believe that the only questions that can be raised about a book or a topic are the ones found in a teacher's guide, and that the only acceptable answers are those imagined by the publishers. I homeschool to give a individualized education and to nurture my children's curiosity. I'm not here to check off boxes. My second complaint is pre-packaged curricula perpetuates the myth that all learning has to be handed down on high from an "expert". I can teach myself how to crochet or fix the dishwasher. I can learn about The Iliad or about quantum mechanics. I certainly do turn to and value experts, but I don't need them guiding every single step of the way.

 

So there's my soap box speech. You don't need a curriculum, you just need to apply that same energy to finding good books and internet sites and you will have everything you need.

 

Do you mind if I print your post and put it in the front of my planner for next year so I remember to breathe and enjoy the learning process with my children??? :grouphug:

[WishboneDawn]

 

It's all about styles really. I wouldn't have been able to homeschool without curriculum to help me along. I used to feel stupid when someone would say how much better they did without curriculum, but I really did finally figure out that it's just different strokes for different folks. So yeah, some of us really do NEED to use a curriculum.

 

Same here and I used to be an unschooler. :) It took me a very long time to stop resisting curriculum, especially with science. I knew what science should be but without anything to ground me it just never got done, even informally. Now I have Singapore MPH and Interactive Science and it's amazing how having that backbone seems to make the whole subject stand up and demand notice. We do more experiments, notice more around us, read more related books...It's been a blessing for us.

[micheller1]

Same here and I used to be an unschooler. :) It took me a very long time to stop resisting curriculum, especially with science. I knew what science should be but without anything to ground me it just never got done, even informally. Now I have Singapore MPH and Interactive Science and it's amazing how having that backbone seems to make the whole subject stand up and demand notice. We do more experiments, notice more around us, read more related books...It's been a blessing for us.

 

For Interactive Science do you buy all the books? Or just the txtbook, activity book and tm?

 

It looks like a great science program. I have a 9 yo, 11 and 13 yo that I'm trying to combine science for next year and I think I could use this? What do you think from your previous experience with it? We used elemental science last year. Next year will be our 2nd year of hs'ing.

[JennW in SoCal]

Well gee! Thank you for the nice comments, jcooperetc and micheller1! Print away if it helps you out. I know I had a binder filled with helpful posts that I turned to throughout the years.

[Sahamamama]

For me, as a mother and a Christian, I find that what I need the most is encouragement to let the Holy Spirit lead the way in our homeschooling, as well as in every other area of life. I don't think most how-to guides address this aspect of our lives.

 

At the end of the day, what matters (to me) is not how many math fact pages my first grade daughter did, nor how far along in the phonics primer I moved my preschoolers. What matters to me is whether or not we met Jesus in any of it? Did we hear Him? Did we follow?

 

I know I can find advice on choosing a math curriculum. ;) I know where to ask questions about spelling. ;) I can even find plenty of Bible study materials... but there is still something lacking (I think). At least, I haven't found it (yet). I would love to connect more with other Christian home school mothers, who could have something to say about how we move towards being truly lead by the Holy Spirit.

 

I realize this is not an academic element, but it is what I feel is missing.

Edited June 13, 2011 by Sahamamama

[WishboneDawn]

For Interactive Science do you buy all the books? Or just the txtbook, activity book and tm?

 

It looks like a great science program. I have a 9 yo, 11 and 13 yo that I'm trying to combine science for next year and I think I could use this? What do you think from your previous experience with it? We used elemental science last year. Next year will be our 2nd year of hs'ing.

 

We've really liked it. I bought the text, theory book and practical book. I felt comfortable enough without the TM. I've skipped some of the experiments in the practical WB but there are enough we can easily do that I think it's worth it.

 

Whether your younger ones could use it, I'm not sure. My 9 yr old does MPH 3/4 and certainly doesn't have the reading or writing skills for IS. He's not really at grade level in those skills yet but I think even an average to somewhat ahead 9 year old would be having some trouble with IS. I'd probably be more inclined to go for MPH 5/6 for the two younger ones and IS A for the 13 yr old.

[Veritaserum]

I always used the curriculum as my guide. I was never successful at fly-by-the-seat-of-my-britches homeschooling. I wanted something to tell me what to cover and when to cover it because otherwise it was all so overwhelming that I didn't know where to begin. Science was really the worst because the only science the kids ever found interesting was natural disasters like earthquakes, tornadoes, etc. They could tell you all about that stuff. But if we tried to read regular books on any other science topics, they were bored. Of course we did experiments, but without a guide telling me what we're supposed to be seeing, they were rarely helpful. And nature stuff was just plain stupid. :tongue_smilie: We would go outside and see a rock, tree, grass, an ant, and then go 'okay, there they are, now what?'

 

It's all about styles really. I wouldn't have been able to homeschool without curriculum to help me along. I used to feel stupid when someone would say how much better they did without curriculum, but I really did finally figure out that it's just different strokes for different folks. So yeah, some of us really do NEED to use a curriculum.

 

:iagree: My introduction to homeschooling was through Thomas Jefferson Education, which is an attempt at classical unschooling. I was taught that I would kill a love of learning if I dictated content. I was told I would still be on the "conveyor belt" if I looked at educational standards. Etc. I was spinning my wheels trying to homeschool the TJEd way. I very nearly gave up on homeschooling all together because it just wasn't working.

 

Then I read The Well-Trained Mind. It was like a lighthouse guiding a lost ship into safe harbor. I had a plan! I had specific, practical suggestions for how to implement classical education at home. I am not a fly-by-the-seat-of-my-pants kind of person. I love order and structure, yet it is not my master. We can and do revise the plan as needed.

 

Well-written programs allow me to relax and enjoy teaching my kids. And they love to learn. They see their progress. New stuff makes sense because of the foundation that has come before. I love our incremental approach. It is working so much better for us than our scattershot, what-do-you-want-to-learn-today method of the past. :)

 

My biggest wish is for more secular science options written for the homeschool market. I don't want "inclusive" or "neutral." I want hardcore secular science based on accepted theories such as an old earth and evolution. :)

[LittleIzumi]

Same here and I used to be an unschooler. :) It took me a very long time to stop resisting curriculum, especially with science. I knew what science should be but without anything to ground me it just never got done, even informally. Now I have Singapore MPH and Interactive Science and it's amazing how having that backbone seems to make the whole subject stand up and demand notice. We do more experiments, notice more around us, read more related books...It's been a blessing for us.

 

I do like curricula to fill in my gaps. I focus on what I think is important, and forget other things (like how dd gets addition & subtraction & more/less, but we hadn't touched money or 3-D shapes on our own). I seem to be incapable of actually following a curricula completely as written anyway :lol: and I like to have several options available per subject so no worries on me getting dependent.

[WishboneDawn]

My biggest wish is for more secular science options written for the homeschool market. I don't want "inclusive" or "neutral." I want hardcore secular science based on accepted theories such as an old earth and evolution. :)

 

Amen.

 

There's no such thing as "inclusive" or "neutral" in a science text. If a curriculum claims it is it's just taken the position that there is some sort of debate in the scientific community and that's a decidedly unscientific view in my mind.

[butterflymommy]

I agree it is hard to find high quality, affordable, packaged-for-homeschoolers science courses. We ended up giving up and are using a creationist program (MFW) supplemented with secular videos and books. Secular homeschool "packages" seem scarce in general. For example, I really like the way Veritas history works but am a little put off with the constant religious bent. We are a religious family but not so religious that we want religion/ God in every aspect of homeschooling.

[Mynyel]

We haven't been able to find a history program we like -- something higher than SOTW, but without the -- well, long, drawn-out, story-less, and frankly boring history texts that seem to exist in between SOTW and adulthood.

 

:iagree:

 

We are using Notgrass which is a good solid program but it is a bit boring.

[Elizabeth in MN]

I want a PE curriculum that teaches life long physical fitness and not just how to play baseball. Oh, and can be used by a family with one child...

[Onceuponatime]

I would really love to find a secular elementary science that is as detailed and informative as the Apologia elementary science.

 

An elementary/middle school foreign language that is pick up and go without a lot of unnecessary bells and whistles.

[DarlaS]

We haven't been able to find a history program we like -- something higher than SOTW, but without the -- well, long, drawn-out, story-less, and frankly boring history texts that seem to exist in between SOTW and adulthood.

 

K12 uses some excellent texts. I think they are called Human Odyssey, and Christianbook.com sells them.

 

Found one: http://www.christianbook.com/the-human-odyssey-volume-1/9781931728539/pd/728534?item_code=WW&netp_id=881460&event=ESRCN&view=details

 

They are pricey, but very good.

[sewingmama]

Decent resources that aren't all American :glare::tongue_smilie:

 

A decent history curriculum for any other country that isn't the USA. I'll be using one for Australian history from the public school curriculum because I can't find anything else that is comprehensive.

 

I'm sure the Canadians here would love a detailed history curriculum for them as well instead of having to piece it together from non-existant resources.

[WishboneDawn]

Decent resources that aren't all American :glare::tongue_smilie:

 

A decent history curriculum for any other country that isn't the USA. I'll be using one for Australian history from the public school curriculum because I can't find anything else that is comprehensive.

 

I'm sure the Canadians here would love a detailed history curriculum for them as well instead of having to piece it together from non-existant resources.

 

There are a few out there but I find they're generally boring and uninspiring.

[micheller1]

We've really liked it. I bought the text, theory book and practical book. I felt comfortable enough without the TM. I've skipped some of the experiments in the practical WB but there are enough we can easily do that I think it's worth it.

 

Whether your younger ones could use it, I'm not sure. My 9 yr old does MPH 3/4 and certainly doesn't have the reading or writing skills for IS. He's not really at grade level in those skills yet but I think even an average to somewhat ahead 9 year old would be having some trouble with IS. I'd probably be more inclined to go for MPH 5/6 for the two younger ones and IS A for the 13 yr old.

 

Thank you for the suggestions. We really LOVE science in this house. Though none of us are especially sciencey - so what we really need is something that gives us direction and is fun but also has the backbone we need. While Elemental Science is Wonderful, I just felt like they never really learned enough.

[Dmmetler]

I'd like materials for state history, so I can work it into US history. Since I grew up in a different state (and took a teaching exam in a 3rd one-so I've had to take state history twice, but neither is in the state that DD is growing up in), I've covered the history of our current state only peripherally. I don't think DD needs to spend her entire 4th grade year learning TN history the way I learned VA history, but integrating it with our US history studies this year seems like a good option.

[stripe]

There's no such thing as "inclusive" or "neutral" in a science text. If a curriculum claims it is it's just taken the position that there is some sort of debate in the scientific community and that's a decidedly unscientific view in my mind.

Ok not a text but how about Bryson's Short History book? He doesn't discuss creation at all. Supplement with the BBC Planet Earth and Life videos.

 

Also what about Galore Park? Haven't seen them so this is a genuine question.

 

Another idea is the Indian books published by NCERT. Posted here for free. They don't seem religious to me, but do advocate and describe contraception, openly discuss abortion, and warn against aborting girls. They are somewhat environmentalist in tone, so that's a warning for the pro-plundering crowd. I haven't read every word of them but they are very direct but not crass about subjects like reproduction.

[FaithManor]

Something concerning Michigan history that does not make my brain want to barf up a hemisphere!

 

Faith

[Recovering Sociopath]

A Christian but not YEC science curriculum. I want something along the lines of Dr. Francis Collins' The Language of God and Dr. Owen Gingerich's God's Universe but accessible to a logic stage audience. Something that explicitly acknowledges God as the Creator of the universe but doesn't take a literal interpretation of Genesis 1. Something that discusses evolution but from a theistic POV rather than an atheistic "it's all just random chance" one.

 

Many Christians read the Creation story in Genesis as allegory rather than a literal scientific and historical account. Where's the curriculum for us?

 

:iagree:

 

BioLogos is working on a curriculum *supplement* (http://biologos.org/projects/curriculum), but it's going to be a while, and it's the only thing I've seen that's even close to what I want.

[LittleIzumi]

I'd like materials for state history, so I can work it into US history. Since I grew up in a different state (and took a teaching exam in a 3rd one-so I've had to take state history twice, but neither is in the state that DD is growing up in), I've covered the history of our current state only peripherally. I don't think DD needs to spend her entire 4th grade year learning TN history the way I learned VA history, but integrating it with our US history studies this year seems like a good option.

 

Currclick has a 50 states bundle with a brief overview of history, the state bird/tree/insect/etc, copywork, word finds, memory games, coloring page, trivia, etc, for each state. It's not really comprehensive or anything but it's great for elementary for an overview of all states.

[Rosie_0801]

Living books to go with physics and chemistry.

 

There was a thread on chemistry books on here recently: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/LivingScience/

 

A decent history curriculum for any other country that isn't the USA. I'll be using one for Australian history from the public school curriculum because I can't find anything else that is comprehensive.

 

Our Sunburned Country isn't any good? I haven't seen it yet.

 

You could also try messaging Keptwoman about a pre-colonial focused program. A friend of hers is working on one. I had a quick flick through and came away feeling it might be possible not to loathe Australian history. That's a good sign, isn't it? :D

 

 

Rosie

Edited June 14, 2011 by Rosie_0801

[DarlaS]

Something concerning Michigan history that does not make my brain want to barf up a hemisphere!

 

Faith

 

For what age? For high school level, this book is pretty good:

 

Michigan: A History of the Great Lakes State

 

This one also looks good: Michigan: The Great Lakes State - An Illustrated History

 

You're probably thinking of something for younger kids though. I think it's typically taught in 4th grade.

[Perry]

Liberal/moderate/anything but Conservative-literal Bible study materials.

 

Telling God's Word is a good start but it's really the only one.

Have you seen this?

The Old Testament for Teens: A Guide to Critical Issues and Perspectives

 

We're going to use it next fall, so I can't give a review, but it looks great from my quick look through it. There isn't one for the New Testament though.

[stripe]

I came across this today for those looking for an evolution-based biology text, Biology 7e by Raven etal.

http://highered.mcgraw-hill.com/sites/0072437316/information_center_view0/

 

Looks available very cheaply used. I think it's a college text.

[TracyR]

A Catholic curriculum like Christian Light. And a Catholic curriculum like Sonlight.

[WishboneDawn]

Ok not a text but how about Bryson's Short History book? He doesn't discuss creation at all. Supplement with the BBC Planet Earth and Life videos.

 

We're listening to that right now and loving it - at least me and the dd.

 

Also what about Galore Park? Haven't seen them so this is a genuine question.

 

Not a clue!

 

I'm actually very happy with Singapore myself. Just wish there were some more choices.

[WishboneDawn]

Have you seen this?

The Old Testament for Teens: A Guide to Critical Issues and Perspectives

 

We're going to use it next fall, so I can't give a review, but it looks great from my quick look through it. There isn't one for the New Testament though.

 

:w00t:

 

I think I love you!!! :D That looks like exactly what I've been hoping for!

 

Actually, that whole store looks fantastic. Thank you!

[Catherine]

Logic curriculum that REALLY explains what syllogisms are, what inductive reasoning is and where they came from. Science ALA SOTW.