Interference by govt schools into family life

[RoughCollie]

One thing that really gets me riled up is when schools interfere in their students' family lives.

 

Here is the email I received from the school today:

 

"Have a wonderful weekend! It is going to be a rainy one so try to encourage your children to read a good book, do a puzzle or play a board game together! If all else fails, they can clean their bedroom!!"

 

Like I need suggestions on what to do with my kids on a rainy weekend! Who do these people think they are?

 

I betcha if I point out the nanny state interference, I will be the only parent who does so.

 

RC

[Mrs Mungo]

I don't see how suggestions for things to do on a rainy day equals interference. Granted, my kids are not in school and never have been but I cannot see *this* as the thing that would get me riled.

[RoughCollie]

It is none of their business what our family does at home, that is why I get riled up about it. Plus, I wonder if they think I'm an idiot who cannot figure out what to do with her family on a rainy weekend. Where was the school when it rained during most of the summer? I didn't get parenting advice then.

 

This is not a community in which the parents are clueless, but the way the schools treat us, you'd think we supply room & board, and they are the parents -- we merely have custody during the weekends and they want to be sure we all treat their kids right.

 

This is merely one example, and it is current -- so far no one has messed with me personally (this email went out to all the parents), but from past experience, I can guarantee they will try it once and it will be more intrusive than this. I can also guarantee it will only be once.

Edited September 26, 2008 by RoughCollie

[LibraryLover]

Yk, it just sounds like they are trying to be friendly. You might not like the chit chat, but it's not 'interfering' .

 

I have a kid in school, and we used to get reminders all the time to make sure we put sunscreen on our children each day before they left for school. Put on suncreeen, read books. Blah blah blah. So what, yk?

[Perry]

I don't take them personally, because I know what to do with my kids on rainy days. I assume they are intended for the people who need help with parenting ideas.

[LibraryLover]

I don't take them personally, because I know what to do with my kids on rainy days. I assume they are intended for the people who need help with parenting ideas.

 

 

Or whose kids constantly get sunburned. It happens...like people who send children to school sick and infect everyone. Hence the, "Please do not send your child to school if they have a fever or are vomiting" reminders.

 

Being in a school, for better or for worse, means being a part of a community of sorts. It's impossible to say every right thing to every parent all of the time. You have to cut each other a little slack, ime, and imo. Getting upset over the small stuff doesn't help advance commuinication.

[LG Gone Wild]

One thing that really gets me riled up is when schools interfere in their students' family lives.

 

Here is the email I received from the school today:

 

"Have a wonderful weekend! It is going to be a rainy one so try to encourage your children to read a good book, do a puzzle or play a board game together! If all else fails, they can clean their bedroom!!"

 

Like I need suggestions on what to do with my kids on a rainy weekend! Who do these people think they are?

 

I betcha if I point out the nanny state interference, I will be the only parent who does so.

 

RC

 

It's that nicey-nice attitude that's really coming across as condescending. I am sure loads of people don't see it that way but I guess it's just a peeve of mine. I don't care for those PSAs about the reminding people to read to their kids. Shrug...it just bugs.

[Nestof3]

I find it a little annoying -- they are speaking to you like they need to teach you how to parent. It also seems to me that they are implying it would be unusual for them to do the things they recommended -- but since it's raining. . .

 

(but perhaps I'm being sensitive)

 

Perhaps you could send them a similar email -- telling them to have a great Monday and remind them to encourage the children to pay attention, do their best and clean out their desk (hee hee).

[beansprouts]

Perhaps you could send them a similar email -- telling them to have a great Monday and remind them to encourage the children to pay attention, do their best and clean out their desk (hee hee).

 

 

Oh that would be funny! :lol:

[JennifersLost]

Nestof3, that is an awesome idea.

[gardening momma]

Oh, at first I thought the email was referring to your homeschooled kids (didn't realize until re-reading that your sig. indicates some go to school). I think the fact that you homeschool makes you more sensitive to this sort of stuff, especially since you do know what you're doing. I would take it with a grain of salt.

[gardenschooler]

That's really sad. Do some parents really need to be told what to do with their kids on a rainy weekend? I guess so.

 

The only note I've gotten is a generic one to the tune of, "Will you please sign this, a promise/pledge that you will make sure your student does his/her homework/studying/projects."

 

Last year, being a newbie to the whole school scene, I signed them for her. This year, I wrote notes back explaining that my 11th grader is responsible for her own work.

 

That just irks me that they think I'm supposed to go to my almost-adult and say, "Now, did you do your homework for Mrs. So and So? You know I promised to check! We can't expect you to take any responsibility, even though you're 16. It's still all on Mommy. Here I am."

 

No. Way. No. Waaaaay. What are they going to do, send these notes home from college, too?

[gardenschooler]

Perhaps you could send them a similar email -- telling them to have a great Monday and remind them to encourage the children to pay attention, do their best and clean out their desk (hee hee).

 

Yes, and please don't show movies instead of teaching, or play board games. Also, please stop taking the kids on nonsense 'field trips' to the movies at the mall, or out to eat. You might also suggest that they cut the announcement and homeroom time down, as well as have a zapper for any discipline problems. No more wasting class time on them - just zap 'em quickly, and get back to class.

[RoughCollie]

Perhaps you could send them a similar email -- telling them to have a great Monday and remind them to encourage the children to pay attention, do their best and clean out their desk (hee hee).

 

I can't. I already stirred the pot enough today. I emailed DD's Spanish, math, and science teachers to inquire why she has not been issued a textbook -- particularly in light of the fact that yesterday the MCAS results were in the paper. In DD's school in spring 2008, 30% of the 8th graders failed the math test, and 49% of them failed the science test!

 

Then I wrote to the principal to comment that he scheduled an Open House on the same night for 3 grades, knowing there was not enough parking for all of the parents to attend. We could not find a parking place, the cops on duty at the school told us our car would be towed if we parked in the vicinity, and we did not get to meet DD's teachers or find out about the curriculum they are using. I suggested how he could schedule Open House differently next time, to accommodate all the cars. Then the police wouldn't have to have cops patrolling the vicinity to make sure no parents parked anywhere but at the school.

 

I also told the principal that I had contacted the teachers about the lack of textbooks in DD's classes. I pointed out that the state's curriculum frameworks contain all the information the students need to know to make a high score on the MCAS. I said that parents and students were the ones ultimately responsible for a child's education in my view, and that I would make sure my DD learned the information she needs by teaching her myself, after school.

 

So, right about now, I'm on point about all this stuff and won't be having a little fun taking your suggestion.

 

It is a great suggestion, though! I may use it another time!

 

RC

Edited September 27, 2008 by RoughCollie

[Kelli in TN]

That's really sad. Do some parents really need to be told what to do with their kids on a rainy weekend? I guess so.

 

The only note I've gotten is a generic one to the tune of, "Will you please sign this, a promise/pledge that you will make sure your student does his/her homework/studying/projects."

 

Last year, being a newbie to the whole school scene, I signed them for her. This year, I wrote notes back explaining that my 11th grader is responsible for her own work.

 

That just irks me that they think I'm supposed to go to my almost-adult and say, "Now, did you do your homework for Mrs. So and So? You know I promised to check! We can't expect you to take any responsibility, even though you're 16. It's still all on Mommy. Here I am."

 

No. Way. No. Waaaaay. What are they going to do, send these notes home from college, too?

 

Okay, I have a gripe left over from when my daughter was in public highschool.

 

Our school district got a snazzy phone message system that automatically calls every parent on every phone (business, home and cell) in the event of an emergency.

 

Emergeny:A serious situation or occurrence that happens unexpectedly and demands immediate action.

 

Our school system's emergencies included teacher inservices, senior portraits, field trips, etc. I knew when senior portraits were due the year my daughter was a senior, thanks to this system. I also knew when senior portraits were due during my daughter's junior, sophomore and freshman years. I knew about ALL the field trips; the ones my daughter qualified for and the ones that did not pertain to her. And you could not hang up on the message system, it was programmed to keep calling you back on every phone until you listened. We use to put the phone down and let the voice rattle on and then come back later and hang it up.

[RoughCollie]

Yes, and please don't show movies instead of teaching, or play board games. Also, please stop taking the kids on nonsense 'field trips' to the movies at the mall, or out to eat. You might also suggest that they cut the announcement and homeroom time down, as well as have a zapper for any discipline problems. No more wasting class time on them - just zap 'em quickly, and get back to class.

 

Also, don't use 2 hours of class time to hold a pep rally for the football team, which eats into the block scheduling of 3 classes, rendering the class time before, during, and after the pep rally useless. DS1 did *nothing* academic in school today -- yet it counts as one of the 180 days and as 5.5 hours of instruction time!

Edited September 27, 2008 by RoughCollie

[gardenschooler]

Also, don't use 2 hours of class time to hold a pep rally for the football team, which eats into the block scheduling of 3 classes, rendering the class time before, during, and after the pep rally useless. DS1 did *nothing* academic in school today -- yet it counts as one of the 180 days and as 5.5 hours of instruction time!

 

That's so crazy. You know, here in TN, we're supposed to have at least 4 hours of school per day, 180 days a year. So on days we only do math and Latin, and then say, go to the library or zoo, I don't count it as a school day. I know I could, but it just doesn't feel right to me.

 

The world's gone crazy, I tell you.

[gardenschooler]

 

And you could not hang up on the message system, it was programmed to keep calling you back on every phone until you listened. We use to put the phone down and let the voice rattle on and then come back later and hang it up.

 

Oh, horrors!!! That one would do me in. We only get occasional ones about days off, and gang-prevention something or other, but you can hang up.

 

I'm also realizing (after reading the afterschooling board) we're pretty lucky - dd gets textbooks, and gets to bring them home.

 

I haven't really had that much to complain about (but I can certainly find things, can't I?). I know it's all a thousand times worse at the elementary level, which is one of the reasons I'd rather die than deal with that nonsense. I figured in high school, they wouldn't nag the parents to death.

 

I am also starting to see (from various IRL conversations) I have very unusual ideas about kids in general. Maybe I 'underparent', but to me, 16 is just about grown. She can certainly keep up with her own deadlines.

 

Now if I could just get dd14 to be that responsible!

Edited September 27, 2008 by gardenschooler
period after parentheses, or no period after parenthesis?

[Mom to Aly]

Actually, I think it is a great idea!!! What if we all, as a nation, got together and sent a nice note to Washington--

 

"It is a rainy day--so, instead of taking your 3 hour lunch, wondering if your hair will look bad if the wind is blowing, and getting your shoes shined, why not stay in, try to work on our failing economy, enormous deficit, huge wasteful spending, ridiculous taxes, and how to make this election something besides a name-calling contest?"

 

Who else is with me? Should we do email or snail mail? Does anyone have their email? Anyone? Ummm, anyone?

[keptwoman]

This type of stuff used to get me riled in the school system too. Along with telling me what could and couldn't go in my childs lunch box. If it was just silly notes home it wouldn't be so bad. But it's insidious, schools interferring more and more into what should be parental responsibility. Then there's the comments from teachers that they "know what goes on at home" like I'm some kind of criminal. All because I let DS watch 3 movies in one weekend once, I'm clearly letting the TV do the parenting. Just thinking about that nonsense makes be very very glad to be out of there!!

UG. Sandra meet Hot Button Topic.

[I talk to the trees]

Actually, I think it is a great idea!!! What if we all, as a nation, got together and sent a nice note to Washington--

 

"It is a rainy day--so, instead of taking your 3 hour lunch, wondering if your hair will look bad if the wind is blowing, and getting your shoes shined, why not stay in, try to work on our failing economy, enormous deficit, huge wasteful spending, ridiculous taxes, and how to make this election something besides a name-calling contest?"

 

Who else is with me? Should we do email or snail mail? Does anyone have their email? Anyone? Ummm, anyone?

 

:patriot: I like the way you think!

 

-Robin

[abbeyej]

I'm afraid that note wouldn't bother me in the least. I would ignore it, but really. They're just filling up space on the page. It's kinda silly, but not offensive.

[Erica in PA]

One thing that really gets me riled up is when schools interfere in their students' family lives.

 

Here is the email I received from the school today:

 

"Have a wonderful weekend! It is going to be a rainy one so try to encourage your children to read a good book, do a puzzle or play a board game together! If all else fails, they can clean their bedroom!!"

 

Like I need suggestions on what to do with my kids on a rainy weekend! Who do these people think they are?

 

I betcha if I point out the nanny state interference, I will be the only parent who does so.

 

RC

 

It would sort of irritate me, because it gives the impression that parents *need* the guidance of their child's teacher, even when the child is at home on weekends. It sounds as though this teacher, well-meaning though I am sure she is, has bought into the idea that since parents can be pretty clueless, it's the school's role to teach them how to interact with their kids. It's no longer only about teaching academic content in schools.. it's about shaping the whole child, inside and outside of the classroom. I don't think this note would be significant enough to respond to in any way, and it's sort of what I'd expect to have to put up with if I put my child in p.s., but it would annoy me slightly, because I disagree with the thinking behind it.

 

Erica

[Erica in PA]

 

 

Perhaps you could send them a similar email -- telling them to have a great Monday and remind them to encourage the children to pay attention, do their best and clean out their desk (hee hee).

 

:lol::lol::lol:

[mrsdash]

I feel exactly the same way and I don't miss the school system at all. As for your comment about the childrens education being the responsibility of the child and parent- I've said that for years to the teachers before I took my kids out. Amen to that.

[chiguirre]

I can't. I already stirred the pot enough today. I emailed DD's Spanish, math, and science teachers to inquire why she has not been issued a textbook -- particularly in light of the fact that yesterday the MCAS results were in the paper.

 

That's awful, RC! If I was in that situation, I would seriously consider pulling her from school. IMHO, books are essential for education and if the school won't provide them, they're failing in a very basic way.

 

If you can't hs your dd, you might be able to find the textbooks on Follett (http://www.fes.follett.com) or ecampus.

[Academy of Jedi Arts]

Actually, I think it is a great idea!!! What if we all, as a nation, got together and sent a nice note to Washington--

 

"It is a rainy day--so, instead of taking your 3 hour lunch, wondering if your hair will look bad if the wind is blowing, and getting your shoes shined, why not stay in, try to work on our failing economy, enormous deficit, huge wasteful spending, ridiculous taxes, and how to make this election something besides a name-calling contest?"

 

Who else is with me? Should we do email or snail mail? Does anyone have their email? Anyone? Ummm, anyone?

 

http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm

 

https://forms.house.gov/wyr/welcome.shtml

 

:tongue_smilie::tongue_smilie::tongue_smilie:

[Deidre in GA]

ladies, face it, we are not typical parents. i realized this years ago and am quite proud of it. we have chosen to homeschool our kids which means were are involved in their welfare to a degree that, frankly, most parents are not. sending a note home reminding us how to parent is like reminding us to breathe. this is not so for many other parents.

 

a few years ago, another mom on my son's soccer team was telling me how she had to find time for parent's night at her son's (probably 6th grader) school. this was an incentive night where parents were given prizes for reading to their kids. i was shocked! i asked her in disbelief to confirm that she had just said that parents had to be bribed to read to their kids. she looked at me like I was nuts. btw, this is a school in a predominantly white, fairly affluent suburb of Atlanta.

 

one of the NPR stations i listen to is owned by Atlanta Public School so every Sunday the superintendent gets 5 minutes to editorialize. this is where she gives parents suggestions on how to prepare their child for the coming schoolweek. it's rudimentary stuff like eat breakfast, provide exercise opportunities, help with homework. i don't need this but apparently, somebody does.

 

we are not normal. that letter home was not really for you. you didn't need the prompt but i bet a fair number of parents in your district did - and ignored it anyway.

 

btw, my son started public high school this august though i seem to still be afterschooling math. as much as a school says they welcome parental involvement, i think they are a bit taken aback by this mama bear. as far as i'm concerned, i am still the entity responsible for my son getting the education he needs. most of the subjects i have 'outsourced' to them are doing great but i am in their face about the one subject (math) that is falling far short of what my son needs.

Edited September 27, 2008 by Deidre in GA

[5kidsforME]

ladies, face it, we are not typical parents. i realized this years ago and am quite proud of it. we have chosen to homeschool our kids which means were are involved in their welfare to a degree that, frankly, most parents are not. sending a note home reminding us how to parent is like reminding us to breathe. this is not so for many other parents.

 

a few years ago, another mom on my son's soccer team was telling me how she had to find time for parent's night at her son's (probably 6th grader) school. this was an incentive night where parents were given prizes for reading to their kids. i was shocked! i asked her in disbelief to confirm that she had just said that parents had to be bribed to read to their kids. she looked at me like I was nuts. btw, this is a school in a predominantly white, fairly affluent suburb of Atlanta.

 

one of the NPR stations i listen to is owned by Atlanta Public School so every Sunday the superintendent gets 5 minutes to editorialize. this is where she gives parents suggestions on how to prepare their child for the coming schoolweek. it's rudimentary stuff like eat breakfast, provide exercise opportunities, help with homework. i don't need this but apparently, somebody does.

 

we are not normal. that letter home was not really for you. you didn't need the prompt but i bet a fair number of parents in your district did - and ignored it anyway.

 

btw, my son started public high school this august though i seem to still be afterschooling math. as much as a school says they welcome parental involvement, i think they are a bit taken aback by this mama bear. as far as i'm concerned, i am still the entity responsible for my son getting the education he needs. most of the subjects i have 'outsourced' to them are doing great but i am in their face about the one subject (math) that is falling far short of what my son needs.

 

Very nicely said, and I agree.

[Kelli in TN]

I'm also realizing (after reading the afterschooling board) we're pretty lucky - dd gets textbooks, and gets to bring them home.

!

 

Bekah did not get an algebra book. That was just awful, she needed to look things up and could not. It was lectures and handouts of problem sets. If you missed a day and could not get someone's lecture notes to copy you were just out of luck.

[Murphy101]

:rant:

 

this is just wrong. it leads to the breaking of one of the 10 commandments.;)

 

seriously.

 

I've been known to point blank LIE that I do not have email or cell phones for just this reason. I don't know that I'd call it interference. I would call it stupidly annoying junk - SPAM.

 

I do not pay for internet or cell or even land phone services for the sake of other people's convienence. I pay for it for MY family.

 

I do not willingly give out email or cell phone to any such places because I know they are just going to use it to either send me junk or nag/hassle me or solicit for something. Nope, that's not what I pay for the service for.

 

I also do not have voice mail. At ALL. I think the guy who invented the automated phone system should be shot. (well maybe no shot. tortured by 24/7 dealing with his own creation would be punishment enough.) If it's important then they can send it in a letter or call back. If they aren't willing to do that - then it's not very important.

 

I have caller id and yes, if I don't know the name or number - I do NOT feel the slightest inclination to answer it.

 

Folks you should try this. It's peace on earth I tell you. I'm tired of the entire world thinking everyone should be "on call" and that I have some obligation to be able to be reached by everyone who wants to reach me when they want to reach me for any and all stupid reasons. um, NO I DO NOT!

 

When we first got these services it drove me nuts that some people/businesses/associations would email, then call the house, then the cells, like they were tracking me down just to hassle or nag me. :001_huh:

 

And I've meet more than one person who actually had the nerve to act ticked that they couldn't reach me. "I tried calling you but it just rang. I sent an email this morning, but you didn't respond." Well excuse me folks, but what I do with my time is my bloomin' business and I'm under zero obligation to stop everything for a call or email. I've yet to have had it be about anything vital or needing a quick response either.

 

Okay, off my soapbox now...

[Mom to Aly]

http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm

 

https://forms.house.gov/wyr/welcome.shtml

 

:tongue_smilie::tongue_smilie::tongue_smilie:

 

Thanks!!! :D

[Heather in VA]

I'm afraid that note wouldn't bother me in the least. I would ignore it, but really. They're just filling up space on the page. It's kinda silly, but not offensive.

 

I agree. There are plenty of things to be bothered by, this is just isn't it. It's an email. Hit the delete key.

 

Heather

[Jackie in AR]

:rant:

 

this is just wrong. it leads to the breaking of one of the 10 commandments.;)

 

seriously.

 

I've been known to point blank LIE that I do not have email or cell phones for just this reason. I don't know that I'd call it interference. I would call it stupidly annoying junk - SPAM.

 

I do not pay for internet or cell or even land phone services for the sake of other people's convienence. I pay for it for MY family.

 

I do not willingly give out email or cell phone to any such places because I know they are just going to use it to either send me junk or nag/hassle me or solicit for something. Nope, that's not what I pay for the service for.

 

I also do not have voice mail. At ALL. I think the guy who invented the automated phone system should be shot. (well maybe no shot. tortured by 24/7 dealing with his own creation would be punishment enough.) If it's important then they can send it in a letter or call back. If they aren't willing to do that - then it's not very important.

 

I have caller id and yes, if I don't know the name or number - I do NOT feel the slightest inclination to answer it.

 

Folks you should try this. It's peace on earth I tell you. I'm tired of the entire world thinking everyone should be "on call" and that I have some obligation to be able to be reached by everyone who wants to reach me when they want to reach me for any and all stupid reasons. um, NO I DO NOT!

 

When we first got these services it drove me nuts that some people/businesses/associations would email, then call the house, then the cells, like they were tracking me down just to hassle or nag me. :001_huh:

 

And I've meet more than one person who actually had the nerve to act ticked that they couldn't reach me. "I tried calling you but it just rang. I sent an email this morning, but you didn't respond." Well excuse me folks, but what I do with my time is my bloomin' business and I'm under zero obligation to stop everything for a call or email. I've yet to have had it be about anything vital or needing a quick response either.

 

Okay, off my soapbox now...

 

I just tried to rep you for this post, then realized that I couldn't! :D

 

I'll have to settle for saying that I agree with you 100%.

[iquilt]

I was just about to hand out some rep, too, when I remembered :) I agree with many of you; while that particular e-mail would just get deleted in my house, it is representative of the bigger idea that most parents are idiots and "certified" teachers must save us from ourselves. I am reminded every so often that my level of involvement is just more than most that I encounter and many parents would need ideas on what to do with their kids all weekend. If the majority of families have 2 working parents then they are just not used to spending lots of time with the kids that's not already scheduled with all of the "extra" activities. I heard some moms at church the other night complaining about several issues that relate to this. One has no reading teacher for her son, he requires extra help with his reading, yet after nearly a month of classes he's not received ANY reading instruction at school. Another mom whose child does not yet have a math book, and a mom who found out the janitor regularly fills in as a sub at the local high school. These were all from ps teachers with children in the system. Sorry, off rant now :)

[GSMP]

I didn't read through every comment but here is my humble opinion for what it is worth.....:lol:

 

I recently read an article on the families who chose to stay on some of the islands that were the most devastated in Texas. Parts of this article I agreed with and parts burned me. I spoke to a friend who lives in Texas and she said that what the article stated was correct.

 

The children are a ward of the state and the parents are basically being used to raise them. That is the view of the govt. Our children do not belong to us. They are technically wards of the state and the state will stay out of the family until they feel the need to step in. Which even then I have to wonder at what they are thinking when one reads the number of times they drop the ball on the cases that need intervention and harangue those that are truly innocent.

 

The public schools feel they own our children. I know that some here have their kids in PS and I don't fault you for doing what you feel you have had to do in support of your family.

 

We have a friend in the area here who was told by the teachers at the school not to teach their kids at home. Especially if it improved what they were doing. It made it too difficult for the teachers to teach the class as a whole. Bunk!!

 

I can see how getting such an email would be annoying when you are not the typical parent of today whose kids veg in front of a game or tv. My guess is that if you are on this board, you are not a normal parent as it is.

 

You care about what your children. My husband and I have been told numerous times that our kids are not the norm. They think. They are not afraid to ask a question. They are not intimidated by what they don't know and will ask an adult.

 

They are annoying little stinkers at home on occasion and I would like to wring their necks sometimes.

 

I can see both sides. It would annoy me slightly but I do understand why they are doing it. You are probably in the minority when it comes to parental involvement with your children.

 

We are becoming a socialist country and when we are fully there....you think its bad now?

[Remudamom]

Gah, spit, spit. It makes me mad that YOU got one, I'd be offended that they felt they needed to send one, and that they wasted my time that it took to read it.

[RoughCollie]

If that little email suggestion I received stood alone, I would have ignored it and not commented on it here. It is just one tiny twig on the pile, though. Enough twigs and pretty soon you end up with a tree.

 

I'm not all that trusting of the government. To sum it up: Give them an inch, and they will take a mile.

 

RC

[Kathleen in VA]

RC, I am usually pretty easygoing and can hit the delete button with very little emotion when I receive irritating emails from relatives and "friends" with whom I disagree about parenting, schooling, politics, you name it. However, after reading the email you were sent, I felt a great desire to punch something.

 

It was utterly and altogether condescending. I'm with Remudamom - gah. spit. spit!!

 

Ginger, your post is haunting and frightening. What will we do when this is a socialist country? I really can't imagine. Is there any place to go?