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Yet another reason to homeschool: School spys on kids through laptop webcams

wulfbourne
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wulfbourne

wulfbourne

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A federal class action claims a suburban school district has been spying on students and families through the "indiscriminant use of and ability to remotely activate the webcams incorporated into each laptop issued to students," without the knowledge or consent of students or parents. The named plaintiffs say they learned that Big Brother was in their home when an assistant principal told their son that the school district knew he "was engaged in improper behavior in his home, and cited as evidence a photograph from the webcam embedded in minor plaintiff's personal laptop issued by the school district."

 

 

The families say the Lower Merion School District issued Webcam-equipped personal laptop computers to each of its approximately 1,800 high school students: in Harriton High School in Rosemont, and Lower Merion High School in Ardmore. The schools issued the computers as part of a "one-to-one" laptop computer initiative lauded by Superintendent Christopher McGinley as an effort that "enhances opportunities for ongoing collaboration, and ensures that all students have 24/7 access to school based resources and the ability to seamlessly work on projects and research at school and at home."

 

 

But the parents and students say that, without their knowledge, the access went both ways. Nowhere in any "written documentation accompanying the laptop," or in any "documentation appearing on any Web site or handed out to students or parents concerning the use of the laptop," was any reference made "to the fact that the school district has the ability to remotely activate the embedded webcam at any time the school district wished to intercept images from that webcam of anyone or anything appearing in front of the camera," the complaint states.

 

http://www.courthousenews.com/2010/02/18/24789.htm

 

 

Who the heck do they think they are trying to control kids while they are at home?! I am so mad right now I don't even know what to say. Ugggg.

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SproutMamaK

SproutMamaK

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Seriously? These are high school students! Sorry, but I can only imagine the sorts of things that are going to happen i nthe same room as a computer (for homework, often theri bedroom) that these kids could have been "spied" on while doing. Technically, couldn't that school board then be ruled as both facilitating the making of and being in possession of child pornography?

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wulfbourne

wulfbourne

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Seriously? These are high school students! Sorry, but I can only imagine the sorts of things that are going to happen i nthe same room as a computer (for homework, often theri bedroom) that these kids could have been "spied" on while doing. Technically, couldn't that school board then be ruled as both facilitating the making of and being in possession of child pornography?

 

The lawyers have that covered in the suit:

 

Should discovery disclose that Defendants are in possession of images constituting child pornography within the meaning of 18 Pa. C.S.A. Section 6312, et. seq., Plaintiffs will amend this Complaint to assert a cause of action there under.

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wulfbourne

wulfbourne

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My wife and I have a little song we sing when we hear about things like this. It has only one lyric and we repeat it in whatever tune pops into our head:

:party: "Homeschool!" :party:

 

LMAO. I picture that being sung to the same way the hyena's in the lion king sang "No King, No King, la la la la la la" Just change it to "home school, home school, la la la la la la".

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AuntieM

AuntieM

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LMAO. I picture that being sung to the same way the hyena's in the lion king sang "No King, No King, la la la la la la" Just change it to "home school, home school, la la la la la la".

 

Around here we sing it to the Star Wars Theme tune, a la Bill Murray.

 

Is it possible this story is bogus? I can hardly believe that (even) in an entire school district, not one person could foresee such an outcome...

 

Off for a roll of tape....

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wulfbourne

wulfbourne

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Around here we sing it to the Star Wars Theme tune, a la Bill Murray.

 

Is it possible this story is bogus? I can hardly believe that (even) in an entire school district, not one person could foresee such an outcome...

 

Off for a roll of tape....

 

The lawsuit is definitely filed and it's being reported by a LOT of news outlets. I guess we'll have to wait for discovery to find out if the principle was FOS and if the school district really obtained information from the webcams while children were at home.

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wulfbourne

wulfbourne

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Right now, the school district is denying it. They are saying this is the first they've ever heard of it. I wonder if an overzealous principal was bluffing to get someone to confess to something.

 

Looking forward to seeing this play out.

 

Barb

 

I don't know, according to another article:

 

A law suit filed by a Lower Merion teen and his parents alleges Harriton High School Assistant Principal Lindy Matsko showed the student a picture taken remotely by school software on a Web camera on his laptop.

 

The assistant principal allegedly told the unnamed student the image showed he was doing something wrong inside his house, MyFoxPhilly.com reported.

 

When the boy's father confronted Matsko, the suit claims Matsko acknowledged the school could turn on the Web cam and take pictures whenever it wanted to.

 

So the principle showed the photo and told the dad that they could operate the webcams remotely. If none of this is true than the principle at the very least is guilty of lying and should be forced to step down.

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wulfbourne

wulfbourne

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Link to a news article, anyone?

 

I have a link to the first article I read in my OP, but here are some more.

 

http://content.usatoday.com/communities/ondeadline/post/2010/02/school-district-accused-of-issuing-webcam-laptops-to-spy-on-students/1

 

http://tech.yahoo.com/blogs/null/160661

 

http://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/local-beat/School-Spies-on-Students-at-Home-with-Webcams-Suit-84712852.html

 

 

 

If you google "Lower Merion School District" and go to the news section there are more articles as well.

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KristenS

KristenS

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Wow, I had no idea webcams could do that.

 

Makes me want to unplug the one on the Wii that came with the Your Shape exercise game ... because I know we look totally ridiculous exercising in our jammies, never mind all the other family stuff that probably goes on in front of that stupid camera.

 

creeeeepy

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RegGuheert

RegGuheert

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That must be a very wealthy community.
I don't know about this community, but the school system showcased in the Frontline Digital Nation episode which was doing this was one of the poorest in the New York City system. In that show, they even have a bit showing how the vice principal was spying on kids in the class using the issued laptops. We had a brief discussion of Digital Nation here on the WTM boards.
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Parrothead

Parrothead

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Right now, the school district is denying it. They are saying this is the first they've ever heard of it. I wonder if an overzealous principal was bluffing to get someone to confess to something.

 

Looking forward to seeing this play out.

 

Barb

It seems that it would be a bit difficult and time consuming. I could see this type thing happening on school grounds, but who has a router that encompasses the entire school district? The school officials would have to have the IP addresses of each student's family, hack the home system, find the correct laptop to activate the camera.

 

Otherwise the cameras (are all the computers in the district on the same frequency?) would have to be activated remotely at the same time (who wants to activate several hundred cameras individually) to record the goings on of the student (if the laptop is even open). Then the recording would have to be downloaded from the harddrive for faculty to watch.

 

And speaking fo faculty watching, Who is watching several hundred laptops at one time to check for inappropriate behavior.

 

What seems likely is that the student in question when to an inappropriate website while at home and his laptop internet history was checked.

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DarlaS

DarlaS

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It seems that it would be a bit difficult and time consuming. I could see this type thing happening on school grounds, but who has a router that encompasses the entire school district?

 

Who knows how they did it, but the article (The Philly one) actually stated they had the capability of doing this in case a computer was stolen--and that it had been done several times. They would activate the camera, find it's IP address and snap a pic of the thief.

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Mrs Mungo

Mrs Mungo

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http://media.philly.com/documents/robbins17.pdf The filed complaint is here. This is so afoul of the US Constitution I cannot even express it adequately.

 

I completely agree, if it's true that such images were captured.

 

Right now, the school district is denying it. They are saying this is the first they've ever heard of it. I wonder if an overzealous principal was bluffing to get someone to confess to something.

 

 

From reading the complaint, it sounds like Matsko *said* he had a photo and Robbins verified that capturing such photos was *possible*. It doesn't sound like the student or parents *saw* such a photo. Lots of things are *possible*. It's *possible* for someone to hack your cellphone and use it as a listening device and/or capture photos with it but it's not easy or likely that someone is randomly doing that. eta: *Most* laptops and cell phones sold today have this capability, whether or not it's likely someone actually used it is another matter. It might be more likely that the laptops could capture photos and would upload them to the school's server when they were plugged back into the school's system, that would be a lot easier but still not very likely imo. I think it's more likely that Matsko was bluffing.

 

 

You never get something for nothing though...too good to be true and all that jazz.

 

I wonder what kind of disclaimers and waivers the students and parents had to sign.

Edited by Mrs Mungo
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nono

nono

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Interesting! I don't know any public high schools where each student has a school laptop for home use. That must be a very wealthy community. Someone is in big trouble.

 

Uh, yes it is. The kind where many of the families have family lawyers. Of all the places for this to happen...

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mcconnellboys

mcconnellboys

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So, they could see people - minor children - in the household walking around in various states of undress, for instance? How could they be allowed to do something like that? They couldn't just hear what was going on, but could actually SEE, right? And even if the computer was not in use, but just present (wouldn't it have to be on? does everyone leave theirs on all the time?)

 

This just doesn't make any sense on so many levels. I don't see how the company could chance a huge, class-action lawsuit by selling computers with this capability to a school district.....????

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KidsHappen

KidsHappen

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It seems that it would be a bit difficult and time consuming. I could see this type thing happening on school grounds, but who has a router that encompasses the entire school district? The school officials would have to have the IP addresses of each student's family, hack the home system, find the correct laptop to activate the camera.

 

Otherwise the cameras (are all the computers in the district on the same frequency?) would have to be activated remotely at the same time (who wants to activate several hundred cameras individually) to record the goings on of the student (if the laptop is even open). Then the recording would have to be downloaded from the harddrive for faculty to watch.

 

And speaking fo faculty watching, Who is watching several hundred laptops at one time to check for inappropriate behavior.

 

What seems likely is that the student in question when to an inappropriate website while at home and his laptop internet history was checked.

 

Well, my hubby is a consultant in the computer industry and he says it is possible hence him taping over his camera. He has taken a few classes in internet security and the stuff he tells me is scary. Your average hacker can do things that would absolutely blow your mind. Someone with a little more know-how can do a whole lot more and the things that the government (and other private entities) is/are doing to combat these things well, let's just say they wouldn't even remotely pass constitutional muster.

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Renee in NC

Renee in NC

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It seems that it would be a bit difficult and time consuming. I could see this type thing happening on school grounds, but who has a router that encompasses the entire school district? The school officials would have to have the IP addresses of each student's family, hack the home system, find the correct laptop to activate the camera.

 

Otherwise the cameras (are all the computers in the district on the same frequency?) would have to be activated remotely at the same time (who wants to activate several hundred cameras individually) to record the goings on of the student (if the laptop is even open). Then the recording would have to be downloaded from the harddrive for faculty to watch.

 

And speaking fo faculty watching, Who is watching several hundred laptops at one time to check for inappropriate behavior.

 

What seems likely is that the student in question when to an inappropriate website while at home and his laptop internet history was checked.

 

It isn't that hard at all. If they loaded the laptop with something like Log Me On before they handed them out, they could access any computer on and attached to the web.

 

I've done it with clients in the past. (Only legitimate reasons, I promise!:D)

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asta

asta

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It seems that it would be a bit difficult and time consuming. I could see this type thing happening on school grounds, but who has a router that encompasses the entire school district? The school officials would have to have the IP addresses of each student's family, hack the home system, find the correct laptop to activate the camera.

 

Otherwise the cameras (are all the computers in the district on the same frequency?) would have to be activated remotely at the same time (who wants to activate several hundred cameras individually) to record the goings on of the student (if the laptop is even open). Then the recording would have to be downloaded from the harddrive for faculty to watch.

 

And speaking fo faculty watching, Who is watching several hundred laptops at one time to check for inappropriate behavior.

 

What seems likely is that the student in question when to an inappropriate website while at home and his laptop internet history was checked.

 

Number 2.

 

 

a

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Sebastian (a lady)

Sebastian (a lady)

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My hubby has a laptop from work and he tapes a piece of paper over the lense to the camera for just such reasons. People call him paranoid but obviously he has good reason to be in this scociety. :glare:

 

Yeah, my kids wonder why I keep my webcam covered too.

 

I would think that this case would have all sorts of interesting angles. Unreasonable search and siezure? Illegial wiretapping? Misuse of government property?

 

But I can't say that I'm all that shocked. My opinion is that the schools will pretty much do whatever they want under the guise of doing it "for the children." That is a covering that can be justify an awful lot.

 

I an so thankful to have an alternative. There is a classroom at the local base school that is so sub par that at least four families have quit school from this one classroom in order to homeschool. Yet it seems to be business as usual in the class.

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Mrs Mungo

Mrs Mungo

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update this morning:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100219/ap_on_bi_ge/us_laptops_spying_on_students

 

PHILADELPHIA – A suburban Philadelphia school district accused of spying on students at home via school-issued computers told parents it only activated the webcams to find missing laptops.

 

 

The schools' technology and security departments would activate the webcam when any of the 2,300 student laptops were reported lost or stolen, Lower Merion School District Superintendent Christopher McGinley said. He posted the letter to parents on the district Web site late Thursday, amid widespread student outrage and the filing of a potential class-action lawsuit alleging wiretap and privacy violations.

 

 

"The security feature's capabilities were limited to taking a still image of the operator and the operator's screen. This feature was only used for the narrow purpose of locating a lost, stolen or missing laptop," McGinley wrote. "The District never activated the security feature for any other purpose or in any other manner whatsoever."

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Mrs Mungo

Mrs Mungo

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http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20100221/2118128243.shtml

 

Update.

 

Was it drugs, smoking, shaving the dog, starting small fires?

 

Nope. It was candy.

 

Video Link:

 

http://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/tech/WebcamGate_Family_s_Attorney___Who_Has_Access__Philadelphia.html

 

What?? That is CRAZY! I'm interested in seeing what the school has to say after that.

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Hen

Hen

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the VP won't lose her job, it will be impossible to fire her, even after this. At worst, the VP will get paid administrative leave until retirement, in the hopes that everyone will forget all about this as the years pass. Seen it happen here in my area.

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GESTEP

GESTEP

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My hubby has a laptop from work and he tapes a piece of paper over the lense to the camera for just such reasons. People call him paranoid but obviously he has good reason to be in this scociety. :glare:

 

I am glad I am not the only one to do this:lol:

 

 

Gina

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mcconnellboys

mcconnellboys

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I'm still laughing (and crying) over this one! SO, let's review:

 

WHY was the vice princi-pal observing this child? They did not suspect drug abuse first and then observe. They observed, mis-read what they saw, and continued to observe more, I guess, then accused - which is when all this came out.

 

The school said they only activated these cameras in case of loss of the computers. But there is no allegation that this computer was lost/stolen. So why was a camera activated at all?

 

The school personnel saw someone popping pills like candy and didn't wonder that the child was at school the next day - having avoided what would certainly have been a massive overdose??????

 

The more I hear about this story, the more it looks like the school personnel were very stupidly mishandling this add-on to their computers. I see no way that it would really be useful to them for theft purposes, anyway, except if a student lied and said the computer was lost/stolen when they really still had it at their home. Because if anyone else took it, unless there's also a GPS installed, how are they going to identify that stranger and FIND them, LOL?????

 

This is just beginning to sound like a very good reason why technology such as this should not be allowed. We simply can not trust that it will not be misused.....

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