Braces or no?

[ma23peas]

I am generally of the mindset that chiropractors and orthodontists will not turn down any patients referred to them..so I'm already skeptical going in..I need some experienced families to help me.

 

My 12 year old daughter does have a higher/narrower palate than her siblings. Her canine teeth are coming in over the top of the two they should be sliding down between...the good news is she lost two teeth that sit behind them and that opened up some space, so over the past 3months I've been watching them to see if they will settle in and her jaw will expand with them pushing their way down.

 

I never had braces and my teeth are straight, I took my son to see the ortho and the only issue my son had was that he had a baby tooth that had no permanent underneath..but it's holding firm and not moving so we simply built up the tooth so the upper teeth would not keep coming down onto the space and messing up his jawline...but this ortho wanted 5k to pull the baby tooth and reconfigure his bottom jawline...after I pressed and pressed for more options he said well, you could build up the baby tooth and see how long it will last, generally if it lasts past age 18, it will always stay there...that bill cost me $90...my son's teeth are STRAIGHT!! UGh.

 

So then I take my daughter to him and of course for the same 5k he wants to pull 2 permanent teeth and allow more room...I was against pulling permanent, and he said he could still straighten them out it would just take 6 months longer...

 

I'm just wondering if any of you had canines that were coming in front of the side teeth and how they settled in with or without braces..

 

So confusing...

Thanks!

Tara

[Liz CA]

I understand your hesitation. I would take dd to a different ortho and get a second opinion.

I am coming from the camp that the importance of nice looking teeth cannot be overestimated.

Both my mother and I had the same teeth problem with one difference. She could never have hers fixed (post WWII) and I had braces. While I did not like wearing them, I am immensely grateful I had the privilege of having my teeth straightened.

Especially, nowadays, where one hardly sees crooked teeth because everyone gets braces, it would be nice for your dd to be comfortable smiling. If the "problem" is indeed minor, a good ortho should tell you and not just eyeball your wallet.

 

Don't know specifically about canines but if you can wait and see with the option of having braces later with the same success rate, it may be worth waiting, however your dd will be older if she has to have braces but it may not matter to her.

Edited July 20, 2010 by Liz CA

[mommytobees]

I think you did well for your son. If (huge IF) there is a problem later, then he can have it corrected then. Though, honestly, I would just have a "fake" inserted if the baby has to come out. I don't remember what they call it, but my friend had the same issue.

 

As for your daughter.... you can have some long-term problems with an uncorrected narrow palate. I would NOT, however, leave it at the one opinion. Go see 2 or even 3 more Ortho's opinions. Then, go from there.

 

Just FYI: my nephew needed very little help in his mouth. The biggest change they did in his orthodontic experience was to have his palate expanded and then just straightened the teeth that adjusted. He started the process at 8 and was done by 9.5. It cost my SIL and BIL in the neighborhood of $2500. They paid and the insurance reimbursed them.

 

Kris

[Mrs Mungo]

I am generally of the mindset that chiropractors and orthodontists will not turn down any patients referred to them..so I'm already skeptical going in..I need some experienced families to help me.

 

My 12 year old daughter does have a higher/narrower palate than her siblings. Her canine teeth are coming in over the top of the two they should be sliding down between...the good news is she lost two teeth that sit behind them and that opened up some space, so over the past 3months I've been watching them to see if they will settle in and her jaw will expand with them pushing their way down.

 

I never had braces and my teeth are straight, I took my son to see the ortho and the only issue my son had was that he had a baby tooth that had no permanent underneath..but it's holding firm and not moving so we simply built up the tooth so the upper teeth would not keep coming down onto the space and messing up his jawline...but this ortho wanted 5k to pull the baby tooth and reconfigure his bottom jawline...after I pressed and pressed for more options he said well, you could build up the baby tooth and see how long it will last, generally if it lasts past age 18, it will always stay there...that bill cost me $90...my son's teeth are STRAIGHT!! UGh.

 

So then I take my daughter to him and of course for the same 5k he wants to pull 2 permanent teeth and allow more room...I was against pulling permanent, and he said he could still straighten them out it would just take 6 months longer...

 

I'm just wondering if any of you had canines that were coming in front of the side teeth and how they settled in with or without braces..

 

So confusing...

Thanks!

Tara

 

I had this exact problem. I had two teeth pulled and wore braces for 13 months as an adult to correct it. I wish my parents had corrected it when I was young, it would have saved me other dental problems.

[Amber in AUS]

My sister is 18 and had a similar problem to your DD and DS. She was missing an eye tooth but the baby one went rotten and had to be pulled, it wasn't replaced and her teeth just closed over the gap. She also had her canine come infront of the baby teeth on the other side and on the bottom. The baby teeth did fall out of their own accord.

 

At 17 my Mum took her to the ortho. They said $25,000 to break her jaw, braces, the whole shabang. Her teeth are not aesthetically displeasing (she models) but she does have a narrow palate and a crowded jaw. Her teeth are not straight and perfect but don't effect her eating either. After pressing hard the ortho said she could go have her wisdom teeth out and see if that helped the crowding. She did that and wont be having any more work done. Having those teeth out has helped a bit.

 

I believe palate expansion needs to be done whilst the child is still growing hence my grown sister would need to have her jaw broken to fix it. My DD has her first adult teeth coming in under her tongue, i think she is going to need palate expansion but we will see someone soon so it can be fixed as she is growing.

 

I'd be getting a second opinion.

[Tenaj]

We are facing the same decision with our ds. He has gone through what we thought would be the first round of two rounds of orthodonic work. The first round did palate expansion and straightening but the ortho was sure that he would need a second round. Well, he's now 13, has all his permanent teeth and they loook great but last week he had a follow-up where the ortho is trying to convince me that we need to spend $4500 more because his bite is "slightly" off. I could not get a straight answer from this dr. as to whether this was just a "looks" issue or if it was a "health of the teeth" issue. Grrr . . .

 

Anyway, another idea for you, is that we are going to take him next week to our trusted dentist just to get his opinion on the whole situation. He doesn't have a monetary interest in our decision so I'm hopeful that I'll be able to get a straight answer out of him. Maybe that would help you with your dd?

[In The Great White North]

So then I take my daughter to him and of course for the same 5k he wants to pull 2 permanent teeth and allow more room...I was against pulling permanent, and he said he could still straighten them out it would just take 6 months longer...

 

 

!?!?!?! Why on earth would he want to pull permanent teeth over six months?

 

I would get another opinion. The palate expander does have to be done fairly young. Ask about just doing that and waiting to see what the teeth do afterwards.

[katemary63]

I am coming from the camp that the importance of nice looking teeth cannot be overestimated.

 

:iagree: Get a second opinion. Make sure the child ends up with good, straight teeth.

[Luckymama]

Get a second or third opinion. Dd15 had some serious crowding in her lower jaw before all permanent teeth were in----her front teeth were starting to overlap. An ortho wanted to pull 2 teeth to make room. The ortho we use does not have permanent teeth pulled except in very rare occasions. He timed the placement of braces for when the last baby teeth had fallen out and used that space (the permanent teeth in that position are actually smaller than the baby teeth) to shift her front teeth around. She has beautiful teeth now :)

 

Of course, this was lower jaw, not upper with a palate expander option.

[Jan in SC]

My ds is 8 and has a palate expander and a few braces now. His mouth already looks better and he hasn't complained about headaches in a long time. He has some friends that had their palates expanded at 3 and 4 years of age.

 

Not all orthos are bad. We visited several and ended up using a very conservative one. As your dd is already 12, your window of time for easily separating the palate is closing. I would have it checked out sooner rather than later.

[Laura Corin]

One dentist said that Calvin should get a palate expander when he was nine, in preparation for braces later. We got a second opinion that it was fine to wait and just do the braces. Calvin is almost out of braces - it's been a quick and easy process to straighten his (very) buck teeth.

 

Laura

[Natalieclare]

Has your dentist given an opinion yet? Our dentist is the one who talked to us about which kids needed orthodontic work and which didn't. I liked that he was willing to give his opinion, since he wasn't getting any reimbursement for recommending braces.

[Aggie]

We used an excellent pediatric dentist who was able to make a few minor adjustments. He pulled 2 teeth and used a permanent retainer for a year (or two?) Dd's orthodontist said she has the most perfect teeth he's seen in his 35 years of practice. (If you happen to be in upstate NY, I can give you the dentist's name!)

 

Our insurance covered his work. It did not cover braces.

[Teachin'Mine]

Second or even third opinion would be my suggestion. If they all say the same thing, then I'd feel more comfortable.

[Cinder]

If you're uncomfortable with the ortho go get a second or third or even fourth opinion. Find someone you're comfortable with!

 

Our situation is similar to yours. Ds1 had a baby tooth w/no permanent. His regular dentist said that as long as the tooth stayed in we shouldn't worry about it. Only if it fell out should we see an ortho about our options. Well, it fell out. It was a canine. Our options were (1) an implant or (2) close the gap. Ds voted to close the gap. It's a long process and it may not even work. But our ortho is very up-front with us as to how it's going and we're comfortable with his judgment.

 

Ds2 had the canines that came in too high and over the other teeth. It had been a long time and they weren't moving on their own. So we took him in (he actually started seeing the ortho long before ds1 did) and the braces helped move his teeth very quickly. He also had an underbite which was corrected. When ds's teeth were "bad" he wouldn't smile. Once his teeth were corrected he started smiling again. I didn't realize how much it embarrassed him before. :sad:

 

I'm glad we are able to get ortho treatment for our ds's. Dh and I never had ortho, but we have straight teeth. My brother OTOH had crooked teeth and a cross bite. Mom still regrets that she couldn't afford ortho treatment for db. As an adult db had to save up $$$$ for oral surgery and braces to correct his problem.

 

Hope you find an ortho you feel you can trust to do right by your family.

 

Cinder

[Ellie]

Get a second opinion, and if that opinion is the same, get the braces. Your dd will be everlastingly greatful to you.

[Kari C in SC]

I would get another opinion, maybe even two. We got 3 opinions on my ds' teeth. We went with the one we felt the most comfortable with. I am forever thankful we fixed his teeth. It made a huge improvement in his self esteem and as worth every penny.

[Dobela]

My dh has a snoring problem and other problems directly related to his mouth topography. If he had his palate and bite repaired as a child, it would have taken maybe a 2 year commitment in braces. Now, in his 40s, the dentists tell us that to repair his mouth he will need major oral surgery that includes breaking his jaw ands wiring it back together. He may have to have surgery twice to get his jaw where it needs to be. Then upwards of 4 years of braces. The cost? Over $40,000 out of pocket because we don't have insurance to cover it. That is more than he makes in 1 year so there is no way we can afford it.

 

The other problem: If his teeth need removal in the future, the way his palate lines up will mean that they can't make dentures to fit his mouth. HIs top teeth don't align over his lower enough to support one another. Yes, we are worried, and he is diligent about his teeth, but there are no guarantees that he won't need dentures later in life. His teeth are so arranged in part of his mouth that they are nearly impossible to clean even by professionals - his dentist is concerned that at some point they won't be able to stop any cavities that occur in those spaces since plaque can still build there.

 

So, yes, if your child is having problems, please check it out with more than one orthodontist. It can be a far more important issue than just having pretty teeth. And it may be easier and cheaper to repair it now than later.

[Barry Goldwater]

I am generally of the mindset that chiropractors and orthodontists will not turn down any patients referred to them..so I'm already skeptical going in..I need some experienced families to help me.

Tara

 

It's just like anything else...there are some excellent chiros & orthos out there, but many are just out to print money...you need to find one you can trust and that has viewpoints that are in harmony with yours...

 

We found our ortho after asking several like-minded families for a reference...the same doc's name kept coming up. We went to a consultation, and we're very happy now with his work (2 down, 2 to go.)

 

The narrow palate can be easy to fix at 12 yrs old, very difficult to fix (e.g. major surgery) after the palate fully fuses as an adult...our oldest had straight teeth, but had a cross bite, which was completely fixed with just a temporary appliance. Braces followed because the appliance made the teeth crooked! But all is good now.

Edited July 20, 2010 by Barry Goldwater

[AngieW in Texas]

I had all 3 of my kids at a pediatric dentist (oldest is now at a regular dentist). He told me that my oldest dd's teeth were absolutely perfect.

 

My middle dd has some crowding at the bottom, but her bite is fine. She could get braces to fix the very minor crowding, but it really isn't necessary to fix it. She is my Aspie and has a lot of sensory sensitivities. She nearly lost it at the thought of braces. We decided to forgo braces for her.

 

My youngest has major mouth issues and we've known about it since she was an infant. Her crowding was so bad that her first 2 adult teeth on top knocked out 4 baby teeth and took up all the space and her first 2 adult teeth on bottom knocked out 3 baby teeth and took up all that space. She hasn't lost any other baby teeth naturally - they've all had to be pulled. She had adult teeth coming in behind her other adult teeth like sharks have and she's had them come in halfway up her gums like fangs. Every time, the next baby teeth had to be pulled to make room for the adult teeth she already had.

 

The dentist wasn't happy with the ortho's plan to pull 4-6 adult teeth and then do 2 years of braces followed by 2 years of retainers. He sent me to the ortho he thought had the best results for my dd's mouth. This ortho is pretty sure he can get away with pulling no more than 2 adult teeth (and maybe none at all). He has already corrected my dd's cross-bite and has managed to get her fangs pulled into position. Now he has to make room for more adult teeth on the top and bottom. My dd still has 4 baby teeth, but because of the extensive amount of work she needs done, he had to get started with the braces early.

 

She may still need to have her jaw broken because her jaw is crooked and recessed. The ortho said that as long as it doesn't tilt more or recess more, she's fine. But if it moves further out of position, she will need to have orthognathic surgery.

[TwinMominTX]

I took my son to see the ortho and the only issue my son had was that he had a baby tooth that had no permanent underneath..but it's holding firm and not moving so we simply built up the tooth so the upper teeth would not keep coming down onto the space and messing up his jawline...but this ortho wanted 5k to pull the baby tooth and reconfigure his bottom jawline...after I pressed and pressed for more options he said well, you could build up the baby tooth and see how long it will last, generally if it lasts past age 18, it will always stay there...that bill cost me $90...my son's teeth are STRAIGHT!! UGh.

 

Not related to your original question, but I still have a baby tooth with no permanent tooth underneath. It is just now starting to loosen and I'm starting the process of getting it replaced right now. I am 37 years old. Those baby teeth can last forever!

[Mejane]

nm

Edited July 20, 2010 by Mejane
I didn't actually answer the question.

[justasque]

I am 48 and still have a baby tooth. Pulling these teeth is outdated practice. (I discussed it with our ortho, as ds is in the same boat.)

 

My experience was that most patients just accept what the ortho says without question. Once my ortho realized that we were interested in understanding and discussing his plan, and that we had goals/priorities that may have been different than his assumptions, he was very open with us and quite happy to take the approach that we preferred. If yours does not respond like this, then find another.

[Matryoshka]

I am 48 and still have a baby tooth. Pulling these teeth is outdated practice. (I discussed it with our ortho, as ds is in the same boat.)

 

:iagree: I am 45 and still have a baby tooth. It's my 1-year molar!

 

I have no opinion on the other situation, where teeth are growing in the wrong place. That would worry me more - but I'd get a second and third opinion.

Edited July 20, 2010 by matroyshka

[Peela]

ds14 has some very strange teeth configurations and has just got braces, even though I am really not into unnecessary interference. He is good looking but his wonky teeth were affecting his self esteem ,even how he smiled. It is costing us $7000 over 18 months. What to do! he is fine with them.

I feel ok about our orthodontist They obviously don't need the business,as they are so busy . it is expensive but they all are....get a second opinion and then just do it.

[TXMomof4]

My canine teeth were very prominent and I didn't get braces til after dh and I were married. I hate looking at my wedding pictures. My parents couldn't afford orthodontics, but I wish I had a pretty smile in my wedding pictures.

[ouzel]

Get at least three opinions on this! There are things that can be done when you are young that can't be done later!!!

[chai]

I agree that you should get another opinion. Most conservative orthos will not pull teeth unless absolutely necessary--if the upfront plan is to pull teeth, I would be concerned with the recommendation.

Twelve is not too old for a palate expander. My dd is 11; her mouth expanded to where it needed to be in just three months. It made room for her permanent teeth and her other teeth are already straighter although she'll still need braces. Our plan has one set price for everything, $3500 (expansion and braces).

[Maddysmom26]

Her canine teeth are coming in over the top of the two they should be sliding down between...

 

 

We just had a dental visit for my daughter and the dentist told me that my daughter has the same problem. Her 2 canines are high up and over top of her others.

 

She recommended a visit to the orthodontist.... Im hestitant because shes so young.. she will 10 in august. Those teeth are not even coming through yet.. in fact the one side she hasnt lost the baby teeth yet.

 

I would say to get a few different opinions. I personally think they should wait until late teens for braces.. I just do not see a point in gettng them so early.

 

Im really not sure what to do either!

[Maddysmom26]

We used an excellent pediatric dentist who was able to make a few minor adjustments. He pulled 2 teeth and used a permanent retainer for a year (or two?) Dd's orthodontist said she has the most perfect teeth he's seen in his 35 years of practice. (If you happen to be in upstate NY, I can give you the dentist's name!)

 

Our insurance covered his work. It did not cover braces.

 

 

 

Where in Upstate are you??

I found a great pediatric Dentist in Latham NY! We travel about an hour to get there, but has been worth it!!

[ma23peas]

Thank you all so much for your responses...it reaffirms that it's serious enough to get several opinions.

 

This ortho came highly recommended, and I think the issue is that he errs more on the side of aesthetics while I am all about having solid healthy teeth that will last them their life. After I told him my son was having his baby tooth built up he said although my son had plenty of space he had a 30% something and he wanted my son to have a 28%...because the 'look' would be better...like I said, my son's teeth are straight and beautiful! Then I noticed something in his office...he puts a picture of every after patient on his walls...fairly big 8x10's..as I began to look closer, all the 'perfect ones' were at eyesline or above and the not so perfect ones were next to the floor! He's a wonderful man and very caring, but I think he's very much into the looks...a bit above the function.

 

Her dentist had recommended a palate extender at 8...with any of my other children I would have not questioned it..but this particular child has a very very low threshold for pain...I think it's physiological not psychological...she's the type that if she gets a mosquito bite her body has a horrific reaction, she's had infections the size of baseballs...she even had shingles at age 6!! I just didn't want to take the chance of something going wrong at that age....when she could not really understand why we were doing this to her.

 

Their dentist has also had a history of taking xrays before their time (insurance pays for one set a year but he'd take them both times, I finally refused to pay b/c I said I would only follow my insurance plan) then he wanted to have him pull two baby teeth, they were already loose and they came out 1 week later on their own! He also wanted to put some type of sealant on 3 teeth that were baby teeth and came out 2 months later! My children are 15, 12, 11 and none have every had cavities or even hints of one so why sealants on babies? UGH...I just feel like I'm walking into a slot machine everytime I enter their offices...I just want healthy teeth for a healthy life...

 

I am seeking a second opinion today!!!

Tara

[LisaKinVA]

My 12 year old daughter does have a higher/narrower palate than her siblings. Her canine teeth are coming in over the top of the two they should be sliding down between...the good news is she lost two teeth that sit behind them and that opened up some space, so over the past 3months I've been watching them to see if they will settle in and her jaw will expand with them pushing their way down.

 

They may settle down, they may not. I would seek an ortho with a less invasive approach, though. Pallet expanders do for narrow (but not short) pallets, what head-gears to for buck-teeth :D

 

 

 

I would have run (not walked) my child out of this office. I am missing 9 permanent teeth -- so I know a little bit about the options. In my case (which is pretty rare, and pretty severe, as 7 of the 9 missing teeth are on my upper jaw), the recommended practice is MUCH different from one single missing tooth.

 

My oldest son is only missing one tooth, and has very nice teeth. He will keep that baby tooth as long as possible (it even has sealant on it, which they normally reserve for permanent teeth). We have told him, that once he is done growing, we will pay for his one tooth to be replaced with an implant. My son, even though he has nice teeth... does not have room for his eye teeth to come in properly, and will need braces for about a year. My oldest daughter is a complete tooth nightmare. We've already had teeth pulled, but she lacks gum tissue, and at some point will need a graft as well. We opted for teeth pulling now (because her teeth were coming in under her tongue and NOT moving forward). There are apparent problems with all 5 of our children...we just don't know the full extent for the youngest 3 as yet.

[Mrs Mungo]

!?!?!?! Why on earth would he want to pull permanent teeth over six months?

 

That's not what he was saying. He was saying not pulling the 2 teeth and doing braces only would take 6 months longer than pulling the 2 teeth and doing braces.

[Aggie]

Where in Upstate are you??

I found a great pediatric Dentist in Latham NY! We travel about an hour to get there, but has been worth it!!

 

We were outside of Albany on I80 and drove 1.5hrs to get to Clifton Park. It was worth it, though!