How many heathens here?

[KarenNC]

Was there a Heathen result on the religion quiz? I only saw neo-pagan. In my experience, people who call themselves neo-pagan tend to be wiccan, and people who call themselves Heathen tend to be Norse or Greek reconstructionists.

 

We're pretty active in the Hellenic community (well, at least online, don't think there are any other Hellenic polytheists in our neck of the woods) and I can't say that I've run into any Greek reconstructionists who call themselves Heathen. I'd say that is pretty specifically Norse/Germanic, when using a capital "H".

 

I do wish more folks realized that "Neopagan" *doesn't* equal "Wiccan", but I'm afraid that's an uphill battle (sigh).

 

Now, with a small "h", that's a different matter----I've been classified as a "heathen" for any great number of things, including when I was very actively trying to be Christian:D. Have to admit having my grandmother refer to us as "a bunch of little heathens" for running around wildly at her house carried somewhat less of a religious connotation than is meant here ;)--though she tended to pronounce it more as "heathern".

 

So, we are Hellenic polytheistic Neopagan Unitarian Universalists with Buddhist and Shinto influences (for lack of a more concise term :D), so I guess we fit the general drift of the meaning of "heathen" as "not a member of whichever particular branch of an Abrahamic religion is using the term".

[dawn of ns]

I find it interesting that while you talk about respect for people's beliefs, some of you (and your children) align yourselves with a website that makes fun of Christianity. Is this "respect" one-sided?

 

I'm not sure poking fun equals disrespect. Even as a Christian I used to poke a lot of fun at my own religion.

 

Regardless, I didn't start the thread to start a debate, just to give the atheists and agnostics (and all of the other fellow weirdos here :D) a place to say, "we're here!" Gets a little lonely sometimes on most homeschooling boards when you're outside the assumed norm.

[jenn-]

Count me in too! I am pretty much atheist, but weird habitual conversations still come out sounding like "let's pray that doesn't happen" even though I haven't prayed for anything since I was in college, and that was probably when I was was peeing on a stick over DD. (You know the "if I'm not pregnant I will never do xyz again" kind of prayer.)

[Paula in PA]

All this ridiculous talk about pasta when we COULD be talking about the truth that is the Invisible Pink Unicorn.

 

Dd saw this while reading over my shoulder and would very much like to know more about the Invisible Pink Unicorn. She adores unicorns and has mentioned several times about "praying to the unicorn", so, um, could this be it? :tongue_smilie:

[PiCO]

We're pretty active in the Hellenic community (well, at least online, don't think there are any other Hellenic polytheists in our neck of the woods) and I can't say that I've run into any Greek reconstructionists who call themselves Heathen. I'd say that is pretty specifically Norse/Germanic, when using a capital "H".

 

 

I'm sorry to have mispoken of you! I've only met one Greek reconstructionist, and he refered to himself as Heathen. I assumed this was normal. Thanks for the correction.

[KarenNC]

I'm sorry to have mispoken of you! I've only met one Greek reconstructionist, and he refered to himself as Heathen. I assumed this was normal. Thanks for the correction.

 

Not a problem, I just hadn't come across that in the general course of things. There are lots of reconstructionists of various sorts who wouldn't call themselves Neopagan, either (and get offended if anyone else does so), so it gets to be a toss-up as to which terms are actually useful in describing the broad community.:)

 

We actually consider ourselves as revivalists than reconstructionists, so that may also be a point of difference, not sure. My husband's been involved in several discussions with groups of pretty strict Hellenic reconstructionists over the years, though, and hadn't come across anyone using the term "Heathen" as a self-descriptor either, so it may have been more of an individual thing with the person you met. We're more interested in approaching the religion as an evolving, dynamic relationship between the Gods and us as 21st century Americans (in our case :)) rather than in trying to strictly recreate ancient Hellenic ritual forms. We do look to them as a guideline, but not as an absolute model. Probably a nuance that doesn't really matter to anyone outside the community, but there you go;). What would we do as Pagans (or homeschoolers or what have you) if we couldn't nitpick shades of differences?:D

[Pam "SFSOM" in TN]

I've had similar battles with myself. Growing up with religious people I felt like how on earth could I believe nothing. So then I figured, perhaps I just believe something else. Maybe my idea of "god" is just different. But for some time now I really just don't believe in a god. And I feel fine. In fact, I have never felt more at peace.

 

I guess what I do miss is the "club" aspect of religion. I just can't pretend anymore though.

 

And I miss the community.

 

I liked when JennifersLost said her religion was kindness. It sounds better than Agnostic Christian (and doesn't make other people rilly rilly rilly mad).

[KAR120C]

As "How many Heathers here"... and thinking, "sheesh, like a gazillion!" :lol:

 

Gotta get new glasses.... ;)

[JudyJudyJudy]

I'm an atheist. Whenever I take those online religion tests, the results show Secular Humanism, Unitarian Universalism, or Nontheist.

[funschooler5]

I am at a point of letting it all go. I am tired of "covering up" who I am which is why I have pretty much pulled out of all the hs'ing group activities in our area. It is nice that they can be themselves now. I remember when we were part of a co-op and I would have my ds change out of the Harry Potter shirt he put on if it was co-op day because I didn't want to have to deal with the questions/comments that would arise because of it. I never claimed to be religious, but I wouldn't volunteer that I was not. Though, in the past few years I have been more open about the fact that we are secular. :)

 

This describes our situation exactly. I just haven't really told anyone about our non-beliefs, because we are in a very religious hs community. I'm going to start to be a little more open about it, though, because as my children get older they are able to participate in some of the extra curricular activities in the local public school.

 

By the way, my results of the test were 100% Secular Humanist, and I think that's the term I'm going to use from now on. I always thought "agnostic" sounded too wishy-washy and "atheist" just scares the heck out of a lot of people. :lol:

[JudyJudyJudy]

This describes our situation exactly. I just haven't really told anyone about our non-beliefs, because we are in a very religious hs community. I'm going to start to be a little more open about it, though, because as my children get older they are able to participate in some of the extra curricular activities in the local public school.

 

By the way, my results of the test were 100% Secular Humanist, and I think that's the term I'm going to use from now on. I always thought "agnostic" sounded too wishy-washy and "atheist" just scares the heck out of a lot of people. :lol:

You sound a lot like me. When I finally "came out" to my sisters, they freaked. They still argue with me that I'm not really an atheist. One sister is still convinced that an atheist is a devil worshipper; I can't make her understand that I don't believe in the devil just as I don't believe in god/gods.

 

I am fortunate that I found a secular homeschool group. Oddly enough, though, there are more Christians than others in it, mainly because we have a lot of good classes. I think it's a pretty good mix actually. On the other hand, I don't think I could ever "come out" in my son's fencing club.

[Rosie_0801]

People can't simply choose to believe something. They will know they are lying to themselves.

 

Perhaps, but they can choose to pretend to. I don't believe in my theory of reincarnation, but it's such a nice theory I wish I did.

:)

Rosie

[plimsoll]

Cast off your sandal, follow the gourd!

 

No! Follow the Holy Sandal! He has given us a Sign!

[keptwoman]

I always laughingly call myself heathen.

 

I don't know what I am. Somewhere on the slider between agnostic and atheist. I grew up in a Christian home and I've felt so much more at peace since I gave it all up. Of course I'm sure Christians would say I'm in denial but I don't think so and if I am, denial is good :rofl:

[KidsHappen]

I have done a lot of reading and I have never read anything and had the, this is exactly what I believe thought, not even a, this is kind of close to what I believe thought. Surprisingly though, several of my children have described their beliefs as very similar to mine without me ever having communicated my beliefs to them. We definitely do not fall into any organized religion that I have ever heard of though. I am not even a square peg trying to fit in a round hole. I am more like a Picasso shaped peg trying to even find a hole. :001_smile:

[Karen sn]

Was there a Heathen result on the religion quiz? I only saw neo-pagan. In my experience, people who call themselves neo-pagan tend to be wiccan, and people who call themselves Heathen tend to be Norse or Greek reconstructionists.

 

Greek reconstructionists?

I thought I'd heard everything.

 

OP: I am agnostic, like non pushy Jews and Christians, love to celebrate the Wiccan tradition, hug trees.....

[Mom to Aly]

I thought most Christians considered you a heathen if you weren't their religion. I'm a Hindu, but according to "The Test" I am a Mahayana Buddhist (which I adore--it is very into nature, but it is atheistic, which I am not), but I do prefer Hinduism. So I don't consider myself a heathen, I am extremely religious, have never had a moment's doubt as to God's existence, truly, never wavered at all--but I guess it would depend upon whom you asked.

[keptwoman]

Why would you be sad at someone elses choice for their own beliefs which give them peace? Just because you feel there is no point without God doesn't mean everyone else feels that way.

[JudyJudyJudy]

I'm just sad...

 

My faith was really reinforced to me last week at WDW. I was sitting in Ellen's Energy Adventure watching that long, drawn-out evolutionary thing they do (it's quite entertaining), and it made me realize just how much of a crock I really do believe that is, and how I KNOW when I look at all the beautiful creations on this earth, that they couldn't have been created by accident.

 

I KNOW that God had a plan for this earth. I KNOW, when I see a newborn baby, that there is one truly AWESOME creator who made that newborn. I don't for the life of me see how anyone can look around them at all of the wonderful things on this earth and not respect at least the idea of a creator. How in the world could anyone believe that any of this just happened?

 

And my hubby (who is so NOT a vocal Christian by any stretch) said to me once that, "If you don't believe in God, and something beyond what we have now, what's the point?" I have to agree!

Oh, you just converted me! Thank you so much! :lol:

[nukeswife]

Count me in!!

 

I was always told as a child I was "Catholic" because that's what I was baptized but that was only to make my Grandmother happy. We never went to church. After getting married I went through all the classes so dh and I could get married in the Church but it never seemed to fit either of us. After many years of searching we're just done. I took the test and it says I'm a Secular Humanist and I'm good with that. I'm happy with who I am. I'm at peace with my life and beliefs so what else do I need.

 

I'm glad to see there are many like me out there.

 

Now as a joke when someone asks what religion we are because they assume that since we're homeschoolers that we're religious fanatics my dh will say were "United Vegetarians" because our kids love veggietales DVDs. Some may not find that funny but we get a chuckle out of it

[Peek a Boo]

 

I too tend to gravitate towards secular boards.

 

I just think there is an assumption in our area that you home school for religious reasons. I remember being really turned off at homeschool gathering when the lead speaker suggested that we all agreed that "The Golden Compass" was a movie that we shouldn't see. I will make that decision for myself' date=' thank you. [b']Please offer up your arguments and don't just make a blanket statement...[/b]

 

FWIW, I was also turned off to my library's book group because the discussion leader said, "I think we all agree that George Bush stole the election." Um, no.... I didn't know I was at a covert meeting of the DNC, I thought I was at a BOOK discussion group meeting?

 

"Groupthink" turns me off.

 

 

i tend to have the same rant about that ;)

 

as a Christian that doesn't homeschool for religious reasons, the circle is small.

 

I think that what we do within the confines of our homes and our private thoughts and conversations within family or like-minded circles should not be analyzed nor ridiculed. It is how we conduct ourselves around others who believe differently than we do that matters.

 

====

Bottom line: I am sure that there are things that others giggle about in their discussions with their families and friends that I would be completely offended by. That's okay. But, I need to be given the same privilege to giggle.

 

I don't think i agree with that bolded part. I prefer the definition of character as that which we do when nobody else is around.

 

i *do* agree that we all tend to slip from time to time.

 

but i LOVE satire :D

 

especially this:

 

Yes, but where does his true allegiance lie?

 

A conservative Pastafarian who believes salvation is only available through al dente freshly prepared noodles?

 

A mainline Pastafarian who extends possibilty of salvation to rice and potato based pasta worshippers as well as the traditional wheat pastas?

 

Or one of those leftish liberal Pastafarians who embrace and welcome ALL noodle worshippers, including those brightly colored long cylindrical styrofoam noodles used for water play?

 

 

I could almost see myself joining the pirates ;)

[Peela]

Plenty, I think, if you mean "non christian".

I came up as neo pagan, even though I don't identify with that, it's obviously the closest that questionnaire can peg me.

I don't feel the need to believe anything, but I feel I have an open mind and don't discount other peoples' experiences (whether they are of angels or of Mary or Jesus appearing to them, or fairies, or whatever). I do have an attraction to the more nature based religions, as well as religions which see us all as potentially, or actually, God, or the universal intelligent life force in some way or another....not that we have to obey anything, or believe anything at all, to earn it, but that it is self evident and simply reality when one wakes up out of the collective dream. Dont peg me down to any dogma though, I cant go there.

[fivetails]

Got room in the thread for a heathen-friendly Christian? :lol:

 

Yeah I'm a Christian now - but as a child I was raised atheist, as a teenager I poked my nose into all sorts of different beliefs (from Wicca to LDS to JW to Buddhism to all kinds of other stuff - I ran away from home and met a lot of interesting people over the next few years)..... :)

 

I'm raising the kids as Christians, but I'm also raising them to respect the beliefs of others. We have friends who are Christians, friends who are Agnostic, friends who are Atheists, friends who have never discussed their faith or beliefs or such with us so we have no idea what they believe or don't believe, and friends who think we're completely goofy. It's all good. :D

[JWSJ]

Straight-up atheist - was raised as a Catholic but it never had any hold on me. I don't advertise being atheist. It's been my experience that once found out relationships tend to whither with the religious. But, if asked directly, I will be honest. I avoid the subject.

[fivetails]

I don't advertise being atheist. It's been my experience that once found out relationships tend to whither with the religious.

 

That sucks. :(

 

I'm sorry you've had that experience :grouphug: - friendships should be built on so much more than what a person happens to believe about the origins of the world or what happens after we leave it.

[sgilli3]

Im agnostic.

The kids are fascinated with religion, so we spend time studying all religions, and I enjoy reading all the literature...but thats it for me.

 

My middle DD calls herself a Christian, and reads a bible- and we are OK with that....

 

What ever religious path our children do or do not choose, I will still love and respect them, just as I love and respect my friends and family who are Christians, Muslims, Hindus,Sikhs etc... each to their own.

 

 

PS- Hi Dawn !!!! :D

[dawn of ns]

Got room in the thread for a heathen-friendly Christian? :lol:

 

Yeah I'm a Christian now - but as a child I was raised atheist, as a teenager I poked my nose into all sorts of different beliefs (from Wicca to LDS to JW to Buddhism to all kinds of other stuff - I ran away from home and met a lot of interesting people over the next few years)..... :)

 

I'm raising the kids as Christians, but I'm also raising them to respect the beliefs of others. We have friends who are Christians, friends who are Agnostic, friends who are Atheists, friends who have never discussed their faith or beliefs or such with us so we have no idea what they believe or don't believe, and friends who think we're completely goofy. It's all good. :D

 

Oh heck, I should have just labeled it something like, "Do you feel like an outsider on homeschooling board because of your beliefs/lack of beliefs?" I know that can certainly happen even when you are a Christian!

[fivetails]

Got room in the thread for a heathen-friendly Christian? :lol:

 

Yeah I'm a Christian now - but as a child I was raised atheist, as a teenager I poked my nose into all sorts of different beliefs (from Wicca to LDS to JW to Buddhism to all kinds of other stuff - I ran away from home and met a lot of interesting people over the next few years)..... :)

 

I'm raising the kids as Christians, but I'm also raising them to respect the beliefs of others. We have friends who are Christians, friends who are Agnostic, friends who are Atheists, friends who have never discussed their faith or beliefs or such with us so we have no idea what they believe or don't believe, and friends who think we're completely goofy. It's all good. :D

 

Oh heck, I should have just labeled it something like, "Do you feel like an outsider on homeschooling board because of your beliefs/lack of beliefs?" I know that can certainly happen even when you are a Christian!

 

I like the thread. I like the word heathen. :D (the word itself - ever have a word that you just like the 'sound' of? I like popcorn too. Yeah I'm weird.)

 

It's true though, that we can all be outsiders in some way or other at some point in our lives - whether Atheist or Agnostic or Pagan or Hindu or Muslim or Christian or trench coat wearing Immortal Jedi. :tongue_smilie: ...What's really important though is that we can be accepted for our differences - different is good (okay, usually!)....a world full of identical paper dolls would be incredibly boring. ;)

[Laura Corin]

 

I am at a point of letting it all go. I am tired of "covering up" who I am which is why I have pretty much pulled out of all the hs'ing group activities in our area.

 

Where I lived before, all the HS families were Christian evangelical missionaries. I covered up, for the sake of my children having other kids to speak English with once in a while. Scotland's home educators seem to be a much more mixed bunch.

 

Laura

[dawn of ns]

 

PS- Hi Dawn !!!! :D

 

Hi!! Glad you came over. :D

[Mad Jenny Flint]

Your post reminds me of the following Mencken quote:

We must respect the other fellow's religion, but only in the sense and to the extent that we respect his theory that his wife is beautiful and his children smart.

 

Yes! Yes, that's it!!

[Mad Jenny Flint]

I prefer the definition of character as that which we do when nobody else is around.

 

 

Absolutely. I was not, however, discussing my definition of character, but rather what we do or don't have the right to say. I think that varies by context, and far too often I find Christians who are very offended by what people who do not share their ideas say in their own private spaces. The feeling I get many times is that it's okay for non-religious folks to have their own ideas (maybe), but that it is not okay to express them in public, even in like-minded circles. That is branded as intolerance.

 

Character is something else altogether. It is not intentionally hurting someone else when you, at the core, disagree with their assessment of an issue. It is knowing *when* to hold your tongue.

[Laura Corin]

I'm just sad...

 

Beliefs expressed in Christian threads often sadden me, but I reckon it's their club, and I'd better stay out of it.

 

Laura (marvelling at a sunny morning in Scotland - you see, atheists can experience joy in nature)

[Pam "SFSOM" in TN]

 

Regardless, how weird a comment. Can you imagine how it would go over if, in the middle of a thread about Christian faith an atheist spoke up saying how sad it was that a bunch of people were talking about it?

 

Every once in awhile, this happens here. Unfortunately.

Edited October 2, 2008 by Pam "SFSOM" in TN

[Jenny in Florida]

Officially, I'm a UU, since I've been a member and friend of three UU churches over the last 20-some-odd years. I got married in a UU church, had both of the kids dedicated there, attend pretty much every week and am now back assisting in an RE classroom.

 

But I find it pretty unfulfilling a lot of the time.

 

When I went religion shopping during college, I chose the UUs because attending worship there didn't make me feel like a hypocrite, mouthing words about God or Jesus that I didn't believe. As the years have progressed, though, my own beliefs have continued to evolve, and I think I would make a difference choice if I were church shopping today.

 

I've been thinking about this a lot lately. My son and I were watching a DVD about Joseph Campbell, which included him saying (and I'm paraphrasing) that the world is divided into two kinds of people: those who believe that their myth (religion) is literally true, and those who believe all such myths are a lie. And I had to pause the DVD and argue, because I am neither of those types. I respect those myths as metaphors that help me to understand my world and to grapple with questions too big and complex to grasp.

 

Then, a couple of days later, we were in the car and listening to Terri Gross interview Bill Maher about Religulous. And I got so mad, because he seemed to be so smug about implying that it is not possible to be religious without being deluded.

 

So, I guess I am a heathen, in the sense that I do not believe in the Judeo-Christian concept of God or in the divinity of Jesus and do not accept him as my savior. I'm definitely not an athiest. I guess I'm tentatively an agnostic theist, in the sense that I feel belief in something, but I'm pretty content not to need to know what it is.

 

In some ways, I think my son pegged it when he was 8. He had been reading Harry Potter, and one day we were driving along on our way to a dance class, when he piped up from the back seat and said, "Hey Mom? I think God is like a boggart." I was bit irritable at being interrupted while trying to listen to All Things Considered, but turned down the radio and asked him to explain. He said, "Well, you know how a boggart always appears in the form of something that will scare each person? I think God looks different to everyone, too."

 

It's an idea worth playing with, at any rate.

 

Of course, it got him into trouble when he tried to explain the idea to another boy at the dance school . . .

[Melinda in VT]

I go to a UCC (liberal Xtian) and UU combined church that doesn't require any particular set of beliefs. In fact I took the quiz as part of a "Building Your Own Theology" workshop.

 

I am so jealous! Right now I attend a UCC church, but in our previous location I split Sundays between a UU church and a UCC church.

[Doran]

Why does this make you sad?

 

Sorry, but I really don't get why people feel the need to feel sorry/sad for those who have different beliefs.

 

...none of which I have actually posted...to Stacey's comments. In one, I made a similar remark to yours here, asking about the reason to feel sad. Thinking about it, I believe it has to do with the teachings of the church.

 

Having been, at one time, a devout member of the Christian church, I conclude that the "sadness" stems from the fact that many religions teach that the non-believer is doomed to live a life of unfulfillment, lacking in inner peace, not able to experience the joys and elations that the believer can have because s/he is separated from God both now and for eternity. Thus, followers are taught to feel something like "pity" for those not in the flock.

 

 

 

(As a humorous aside, I very nearly posted this with a typo. I just noticed that I used the word "meany" instead of "many" next to religions up above...that just tickled my funny bone.)

[Mama Lynx]

Every once in awhile, this happens here. Unfortunately.

 

I can only recall seeing Phred do that. Have others?

 

And Stacey ... ah, nevermind. It's been said already, and I would just be giving in to my baser instincts. :D

[Desert Rat]

This is so true. Unfortunately, IRL I'm finding road blocks being accepted and stomach aches trying to fit in. :o)

[Jill]

The Beliefnet quiz scored me as Liberal Quaker/Neo-Pagan/Mahayan Buddhist. hmmm... they forgot possible pastafarian. I don't really know what any of those 1st 3 are but will look into it.

Did "Deist" come up for anyone? I wonder if they didn't include it, and why not?

"Deism is the belief that a supreme God exists and created the physical universe, but shall not intervene in its normal operation.It takes no position on what God may do outside the universe. That is in contrast to fideism which is found in many forms of Christianity[1], Islamic and Judaic teachings, which hold that religion relies on revelation in sacred scriptures or the testimony of other people as well as reasoning.

Deists typically reject most supernatural events (prophecy, miracles) and tend to assert that God does not intervene with the affairs of human life and the natural laws of the universe. What organized religions see as divine revelation and holy books, most deists see as interpretations made by other humans, rather than as authoritative sources. Deists believe that God's greatest gift to humanity is not religion, but the ability to reason."

(yes that's from wikipedia, and no I have not checked the citations in the article.)

but please include me in the heathens group as defined as non-Christian. :) - Jill

Edited October 2, 2008 by Jill
added some websites but thought that might be, um, presumptious...

[Jill]

 

The last few questions are prefaced by: Respond to the following moral statements (Questions 13-20) based on how you would want your religion or faith category to address them. And then the questions have to do with anything from abortion to divorce. They don't separate morality and religion here (which is a whole nother beef of mine). If one is not religious, then none of these items pertain to their religion. Yet one feels compelled to answer otherwise because most people do in fact have opinions about these things (not that they are "not applicable").

Good point! that would explain some of our results...

[Jenny in Atl]

...none of which I have actually posted...to Stacey's comments. In one, I made a similar remark to yours here, asking about the reason to feel sad. Thinking about it, I believe it has to do with the teachings of the church.

 

Having been, at one time, a devout member of the Christian church, I conclude that the "sadness" stems from the fact that many religions teach that the non-believer is doomed to live a life of unfulfillment, lacking in inner peace, not able to experience the joys and elations that the believer can have because s/he is separated from God both now and for eternity. Thus, followers are taught to feel something like "pity" for those not in the flock.

 

 

 

I also wonder how much of this is just basic human nature (wanting others to be the same or similar in views and traditions). Going back to a more basic state (kill or be killed.. what and who is "safe"). I know many who are non-believers who feel sad or sorry for those who have a faith. The sentiment going both ways and every which other way. ;)

[lovemyboys]

I also wonder how much of this is just basic human nature (wanting others to be the same or similar in views and traditions).

 

 

Right. Just look at the political threads. Those who have in no uncertain terms chosen their candidate want to convince everyone else to get on board....guess it's the same with our faith, our food choices, our curricula...it's like a validation.

[Jenny in Atl]

Right. Just look at the political threads. Those who have in no uncertain terms chosen their candidate want to convince everyone else to get on board....guess it's the same with our faith, our food choices, our curricula...it's like a validation.

 

But I wonder if it's deeper than even validation. Maybe left over from a time when we had to make constant survival choices? Always on the fight or flight mode. But then that stumbles into an evolutionary thing... don't want to muddy the waters already brown from all our hopping. ;)

[Greta]

He said, "Well, you know how a boggart always appears in the form of something that will scare each person? I think God looks different to everyone, too."

 

Wow, I've been thinking something very similar lately, but it took me a bit longer to figure it out than it took your son! :D My view of "God" (though I really don't care for that word) or Divinity or whatever you want to call it is like a force that exists within every living thing, and permeates the entire universe and possibly beyond the universe as well. It's something which connects us all, and IS us all.

 

I read a story years ago, and I wish I could remember where this story came from, that in the beginning, there was God. God decided to put on a play, and God would play all the roles him/herself. God got so caught up in playing the roles that s/he forgot s/he was God. Those roles/characters are us. I really like that story, and it's about as close to an understanding of "God" as I can get.

 

I think that "God" is something that in many ways defies our understanding, is far beyond our comprehension. So we put God in a neat little box that we can understand and "deal with" better. The box that I use makes God sound like something out of Star Wars. :lol: The box that others use makes God sound like a person out there somewhere who has specific ideas for how they should live and the choices they should make. There are as many boxes as there are people, I suppose. And hey, whatever works. It's all good.

[PariSarah]

"Groupthink" turns me off.

 

It's not always easy to diagnose, but when it's there, it's just plain unattractive.

[Pam "SFSOM" in TN]

I can only recall seeing Phred do that. Have others?

 

And Stacey ... ah, nevermind. It's been said already, and I would just be giving in to my baser instincts. :D

 

Yes, but not frequently. You kinda have to remember the long history of the board, which is of course longer still than I've been here. This happens, but rarely. I was simply answering the "how would you like it if" question that it *does* happen the other way around. You have a good point that I should have qualified that to say the only rarely will a brash person jump in to do that. (And I'm not saying Stacy is brash. She was coming in with what she felt she needed to say, and she wasn't ugly about it. On the very few occasions that I've seen it happen the other direction, though, it was done in what I would consider a rude or in-your-face way. Or rather, their comments weren't couched in a tone of "concern.")

[Greta]

But don't the Christians who do support ID claim that it is not necessarily chirstian in nature?

 

That's a good point. I think there are at least some supporters of ID who do not identify as Christians. I haven't met any IRL, but I've seen this on the web.

[melissel]

Wow, I've been thinking something very similar lately, but it took me a bit longer to figure it out than it took your son! :D My view of "God" (though I really don't care for that word) or Divinity or whatever you want to call it is like a force that exists within every living thing, and permeates the entire universe and possibly beyond the universe as well. It's something which connects us all, and IS us all.

 

GretaLynne, you just described exactly how I feel about this. Thank you!

[lovemyboys]

But I wonder if it's deeper than even validation. Maybe left over from a time when we had to make constant survival choices? Always on the fight or flight mode. But then that stumbles into an evolutionary thing... don't want to muddy the waters already brown from all our hopping. ;)

 

 

What? Us hop around on a topic???

 

Good point though. Dc and I are reading a fiction story for history from a time when there was so much mistrust and hatred and fear and killing amongst religions. We talked about friends we have in various religions. Living in a country with such freedom of religion, it's hard for them to imagine the alternative.

 

I guess maybe the instincts might come from those early origins but for today's practices and preachings, not so sure.

 

For us, we attend a church that will be happily celebrating world communion this weekend -- in the deep sense of the words -- we are all God's children. :001_smile:

 

eta: maybe I should add -- YMMV : )